Talk:Tigray Region

Merger proposal

I propose that Tigray Province be merged into Tigray Region. I think that the content in the Tigray Province article can easily be explained in the context of Tigray Region. Recent expansion of Tigray Region includes the history of Tigray Province and removes the wikilink to Tigray Province. The Region article is of a reasonable size that the merging will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned. It seems like these are very similar topics, but I am not a subject matter expert so maybe there is a reason to have separate articles. Groceryheist (talk) 02:02, 14 July 2017 (UTC)

I am familiar with most areas of central and northern Ethiopia. I agree that the two should be merged, with the province's history being explained in the region article's history section. I do understand the reasoning why there are two because the provinces existed until relatively recently (1996) so all of the other provinces have their own Wikipedia articles. The current regions are completely different than the provinces (even the names are different). The only province that has the same name as the current region is Tigray (i.e. there was no Amhara province but there were Gojjam, Wellega, and Wollo provinces that were highly populated with Amharas thus they became the Amhara region). Regardless, I believe that the province article should be merged, precisely because of the confusion that exists due to the shared names of Tigray region and Tigray province. Turtlewong (talk)17:12, 14 July 2017 (UTC)

How big is Tigray?

Hi. I noticed that there have been some edits changing the listed area of Tigray. I tried to look up the correct value and have not been able to find a definitive answer. Some of the values I have found include:

1. 84,722 km² This is the value KiBe123 gave in an edit today. It also matches the value currently given at Regions of Ethiopia. In both cases, the value has a citation to the "2011 National Statistics."
2. 53,638 km² The original value, as restored by Turtlewong, still cited to the same 2011 report in the Infobox, but cited to an "investment Guide" when given in the main text. The Investment Guide reference doesn't have a URL, but may be this, which does give that value for the area: [1].
3. 41,409.95 km² This is the actual value given in the 2011 National Statistics link: [2].
4. 85,366.53 km² This is what you get when you sum the areas of the zones of Tigray as given at the above link.
5. Approximately 80,000 km² This is according to this official Ethiopian government website: [3].
6. 50,078.64 km² This is the value given at what appears to be the 2006 equivalent of the 2011 report at: [4].

Looking at the region on a map, it seems to be about 360 km long (east to west), and an average of around 150 km wide (north to south), which would correspond with the values around 50,000 km². Further, on a map Tigray seems to be smaller than the adjacent Afar Region, which has a listed area of 72,053 km². I note that prior to 1995 there was a Tigray Province, which doesn't cover the same area as Tigray Region, and looks somewhat bigger. I suspect that that is where the values around 80,000 km² come from, and that the current area is closer to 50,000 km². However, I can't find a source for a definitive answer. Can anybody find one? Tdslk (talk) 00:18, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

There is no accurate information about the area of the regions in Ethiopia. The changes were made based on the Regions of Ethiopia. However, using the google map area calculator (https://www.mapdevelopers.com/area_finder.php), the area of Tigray region is roughly 53,638 km². — Preceding unsigned comment added by KiBe123 (talk • contribs) 07:18, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Thanks, KiBe123. I say we should go with that as the correct value unless someone can make a more convincing argument for another number. Tdslk (talk) 18:26, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Readdressing this question. We have three sources mentioned above: (a) 2006 national statistics report (b) 2011 national statistics report (c) Tigray investment guide. In addition the Google Maps area calculator can be used to provide support for figures. And there are various maps one can use to make visual comparisons. The link above to the government website is now dead.

1. 2006 national statistics report says 50,078.64 km². The sum of the zones matches this.
2. 2011 national statistics report says 41,409.95 km². But the sum of the zone figures it gives is 85,366.53 km², so this report is wildly inconsistent internally, and therefore unreliable.
3. Tigray investment guide (p. 5) says 53,638 km². However the borders in the map on page 4 are not the ones that are now accepted by Ethiopia. The map includes part of Eritrea, e.g. west of Badme, that Ethiopia was still claiming up till 2018. This then points to a figure smaller than 53,638, when using the since accepted border.
4. Using Google Maps area calculator I came up with an area of approx 50,000. This supports the 2006 report.
5. I used Google Maps calculator to include the area that Ethiopia was claiming from Eritrea in File:Eritrean–Ethiopian_War_Map_1998.png and came up with approx 53,000. Although that map differs somewhat from the one in the investment guide as regards the claimed Eritrean territory west of Badme, the Google calculation and the investment guide are consistent.

