User talk:Hatchens/Archive 5

This is an archive of past discussions with User:Hatchens. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 1

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Archive 3

Articles for creation: Sanjay Bhatia

Hi Hatchens, some time back you had reviewed this article and given your suggestion about notability. In addition I had received additional feedbacks also from other reviewers. Please note a Lokayukta is an important position for an Indian state as only an single person is appointed in that position for a fixed period of time and is a responsible and autonomous position. It is like the ombudsman position in the Scandinavian countries. There are already articles of Lokayuktas of other states of India in Wikipedia. I have further worked on the article and have improved it by incorporating feedback received from other reviewers, especially around neutral tone. Can you please review it once again and suggest me on this. The helpdesk team asked me to reach you on this. This is the article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Sanjay_Bhatia_(administrator). Thanks Gardenkur (talk) 11:08, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Taylorsville Milling Company Roller Mill

Hello, Hatchens. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Taylorsville Milling Company Roller Mill, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Draft space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for article space.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion under CSD G13. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it. You may request userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

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Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 15:01, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Banner Elk School

Hello, Hatchens. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Banner Elk School, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Draft space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for article space.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion under CSD G13. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it. You may request userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

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Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 15:02, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Bladen County Training School

Hello, Hatchens. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Bladen County Training School, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Draft space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for article space.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion under CSD G13. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it. You may request userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

If the deletion has already occurred, instructions on how you may be able to retrieve it are available here.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 15:02, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Sanjay Bhatia (administrator) accepted

Hi Hatchens, I have overwritten the decline and rejection of Sanjay Bhatia (administrator) because Maharashtra Lokayukta seems to be a state-wide office of a federal country (WP:NPOL). I found it via the talk page of Iamfarzan, who had applied for rollback and received a request for a re-review. If I understand the situation correctly, you have rejected the article and nominated it for speedy deletion when the draft already contained this information and could have been reduced to it. Best regards, ~ ToBeFree (talk) 20:22, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

ToBeFree, thank you for reaching out. But, I had a doubt - a politician qualifying as per the WP:NPOL has to win elections (at federal or state level) and for a judge (he or she need to be appointed by a superior court's collegium which is again a type of controlled election). But, in the case of Sanjay Bhatia - he is a beureaucrat who has been appointed by the state government based on his qualification as an Indian Administrative Service officer (which is based on a nation-wide competitive exam). I may be wrong in my interpretation but do consider this as a valid reason from my end for rejecting the article in the first place. But, if you feel it to be otherwise.. then also you have my complete support on this. -Hatchens (talk) 03:58, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

ToBeFree, also one more thing. I recommend and suggest you to do a normal Google search on Google News. Sanjay Bhatia's media citations are press releases sort of thing which are declaring his official appointments (as his career progressed). In depth coverage is still lacking. - Hatchens (talk) 04:16, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Okay, these doubts are definitely reasonable, thanks for the clarification. I'd say not for final rejection but for a notability-based decline, perhaps with additional reasoning text similar to your explanation above. Regarding online sources, yeah; I'm primarily assuming that even for this appointed bureaucrat, there will probably also be sources we don't quickly find via Google News – offline newspapers, perhaps even a book or two dedicated to describing people who served as Maharashtra Lokayuktas. Whenever I look at newspaper websites with incorrectly scaled photos and similar technical issues, I guess there will be ten other newspapers of similar significance with an even worse (or non-existent) online presence. I focused too much on what's available online in a five minute Google search before people explained this to me at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Moyna High School. 😅 ~ ToBeFree (talk) 10:40, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

ToBeFree, I agree with you on this part - the final rejection could had been avoided. But, c'mon... as long as you as an admin bring the best out of us (the reviewers) by bringing in such constructive discussion... I'm all game for it. Wikipedia guidelines are highly confusing sometimes and we should always edit (& expect other's edits) by assuming good faith. - Hatchens (talk) 11:28, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Without all the good faith, the project would have failed from the beginning. Regarding AfD and regular deletion, uuuh, yes, no, well, I'm not really an admin in that area. I've never closed a deletion discussion and do not intend to do so. I've even asked for help at the Teahouse (Special:Permalink/1041237745#Notability_of_the_Maharashtra_Lokayukta) before making the decision, but in the end, I figured the worst that could happen is a deletion discussion, and that wouldn't have been bad either. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 11:54, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Very interesting discussion. I'm just saving this discussion link for the future references purposes. Thank you for tagging me over there. - Hatchens (talk) 12:06, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Chan Hok-lam

Hi, the sources are obituaries from the Chinese University of Hong Kong and a peer reviewed journal (Journal of Song-Yuan Studies), and then info on publications from Cambridge U Press, and the Australian National Uni website. Could you specify the issue, please? Thanks Sheijiashaojun (talk) 05:38, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Sheijiashaojun, thank you for reaching out. It's a promising/notable entity but you need to work upon the structure of the article and on the citation style. Once it's ready, then move it to main article namespace by yourself or you can take my help or anyone else. - Hatchens (talk) 05:43, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. Can you explain to me how to do the Refill thing? I've only ever done it when someone tags it, so I don't understand how to do it on my own. Sheijiashaojun (talk) 05:44, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Sheijiashaojun, sure. Let me sort out few things for you. But, in the meanwhile, could you please add entity's Google scholar or Scopus author page as an external link on the draft page? - Hatchens (talk) 05:47, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, Chan died in 2011, and I think scholars have to do their own GS pages? It might be a bit early for that--his most productive period is 70s through 90s. He doesn't seem to have one. This is the Scopus page https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=57189723588 but neither his field nor his period are ones in which Scopus is very useful. This is also him https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=57200386102 and so are a few other unlinked entries. I wouldn't usually add them b/c not what ppl interested in Chan are looking forward to, but I will if it's the format on WP. But do I add both? Sheijiashaojun (talk) 05:51, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

There's a longish bilingual bibliography in this entry, but I wasn't sure I should fill the page with the names of Chinese books. https://www.itsfun.com.tw/%E9%99%B3%E5%AD%B8%E9%9C%96/wiki-3626665 Sheijiashaojun (talk) 05:57, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Sheijiashaojun, just do one thing. Add all possible links at Drafts' talk page and tag me. I will go through it and help you to develop the page. - Hatchens (talk) 05:59, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

