Talk:List of WWE personnel/Archive 22

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Archive 23

Shane McMahon

Just so there's no misunderstandings, I moved Shane to the main roster because since he is now suspended, he is no longer an authority figure...right now his role is as a guy feuding with Kevin Owens, and getting suspended due to flipping his lid and attacking KO.

Vjmlhds (talk) 02:46, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

Honestly shouldn't he be moved to inactive? He was "suspended indefinitely" nothing was said that he was moved to the roster. So for all we know he's not going to be on the show for awhile and nothing has been said that there is definitely a match yet. So I guess I'm not really sure how he should be listed. Chris "WarMachineWildThing" ^{Talk to me} 02:51, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

I did mention in the notes section that he is inactive due to suspension. At the end of the day, he has been stripped of his authority duties, and is involved in a feud, so moving him to the wrestler roster (for now) makes the most sense - once the KO feud runs it's course and Shane is reinstated as an authority figure, he can always go back to other personnel. Vjmlhds (talk) 15:17, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

Come on, guys. Aren't we splitting hairs a little bit here? In my opinion -- and I am stating this as my opinion -- he should be left in the authority figure role. It drives me nuts every time someone gets moved onto the active roster for 1-2 matches per year. That's why we have the "Occasional wrestler" description. We can certainly put kayfabe suspended. Is he not still the commish? Kjscotte34 (talk) 15:40, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

Well, according to WWE's preview for next week's SD, Shane was suspended as SD commish, meaning he has no authoritarian power right now. He was removed from his post of power. Like I said once the feud ends, everything can be reset, but for now, Shane isn't in a position of authority...right now, he's just a dude feuding with Kevin Owens. Vjmlhds (talk) 17:26, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

I'm I the only person that thinks this is a little too in-universe to change week-to-week? The fact that it's already planned to switch it back is exactly why it's probably not best to move it in the first place. We're probably best just leaving him in the same place with a note.oknazevad (User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 18:02, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

I'll see that argument and raise you that Wikipedia deals in the here and now, and right now, Shane isn't an authority figure - just a guy feuding with KO because KO ran his yap about his family, and Shane let his temper get the best of him, beat up KO, and got suspended from his position of authority. Wiki always makes changes as we go along to reflect the current reality (i.e. title changes and roster moves). Wrestlers will inevitably win and lose tiles, and bounce from brand to brand, but for the purposes of Wiki, we deal with what is going on in the present time, and in the present, Shane has been stripped of his authority figure powers, and is involved in a feud, thus elevating him from "other personnel" Vjmlhds (talk) 23:30, 6 September 2017 (UTC)

"Suspended" doesn't mean "Fired." Technically, he is still the commissioner. At least until next week's visit from Vince. Kjscotte34 (talk) 16:10, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

Also, I'm not sure who left the comment above your last one. Wasn't me, someone forgot to sign. Kjscotte34 (talk) 16:11, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

This is true as well. That's what the note would cover. (The above comment was me. Accidentally signed with five tildes, which leaves a date stamp but not a signature. I fixed it.) oknazevad (talk) 16:17, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

Just to throw my two cents in... as has been said, "suspended" does not mean fired. When you get suspended from work, you still have your job, even though you're not actually able to do it at the time being. So even though Shane wouldn't have any power at the minute, he would still - at least on paper - have the title of "Commissioner" so would still belong in the Other On Air Figures section. IanPCP (talk) 11:21, 9 September 2017 (UTC)

Consensus says keep in "other personnel", so he stays in "other personnel". A year ago, I'd be more apt to battle...these days, not that big of a deal. Vjmlhds (talk) 15:20, 9 September 2017 (UTC)

Shayna Baszler

Signed with WWE or not? Triple H posted this on Twitter right before the final:

The calm before the storm... Win, lose, or draw, it is my pleasure to welcome @KairiSaneWWE and @QoSBaszler to @WWE. #MaeYoungClassic

Thoughts? IanPCP (talk) 12:49, 17 September 2017 (UTC)

Alvin Abitz

He is no longer with WWE Adam1986666 (talk) 06:44, 29 August 2017 (UTC)

Have you got a source? IanPCP (talk) 12:48, 29 August 2017 (UTC)

Not as such, but if you go on his Twitter page, he is talking about WWE up until Wrestlemania, then he stops and posts about how he needs a job

On his facebook page he confirmed that he asked for release shortly after wrestlemania https://www.facebook.com/TheRabbitzShow/posts/10209784065263722 184.15.246.207 (talk) 00:09, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Danny Burch

Not anywhere on this page? He works NXT house shows in Florida and has been featured on NXT TV in a storyline with Oney Lorcan. At least hoping to get him to unassigned under "appears in NXT" like the other UK guys

I don't believe he's actually signed to any kind of deal (other than per appearance) but I'm happy to be proven wrong IanPCP (talk) 21:09, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Dunne & Bate - WWE.com says NXT

Pete Dunne and Tyler Bate are now listed under the WWE NXT filter at http://wwe.com/superstars and no longer appear on the main - i.e. Raw, Smackdown, 205 - Superstars page. Furthermore, their profiles both now have the NXT logo on them. Do we think it's worth moving these two from Unassigned to NXT? IanPCP (talk) 00:26, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

I've made this change myself. Any objections? IanPCP (talk) 09:52, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 October 2017

Lince Dorado's Unknown name to be changed with Jose Cordero 93.86.36.16 (talk) 21:56, 10 October 2017 (UTC)

