Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Scotland/Archive 13

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Archive 12

Archive 13

"Scotland, UK"?

See Strathberry: is "UK" used? If anyone can cite chapter and verse in favour of using, or not using, "UK", their contribution would be welcome. PamD 14:20, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

I've seen a few mini-edit-wars over this on various articles recently. To me it seems unnecessary to add "UK", but then I live in Scotland. Maybe to someone living in, say, Bangladesh, it would be helpful. Like so many things people squabble over on Wikipedia, there's no right and wrong answer: it's not wrong to add "UK", but nor is it wrong to omit it. I believe the best way to deal with this is to look at the history of the article in question: whichever form has predominated may be regarded as having unwritten consensus, and any recent change without good reason may be regarded as going against that consensus. --Deskford (talk) 19:14, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

The use of place abbreviations for any location is to be avoided, in my view. Shipsview (talk) 13:43, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

You can justify abbreviations like UK in parts of the page that need to be kept free of clutter - like here where it's in an infobox. But I personally hate the "xxx, UK," construct in article text just because it is so ungainly, it breaks the flow of the text. So I'd go for one or the other unless you need to disambiguate eg Bangor, Wales from Bangor, NI. I understand how passions can be roused with this sort of thing but just looking at it from a Wikipedia point of view, consistency is very important. That means if we allow Scotland then we have to allow Catalonia, Inner Mongolia and East Turkestan, which I don't think is helpful so I'd reluctantly conclude that the correct formulation for this particular infobox is "Edinburgh, UK". Le Deluge (talk) 17:23, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

Is NI for Norfolk Island? or Niedersachsen? The use of place abbreviations for any location is to be avoided, in my view. Shipsview (talk) 19:01, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

Good luck finding a Bangor in Niedersachsen. At no point was I suggesting using "NI" in the encyclopedia, I was just using it informally in conversation on a talk page. Le Deluge (talk) 14:35, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

Scotland has roughly the same population and area as South Carolina and I think editors are not expected to add US in that case. Thincat (talk) 18:18, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

It's not so much a question of population - East Turkestan has 5x the population of Scotland. Sure, it's kinda assumed by many editors that readers know the geography of the US better than rural China - but that's an example of WP:WORLDVIEW bias, and is probably not something to encourage.Le Deluge (talk) 14:35, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

St Kilda requested move

Greetings! I have recently listed a requested move discussion at Talk:St Kilda, Scotland, regarding a page relating to this WikiProject. Discussion and opinions are invited. Thanks, Ivar the Boneful (talk) 11:47, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

Irn-Bru history

I'm not in a position to check this edit out thoroughly in the short term but it's either a revelation in regard to Irn-Bru's history or a pile of pony. Views? Mutt Lunker (talk) 15:12, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Scotch-Irish Russians

This new article may have potential but its aim seems somewhat unclear, listing various people with Scottish and Russian connections and various people with Irish and Russian connections. Some may actually be in some sense Scotch Irish but most, or possibly all, are not. It's unclear as to why are they being lumped in together. Mutt Lunker (talk) 23:47, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

WikiProject Women in Red/The World Contest

Hi. In November The Women in Red World Contest is being held to try to produce new articles for as many countries worldwide and occupations as possible. There will be over $4000 in prizes to win, including Amazon vouchers and paid subscriptions. If this would appeal to you and you think you'd be interested in contributing new articles on Scottish women during this month please sign up in the participants section. If you're not interested in prize money yourself but are willing to participate and raise money to buy books about women for others to use, this is also fine. Help would also be appreciated in drawing up the lists of missing articles. If you think of any missing articles for your project please add them to the appropriate sub list Missing articles. Thankyou, and if taking part, good luck!♦ Dr. Blofeld 10:01, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

Police Scotland

Hi, would anyone care to assist me with the above, an insistent IP user has reverted me twice (within seconds on the second occasion) after they added content which is defamatory, unproven and, on a very basic wiki policy level, unsourced. Thanks. Crowsus (talk) 12:05, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

Glasgow Gladiators Powerchair FC

Could someone from WP:SCO take a look at Glasgow Gladiators Powerchair FC and assess it? It's newly created (possibly by a person or persons connected to the team) and it does not appear to meet WP:ORG or WP:GNG. It guess might be notable as a "wheelchair football team", but I am not sure if there any specific guidelines for such teams. I did find this, but again I'm not sure if even something such as the Scottish Powerchair Football Association is Wikipedia notable. There's also this and this which may be helpful in showing notability, but which can most likely be used to cite article content. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:18, 30 November 2017 (UTC)

Disambiguation links on pages tagged by this wikiproject

Wikipedia has many thousands of wikilinks which point to disambiguation pages. It would be useful to readers if these links directed them to the specific pages of interest, rather than making them search through a list. Members of WikiProject Disambiguation have been working on this and the total number is now below 20,000 for the first time. Some of these links require specialist knowledge of the topics concerned and therefore it would be great if you could help in your area of expertise.

A list of the relevant links on pages which fall within the remit of this wikiproject can be found at http://69.142.160.183/~dispenser/cgi-bin/topic_points.py?banner=WikiProject_Scotland

Please take a few minutes to help make these more useful to our readers.— Rod ^talk 18:35, 3 December 2017 (UTC)

Barony of Coigach

Could someone have a look at Draft:Scottish feudal Barony of Coigach and see if it should be accepted as an article? Thanks! – Uanfala (talk) 00:54, 26 December 2017 (UTC)

Macbeth and this Wikiproject's scope

Would Shakespeare's Macbeth fall under this Wikiproject, seeing as it concerns itself with Scotland? The Verified Cactus 100% 01:24, 5 January 2018 (UTC)

Rèiteach

I've just started a new article on the highland rèiteach tradition. I included the first reference (Martin) because the title looks highly relevant, but I haven't been able to get a copy of it. (I've read and used everything else that is cited.) It would be great if we could have some other people working here, especially if they have access to Martin or other scholarly sources. Thanks a lot. --Doric Loon (talk) 18:18, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

Clan chiefs and A7

Is the statement that someone was a clan chief generally considered an "assertion of significance or importance" such that they should not be speedy-deleted A7? Has there been any past discussion about this? Or other questions of how they should be treated? There's a discussion on my talk page. PamD 08:53, 17 January 2018 (UTC)

Maclachlan clan chiefs at AfD

Several recent Maclachlan clan chiefs are jointly at AfD (and John Maclachlan, 23rd of Maclachlan has already been speedy-deleted as a copyvio of that site). Their sole source is The Peerage website. Members of this project might have access to more reliable sources with which to improve the articles, or views on whether they should exist at all. PamD 09:48, 23 January 2018 (UTC)

List of tartans

The last two posts at Talk:List of tartans raise important concerns. If anyone knows about tartans, please drop by and share your views. Many thanks! Anna Frodesiak (talk) 10:09, 1 February 2018 (UTC)

Orcadian notability

Sanday, Orkney has a reprasentative on Orkney Islands Council and their particulars appeared under the heading People associated with Sanday. I removed this on the grounds that we don't normally include indivdiuals who have no article of their own on such lists (and I doubt said Cllr would get one based purely on their current political status). This was then reverted with an optional insult added for good measure. I had a quick trawl through MOS but I couldn't see anything especially definitive. Any views or suggested precedents welcome. Ben MacDui 19:19, 6 February 2018 (UTC)

I agree with you regarding this particular section. While it doesn't specifically refer to islands, I think the WikiProject UK geography guide to writing about settlements can reasonably be used for guidance here (the Sanday article is indeed tagged under that project). Those guidelines suggest the use of the heading "notable people" and stress that those included should indeed satisfy notability requirements under WP:NBIO, i.e. qualify for their own article. However, those guidelines also recommend a "government" section detailing parliamentary and local government arrangements, including listing representatives where appropriate – so the councillor could be detailed there, as an arrangement to keep everyone happy. Jellyman (talk) 19:44, 6 February 2018 (UTC)

Many thanks. Ben MacDui 19:56, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Category:Scottish devolution has been nominated for discussion

Category:Scottish devolution, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for renaming to Category:History of Scottish devolution. A discussion is taking place to see if it abides with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:45, 13 March 2018 (UTC)

Village Pump proposal to delete all Portals

Editors at this project might be interested in the discussion concerning the proposed deletion of all Portals across Wikipedia. See Wikipedia:Village_pump_(proposals)#RfC:_Ending_the_system_of_portals.Bermicourt (talk) 08:44, 13 April 2018 (UTC)

Category:17th-century British painters has been nominated for discussion

Category:17th-century British painters, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for deletion. A discussion is taking place to see if it abides with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you.. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:00, 4 May 2018 (UTC)

WikiProject collaboration notice from the Portals WikiProject

The reason I am contacting you is because there are one or more portals that fall under this subject, and the Portals WikiProject is currently undertaking a major drive to automate portals that may affect them.

Portals are being redesigned.

The new design features are being applied to existing portals.

At present, we are gearing up for a maintenance pass of portals in which the introduction section will be upgraded to no longer need a subpage. In place of static copied and pasted excerpts will be self-updating excerpts displayed through selective transclusion, using the template {{Transclude lead excerpt}}.

The discussion about this can be found here.

Maintainers of specific portals are encouraged to sign up as project members here, noting the portals they maintain, so that those portals are skipped by the maintenance pass. Currently, we are interested in upgrading neglected and abandoned portals. There will be opportunity for maintained portals to opt-in later, or the portal maintainers can handle upgrading (the portals they maintain) personally at any time.

Background

On April 8th, 2018, an RfC ("Request for comment") proposal was made to eliminate all portals and the portal namespace. On April 17th, the Portals WikiProject was rebooted to handle the revitalization of the portal system. On May 12th, the RfC was closed with the result to keep portals, by a margin of about 2 to 1 in favor of keeping portals.

There's an article in the current edition of the Signpost interviewing project members about the RfC and the Portals WikiProject.

Since the reboot, the Portals WikiProject has been busy building tools and components to upgrade portals.

So far, 84 editors have joined.

If you would like to keep abreast of what is happening with portals, see the newsletter archive.

If you have any questions about what is happening with portals or the Portals WikiProject, please post them on the WikiProject's talk page.

Thank you.    — The Transhumanist   07:54, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Merging Hamilton unsourced stubs

Hi, can I direct anyone who might be interested to Talk:Hamilton, South Lanarkshire#Multiple merge proposal. As it suggests, I have tagged several very poor Hamilton related articles, giving others a chance to improve them and justify theirs continued existence rather than just boldly merging it all into the main town article. However, I would not be surprised if admins took that bold action on a few of them. Crowsus (talk) 23:20, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Commons - Category:19th-century politicians of Scotland

Hi all! I've split the mish-mash of 'Category:19th-century politicians of the United Kingdom' into three new categories: Scotland, England and Wales. Now we can find Scottish politicians easier, rather than having to open each file individually! Can someone check to make sure I've fished them all, please? ie there may be a few in the Category:19th-century politicians of England, which may need changing; of course they could be in both categories. I'll then split the 20th c. politicians, but would appreciate some help! Tapadh leat! Llywelyn2000 (talk) 08:39, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

Choice of infobox on articles about constituencies

FYI

 – Pointer to relevant discussion elsewhere.

Please see this discussion and follow-up RfC concerning the relative merits of {{infobox constituency}} and {{infobox settlement}}. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 07:18, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

Another proposal to rename Lewis

This project seems to have been rather quiet of late. Is anyone still around? There's another proposal to rename Lewis to "Isle of Lewis". This must be at least the fifth proposal to move this article. Shouldn't there be some guideline about repeated proposals? Please consider and comment at Talk:Lewis#Requested move 18 July 2018. --Deskford (talk) 09:07, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

This time the proposal is mainly that the place is actually called "Isle of Lewis" but also that it is clearly not the primary topic for plain "Lewis" anyway. There is a general expectation that we don't have the same proposal again and again without something new, but I have presented something new. Personally, living in England, I'd expect to find the given name under "Lewis" and the place under "Isle of Lewis" but having "Lewis" as the DAB seems like the best option. Crouch, Swale (talk) 09:55, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

Can you clarify the new aspect please? As far as I can tell, the arguments you address are all covered in previous archived discussions. Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:14, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

The new aspects are 1-the fact that the place is actually called "Isle of Lewis" (rather than that merely being natural disambiguation) and 2-I have provided page views (an advance from the other discussions) of more of the other pages which show that others get more than double (actually more like triple) the views for just "Lewis". Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:18, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

The first assertion is not new and forms part of previous discussions. Mutt Lunker (talk) 11:11, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

All the other 4 proposals where apparently just over disambiguation. But anyway the last discussion was in 2012 and closed with no consensus, which is more than enough time. Crouch, Swale (talk) 06:31, 25 July 2018 (UTC)

Rouken_Glen_Park

Is the Rouken Glen Park the Rouken Glen that is referred to in the song (Dubliners, Luke Kelly) The Dundee Weaver? If so, it should be mentioned - it is such a great song by a great band. Being a foreigner however, I do not know for sure. Janmark~nowiki (talk) 15:28, 31 July 2018 (UTC)

Domaduir

I've nominated the newly created article Domaduir for deletion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Domaduir as it looks to me like a hoax. Happy to be proved wrong if such a place really does exist! --Deskford (talk) 20:33, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

A link to a DAB page

In John Pairman, Bridge over the River Almond links to the DAB page River Almond. Both rivers look plausible. This problem was first spotted in October 2015. Can anyone help solve this puzzle? Narky Blert (talk) 20:19, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

Merge proposals - Aberdeen / Edinburgh / Highland councils

I have found Aberdeen and Edinburgh both have Politics of and City Council articles which relate to basically the same content (in contrast, Dundee and Glasgow have single articles with redirects which seem to adequately serve the purpose). I have added merge suggestion entries here (Edinburgh) and here (Aberdeen), any input welcomed. Crowsus (talk) 03:07, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