OK, I'll do that. Thanks. Sheijiashaojun (talk) 06:01, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

just for your information, Google Scholar makes a page for every author based on the citations. It also offers authors the opportunity to verify it. Either of these can be called the google scholar author page. I have known cases where the verified page omits some of the publications--if in doubt i check it by entering an article title, finding the author's name in that reference, and clicking it. This gives a page constructed programmatically as if there had been no author-verified page. This is important for all hyphenated or complex names, and non-roman script names; GS does not always collect them all together. FWIW, there are sometimes though rarely similar problems with scopus, and, there have been in the past considerably worse ones with ISI--I do not know the extent to which they have fixed it.The GS page for him i s[ https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C33&q=Chan+Hok-lam&btnG=] It gives a very nice bibliography of books ,journal articles, and other publications.(It tends to include a wider assortment of miscellaneous publications than Scopus or ISI, which can be considered either a positive or negative feature (it's generally true that citation counts in most fields from GS will be about. twice that of Scopus or ISI). There are links to those available open access at the right. And of course GS, unlike Scopus, is available free to everyone. DGG ( talk ) 21:22, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

DGG, thank you once again for sharing this important info about the Google Scholar. As per the content, I had no doubt about entity's notability but an apprehension was there on how to justify his academic background as per the wikipeda guidelines. Google Scholar is go to site for such validations and checks but lately (as your have also mentioned) not all the scholistics papers are included. The possible reason is GS has discarded using OAI-PMH feed way back in early 2010s which resulted into substandard metadata harvesting. (The reason of abandonment is not clear). Yes, Scopus can be an alternative but it's coverage is not as vast as GS. Lately, have been closely watching an Indonesian platform called Neliti.com; tech-wise it looks promising. But, they do lack author pages. - Hatchens (talk) 03:41, 1 September 2021 (UTC)l.

Draft: Padma Rao Sundarji

Hello!

Thank you for reviewing my submission Draft: Padma Rao Sundarji. I need help in understanding the reason why all those print media sources provided that covered the subject and her work in detail were not considered to support the notability of the subject, although the cited newspapers articles mention otherwise.

Also, I have now included the Award section & provided references for the same. I hope the subject of the article will now be considered as notable?

Would appreciate it if you could take a look at the draft once again and guide further please.

Thanks in advance! DivineTogether (talk) 11:33, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

I have made some changes to the write up as well. The subject has received a lot of recognition for her book and also her work as a journalist (which is stated in the print media). I have tried my best to cite facts & sources to prove the same. I am not connected to the subject. Request your guidance further to get the article approved. Thank you

DivineTogether (talk) 11:41, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

DivineTogether, thank you for reaching out. The explaination has been given at the draft page itself. - Hatchens (talk) 14:58, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi Hatchens, thank you for the reply. :)

I have read and understood the comment you left on the draft. However, what I wanted to stress on, is that the book reviews that have been cited as sources have recognised her work as an author as well as a journalist. She has been recognised and was awarded the Rajiv Gandhi Excellence Award 2015 for Best Literary Personality of the year, which is a well recognised award in India. The print media sources have all covered her and her work in detail. She has been one of the senior journalists who has been highly appreciated in many news articles (print media quoted). Even if Wiki does not want to accept her journalism as notable enough, would she not be considered notable as an author and for the award she received that is authorised by the State government? (I can assure you that neither the print media articles written about her nor the award are connected to her or the places she worked, unlike the wiki article you had mentioned about in the comment :-) )

With what I understand of the wiki guidelines, the news articles that cover the subject hold a lot of weightage. I request you to give the article one more read, please! I have made some changes to focus on her as an author. I have provided a lot of print media citation as independent, secondary and third party verifiable sources to prove her notability. I request your expert guidance, please! :) Thanks a lot again!

DivineTogether (talk) 13:49, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

the draft is now in mainspace; I have made some comments.

Yes DGG, I just saw. The entity doesn't qualify for the wikipedia page. Its purely promotional... head to toe. Besides that, the creator prefers for a deletion discussion over draftification (that's what they have written in the edit summary when the draft was moved). What would you advise? -Hatchens (talk) 18:22, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

It's a little odd. If I had some help in. finding the references, I could turn this into a probably acceptable article (especially if there are other reviews of the principal book). I doubt the contributor will help enough, and I'm not going to try to figure it out myself -- once I start doing that, I'm in effect taking on the responsibility of improving everything submitted to WP. But it is not totally unreasonable for a contributor to want to take their chances with our notoriously erratic AfDs, and I suppose they have the right once they're autopatrolled and its not CSD territory. But the insistence of an article in exactly the form originally written and reluctance to make changes is in my experience often typical of coi editors--and very much so for autobiographies. I suppose on balance, we have no right to ourselves individually be the gatekeepers, and the final decision on acceptability , as for everything elsewhere, can only be the community. I think that maintaining this as a basic principal is more important than the obvious fact that it doesn't always work right. (It's always interesting how quickly one can get from a specific procedural or technical point to the fundament philosophy of WP) DGG ( talk ) 21:38, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

Technically, it's a stand-down moment. I agree with you on this. Let's hope this article will develop with time but frankly speaking, I have not such great expectations from it and it's creator(s). This is similar to a case which I dealt with couple of months ago - James Crabtree. - Hatchens (talk) 03:46, 1 September 2021 (UTC)

You can have a look at the AfD discussion here - Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/James Crabtree (2nd nomination). At that time, Barkeep49 assisted and guided me during that AfD closure. Both - this entity and James Crabtree are sitting on the fences. - Hatchens (talk) 03:51, 1 September 2021 (UTC)

Recently AfC comment

Sir, the thing I got noticed is that a politician can't be always be a non-elected person. As per some reviewers comment they said only WP:GNG would pass if it doesn't pass WP:NPOL. Sir this person may not be popular all over India but popular in West Bengal. If it is in a district or some, I would have delete this article. But there are frequent references made. Though his life information are rarely found in some bengali references. But education or early there are no such references. As since he is a local district party president. After you review on this comment. Kindly give your advice whether I can modify it or to delete it. Please do the needful on commenting my talk page or ping me.Jyoti Roy (talk) 02:20, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

TTP1233, no, it's opposite. Politicians has to win state or federal elections. There is no second opinion about it. If this is regarding; Draft:Anubrato Mandol - then I'm sure he is not yet ready for a Wiki page. However, feel free to consult with Fences_and_windows as he had a different opinion about the draft. If he is OK with your draft, then I have no objection because I trust his judgement in these kind of matters. - Hatchens (talk) 04:28, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for pinging me. I think the statement that politicians must win elections is a misreading of NPOL. It states that those who are presumed notable include "Major local political figures who have received significant press coverage" and says "[local or unelected politicians] can still be notable if they meet the general notability guideline." Coverage during one campaign is indeed usually held to fail WP:BLP1E, but we have many bios of unelected politicians and repeat candidates who have received enduring significant coverage. Jyoti Roy, I'll reply further about this draft on my talk page. Fences&Windows 14:45, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

Fences and windows, thank you for bringing in the clarity. I have noted your points which will surely help me in dealing future AfC drafts at the time of reviewing. - Hatchens (talk) 01:27, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

the use of BLP1E for this is in my opinion a perverted use of a very important rule. BLP1E was intended to prevent trivial tabloid-style notability. Doingeven one actually 1notable and important thing is enough. An example we all admit is coming out of nowhere, and winning the elction. The question is whether running in a general election as candidate of a major party for a major office is significant enough. I think it is, though consensus so far usually doesn't agree. My basis is NPOV--that otherwise we are showing political bias by using rules that will almost always favor the incumbent. Eventually I hope we will all realize that NPOV (and V) are more improtant than details of notability rules. DGG ( talk ) 06:11, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

DGG, I agree we should cover more candidates. However, the difficulty is in defining "major party" internationally and that many "major party" candidates in FPTP elections are standing with zero hope of being elected. See for example United Kingdom general election records#Lowest share of the vote. Fences&Windows 12:58, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

Fences and windows, I should have added, as I usually do when I say this, that I am talking only about a two party system as in the US, where except for a very few elections in the past it has been clear which are the 2 major parties. DGG ( talk ) 06:48, 4 September 2021 (UTC)

Congratulations from WikiProject Articles for Creation!

