User talk:Jc86035/Archive 8

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Renaming of 333 pages

I noticed your request to rename 333 pages. Do you know what happens next? Is there a bot to do such moves? — Sebastian 14:00, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

​I would probably file a BRFA myself and do the moves with pywikibot. Not sure, though. Jc86035 (talk) 15:05, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

So you are considering to write a specific bot yourself? I see that you already filed a request at Wikipedia:Bot_requests#CR and CRH S-line templates, which unfortunately hasn't elicited a response yet. Maybe the way you wrote it was too specific for the topic - at least for me, the headline would not intrigue me, if I were a bot writer. Maybe you can split up up your approach:

• The core task of renaming pages and updating the links should be independent of your specific topic. I must admit, I'm surprised that there isn't a bot for such a general task at Wikipedia:Bots/Status. You could maybe start a new request specifically for this task, and link to it from the existing request to avoid double work.
• Such text changes as "|system=CR" to "|system=CRH" should be possible using Thehelpfulbot.

Good luck! — Sebastian 17:03, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

​I filed a bot request for that because I don't think I have the time to do it and work out all of the issues, like articles which might need to be renamed further and bits of code which might need to be fixed manually. Moving pages in pywikibot is trivial but I only do it on Commons because they won't(?) grant the bot flag for semi-automated things like that. Jc86035 (talk) 07:34, 13 January 2018 (UTC)

Unfortunately, the request for UsuallyNonviolentBot is above my head; to be honest, I don't even know the significance of granting the bot flag. (But I love the bot's name!) You obviously know more about this than I do, so I trust that you'll figure out the solution for the case at hand. I wish you good success with that! — Sebastian 12:51, 13 January 2018 (UTC)

Update: I used AWB to do this semiautomatically. bd2412 T 16:16, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Technical Barnstar
	For thoughtfully enabling direct-link disambiguation of the S-Line template. bd2412 T 16:12, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the barnstar! Jc86035 (talk) 16:29, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

Module:Routemap

Could you add an outline effect (similar to bold, italic, colour, etc.)? There's a legibility issue when text spans multiple icons. (See the platform numbers at Template:Sheffield station, for example.) Useddenim (talk) 15:33, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

@Useddenim: I'm not sure if adding an outline is necessarily the best option for making the labels more legible. It's a bit hacky to use text-shadow. If there's a style for the platform signs maybe you could try using {{RouteBox}}, like how I used {{Color circle}} at Kowloon Tong station and Mei Foo station (since it's a bit wide you could have each use centred between a track and a platform e.g. vSTR-BS!~*{{RouteBox|3A||#039}}). Alternately you could use __style=your-css-here. Jc86035 (talk) 16:28, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

The four major browsers (Chrome/Safari/Firefox/Edge) do support (-webkit-)text-stroke, but it's even less legible than the current black-over-white in the Sheffield station diagram. Jc86035 (talk) 17:08, 26 January 2018 (UTC)

List of Presidents of Israel

Hi, why did you undo the fix and reintroduce the error? DuncanHill (talk) 17:31, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

Presumably because it's not an error. The Rambling Man (talk) 17:33, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

@DuncanHill and The Rambling Man: I have no idea if {{Script/Hebrew}} is supposed to be used in the context, but using both templates appears to not cause any errors with the dates for me. If it's causing the dates to be reversed, please revert. Jc86035 (talk) 17:38, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

The template documentation says to use the format I used. I noted in my edit summaries that I was fixing the date reversal, I shall revert, thank you. DuncanHill (talk) 17:39, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

Station in the names of MTR stations should be capitalized

I noticed that you moved and redirected the pages from capitalized title to a small case one. On the official webpage, on the station layout and street maps, on the name signs of the stations exits (e.g. File:Kennedy Town Station 2014 part12.JPG, File:MTR CEN (3).JPG) and on directories (e.g. File:Metro Station in Hong Kong.jpg). Hence, it should be capitalized as in proper names. Xeror (talk) 13:01, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

@Xeror: The pages were moved following a RM at Talk:Hung Hom station#Requested move 17 December 2017. Certes (talk) 13:57, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Didn't know that news media are inconsistent with the station names. Since the discussion was over, let's stick with the current naming convention. However, a naming convention page like Wikipedia:Naming conventions (UK stations) should be written. Xeror (talk) 15:02, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

@Xeror: I don't think it would be necessary; the RM sums up most of the discussion. Having a naming convention for each city or each country's railway stations would probably be unmaintainable (and it's usually the same few editors running around looking for WP:NCCAPS transgressions and other naming issues to fix anyway), so I would prefer having one for all railway stations, with subsections indicating consensuses for each country or individual system. Jc86035 (talk) 15:07, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Having a single naming convention for all railway stations is ideal but the one that serves this purpose is still under debate after more than 10 years (Wikipedia:Naming conventions (stations)). WP:NCCAPS isn't clear at all in this case. Several naming conventions for stations in different countries were created due to the ambiguity. As more people may join editing in the future, a temporary solution is still needed. Xeror (talk) 16:42, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Courtesy notice of discussion

Considering you did you do a bit of changing to {{Template album}} — which I do like, a lot, I thought I'd make you aware of this discussion concerning the template! Thank you! Hope you are doing well. livelikemusic talk! 15:28, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Another Daily Mail RfC

There is an RfC at Talk:Daily Mail#Request for comment: Other criticisms section. Your input would be most helpful. --Guy Macon (talk) 16:18, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

Nomination of dab page for deletion

We don't normally nominate dab pages for deletion in this way. Dabs do not have references. Are you proposing it be converted into an article and references added? In ictu oculi (talk) 12:32, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

@In ictu oculi: Wikipedia:Disambiguation § Deletion states I should use AfD (though it doesn't really function as a disambiguation page, since none of the musical works listed exist). I'm not proposing that it should be converted into an article, though it's certainly something that could be done. Jc86035 (talk) 12:35, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Invitation to Women in Art Editathon in Hong Kong, March 2018

@春卷柯南: 30 February? Jc86035 (talk) 15:43, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

It should be 30 March. Sorry for typing mistakes. --Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 03:46, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

Upcoming changes to wikitext parsing

Hello,

There will be some changes to the way wikitext is parsed during the next few weeks. It will affect all namespaces. You can see a list of pages that may display incorrectly at Special:LintErrors. Since most of the easy problems have already been solved at the English Wikipedia, I am specifically contacting tech-savvy editors such as yourself with this one-time message, in the hope that you will be able to investigate the remaining high-priority pages during the next month.

There are approximately 10,000 articles (and many more non-article pages) with high-priority errors. The most important ones are the articles with misnested tags and table problems. Some of these involve templates, such as infoboxes, or the way the template is used in the article. In some cases, the "error" is a minor, unimportant difference in the visual appearance. In other cases, the results are undesirable. You can see a before-and-after comparison of any article by adding ?action=parsermigration-edit to the end of a link, like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Foss?action=parsermigration-edit (which shows a difference in how {{infobox ship}} is parsed).

If you are interested in helping with this project, please see Wikipedia:Linter. There are also some basic instructions (and links to even more information) at https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikitech-ambassadors/2018-April/001836.html You can also leave a note at WT:Linter if you have questions.

Thank you for all the good things you do for the English Wikipedia. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:18, 19 April 2018 (UTC)

Module:Routemap/sandbox

Moved to Template talk:Routemap

 – Jc86035 (talk) 10:23, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

Letter from Wikimedia User Group Hong Kong

Dear Jc86035,

Thank you for your interest in our user group. To obtain the status as a Wikimedia User Group, we have to make a decision on our mission. A member of the user group put forward a motion to amend the provisional missions proposed in March 2017 since i) it is unable to reflect the user group’s actual operation and social situation and ii) it has never been endorsed by a majority of members of the user group. You are welcome to endorse or discuss on this motion on Meta (link.) We look forward to your reply.

Yours sincerely,

Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 15:02, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

The consultation on the proposed amendments to the user group's mission will end on Sunday, 20th May. You are encouraged to comment on our meta page. As a reminder - two-third majority is require to have the motion passed. Regards, --Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 14:06, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

The consultation on the proposed amendments to the user group's mission has ended. However, the results can't be confirmed instantly due to errors in my statement. You are welcome to comment on ways to deal with it on our meta page. Regards, --Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 14:28, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

A beer for you!

For being WP:Bold and cleaning up my template User:DBigXray/ref. Thanks DBigXray 16:14, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

Adjacent stations

Can the new template use completely custom messages in boxes? That would come in handy for Tokyo's many through services, or any other through service for that matter. Cards84664 (talk) 15:29, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

{{s-start}}
{{s-rail|title=GCRTA}}
{{s-line|system=GCRTA|line=Red|previous=West 25th–Ohio City|next=East 34th–Campus}}
{{s-line|system=GCRTA|line=Blue|previous=Waterfront|next=East 34th–Campus|rows1=2|through1=yes}}
{{s-line|system=GCRTA|line=Green|next=East 34th–Campus|hide1=yes}}
{{s-line|system=GCRTA|line=Waterfront|previous=Settlers Landing|next=Blue Green|type2=Both|through2=yes}}
{{s-end}}

@Cards84664: Where are you putting your custom messages? {{Adjacent stations}} can already handle |through= (here the lines aren't linked because they don't have their own articles yet).

Preceding stop	MTR Light Rail			Following stop
Fung Tei towards Tuen Mun Ferry Pier		614P		through to 615P
Kei Lun towards Tuen Mun Ferry Pier		615P		through to 614P

If you want you can also arbitrarily swap the termini, but I haven't done it because most of the lines in this system are shown south-to-north. If you meant you were to add text which isn't a line label, I think you would need to add an extra line definition to Module:Adjacent stations/RTA Rapid Transit (if it existed). Jc86035 (talk) 15:35, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

For cases like yours, instead of having custom text you could alternatively have two rows which are identical except one row has |through4=Blue and the next has |through5=Green. Jc86035 (talk) 15:37, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

I think what especially needs custom text is the Chicago L near the loop elevated, because of the orange and brown lines swapping identities between stations during morning rush hours Cards84664 (talk) 15:57, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

{{s-start}}
{{s-rail|title=CTA}}
{{s-text|text=[[State Street Subway]]}}
{{s-line|system=CTA|line=Red|previous=Harrison|next=Cermak–Chinatown}}
{{s-text|text=[[South Side Elevated]]}}
{{s-line|system=CTA|line=Orange|previous=Halsted (Orange)|next=Harold Washington Library – State/Van Buren|rows1=3|rowsmid=2|type=Midway|type2=Terminus|circular2=yes}}
{{s-line|system=CTA|line=Orange|next=Adams/Wabash|oneway2=true|hide1=yes|hidemid=2}}
{{s-line|system=CTA|line=Orange|previous=Halsted (Orange)|next=Harold Washington Library – State/Van Buren|hide1=yes|oneway2=yes|type=Special|branch=SB Special}}
{{s-line|system=CTA|line=Orange|previous=Halsted (Orange)|next=Adams/Wabash|oneway1=true|type2=Special|branch=NB Special|note2=<small>(Becomes Brown Line)</small>}}
{{s-line|system=CTA|line=Green|previous=Adams/Wabash|next=Cermak–McCormick Place}}
{{s-end}}

@Cards84664: It's definitely possible to make this with {{Adjacent stations}}. The template also has |note-left(n)= and |note-right(n)=; and you can also enter arbitrary termini in |type-left(n)= and |type-right(n)= for lines without alternate termini*: |type-right=Cottage Grove or Ashland/63rd (as an example) would return something that looks like "Cottage Grove or Ashland/63rd".

You might want to remove the <small> tags – they contravene WP:FONTSIZE. Jc86035 (talk) 16:17, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

* It's more complicated than that, but that's basically how it works: If there are no alternate termini and the module finds "or" or "via" in the text, then it splits the links. Jc86035 (talk) 16:17, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Template:Rii-more

I suspect that this template could be rewritten as a Lua module so that
{{rii-more|A|B|C|…|n}} expands to
or {{…|A|B}} or {{…|A|C}} . . . or {{…|A|n}}. Useddenim (talk) 23:10, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

@Useddenim: Done by coding a |start= directly into Module:Separated entries. Jc86035 (talk) 03:06, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

Thank you. Useddenim (talk) 03:51, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

And another problem…

Please take a look at this version of Template:BS-AUSgauge. I can't figure out why I can't pass the |map2= parameter into another diagram. (See Template:Yackandandah railway line for an example of it's usage.) Useddenim (talk) 03:51, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

@Useddenim: That only works if you're substituting the template. The markup can't be carried through a transclusion. Jc86035 (talk) 05:15, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

File:Snapchat logo.svg

Why does the file page say there are versions up to 1024px ? - FlightTime (open channel) 16:09, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

@FlightTime: It's an SVG; you could scale it to any size. Jc86035 (talk) 16:17, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

Sorry, not that familiar with SVG nomenclatures. - FlightTime (open channel) 16:24, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

Human science proposed merge

Dear Jc,

I saw that you recently suggested a merge between the Human science page and Social science page. I'm about to go to a conference on the History of the Human Sciences and speak about Wikipedia, and I plan to show them the page and the proposed merge and use it to get attendees thinking about the discipline more broadly, and how it is perceived by others: could you please explain your reasoning for proposing the merge? I can see several possible reasons why you might have suggested it, and I've seen from the Talk page some other people's comments, but I'd like to know your explanation for taking the step to propose the merge?

Thanks! Zeromonk (talk) 10:52, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

@Zeromonk: I'm probably quite far out of my depth here, but to me they seemed to be slightly different ways of classifying similar sets of fields: yet one of the articles (social) is a broad, well-developed article which provides an overview of most of the subjects, whereas the other (human) appears to be relatively incomplete. Neither article really provides a justification for why it is different to the other, and since the named fields in each case heavily overlap and are not exhaustively listed, I thought it might be better to have a single article encompassing both a discussion of the differences in classification and information about the fields themselves. In addition, a merge discussion would in theory attract editors more suited to writing about these topics. I hope this helps. Jc86035 (talk) 17:08, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

@Jc86035: Thanks so much, that's what I thought (and for what it's worth I think it was a good move!). Hopefully when I show this to the conference delegates they'll be spurred to edit to clarify things, or at the very least point me toward some useful sources to help improve some pages! Zeromonk (talk) 09:01, 3 July 2018 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Module:Preview warning

Module:Preview warning has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the module's entry on the Templates for discussion page. {{3x|p}}ery (talk) 11:49, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

Letter from Wikimedia User Group Hong Kong

Dear Jc86035,

Thank you for your interest in our user group.

• It is proposed to adopt amendments to the mission of the user group proposed in March this year by combining the consensus expressed in the user group's talk page and our last meetup. The motion will settle in this way unless there are objections raised before 11th July.
• To obtain the status as a Wikimedia User Group, we have to elect liaisons to contact with the Affiliations Committee. You are welcome to nominate yourself or editors who are capable by tomorrow on Meta. No elections will be held if there are less than four nominees; otherwise single transferable voting is applied to elect liaisons.

Yours sincerely,

--Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 15:14, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

Improper rendering in {{Korean}} and {{Infobox Chinese}}

Could you possibly explain why the Hanja parameter (in {{Korean}} {{Korean name}}) does not render properly unless an explicit {{lang|ko| tag is added? I have hit a roadblock at the former. Same issue with {{Infobox Chinese}} when the |c= is used. CaradhrasAiguo (talk) 16:11, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

@CaradhrasAiguo: Is this a font issue? I've never noticed any substantial difference between text in |c= and in |t=, and the Hanja text doesn't look problematic to me, so I'm not sure what you mean by "render properly" (I'm using Firefox on a Mac). Both templates use ko-Hani as the language code for Hanja. I can't really help you further if there's nothing that's intrinsically wrong with the templates themselves, because I can't fix the fonts on your computer. Jc86035 (talk) 16:59, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

I've forgotten to mention I'm using Chrome on a Windows 10 system. Screenshots may come tomorrow. CaradhrasAiguo (talk) 17:06, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

Template:Infobox Austrian organization

now recreated as Template:Infobox Austrian government agency Frietjes (talk) 13:45, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

Is this eligible for CSD or does it have to go through TfD again? Jc86035 (talk) 13:46, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

the depends on the admin who sees the deletion request. if you can show someone this comparison, then it would look like a clear CSD situation. Frietjes (talk) 13:49, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

I've nominated it for TfD; there's no harm in it existing for another week. Jc86035 (talk) 14:01, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

Preceding the list with a prose

Hi. If I put a paragraph before the list, would that section be considered as a prose? Chess2018 (talk) 13:27, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Chess2018: See WP:PARAGRAPH, Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Layout and Wikipedia:WikiProject Musicians/Article guidelines. (You can reply on your talk page and notify users you're replying to by linking their user page in your message, as I have, or in your edit summary.) Jc86035 (talk) 13:35, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Jc86035: I saw that the template for the Musicians guidelines was a suggestion and the editors are free to rearrange them, but I’ll leave it as is. Thanks for the links. They are good reference materials.Chess2018

Feat. Singles

I know, i didnt quit them because it is a featured i quit it because it was a promo single. A sigle to be an official single needs a radio release — Preceding unsigned comment added by Before the Storm (talk • contribs) 13:52, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Before the Storm: Please sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You can reply on your own talk page and give other users notifications by linking their user page in your comment (as I have done) or in your edit summary.

@Ss112 and Life of Tau: Can you confirm whether Nothing to Lose (Bret Michaels song), Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds#The Flaming Lips version and Fall Down (will.i.am song) were released as singles? I'm not sure about this. Jc86035 (talk) 14:15, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

A song does not need a radio release to be a full single, that is just an indication a song is an official single. The songs you have linked to appear to be official singles to me. I'm sure some users would be inclined to believe perhaps the Bret Michaels and Flaming Lips songs are promotional due to those songs' chart performance (that's one of the criteria a lot of fans like to use to preserve their favourite artists' relative chart success—"it underperformed commercially because it wasn't given much of a push, it must be promotional!"), but given Bret Michaels' and the Flaming Lips' histories—as neither has ever been very successful with their singles on charts—it's not surprising. Ss112 14:20, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

Its not because of that. Start all over and fly ln the wall underperformed but qe know they are orricisl singles. That songs were never promoted, performed or released to radio. They were advances to the albums just like Walking on air by Katy Perry. Thank u I — Preceding unsigned comment added by Before the Storm (talk • contribs) 14:25, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Ss112: ...? Jc86035 (talk) 14:34, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Before the Storm: I just said, songs are not singles solely because they were released to radio. There is no requirement on Wikipedia that songs have to be released to radio before we can call them singles, so until there is, this sounds like your opinion and an agenda you want to push. Besides, I would guarantee you can't ensure those songs weren't released to radio elsewhere in the world (particularly will.i.am's "Fall Down"), so you're probably only talking about US radio. I'm not going to continue a debate with somebody who has no proof but rather an opinion, whereas on the other hand we have multiple sources on each article calling them official singles. Ss112 16:29, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

Could you check this revert? I'm aware the deletion of the single is probably wrong because it's clearly mentioned in the lead section, but I'm not sure about the other things. Jc86035 (talk) 16:41, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

Jc86035, if you can, please revert instances of this editor changing dates. They keep changing dates without a source on Who Owns My Heart and elsewhere, and reclassifying songs as whatever they please. These kinds of changes are contentious and should be discussed. Ss112 16:58, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Before the Storm: Do you have any sources for the release dates of When I Look at You and the other songs? If you don't I will have to revert all of your recent edits, partly because you've only changed the dates in the infoboxes and left the body text unchanged. Jc86035 (talk) 17:48, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

yes i do! oh i forgot about vhanging the text too. thank u. i will edit them — Preceding unsigned comment added by Before the Storm (talk • contribs) 17:50, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Before the Storm: No, you totally missed the point. You have to add the source you used to the article, or you get reverted because Wikipedia:Verifiability is a policy and must always be followed (outside exceptional circumstances). See WP:Citing sources. Jc86035 (talk) 18:00, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

I ment I will add the sources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Before the Storm (talk • contribs) 18:35, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

@Before the Storm: I have reverted your edits; the previous dates can remain until you add the sources to the articles. I find it especially odd that you're changing the date for Start All Over, which was reviewed through the good article nomination process and accepted. Jc86035 (talk) 18:40, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

Bkup idea

There are currently about 20,000 unique YouTube links across the 10 largest Wikipedias (en, de etc). They could fit in a 10TB drive ($350) with lots of room over for new videos. If the WARCs were saved to the drive using Pyweb, then monitor for when the YouTube links stop working - when dead, upload the WARC to webrecorder.io and update Wikipedia to the webrecorder.io URL.. most steps could be automated. It would only require co-operation from webrecorder.io since there is no current way to upload WARCs. It's convoluted, but would save select domains from disappearing forever. -- GreenC 21:51, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

@GreenC: I think saving other things which IA can't archive might help more (maybe sources tagged with {{dead link}} by InternetArchiveBot?), since links to YouTube, I find, are often not actually reliable sources (or are unauthorized copies of documentaries). Regardless, I think this is a good idea. Jc86035 (talk) 07:24, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Well yeah my bot WaybackMedic already does that, it follows behind InternetArchiveBot and checks every {{dead link}} across 20+ other archive service and fills in any it can find - it has about a 25% discovery rate and has been running as long as IABot - it also runs against the IABot database maintaining that. It also does many other things. But.. in terms of pages like YouTube (as an example), there is no solution, none of the 20+ archive providers can reliably archive YouTube - except for webrecorder.io techology. And so these links are being lost every day they disappear. You may be right not all of YouTube are reliable, but YouTube is one easy example to start with, of many that contain multimedia content. News sites now often have embedded multimedia for featured content as a larger example. The idea is proof of concept and stepping into it. Probably I need to contact webrecorder.io and see what level of interest they might have in supporting Wikipedia or not. -- GreenC 13:41, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

@GreenC: Oh, I didn't realize your bot did that. If Webrecorder is interested in doing this, would you own the 10 TB drive, or would this be on the WMF cloud? Would there be downsides to uploading WARCs as soon as they're archived, other than the obvious space restrictions? (Given that Webrecorder has 50 GB allotted per account I don't think a 10 TB limit would be particularly problematic on their end.) Jc86035 (talk) 13:56, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

(example bot edit). I just sent an introductory email and hoping they respond they would archive the pages for us, but if not, will try the offline caching idea as a secondary proposal. The 50GB constraint, and need for user account would have to be adjusted for on their end, as well as ability to send metadata about the original URL via bot. -- GreenC 14:19, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

@GreenC: Have they replied? Jc86035 (talk) 16:16, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Yes. Still arranging time to discuss more. -- GreenC 17:07, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Sending you an email update as it might contain non-public information about Webrecorder. -- GreenC 17:14, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Template:NYCS station-layout

Could you take a look at Template:NYCS station-layout/doc and Template:NYCS station-layout/sandbox please? I've almost got it there, but I can't quite figure out where things go wrong for cases 3E and 4E. Thanks! Useddenim (talk) 20:56, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

@Useddenim: You can't specify parameters using {{!}}; you have to have separate if statements for each parameter (or write a whole Lua module). Or is there something else I'm missing? Jc86035 (talk) 09:09, 6 August 2018 (UTC)

Comment for RfC involving genre in the infobox

Can you please vote or comment at this RfC involving the removal of "heavy metal" from the infobox at Back in Black? Dan56 (talk) 00:01, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

Hong Kong Tramways route diagram template

I noticed recently that Hong Kong Tramways did not have a route diagram template, so I created one today here: Template:Hong Kong Tramways and added it to the article's infobox. It's a minimalist treatment, but you are welcome to add additional details if you want. Jackdude101 ^talk cont 15:31, 18 August 2018 (UTC)

Renaming of Wikimedia User Group Hong Kong

Dear Jc86035/Archive 8 :

You are receiving this email as you have signed up as an interested member of the Wikimedia User Group Hong Kong, and is active at the English Wikipedia.

This message is sent on behalf of group Liasons of the User Group.

As the mission of the group has been successfully amended, and Liasons elected, the Liasons to affcom have now sent an email to Affcom seeking recognition. However, during the process (which is delayed by the hosting of Wikimania), we have been requested by them Affcom to amend the name of the usergroup (which subsequently mean a change of text of logo as well) as our name did not meet their guidelines.

To resolve this problem, one of the liasons, 1233, has started a discussion on the group's meta talk page(meta) to amend the name of the User Group according to the email received about the recognition of the group. We would hope for more input so as to obtain consensus on this matter and resolve this situation. The discussion will end at 00:00, 1 September (HKT, UTC+8).

In order to speed up the process, we would assume you having no preference if no reply is received on meta.

Many thanks,
1233 (on behalf of the Liasons)
Talk · Page

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If you wish to opt-out of future mailings, please notify the sender. If you want to opt-out of all massmessage mailings, you may add Category:Wikipedians who opt out of message delivery to your user talk page.

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What is ce?

Dear Jc86035, I was wondering why you changed 'Tianyang Railway Station' to 'Tianyang'? I admit the capitals were wrong, so should bbe 'Tianyang railway station' is the natural way to start a train station article in English, cf Euston railway station, Maidstone East railway station or even Nanning railway station. You put 'ce' as your reason. What does 'ce' mean?Johnkn63 (talk) 15:31, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

@Johnkn63: Abbreviation of "copy edit". I think either "Tianyang railway station" and "Tianyang" would be acceptable in bold, since both are in common usage in articles for stations in various countries (often interchangeably, although one wouldn't write "Tianyang railway station is a railway station..."). Jc86035 (talk) 14:55, 14 September 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for an informative reply. When spanning two languages the question of what is best is not always easy tooo decide. Discussing things helps me think things through,please allow me to say a little more. I notice the info box has the Chinese name as simply "田阳", however this is an abbreviation limited to timetables and the like, but elsewhere, on the station, on tickets, etc it is "田阳站". Whilst "Tianyang", "Tianyang station" and "Tianyang railway station" are often interchangable, this does not mean that all are equally suitable in a given instance. For an article using the title in bold to start is usually the most natural thing to do. I have been working on this article, trying out different ideas, so that the ideas that work well can be used for some other stations in southern China. All feedback is much appreciated.Johnkn63 (talk) 01:22, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

@Johnkn63: I guess I would favour omitting "station"/"站" in the infobox header since it is overwhelmingly more common in English to do so (at least in infoboxes). For Chinese I'm not totally sure (the Chinese Wikipedia seems to be inconsistent about this). Jc86035 (talk) 05:01, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

Thank you, I agree. For info boxes the English convention for wikipedia is as you say clear, one does not include 'station', a convention which is followed through to Chinese name on en.wikipedia. For the Chinese name I feel that including '站' is more natural even in the info box, but despite the fact that every station photo shows '站', would be hard to implement en.wikipedia. This is an English covention meets Chinese convention problem.Johnkn63 (talk) 04:24, 17 September 2018 (UTC)

Thanks!

Hey there. Haven't used it yet, but just found Wikipedia:Record charts/Sourcing guide/Australia and it seems like quite a helpful thing to do, so thanks for making it! I see a lot of work has gone into it too. Ss112 09:14, 1 October 2018 (UTC)

Change coming to how certain templates will appear on the mobile web

Hello,

I wanted to share a follow-up to an RfC you participated in from late 2016/early 2017. It was regarding making certain warning templates visible on mobile. The Readers web team has been working to improve how these templates appear on the mobile website. I shared an announcement with communities today that covers what is happening. If you have any interest, I encourage your support in giving feedback on the project page or helping update templates of this nature with some of our recommendations.

Thank you, CKoerner (WMF) (talk) 20:31, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Album Templates

Howdy! You've been absolutely killing it with your work on these music/album/song infoboxes! A few of us have been working on emptying out Category:Music infoboxes with deprecated parameters and it looks like {{Singles}} is all done. I.E. there are no remaining transclusions with deprecated parameters. I wanted to see what your plan was moving forward. My advice is that once the deprecations are resolved for each template, the template should be changed back to being a traditional template. I.E. lets remove the subst code. Obviously we will also want to remove all support for the deprecated parameters as well. I'm happy to do this work but since this has really been your baby for a while, I wanted to at least drop you a line before starting in on the work. Let me know if you have any thoughts? --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 21:07, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: I'd expect the substitution code to be kept, since it is still useful for formatting existing templates. However, I would remove most of the code that does parameter transformations for deprecated parameters. I don't really mind what happens, since I haven't really been involved for over a year. Jc86035 (talk) 07:40, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

@Jc86035: can you add proper tracking to this template to track the pages that are using the deprecated parameters. I tried to but I can't figure out how to work with the subst stuff you've got going on. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 00:17, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: If you had already emptied the category of {{Singles}} deprecated parameters it's not that surprising that the new category would also be empty. Special:Search/insource:"Single 1 date" only returns 13 results (there's probably some template syntax error on each page). Jc86035 (talk) 05:53, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Did you look at the results? That is for a different template bud... {{Digital singles}}... Just doing a source for the params being in the source doesn't demonstrate anything. If they were using the singles template then they would show up in the unknown params category for {{Singles}}... --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 05:57, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

And why are you restoring substitution to the infoboxes? Infoboxes are not meant to be substituted. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 06:01, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: Exactly. The substitution is useful for preventing accidental substitution and formatting the parameters. I did look at the results and I fixed one of them, although I didn't look at all the pages. (The template didn't show up on the page because it was incorrectly nested so that |Misc= was a parameter of another template, and was thus hidden.) Jc86035 (talk) 06:06, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

SO are you suggesting that every infobox should now support substitution? --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 06:07, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: No, but if there is nothing wrong with keeping it and it's useful, then why remove it? Some non-infobox templates use Module:Unsubst and some don't. Jc86035 (talk) 06:11, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Because it is absolutely impossible to maintain... That's why. It is a total clusterfuck of code. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 06:14, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

But have at it. Clearly it is your baby so I won't touch it anymore. Have fun. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 06:15, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: The only reason it looked so messy was because there was a large amount of parameter fixes. Admittedly they should have been done entirely in Lua but I wasn't going to go and rewrite all that just to make it look nice, since that specific part of the template was supposed to be temporary. Right now it's mostly just the parameter list, which is quite manageable. Jc86035 (talk) 06:16, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Like I said, have at it. I'll move on to other projects. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 06:46, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: Sorry if I was a little blunt, I was trying to reply quickly.

A while ago someone seems to have created Wikipedia:Substitution trick (18 views/month). While I did add the instruction to use "subst:" to the documentation of {{Infobox album}}, some people seem to have found it useful and it's not really doing any harm (and it might still be helpful for templates which haven't been fully substituted). The substitution capability is also still present in all of the other templates in the series. There isn't consensus for or against having it, though, so if it's genuinely detrimental because it's confusing for users who have tried to substitute other templates (I haven't edited these templates in a while so I wouldn't know), then I'm fine with unsubst-infobox being removed.

I've gone through the rest of the results from the search. Seven of them were from {{Digital singles}} (which I've nominated for deletion) and the rest were blank templates or other errors. I wasn't trying to blame you; I was only implying that it would be useful to keep the parameters if I ran into something like this version of The Album (The Firm album) (although in the end none of the rest needed to be substituted). Jc86035 (talk) 14:03, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

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Thanks for that

Thanks for replying on my talk page. MaranoFan seems to be of the belief that I'm the one who regularly updates Billboard Hot 100 or that I'm the one who came up with the wording used on that article—all I did was update it today. (They followed me (seven minutes after my edit) to that article to take issue with what I did—much more of this and it'll be hounding.) It seems to be defying common sense to think that we have to wait for the specific chart page to update when the actual chart publisher itself made available an article on its website to tell us what the new number one on that chart is. No other user has ever had an issue with it besides them. Ss112 07:16, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Template:Gotthardbahn/sandbox

Help, please! Once again I am having trouble aligning the collapsible sections on a complex, double-column RDT… Thanks! Useddenim (talk) 16:09, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

@Useddenim: I've tried adding |tw= and it seems to be fine now, although it might be possible to make it slightly narrower. (The comma-separated values are for the six columns, the second and fifth being the "main text" ones. Values are input in px, although a while ago I made the module convert them to ems so that the mobile site would be fine with them.) Jc86035 (talk) 16:15, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

User:Jc86035/Alexa Internet

I have moved this page from draft space because WP:G13 Hhkohh (talk) 09:40, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

Template:Infobox song

Howdy! So with almost all of the {{Infobox single}} pages converted, I'm starting to turn my attention to cleaning up {{Infobox song}}. There are a ton of deprecated parameters in the template... For example {{{Name}}} → {{{name}}}. I'm planning to start cleaning those up but I wanted to get your assistance. I have a preliminary list but I wanted to see if you could help me make sure it is complete? (see: User:Zackmann08/sandbox2). The more I think about it the more I think it might be better to just make a freaking table showing all the params and what they should be converted to... This template is kind of your baby. I'm happy to do the work of cleaning up all the transclusions, but would you mind helping me build this table of exactly what params should be kept and which should be converted? When all is said and done, there should only be one acceptable value for each input. So using the above example, right now both {{{Name}}} and {{{name}}} work. I want to clean that up to just use the standard lowercase. Same goes for things like {{{Cover size}}}, {{{cover size}}} & {{{cover_size}}}. The last one is the one we want to go with. Anyway, are you willing to spend a little time building this with me? --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 19:52, 14 December 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: Shouldn't the template substitution take care of that? Module:Unsubst-infobox has a parameter for listing parameter replacements, |$aliases=. (I should probably have written documentation for that module.) Jc86035 (talk) 08:20, 15 December 2018 (UTC)

Sorry, I needed to take a 24 break from Wikipedia due to some bull shit. Just needed to walk away. So I believe you are correct, the unsubst should take care of that. The issue is that I'm a bit confused on what parameters we are deprecating. I want to help clean up all the transclusions, but for that to happen, I need to get a category that has all pages using the old params. Can you help me out with that? --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 01:42, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: I think you could probably get away with substituting all of the existing infoboxes, which would result in a null edit where it's already been done. Doing a search for {{Duration}} to convert all |length= uses with only one value into plain [m]m:ss or [h]h:mm:ss format, since Module:Hms is built into the infobox (adds metadata to the first instance), would probably prevent almost all edits that only change whitespace.

The parameters to be deprecated can be inferred from the TemplateData. Of the parameter aliases, the ones that have uppercase letters should be deprecated (along with the parameters which are already marked deprecated), and the rest (including |A-side=, |B-side= and |EP=) should be retained. Jc86035 (talk) 08:54, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

The issue is that there is no way to keep track of which pages have already been done. That's the purpose of the deprecation tracking cat. No worries, I'm going to make it happen. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 19:20, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

So just about done with all the deprecated parameters. Do you want to go ahead and start re-writing the template without the deprecated parameters? I'd be glad to do it myself, but I'm still lost with all the unsubst-infobox stuff. Suggestion, lets keep the support of the old deprecated parameters in the unsubst-infobox function. That way if any new articles are moved from user drafts to the main space, they will populate Category:Pages using infobox song with unknown parameters can be quickly fixed with {{subst:Infobox song.... As always let me know if I can help. --Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 18:53, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

@Zackmann08: I think keeping the alias replacement would probably be useful, although allowing the old transclusions to be converted entirely through substitution (particularly for the chronology parameters, which used to be in |Last single="[[Song]]"<br>(1994) format) would essentially mean leaving all of the current unsubst code in place. Removing the aliases in the rest of the template would be appropriate, I think. Jc86035 (talk) 07:18, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

Nomination for merging of Template:Infobox Korean name

Template:Infobox Korean name has been nominated for merging with Template:Infobox Chinese. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you.

Hi, you participated in the Infobox East Asian name removal here. It appears you contribute to China-related articles and people are concerned about this template being merged into the other due to the {{Infobox Chinese}} being designed for strictly Chinese-language articles, so I invite your input. Thanks, DanielleTH ^{(Say hi!)} 15:29, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Been wondering something

I saw your reply to Willbo Waggins at the talk page of YouTube Rewind 2018: Everyone Controls Rewind and I was wondering, how come you never did the edit request that Willbo Waggins mentions in the talk page? VibeScepter (talk) (contributions) 11:09, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

@VibeScepter: I was working on something else at the time (someone else has already added a mention of Jaiden/the chair). It also might have been beneficial if Willbo had figured out the sentence himself (you're probably aware that many users mark edit requests that use {{Edit protected}} as "not done" if the requests don't specify exactly what should be done), although maybe I should have mentioned this. Jc86035 (talk) 11:50, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Didn't notice until now, but it looks like someone had done the edit request. VibeScepter (talk) (contributions) 21:54, 30 December 2018 (UTC)

Tai Po Market station

Please explain the removal of {{redirect}} hatnote from article. Matthew hk (talk) 15:49, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

@Matthew hk: It's not really necessary to indicate the redirect's title in the hatnote, since "Tai Po Market station" could also plausibly refer to the station that closed in 1983. The current hatnote also incorrectly repeats "for"; "building of" isn't strictly necessary since the Hong Kong Railway Museum article also discusses the building's function as a railway station; and "old station" is unnecessarily vague and doesn't distinguish the current station from the closed station as clearly. Jc86035 (talk) 16:01, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

Nope. Both articles can mean "Tai Po Market railway station" but the current Tai Po Market station is the primary topic of that redirect as per redirect for discussion. Matthew hk (talk) 16:12, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

@Matthew hk: But why does the redirect need to be mentioned at all? The current title could plausibly refer to the old station, thus it is not necessary to mention the redirect (because the context of the redirect is not necessary for the inclusion of the hatnote to make sense). Or am I missing something? Jc86035 (talk) 16:15, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

Did you ever understand the function of {{redirect}}? Matthew hk (talk) 16:16, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

"Tai Po Market railway station" is a very very likely search team, while the museum, is also known as "Old Tai Po Market railway station", so it is totally logically to display the redirect in the hatnote. While your version, people not understand the slang KCR, would not understand the hatnote at all. "railway station" is something universally understand, for people from UK, US, but KCR is not. Matthew hk (talk) 16:23, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

S-line/TRTS right/5

{{S-line/TRTS_right/5}} was at the top of WP:Database reports/Transclusions of deleted templates so I made these edits to orphan it. it would be great if you could check/fix these if I didn't do it properly. thank you. Frietjes (talk) 13:50, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

@Frietjes: Thanks for fixing those; I don't think there's anything wrong with them right now. I had fixed one before nominating the templates for deletion, but didn't realize that the template was used in that way on a bunch of other pages. Jc86035 (talk) 14:53, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

Help please

Could you take a look at Template:Howrah–Kharagpur line? I just can't seem to get the collapsible section (commented out at the top) to line up properly, despite playing around with the |tw= values.
Also, I was working on Template:Rail-interchange, and noticed that several cities had very similar code that could probably be consolidated: Los Angeles, New Orleans, Portland, Dallas; and Denver, Chicago, Boston, Minneapolis-St. Paul. Useddenim (talk) 18:06, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

@Useddenim: I think I've fixed it, although you might want to fiddle with the tw values a little more. (Mainly, the -startCollapsible was one row too late, and there weren't enough spacers to make the inner table as wide as the outer table.)

I'm not sure it's worth consolidating {{Rail-interchange}} code (and I can't really tell what code you want to consolidate anyway); AFAIK the template's not causing any template limit problems, and Module:Adjacent stations / {{ric}} has icon functionality which I think could eventually replace {{Rail-interchange}}. Jc86035 (talk) 18:26, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

@Useddenim: Also, if you haven't already you might want to look at the OpenStreetMap data for the area, since it seems to show at least some tracks that aren't in the diagram. Jc86035 (talk) 18:33, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

Thanks! (I wasn't counting correctly…) Useddenim (talk) 19:00, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

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Edit on the article Peak Tram

Did you know I am still nine? SCRATCH1234 (talk) 02:00, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

@SCRATCH1234: No, I didn't. Before you continue, you might like to read Wikipedia:Guidance for younger editors, an essay written by other Wikipedia editors.

I reverted your edits – as I probably would have if an adult or a teenager had made those edits – because the fact that you're nine years old doesn't change the fact that English Wikipedia articles are written with a formal tone, for an audience which includes a lot of adults.

Information in Wikipedia also has to be verifiable. If you find a source for the "tips" section that you added (for example, a website or a book that seems to be reliable, which supports the claims in your text) then I think it would be appropriate to re-add the text, although it might be hard to find a suitable online source because most of the websites that mention the request stops are personal blogs (which can't be used). You could try searching through websites such as Google Books. Jc86035 (talk) 13:55, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Template:SPb Metro\Line 5

A tag has been placed on Template:SPb Metro\Line 5 requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done for the following reason:

No longer used redirect with awkward backslash leftover from a rename (I removed all but old talk usage)

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, pages that meet certain criteria may be deleted at any time.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. —[AlanM1(talk)]— 19:48, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

Template:BS-table3

I converted almost all of the templates and articles that used {{BS-table3}} over the past week; you can do the user and miscellaneous pages if you feel so inclined. Useddenim (talk) 00:46, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Instructor's Barnstar
	Thank you for your contributions to the perennial sources list, including the style sheet, the templates, and the "Alexa rank" column. I appreciate your help in these areas, especially since they are usually overlooked. — Newslinger talk 08:44, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

Re: Wikipedia:Talk pages consultation 2019

I just signed myself up to help close the discussion.

I'm not an admin, but feel free to check out some of my previous closings. ―Matthew J. Long -Talk-^☖ 16:49, 23 February 2019 (UTC)

@MattLongCT: Thanks. I'm not totally sure if the discussion is going to work out, but it should hopefully resolve itself by the time summaries are needed (regardless of whether it's currently well-structured). Jc86035 (talk) 16:55, 23 February 2019 (UTC)

I am optimistic! ―Matthew J. Long -Talk-^☖ 16:12, 24 February 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Barnstar of Good Humor
	For your contributions to Talk:Rickrolling. The sad part is that I actually got rickrolled twice today. And one of them was incredibly obvious!!! — pythoncoder  (talk | contribs) 03:13, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

Thanks. I actually clicked the link in the barnstar. I don't know why. Jc86035 (talk) 07:33, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

Deletion review for Template:Puke

An editor has asked for a deletion review of Template:Puke. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Zackmann (^{Talk to me}/_{What I been doing}) 21:15, 8 March 2019 (UTC)

Talk pages consultation - it is time to close the Phase 1!

Hello

You have volunteered to be a coordinator for the Talk pages consultation 2019. Thank you again!