Edit: Just found Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The City of Edinburgh Council which was created and closed yesterday (7th August). Looking at it, I assumed The City of Edinburgh Council had existed as a proper article of some size since its original creation date in 2010, but it is actually 'brand new', being only a redirect until yesterday when expended. I do not agree with the AfD proposer/closer's opinion that the articles' contents are sufficiently distinct to merit two different articles. However, depends what others think. Crowsus (talk) 03:15, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

Further edit: The same situation also exists with the Highlands, a region of 250,000 which nevertheless has a Politics of the Highland council area article and a Highland (council area) article covering much the same information (in addition to the Scottish Highlands which I'm well aware is distinct). I'm putting the merge on those too (see here). Crowsus (talk) 13:29, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Hogmanay traditions

So I've heard from a friend who lived in Edinburgh that on New Years' Eve it is tradition for members of the public to kiss policemen and policewomen. I've seen photos in online news reports of this happening in the streets of Edinburgh, but I couldn't put my finger on an explanation of the tradition. Does anyone know for sure if this is limited to Edinburgh or does it happen all around Scotland? Is it just police or also firefighters and EMTs and whatnot? Is this explained in writing anywhere we can cite? Thanks! -- Beland (talk) 03:42, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

File:Scots lang-en.svg

From an e-mail to OTRS ticket:2018100110006485 - the map (used on 5 pages) shows "Moravians" in the Inverness area. There appears to be no mention of Moravians in any of the articles, so is the map correct? Ronhjones  ^(Talk) 19:02, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

It is referring to inhabitants of Moray, in its older, wider sense. Mutt Lunker (talk) 19:27, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

RfC on election/referendum naming format

An RfC on moving the year from the end to the start of article titles (e.g. South African general election, 2019 to 2019 South African general election) has been reopened for further comment, including on whether a bot could be used move the articles if it closed in favour of the change: Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (government and legislation)#Proposed change to election/referendum naming format. Cheers, Number 57 15:42, 20 October 2018 (UTC)

Help with Scottish jewellery

Hi there! I would love to be involved in this Wikiproject and would like some editing help on my page on Scottish jewellery. Sorry if this is the wrong place to post this request. Thanks! --Dream8047! (talk) 22:48, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Disambiguation guideline

There is discussion at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (geographic names)#Scotland regarding WP:UKPLACE for those who are interested. Crouch, Swale (talk) 14:39, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

Featured quality source review RFC

Editors in this WikiProject may be interested in the featured quality source review RFC that has been ongoing. It would change the featured article candidate process (FAC) so that source reviews would need to occur prior to any other reviews for FAC. Your comments are appreciated. --IznoRepeat (talk) 21:47, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

Scots v. Scotch

There is a topic on the page Category_Talk:American People of Scotch-Irish descent entitled 'Pejorative.' As it is the only topic on the page, and as I have been previously instructed that 'cat_talk' pages receive minimal-to-zero traffic (witness this 8+ year conversation with zero results), and as the topic is of considerable concern to persons of Scottish derivation, I felt it appropriate to raise the issue here. I see the term 'Scots' in various places on this project. I would not think an RfC would be necessary for this issue. rags (talk) 04:03, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

The link you have added is broken (is Category_talk:American_people_of_Scotch-Irish_descent intended?) and I'm not entirely clear as to your point or question. Are you concerned as to whether the category should use the term Scotch-Irish or, say, Scots-Irish? The Scotch (adjective) article is not great and requires some work but it might give you some background. The term "Scotch" has largely fallen out of use in Scotland, except in its specific application to, say, Scotch Whisky, and Scots who are unaware of its continuing currency outside of Scotland may be surprised when they encounter this usage and regard it as somehow "incorrect". I guess some of us may misinterpret the usage as pejorative but that is no more reason to change terms such as Scotch-Irish, which is the term employed, as it would be to impose the "correction" "Scots Whisky" or "Scots Beef", which are never employed, to my knowledge. Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:19, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Noss

There's a proposal to rename Noss to Isle of Noss. Clearly nobody thought to notify this project. Please comment at Talk:Noss --Deskford (talk) 21:00, 29 December 2018 (UTC)

File:ICT6012.jpg

Can anybody identify this castle? Agathoclea (talk) 11:44, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

It is the Governor's House, Edinburgh and the Political Martyrs' Monument. File:PoliticalMartyrs.jpg is a photo from a similar viewpoint. Thincat (talk) 12:43, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

Glims Holm or Glimps Holm?

Expert input needed at Talk:Glims Holm#Requested_move_14_January_2019. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 05:15, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

And Talk:Point (Outer Hebrides)#Requested move 14 January 2019. Crouch, Swale (talk) 16:03, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

St Mary's Wynd, Stirling

The text says: "The major street leading down the castle hill from the royal residences in Stirling Castle to the abbey was called St. Mary's Wynd, a name it retains." Ahem.... schoolboy Geography... St Mary's Wynd leads AWAY from the Abbey so the statement as it stands is crass. I don't know enough about this to suggest what is wrong. Perhaps the wynd did lead to an old eg St Mary's Church long since replaced (eg when the abbey was built) - but that is pure guess. Freuchie (talk) 15:40, 16 January 2019 (UTC)

Disambiguation of council areas

There is a discussion over at Commons, see Commons:Commons:Categories for discussion/2019/01/Category:Highland (council area). Over there other than the main Commons:Category:Highland (council area) the other categories use "Foo council area", not "Foo (council area)". Should this be done here per WP:NATURAL? "Highland council area" doesn't get many results on Google (76,400, compared to 44,100,000 without quotes) so this may show that even though the term without brackets may be an obvious was to refer to the council area, it isn't used much by reliable sources. The OS just uses "Highland" (although that's the case for Warwick to). Also wouldn't "Highland Council Area" be the correct title here, if its part of the name, similar to Warwick District for example. Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:43, 18 January 2019 (UTC)

One problem with the name is something I have highlighted on the relevant talk pages: there currently exists both an article on the geographical extent of the local authority (Highland (council area)) and one on its political composition (The Highland Council), in addition to the more generalised article on the Scottish Highlands and one on the Politics of the Highland council area. Please see the merge discussion I started there, rather than me clogging this post. In relevance to the article names, it can be seen that the term The Highland Council is possibly contributing to the naming of Highland (council area) as it has been due to the closeness with Highland Council. However, the naming standards differ: we have Stirling (council area) but Falkirk Council, and while Orkney Islands Council and Fife Council exist, these refer only to the modern local political aspects while contemporary geographical and historical aspects remain with the Fife and Orkney articles due to the old county boundaries and those of the new local authority being the same, unlike the Highlands (if a clear definition of its area ever did exist). Not an easy issue to resolve. Crowsus (talk) 12:48, 18 January 2019 (UTC)

"Fife"

There is a proposal at Talk:Fife (disambiguation)#Requested move 1 February 2019 requesting to disambiguate the council area to Fife, Scotland. Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:39, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

Kingston, Glasgow

Please see discussion at Draft talk:Kingston, Glasgow regarding whether the draft should become a mainspace article about the neighbourhood of Kingston, or whether it should be merged into Govan based on WP:NPLACE. Curb Safe Charmer (talk) 16:30, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Gowkthrapple

Could an admin maybe have a look and consider moving the articles? Gowkthrapple (Wishaw) seems an unnecessary distinction given that the only alternative in the disambiguation page (which has existed since 2005) is for a fictional character in a novel which has since been deemed non-notable? Crowsus (talk) 14:02, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Agreed: disambiguation is not required, and Gowkthrapple (Wishaw) should be at the base name. I note that neither Gowkthrapple nor Goukthrapple are even mentioned in the article on the novel. --Deskford (talk) 14:20, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

 Done. Crouch, Swale (talk) 21:47, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

Dunkeld and Birnam

I just saw that Dunkeld no longer has an article and has been merged into a 'Dunkeld and Birnam' settlement article. Is this really the will of the community, it's absolutely mad?! Dunkeld has a long and distinct history and was not the same 'settlement' as Birnam until recently, it is the site of an ancient hill fort and a cathedral and has countless other claims to historic importance distinct from the fact that Dunkeld and the Victorian village of Birnam are connected today by a bridge. Are we to merge urban districts like Broomhill and Jordanhill because they are adjacent?! Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 21:43, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

There is discussion at Talk:Dunkeld and Birnam#Merger proposal (and objection in the next section). Crouch, Swale (talk) 21:47, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

Never seen anything like this in Wikipedia. There are still multiple Wikipedia pages about Dunkeld in 12 other languages, but not on en.wikipedia. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 21:50, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

I was the original proposer of the discussion mentioned above, which was open for four months without attracting a single comment either way, so I went ahead with the merge. My rationale can be read on the talk page. The objection referred to above — the only time anyone bothered to respond until now — occurred almost a year later, and consists of the only two edits from an account apparently of some local residents who signed up solely to make this objection. Jellyman (talk) 22:02, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

Every instinct tells me they should have remained separate articles. The problem is editors were obviously just to thin on the ground to address the proposal. It doesn't seem unreasonable at all that some locals noticed the Wikipedia article had changed and finally decided they'd need to sign up to get involved. Their opinion still ought to count. I'm new to the Scotland Project, so perhaps I missed it - did you post about the proposed merge here? Donama (talk) 23:16, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

At Jellyman, yes, fair enough. I'm guessing the issue is that the proposal was not publicized, so people with wider knowledge and interest in Wikipedia's norms or Scottish place articles were not aware of the proposal. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 13:03, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

If a significant number of sources refer to "Dunkeld and Birnam" as a single entity, then we should have an article about that place. That may be the case as for example, as the census data is for "Dunkeld and Birnam" and its tourist association says "Dunkeld and Birnam is one ... historic town", but those appear to be the only references to a single combined unit. That's different to things like Dunkeld & Birnam railway station, where the two names are merely combined. I note that Dunkeld and Birnam is a community council area.

There is clearly plenty to say about both Birnam and Dunkeld independently, so we should have articles about the two places separately. There is significant history (especially for Dunkeld) and continuing distinct identities for both.

IMO there is a need for three articles here - one about Dunkeld, one about Birnam and one about Dunkeld and Birnam. The content of the first two is obvious, while the third should cover the entire community council area which also includes places like Glen Quaich and Loch of the Lowes (and so a short stub can be avoided).--Nilfanion (talk) 09:34, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

Considering 3 editors have objected to the merge, is it worth proposing a split? I would also note Blairgowrie and Rattray, Redenhall with Harleston, Shaw and Crompton and Totton and Eling also are similar. Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:31, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

These need to be split also I think. Historic settlements don't lose their identify because of obscure, short-term bureaucratic classifications--or, at least, they usually don't elsewhere on Wikipedia. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 13:03, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

Well, if people prefer separate articles, fair enough. In hindsight, I could have sought wider opinions, such as from this project; but my personal opinion remains that, where a natural and logical link exists, there are advantages to having one comprehensive article rather than a string of poorly-developed ones, such as Birnam as it was in 2017 pre-merger. Not a great article to have developed over its decade of existence, was it? I find people will make vague assertions of "potential for expansion" or express a willingness to expand articles themselves, only for nothing concrete to ever materialise. I note also the recommendation in the WP:UKTOWNS guidelines for writing about small settlements that suggests dealing with them under a larger area such as civil parish, community council area etc when appropriate. None of this is to denigrate such places, or somehow deny their identity. It doesn't mean useful material should be deleted. I'm not saying that these individual settlements aren't significant or notable. I believe that all notable topics deserve coverage on Wikipedia, I just don't agree that in every case that is best served by giving every notable person / place / concept its own article. Jellyman (talk) 20:40, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

I partially agree with you - developed articles are better than a series of stubs. UKTOWNS states when there is no likelihood of expansion, to describe the place in a larger notable area. IMO the error here was removing the article on Dunkeld - that was a mature article on a notable subject and shouldn't have been removed because of the poor state of articles on different subjects. Both of the other articles could be improved: Birnam by finding additional information, and the stub on the combined entity by appropriate summarising of the other articles and inclusion of rural details.--Nilfanion (talk) 21:33, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

I'd note for example that there is Nedging-with-Naughton which was formed from Nedging and Naughton parishes. WP:GEOLAND and WP:NTEMP are clear that just because a place is no longer a legal entity doesn't mean that it has to be merged with the current one (as long as the names and boundaries are distinct). However neither of those settlements appear to be legally recognized, other than being on an OS map (or like Nedging and Naughton formerly were) however it looks like there is quite a bit of info on Dunkeld (it was a market town) so maybe that should be split again (and summarized per Nilfanion in the Dunkeld and Birnam article) but there seems to be less on Birnam, however as noted with Shaw/Shaw and Crompton even Dunkeld may end up as a bit of a content fork. Crouch, Swale (talk) 21:51, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

Birnam has potential for expansion, indeed. The fact that it is not expanded should not impinge on another article. Dunkeld is not Birnam. Birnam is not Dunkeld. They are close in geographical terms but nobody ever refers to them as a combined entity. Catfish Jim and the soapdish 21:58, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

Nobody ever does, apart from when they do. To repeat from above: they are classified as a single census locality. They have a joint community council area. The local tourist association refer to them together as "a historic town". The merge didn't create a "Dunkeld and Birnam" article, one already existed even when each settlement had its own article as well. You can prefer separate articles, sure, but don't pretend they aren't sometimes grouped together by officialdom and sources. Jellyman (talk) 22:30, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

In D&B's case I suspect more people think Birnam is district of Dunkeld than a union between two settlements, as inaccurate as that might be. Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 13:14, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

Everyone seems to agree that the settlements should have separate articles, though no-one seems to object to the idea that 'Dunkeld and Birnam' should be retained as a distinct article. The case for restoring the articles for Rattray and Blairgowrie seems pretty straightforward too. As WikiProject Scotland we don't really have any competence for the others that Crouch, Swale kindly brought to our attention, but that's not to say we accept them--though note that one of them, Shaw and Crompton is an FA and in that instance it would obviously not be wise or beneficial to do anything. Anyone disagree here? Deacon of Pndapetzim (Talk) 13:14, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

TRNSMT Glasgow

Will somebody please take the time to explain what TRNSMT means?.....I'm assuming it means transmit but I'm probably wrong....if I'm correct, why not just say TRANSMIT? IKOK — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.75.64.77 (talk) 11:22, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