		The Brownie
		Congratulations! You have earned The Brownie for reviewing 33 drafts during the WikiProject Articles for creation July 2021 Backlog Drive. Thank you for your work to improve Wikipedia! On behalf of WikiProject Articles for Creation, Enterprisey (talk!) 00:19, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Legendary Ventures

Hello, could you please elaborate in what way this is WP:TOOSOON ? It appears this criteria is for articles that are expecting more upcoming news, such as new movies. But this company have been around since 2012 and have plenty of news. It is also notable for being SpaceX and Pinterest investor. Carl Carter X (talk) 20:09, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Carlcarterx, thank you for reaching out. Well your assessment about this company is very much skewed. News coverages has to comply with WP:RSP, WP:SIGCOV. Kindly update the draft accordingly and resubmit it for a review. - Hatchens (talk) 11:51, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Regarding Draft:Thangjam Dhabali Singh

Hi Hatchens! Could you please have a look at Draft:Thangjam Dhabali Singh again? You were the last reviewer to decline it. I feel I have addressed the concerns you had regarding the article. I'm waiting for it to be approved (hoping that it would get approved in the next review) soon. Regards SukumarThingom (talk) 16:06, 5 September 2021 (UTC)

SukumarThingom, thank you for reaching out. The draft needs massive copyediting. Kindly refer to the following rules WP:BIO, WP:NPOV, WP:SIGCOV and update the article. - Hatchens (talk) 11:36, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

Noted, Hatchens. Thanks!SukumarThingom (talk) 16:55, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

SukumarThingom, once it's done. Just resubmit for the review. - Hatchens (talk) 01:53, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

I am here again, Hatchens. I was thinking if the reviewers feel the notability of the subject is the main "issue", then no amount of copyediting of the draft would help it. Isn't that so? Regards, SukumarThingom (talk) 08:38, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

SukumarThingom, that depends on how you enhancing the draft. Kindly proceed with editing without any hesitation. All the best. - Hatchens (talk) 11:53, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for your help so far, Hatchens. Regards, SukumarThingom (talk) 07:45, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

Your draft article, Draft:Adam Bessa

Hello, Hatchens. It has been over six months since you last edited the Articles for Creation submission or Draft page you started, "Adam Bessa".

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been deleted. If you plan on working on it further and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:24, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

Liz, thank you for reaching out. Unfortunately, I have given up on this entity's draft as I failed to gather substantial material to start with. - Hatchens (talk) 13:19, 13 September 2021 (UTC)

Reverted edits!

Hello mr. ! i hope you all right! you recently declined my submission about Draft:Pyramids Higher Institute for Engineering and Technology.. I understand that and took your advice and started editing the article, but all my edits are automatically reverted with bo reason!! .. What should I do to avoid this problem and edit the article to make it better? this is the source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:MobileDiff/1044233209&markasread=227816580&markasreadwiki=enwiki Shahba3049 (talk) 07:12, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Shahba3049, thank you for reaching out. Just update the page with independent citations (not directly adding institute links) and then get it reviewed. Also, update the article as per WP:NPOV. If you do this much, then I'm sure entity will qualify for the wikipage. All the best and keep up the good work. - Hatchens (talk) 07:16, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for responding. I am really tried to update the article as per WP:NPOV, also tried to update the links but all my edits automatically reverted. You can check the link below i am really trying but nothing happen. All edits magically cancelled! Shahba3049 (talk) 07:23, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

About South Asian Esport Scenario.

Hey just saw your reason of Nomination for deletion of Stalwart Esports,

Just wanted to let you know that, ESL isn’t active in the South Asia Region as much it is in NA or other regions. The Majors in South Asia are mostly Pubg Mobile Pro League(PMPL), Pubg Mobile World League(PMWL) , Pubg Mobile Club Open (PMCO) and Pubg Mobile Global Championship(PMGC).

In NA and Europe the major’s are organised by ESL but in South Asia the major’s are organised directly by Game Publishers i-e Tencent, Vspn, Krafton etc. These majors are of the same level or infact bigger than ESL hosted tourneys.

Just giving you information so you can have better idea about south asian region. Warm Regards---Abhay Esports Talk To Me 15:30, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Abhayesports, Thank you for reaching out. My only words for you - "check the following links: LINK 1, LINK 2, LINK 3. Pinging Umakant Bhalerao, Nomadicghumakkad - can you guys have a look at this particular AfD - Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Stalwart_Esports_(2nd_nomination). I'm sensing: it's a WP:SOCK/WP:COI (possibility). -Hatchens (talk) 15:58, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

there's a difference between South Asia and South East Asia.

Stalwart Esports Has been participating in India, Pakistan and Mongolia Regions which fall under South Asia and if you go to the links you've shared, you'll find that the countries eligible for those ESL events are Brunei Darussalam, Indonesia, Malaysia, Philippines, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam and they fall under South East Asia. Moreover, These events aren't majors. Go read and check about the one's i've mentioned above. Warm Regards---Abhay Esports Talk To Me 16:33, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

@Abhayesports: Your comment here is, frankly, rude. Please refrain from attacking other editors. — Pbrks (talk) 16:37, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

@Pbrks: my bad bro, just got bit angry because he accused me of something just because i acted in good faith and tried to aware him about the esport scenario in south asia, i've deleted my remarks and shouldn't have made them at first place. Hatchens sincere apologies man. Warm Regards---Abhay Esports Talk To Me 16:45, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Pbrks, it's ok. Thank you for your support. - Hatchens (talk) 16:42, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

New Page Patrol newsletter September 2021

Hello Hatchens,

Please join this discussion - there is increase in the abuse of Wikipedia and its processes by POV pushers, Paid Editors, and by holders of various user rights including Autopatrolled. Even our review systems themselves at AfC and NPR have been infiltrated. The good news is that detection is improving, but the downside is that it creates the need for a huge clean up - which of course adds to backlogs.