Community summaries are due by Saturday, April 6, 2019. It is now time to close the conversations. We really thank everyone who has participated. Every opinion matters.

What is a community summary?

The goal of a community summary is to wrap up the discussions and provide a summary of what your participants said. That way, other communities can learn about your community's needs, concerns, and ideas. We have seen very different feedback on different wikis, and it is time to discover what everyone thinks!

Please include in that summary:

• every perspective or idea your community had, and
• how frequent each idea was; for example,
  • how many users shared a given opinion
  • whether an idea was more common among different types of contributors (newcomers, beginners, experienced editors...)

You can add as much detail as you want in that summary.

Please post it on the page for community summaries, using the most international English you have.

Can't the Wikimedia Foundation read all the feedback?

We are trying, but we really need your help. For most conversations, we have to use machine translation, which has limitations. This can help us find the most common needs or global ideas. Machine translation is useful, but it does not tell us how people are feeling or what makes your community unique.

Your community summary should be built from your community's perspective, experience and culture. You might also know of relevant discussions in other places, which we did not find (for example, perhaps someone left a note on your user talk page – it is okay to include that!). Your summary is extremely important to us.

What are the next steps?

Phase 2 will happen in April. We will analyze the individual feedback, your community summary, and some user testing. We hope to have a clear view of everyone's ideas and needs at the end of April.

Some ideas generated during phase 1 may be mutually exclusive. Some ideas might work better for some purposes or some kinds of users. During Phase 2, we'll all talk about which problems are more urgent, which projects are most closely aligned with the overall needs and goals of the movement, and which ideas we should focus on first.

Discussions about these ideas may be shaped and be moderated by the Wikimedia Foundation, guided by our decision criteria, listed on the project page.

How can I help now?

• Please provide the summary. :)
• While we study the feedback, we may ask you for more information.
• We will need your help for Phase 2 as well, probably to translate or publicize some future materials we may have.

If you have any questions or need some help, please ask.

Thank you again for your help, Trizek (WMF) 18:12, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

Alexa ranks

Hi Jc86035, have you considered developing a hosted service on Toolforge to make Alexa ranks from the Internet Archive available through a Wikipedia template? This would benefit every page that uses the {{Infobox website}} template with the alexa parameter. I'd be happy to help if you'd like me to assist, although I'm unfamiliar with Wikipedia/Wikimedia APIs, and I'd need to do some reading before I can start contributing. The Wikipedia-facing changes would need to be implemented by an approved bot. — Newslinger talk 11:23, 24 February 2019 (UTC)

@Newslinger: I do actually already have a Toolforge tool, archive-things, with which I archived the data from August to January. Originally (last January) the data was supposed to be added to Wikidata by Tozibb's bot, but Tozibb abruptly disappeared about a year ago after they got flak for their bot adding Alexa ranks below 1,000,000 to several hundred municipality items. I haven't added any of the subsequently archived data to Wikipedia. (My Toolforge tool still archives a large amount of content regularly, including a fairly excessive yet also fairly limited amount of YouTube data, and several music charts.)

I am also not particularly familiar with the Wikimedia APIs; almost all of my pywikibot use has been on Commons (uploading and moving files).

I haven't archived that many different websites, but alexa.com has far and away been the most irritating to archive at the scale needed to make Wikidata data reasonably complete. Alexa.com has a fairly severe rate limit (applied to all probably-not-human user agents) that doesn't reset for a full 24 hours, whereas websites like Spotify just don't have any rate limits whatsoever. This is also difficult partly because Alexa Internet has a close connection to the Internet Archive, so there is an expectation that only a limited amount of data is archived so as not to effectively reduce the value of Alexa's paid services; thus, no support can be expected from anyone affiliated with either the Internet Archive or Alexa, as far as I'm aware. It would also probably be considered a waste of Archive Team resources, though I've never asked.

There are several other relevant issues:

• All Alexa ranks are supposed to be updated at around 17:00 UTC, but (at least on www.alexa.com) they may also be updated silently in the ~40 minutes prior; there is no indication that this happens other than the rank changing. All data is from the previous UTC day (based on the headers below "Monthly Unique Visitor Metrics"), although there is no indication of the exact hours of data collection. As such, any archival should not be done between 16:15 UTC and 17:15 UTC.
• I used Toolforge specifically because it has multiple public-facing IPs; I was getting a lot of HTTP errors from www.alexa.com when archiving using my home computer. When not logged in to the Internet Archive, Internet Archive IPs and end user IPs are paired 1:1. Unfortunately, because of the grid structure, Toolforge users have no control over which grid server runs commands. As such, if too many jobs are run on the same server at the same time, the rate limit gets activated quite quickly.
• I recently found out that https://web.archive.org/save has a separate service for users logged into the Internet Archive, which also archives outlinks and ignores robots.txt (and doesn't make all outgoing requests through the same IA server IP address). This does not appear to be advertised anywhere (or is explicitly omitted), which is why it took me several years to find out about it; I also don't know when it started existing. After figuring this out, I tried archiving 1,000 URLs through this method by putting some links in User:Jc86035/sandbox3. It worked, but then I tried using two tabs at once and it started returning HTTP 403. Using a list longer than about 1,000 URLs also doesn't seem to work very well. (As you can probably tell, I've assumed that there are no user manuals for most of the aforementioned things. Whether or not this assumption was correct, it has been intensely irritating and time-consuming, and in retrospect I would have preferred not to have had any involvement with this.)
• The reason I didn't archive data.alexa.com is because the robots.txt prevents it, and only saving the data to Wikidata would have made the data impossible to verify afterwards. I successfully archived it using the logged-in IA service, but it started failing after a few minutes. I don't know the cause of this.
• In order to generate the lists of websites, I've used other lists of websites, including other "top million websites" lists and lots of URLs scoured from Wikidata queries. (Alexa no longer freely releases a canonical list beyond the top 50; they last did several years ago.) Most recently I sorted the large list of websites by querying data.alexa.com and changing my home IP address every ten minutes. I don't know why it worked, and it probably shouldn't have (I was sending hundreds of HTTP requests per second), but it did.

I disabled the Alexa archival because it was starting to return 403 Forbidden very quickly after stopping and restarting archival. I was archiving several hundred thousand websites per week using a fairly crude mechanism (7 × xargs + wget every three hours), so it's not that surprising. (The grid configuration did not help, because even if I had written a proper script to only send one request every x seconds, the rate limit would have been activated for 24 hours almost every time enough jobs were sent to the same grid server. There are only 42 grid servers, and in December I was archiving seven groups of seven alexa.com jobs every day.) I'm not planning to reactivate it in its current form.

Any automatic updating of the data would have to take into account the above issues. In addition, adding data to Wikidata and using the data in this way could be problematic because items do not have 1:1 relationships with domain names, and Wikidata doesn't have separate items for the domain names themselves. (Alexa also has separate ranks for subdomains of particular sites, like Tumblr.)