See TRNSMT. Donama (talk) 23:03, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

Monros of auchinbowie

Hi Thankyou for your article which has much valuable information. I believe however that it is misleading in respect that Inglis shows in his book that Neither Primus or Secundus or Tertius lived at Auchenbowie and only Primus owned it. In their time the place was occupied by John and his daughters and then went to David and Sophia. The epmhasis on those who were not either residents or owners on Auchinbowie and diminution of those who were in fact ,residents and owners, is misleading with respect to the Title which is Monros of Auchinbowie. Bet Regards Peter Monro Great great grandson of Harriet — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.98.209.74 (talk) 19:15, 22 February 2019 (UTC)

WP 1.0 Bot Beta

Hello! Your WikiProject has been selected to participate in the WP 1.0 Bot rewrite beta. This means that, starting in the next few days or weeks, your assessment tables will be updated using code in the new bot, codenamed Lucky. You can read more about this change on the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial team page. Thanks! audiodude (talk) 06:46, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

The Gaelic College

Would The Gaelic College be considered to be under the scope of this Wikiproject? The Verified Cactus 100% 17:34, 4 April 2019 (UTC)

Guide to creating new Scottish settlement articles

Hi I am an Australian editor with a lot of experience creating Australian place articles and am familiar with interactimg with a pool of local editors approximately the same size as implied by the WP:SCO participants list. I really want to start helping fill the gaps in Scotland and am trying to educate myself. My underlying inspiration is that so many of my ancestors were born in Scotland (typically places like Jedburgh or Dunbar or Montrose but often tiny villages for which an article doesn't exist like Ballygown or Kilninian on Mull or Ferryden south of Montrose). Also, plenty of South Australian place names are for now-obscure places in Scotland which is a shame when trying to put links when writing etymologies. I've read all the advice I could find at WP:UKGEO but I still have a few questions:

• Any info about the threshold/guide for notability for a place to have an article all of its own? Or, if not, how to add that information to a parent town/island/parish article?
• What is the encyclopaedic value of knowing about civil parishes? Or is it better to think about council areas in Scotland? Assuming parish information is valuable, why doesn't the Angus article have a list of civil parishes contained therein? How do you find out which civil parish a villages is in? I tried to figure out which one Ferryden was in but Craig, Angus redirects to the Barony of Craigie article which doesn't appear to be an article about a civil parish at all? And, related to that, how do you find out all the features/villages contained within the borders of a single civil parish in case you wanted to know?

Thank you so much for any help or advice. Donama (talk) 00:03, 4 January 2019 (UTC)

I thought I'd at least start to reply to your questions though there will be others who have far more experience than I have on articles about Scottish settlements. I know some people who have lived in Calgary, Alberta and the contrast with Calgary, Mull is very great indeed. First, as worldwide, by WP:NPLACE, villages are generally kept as whole articles as indeed are uninhabited islands, etc. provided there are a couple of references. Scotland is pretty well documented so references are rarely a problem. Civil parishes in Scotland are administratively obsolete, unlike in England/Wales – there has been discussion, sometimes acrimonious, in Template talk:Infobox UK place and its archives. I'd suggest forgetting about civil parishes for Scotland – community councils are the smallest administrative areas but they have no power and little influence. Council areas count for a lot, see Subdivisions of Scotland, lower down are the committee areas. Less administratively dry are the (obsolete but still much used) Shires of Scotland. How you find out where a place is in the administrative/geographical/census hierarchy I don't know, but I suggest looking at https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/ and, in particular, https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/places for a start. I expect https://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/ and https://www.scotlandscensus.gov.uk/ may help too. Best wishes. There are many settlements near where I live with nothing at all on WP! Thincat (talk) 20:27, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

PS, in my experience Geograph is an excellent source of photographs and I find the Ordnance Survey maps on https://streetmap.co.uk the best to use. Thincat (talk) 20:38, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

I would echo most of what Thincat has said above. On the subject of notability, we seem to accept articles on more or less any named place, however small. I think sometimes an editor sees a cluster of buildings on a map, creates an article calling it a village even though in reality it is no more than a farm with outbuildings and perhaps a few cottages, and the article sticks. There are countless examples where I doubt the notability – see for example Ardonald, Auchallater, Bainshole and Bonnyton, Aberdeenshire just to explore the first two letters of the alphabet in Aberdeenshire alone – but mine seems to be a minority view. Sometimes there may be a case for notability – Skaw, Unst is just a single house (the article euphemistically calls it a "tiny settlement") but it is the most northerly inhabited place in the UK, and there were once other dwellings around it. And I well remember the case of Ardtalla, when one editor questioned the notability and another editor built it up into quite a respectable article (see User talk:Hadrianheugh#Ardtalla).

And as for administrative divisions, the council areas are what counts – these are the ones that determine the provision of most services, and the names that are most apparent on the ground. Council area boundaries are clearly marked on Ordnance Survey maps, which can be viewed online through several providers, so it is usually easy to see which council area covers a particular location, and most councils have useful websites. The larger council areas geographically speaking are subdivided into committee areas, and these are sometimes used here. It's true that some older people harbour an attachment to the counties that became obsolete over 40 years ago, and so they make claims for obscure geographical divisions like lieutenancy areas and land registration areas because they are more closely connected to the old counties, but in practice these serve very limited purposes and it would be difficult to find the appropriate area for any given location. Younger people are often confused by the old county names, and even in Scotland most people wouldn't be able to identify many of them on a map.

I'm sure your contributions here will be very welcome – we have lost many of our most active Scottish editors in recent years, often over badly handled acrimonious disputes over place names I think – so it's good to see someone new taking an interest! --Deskford (talk) 22:22, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

Thank you, both. Very helpful. I hear what you're saying about the civil parishes and counties being obsolete. Just that they are mentioned in almost every Scottish village article, normally without any definitive sourcing, so obviously this information is useful and meaningful to locals at least. Certainly if you're tracing family history the parish information is likely to be very useful because you can try and trace back to the church parish where records might be kept. I imagine there would be a similar argument for the value of county information - albeit historical. Donama (talk) 04:34, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

@Donama: I'd agree with Deskford, that more is not necessarily better, I think readers are better served by an article about a slightly bigger area that can provide some historical and economic context rather than a host of articles that say "There's a farm here. They farm sheep". But I know other editors will disagree. Generally in Europe the WP:GEOLAND requirement of "legally recognized place" is interpreted as the parish/commune being the lowest level with default notability, whereas below that they're treated on a case-by-case basis, maybe 10-15% get the nod. Ski resorts in the Alps are a typical example as many aren't communes in their own right but they can be world-famous on sporting grounds. Obviously it gets complicated in Scotland with the civil parish thing, but a good rule of thumb is that if there's a church or similar public building then it's notable by default, whereas you need to establish notability if there's just private buildings. In many cases a hamlet is just the infrastructure that supports a "big house" and since the big house will often be notable in its own right due to a heritage listing, having a separate article about the hamlet may be rather redundant. It's all about prioritising and giving the reader the best experience given our limited editing resources - redirects are your friend. If a hamlet starts to outgrow an article about its nearest village, then it's easy enough to split it off. One other thing - don't trust Google Maps once you get off the beaten track, the Ordnance Survey (most conveniently accessed via Bing Maps UK) should be regarded as the map of record.Le Deluge (talk) 09:11, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Infobox UK place

Template:Infobox UK place has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 22:44, 17 April 2019 (UTC)

Organisation/organization RfC

There is an RfC on whether all Wikipedia categories should use the spelling "organization" (regardless of the respective country) taking place here. Number 57 19:26, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

2019 Scottish Cup final - Pictures

If anyone is heading to the 2019 Scottish Cup Final, can you take some pictures of the match for the article. As I might try and target this page for GA. Matt294069 (talk) 02:39, 1 May 2019 (UTC)

Glasgow University photo request: Thomas Logan Stillie bust

Do we have someone at Glasgow University who could kindly take a (full face) picture of the bust of Thomas Logan Stillie (Q19407690), seen in this non-free image, assuming it is still on display? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 22:51, 13 May 2019 (UTC)

Sheriffdoms

Hello, I'm English, but I hope I can help (but I don't live in the UK, so it's rather remote). I just ran into Grampian, Highland and Islands created by a mass-permastub factory (User:Shevonsilva), and redirected it to Sheriff Principal of Grampian, Highland and Islands, which is where the existing link in Template:Scottish Sheriffs points to. But I find that some of the other Sheriffdoms have redundant articles at "X" and "Sheriff Principal of X", while the page Sheriffdom has links generally just to the name "X", some of which are red. I'm making redirects to fill this gap, but I wonder if there could be a discussion whether the articles should be moved to the plain "X" titles. Imaginatorium (talk) 16:58, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

• Followup: Lothian and Borders and Sheriff Principal of Lothian and Borders are the problem - I think they should be merged. Imaginatorium (talk) 17:10, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

6th of what?

If you know about titles in Scotland, please see question at Any possibility of adding a clarifying word or two to this inbred line? Shenme (talk) 02:54, 2 June 2019 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

Greetings! I have recently relisted a requested move discussion at Talk:Cutty-sark (witch)#Requested move 1 July 2019, regarding a page relating to this WikiProject. Discussion and opinions are invited. Thanks, Sangdeboeuf (talk) 21:07, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

Bot created articles

I am currently looking at creating articles for civil parishes with a bot, see User:Crouch, Swale/Bot tasks/Scottish CPs. Feedback and suggestions welcome on the sub pages' talk pages, in particular is there census date and area data available for Scottish CPs. There surely should be some data given that Historic Environment Scotland shows the parish that the buildings are in, see List of listed buildings in Gigha And Cara, Argyll and Bute for example. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:08, 1 June 2019 (UTC)

Note: there are similar messages at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject UK geography#Bot created articles and Wikipedia talk:WikiProject England#Bot created articles. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 07:32, 2 June 2019 (UTC)

Here via Arbcom. I thought Scottish CPs were not being created because Scottish CPs are historical only? I've held off creating those local to me on those grounds. I'm hugely concerned over bot-created articles in general but creating them where the administrative division no longer exists seems even more make-work. Espresso Addict (talk) 02:57, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

I indeed thought they were historical only but somehow all the lists of listed buildings were created (although I can't find the source for them) and this source for example gives the parish. Crouch, Swale (talk) 07:28, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Draft:Bantaskine

I's appreciate any help or insights for this subject. Thanks. FloridaArmy (talk) 22:34, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Murder of Alesha MacPhail

I have been working on this article for the past week or two and believe it is now the most comprehensive account of the case available. The subject may be of interest to some members of this project, in which case I welcome you to leave any suggestions for further improvement on the talk page. Many thanks. Myth House (talk) 20:34, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

Refs needed dates, have added them now. Crowsus (talk) 02:36, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Disambiguation of link to Kincardine

Would anyone with local expertise be able to help disambiguate links to Kincardine? There seems to be several current and historical places in the list and it is often difficult to work out which one is intended. The list of links still contains about 50 I couldn't work out.— Rod ^talk 18:22, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

I made a small start but will have to pack it in shortly. All the mentions of a port, particularly the shipwreck-related articles will be referring to Kincardine-on-Forth. The Sutherland hamlet is on the coast but tiny and not navigable to large vessels, if it has ever had a harbour. Mutt Lunker (talk) 19:12, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

I've done a couple of the more obvious ones. Crowsus (talk) 00:11, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

I'm almost certain that the mentions of the deployment of Second World War anti-aircraft units to Kincardine in 1st Suffolk Artillery Volunteer Corps, 40th Anti-Aircraft Brigade (United Kingdom) and II Anti-Aircraft Corps (United Kingdom) will be to Kincardine-on-Forth. Its location by the Kincardine Bridge and a large ammunition depot at Longannet in the immediate vicinity, the refinery at Grangemouth slightly more distant and the Forth Bridge and numerous naval establishments - harbours, ammunitions depots etc., up and down the Forth, all of signifcant strategic and economic importance would seem to make it by far the likeliest candidate. But I haven't manged to pin this down. Can anyone else? The mention in the 1st Suffolk article is referenced by "Order of Battle of AA Command, 15 November 1945, TNA file WO 212/86" if anyone knows how to access that. Mutt Lunker (talk) 11:56, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

To add to those good military reasons for there having been an AA battery at Kincardine-on-Forth during WWII, here's a Luftwaffe photo of the ammo dump. Searches for 'anti-aircraft Kincardine' turned up nothing useful. Narky Blert (talk) 16:39, 15 August 2019 (UTC)

The reference to "Furris, Kincardine" being the birthplace of Alexander William Pearson's father may be due to a misprint in the source (I can find no record of any location named "Furris") and the intention may be Durris, in Kincardineshire. That said, this site (I've no idea re its reliability) states the father was born in Ceres, Fife, incidentally nowhere near the Fife Kincardine. Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:40, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

I had independently concluded that 'Furris' was likely a misprint for 'Durris' (possibly Kirkton of Durris, or perhaps Durris Forest); 'd' and 'f' are next to each other on the keyboard. Geni.com consists of user-generated content and is therefore not WP:RS. At least the sources agree on birthdate, so they're likely talking about the same man. The best solution may be to mention both places and both sources, and to explain the problem neutrally in an {{efn}} leaving the options open. Narky Blert (talk) 16:19, 15 August 2019 (UTC)

References

Portal:Scotland

Proposal to delete all portals. The discussion is at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Proposal to delete Portal space. Voceditenore (talk) 09:13, 23 September 2019 (UTC)

Redlinks for "Gazetter for Scotland" biographies

About 90% of the ~2700 biographical entries in the Gazetteer for Scotland website have recently been matched to Wikidata.