Copyright violations are also a serious issue. Most non-regular contributors do not understand why, and most of our Reviewers are not experts on copyright law - and can't be expected to be, but there is excellent, easy-to-follow advice on COPYVIO detection here.

At the time of the last newsletter (#25, December 2020) the backlog was only just over 2,000 articles. New Page Review is an official system. It's the only firewall against the inclusion of new, improper pages.

There are currently 706 New Page Reviewers plus a further 1,080 admins, but as much as nearly 90% of the patrolling is still being done by around only the 20 or so most regular patrollers.

If you are no longer very active on Wikipedia or you no longer wish to be part of the New Page Reviewer user group, please consider asking any admin to remove you from the list. This will enable NPP to have a better overview of its performance and what improvements need to be made to the process or its software.

Various awards are due to be allocated by the end of the year and barnstars are overdue. If you would like to manage this, please let us know. Indeed, if you are interested in coordinating NPR, it does not involve much time and the tasks are described here.

To opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself here. Sent to 827 users. 04:31, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

About Typhoon Chanthu/Kiko (2021)

Hello Hatchens, I just wanted to let you know that per WikiProject tropical cyclone naming guidelines for tropical cyclone articles, we generally do not use both JMA names (in this case, Chanthu) and PAGASA names (Kiko) in the title of the article. Since there is a JMA name, that is the one that takes precedence and therefore is the only one used in the title of the article. See Typhoon Goni and Typhoon Haiyan as examples. Thank you. codingcyclone ^{please ping}/_{my wreckage} 18:35, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Also, I'd like to remind you to be a bit more careful when declining/accepting AFC drafts in the future. [1]. Thanks, Destroyer (Alternate account) 19:21, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Destroyeraa-alt, thank you for reaching out. Sure, I will. - Hatchens (talk) 00:58, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

No worries. Thanks, Destroyer (Alternate account) 14:14, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

CodingCyclone, thank you for reaching out and updating me about the Typhoons and it's naming standards. I used the two names (together in title) because I was not able to accept the draft due to existence of "Typhoon Chanthu (2021)" which was, in turn, getting redirected to "2021 Pacific typhoon season" page. - Hatchens (talk) 00:57, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

I should had had requested a technical move. My bad . - Hatchens (talk) 03:51, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Draft:Bladen County Training School

If this was the first article that you created, you may want to read the guide to writing your first article.
You may want to consider using the Article Wizard to help you create articles.

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. This is a notice that the page you created, Draft:Bladen County Training School, was deleted as a test page under section G2 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Please use the sandbox for any other tests you want to do. Take a look at the welcome page if you would like to learn more about contributing to our encyclopedia.

Please do not recreate the material without addressing these concerns, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If you think this page should not have been deleted for this reason, or you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:44, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Draft:Banner Elk School

If this was the first article that you created, you may want to read the guide to writing your first article.
You may want to consider using the Article Wizard to help you create articles.

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. This is a notice that the page you created, Draft:Banner Elk School, was deleted as a test page under section G2 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Please use the sandbox for any other tests you want to do. Take a look at the welcome page if you would like to learn more about contributing to our encyclopedia.

Please do not recreate the material without addressing these concerns, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If you think this page should not have been deleted for this reason, or you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:49, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Regarding Page/Draft

Hello Hatchens. I recently created an article for Global Esports. You moved the article to draft space here. You said, that there are not much credible sources there to prove the topic's notability. But as I see, there are more than few sources termed as reliable for video games on the page/draft; WP:VG/RS. I request and suggest you to please look into it. Gyan.Know (talk) 01:20, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Dear Gyan.Know, thank you for reaching out. Since you have actively participated in Stalwart Esports AfD, then you can easily anticipate why Global Esports has been put back into the draft. Let's first collaborate to initiate a discussion on Esports' notability and then handle these teams systematically. -Hatchens (talk) 03:01, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for replying kindly Hatchens. But sorry, I still don't get the point. A user at Teahouse said it's probably due to sources likely containing interviews of owners/founders of the team. And also, how shall we collaborate on the said topic? Gyan.Know (talk) 03:28, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Expert needed tags

Hi Hatchens,

You recently placed an expert needed tag on Al-Saffarini which I have removed. We have a consensus at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2021 February 9#Template:Expert needed, that these tag should never be placed without an explanation - this explanation can be a reason given in the template markup, or a link to a talk page section. If you have a very clear idea of what the expert needs to do, please feel free to put the template back, with a reason or talk parameter.

Thanks, Oiyarbepsy (talk) 05:01, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Oiyarbepsy! Amazing discussion at the thread. I'm sorry I missed it in the first place. In fact, I was actually wondering how these tags helps. - Hatchens (talk) 05:13, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

Some Deja Vu

Hey, check the last person who commented at [2]. I sort of analysed them and left a comment about them at an AFD for an article that I had accepted at AFC and they commented on. Reminds me of someone who was blocked very recently. Nomadicghumakkad (talk) 23:50, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Kindly share the complete link by link details to establish the context. If you feel somebody is violating block/ban, thed please do take the necessary/required action. -Hatchens (talk) 02:58, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Hey Hatchens, Check this [3]. Reminds me of German Kitty honestly. Since I pointed them out at the AFD I have been defending [4], they went ahead and even tried to canvas against the subject at talk page of Celestina007 [5]. I see this as a sign of a bad faith editor. Nomadicghumakkad (talk) 16:49, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

German Kitty, hmmm... might be possible. Random AfD participation (in quick succession) - quite a matching editing behavior. Let's monitor it for a while. - Hatchens (talk) 05:17, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

Draft:1993 Copenhagen Open – Singles

I was about to complete the article during the week. I explicitely wrote it in the sumarry. Why did you draft the article? Why? Pablito064 (talk) 00:30, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Peter Haynes (lawyer)

This draft is under review. And I want to accept it but this draft's source are in wrong format. Just for help, shall I accept it? Try to answer fast as possible.Jyoti Roy (talk) 12:37, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Jakir Hossain (politician)

Please check it as possible and mark it stub.Jyoti Roy (talk) 13:47, 12 October 2021 (UTC)

Link is Draft:Jakir Hossain (politician) Jyoti Roy (talk) 13:47, 12 October 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for reaching out. For assessing any politician's page - for approval purpose, just make sure about a verified mention (with credible/independent references) of their winning a state-level or a federal-level election. -Hatchens (talk) 03:59, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Request on 13:27:13, 19 October 2021 for assistance on AfC submission by Anderson1970

Adding to my last message, I made some changes. Do you think the editor can consider this version? Thank you. Anderson1970 (talk) 15:40, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Anderson1970 (talk) 13:27, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Reminder

