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Do you mind if we continue this discussion here ? I think it is getting off topic. If you would like to discuss the merits of Kahana Vs Boteach, and which is a chilul h', we can do that. I just don't think it belongs on wikipedia. yisraeldov (talk) 13:47, 26 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Are you familiar with "אין דורשין בעריות בשלשה ברבים" ? It means that we don't talk about things that happen between husband and wife in public. Also חז''ל were very carful not to engage in public debates with non jews on the topic of religion. Why is he the only rabbi who is doing things like these ?
Have you ever read anything from R' Kahana (H'YD) ? While you might not agree with his politics his views on judiasim seem to be very standard, although his politics might not be. If you have time, I suggest trying Uncomfortable questions for comfortable jews. If you don't agree with him, at least it is thought provoking. yisraeldov (talk) 14:15, 26 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I have not read anything from Kahane but I have seen some interviews with him.. I am happy to try to take a look at the book you recommend. But even if his views on Judaism are mainstream, the world (including a lot of Jews) overwhelmingly know him as the mentor of Baruch Goldstein, and for me that makes it a Chillul Hashem to elevate him in our society, even were he in fact been big chasid with big a reward in the world to come. If he really were a chasid, I think he would agree with this. As for your remarks about Boteach - yes those principles are certainly relevant, but there is a difference between lowering a fence for what at least he sees as a legitimate educational purpose, and rejecting it entirely. Regarding interaction with gentiles, Boteach doesn't pretend to be Chazal (sorry I don't know how to type Hebrew on my Keyboard), and again I feel if his purpose is to be a presence for Jews challenged by the secular world, that is a justification. It is not as if there is no precedent in tradition.. the Kuzari springs to mind..? Zargulon (talk) 14:30, 26 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I don't understand why you are listing already-translated articles at WP:PNT. This project is for pages that partially or wholly need translation, usually in the former case there are quotes that need translation, or in the latter that they have been dumped into English wWikipedia from other Wikipedias or from other sources. I don't understand your motive for adding them here.
Can you please enlighten me what you expect to be done with them? I think PNT probably is the wrong place to list them, but I am sure we can guide you to a better place to list them.
Thanks for the reply at my talk page. I am not quite sure what you mean by "instructions", but I see that the template says "please see this article's entry on Pages needing translation into English for discussion". My guess is from that you decided to list at PNT, whereas, also guessing, the normal way around would be for it to be listed at PNT then have its translation templates replaced by cleanup-translation once the main translation is done but fixes by a subject expert were thought needed.
I have no problem with your way of doing it, but it did puzzle me. In any case, I had already moved them to the "Pages needing cleanup after translation" section, where probably you would have been better off putting them in the first place. That being said, I can imagine it would be thought unusual suddenly to find a page appearing in that section that had never appeared as needing translation, so I can see your bind.
Might I suggest, perhaps, then, that if other articles of this kind come your way, you list them as you did in the top section of PNT, but make it clearer that they need cleanup (so as to let someone else move them down, rather than simply listing in the section below yourself). I myself, and a few others, tend to let someone else move/delete entries about articles we have translated, to let others give an opinion, rather than just do it ourselves, so perhaps that would be a good compromise in your case too? The instructions are almost inevitably followed, it just then allows for a second opinion. e.g. after writing as you did for your articles, put "Suggest move to cleanup section", that would be all that is needed I suspect.
("Add at the bottom")... ah. I did not see that, as I simply looked at the documents and not at the template itself, which I have now looked at. I suppose it depends on your interpretation of what "at the bottom" means; you took it to mean at the bottom of the "Pages for consideration" section, whereas I would interpret it as at the bottom of the "Pages needing cleanup after translation" section (which is also the bottom of the whole document). I think it's a little fragile anyway to assume that the second is also the last section in the document.
So, since it seems genuinely ambiguous and a little fragile, I would suggest a rewording. It's probably best to take this to the tempalate's talk page, but to get your opinion first, how about just putting explicitly "at the bottom of the Translated pages that could still use some cleanup section of WP:Pages needing translation into English". I would also suggest changing "please add" to "please consider adding", because there may be articles which an editor does not consider useful to list at PNT (e.g. if they are in other projects/categories where a subject expert is more likely to look than PNT). I imagine that cleanup-translation was originally intended specifically for articles originating at PNT (or other translation request pages) but I don't see that that needs must be the case (and if it is, it should say so explicitly at the doc page).
I would also change the title of the section from "Translated pages that could still use some cleanup", which sounds a bit informal to me, to "Pages requiring cleanup after translation". Perhaps you have a better suggestion? We can add a redirect anyway, so if the section name changes we just change the redirect.
I'm copying this to the talk page at WP:PNT, together with your replies at my talk page interspersed. Probably best to continue any discussion there. SimonTrew (talk) 08:42, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I know the translation from German is "Austrian Freedom Front", but in the sources in French mentioning it, including from that period (see here), the second name in French is "Front national autrichien", it was not a translation mistake. Thanks for having finished the translation from French to English. After further readings tonight (e.g. here ), I see that there were also French and Austrian chapters of the Ö.F.F. which I overlooked when writing the original French article about a year ago :-/ --Pylambert (talk) 21:34, 21 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
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Hello Zargulon! Thank you for your contributions. I am a bot alerting you that 2 of the articles that you created are tagged as Unreferenced Biographies of Living Persons. The biographies of living persons policy requires that all personal or potentially controversial information be sourced. In addition, to insure verifiability, all biographies should be based on reliable sources. if you were to bring these articles up to standards, it would greatly help us with the current 139 article backlog. Once the articles are adequately referenced, please remove the {{unreferencedBLP}} tag. Here is the list:
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Thanks for your nice message and you did a fair and evenhanded edit on that page.
