User talk:Marchjuly/Archives/2013/December

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December 2013

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Mancow Muller may have broken the syntax by modifying 2 "{}"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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• not broadcast Muller's program<ref>http://www.radioink.com/HeadlineEntry.asp?hid=124080&pt=archive">Decency Activist David Smith To FCC: Don't Renew Emmis Licenses – 8-10-04</ref>{{spaced ndash}}
• you of him? Barack Obama is me, you’ve seen me on TV, you’ve seen me on movies, he is me." <ref>{{cite news|url=http://www.infowars.com/mancow-muller-obama-is-an-actor-trained-by-harry-lennix/|

Thanks, BracketBot (talk) 06:01, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

RE: Question

To answer your question what the reviewing means is that another editor has reviewed your contribution it is called the Recent Changes Patrol, see WP:RCP. To add that heart that you get from signing that persons guestbook, all you do is add {{User:Arknascar44/Love Cabal}} to the top of your talk/user page. Please don't hesitate to ask me if you have any further questions. As I will be more than happy to help you learn more about editing Wikipedia. :) Clarkcj12 (talk) 14:46, 12 December 2013 (UTC)

Yes, reviews are pretty much a standard. Basically the reviewer reviews the whole page, and places any maintenance tags if needed. Also that heart thing when you click on it on a users talk page, you can give love that way. You can pick what message you want it to say. --Clarkcj12 (talk) 21:44, 12 December 2013 (UTC)

You can tell if a page that you created was reviewed by when you get that message. Also its not a pass or fail thing, basically a recent changes review is when someone checks the page to make sure it meets the different policy's, and tag it approperiately so other editors can know what needs to be fixed to improve it. Also that heart thing is shown on my userpage, but I can't see it our use it on there. It will only show up on other users talkpage. Like I can see the heart on your talk page, but you can't. As clicking it would have given you yourself wikilove. --Clarkcj12 (talk) 00:30, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

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Larry Lujack

I've left a reply on my talk. If you're watching it already and don't need notes here then please let me know! Thanks! – Connormah (talk) 05:31, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

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Hello, Marchjuly/Archives/2013/December. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived after 2-3 days of inactivity. Message added by David Biddulph (talk) 21:50, 19 December 2013 (UTC). (You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template).

Larry Lujack info

I think all of this will need to go as a copyvio. I read the earlier online edition of the Chicago Tribune obit- this is the obit at present-and it looks to be a copy/paste of that earlier obit. We hope (talk) 13:28, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, but I'm not sure exactly what that means. Is the current version of the page a copyright violation in some way? Also what does the padlock icon mean? I wonder if the person (Alujack) who made this update is Larry Lujack's son Anthony Lujack. Marchjuly (talk) 13:52, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Since it did appear under the Chicago Tribune copyright when the information was on their site, I'd believe it is a copyvio and should be removed or commented out. The information can be re-written. The padlock is because of SSL. The user may be related to Lujack--we can't say for certain; he she made only that edit at WP thus far. We hope (talk) 14:33, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

The section written by that user is the apparent copy/paste. We hope (talk) 14:36, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Update-I've rewritten what appears to have been the copypasted section. The article still needs more refs, etc., but the material is gone now. We hope (talk) 16:19, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

OK. Thanks again for all the help. And, thanks for taking the time to rewrite all of that. Looks much better now then when I first read it. So copivio means that you cannot copy and paste stuff directly from newspapers, etc.? Still a little unclear on that. Finally, should his stepson's name be given? The old version said Taber Sequin. Also, should mention be made that Judith was his second wife? Other than those two minor things I can't think of anything else.--- User:Marchjuly|Marchjuly]] (talk) 21:23, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

The information in newspapers, books, and on many websites is under copyright. When you use something like this as a source, you rewrite the material so it's not exactly what the copyrighted source shows--sort of like telling a story in your own words and not someone else's.  :) It's OK to use quotes from a source as long as you attribute them to where you got them--a newspaper story, magazine article, book, etc. You can mention his stepson's name if you use this obit from San Francisco Gate as a source. You could also work it in to the "survived by" paragraph that she was his second wife. HTH, We hope (talk) 22:02, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. Will add the stepson's name. I'll try to follow what you did so, hopefully, I won't screw the pooch. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:14, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