Here's a list of the items with no English wiki articles that people might like to consider. The ODNB and 'Old DNB' columns give links to entries in the current and 19th-century Dictionary of National Biography, respectively. Jheald (talk) 12:40, 7 October 2019 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK / Train the Trainer (Scotland)

Hello all, Wikimedia UK are looking for new trainers in Scotland, and as such we're running a Train the Trainer course in November in Glasgow. The call for expressions of interest closes on the 1st November. We're particularly interested in hearing from those outwith the Central Belt. More details on the WMUK site here. Thanks! Sara Thomas (WMUK) (talk) 08:37, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

Request for information on WP1.0 web tool

Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.

We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma (talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Sad News

I just spotted this announcement on Angus Mclennan's TalkPage that he sadly passed away on Friday morning. I'm sure we all appreciate the enormous contributions he made to Wikipedia over the years and wish to convey our condolences to his friends and loved ones. A sad loss indeed. --Cactus.man ✍ 20:29, 18 November 2019 (UTC)

Requested move

An editor has requested that {{subst:linked|Anglo-Scottish border}} be moved to {{subst:#if:|{{subst:linked|{{{2}}}}}|another page}}{{subst:#switch: project |user | USER = . Since you had some involvement with 'Anglo-Scottish border', you |#default = , which may be of interest to this WikiProject. You}} are invited to participate in [[{{subst:#if:|{{subst:#if:|#{{{section}}}|}}|{{subst:#if:|Talk:Anglo-Scottish border#{{{section}}}|{{subst:TALKPAGENAME:Anglo-Scottish border}}}}}}|the move discussion]]. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 12:06, 28 November 2019 (UTC)

Highlands and Islands Locality Infobox suggested (with Language information)

First of all, I am not and have never been Scottish, let's just first get it out (and I am not even entirely sure I have any at all in the blood)... anyway, I have been having a bit of bother at Talk:United Kingdom, but that is albeit (somewhat) related, but 'not the point'... my point here is, I would think that perhaps a separate Infobox ought to be created for (certain) Scottish localities like they have with concerning places in Finland, because certain places in Scotland, namely many of the islands of the Outer and Inner Herbies and the nearby immediate coastal areas of the Scottish Highlands, are (for the moment at least anyway) either Gaelic-speaking or bilingual, as I understand it, and the (Scottish) Gaelic language is either official or co-official in many of these places. Wouldn't really be that politically controversial either as it is (unfortunately) the case across 'a certain' Sea, I don't think. What do you Scottish editors think about this? 194.207.146.167 (talk) 17:50, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

Draft:Battle of the Brig of Dee

I believe this article is notable, but could someone improve this article, particularly the referencing? PatGallacher (talk) 19:53, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Margaret, Maid of Norway

Would appreciate some input at Margaret, Maid of Norway discussion. GoodDay (talk) 22:08, 3 January 2020 (UTC)

Scoti

Various IPs and a new user have been making the same edit to the lede of Scoti, which involves removing cited text. They have finally engaged at talk but have continued with the edits. Edits by the same editor/s appear to have, at the least, a point to prove, which makes me wonder whether the edit at Scoti is dubious or undue. Do others with more knowledge of the factual aspects have a view? Mutt Lunker (talk) 16:11, 12 January 2020 (UTC)

Geographic question: "Kenilworth, Scotland"?

I'm trying to track down the birth place of actress Kitty Loftus (Q82601043): Some sources state her birth place as "Kenilworth, Scotland" (e.g. encyclopedia.com), while others simply state "Kenilworth" (Who's Who in the Theatre), which might imply the town in Warwickshire, England. At least one other source states her birth place as "Whitecliffe, Gloucs." Loftus is sometimes described as an "English actress". Can anyone confirm that there is (or was) a place called "Kenilworth, Scotland" (or for that matter, "Whitecliffe, Gloucestershire")? Thanks, --Animalparty! (talk) 20:34, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

If there is a settlement in Scotland called Kenilworth, the Ordnance Survey 1:50 000 doesn't list it. Perhaps she was born above the Kenilworth pub in Rose Street in Edinburgh? Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:29, 19 January 2020 (UTC)

There's a Kenilworth in Calderwood, East Kilbride but there's not much to it. In the 1800s it was just fields and I'm not sure how it got its name today either. Stevie fae Scotland (talk) 16:55, 19 January 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. I'm beginning to suspect that a Scottish origin for Kitty Loftus is an error, possibly confused with actresses Marie Loftus (Q69718083) and her daughter Cecilia Loftus (Q980144), both of whom are from Glasgow and lived about the same time as Kitty. --Animalparty! (talk)

As to how it got its name: it's not uncommon for places in Scotland to take their names from the novels of Sir Walter Scott – in this case, Kenilworth (1821). Opera hat (talk) 14:37, 20 January 2020 (UTC)

Just what I was thinking! -- Derek Ross | Talk 20:58, 20 January 2020 (UTC)

Dál Riata

Someone put a tag on the Good Article Dál Riata last year to indicate that it is written like an essay. It's not an area that I know anything about, but if the tag is correct perhaps it should be demoted from GA? Espresso Addict (talk) 05:06, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

The Great Britain/Ireland Destubathon

Hi. The Wikipedia:The Great Britain/Ireland Destubathon is planned for March 2020, a contest/editathon to eliminate as many stubs as possible from all 134 counties. Amazon vouchers/book prizes are planned for most articles destubbed from England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland and Northern Ireland and whoever destubs articles from the most counties out of the 134. Sign up on page if interested in participating, hope this will prove to be good fun and productive, we have over 44,000 stubs! Even if "contests" aren't your thing, think of it as motivation to improve our content! Hope to see a lot of articles improved as part of this, there is a £50 prize for most Scotland articles destubbed!♦ Dr. Blofeld 15:22, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

Proposed inclusion criteria for List of tartans

FYI

 – Pointer to relevant discussion elsewhere.

Please see Talk:List of tartans#Inclusion criteria, a proposal for a three-point list of inclusion criteria. There are at least 7000 tartans and we cannot account for them all in a single article.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  20:44, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Meh. They're all fake anyway. Catfish Jim and the soapdish 20:47, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

Notification of discussion on deleting all local government subdivision articles

There is currently a discussion going on at WikiProject Politics of the United Kingdom regarding a proposal to delete all articles on individual local government subdivisions. Please feel free to participate in this discussion. Sparkle1 (talk) 19:44, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

Talk:Falkirk Council#Requested move 29 March 2020

Hi a move discussion at Talk:Falkirk Council in respect of the article's scope has been relisted seeking more consensus, comments are welcomed, ta. Crowsus (talk) 01:42, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

Clearances

The term clearances has redirected to Highland Clearances for many years. Someone is proposing to change this to a disambiguation redirect, but doesn't seem to have notified any of the projects concerned, so I am posting this to each of the projects. If you wish to comment, please do so here:

• Wikipedia:Redirects_for_discussion/Log/2020_May_27#Clearances

--188.30.171.198 (talk) 14:20, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Speedy CfD re Counties of Scotland

Not sure if it should have appeared at Wikipedia:WikiProject Scotland/Article alerts (it hasn't) but there's a proposal at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Speedy#Current_requests for the speedy renaming of Category:Counties of Scotland to Category:Shires of Scotland. You may wish to comment. Mutt Lunker (talk) 11:43, 2 June 2020 (UTC)

...now moved to Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Speedy#Opposed_requests. Mutt Lunker (talk) 17:28, 2 June 2020 (UTC)

Constituent country

I notice a series of, doubtless good faith, edits to the infoboxes of county and council area articles which include the noting of the "Constituent country". This is one example. Is my memory correct that this term is deprecated? Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:43, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Per clarity, the fellow was likely trying to help readers understand that neither England, Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland were independent. He was adding a descriptive to what kinda country they were, so they wouldn't be confused with a sovereign state. GoodDay (talk) 17:25, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

WP:NOTFORUM, that's not the question I asked and, even if it was, I can speculate as to their purpose as much as you can. See fuller response here. Mutt Lunker (talk) 18:44, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Wasn't seeking a forum or platform. GoodDay (talk) 18:55, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Aye, right. Again. Mutt Lunker (talk) 19:07, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Category:Hardys has been nominated for deletion

Category:Hardys has been nominated for deletion. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Bermicourt (talk) 16:17, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

Lowland Scots Wikipedia needs corrections

On Meta users are discussing an issue where multiple articles were written in less than good Lowland Scots on the Lowland Scots Wikipedia

Do you have any contacts in Scottish Universities who could make it a project to clean up some of these pages? WhisperToMe (talk) 06:07, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Scottish Parliament regional results by constituency

I have started a discussion at Talk:Next Scottish Parliament election#Regional results by constituency about adding regional results to constituency articles. Any feedback on this would be great. Thanks, PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 12:24, 24 October 2020 (UTC)

FAR of renewable energy in Scotland

I have nominated Renewable energy in Scotland for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Femke Nijsse (talk) 18:53, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

Need help for French translation

Greetings! I'm working on a translation in French of the Politics in Scotland article in English, and I'm having a bit of trouble with translating the technical legal jargon. Is there anyone here who speaks French and could maybe proofread my draft as I complete it? Thank you guys. --Liberlogos (talk) 20:13, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Request for article on the Sustainable Growth Commission

Hi all! Can I request an article on the Sustainable Growth Commission, chaired by Gordon Wilson (Scottish politician), please. I'll then translate it into Welsh. Thanks! Llywelyn2000 (talk) 06:20, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Llywelyn2000: I've made a first draft at my sandbox, hopefully it's along the lines of what you are after. By the way, the commission was chaired by Andrew Wilson (economist), not Gordon Wilson (Scottish politician) (who sadly died in 2017, a year before the Commission's report was published). Cheers, PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 11:46, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Many thanks! I'll get it translated and onto the Welsh wiki (cy-wiki) shortly. Let me know if I can reciprocate! Llywelyn2000 (talk) 07:44, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Children of Songea Trust

I’d like to create more content for this page and update the title to reflect the change in the organisation’s name (removing the word ‘Trust’). Can anyone advise on how to get the title changed? I can edit the stub but would like to create more content to classify this as a page. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. Ncmathers (talk) 11:02, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

 Done @Ncmathers:: I moved the page to Children of Songea as per https://www.oscr.org.uk/about-charities/search-the-register/charity-details?number=50507, the name has changed & trust is no longer part of the title. "Charity Details". OSCR. 1999-02-22. Retrieved 2020-12-15. This charity has been established to replace SC036556 - Children of Songea Trust. SC036556 - Children of Songea Trust intends to wind up and pass its assets and liabilities to SC050507 - Children of Songea SCIO. Children of Songea seems to be the WP:COMMONNAME. Please also add details to the Wikidata item for the organisation. Peaceray (talk) 17:26, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Calendar (New Style) Act 1750 : please review quality and importance rating

A great deal of work has gone into expanding, cleaning up and citing Calendar (New Style) Act 1750, so may I suggest that its classifications according to this wikiproject merit review. It is clearly no longer start class, though I suspect its importance in Scottish history is still low. Of course I don't expect this WP to pre-empt the GA process (unless of course someone would be kind enough to get two for the price of one and do the GA review: if not, then any suggestions or corrections that can be actioned while it is in the GAN queue would be most welcome). --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 16:02, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

The Galloway Hoard

Hello Scotland group,

I'm getting in touch about the Galloway Hoard. I'm Digital Product Manager at National Museums Scotland, and we've been working in partnership with Wikimedia UK over the last couple of years to move the organisation forward in our journey towards open access to the national collections. We've been publishing some small image releases to Wiki Commons of objects like the Lewis Chessmen and the Monymusk Reliquary.

The next step in this project is an upload of images of the Galloway Hoard, which you can find in the category https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Galloway_Hoard_at_the_National_Museum_of_Scotland

As a bit of background, the hoard was acquired by National Museums Scotland in 2017 thanks to generous support from the public. We're due to exhibit the hoard at the National Museum of Scotland and on tour around Scotland in 2021. I wanted to flag the images with WikiProject Scotland in case there are any pages - existing or new - you'd like to use them in.

Part of the project at NMS is about internal advocacy and demonstrating the value of opening up access to the collections via Wikmedia, so please let me know if you use the images in any content as we'd be delighted to see how they are used.

Thanks, Adam Adamcoulson (talk) 12:57, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Messed up talk page archiving

While looking for very long page titles we found this beauty: Talk:Scottish clan/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1/Archives/2016 1 - and another one. The problem was an archiving instruction that itself got archived - so the bot created an archive of the archive, again containing the archiving instruction... that's cleaned up as soon as an admin deletes the extra pages, but in the process I found a different error: Talk:Clan Campbell, Talk:Kingdom of Scotland, Talk:Highland games, Talk:Clan Campbell, Talk:Largs, Talk:River Clyde, Talk:Dumbarton, Talk:Cowal and the non-Scotland Talk:Commuter town (which also had archive nesting) all told the bot that archives will be at Talk:Cowal/Archives/. The archiving went to the right pages, but User:Cluebot III stored that information in pages like User:ClueBot III/Indices/Talk:River Clyde so now all archive infoboxes show the wrong archives. If you want to fix your archives, go to the all the corresponding pages and replace the wrong archive links with the actual archives. You can find them here: Special:PrefixIndex/Talk:River_Clyde/. It's possible that the bot does that automatically in the future, but it might just keep the old archives around. How did that happen? Someone copied the archive instructions from Cowal to other talk pages without changing the parameter in there. --mfb (talk) 12:41, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Scottish people

There have been very substantial changes made to the Scottish people article in the last day or so which strike me as requiring some scrutiny. @2A02:C7F:C7A:4A00:9402:A34A:22C7:8DB4: has made a start, removing or editing substantial sections of the additions and has commented on the talk page. I'm partly inclined to reverting further, to the status quo ante, and asking the editor to state their case though some of their additions may be of worth. Any views? Mutt Lunker (talk) 21:18, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Scottish parishes

How should we deal with Scottish parishes with respect to merging non notable articles to them and categorization? Category:Falkland, Fife that I created for example is only for the village (namely the census locality) even though Freuchie is located in the parish of Falkland. In the case of Category:Stanhope, County Durham (and Category:Rothwell, West Yorkshire an unparished area) in England the category is also for the parish which includes a far wider area such as Westgate, County Durham. I originally was under the impression that Scottish parishes were almost completely defunct, see Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2018 March 12#Rhives though I did favour targeting a parish at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 March 16#St Fort. However I have found that Canmore (select boundaries on the top right) does show parish boundaries and sources at each of the listed buildings articles for each parish (created by a bot in 2012) such as List of listed buildings in Falkland, Fife also uses parishes. I don't think that there's dispute that they are notable since defunct places remain notable anyway but should we be using them in categorization etc in a way that suggests that they're current? Obviously in cases like Raasay which is in Portree parish we would merge non notable topics to the island itself since we generally try to put in the lowest place reasonably possible but we should ask if Raasay and Category:Raasay should be in Category:Portree? Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:58, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Salmondgate?

Do we have an article dedicated to the current unpleasantness in the SNP? If not, should we? It seems the matter would easily pass GNG and there is enormous secondary source coverage. -Ad Orientem (talk) 23:30, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

I can help draft such an article if needed, but I would suggest a more neutral title like Scottish Government harassment inquiry or similar. PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 09:24, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

I'm a wee bit surprised we don't have one tbf. Perhaps Scottish Government harassment investigation inquiry or as the BBC often put it Inquiry into the Scottish Government's handling of harassment complaints? I agree that we shouldn't use Salmondgate as it's not a commonly used name for the whole ordeal but Scottish Government harassment inquiry sounds a bit like it was the Scottish Government who were doing the alleged harassment. Whatever name we pick, it's not going to be a simple one. Stevie fae Scotland (talk) 10:00, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Either of those sounds good Stevie fae Scotland, although I prefer the second one as it is more descriptive. PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 11:32, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

I agree that an article is needed and that it should be titled neutrally. But I'd caution that it needs to be handled very carefully due to the legal issues involved and that it might become a bit of a magnet for seriously inadvisable edits. PelicanPrize (talk) 16:26, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

I see JLo-Watson has created a draft (Draft:Alex Salmond scandal), I have also started one (Draft:Inquiry into the Scottish Government's handling of harassment complaints). JLo-Watson's draft is more complete than mine, but I am unsure whether "Alex Salmond scandal" is a suitable title considering that the focus is on the Scottish Government's handling of the complaints, not Alex Salmond himself (the trial is already covered at HM Advocate v Salmond). I would propose merging the two together when ready to move to mainspace. PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 19:49, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Good idea PinkPanda - The name of the article was something I struggled with myself honestly. I was thinking perhaps Salmond-Sturgeon standal/affair or the like but it’s a difficult one. Thanks :) JLo-Watson (talk) 21:23, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

JLo-Watson: I've copied some of the text from your draft to my one, and I'll work on adding more details before I move it to mainspace. You (and others) are more than welcome to help out if you wish. PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 18:42, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

Merge proposal

A proposal is currently listed at Talk:Moredun as to whether Craigour should be merged into it. Comments welcomed, thanks. Crowsus (talk) 21:51, 20 March 2021 (UTC)

FAR for Scottish Parliament

I have nominated Scottish Parliament for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. (t · c) buidhe 22:22, 16 January 2021 (UTC)

FAR for St Kilda

I have nominated St Kilda, Scotland for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. DrKay (talk) 17:45, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

Photos of cricket grounds

Hello WP:Scotland members. I'm just over from the Cricket Project. We're looking for editors to take pictures of cricket grounds which have hosted major matches at international/domestic level. Here are some cricket grounds in Scotland which we currently do not have photos for. It would be greatly appreciated if any project members living locally to these grounds were to dust off their cameras and take some photos! Thanks in advance. StickyWicket (talk) 09:02, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Hi, have you checked on Geograph [1], might be a few of those on there? You're probably already aware, but the first decade worth of contributions were uploaded automatically to Commons, but that hasn't happened with the second decade - but they are still eligible for Wikimedia and can be uploaded easily? Crowsus (talk) 09:34, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Hi Crowsus. I did check Geograph and the only one I could see that had any sort of photo was Shawholm, but the picture wasn't the best! StickyWicket (talk) 10:18, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

OK, thought you might have. Well, Shawholm, Uddingston and Titwood aren't a million miles from me so I might swing by at some point soon and try to grab something. Not going to Perth for that tho I'm afraid! Crowsus (talk) 10:21, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Crowsus if you could grab a few shots of those three that would be absolutely brilliant :) StickyWicket (talk) 12:05, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Proposed Glasgow Life article

Hi. I wanted to reach out for some local Editor assistance/guidance/support regarding my resumed attempt to create an article on Glasgow Life. Current draft is here: Draft:Glasgow Life. My talk page has comments and notes from my previous attempts to create the article.

This is a current and active topic in Glasgow, so I think there are even more compelling reasons to add an article. As many of you will know it's a big part of civic life in Glasgow too, and one of the largest charities in Scotland.

Would welcome any feedback or assistance or pointers.

Rleyton (talk) 10:16, 23 April 2021 (UTC)

Your draft article looks fine and with 17 varied references, I would support it meeting Wikipedia:Notability criteria. I would suggest perhaps incorporating the significance quote/sub-section into the lead as an alternative to its own sub-section. LordHarris 21:51, 16 May 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for your note. Apologies, I got rather side tracked at the time, and haven’t had a chance to revisit this.

Really appreciate your feedback, once draft article has been restored I’ll pick it up again. Rleyton (talk) 14:45, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

New Ministerial portraits now on Commons

Hey folks, heads up that I've transferred the new ministerial portraits from ScotGov's Flickr account to Commons, they can be found over here. I've been transferring over the contents of the Flickr (where it's appropriate for Commons) following ScotGov's agreement to change the license to -NC, to the category here, still a bit of work to do but there's some useful stuff in there that should be useful for folks here. Lirazelf (talk) 11:17, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

St Hilda Sea Adventures: Notable or not?

I found this article after looking to see if there was an article for the ship St Hilda. I'm unsure if it's notable or not; I thought the ship (which doesn't have an article) might be, but I'm less sure about the company. Does anybody have any advice on this? 92.24.246.11 (talk) 16:10, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

I would support the company and its ships meeting Wikipedia:Notability guidelines on their existing page, however I don't think the individual ship would warrant its own article. She is certainly a nice example of a Scottish ketch but I don't think notable enough for a separate article, as the references are mostly commercial/tourism related in nature. LordHarris (talk) 16:33, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

@LordHarris: Thanks :) 92.24.246.11 (talk) 21:01, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

@LordHarris: FYI, the article has ended up at AfD. 92.24.246.11 (talk) 22:56, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. I had a go at tidying up the article/adding references to see if it can be kept. LordHarris (talk) 08:44, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Source for date of death for David Anderson (judge)

Hi all. I am currently working on expanding Deaths in 1995 by adding and sourcing all articles in Category:1995 deaths. I can't find a source that verifies his date of death on 31 December 1995. If anyone is able to locate one, please ping me. Thanks.4meter4 (talk) 14:24, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

4meter4 would this do? This also lists a 1995 death, though just the year CiphriusKane (talk) 21:28, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

Arthur Conan Doyle has an RFC

Arthur Conan Doyle has an RFC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. Skyerise (talk) 23:34, 12 August 2021 (UTC)

RFC invitation

You're invited to an RFC at WP:YEARS. -- GoodDay (talk) 19:33, 14 August 2021 (UTC)

Proposed merger

The proposed merge of John Gray (nightwatchman) into Greyfriars Bobby needs more input. Please join the discussion. Schwede66 05:17, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Geographer Royal

Hello, I just created an article for Geographer Royal. Any help with the article would be appreciated. Thank you, Thriley (talk) 17:30, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Found a few more references LordHarris (talk) 18:08, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Nomination of Am Buidheann Dubh for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Am Buidheann Dubh is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Am Buidheann Dubh until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

Eastmain (talk • contribs) 19:37, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Census localities

I am tracking the census localities with User:Crouch, Swale/Scotland for changes as well as User:Crouch, Swale/Scotland BUA (A-E), User:Crouch, Swale/Scotland BUA (F-M) and User:Crouch, Swale/Scotland BUA (N-Z). The 1st is useful because I can check the newer list on City Population and compared them to the older one with "show changes". The 2nd lists are useful for checking if articles get deleted or merged incorrectly since they will then show up as red links, or in my case green links for redirects. There are 4 missing articles:

• Eastfield, Shotts
• Hillhead, South Ayrshire
• Marywell, Banchory-Devenick

Which are OS settlements and there is also one that isn't an OS settlement:

• Glenochil Village

The most recently created articles were Comrie, Fife (2020), Netherburn (2019) and Carstairs Junction (2019). Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:11, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

I don't know of a Marywell in Banchory-Devenick. Do you mean Marywell in Portlethen? I understand it was treated as a separate locality for the first time at the last census, whereas previously it was included with the rest of Portlethen. There's not much there of interest, and I don't think it merits an article in its own right - at present it doesn't even get a mention in the main Portlethen article. Although we presently have separate articles for some parts of Portlethen, such as Findon, Downies, Portlethen Village, these are arguably the more historic parts. Hillside and Marywell are mostly modern developments, and are probably best covered in the main article on Portlethen. --Hrossey (talk) 22:26, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

"Marywell" near Portlethen, "Banchory-Devenick" is the name of the civil parish as there are 2 in Aberdeenshire[2]. Crouch, Swale (talk) 11:29, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

Crouch, Swale – I will endeavour to update {{Scottish locality populations}} and {{Scottish settlement populations}} with the new data when I have a chance. PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 21:41, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Actually, on closer inspection of the City Population website it seems that the 2020 figures are estimates for the best-fit datazones, not the locality populations themselves. I think we should stick to the official data for the time being, even if it's a few years out if date – the intervals for settlement/locality estimates seem to be every four years (the last two were 2012 and 2016), so hopefully there is a new release due some time soon. PinkPanda272 (talk/contribs) 21:47, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, it it possible to work out which ones don't have the template transcluded, this may show a missing article, the template needs to be added or perhaps the place isn't notable. I've only used the City Population website but if the official data is more reliable the use that. Crouch, Swale (talk) 21:51, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Project on Loch Ness

Over the next week, there is going to be a work project on Loch Ness by the Wikipedia Discord server as part of an attempt to get Loch Ness to B-class and we would appreciate your help. They are trying to get all vital articles to B-class. (Oinkers42) (talk) 00:13, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Highland Clearances

Hi, i'm concerned that the Highland Clearances article has been rewritten with too much of a revisionist point of view favouring the landowners' justifications of their actions. Copy of my comments on the article talkpage: "It seems one editor, @ThoughtIdRetired: has rewritten this article and changed it's point of view significantly from the 2018 version here so that the views and justifications of the landlords are given a much greater prominence. There have been many contradicting edits in the page history which the said editor has reverted. Most of the sources are offline but the Brittania Encyclopedia shows a very different interpetation, see here - the Brittanica article was recently revised by the manager of the history section. Am hoping to discuss the article with a local history export in the next week or so, regards Atlantic306 (talk) 01:36, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Reading and comparing the difference article from 2018 and the article of now, I would agree the article has definitely been edited heavily towards a certain historical perspective. Also, potentially concerning is that the references have been reduced down from 67 to 51 in that time. It may be just cleanup but still I think it would warrant a closer look from some other editors with a better knowledge of the Clearances. As a general reader, I found the last paragraph of the lead almost anti-NPOV. I also observed the article is heavy on several references but no page numbers are given to support such a large body of cited text from a few sources. Coldupnorth (talk) 08:33, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

RFC at WP:WALES

An RFC is taking place at WP:WALES, concerning the incumbent section of Year in Wales articles. Input there, would be appreciated. 13:52, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

Missing Council logos

Just flagging up that I noticed on this page that the logos for

• Angus Council, and
• East Lothian Councils are missing

Angus' logo can be found here

Working on another project today - so no time to fix right now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Watty62 (talk • contribs) 15:59, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

Irish-Scots page move

Not sure how I view this page move and the subsequent one but it should have been discussed. Others may have a view. Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:05, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Hazel Hutcheon at AfD

Please see this AfD for the Scottish skier. Thanks. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 08:57, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

RFC on lead of devolution in the United kingdom

Their is an RFC going on here which may be of interest to editors who are interested in Scotland.--Llewee (talk) 16:12, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

new memorial stone for battle of Littleferry

planing to do some editing on the article. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Littleferry looking for support https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/highlands-islands/3846096/highland-community-plans-to-turn-forgotten-battle-into-an-annual-event/?fbclid=IwAR3Soiw3H5VBupPmvErRurNYC2fqrD3NJuP2tBybeD4P0821GsPTG0VL3Bg Ballancier (talk) 15:14, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Looking to speak to UK based Wikipedia editors

Hi there,

My name is Victoria and I work at the cross-party UK think-tank Demos. We bring the voices of the public into policymaking, and a big focus for us is bringing those voices into political debates about the future of online life.

Right now, we’re listening to people who earn low or no pay from their online work, to understand what they think a fair and desirable future would look like when it comes to being paid for this work.

We are looking at this because new technology could make it easier for people to monetise their work online, instead of relying on existing ways of being paid such as advertisers, subscribers, and through traditional platforms. We are keen to hear perspectives both from people who would like to monetise their online work and from those who would not find such an option desirable, for example, those who volunteer their time online, view their content creation as a hobby or feel getting paid would negatively change the nature of the work they do.

I’m posting here to see if there are any wiki editors that would be interested in taking part in this project. We believe perspectives like yours should be included in decisions about how people are paid for their work online. The outputs of this project will be social media content, a short report and a site that highlights the views that come out of the workshops. Through these we will try to shape the debates held by politicians, the media and tech companies about how online payment for work is run.

It would involve joining a 1.5 hour Zoom workshop with others who do work online across various platforms, where we’d discuss as a group people’s experiences and how the systems for being paid for online work could be improved.

We will need your email and the name you would like to use in the workshop. We would record the Zoom call for our research but would delete this on completion of the project. We recognise that this discussion would touch on sensitive personal information, and all personal data would be handled and stored in accordance with Demos’ privacy policy, which can be found here. If we use any quotes from you, we will reach out to you first to check if this is okay, and we can use a pseudonym if you prefer.