Frankly, I am becoming a bit disillusioned by the Wikipedia concept.
The United States Patent Office no longer allows Examiners to cite Wikipedia as a reference for anything because the pages keep changing, can be hacked and edited by anyone, and frankly, are just not trustworthy sources of information.
Anything the slightest bit controversial is often hacked by fervent supporters or opponents of the issue.
In the instance of Shine, it seems there is a group of strong-willed supporters (who may in fact work for Helfgott, who runs a small "Shine" industry) that edit the pages relating to him, the movie, and his sister's book, and also spam the netflix, amazon, IMDB and any other review site with laudatory reviews.
In a way this is a troubling trend on the Internet in general. Many fraudsters running bogus operations of various types go onto review sites (which themselves are often bogus or harbors for Trojans) and post self-laudatory reviews. Some review sites pay reviewers for writing reviews or give them "credits" for reviews.
It maybe started out as Democracy but has morphed into Anarchy.
But perhaps that is part of the game - to read these entries and edits and then try to figure out who wrote what and who edited or deleted what, and then figure out why and the motivations of the players and they try to discern a real truth.
(With every entry I read now, I always go to the "Talk" page to see what is up. I've seen raging controversies on pages innocuous as Dr. Seuss "Fox in Socks".) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joe Patent (talk • contribs) 15:52, 18 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
And in a way, perhaps the same could be said of traditional encyclopedias, biographies (autobiographies in particular) and history in general. People write things from a certain slant, which can be achieved often by simply failing to mention some facts while emphasizing others.
"Truth is Beauty, and Beauty Truth" right?
Anyway, you did a nice edit. I wonder how long it will stay that way.. ;)
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By the way, your interpretation of the three-revert rule, as noted here, is wrong. You are not entitled to three reverts in a given 24-hour period. If you are clearly edit-warring, especially when it's coupled by the non-collaborative tone exhibited therein, there are still grounds for a block. I suggest you re-read WP:3RR because ignorance of the rule, despite being pointed to the page multiple times, is not a valid defense against a block. -- tariqabjotu21:55, 5 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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Hi, thanks for your comments on this and the Manouchian Group. They are fascinating, and now that European websites are being translated into other languages (in some cases), even more information is available. I've gotten interested in the many immigrants involved and came across some great info on the Hungarian artists and writers.Parkwells (talk) 22:20, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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Z, I'll answer this way, as I don't think this is of general interest. "Weak suace" is a term for a very weak agrguement. I've never really understood the argument "X was never true untill Y happened", with the implication that therefore X was never true. Doesn't make any sence to me. JWF is fond the of the same line of reasoning, with his "noboby ever thought that RD was the CD untill Goethe did". Not sure that its a true statement, but even if it is, I don't get the point of it. 02:15, 12 September 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Steve kap (talk • contribs)
Steve, I don't know what you are talking about. Firstly, I am not JFW, I have no idea who he is or anything about him, and he and I are not on some sort of team together as you keep seeming to suggest. Secondly, what is "X"? I can't find any reasonable substitution for "X" where what you say would make sense. Zargulon (talk) 11:52, 12 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]
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There's no consensus for the current revision of the infobox that was produced (there's only a consensus for certain criteria, such as including a religious figure, and including a proportion of women), some of the figures chosen were extremely controversial and akin to having Lenin in the Russian infobox (Emma Goldman!) and one of them is a Nazi supporter (Gertrude Stein), while others (that I had originally added, such as Feynman and Gety Cori) were removed for no reason. I have introduced unarguably less controversial choices, according to the recommendations that you were able to make in talk, and most of these choices do have a genuine consensus from the long discussions we had about who to include (and who not to include) for the Ashkenazi infobox photos in 2009 (Gershwin and Von Neumann got a lot votes in those discussions).
Avaya1 (talk) 14:28, 17 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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Sorry if I misunderstood you - i thought it directly answered your question. Anyway, would you mind confirming whether you have any concerns about the text you reverted, or we're you just commenting on my edit comment? Oncenawhile (talk) 12:39, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I don't like it, but I probably wouldn't have troubled to revert it if you hadn't claimed to be acting on my behalf. Zargulon (talk) 13:56, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
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Hi Zargulon! I am tracing my family lineage and I am curious to learn more about Cecile Cerf and Moshe Shalit! Your contributions to their pages were fascinating, and I would love to know where you got your information from. Thanks, and feel free to contact me through my page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Angvoh —Preceding undated comment added 08:15, 9 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Seems totally unnotable. Only sources are related to sports clubs that this club have partnered with. Only source to ever cover this has been a passing mention (one sentence) in the Spectator news.
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Hello Zargulon! Thank you for your contributions. I am a bot alerting you that 2 of the articles that you created are tagged as Unreferenced Biographies of Living Persons. The biographies of living persons policy requires that all personal or potentially controversial information be sourced. In addition, to insure verifiability, all biographies should be based on reliable sources. if you were to bring these articles up to standards, it would greatly help us with the current 139 article backlog. Once the articles are adequately referenced, please remove the {{unreferencedBLP}} tag. Here is the list:
