Talk:Israeli attacks on Al-Maghazi refugee camp

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Israeli attacks on Al-Maghazi refugee camp article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Warning: active arbitration remedies

The contentious topics procedure applies to this article. This article is related to the Arab–Israeli conflict, which is a contentious topic. Furthermore, the following rules apply when editing this article:

You must be logged-in and extended-confirmed to edit or discuss this topic on any page (except for making edit requests, provided they are not disruptive)
You may not make more than 1 revert within 24 hours on any edits related to this topic

Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page.

Further information

The exceptions to the extended confirmed restriction are:

Non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace only to make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided they are not disruptive.
Non-extended-confirmed editors may not create new articles, but administrators may exercise discretion when deciding how to enforce this remedy on article creations. Deletion of new articles created by non-extended-confirmed editors is permitted but not required.

With respect to the WP:1RR restriction:

Clear vandalism of whatever origin may be reverted without restriction. Also, reverts made solely to enforce the extended confirmed restriction are not considered edit warring.
Editors who violate this restriction may be blocked by any uninvolved administrator, even on a first offence.

After being warned, contentious topics procedure can be used against any editor who repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process. Contentious topic sanctions can include blocks, topic-bans, or other restrictions.
Editors may report violations of these restrictions to the Arbitration enforcement noticeboard.

If you are unsure if your edit is appropriate, discuss it here on this talk page first. When in doubt, don't revert!

While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard.

This article is rated Stub-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects.

Geography Low‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Geography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of geography on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GeographyWikipedia:WikiProject GeographyTemplate:WikiProject Geographygeography articles

Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

WikiProject Geography To-do list:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Article requests : See Requested articles/Social sciences/Geography, cities, regions and named places and Missing articles about Locations
Assess : Tag related article talk pages with {{WikiProject Geography}}. To help assess the quality and importance of geography articles, please see: Unassessed geography articles and Unknown-importance geography articles.
Cleanup : See Geography articles needing attention
Deletion sorting : Listed at Geographic related deletion discussions
Geographical coordinates : See Articles missing geocoordinate data by country
Infobox : See Geography articles needing infoboxes
Map : See Wikipedia requested maps
Notability : See Geography articles with topics of unclear notability
Photo : See Wikipedia requested photographs of places
Stubs : See Geography stubs

Biography: Military

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by the military biography work group (assessed as Low-importance).

Crime and Criminal Biography: Serial, mass, and spree killers Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by the Serial Killer task force (assessed as Low-importance).

Death Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Death, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Death on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DeathWikipedia:WikiProject DeathTemplate:WikiProject DeathDeath articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

International relations: United Nations Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject International relations, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of International relations on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.International relationsWikipedia:WikiProject International relationsTemplate:WikiProject International relationsInternational relations articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject United Nations.

Israel Low‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Israel, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Israel on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.IsraelWikipedia:WikiProject IsraelTemplate:WikiProject IsraelIsrael-related articles

Low

This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Project Israel To Do:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Assess : Rate the Unassessed Israel-related articles and Unknown-importance Israel-related articles.
Cleanup : Cleanup listing for this project is available. See also the list by category and the tool's wiki page.
Collaborate : Participate in WikiProject Israel Palestine Collaboration.
Copyedit : Timeline of the Israeli–Palestinian conflict in 2005
Deletion sorting : Participate in discussions at WikiProject Deletion sorting/Israel.
Expand : Ayala Procaccia, Diamond industry in Israel, Edna Arbel, Levin Kipnis, Rami Kleinstein, Sephardic Haredim, Zman Tel Aviv, Nachum Heiman, Public Defence (Israel), Prisoner of Zion, Trial of Benjamin Netanyahu, Day to Mark the Departure and Expulsion of Jews from the Arab Countries and Iran, Pre-Modern Aliyah
See also Articles needing translation from Hebrew Wikipedia.
Geographical coordinates : Add geographic coordinates to Israel articles missing geocoordinate data.
Infobox : Add infoboxes to Israel articles needing infoboxes.
Maintain : See Israel articles needing attention.
Map : See discussion at Module:Location map/data/Israel. Add maps to articles in Wikipedia requested maps in Israel.
NPOV : Jewish exodus from Arab and Muslim countries
Photo : Add pictures to articles in Wikipedia requested photographs in Israel.
Stubs : See Israel stubs.
Update : Basic Law proposal: Israel as the Nation-State of the Jewish People
Other :
- Translate to Hebrew : David Bar-Hayim, Guy Bavli, and Guy Oseary.

Military history: Biography / Middle East / Post-Cold War

This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history articles

Associated task forces:
/
	Military biography task force
	Middle Eastern military history task force
	Post-Cold War task force

Palestine Low‑importance

	Palestine portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Palestine, a team effort dedicated to building and maintaining comprehensive, informative and balanced articles related to the geographic Palestine region, the Palestinian people and the State of Palestine on Wikipedia. Join us by visiting the project page, where you can add your name to the list of members where you can contribute to the discussions.PalestineWikipedia:WikiProject PalestineTemplate:WikiProject PalestinePalestine-related articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

On 16 May 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved from Al-Maghazi refugee camp airstrikes to Israeli attacks on Al-Maghazi refugee camp. The result of the discussion was moved.

Remove "civilians" word from the infobox

None of the referenced articles on the page state that everyone killed were civilians. Therefore it cannot be verified as true. I am not saying it is false but before there is proof (be it just an article that states they were all civilians) it is just an assumption. It is also how deaths/casualties are presented (only number or interval) in most other articles about Israel-Hamas war (except where soldiers are presented apart from civilians). BnC78 (talk) 13:12, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It hardly needs to be proved that people are people. That is the default state of affairs. What needs proof is that there was anyone in any way separate from civilian life on the scene. What are the opposing claims? Iskandar323 (talk) 13:30, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't state anywhere that people are not people. But people encompasses both civilians and combatant. The article itself (not the infobox) is correct because it uses "people" instead of "civilians".

In my opinion using the term "civilians" in this instance violates the WP:NOR policy because no references state that the only casualties were civilians. And the absence of proof of combatant casualty isn't proof of the casualties only being civilians.

The infobox should state "Deaths 40+ people" or just "Deaths 40+" so it is neutral and verifiable. BnC78 (talk) 15:17, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Second attack, Dec 24

'Israeli air strike kills at least 70 Palestinians in central Gaza refugee camp, health officials say' Reuters [1]

"An Israeli air strike that hit central Gaza's Maghazi refugee camp has killed 70 people, Palestinian health ministry spokesman Ashraf al-Qidra said on Sunday, and he said the death toll was likely to climb."

IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 04:53, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Should this page become Al-Maghazi refugee camp airstrikes plural? Similar to the page Jabalia refugee camp airstrikes, 2023. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 05:41, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Page moved to Al-Maghazi refugee camp airstrikes. The description in the page is short, someone can create specific page about specific airstrike if needed. Template:2023 Israel–Hamas war updated. Sinucep (talk) 12:11, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Suggested move to Al-Maghazi refugee camp massacre

Many sources refer to the airstrikes as a massacre, and this would be more consistent with other articles on attacks in this war.

Dylanvt (talk) 20:53, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Do you mean the airstrike on 24 and 25 December? In that case a page called Al-Maghazi refugee camp massacre can be created likewise the page Al-Maghazi UNRWA school airstrike, keeping this page. Better to wait few days, collect informations and talk here about the need for such a page. Sinucep (talk) 22:43, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Most of the mentions of a massacre are in regard to the Christmas strikes, yes, with many calling it a "Christmas Massacre". But a few sources refer to earlier strikes on this camp as massacres as well. Perhaps there should be separate articles, for the different attacks, yes. Dylanvt (talk) 01:42, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Are there any other airstrikes that are referred to as massacres on Wikipedia? In my opinion the sources provided warrant at least mentioning that the airstrike has been called a massacre, but I'm not sure the page or event should be title as "Al-Maghazi refugee camp massacre". IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 23:04, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Don't know the answer to that. And your suggestion is certainly another possibility worth considering. Dylanvt (talk) 01:43, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Correct the year in "17 October 2032 strike"

The section "17 October 2032 strike" has the year incorrect. Should be 2023. Keithicus (talk) 06:32, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed, thank you. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 14:12, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Spelling correction in lede

Struck, not struk. 69.156.166.201 (talk) 10:22, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 15:36, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 16 May 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (non-admin closure) Safari Scribe^{Edits! Talk!} 02:08, 3 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Al-Maghazi refugee camp airstrikes → Israeli attacks on Al-Maghazi refugee camp – The attacks on the camp comprised of not only airstrikes but also of ground attacks, as evidenced in the article, while naming the perpetrator makes the title less ambiguous / more precise. — kashmīrī ^TALK 09:56, 16 May 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. DannyS712 (talk) 03:02, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - at first glance, the statement about ground attacks seems backed only by an Al Jazeera liveblog titled "Maghazi refugee camp resident says Israeli tanks crushed people". The liveblog seems based on an interview with a single unnamed resident. Is there better evidence from reliable sources about this?

XDanielx (talk) 13:58, 19 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

In Maghazi, the IDF has used mortars [2] and artillery [3][4], both of which are fired from the ground.

In addition, Al-Jazeera reported: "Witnesses in the Maghazi refugee camp say many of the residents were shot at close range by Israeli soldiers “in cold blood”."VR _{(Please ping on reply)} 05:37, 28 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom and per evidence above.VR _{(Please ping on reply)} 05:37, 28 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.