Hi Hatchens. I am reading Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stalwart Esports (2nd nomination) with an eye to possibly closing it. In that discussion I noted that you accused another editor of duplicity and spread a disagreement from one place (a DRV discussion) to a new place (an AfD discussion). If an editor is indeed being duplicitous that is a serious issue and should be dealt with at an appropriate conduct forum, such as ANI. I know these comments are a month ago but since they are new to me and do not appear to have been commented on at the time I am reminding you now. Barkeep49 (talk) 19:36, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Dear Barkeep49, thank you for reaching out. It has been a long time since we communicated. I hope and wish everything is fine at your end. I'm replying to your message after the AfD discussion has been closed (with Result: KEEP). I nominated Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Stalwart_Esports_(2nd_nomination) and put forward my reasons. But, the way I and others got hounded - we surrendered (especially me). There was a similar situation Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Luca_Soccer_Club_(2nd_nomination), but, there also I have been hounded by the same editor - despite clearly stating my neutral intent. It's the same page where the duplicity in the argument was noticed when compared with Stalwart Esports - but I was not confident to give a fight to it as the second nomination (renomination of Luca Soccer Club) was against the Wiki rules as the page had just passed through an AfD a month ago. I guess; we were close enough to catch up a ring of seasoned Wiki IDs who are involved in passing substandard articles into the main article namespace but somewhere we botched up the whole case, and even if they get deleted - they know how to bring them back via DRV (as it happened in the case of Luca Soccer Club). In the current state, I don't know how we can take this forward to ANI (because of a lack of Wiki skills at my end). Technically speaking, these IDs are far well prepared than us. Nevertheless, I would like to thank DGG, Sandstein, and Usedtobecool for bringing the best points into the discussion that will prepare a novice like me for future AfD nominations and discussions. -Hatchens (talk) 03:36, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Ridge Westfield Elementary School

Hello, Hatchens. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Ridge Westfield Elementary School, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Drafts that have not been edited for six months may be deleted, so if you wish to retain the page, please edit it again or request that it be moved to your userspace.

If the page has already been deleted, you can request it be undeleted so you can continue working on it.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 14:04, 23 October 2021 (UTC)

November 2021 backlog drive

New Page Patrol \| November 2021 Backlog Drive
On November 1, a one-month backlog drive for New Page Patrol will begin. Barnstars will be awarded based on the number of articles patrolled. Barnstars will also be granted for re-reviewing articles previously reviewed by other patrollers during the drive. Redirect patrolling is not part of the drive. Interested in taking part? Sign up here.
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Forget Me Not Children's Hospice

Hello, Hatchens. This is a query regarding my draft article for Forget Me Not Children's Hospice - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Forget_Me_Not_Children%27s_Hospice. I have been recommended to seek help from you.

My article for Forget Me Not Children's Hospice has been declined twice now due to an issue with my citations/sources. I'm wondering why the article doesn't meet the minimum standard for inline citations (I have read the guidance and believe I have done everything properly). Most of all, I have been told my sources aren't reliable enough - despite me using sources from the BBC, Yorkshire Evening Post, Examiner Live, The Mirror, Charity commission, CQC - all of which are established, trusted news outlets and government bodies. I have looked at the Wikipedia page for Martin House Hospice, which is another local children's hospice, and I am confused how that page was approved and not mine? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_House_Hospice - As you can see - Martin House's page uses only 4 sources, one of which is its own website? I have spent a long time finding good sources that prove Forget Me Not is worthy of a Wikipedia article. We are even mentioned on the Wikipedia article for HRH Princess Beatrice (who is the charity's royal patron) - which I would think is proof in itself that Forget Me Not are relevant enough to be approved?

I appreciate your help with this article. Please could you provide a more detailed explanation regarding the problems with my article and how I can fix them? (Where specifically have I used footnotes wrongly? How is my citing pattern incorrect? And which specific sources do you feel aren't reliable enough?) I am keen to get this article approved - so please give me as much specific feedback as you can!

Thank you for your help. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Adamsimpson1998 (talk • contribs) 10:48, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

RattanIndia articles

Hello Hatchens. Thank you for the pings on these two articles. At a quick glance, they both might not meet notability standards due to WP:RUNOFTHEMILL, but I might hold my peace until they get submitted for review. Regards, MrsSnoozyTurtle 07:27, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

MrsSnoozyTurtle: I'm ok with your call. If you need any sort of assistance, then just ping me. -Hatchens (talk) 07:30, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Nikon Z 9

Added couple sources and article introduction. Other camera articles seem to link to non-primary sites for specifications, I've chosen to directly link Nikon's datasheet here since I think that'd be the actual authoritative source for these specs. Do you see something else missing? A picture would of course be nice but none are available yet under an appropriate license. -- Phiarc (talk) 17:15, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

Dear Phiarc, let me assess the draft and ping you back. Image would be an issue but do keep an eye at Wikimedia Commons. -Hatchens (talk) 07:32, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Nima Bank

Hello Hatchens. I have recently made significant changes to this draft and have included new and reliable citations to further clarify the subject. Can I ask for a review of thee article? or for the rejection to be dropped? Can you make me understand the process? Thank you for your time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rooz1370 (talk • contribs) 13:47, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello, again Hatchens. I know you must be busy and I understand that, but I would love your great input on this matter so I could start working on the article again. Your input would mean the world to me thank you. Rooz1370 (talk) Rooz1370 (talk) 09:29, 23 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello Hatchens. I hope you're doing fine. Could you please consider helping me with the article that you rejected? I have made significant changes and I would love your feedback. Thank you. 08:45, 30 October 2021 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rooz1370 (talk • contribs)

New article on "Vin Gupta"

Greatly appreciate your feedback and perspectives on the "Vin Gupta" article. @Nomadicghumakkad, who left the note below for me, noted being fine with you moving ahead accepting it if you'd be willing. I greatly appreciate your review and glad to make any additional changes as you see appropriate. Thank you.

"Hey Caroline grossman23, you already have an ace editor like Hatchens willing to accept it. I don't have any objections on them accepting it. So we are good here. Just want to flag that you might have to take care of WP:NPOV. Nomadicghumakkad (talk) 14:07, 31 October 2021 (UTC)"

Draftifying a stub article

Hi Hatchens. IF you think Institute of Advanced Research should be deleted, please go through AfD. Please don't draftify an article which exists for four years as means for deleting it. --Muhandes (talk) 08:28, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Dear Muhandes, thank you for reaching out. I don't think Institute of Advanced Research should be deleted because it's affiliated to University Grants Commission. It should be enhanced further in the draft phase and then duly moved into main article namespace (either directly or via AfC route). An article sitting as a stub for four years... seriously needs an attention either from the creator or other editors. -Hatchens (talk) 08:38, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

If you think it should be deleted take it to AfD. Draftify is a tool for gestating new articles created by unexperienced editors, not a tool for editors who have been doing this for fourteen years. Also, there is no limitation to the time an article can exist as a stub. --Muhandes (talk) 08:44, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

You seem to be misunderstanding what the draftify tool is for. Please read WP:DRAFT and especially WP:DRAFTOBJECT. --Muhandes (talk) 08:55, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

I think @Muhandes makes a good and valid point here, and that you have likely made an error. The outcome will be a better article (one that you might choose to accept as soon as possible), but I do not think this was the best way to achieve it. Draftification is being seen as 'deletion by the back door' and should only be used on recent escapes into the wild, at least in my view.