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December 2013

I've, temporarily at least, removed your recent addition to the Mancow Muller article. Somethng of that nature really needs some sort of reliable reference under Wikipedia:Verifiability guidelines and general WP:BLP proceedures. Provided you can add a reliable independent source (i.e. a news article would do nicely) please feel free to add the information back in. Otherwise please don't, lest it be reverted again. Much thanks!Sector001 (talk) 05:37, 4 December 2013 (UTC)

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to User/Marchjuly/sandbox/NHK Cup (Shogi) may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "()"s and 1 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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• [[NHK Cup (Shogi)]]]<br />
• (shogi professionals): A {{nihongo|female shogi professional|[[Shogi#Tournament play|女流棋士]]}}) who serves as the tournament's {{nihongo|host|司会}} and a {{nihongo|(male) shogi professional|[[

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Hello, Marchjuly/Archives/2013/December. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived after 2-3 days of inactivity. Message added by ~SuperHamster Talk Contribs 05:44, 22 December 2013 (UTC). (You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template).

And another one :) ~SuperHamster Talk Contribs 15:53, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Memorial day for the end of the war

Thanks for the info :-) Cls14 (talk) 22:58, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

No problems. Not really sure how to improve that page. It appears have been added by a native Japanese (non-native English speaker) possibly somebody living here in Japan. That would explain why some of the wording seems a little unnatural. The official English translation of the "終戦記念日" was mostly likely made some years ago by some government official who in all honestly probably not a very experienced translator. Lots of "official" English translations of stuff Japanese often ending sounding a little strange to native English speakers. AS for whether it is a "public holiday" or not, I guess that depends upon how you define "holiday". On Public holidays in Japan there is no mention of this day at all. My feeling is that the who categorized this as a public holiday might have been using a more general definition of "holiday" than a "legal" one. I think this page is better categorized as List of Japanese anniversaries and memorial days. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:03, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

Help! I Need Somebody. Help! Not Just Anybody. Help! You Know I Need Someone. Heelp!

Hi, I am new to Wikipedia and basically trying to figure things out by trial and error. I ahve 2 questions about archiving stuff.

1. Situation: I am trying to set up my Talk Page so that it archives (using Lowercase sigmabot III) stuff once a monthly and designates these archive pages as "name of month/YYYY" (e.g., Dec. 2013). Moreover, I would like the archive pages to be accessible as follows: "user:marchjuly/talk_archives/yyyy/nameofmonth"

Question: Have I set it up correctly?

2. Situation: When I first set up my archives, I basically just copied and pasted something from somebody else's page and changed the info accordingly. An archive was in fact created, but it only contained two items since it was set up by the other user to archive stuff every 10 days. Here's that page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Marchjuly/Archive_2.

Questions: Will my new archive setup overwrite this page when a new archive is created, or is it pretty much there forever? Is there some way to remove this archive page, if it is the same information is contained in another archive page?

Thank you in advance Marchjuly (talk) 01:13, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Hello.

I've updated the config template so that it archives to User talk:Marchjuly/talk archives/year/monthname. You'll have to move the discussions out of the Archive 2 page by yourself, though. →Σσς. (Sigma) 01:37, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for the help. Few more questions. How do I move everything? By copying and pasting? By using move? Will the Archive 2 page be deleted automatically once everything is moved?Marchjuly (talk) 02:02, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

In this case, you can just copy/paste it and then put {{db-u1}} on the page. →Σσς. (Sigma) 02:21, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks again. Just a few final questions: (1) How can I set my archive box so that it's default position is collapsed (i.e., it is hidden)? and (2) Should I move the stuff from Archive 2 now or just wait at let the lowercase sigmabot III do it for me at the end of this month? I don't want to screw up the archiving anymore than I already have. Marchjuly (talk) 02:46, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

My bot won't touch Archive 2 anymore, You have to do it by yourself. I would dump its contents back onto this page and wait another day for my bot to clean it up again.