My conclusion is that there is no reason to doubt the figure of 50,078.64 km² from the 2006 report. Nurg (talk) 11:02, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Civil War

Financial Times, Ethiopian fighting breaks out after federal troops sent to quell rebellion (04 Nov 2020):

Fighting has begun in Ethiopia’s northern region of Tigray after prime minister Abiy Ahmed sent federal troops to quell a rebellion in a move that threatens to bring Africa’s second most populous country to the brink of civil war. According to the prime minister’s office military operations began in Tigray on Wednesday afternoon. A western diplomat in Addis Ababa also said that “people have been killed” but that the death toll is “uncertain”.

JDAWiseman (talk) 18:32, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

Add pronunciation?

Greetings and felicitations. I've been listening to the news, and heard both "TĒ-grā" (ˈtiː-greɪ) and "TĒ-grī" (ˈtiː-graɪ). Since it is currently missing, IMHO it would be a good idea to add whichever is the correct pronunciation to the article. —DocWatson42 (talk) 14:05, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Done, by Thiqq on 16:20 (ET), 12 March 2021‎. Thanks again. ^_^ —DocWatson42 (talk) 05:31, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Expert editors with local knowledge are really welcome !

Without visual clues, such as smiles, and tone of voice and a warm handshake, it can often seem that the English Wikipedia is a frosty place for those "handicapped" by their local know-how and professional knowledge.

The essay at Wikipedia:Expert editors highlights some of the pitfalls around WP:SELFCITEs and emphasises fundamental Wikipedia policies of no original research and verifiability in the context of utitilising reliable sources.

User:Jnyssen might want to consider identifying themselves on their user page and list any credentials and experience they wish to publicly divulge as it will help fellow Wikipedians who seek advice and expertise. (Experts should be aware there is no personal advantage and considerable risk in divulging one's real identity and expertise in this way. Please see WP:REALNAME, and think carefully before you do this.)

Some editors can get very bitchy and pernickety about conflicts of interest that may arise if editing articles which concern an expert's own research, writings, discoveries, or the article about themself.

Wikipedia's policy about citing yourself does allow an editor to include information from their own publications in Wikipedia articles and to cite them. However, many think this may only be done when the editors are sure that the Wikipedia article maintains a neutral point of view and their material has already been published in a reliable source by a third party. If the neutrality or reliability are questioned, it is Wikipedia's consensus, rather than the expert editor, that decides what happens. When in doubt, it's good practice for editors who may have a conflict of interest to disclose it on the relevant article's talk page and to suggest changes here rather than in the article. Transparency is essential to the workings of Wikipedia.

You, User:Jnyssen, (and others) may also want to add your names to Wikipedia:WikiProject Ethiopia/Members

PS: Thanks for the new "woreda re-organisation" map, Jan - what a pity that Axum wasn't labelled... BushelCandle (talk) 23:50, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

I am well aware that my texts can be reworked in Wikipedia. No matter. With regard to the map, there is a better map in our Tigray Atlas. We intend to formally publish it in a journal, so I cannot place it on Wikipedia.Jnyssen (talk) 03:50, 13 April 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the quick response, Jan. Unless you contradict me, I will take it that you, Jnyssen, have now

a) confirmed that you are Jan Nyssen in real life

b) claimed copyright in the Tigray atlas - so there is no need for editors to spend time editing your own words to avoid perceived copyright infringements.

I take your point about reserving rights to future publication(s) but I would strongly suggest that you read up on conflict of interest declarations on your own user page (and possibly other relevant pages in article space).