Have you considered other mechanisms. AFD is the biggest hammer in the armoury and was almost certainly not appropriate. A merge/requested merge would have borne fruit, though. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 08:58, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Yes, it seems to be you're correct with WP:DRAFTOBJECT. I was referring to this page in particular; Wikipedia:WikiProject Reforming Wikipedia/Draftifying and it is yet proposal. -Hatchens (talk) 09:01, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

@Muhandes and Timtrent: Thanks to both of you. I will be more than happy to move back the article but I'm unable to do it as it says the article already exists. Need help here. Besides that, I have no intention to nominate this article for an AfD. -Hatchens (talk) 09:08, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

The redirect will go soon. That is all that is in the way.

Making mistakes is expected. It is how we handle ourselves afterwards that is the measure of us. Thank you for being open and wise and receiving advice well. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 12:06, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

What Timtrent said. You could go to WP:RM#TM but WP:NORUSH, the CSD will be done and you can move the article back afterwards. --Muhandes (talk) 12:29, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

I moved it myself. Have fun editing. --Muhandes (talk) 14:54, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Muhandes and Timtrent for the guidance and bearing up with my mistake. Now, I have one question: suppose I want to move a page to a draft with a good intention and after moving... I put a "Promising draft" tag and expect it to be developed with time by others and if possible... by me. Does it still violates WP:DRAFTOBJECT? My reason to choose draftification over AfD is to avoid edit wars and following unwanted deletions. If we take IAR's page, personally I feel it should never go to AfD because of WP:NSCHOOL /WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES. At the end it boils down at one simple question - how can I convey my good intention behind my action without violating Wikipedia rules and offending the creator?. -Hatchens (talk) 15:51, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

I suggest good use of the ability to modify the default script edit summary for the draftification script plus use of the relevant talk page of the article that is now a draft.

I find {{promising draft}} to be a distraction. All drafts are promising until they are not. Trash should always be deleted. Not all articles can be rescued. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 16:13, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

@Timtrent: so it means communication has to be crystal clear via edit summary and talk page. And, the onus completely lays with the draft mover to avoid unwanted confrontration. And, ofcourse, respect and humility has to be maintained at all cost. -Hatchens (talk) 16:22, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

The nail has been hit on the head.

Irony is also not yet dead Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 16:33, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

My advice is not to draftify an article if the author is still active, it is rarely well accepted and only leads to trouble. There are many other tools which will be much more well-accepted. --Muhandes (talk) 19:48, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Rattan, Vin and others

Hey, reaching out to clear the air of confusion. I provided an explanation at the talk page but I felt I should reach out to you separately, considering I respect and appreciate your work. I should have done a better job at making it more balanced, I agree to that. But, to your point, from what I read from the IE article - there was not a clear conclusion if it was their mistake or not. I still feel same but have removed that part and expanded more on the controversy including the related protests that happened. I have made many more changes that I hope will satisfy you and I hope you will reassess your vote.

About Vin Gupta, the state of article that I rejected was not following WP:NPOV and hence I removed a lot of material that was promotional. I hope you were not offended or triggered with that which may have resulted you to feel against me. I believe working in collaboration and I hope to work with you on Rattan, Vin and other pages in future. Good day my friend! Nomadicghumakkad (talk) 15:23, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Asia Reassurance Initiative Act

Hello, Hatchens. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Asia Reassurance Initiative Act, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Drafts that have not been edited for six months may be deleted, so if you wish to retain the page, please edit it again or request that it be moved to your userspace.

If the page has already been deleted, you can request it be undeleted so you can continue working on it.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 19:02, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Following up on Vin Gupta

Hello! As mentioned before, I greatly appreciate your edit and feedback on my AfC. Given the additional new edits from the prior reviewer, would you be open to doing a re-review and potentially moving this forward? Thank you for considering. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Caroline grossman23 (talk • contribs) 16:00, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

Dear Caroline grossman23 Thank you for reaching out. I'll pass the reviewing opportunity to some other seasoned editor to maintain an unbiased outcome. Please do wait for sometime. Sooner or later it will get reviewed by someone at AfC. -Hatchens (talk) 00:32, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Beware the hunt for paediaticians

Some years ago in the UK the celebrity Jimmy Savile was revealed to be a serial abuser, a paedophile, and the nation went mad. Outraged citizens went on paedophile vigilante watch, which was perhaps no bad thing.

Some years before that the satirical UK TV show Brass Eye ran a mockumentary, Paedogeddon. People unfamiliar with satire thought it to be in some manner real. But we also had people who thought Till Death Us Do Part was funny because they thought it espoused racism rather than was a biting satire against endemic UK racism.

Caused by one or other of these trigger events a paediatrician had a brick hurled through their window. And, as we know, we cannot let our children out to play in the street because there are paediatricians hiding behind every bush.

I'm being allegorical. Please do not dilute the excellent work you do by becoming distracted with a hunt that may fix on the wrong target. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 08:20, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Dear Timtrent, I got the message and I comprehend it as well. Thank you once again for the wise words and the guidance. -Hatchens (talk) 08:42, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Draftification

Hello, Hatchens,

Please do not move older articles to Draft space. There isn't any firm rule on this but I wouldn't draftify an article older than 6-12 months. It is definitely not appropriate for articles that have existed in main space for years to be moved to Draft space. If you think that an article doesn't meet Wikipedia standards and you don't want to work on the article yourself, considering using WP:PROD or nominate it at WP:AFD. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:41, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Dear Liz, thank you for reaching out. Yes, I've been notified and necessary guidance being given by Paul 012 and Muhandes. I've decided to put one more check (for older articles) before going for WP:AFD (based on the Paul 012's suggestion); engage in a discussion at talk page first with editors and reviewers of the article. Any such decisions would be taken only when everyone comes on the same page. -Hatchens (talk) 01:49, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of True Enlightenment Education Foundation