You would be paid £125 for your time and we would try to organise the call at a time that is convenient for all. At present the workshop is scheduled to run in the week beginning 9 May but there is some flexibility here to move the call forward if that week proves difficult for people.

This project is funded by Grant for the Web (you can read their announcement about the project here), a fund to boost open, fair, and inclusive standards and innovation in web monetisation. Demos itself is an independent, cross-party charity and has control over how the project is run.

Thank you for taking the time to read through this. If you are interested in taking part or would like to learn more, please contact me at victoria.baines@demos.co.uk and I can provide further information. Vbdemos (talk) 12:28, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

• There are replies at Wikipedia talk:UK Wikipedians' notice board#Looking to speak to UK based wikipedia editors, a similar post. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 16:30, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Scotland opentask

Template:Scotland opentask has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the entry on the Templates for discussion page. Nigej (talk) 14:46, 12 March 2022 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Craigie, Perth and Kinross#Requested move 23 March 2022

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Craigie, Perth and Kinross#Requested move 23 March 2022 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. 🐶 EpicPupper ^{(he/him | talk)} 07:01, 9 April 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Edinburgh in popular culture

Strange you weren't notified of this! Johnbod (talk) 18:06, 20 April 2022 (UTC)

User script to detect unreliable sources

Main page: User:Headbomb/unreliable

I have (with the help of others) made a small user script to detect and highlight various links to unreliable sources and predatory journals. Some of you may already be familiar with it, given it is currently the 39th most imported script on Wikipedia. The idea is that it takes something like

• John Smith "Article of things" Deprecated.com. Accessed 2020-02-14. (John Smith "[https://www.deprecated.com/article Article of things]" ''Deprecated.com''. Accessed 2020-02-14.)

and turns it into something like

• John Smith "Article of things" Deprecated.com. Accessed 2020-02-14.

It will work on a variety of links, including those from {{cite web}}, {{cite journal}} and {{doi}}.

The script is mostly based on WP:RSPSOURCES, WP:NPPSG and WP:CITEWATCH and a good dose of common sense. I'm always expanding coverage and tweaking the script's logic, so general feedback and suggestions to expand coverage to other unreliable sources are always welcomed.

Do note that this is not a script to be mindlessly used, and several caveats apply. Details and instructions are available at User:Headbomb/unreliable. Questions, comments and requests can be made at User talk:Headbomb/unreliable.

- Headbomb {t · c · p · b}

This is a one time notice and can't be unsubscribed from. Delivered by: MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:02, 29 April 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ben Cruachan Quarry Branch

This AfD might be of interest, as well as the precipitating deprecation of RailScot as a source (previously used in 1489 links from articles) which was recently decided without apparently notifying this project. Cheers, Espresso Addict (talk) 23:14, 21 May 2022 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:John Stewart, 3rd Lord of Aubigny#Requested move 22 May 2022

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:John Stewart, 3rd Lord of Aubigny#Requested move 22 May 2022 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 05:22, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

Lowland Scots people

A sizeable Lowland Scots people article has appeared today. It's copiously referenced but my initial impression is that, at least to some extent, it may be advancing original research or synthesising sources to advance a thesis not fully supported by them. Also, if what it says is of significance, it would surely already be covered in this project by now? Mutt Lunker (talk) 23:28, 16 April 2022 (UTC)

Agree with your assessment from what I've read. Some of it is somewhat contradictory and some of the fulsome reference explanations, in my opinion anyway, don't justify the interpretations reached. I think scrutiny of the sources is needed. Willing to do some of that as time permits. Bill Reid | (talk) 16:33, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

Haven't looked into the references themselves but my initial suspicion is this has been created with selective sources (see Background section in particular) as a means to reinforce the idea that lowland Scottish people are the same as English people in all significant historical aspects, thus diminishing Scots as a separate modern-day cultural identity. Crowsus (talk) 17:48, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

Scots Gaelic people has similarly sprung into existence, with similar concerns. Mutt Lunker (talk) 20:32, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

Since proposed for merger. Mutt Lunker (talk) 11:10, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

Oban railway station clean-up needed

Hi, participants may be interested in helping 'restore' this page - and the other stations along the Oban branch line - with more inline references (when I found this page earlier today, I think there was one in total). Please do contribute if you are able to. Thanks. Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 07:25, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

---

Further down the line, if anyone would like to - or be able to - help with cleaning up the "Rockfall Risk" section on the page about the Falls of Cruachan derailment, it would be most appreciated. Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 15:41, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Death and state funeral of Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani#Requested move 25 September 2022

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Death and state funeral of Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani#Requested move 25 September 2022 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. UtherSRG (talk) 10:50, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

That probably was cryptic... why do we care about that? This RM involves about 50 state funeral articles, including at least one that is related to this WP. - UtherSRG (talk) 12:16, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

Cutty-sark (witch) listed at Requested moves (rename article)

A Requested move discussion (rename article) has been initiated for Cutty-sark (witch). Please join the discussion here. Sangdeboeuf (talk) 13:06, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Template:Sustainable development in Scotland

I am not convinced that the inclusion of North of Scotland Hydro-Electric Board in the private sector section of Template:Sustainable development in Scotland is right. The organisation was specifically a public body, as there was political unease at private companies being responsible for the management of such natural resources at the time, and a number of private schemes were voted down by the Commons on that basis. There is not a "State sector" section in the template, and I wonder if the "Private sector" section would be better as "Organisations". I raise the issue here rather than just altering the template, as I am not sure that it will get spotted if I put it on the talk page for the template, and I think it deserves discussion. Who looks at such talk pages anyway? Any thoughts? Bob1960evens (talk) 17:40, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

In the absence of comment, I have created a Public Sector list within the template. Bob1960evens (talk) 00:00, 16 November 2022 (UTC)

Glasgow Life

Hi. I'm refreshing my attempts to get an article together on Draft:Glasgow Life the charitable body that manages cultural and sports in Glasgow. I've incorporated previous feedback from my previous efforts on this draft. Alas life got in the way and wasn't able to work through to requesting review in 2021, but really hope to do so over next wee while.

Would appreciate any further feedback from any Scotland based editors. I genuinely feel there's a strong case for this charitable entity to have its own Wikipedia page. Have endeavoured to make that case in the reviewed opening paragraph,

Rleyton (talk) 16:30, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

Mansfield Place Church

Hi. I have some problems with references in Mansfield Place Church. Can someone help me? Thank you in advance. MrKeefeJohn (talk) 08:57, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

problem solved. Anyway the article is a stub, if someone would improve it, will be good. MrKeefeJohn (talk) 17:14, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Arbroath

Arbroath has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Onegreatjoke (talk) 18:25, 22 January 2023 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Glasgow, Paisley, Kilmarnock and Ayr Railway

Glasgow, Paisley, Kilmarnock and Ayr Railway has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Onegreatjoke (talk) 16:22, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

Aberdeen Editathon

We're running an Aberdeen Editathon under the guidance of Dr Sara Thomas on 18 March 2023. We aim to improve on some Aberdeen articles. See https://codethecity.org/ctc28 for more details, booking etc. Hope to see some of you there! Watty62 (talk) 19:01, 18 February 2023 (UTC)

Priority pages for creation

I've added these pages for creation. Equivalent pages can be seen for Wales.

• Science and technology in Scotland
• Food and drink industry in Scotland
• Manufacturing in Scotland
• Mining in Scotland

Titus Gold (talk) 18:55, 19 February 2023 (UTC)

Request for editor assistance at Talk:Duncan Bannatyne

Hi, WikiProject Scotland! I have started a discussion at Talk:Duncan Bannatyne in which I request your expertise. The comment concerns a claim, in the article since August 2011, that Duncan Bannatyne, a Scottish entrepreneur, was involved in the Glasgow ice cream wars of the 1980s. Thank you! _MB190417_ (talk) 18:46, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

FAR

I have nominated Scottish Parliament Building for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" in regards to the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Desertarun (talk) 09:15, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Deborah Kerr

Deborah Kerr has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:29, 12 March 2023 (UTC)

Glenfinnan Monument

I've posted this on the Glenfinnan Monument Talkpage but thought it might get a wider readership here. Our article on the monument claims that it is dedicated to Loudon's Highlanders. This doesn't appear to be cited and it's not mentioned in the Historic Environment Scotland entry, nor in the National Trust for Scotland entry, here. According to our entry on Loudon's regiment, they fought against Charles Edward Stuart, so I'm struggling to understand why the monument, often called the Jacobite monument, would be dedicated to them. Does anyone have a source/explanation that would clarify? KJP1 (talk) 08:48, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

I'd agree, it seems contrary to cited facts and indeed to the rest of the article, not least it having been erected by Glenaladale. It was changed from a redirect to Glenfinnan to an article in its own right on 21st October 2021 but this fact was not one found in the parent article. Perhaps @Seasider53:, who created it as a separate article, could shed some light as to the source? Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:29, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

Agred, though I checked back to see if I could find anything contemporary. The earliest published ref to it I have turned up is from 1822, and makes no reference to Loudon's - it confirms that this was the original commemorative text. "On the spot where Prince Charles Edward first raised his standard ... this column was erected by Alexander Macdonald Esq of Glenaladale, to commemorate the generous zeal, the undaunted bravery, and the inviolable fidelity of his forefathers, and the rest of those who fought and bled in that arduous and unfortunate enterprise". Andrew Gray (talk) 13:08, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

Many thanks for the responses, It certainly “feels” odd. I’ll wait to see if Seasider53 responds to the ping. KJP1 (talk) 13:41, 19 March 2023 (UTC)

RfC on nearly identical sentence about writing letter to the Guardian opposing Scottish Independence in many articles

There are 149 articles on Wikipedia using the phrase "was one of 200 public figures who were signatories to a letter" with the surrounding context explaining that it was the letter in the Guardian opposing Scottish Independence from August 2014. Should this be included in articles as is? TartarTorte 13:50, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

• I feel that this is probably a notable part of someone's politics, so it should probably be in the page in some way; however, I have a concern about the very similar phrases appearing on the pages as they currently do. TartarTorte 13:54, 15 February 2023 (UTC)
• Many of these people are not really notable for politics. I'd say include if there are secondary sources discussing the person signing the letter, but not if the only source is the list of signatories itself. —Mx. Granger (talk · contribs) 16:41, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

Peter Murrell investigation

Hi all. There's a lot going on around the Peter Murrell/SNP investigation. It would be great if more editors could input to the Operation Branchform article covering this. Thanks. Bondegezou (talk) 10:18, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

Project-independent quality assessments

Quality assessments by Wikipedia editors rate articles in terms of completeness, organization, prose quality, sourcing, etc. Most wikiprojects follow the general guidelines at Wikipedia:Content assessment, but some have specialized assessment guidelines. A recent Village pump proposal was approved and has been implemented to add a |class= parameter to {{WikiProject banner shell}}, which can display a general quality assessment for an article, and to let project banner templates "inherit" this assessment.

No action is required if your wikiproject follows the standard assessment approach. Over time, quality assessments will be migrated up to {{WikiProject banner shell}}, and your project banner will automatically "inherit" any changes to the general assessments for the purpose of assigning categories.

However, if your project has decided to "opt out" and follow a non-standard quality assessment approach, all you have to do is modify your wikiproject banner template to pass {{WPBannerMeta}} a new |QUALITY_CRITERIA=custom parameter. If this is done, changes to the general quality assessment will be ignored, and your project-level assessment will be displayed and used to create categories, as at present. Aymatth2 (talk) 13:54, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

New Scotland related articles to be considered

Following a recent expansion of Wales (see Wikipedia:WikiProject Wales) related content, the creation of similar articles may be of interest to WikiProject Scotland.

Other potential articles could include:

• Foreign relations of Scotland (see Foreign relations of Wales)
• Science and technology in Scotland (see Science and technology in Wales)
• Food and drink industry in Scotland (see Food and drink industry of Wales)
• Manufacturing in Scotland (see Manufacturing in Wales)
• Mining in Scotland (see Mining in Wales)
• Armed forces in Scotland (see Armed forces in Wales)
• List of cities in Scotland (see List of cities in Wales and List of built-up areas in Wales by population)
• Scotland in the World Wars (see Wales in the World Wars)
• Irreligion in Scotland (see Irreligion in Wales)

I would be more than happy to collaborate on any of these or others which may be needed. I recently published both List of highest mountains in Scotland and List of highest mountains in Wales for example. Thanks! Titus Gold (talk) 01:25, 14 April 2023 (UTC)

England, Scotland, etc. vs UK in concert articles

There is a discussion regarding the use of England, Scotland, etc. versus UK in lists of concert locations. Please add any comments at WT:WikiProject Concerts#England, Scotland, etc. vs UK. Thanks. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:41, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

Scottish district tartans

List of tartans could use some attention by someone with time on their hands. Notably, it is missing a section on the Scottish district tartans (while including information on Canadian, American, etc., ones).  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  07:17, 9 May 2023 (UTC)

Tartan#Clan tartans

I've just overhauled the Tartans article to finally have (again?) a coherent section on the history of clan tartans and their adoption (and redirects like Clan tartan and Scottish clan tartans go there). I also fixed up a bunch of other deficiencies in the article over the last few days but am not done yet.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  08:51, 14 May 2023 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Lothian Buses

Lothian Buses has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Onegreatjoke (talk) 05:03, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Kirking of the tartan

I'm posting this here for lack of a better place. It's an entirely Scottish diaspora topic, and not related (that I know of) to Scotland per se. Edit: Actually, I already found a source that suggests a Scottish origin [3]

Anyway, the gist: We have no article at Kirking of the tartan (or obvious alternative spellings like Kirkin' o' the tartan). It's mentioned in passing at Kirk as a Novia Scotian tradition, but everything I see about it from Google hits says it's a pan-North American thing, also found all over the place in the US, but most especially in the eastern South (Georgia, the Carolinas). Also found a source [4] that says it's done in "Australasia" which I think is an over-generalisation for Australia and New Zealand in particular. I would create a WP:STUB on this, but I've been up to my eyeballs for weeks overhauling the Tartan article and getting ready to split off some subtopics like Clan tartan and Regimental tartan.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  04:40, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

