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Misinformation in this Article

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I see that this article has just been copied from the "About" page on the current TorilMUD. Some things need to be corrected and most can be verified by reading the credits on the same web site:

1. "Following leadership roles on Copper 2 MUD from 1990-1992, Kris and some friends created Black Knights MUD" This is *very* wrong. Kris and "his friends" did not create Black Knights Realm. Black Knight's Realm (based on Copper II code) was owned by Van Vangor (Zig) and was run on the server at UCF. The coders were Barlows and Myrrh. Kris (Miax) became an area writer on BK shortly before it was taken down by Zig. When BK folded, Zig gave Kris some zones to use in his own MUD. Kris and his friends were not involved with the creation of BK at all. I was one of the Gods (Pez) on BK at the time that Miax started writing for the MUD.

2. SojournMUD was created by Miax (Kris Kortright), Gond (John Bashaw) and Cython (Tim Devlin). Since these names are, or, at least WERE, in the MUD credits, they should be replicated here as well.

Credits on TorilMUD: http://www.torilmud.org/maininfocredits.htm

Roan Art 01:34, 18 May 2007 (UTC) (Eileen Kortright [Mystra])[reply]

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In addition above items, the text claims that the layout of the city of Waterdeep in Sojourn/Toril was used as the basis for the city of Waterdeep in EverQuest. Except that there is no such city in EverQuest. I presume that they mean that it was the basis for the city of Freeport in EverQuest, as they do share some characteristics and locations. Is this correct? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zouve (talk • contribs) 19:54, 12 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

-- Response Re: City layout, Waterdeep

Yes, Waterdeep was used as a model for the first city in EverQuest. Kris thinks it may have been Freeport, but doesn't remember. Whichever city came first, that would be it. Also copied over from Sojourn were many aspects of the Crimson Sigil guild -- Brad McQuaid was a member -- as well as the Petition Channel and a *lot* of items and MOBs.

Roan Art (talk) 07:21, 7 March 2008 (UTC) (Eileen Kortright [Mystra])[reply]

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I was just reading the entry for Sojourn MUD and wow, it is ever wrong: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sojourn_%28online_game%29 I made some changes, but undid it. Could you guys PLEASE fix this? Sojourn was NEVER backed by TSR and I have no idea where the author of "Playing MUDs on the Internet" got that from. I'm assuming that it should have read "TSR-based" and not "TSR-backed". Just because the book is published does not make it right. In fact, we spent most of our time worrying about whether TSR was gonna pull a hissy-fit and try to shut us down! Again, the entry says that developers from Black Knights Realm created Sojourn and they did not. History is here, on this Toril page.

Btw, you guys have done a great job with this page Roan Art (talk) 18:44, 13 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The problem with Wikipedia is that solid primary and secondary sources are required. So unless you have reliable sources there's no real point in editing as you'll see that either 1) someone will change things at will 2) the article gets deleted for lacking sources. --Scandum (talk) 03:11, 14 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
My primary sources are ME, Eileen Kortright, and my husband, Kris Kortright. Since we are the people who created the MUD and his name is even in the project box, I think that's as primary as you can get, don't you? The book is wrong and this page and the Sojourn page do not jive with each other. Roan Art (talk) 01:19, 19 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
In that case the best course of action would be to write a good article about the game under your real name that covers most of the encyclopedic information, and post it somewhere where a) It's going to stay and b) it's not going to be altered. The MUD section in Google groups works fairly well for this purpose. http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.mud.diku/topics?lnk You'd also want to do some fact checking by reading up on old Usenet posts (also available on google groups) and other sources, as a primary source quickly loses credibility if it gets dates and names wrong. Some factual information about Sequent would be interesting as well, as there's currently little proof the Sequent codebase actually existed.
There's a great deal of MUD related articles that have benefited from the people originally involved writing articles about the topic. --Scandum (talk) 02:51, 19 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I've done some reworking of Sojourn (online game) around the disputed bits. Hopefully it's better now. —chaos5023 (talk) 12:39, 19 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, Chaos! Very nicely edited and now it jives with TorilMUD. How come no one has written anything for Duris? Scandum, I'm not into MUDs anymore and am not interested in writing articles on them. Sorry. I just want to see facts and not myths ;) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Roan Art (talk • contribs) 00:12, 20 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Re Duris: For my part, because I only have one source for it (Yahoo! Wild Web Rides). I don't usually bother creating an article unless I think I have a chance defending it at AfD, and two independent reliable sources is what it takes to make me feel reasonably confident. —chaos5023 (talk) 00:26, 20 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Screenshot on the left?

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Hey, IPs, what's up with the screenshot-on-the-left thing? I don't get at all why you would want that; to my eye it makes the article look cramped and has the reader darting all over the place to follow the prose. Why do you see it as an improvement? —chaos5023 (talk) 19:51, 3 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Well, speaking for myself at least, on my browser you currently have the infobox, and below that the screenshot, and these dominate the right hand side of the screen. Then, you actually have to scroll down to read the first paragraph, because the placement of the screenshot forces the text down so far. There is a large field of whitespace under the "Game characterstics" heading. I'm not sure if it looks differently on your browser, or if you actually prefer it that way. 204.153.84.10 (talk) 22:07, 3 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, wow. Yeah, that's horrible. It definitely doesn't do any of that to me. What browser and screen resolution / window size are you using? —chaos5023 (talk) 22:10, 3 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I did some testing and was able to replicate the issue in IE. Running IE8, it shows up in IE8 Compatibility Mode and IE7 mode, but not in IE8 Standards Mode. So I guess it's one of those wacky IE things. I'm not clear on to what extent browser issues should be humored in article design on WP; I'll see if I can turn up some consensus on that. —chaos5023 (talk) 15:15, 4 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry about not responding - I got busy and then forgot. I checked the article on my computer at home, and at the local library, and the same thing there, all on IE. 204.153.84.10 (talk) 20:48, 4 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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