As for the archive box, you can pass either "yes" or "no" to the |collapsed parameter. I've done that for you. →Σσς. (Sigma) 03:15, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for all the help. Baby steps, baby steps... Marchjuly (talk) 04:05, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) I have changed your archive configuration, {{MiszaBot/config}}, such that it will actually work. Comments, "<!-- -->", definitely make it fail (tested late yesterday). You appear to have gotten that text from something I wrote on the Help:Archiving a talk page. Sorry about that. That page has been changed and a bug reported. I also changed where your archives will be placed. They will now go to pages named: User talk:Marchjuly/Archives/YYYY/Month as that is where all the templates (e.g. the {{archives by months}} template in your your archive box) expect them to be. If the archives are somewhere else you will find using the standard templates more cumbersome. Some will not function properly at all. The archive bot you are using, lowercase sigmabot III, is, I believe, next scheduled to run in about 11 hours from now. We should know then if everything is working. Makyen (talk) 13:05, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Shouldn't it be "User talk:Marchjuly/Archives/YYYY/Month" ? Four Y's since a calendar year has 4 digits? Marchjuly (talk) 14:01, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Yes. That was a typo in what I wrote in this section, the bot will use 4 digits. Thanks for picking it up. (corrected above) Makyen (talk) 14:10, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

No worries. I thought that's what it was, just wasn't sure. Thanks again for the help -- Marchjuly (talk) 21:21, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

The bot did not run today. I do not actually know which days it is scheduled to run and which it does not. I expected that it was scheduled to run on a daily basis, but that does not appear to be the case. It last ran on the 17th, but it was a very short run. I will be watching it and your page to check for it doing your page when it runs. Makyen (talk) 03:59, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. "I always feel like somebody's watching me" so no worries. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:24, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

[I got tired of typing so many ":". Actually, I was going back and forth about either using an {{outdent}} or seeing how far we would go .]

The bot did run today, but —as I should have checked earlier— you don't have any threads that are old enough to archive, yet. Your archiving is currently set at 30 days.

As you have looked at the edit history, I am not going to reiterate what I did given that I described it there. Most of the edits are self explanatory/cleanup. The explicit TOC is because I have seen pages where random people have put content in the headers. That, and the comment about "everything below this line", are to, hopefully, encourage new editors coming to your page to put things in the correct spot. If you don't want the white space between the talk header and the TOC & archive bot, we can reduce it.

User:Σ‎‎, the developer of lowercase sigmabot III (lcSB3, or lcΣ‎‎B3), has stated that he has fixed the issue of comments not working in the MiszaBot config template. So that should not be an issue anymore. Makyen (talk) 09:33, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

Wow, I have pretty much no idea as to what you're talking about, but that not a reflection on you; I'm just a total newbie. Also. thanks for showing me how "outdent" works. I really do appreciate you trying to clean this up for me. Appearance wise it does seem a little tighter and easier to read. I set my archives at 30 days because I thought that was necessary to get them to archive by month. But, if it's better to have it done every 10 or 15 days than I will do that instead. Thanks again for all the help --Marchjuly (talk) 11:24, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

No problem, happy to do it.

As to not understanding, I can explain more about what I did, if you desire. The TOC is table of contents which is indicated by the __TOC__ tag. In general, a page will have one automatically made if there are more than 3 sections. You can find more information on TOCs at WP:TOC. As to the edit history, I was actually referring to the edit summary which we each enter for our edits and is viewable on the edit history or watchlist pages.

I also just made an edit which enclosed the extra the newline characters, white space, which were causing the gap between your table header and the TOC and archive box. Rather than have lines that look like "}}{{archive box", I enclosed the newline within a comment (e.g. "<!--
-->").

BTW: Do you really want the {{FilemoverTalkpageNotice}} at the top of your page? It is a bit unusual to see on a talk page of a relatively new user.

That's what that is. I must have taken it along for the ride when I was copying and pasting stuff from other pages whose layouts I liked. That's explains the redirect notices. I'll remove it since I have no idea as to help out with stuff like tha, at least not yet. -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:24, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

You can always look for a template like that by typing "Template:FilemoverTalkpageNotice" in the search field at the top of the page. If on Preferences->Gadgets you have checked "Open search results in new tab/window when holding down the CTRL-key" then you can open a new tab instead of leaving the page you are on by ending the typing in the search field by pressing ctrl-enter.