Hi, Hatchens,

Thanks for your notification regarding the concern of promotion in this article. Although all the contents are the facts regarding the activities of this foundation since 2006, I will review the contents once again to improve the concern about promotion. In addition, the most important part of this foundation, the Tathagatagarbha View which scatters over many Buddhist sutras, is not yet added in the current contents. Tathagatagarbha is the kernal of all Buddhist sutras but unfortunately there is no consolidated and overall interpretation by citing related sutras till now. This foundation explains it with plain language by citing the sutras to educate the public with correct Buddhist knowledge (please refer to the external links). It will benefit all people of the world on the precise understanding of Buddhism. With your understanding, I will contest the deletion and improve the contents of this article. Thank you very much. Thomaswz19 (talk) 10:39, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Thomaswz19 for reaching out. Feel free to expand the draft and submit for a review. I do not review an article or draft more than once. At AfC, there are many seasoned editors who will do assessment and guide you. All the best! -Hatchens (talk) 12:26, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of InterClimate Network

Hi - I was just notified of the speedy deletion tag on InterClimate Network but was unable to contest this before the article was deleted. I disagree that the article was promotional - the tone was factual and all of the claims were well sourced, including references to the topic in UK national outlets such as the Guardian and institutions such as the UK Parliament. I created the article as there are a number of environmental NGOs of similar scale and importance that have entries, and by this standard InterClimate Network should meet the notability criteria for its domain. Could you help me recover the text of the article and/or restore it from deletion so I have time to contest this decision with other editors? Thank you, --KingBrooke (talk) 15:17, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Forget Me Not Children's Hospice

Hi Hatchens, I have been recommended to seek advice from you regarding my draft article for Forget Me Not Children's Hospice - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Forget_Me_Not_Children%27s_Hospice

I have been told my citing pattern is incorrect and that you might be able to help with some specific feedback as to how I can fix this? I am keen to get this article approved so any help you can provide would be really helpful. Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Adamsimpson1998 (talk • contribs) 09:27, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

Review of Gulf of Mexico Research Initiative submission

Hello, Hatchens. I will be submitting a new draft for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Gulf_of_Mexico_Research_Initiative NMDann (talk) 21:42, 15 November 2021 (UTC)NMDann

Deletion: Ofra Cosmetics

Hi! I just noticed my page was deleted after it was approved by the Articles of Creation process. I saw it was nominated, but I didn't see the nomination in time to contribute to the discussion. Please tell me what I can do to get it back up?BaileighD (talk) 23:49, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Nima Bank

Hello to the amazing Hatchens, It's been three months since the rejection of the article and I have made significant changes to it. I would love to know your input on the article and would love to improve it so the article could get back on the main page. If you could please let me know what other changes I could make to the article and how I could move one more step towards getting the page back on. Thank you for your time. Rooz1370 (talk) 07:57, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

ArbCom 2021 Elections voter message

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CFI Financial

Hi Hatchens. Thanks for passing by on CFI Financial. I am Dr. Rami Tarawneh. I am a wikipedian for almost two decades. I attended four wikimania conf. I contribute mostly on Arabic wikipedia. I was an admin, CU, and Bero there, until the will-known Egypt incident. That was when Jimbo tweeted that I was a hero. I am co-founder of Wikimedians of the Levant usergroup, and a Member of the organizing committee of Wikiarabia 2016 Conference. I am also an admin on commons for almost 15 years now. I can assure you that neither me nor my students are associated with CFI Financial. CFI Financial entity was checked by a team in the University. All articles the students work on are initially screened by a team of five professors to make sure that it is eligible and had the Notability required. We have a huge program at the university (NUCT). Actually I started wiki editing programs in three major universities in Jordan; JU, AHU, and NUCT. I know the pressure when handling new articles. I have been here. I totally understand the process, and appreciate the efforts. I know we all have lots to do in the real world, but I would apprentice it if you have another pass on the article; maybe even try showing my students the proper wording and writing techniques if you have the time. This would be a really good learning experience for my students. Sadly they contribute in Arabic, and we later translate to English. Still, if some of them start working in en wiki then maybe we can have you helping them if you have the time, hopefully winning a few new contributes to the English wiki.

Thanks for being a good Wikipedian. These efforts are what makes Wikipedia great.--Tarawneh (talk) 05:16, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Ohhhhh, if ,in the future , you decide to work with our students, you might get yourself a Thank You card from the my university. None for Liz, she is too old for this.

--Tarawneh (talk) 05:28, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Dear Tarawneh, thank you for reaching out and explaining your take on CFI Financial. I am sorry, I haven't checked your cross-wiki credentials at the time of reviewing. Could you ask your student(s) to resubmit the draft or publish the article directly. In the meanwhile, let me connect you with HighKing - when it comes for evaluating company pages in English Wikipedia, then he is one of the best. Also, I would like to thank you for the generous offer for collaborating with your students. Let me know, how would you like me to assist your s?. -Hatchens (talk) 17:17, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Your draft article, Draft:Asia Reassurance Initiative Act

Hello, Hatchens. It has been over six months since you last edited the Articles for Creation submission or Draft page you started, "Asia Reassurance Initiative Act".

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been deleted. If you plan on working on it further and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 18:52, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for your participation in the November 2021 New Pages Patrol drive

		The Reviewer Barnstar
		For reviewing at least 50 articles during the drive.

Thank you for reviewing or re-reviewing 67 articles, which helped contribute to an overall 1276-article reduction in the backlog during the drive. (t · c) buidhe 12:35, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

The pleasure is all mine. Thank you!. - Hatchens (talk) 16:44, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Citizen Lab and the Munk School

This set of AfDs is difficult. Thank you for pinging me. I think that merging is the correct outcome, though you may disagree. The articles have value, but I do not believe any of the three of them have independent notability outside the university Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 07:52, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Timtrent. I was quite skeptical that's why I pinged you and DGG. Now, I'm in total agreement with the "merge" call. -Hatchens (talk) 16:14, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

An AFD query

Hello, Hatchens,

I saw that you created Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Honey Bunny Ka Jholmaal so when I noticed Honey Bunny Ka Jholmaal, I tagged it for CSD G4 speedy deletion. But the reviewing admin declined, saying it was different from the first article so I thought I'd ask if you could look it over and see what you thought since you started the original AFD. Thanks for any help you can supply. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:04, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

Dear Liz, thank you for reaching out. Last year, I nominated this entity because at that time it was failing as per WP:NMEDIA guidelines and article itself was short in content. Now, if we take its current form into consideration; then also it barely qualifies for a standalone/independent article. Most of the core media citations are having mere passable mentions. And, remaining ones are nothing more than press releases. -Hatchens (talk) 09:14, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

Please revisit Draft:Indian National Young Academy of Science

Hello, I edited Draft:Indian National Young Academy of Science in a good manner. I think it could be now on Mainspace because the article is well notable in India. Please revisit the page. Thank you ShifaAayat (talk) 13:44, 23 December 2021 (UTC)

Draft:PharmEasy

I do not ever guarantee to be correct. What I hope to do is to present a holistic and balanced view. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 12:04, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

Dear Timtrent, your wisdom has never failed me and I've never questioned it back either. Your views are unadulterated, unbiased,and just. That's all I want. Thanks to you for being you... always. -Hatchens (talk) 12:17, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

Flattery, my friend, will get you a long way! I thank you for the compliment Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 12:23, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Nomadicghumakkad (talk) 00:53, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of GISLEY (company)

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You may want to consider using the Article Wizard to help you create articles.