I don't know what configuration would be best for an English Wikipedia bot, I don't know how I would update the lists of URLs (although it's possible that keeping them in a Commons data table would be the best option), and I'm probably not the best person to properly set this up. Regardless, I will probably have to reconfigure a lot of things quite soon because of a rate limit being introduced through the Toolforge server changes. Jc86035 (talk) 16:11, 24 February 2019 (UTC)

Wow, that is a lot of information. You've clearly put a considerable amount of effort into this project. I'll need some time to read more about Toolforge and think about how this could work before I can offer suggestions. Thanks for taking the time to explain everything. — Newslinger talk 21:34, 24 February 2019 (UTC)

@Newslinger: Sorry for the late reply. Having thought a little about this, if you're still interested, I don't think implementing this would be as difficult as the previous archiving setup. Apologies if the large block of text made you think it would be extremely difficult (as noted, I'm probably not the best person to properly set this up).

The main issue with the previous attempt was that I was trying to archive too many pages, at regular intervals using one-liner scripts. I think it would be possible to have a setup involving the data (rank, domain, archive date) being pushed to one or two Lua data pages, with the data collection running on a loop and being stopped automatically. The archival interval would become irregular and probably less frequent. Jc86035 (talk) 11:01, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

Hi Jc86035, don't worry – I wasn't expecting a response because it's my responsibility to do the required reading before I'm able to help out. There are a couple of hurdles: Wikimedia developer account registration is currently closed (details here), and I'm also not sure how to see the source code for archive-things as the tool page doesn't provide much information to logged out users.

I can think of two ways to address the scaling issues with archiving Alexa. First, it might not be necessary to do daily updates. Many website articles have Alexa ranks that are outdated by many months, and automatic monthly updates would already be a significant improvement over the status quo. Second, archiving can be handled on an opt-in basis. One way to implement this is to have a subscription page (similar to a MassMessage delivery list) that lists domains for archive-things to update. A template could then populate the values from the data source (the Lua data page or Wikidata) into the website infobox. This gives editors maximum control over which articles display the automatically updated values, and also allows you to monitor the job volume for archive-things. — Newslinger talk 00:43, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

@Newslinger and Jc86035: If not seen already please see discussion Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#Alexa_rank_question. -- GreenC 18:52, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

​Thanks for bringing this up. The proposed bot queries Alexa's API for sites registered at User:OsamaK/AlexaBot.js, and then updates the infoboxes in the articles directly. And it also looks like there's concern over using Alexa data at all, regardless of whether it's manually or automatically updated. — Newslinger talk 19:49, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

Album / song infoboxes

I'm facing issues with some editors who are ignoring parameter and notes at both {{Infobox album}} and {{Infobox song}}, mostly where each "Notes" section is involved. I'm told that {{hlist}} should be used, due to "saving space," yet the notes themselves cite MOS:Accessibility for excluding it and simply listing in the bulleted format itself. Is there a "bot" we can activate to change this? livelikemusic talk! 15:27, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

@Livelikemusic: I think {{hlist}} is fine in this case. It's just redundant, since the CSS class it applies to the lists it generates is already applied by the infobox to the relevant table cells. It does save vertical space, though. I don't think its use is problematic; the accessibility concern is about the use of comma-separated lists and not list templates. Jc86035 (talk) 16:23, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

@Jc86035: Oh, alright. Did not realize it was in-related to comma-use, and not the template itself. My concern was, if {{hlist}} was used manually was that was in-violation of the accessibility manual of style, and I did not want that at the end of the day! livelikemusic talk! 16:30, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

Module:Adjacent stations/Washington Metro

FYI, this will probably be used in article space within the next day or two. Best, Mackensen (talk) 21:21, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

@Mackensen: Is there an issue that's preventing it from being used in all of the stations' articles? Jc86035 (talk) 16:24, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

No, just working in other areas. Mackensen (talk) 18:12, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

Discord

I had no idea we had a discord - is that a general one, just some languages or is there an en-wiki one as well? Nosebagbear (talk)

@Nosebagbear: In practice, the one linked from Wikipedia:Discord is overwhelmingly used by English Wikipedia editors and almost all discussion is in English. The server has dedicated Commons and Meta channels, as well as specific channels for five WikiProjects, #english-wikipedia, #general, #technical and #offtopic. I haven't joined any of the other servers, as I'm most fluent in English. Jc86035 (talk) 13:13, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

Proposed Safe Space Policy for the Hong Kong User Group

To ensure a safe, friendly, inclusive and harassment-free environment for all future events, it is proposed that a Safe Space Policy shall be established by the User Group.

The full proposed policy is posted at meta:Wikimedia Community User Group Hong Kong/Safe Space Policy.

A consultation on the proposed policy is currently conducted. During the consultation period, please voice your opinion on the discussion thread in Meta. The proposed policy would come in effect on 22 May 2019 if no objections are raised by the user group members.

Regards, --無聊龍 (talk) 05:31, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

Talk pages consultation: Phase 2 starts!

The Wikimedia Foundation is currently conducting a global consultation about communication. The goal is to bring Wikimedians and wiki-minded people together to improve tools for communication.

Phase 1 of the consultation is over, thank you very much for your help on setting up that first phase. We've published the Phase 1 report. The report summarizes what we've learned, proposes a direction for the project, and asks specific questions to explore in Phase 2.

Very briefly, the proposed direction is that wikitext talk pages should be improved, and not replaced. We propose building a new design on top of talk pages that changes the page's default appearance, and offers key tools like replying, indenting and signing posts. To keep consistency with existing tools, the new design will be a default experience that existing users can opt out of. We also propose building features that experienced contributors want, including the ability to watchlist a single discussion, and the ability to move, archive and search for threads. Building these features may require some loss of flexibility, or small-to-medium changes in wikitext conventions. The goal is to only make changes that directly enable functionality that users really want.

You can see more information and discussion about the proposed direction in the Phase 1 report, including the results of new user tests and some of the quotations from Phase 1 discussions that led to this proposal.

Now it's time to start Phase 2!

We have six questions to discuss in Phase 2, asking for reactions to the proposed direction, and pros and cons for specific changes that we could make.

Can you help by hosting a discussion at your wiki? Here's what to do:

1. First, sign up your group here.
2. Next, create a page (or a section on a Village pump, a dedicated page, or an e-mail thread – whatever is natural for your group) to collect information from other people in your group.
3. Then start the conversation with the six questions listed in the Questions for Phase 2 section of the report.
4. Inform your community about the Phase 2. We will display a banner on the wikis when some communities will have setup their local consultation places.
5. When the conversation is concluded, please write a summary of the discussion on the Phase 2 community discussion summaries page, and report what you learned from your group. Please include links if the discussion is available to the public. Community summaries for Phase 2 are due by June 15, 2019

You can read more about the overall process on MediaWiki.org. If you have questions or ideas, you can leave feedback about the consultation process in the language you prefer.

Thank you! We're looking forward to talking with you.

Best, Trizek (WMF) 07:35, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

Meetup #120

Hi! Do you have any plans to go to Meta:Meetup/Hong Kong/120?

WhisperToMe (talk) 02:55, 19 May 2019 (UTC)

@WhisperToMe: No, not yet. Jc86035 (talk) 06:31, 19 May 2019 (UTC)

Old Town station

I had split them off to here. If you disagree, that is fine with me. Thanks.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 18:07, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

@Kew Gardens 613: I'd have thought it would be more common to include the transit stations on both pages? (See e.g. Central and Central Station.) I'm not sure if it would be better to only include the link to the more specific disambiguation page. Jc86035 (talk) 19:19, 20 May 2019 (UTC)