The amount of time that you set for threads to be on your talk page prior to being archived is a personal choice. For most people, it will depend on at least A) the amount of traffic that is on the page, B) how long it can be between posts in a topic, C) how long you like to see old threads on your talk page, etc. Some pages are archived at more than a year, some are archived after a day, or less. (A) affects both how large your talk page gets before archiving and how large each archive file is if using monthly archives. There is no requirement to archive. People are encouraged to keep the overall length in bytes less than 100k, or so, but some are much larger. Some people allow their talk page to grow to great lengths. Personally, I find long pages with old discussions to be hard to deal with. How long is really your choice. The length of time that threads (sections) stay on your page has nothing to do with your archives being in files by month. As currently configured, lcΣ‎‎B3 will place threads in the monthly archive page which corresponds to the most recent time it finds in the signatures within the thread.

I thought it had to be set up as 30 days for monthly archiving. I think I'll change that since the page is getting a little long. Do I just set it to day to another number? If I change it, does the countdown begin from the date of the change or the date of the earliest post that has yet to be archived? -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:24, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

lcΣ‎‎B3 places threads/sections in a file named by year and month based on the most recent date that it finds in signatures within the thread irregardless of the amount of time that the thread has been on the page. Here is an example of lcΣ‎‎B3 putting 185 threads into 54 YYYY/Month based archives in one pass from a page which had never had archiving and had reached 214,054 bytes. The date ranges of the threads spanned from 2008 through 2013. [Note: the other bot, ClueBot III, does not do the same thing in that specific situation. Ignore this parenthetical. It is merely here for completeness.]

To make the change you should change the number of days in both: A) |algo=old(30d) which tells lcΣ‎‎B3 how many days to leave a thread on the page from the last time it was signed; and B)

|bot=Lowercase sigmabot III

|age=30 <!-- Here tells the archive box how many days to display as the time to archiving. -->

There are two basic ways to organize archives: 1) Into files by month, and 2) numbered files limited to a maximum size. Which you use is up to you. Everything here is currently set up to have them by month, as that was how the config file was set when Σ and I started working on it (i.e. it was/is the way we believe you want it). Your comments above confirm that. Makyen (talk) 22:02, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

I want it monthly, but would prefer it if the page doesn't get too long that it's hard to read. Any suggestions? -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:24, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

How long to leave threads on is really a personal choice and largely depends on your personal preferences, how much traffic you get on this page, and how long you like seeing old threads here. Different users like different things. If you set it to a short amount of time, you may also want to consider adding the |minthreadsleft=2 with some number of threads you always want to have on your talk page. That will leave the last X threads on the page if there happens to be a long time with no activity (e.g. you go on vacation). I know you asked for suggestions, but I am not going to actually provide a specific suggestion for this one. You can, of course, try different numbers and see what you like. Certainly nothing wrong with doing that, or changing it multiple times. Makyen (talk) 00:14, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Actually that's exactly the the kind of suggestion I was looking for. It's not a lot of fun when somebody does everything for you; It's so much more fun when they give you ideas that you and play around with yourself. Gonna try that "mini thread" stuff out later and see what happens. Thanks again -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:12, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

I agree. It also provides a better learning experience. When showing people how to do things, I usually try to have them do it themselves with me explaining. Unfortunately, in this environment it is just much easier to actually do it as the example than to trying to generate examples which the other person can then apply to what is happening. Generating the example takes more time and code than actually doing of it. For example, you have to enclose things in <nowiki></nowiki> pairs, etc. to get things to show up on the page properly. If you want some examples of what the differences are, you can take a look at the code on Help:Archiving a talk page. The time spent generating the code to make the examples show up accurately and viewable in a way that a user can just cut&paste them to try them out was quite a bit more than just doing such myself. [NOTE: Talking about ClueBot III is also a special case. While you are not using it here, I have written some stuff about it recently. The bot can do some unexpected things when you are trying to write about it on a talk page with complete code examples (example of ClueBot III generated pagename problem). Thus, at the moment, I am being a bit more careful than is probably necessary.]

I do want to stress that everything I have done on your page should be considered just an example. This is your page, you should do with it what you desire.

BTW: the {{outdent}} template is designed to take an argument that specifies how far from which it is outdenting. This can be numeric or just cut&pasting the indent marks from the line that you are following (assuming that you are outdenting to the left margin). Thus, the outdent you used above could have been written as {{outdent|::::}} which would have put the upper mark directly under the preceding indent. You can see Template:Outdent/testcases for examples. Makyen (talk) 08:06, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks again for all the help-- Marchjuly (talk) 10:50, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Happy to help.