A tag has been placed on GISLEY (company) requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section A7 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the article appears to be about a company, corporation or organization that does not credibly indicate how or why the subject is important or significant: that is, why an article about that subject should be included in an encyclopedia. Under the criteria for speedy deletion, such articles may be deleted at any time. Please read more about what is generally accepted as notable.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:01, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello, Hatchens,

You created a redirect with a page move that another editor built an article on top of. So, when it was tagged for deletion, Twinkle saw you as the page creator even though you were not the article creator. Hence, you receiving this message for an article that you didn't write. This seems to happen a fair amount of times when editors move pages to Draft space that the original page creators disagree with and so they change the deletion-tagged redirects back into articles. But it does result in the page movers getting puzzling talk page notices like this one. Thank you for your work! Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:05, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Hey Liz, no problem at all. I faced this issue couple of times in the past. Thank you for such a sweet message. You know what, I faced quite different problem while trying to put an AfD notice at Super Soco. My first nomination was not at all populating as AfD link via NPP tool and eventually I had to launch Second AfD via Twinkle. Kinda bug I guess. -Hatchens (talk) 05:27, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Detoxifying disagreements

I note the difficult discussions you have had with and about another editor. It serves no purpose to name them here, so please do not do so yourself. I hope you will find my thoughts on ways to disagree of some use. The written word is particularly harsh, often leaving no nuances. If you are receptive, please may I suggest:

Never lose the moral high ground by answering every point. You may leave points unanswered with no loss, sometimes with gain
Never feel the need to make an immediate response. Time is better spent considering whether a reply is really needed. Often the editor who says the least carries the day. You will have noticed this in AfD discussions.
Never get drawn into a battle. Present your case and consider very seriously walking away
Never forget WP:BOOMERANG if you choose to make a report to a drama board. That is almost worth restating
Always be the person you would turn to for advice
Recognise that every last one of us is capable of making the most enormous errors, usually with good intent. Always be sure that these errors will bite one's nether regions very hard because others love to use them as weapons
Try very hard to have so much patience that you never fire the first shot. If that shot has been fired at you already, consider wisely whether return of fire is productive.
Never, not ever, post when angry, impatient, or upset.
Never seek to have the last word.

I have often guided editors who have found difficulties with other editors. Please accept this post in the spirit I mean it, one of true aiming for truce, even armed truce. If any of it offends you it is not meant to offend. If I have achieved that then I am at fault and apologise in advance. Thiis is your talk page. You are welcome to delete my words even without this permission. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 17:10, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Timtrent you're my pole star. I admire and adore you from the bottom of my heart. -Hatchens (talk) 17:51, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for the compliment. I'm not sure I deserve it, but I accept it with pleasure.

Please behave as though you have the skills of extreme patience and restraint that I try to display. It gets ever easier to do this. Losing an argument by being patient and restrained is unlikely. The reverse is also true 😂 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 19:53, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Timtrent you have handhold me since the beginning, and you might have noticed that I'm pretty good at getting soaked with your "cryptic wisdom". :-D. When you get into any conversation over Wikipedia (where I'm facing the direct crosswinds), I become overtly very conscious about how I present myself because I don't want to make you feel disgusted about me, and I also don't want you to feel that whatever you have taught me about Wikipedia etiquettes had been lost. But, in the end, we all have emotions, and my job is to channelized (my emotions) for the greater good. - Hatchens (talk) 04:32, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

The major challenge about playing in this pond is that we all have to learn that our emotions fight against us. Editing Wikipedia successfully also means one can hold down a real life stressful job, precisely because one learns how to take emotions out of the equation.

We write dull-but-worthy prose, with citations. We also present ourselves as dull-but-worthy. In real life I write romantic short stories, and things I find to be worthy, but rarely dull! My working life was bullshit and hype for IT companies. I wrote press releases, product blurbs, put on events, all sorts of non dull stuff. Wikipedia allowed me to learn how to do that better. A paradox, if you like. Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 09:10, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

Draft:Rituraj_Kishore_Sinha

Hi, Hatchens,

Thank you for reviewing the article of Rituraj Kishore Sinha.

I've added a few more sources that can be considered reliable sources. I'd request you to review the article again.

Also, I'd love to hear how I can improve this article. Thanks in advance for any suggestions and advice.

NileshPatel560 (talk) 08:00, 6 January 2022 (UTC)

Nabhit Kapur draft rejected

Hi,

I am new here. I have seen that you have rejected one draft with the name of Nabhit Kapur four months ago. I look at the draft and it seems like it was accepted earlier and then declined a few times and then finally you rejected it. I have found more than 50 media sources published for Nabhit Kapur and it seems he is a notable person. I know some of the media sources are branded that look like paid but many of them are reliable sources, not paid which makes this person a notable person as he is a famous psychologist from India who has worked in developing countries.

Aman13130 (talk) 00:49, 10 January 2022 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Adalia Rose (January 15)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Rusalkii was:

This submission's references do not show that the subject qualifies for a Wikipedia article—that is, they do not show significant coverage (not just passing mentions) about the subject in published, reliable, secondary sources that are independent of the subject (see the guidelines on the notability of people). Before any resubmission, additional references meeting these criteria should be added (see technical help and learn about mistakes to avoid when addressing this issue). If no additional references exist, the subject is not suitable for Wikipedia.

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Adalia Rose and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Adalia Rose, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Rusalkii (talk) 03:32, 15 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello, Hatchens! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Rusalkii (talk) 03:32, 15 January 2022 (UTC)

Rajasekhar Mamidanna

Hi Hatchens. I thank you for your time and effort in reviewing this article. However I see that this article has been deleted without giving me a chance to explain. The subject of this article meets Wikipedia guidelines has wider following in India, and hence I thought it would be of relevant. Kindly share your thoughts to avoid such incidents in future. Thanks. Gardenkur (talk) 02:43, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Sure, I'll keep that in mind. -Hatchens (talk) 07:45, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

There are two Dharasu village in Uttarakhand

Dear Sir/madam, There are two villages of the same name Dharashu in Uttarakhand. One is in Pauri district and the other is in Uttarkashi district. Please check the references then you will know that both dharsu pages are correct. I have a humble request to you sir/madam, please make this page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Dharasu_Pauri_Garhwal) live. --RJ Raawat (talk) 16:03, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Let me ping someone from India, to assist you. Pinging TheAafi. Dear Aafi, I guess... I made a mistake in assessing this draft. Could you help? -Hatchens (talk) 16:15, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Thank you so much --RJ Raawat (talk) 21:36, 21 January 2022 (UTC)