PS: I realize that actual Scots probably consider this diasporic ritual pretty ridiculous; but it's still an encyclopedic topic (including why it has little to do with proper Scottish culture).  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  12:00, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Missing article: Clydesideism

Clydesideism or Clydesidism or Clydeside-ism has been written about pretty extensively in media-crit and sociology as one of three pervasive but contradictory media-driven (and perhaps masculist) stereotypes of "Scottishness" (along with kailyard and tartanry), but we don't have an article on it. I've opened a thread with some initial sources at Talk:Tartanry#Clydesideism  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  05:37, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

Clan societies

We probably need an article, or at least a section at Scottish clan, on Scottish clan society as a concept. It is mentioned at Scottish clan, but the reader of that article is apt to be completely confused about the difference between an actual clan, a modern-day clan society, and the old general Celtic/Highland/Gaelic societies. PS: Yes, I realize this is predominantly a Scottish diaspora topic, but there's not a better place I can think of to post about this, and some of these organisations were in fact founded in Scotland (one of the earliest, the Clan Gregor Society, was set up in 1822).  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  06:21, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Found establishment dates (in Scotland) for a bunch more of these: Buchanan Society, inaugurated in 1725; Clan Chattan in 1727; the Graham Charitable Society in 1759; McKay's Society in 1806. The Clan Gregor Society was the next to appear in 1822 (not as relatively old as I thought above), and this seems to have been the extent of them until the late 19th to early 20th centuries, when there was a boom in them. The 1890s saw 16 more of them founded, including Lamont, Maclean, Colquhoun, and Campbell associations. Earliest one outside Scotland might be the American Clan Gregor Society, formed in Virginia, 1909. Got all this from:

• Armstrong, Fiona Kathryne (31 August 2017). Highlandism: Its value to Scotland and how a queen and two aristocratic women promoted the phenomenon in the Victorian age (PhD). University of Strathclyde. pp. 249, 252. doi:10.48730/2m47-md74.

 — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  04:44, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

Use of "the three kingdoms" as a term outside of the 1639-1651 wars

Hello WPScotland, I noticed Jacobitism has a rather prominent section describing various movements "in the three kingdoms", referring to England, Scotland, and Ireland together, and I wanted to ask around on the project pages to see if such a title is actually backed up outside of the context of Charles I of England and the Wars of the Three Kingdoms.

Three Kingdoms (disambiguation) seems inconclusive on the subject and in general this style of terminology seems like it shouldn't be employed without something in the text to back it up, as titling a section "in the three kingdoms" rather than "in the British Isles" or "in England, Scotland, and Ireland" implies it to be an established term the reader can already be presumed to be familiar with. Orchastrattor (talk) 17:17, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

I may be wrong but my impression of the usage in the Jacobitism article is that it is only intended idiomatically in the one usage of the term Wars of the Three Kingdoms, in the lede. In the Jacobitism#Political_background section, I see it as referring back to mention of "first monarch of England, Scotland and Ireland" in the first sentence but that could be made clearer by rephrasing as "first monarch of the kingdoms of...". It might, though, appear to be intended to be idiomatic in the "in the three kingdoms" section heading, so spelling out instead "in England, Scotland and Ireland" seems clearer and preferable to me. Mutt Lunker (talk) 18:13, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Joan Beaufort, Queen of Scots#Requested move 6 June 2023

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Joan Beaufort, Queen of Scots#Requested move 6 June 2023 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. - 🔥𝑰𝒍𝒍𝒖𝒔𝒊𝒐𝒏 𝑭𝒍𝒂𝒎𝒆 (𝒕𝒂𝒍𝒌)🔥 15:12, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Rare book

Any chance someone in here who is in the UK (or otherwise in Europe) could get this book: [5]?

• de Heere, Lucas (1937) [1567]. Chotzen, Th. M.; Draak, A. M. E. (eds.). Beschrijving der Britsche Eilanden. Antwerp: De Sikkel.

It's very rare (450 copies printed, most surviving ones are in BeNeLux libraries), but going for a paltry €15.49 – from a vendor who only ships within the EU, so I'm stuck and can't get it. It contains the earliest known image of a Highlander in tartan (1567); need a scan of this for the Tartan article. The only other book I know of with a facsimile of it is J. T. Dunbar's History of Highland Dress, but it is the author's own line-art sketch based on the original, so it is not a PD image. I'm willing to PayPal you the cost of the book in exchange for the image (you keep the book, though hopefully scan other stuff from it; it probably also has a variety of other good images we could use on Commons). I've looked on Google Books, Internet Archive, etc., but there's no free scan of the book anywhere that I can find. PS: I did find a "back door" way to order it from the same vendor, through AbeBooks [6] but the postage alone is $45.97 so I would rather not if I don't have to.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  00:14, 17 June 2023 (UTC)

Never mind. I bit the bullet and ordered it, despite the stupendous shipping cost, because it won't be available for long.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  22:37, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Draft:The Abbey of St Mary, Haddington

Hello, WikiProject Scotland,

I came across this expiring draft today and thought this abbey that might be of minor historical interest. The editor who created it has been gone for six months but I thought that maybe there was someone who cared about Scottish history or Scottish religious history that would be interested in cleaning it up and resubmitting it for review. I know you all have articles of your own that you are working on but I thought I'd give this a shot. Thanks for considering this request. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:19, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

Request for peer review of Victorian era

I've been working on the article about the Victorian era a great deal this year and have recently got it to good article status. I'm hopping to get it to featured article status over the next few months which would be my first featured article. What kind of changes do you think would be needed to get their?

Link to peer review page: Wikipedia:Peer review/Victorian era/archive1 Llewee (talk) 14:46, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

Discussion at Isla Bryson case

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Isla Bryson case#RfC on the inclusion of Isla Bryson's former name, which is within the scope of this WikiProject. This RfC is on the application of MOS:GENDERID in relation to Bryson's former name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by BilledMammal (talk • contribs) 20:54, 10 July 2023 (UTC)

Glasgow Kelvin College

An IP editor recently tried a major spammy update to this, with chunks lifted from the college website, which was reverted, but the new names of director and principal were correct and I've sourced and updated them. I also tweaked the bit about the defunct Gazelle Group, and updated the name of the sponsored basketball team, but someone familiar with Glasgow and/or Scottish FE might like to have a go at updating the rest of the article. PamD 13:10, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

Homecoming Scotland 2014

Need an article at Homecoming Scotland 2014, the followup event series to Homecoming Scotland 2009; I gather the 2014 one was even a bigger deal than the 2009 one.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  00:33, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

In/around Dundee?

It would be great if someone from the Dundee vicinity (or going there soon) would go to the V&A Dundee Tartan exhibition and photograph the separate exihibits for Commons.Wikimedia.org, like this pic on Facebook. I think the exhibition ends early in 2024. It would be of great use to have pictures of historical tartan clothing for articles like Highland dress, Tartan, etc. If the 3rd-century Falkirk tartan happens to be one exhibit there, it would be ideal to have a photo of it and the reconstruction of what it probably looked like when freshly woven (we presently only can link to external sources that provides pictures like this, since there are no free ones to upload to Commons). Same goes for a pic of the reconstruction of the 16th-century Glen Affric tartan (we do have a pic of the original now), and same goes for pics of the original and reconstructed Dungiven tartan of c. 1590–1650. I'm not sure exactly what is on display at V&A Dundee, though. I think the jacket of the Ancient Caledonian Society of London (c. 1786) is there, along with the original Royal Company of Archers uniform of the early 18th century, and probably lots of Highland regiment uniform stuff.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  06:21, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

GlobalScot, and Scottish Connections Framework

Two Scottish Government programs that need coverage, either in their own articles or as sections in larger-ministry articles:

• GlobalScot (founded 2001), is an international business network to help Scottish businesses and entrepreneurs with worldwide business connections.
• Scottish Connections Framework, (since 2023) is a program for outreach to members of the diaspora who want "to live, work, study, visit, or do business in Scotland".

References

 — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  09:12, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Kailyard school#Requested move 22 July 2023

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Kailyard school#Requested move 22 July 2023 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. CLYDE ^{TALK TO ME}/_{STUFF DONE} 19:13, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

Kilmarnock RFC

Long shot, I know, but does anyone have a copy of Kilmarnock - More Than a Game by JFT Thomson, the History of Kilmarnock Rugby Club from 1868–1973? Or even if you know of a library which has a copy? I'm working on Draft:History of Kilmarnock F.C. and I want to know if my suspicions that the football club and the rugby club were the same thing between 1868 and 1872 are correct or not. The histories of the football club point to it being formed in 1868 (the same as the rugby club) and a split in the membership forced a rule change in 1872 effectively ruling out any future matches under rugby rules so, as a result, one club became two. Any help would be much appreciated. Stevie fae Scotland (talk) 15:47, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Celtic nations category

Just dropping a line to notify that Category:Celtic nations has been nominated for deletion, which seems to me to be a bit odd. Comments welcome on the CfD page --Tóraí (talk) 18:14, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

White space

Wondering if anyone here can help out. Election results transcribed from 2022 Glasgow City Council election to the individual ward pages are creating a lot of white space (see Linn (ward) as an example) but I can't figure out why. There's no white space on the main page and the wiki markup looks identical to those transcribed from 2022 East Ayrshire Council election but there's no white space created there (see Ballochmyle (ward) as an example). Any help would be greatly appreciated. Stevie fae Scotland (talk) 11:26, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure why, but doing this seems to have fixed it. Perhaps it's something to do with the transcludable section code? Number 57 11:56, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. I'm stumped by it but I'll ask at the module talk page and see. Stevie fae Scotland (talk) 15:07, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Answered at Wikipedia:Help desk#Module:Transcludable section. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:50, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Women in Green's 5th Edit-a-thon

Hello WikiProject Scotland:

WikiProject Women in Green is holding a month-long Good Article Edit-a-thon event in October 2023!

Running from October 1 to 31, 2023, WikiProject Women in Green (WiG) is hosting a Good Article (GA) edit-a-thon event with the theme Around the World in 31 Days! All experience levels welcome. Never worked on a GA project before? We'll teach you how to get started. Or maybe you're an old hand at GAs – we'd love to have you involved! Participants are invited to work on nominating and/or reviewing GA submissions related to women and women's works (e.g., books, films) during the event period. We hope to collectively cover article subjects from at least 31 countries (or broader international articles) by month's end. GA resources and one-on-one support will be provided by experienced GA editors, and participants will have the opportunity to earn a special WiG barnstar for their efforts.

We hope to see you there!

Grnrchst (talk) 14:01, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

List of cities in Scotland

See the new page, List of cities in Scotland. The article could do with some additional development of the history of city status. Thanks Titus Gold (talk) 21:03, 29 October 2023 (UTC)

AfD comment request

Comments welcomed please on the deletion discussion for 2 Atlantic Square, an office building in Glasgow. Crowsus (talk) 17:00, 11 November 2023 (UTC)

Fitba related shennanigans...

Hello all! : )

If I have the time, I feel like the Scottish footy related pages are in a sorry state, like the SPFL, tbh...

whoops, sorry, but I am very passionate aboot oor game. : P ΤΕΡΡΑΣΙΔΙΩΣ(^Ταλκ) 21:52, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

FAR for Shapinsay

I have nominated Shapinsay for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" in regards to the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Z1720 (talk) 17:04, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

Revival of Scottish Gaelic task force and articles needing assessment

Hello everyone, I have been working recently on reviving the previously semi-active Scottish Gaelic task force attached to this WikiProject as I have an interest in the language and would like to improve coverage of Gaelic-related topics here on the English Wikipedia. As part of this, I have added a range of articles related to Scottish Gaelic to the task force (and to WikiProject Scotland), so the main task going forward in relation to this if anyone is interested is to assess these articles for quality and importance using WP Scotland's assessment criteria. At the time of writing this, there are 66 unassessed articles. I also wanted to take this as an opportunity to encourage any editors interested in contributing to Scottish Gaelic-related topics or who simply want to help out to add their name to the list of members on the task force page (you don't need to speak Gaelic), and if anyone knows of more articles that could be assigned to the task force (Gaelic speakers, literature, music, film, organisations e.t.c.), to add them to the task force. Mòran taing/many thanks, Redtree21 (talk) 09:58, 27 November 2023 (UTC)

Rosemarkie

Is there anyone here who lives near Rosemarkie? Our article Eliza Junor would greatly benefit from a photograph of her gravestone. Who knows, perhaps there is also scope for a second picture at Rosemarkie, if there is anything of interest there apart from the seafront. Doric Loon (talk) 15:37, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

Scottish Green party article

Hello.

I've ended up embarking on a massive update of the Scottish Greens article. I started a little a few months ago with Patrick Harvie and Lorna Slater's pages, but have since expanded my ambitions!

Anyway if anyone is interested in Scottish Green politics and fixing up what was a pretty poor article for a party in government, feel free to help me out Nordrhein-Westfalen-CanlntoSpace (talk) 08:17, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Kingdom of Great Britain#Requested move 26 December 2023

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Kingdom of Great Britain#Requested move 26 December 2023 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Polyamorph (talk) 08:41, 2 January 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Colin MacKay (journalist, born 1944)#Requested move 6 January 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Colin MacKay (journalist, born 1944)#Requested move 6 January 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 12:40, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:English invasion of Scotland (1400)#Requested move 9 January 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:English invasion of Scotland (1400)#Requested move 9 January 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 15:47, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

Low quality edits at Scotland

I'm alarmed at the sweeping nature and highly variable quality of recent edits at the Scotland article by an editor who is prone to reference poorly, verification routinely failed, to introduce outright errors, to express their material poorly, with typos and grammatical errors and to leave a requirement for copious remedial work in their wake, if one can pick through the sizeable changes. (See Talk:Scotland#Sweeping_and_inattentive_changes). This is stated as a campaign to bring the article to GA standard but seems destined to do the reverse.