It appears I might not have communicated quite what I intended with the comment about the {{outdent}} template. If you are not going to use the argument, then it is not necessary to have the | to indicate the lack of an parameter. I was attempting to communicate the difference between the following two outdents:

Only in relatively rare cases is a blank parameter required (e.g. where you are showing the lack of a parameter between other parameters (e.g. This page's history with list lengths: default, as 10, and as 10 starting from 22:02, 19 December 2013 (UTC)). [NOTE: The date argument for {{history3}}, and most other such templates, is UTC time, not your local time. For page histories you have probably found the correct edit using the Revision history search link from a history page. WikiBlame returns the found page times in UTC.] Makyen (talk) 00:48, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

OK. Have I used "outdent" correctly this time? Also, I have changed "algo=old(30d)" and "|age=30" to "algo=old(1d)" and "|age=1" respectively so that my page is archived daily. Have I done this correctly? I also added "|minithreadsleft=3" but not sure if I put it in the right spot. Finally, I noticed that when you move the cursor over "Archive Index" it looks like "Archive Index(space)(space(space). Is there any way to fix the underlining so that it looks like Archive Index

q1)Yes, that outdent looks good.

q2)The changes to the archiving templates should be functional. One day seems a very short period of time. It gives people, you included, very little time to respond and assumes that people are on WP daily. Are you planning to log into WP every day?

From a visual perspective, I would suggest adding the |minthreadsleft=3 as a separate line instead of on the same line as |algo=old(1d). This is only to match the fact that all the other parameters are each on a separate line by themselves. This is to make it more readable. Usually, parameters will be either all on one line with the template, or all on separate lines. It is not common to mix the two styles. Mixing such is usually done only to highlight specific parameters, or when formatting an entire parameter. You will use this when you add 2014 to your list of archives (example).

In the {{archives}} template, I would suggest that you have the line that includes {{archives by months|2013}} as the last line in the list. [Watch out for the closing }}. You will need that after that line.] The line I am suggesting you move is an unnamed parameter which is used to define what you want in your archive box. When you add 2014 to your archive box it will be as part of this parameter on an additional line (see an example of what that will look like here).

q3) You can get rid of all the "&nbsp;" text that is in the line:

title=Archive index              

The choice is either having the "Archive index" centered under the icon with the extra spaces, or not centered and no extra spaces. Try removing them and using the "Show preview" button to see which you like better. It is almost certainly possible to get it with no spaces and centered (the template should do this, but does not). For you to implement it would be much more complex. You would have to use a lower level of formatting, basically recreate everything that the {{archives}}, or {{archive box}}, are providing.

Additional: I have replaced the archive indexer bot config. I copy & pasted the numbered indexes version instead of the YYYY/Month version. Makyen (talk) 06:56, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

@Makyen: Well it seems to be archiving. The bot paid may a visit once yesterday and then again earlier today. It appears that some of the messages have been moved to the "Dec. 2013" page. This one thing, however, that has me confused. When I click on the "Archive Index" link beneath the icon, it takes me to the a page with nothing on it. Is that how it's supposed to work? Thanks again for all your help. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:28, 25 December 2013 (UTC)

Sounds good.

Currently, the archive index page should be blank with merely a comment on it saying that legobot can blank the page. You can edit the page to see the comment, but don't remove it or the bot won't write the index. The archive indexer bot is User:Legobot. The last time it ran was on December 10. It is not clear to me how often this bot is supposed to run. The bot has in the past months had some problems being operational. I do not know if the delay from the 10th is intentional, or a problem. The run before that was quite some time ago. The status of this is uncertain at the moment. If you really need an index in the very near future, there is a alternate method of having it happen which I can describe if you desire. There may also be another way developed, but that was merely just suggested a couple of days ago. Makyen (talk) 05:03, 25 December 2013 (UTC)

That's OK. I'm good to go for now, so no need for an index. Thanks again --Marchjuly (talk) 05:25, 25 December 2013 (UTC)

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Hello, Marchjuly/Archives/2013/December. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived after 2-3 days of inactivity. Message added by PrimeHunter (talk) 15:51, 30 December 2013 (UTC). (You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template).