Talk:Tile-matching video game
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Questionable Example
[edit]A screenshot of Tetris is provided as an example in the article, but is Tetris really a "tile-matching" game? It has tiles, yes, but the gameplay doesn't really involve matching them. The term "tile-matching" implies that there are several different types of tiles, and that the player must somehow group tiles of the same type to achieve some objective. In Tetris, though, all the tiles are of exactly the same type, at least from a functional point of view. The caption of the screenshot says that the "matching criterion" is that a complete line be filled. While I agree that that's a criterion, exactly what is being matched? Dougdigdag (talk) 02:11, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
- I was originally (and still am) doubtful wether or not Tetris really fits the common description of a tile-matching game (being more the classical example of a falling-block puzzle with no tile-matching elements). In general, tile-matching games have, as the name implies, tiles of different types that must be matched according to the tiles' characteristics, which is not the case in Tetris (where every tile is equivalent to every other tile). The reason I've not raised this issue before is because the source describes it as such, and Wikipedia goes for verifiability -- what I think is my OR, so to speak. Salvidrim! 02:15, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
- I completely agree. I think describing Tetris as a tile-matching game is utterly incorrect and unsourced OR. Notably, the cited reference does NOT classify Tetris as a tile-matching game; it instead notes that Tetris influenced the genre, but does not call it part of the genre, especially when it specifically calls out the fact that Tetris does not have tile matching. The article here is completely wrong and utterly misrepresents its main source. It's also largely based on sources by the same author (meaning it's essentially over-reliant on a single source), making the incorrect presentation of it completely inappropriate. The article needs to be reworked. Immediately. oknazevad (talk) 20:08, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
- That Tetris is a tile-matching game is supported by Juul, an expert in this area. Here, the rule for tile matching is "one completed line across the board" to make the tiles disappear. [1]. It may not be the first "tile-matching" game that comes to mind compared to, eg Candy Crush, but it clearly has a place in this article. I just wouldn't use a picture of it for this. --Masem (t) 20:57, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
- No, that's not what Juul says. He notes right in figure 3 of that source that there's no tile matching in Tetris, and in his breakdown shortly thereafter he notes that making lines is needed to clear, specifically contrasting that with matching tiles as in Chain Shot. In other words, he specifically contrasts the mechanics of Tetris with mechanics that carry into later tile-matching games, thereby clearly setting Tetris apart from the genre. To call it a tile-matching game based on Juul is to misrepresent what Juul actually wrote. oknazevad (talk) 23:34, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
- Juul's definition of a matching tile game is (per that paper) "Video games where the player manipulates tiles in order to make them disappear according to a matching criterion." And as Juul explains later, the criterion in Tetris is matching a complete horizontal line, where as in Bejeweled/Candy Crush and most other games that are considered tile matching, the criterion is connecting 3 of the same tile type in a line. I cannot see how we cannot take Tetris as a tile matching game based on Juul's reports. --Masem (t) 03:53, 28 November 2021 (UTC)
- Well, there's the fact that he explicitly contrasts it with other games right in the paper, clearly establishing Tetris as a separate thing from tile-matching games. His mention of Tetris's clearing criteria is done specifically to show how it is not the same as the sort of tile-matching game that the paper examines, ones where the manipulation requires swapping items already on the play field, not adding items to the play field. Plus Tetris doesn't have tiles, it has blocks (tetronimos). Tetris is discussed in the paper not as an example of the genre, which is more specific as made clear by the background material earlier in the paper, but as a historical influence on the development of the modern genre, specifically in terms of time limits or level structures. oknazevad (talk) 11:41, 28 November 2021 (UTC)
- I fully disagree with that approach in the paper; Tetris is fully considered a tile-matching game based on the text and Fig 3 (the diagram of tile-matching game influences) Juul's definition takes out anything about having types of tiles and instead leaves it to being the rule to be defined to remove tiles. I'd also add that if you do Google Scholar searching (typically around artificial intelligence and games), Tetris is commonly defined there as a tile-matching game too. (as well as "puzzle game" too). Juul points out that Chain Shot and Tetris have very different play styles but which thus combined created the whole hierarchy of tile-matching games today. --Masem (t) 03:04, 29 November 2021 (UTC)
- Well, there's the fact that he explicitly contrasts it with other games right in the paper, clearly establishing Tetris as a separate thing from tile-matching games. His mention of Tetris's clearing criteria is done specifically to show how it is not the same as the sort of tile-matching game that the paper examines, ones where the manipulation requires swapping items already on the play field, not adding items to the play field. Plus Tetris doesn't have tiles, it has blocks (tetronimos). Tetris is discussed in the paper not as an example of the genre, which is more specific as made clear by the background material earlier in the paper, but as a historical influence on the development of the modern genre, specifically in terms of time limits or level structures. oknazevad (talk) 11:41, 28 November 2021 (UTC)
- Juul's definition of a matching tile game is (per that paper) "Video games where the player manipulates tiles in order to make them disappear according to a matching criterion." And as Juul explains later, the criterion in Tetris is matching a complete horizontal line, where as in Bejeweled/Candy Crush and most other games that are considered tile matching, the criterion is connecting 3 of the same tile type in a line. I cannot see how we cannot take Tetris as a tile matching game based on Juul's reports. --Masem (t) 03:53, 28 November 2021 (UTC)
- No, that's not what Juul says. He notes right in figure 3 of that source that there's no tile matching in Tetris, and in his breakdown shortly thereafter he notes that making lines is needed to clear, specifically contrasting that with matching tiles as in Chain Shot. In other words, he specifically contrasts the mechanics of Tetris with mechanics that carry into later tile-matching games, thereby clearly setting Tetris apart from the genre. To call it a tile-matching game based on Juul is to misrepresent what Juul actually wrote. oknazevad (talk) 23:34, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
- That Tetris is a tile-matching game is supported by Juul, an expert in this area. Here, the rule for tile matching is "one completed line across the board" to make the tiles disappear. [1]. It may not be the first "tile-matching" game that comes to mind compared to, eg Candy Crush, but it clearly has a place in this article. I just wouldn't use a picture of it for this. --Masem (t) 20:57, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
- I completely agree. I think describing Tetris as a tile-matching game is utterly incorrect and unsourced OR. Notably, the cited reference does NOT classify Tetris as a tile-matching game; it instead notes that Tetris influenced the genre, but does not call it part of the genre, especially when it specifically calls out the fact that Tetris does not have tile matching. The article here is completely wrong and utterly misrepresents its main source. It's also largely based on sources by the same author (meaning it's essentially over-reliant on a single source), making the incorrect presentation of it completely inappropriate. The article needs to be reworked. Immediately. oknazevad (talk) 20:08, 27 November 2021 (UTC)
Magic Jewelry???
[edit]This is an unlicensed clone of the game Columns, and that is probably the game that should be listed there instead. 74.211.59.182 (talk) 18:17, 31 July 2014 (UTC)
- This appears to have been sorted out. Equinox ◑ 20:58, 23 July 2016 (UTC)
HTML comment in first paragraph
[edit]Nobody has bothered to do anything related to the HTML comment in the first paragraph. Can anyone add anything related to it?? (Try not to simply remove it.) Georgia guy (talk) 21:13, 26 August 2016 (UTC)