I have been aware of this style for some years now and there is no evident improvement or awareness of the deficient nature of their edits. Though I haven't noticed this as a particular feature in the edits at Scotland, they have also failed to heed warnings re repeated copyvios.

Other editors have made efforts to correct some of their errors, at this and other articles, but I fear much is being missed and there is every sign that there is much more to come. More scrutiny would be welcome. 22:32, 11 January 2024 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mutt Lunker (talk • contribs) 22:32, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hillhouse (ward)

More opinions would be welcomed on the above AfD discussion on Hillhouse (ward), thanks. Crowsus (talk) 17:02, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Evanton

Evanton has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 03:47, 31 January 2024 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Coatbridge

Coatbridge has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Hog Farm _Talk 15:26, 10 February 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Anne, Queen of Great Britain#Requested move 15 February 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Anne, Queen of Great Britain#Requested move 15 February 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Векочел (talk) 13:14, 17 February 2024 (UTC)

MFD of WikiProject Glasgow and Lanarkshire

This project may be interested in discussing the proposed deletion of two newly-created projects (Wikipedia:WikiProject Glasgow and Wikipedia:WikiProject Lanarkshire) at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:WikiProject Glasgow. Thanks. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 20:18, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

FA review: Edward I

I have nominated Edward I of England for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" in regards to the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Jim Killock (talk) 21:31, 20 February 2024 (UTC)

County flags discussion

A discussion has been opened at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject UK geography#County flags: discussion 1 concerning the UK county flags, which you are welcome to participate in. Thanks, A.D.Hope (talk) 11:18, 10 March 2024 (UTC)

Peer Review - Muckrach Castle

Any comments welcome at Wikipedia:Peer_review/Muckrach_Castle/archive1 whilst the PR is ongoing, thank you. -Kj cheetham (talk) 17:02, 10 March 2024 (UTC)

Merge discussion at 2024 Scottish government crisis

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:2024 Scottish government crisis, which is within the scope of this WikiProject. There is a proposal to merge this article into Bute House Agreement. Clyde1998 (talk) 10:29, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Ae Fond Kiss...#Requested move 1 May 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Ae Fond Kiss...#Requested move 1 May 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 14:21, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Robert Gordon University – Garthdee campus

The article Robert Gordon University – Garthdee campus has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

This whole page reads like an overly detailed promotional pamphlet for the Robert Gordon University, and the main Robert Gordon University article has most, if not all, of the useful information from this article in its Garthdee campus section

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. UltrasonicMadness (talk) 01:03, 22 May 2024 (UTC)

Nationality discussion at Talk:Snow Patrol

There is a discussion currently ongoing at Talk:Snow Patrol regarding a controversial change in the band's nationality, which may be of interest to project members. The discussion is titled Change Snow Patrol from Scottish Rock Band to Northern Irish Rock Band. Thanks. HorrorLover555 (talk) 16:27, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:James V of Scotland#Requested move 7 June 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:James V of Scotland#Requested move 7 June 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Векочел (talk) 02:36, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Ae Fond Kiss (song)#Requested move 1 June 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Ae Fond Kiss (song)#Requested move 1 June 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Safari Scribe^{Edits! Talk!} 22:17, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

RFC at RSN: The Telegraph on trans issues

Hello! There is an RFC at the reliable sources noticeboard regarding a subject relevant to this Wikiproject. BilledMammal (talk) 06:44, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

UK sub-national geographic flags discussion

I've opened a new discussion at WikiProject:UK geography about sub-national UK flags, including historic county and council area flags. Anyone is welcome to participate. A.D.Hope (talk) 10:12, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

Shapinsay at FAR

Shapinsay was nominated for a featured article review in November of last year. I had dealt with the bulk of the queries by March this year. After some additional input there has been no further comment for over a month. However, so far only one editor has been kind enough to support FA status being retained. The discussion page is at Wikipedia:Featured article review/Shapinsay/archive1 and any input is welcome. Ben MacDui 08:28, 30 June 2024 (UTC)

Question about the Scottish birth registry

Hello, when citing the Scottish birth registry (https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/) for biography articles, the website link returns an error after a while, as searches expire. Also, searches do not return the specific day the person is born.

Would you have any advice on how to source & cite a living person's date of birth using this website? This question is for the following draft I am working on: Draft:Ryan_Kopel. Artemis-red97 (talk) 17:00, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi, you may be able to archive the search as a specific moment. See Help:Archiving a source though I am not familiar with this process. Wikipedia used to have a partnership with the site Wikipedia:ScotlandsPeople but I think its discontinued. You could try contacting some of those individuals if no one else responds. Coldupnorth (talk) 09:46, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Bloating in Gaels articles

I’ve become aware of similarities in some problematic aspects in various articles regarding notable Scottish Gaels. The major concern is the inclusion of large passages of material which, though arguably broadly related, does not really apply directly to the subject of the articles in question, making the articles bloated and unfocused. As a recent example, I’ve just removed these sections from the Alexander Cameron (priest) article, which included original research about the subject’s not being covered in popular culture but that a beach connected with him had been, as well as much material about the historical period but not directly about the subject’s part in or relation to it. I haven’t tackled this long section of the article yet but it appears to directly feature the subject only occasionally. Other examples are Dòmhnall Ruadh Chorùna, which included various off-topic passages and this material at Iain Lom.

Outwith the category of notable Gaels, inclusion of material such as this at Catholic Church in Scotland may be related. That the source material relates to an organisation that is most notable for their hostility to the subject of the article but does not in fact regard the latter is an impressive find.

Accompanying common characteristics are editorialising language, reverential, adulatory or POV phrasing, questionable capitalisations of terms, questionable ENGVAR spellings and terms (e.g., variously, “Meanwhile,” “However,” “the Bard”, “’’posse’’ of Redcoats”).

It may be circumstantial but each of these articles has been edited extensively by User:K1ngstowngalway1, so pinging them as a courtesy.

The articles I have listed may benefit from further attention and pruning but I am concerned that there may be others similarly affected. Has anyone else noted such? Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:22, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

Alasdair mac Mhaighstir Alasdair - various sections. Ben MacDui 15:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

Ah yes, that rings a bell. Looks like I may have clocked this in 2020 but didn't address much and the issues have amplified significantly in the interim. Also to note, the earlier campaign was by User:Kingstowngalway, without the inclusion of the two number "1"s, per the current editor's similar handle. Mutt Lunker (talk) 16:10, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

Some highly partial and choice phrasing throughout. "the Whig single party state's apologists"! I've also seen this unfounded claim in other articles: "It is widely believed that Whig poet Robert Burns was the first Poet Laureate of Scotland." To my knowledge, this is never claimed, the post being non-existent, and Burns notably expressing as much in the way of Jacobite sympathies in his works. The bulk of the article comes across as pretty questionable. Mutt Lunker (talk) 16:28, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

If this edit, summarised "As my use of period spellings and capitalisations has been cited as a problem, I have corrected them in this section." is in reponse to the above, it shows an erroneous understanding. Quotes should be represented as they were. Secondary to the the issue of the lack of discrimination in the large quantitty of material being added as it is, this issue is with your own text, where you routinely use non-British and culturally inappropriate terms and spellings and you capitalise terms which do not require to be.

As I become more familiar with the edits, I am increasingly concerned about issues of neutrality with these articles. The articles are essay-like, a "case" appears to being built, those on one "side" are referred to reverentially, those perceived as on the other with contempt, contemptible though many of them may be. I suspect the sourcing may be partial and original research, not warranted by the sources, appears to be being inserted. Mutt Lunker (talk) 22:04, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

Can anyone suggest a way forward with the problems in these articles as the task of sorting through all the material would be considerable?

I've taken a look at the lead section of Alasdair mac Mhaighstir Alasdair alone and it's a vast a miscellany of material about the subject, in no particular order and in no way fulfilling the function of "an introduction to an article and a summary of its most important contents". Much of the material therein would be of questionable pertinence to the main body, let alone the lead.

Much of the material that has been added, largely by one individual, may of worth and pertinence and well sourced but it's difficult to assess this, the articles having been swamped, the tone reverential, the structure incoherent. (On sourcing, as a tabloid, is The National regarded as a RS?)

The best good start would be if User:K1ngstowngalway1 could cease the addition of any new material until they have gone over what they have already added, excising off-topic material, addressing the tone. and removing material not supported by their sources, or synthesised from them. Failing that, it seems drastic but would reverting to versions before the swamping of the articles be acceptable to the community? Is putting them up for assessment a suitable way of formally noting deficiencies and indicating appropriate action? Mutt Lunker (talk) 13:31, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

This is, after all, a collaborative project and I am certainly okay with that fact. I do believe that history is nuanced and complex and I do try to bring that across when editing

whenever possiblIf, as often seems to be the case about important figures in the Scottish Gaelic literary canon, the limited sources I have are only reverential in tone, it can be difficult to convey nuance unless I find it in other sources over time. Sometimes canonical poets live lives that are inspirational and other times contemptible, but we are all trying in our edits to be as objective as humanly possible and to correct bias whenever we see it. With regard to Alasdair Mac Mhaighstir Alasdair, I have included that he was unfaithful to his wife and was also obscenely dirty, and I mean filthy and borderline pornographic, in a number of his poems. I have chosen not to attack him morally for those facts and to simply reported them impassively as possible. I have also also added, however, that repeated expurgation of those same poems over the past 200 years has attracted very harsh criticism from a number of literary scholars, including the late John Lorne Campbell, despite the latter having been a very staunch adherent of Traditionalist Catholicism. Regarding Dòmhnall Ruadh Chorùna, I personally find his expressed desire in "The Song of the Poison", for the complete annihilation of the German people by fire from heaven to be horrifying, which is why I found it so ironic to learn many years into researching him and expanding his article that his first experience of poison gas was actually in a friendly fire incident. It certainly brings home how badly that war was fought by both sides and how wasteful and unnecessary it was, but even so I added that information to put the poem into context while trying not to judge Dòmhnall. I am trying to take your concerns into account and am looking forward to working with you to improve these articles. Best Wishes.K1ngstowngalway1 (talk) 16:41, 26 June 2024 (UTC)e.

Regarding the bloating of the articles, I see you have made a few edits in that regard at Alasdair mac Mhaighstir Alasdair but much more is required. The issues of tone and bias can be dealt with more easily when the material has been trimmed and made more focused. This is only a quick and rough start at the lead, but these edits at Alexander Cameron (priest) might give you an indication of some of the issues that are required to bring more focus to the various articles and to reduce bias. Please can you take on more trimming? (And any others who'd care to; I see there has been some intervention.) Mutt Lunker (talk) 09:56, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

I've noted concerns about neutrality and tone specific to Alexander Cameron here, though there are similar issues at other articles mentioned above. Mutt Lunker (talk) 20:32, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

I've just clocked that the article is overwhelmingly sourced to a single work and this is self-published. That surely throws the reliability of the article in grave doubt. This returns me to my inclination that the only way to address the multiple issues is to revert to a version prior to the intervention. Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:58, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

This would appear to be suitable revision, without the swathes of self-pub material, tone and neutrality issues and considerably more focused. Mutt Lunker (talk) 11:14, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

I held off from restoring this last credible revision when I saw that a small number of passages, reliant on the self-published source, had had additional sources, potentially more credible, noted at these passages. I'd hoped that this may indicate a start to the very sizeable task of properly sourcing the material, or purging that only supported by the questionable source. To remove the self-pub tag after these minimal tweaks shows some front and a complete lack of appreciation of the task in hand. The reference section indicates the majority of the numerous citations are to this one work which should, ideally, not be being used at all. Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:39, 4 July 2024 (UTC)

Considerable editing continues to the article, none in any signicant way to remove the mass of material reliant on the self-pub source. A week's wait seems long enough, so last good version it is. Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:09, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

I have come across something similar now at Eigg. However, in my absence for a year or three the whole article, (not just Gaelic era history) once close to GA status, is now so full of unsourced statements and absurd footnotes that I fear it is not really salvageable. Ben MacDui 10:41, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

Oh dear, so I see. I remember the article being very good at the time of a visit to Eigg a few years ago but much of it has nose-dived since. I've encountered numerous other articles so-affected. Eigg would be considerably improved with a straight revert to its GA-proximal version. Such action at the Cameron article was met with reversion, removal of maintenance templates, no effort to address sourcing concerns and a doubling down of the addition of bloat. One characterstic of the editing is the packing of the text with very lengthy quotes. This may have a copyvio side issue.

Not all the edits may be so-motivated but a good indication of a fooist agenda is that criticism of edits must be inspired by anti-fooism, so make what you will of this. Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:11, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

Eigg was and remains in quite a state - it's a broad issue here as quite substantial numbers of edits were made by accounts later blocked as sockpuppets. In fact as a more general topic I note that my watchlist is largely cluttered up with bots amending talk pages, wikignomes messing about with 'short descriptions', POV-pushing/conflict of interest edits, etc. Maybe I spend too much time in rural Scotland but I am beginning to wonder if, outside of scence articles, we have many genuine editors anymore. Apologies - back on topic, take a look at Morar. Ben MacDui 08:23, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Never lose hope; there are plenty of genuine editors still around and improvements are still being made. I just looked at Eigg and those footnotes are excessive! Coldupnorth (talk) 08:57, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

The problems at Morar fit with those also at Loch Morar. There's particular activity at Catholic Church in Scotland currently, with much editorialising and off-topic diversions, so some extra eyes would be appreciated. Would assessment/re-assessments of affected articles be a useful way of formally recording the issues and perhaps convincing those responsible of the detrimental effect? This is not an area in which I am experienced. Mutt Lunker (talk) 17:40, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

You could try Wikipedia:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard - I have no direct experience of it that I can recall however. Ben MacDui 11:44, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

I've posted there. Mutt Lunker (talk) 19:06, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

...where it has been suggested it be taken to ANI, so this report. Mutt Lunker (talk) 14:17, 8 August 2024 (UTC)