Needs admin's attention

I noticed many vandalism for this article. It really needs admin's attention. If necessary it should be semi protected. - Yitbe ^A-21 09:44, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

@Yitbe: Please make your request at WP:RFPP. ‑‑ElHef (Meep?) 14:12, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

References

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Afar Region which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 23:46, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Leader

I keep noticing the interim government, and the previously undisputed government being switched around as leader on the infobox. Can we not just keep both of them on as WIKI IS A NON-BAIS SOURCE. sofonias2000100

@Sofonias2000100: I 100% agree. Both claim to be the true leader of the Tigray Region and the fact that the TPLF dude one an election that wasn't recognized by the central government shouldn't change that fact nor should the TDF controlling much of Tigray change that fact ethier. Wowzers122 (talk) 10:34, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

History section

This article has a fairly detailed history section, which reaches back to antiquity; however, there is also an article on the historical Tigray Province. I think it would make more sense to have all of the pre-1995 history of this region in that article, rather than this one. -- llywrch (talk) 19:37, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Getting whiplash from all the reverting

Would someone please impose some sanctions or put protection on this page? I'm getting whiplash trying to decipher the diffs from just the last 24 hours! [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10] Please decide whether it's the Regional State of Tigray or the National Regional State of Tigray, and whether it's 6M, 7M or 10M people. This isn't rocket science, people! Platonk (talk) 06:58, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Also the area, towns and borders are part of these modifications, because editors try to implement claims by Amhara Region to annex Western Tigray and parts of Southern Tigray avant la lettre on Wikipedia.Rastakwere (talk) 07:30, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Official name of Tigray Region in English

Is there an official name for Tigray Region in English?

• I got Tigray Regional State from the Ethiopia government website.
• Ue3lman got Tigray National Regional State from Embassy of Ethiopia in Washington DC.
• Previously the article showed National Regional State of Tigray.

Platonk (talk) 08:43, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

It was originally the Tigray National Regional State. I changed it to the National Regional State of Tigray a while back since the Tigray government statements calls it that. There's no concrete answer to it since it's widely known as different names. If you're going by the constitution it's the State of Tigray as all the other regions are. As Tsegaye Regassa points out "the states are called "States" although the term "Regional State" is also used as an infrequent variant. In practice, most political and legal actors frequent referring to them as "Regions". The latter term is understandably carried over from the name used to refer to the sub-national units during the Transitional Period (from 1991-1995)."
I would say to just keep it how it is now. Ue3lman (talk) 23:38, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

Agreed! I'm bowing out of this one and just letting it be. Platonk (talk) 02:00, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

Tigray war and genocide

Tigrayan people who live in Addis Ababa and another regions are getting in jail because of racist Ethiopian and Eritrean government. 196.189.25.106 (talk) 20:24, 9 December 2021 (UTC)

Axum / Aksum

The article seems to jump around in terms of which spelling to use. If there is a reason for one over the other for particular uses, it should be given; otherwise, one spelling should be adopted (possibly with a note that there is an alternative spelling). Kdammers (talk) 14:21, 11 December 2022 (UTC)

"Tigray Genocide" in lede

Has this been discussed? This doesn't seem like a widely-used term, though I'm not familiar with the topic at hand. Skarmory (talk • contribs) 02:17, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:Tigray#Requested move 30 September 2023

An editor has requested that Tigray be moved to Tigray (disambiguation), which may be of interest to this WikiProject. You are invited to participate in the move discussion. XTheBedrockX (talk) 17:38, 30 September 2023 (UTC)

Deletion proposal for Tig (Tigrinya language)

I have proposed the deletion of the page Tig (Tigrinya language). This page aims to clarify the distinctions between Tigrinya, Tigre, Tigrai, & numerous derived terms. You can find the deletion discussion page here: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tig (Tigrinya language). Very briefly, I do not oppose some clarification page as such, but rather oppose the invented term tig. I strongly encourage those who are following this page & who have an opinion on the matter to vote or comment at the deletion discussion—whether or not they agree with me. Pathawi (talk) 17:27, 2 October 2023 (UTC)