•  Not done Will not be done without a reliable source. oknazevad (talk) 22:58, 10 October 2017 (UTC)

I've found a decent source - http://espndeportes.espn.com/luchalibre/nota/_/id/3027534/lince-dorado-abraza-su-nuevo-reto-en-los-cruceros-en-wwe - I'll make this change unless it's already been done IanPCP (talk) 23:57, 11 October 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 October 2017

Change all mentions of Smackdown from July 2016 to current to Smackdown Live. Update Chris Jericho: "Inactive, on tour with Fozzy". Remove Primo and Epico Colon: they were released. Update photos of Jinder Mahal, Baron Corbin and The Usos to more recent pictures. 69.115.91.42 (talk) 06:26, 21 October 2017 (UTC)

Not done: 1. SmackDown Live is the show, not the brand.

2. Please provide reliable sources. 3. I don't see what's wrong with the current ones. It's not like they look much different. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:16, 21 October 2017 (UTC)

Status of this article

I came back to look at this article since I haven't edited it in a while, and this article is, to put it lightly, a clusterfuck of information. If you are not familiar with WWE, this article is a disaster to look at. This article has several problems, namely:

• The actual roster of wrestlers is divided, and divided repetitively. There should be two rosters, the main roster and the NXT roster. We have sortable wikitables and don't use them. The information needs to properly combine the main roster and state a brand next to the wrestler, so that the size of the article is reduced and the same information is present. Sortable wikitables were invented so that we didn't have to use a million headings. That alone would reduce the article size a bit.
• The NXT roster is divided between wrestlers on "television" and those who wrestle at live events. This would be fine if it was accurate. I've seen more action from Cezar Bononi and Fabian Aichner on television than I have from Buddy Murphy and Wesley Blake, so do these sections actually separate anything meaningful? It does separate who has a biography on the WWE website, but the premise of the list is not that, it's to list the roster.
• Has anyone actually looked at the table of contents and actually found what they were looking for other than being able to identify 'Raw', 'SmackDown' and 'NXT'? Because let me tell you, with thirty different subcategories of listings someone could be under, a new editor would be hard pressed to find who they were looking for and mistakenly list someone like Triple H in the article twice.
• The article has zero organization. There's two sections called 'Backstage personnel' with no difference other than one being for a specific show, which frankly doesn't matter. One section is called 'Off-screen personnel', which is fine, but there's a lot of different sections of people and every sub-heading that isn't under 'Off-screen personnel' is presumed to be on-screen at that point (and that is inaccurate). The broadcast team section and referees section is perfectly fine looking as it combines every roster main and NXT and fits it in one table neatly. But directly after the sections discussing the commentators and refs, you have the 'NXT' section, which then lists the wrestlers. That is poor organization at best. You have to cater to the reader, they care significantly less about learning about who the referees are before who is on the roster.

This article needs a major facelift so that the information is presentable, because as it stands I can't even navigate it to what I'm looking for without using a keyword search on my browser. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 23:49, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

I've posted a draft at User:Moe Epsilon/sandbox of what the article should ideally be organized like. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 02:21, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

Separate the Raw and SD rosters (just to make it easier to see who is on what brand, because when you have 60 some guys, it can kinda blend together), and keep the rest of it just as you have it, and that works. Vjmlhds (talk) 04:25, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

I can live with that suggestion, so I've went ahead and done it. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 04:44, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

Looks good, Moe. What do you think about listing the McMahons in their own section, since they run the whole pop stand and do a little bit of everything? Vjmlhds (talk) 17:06, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

I would like that, but with just Vince and Triple H in the corporate section it wouldn't be much difference. I wouldn't object to it. It would just be better if Stephanie and Shane weren't on-screen characters right now. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 18:26, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

The NXT 'televised' and 'live events' sections separate those who have profiles on WWE.com from those that don't, which is important as NXT at times operates like an indy federation with a large variety of performers including Performance Center trainees and non-contracted talents. Splitting the lists in this way allows us to keep track of and differentiate between performers who are official members of the roster as per WWE.com (which is the resource we use), and those who are contracted Performance Center talents who may appear at house shows etc but aren't yet officially considered part of the roster. The live events section was introduced because it doesn't make sense to list Performance Center trainees who have begun to wrestle at house shows as unassigned personnel, but they also don't belong on the active NXT roster. Dannys-777 (talk) 20:13, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

You act like I don't understand what the difference between the two lists are. Who considers them not apart of the official roster? If you are signed to WWE and you appear on NXT television, then you are on the NXT roster. Don't give me some kind of convoluted "WWE.com is our source" reason. Blake and Murphy are no where to be found and some of the live event section wrestlers are wrestling on television semi-regularly. If they debuted for NXT, there's no difference between being seen at live events and being seen on television, literally none, other than having a WWE.com biography. If they haven't debuted on NXT, put them under unassigned personnel. It really is that simple. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 21:34, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

I think the point is that NXT house shows will sometimes include indy wrestlers appearing on a tryout basis, who aren't actually signed to WWE contracts, but being paid on a per-appearance basis, as is done with many indy promotions. Those wrestlers may be on WWE-produced NXT house shows, but they're not part of the NXT roster proper. Conversely, WWE may have signed someone as a trainee at the Performance Center who hasn't yet made their NXT debut. Using NXT house show reports to figure out if someone is actually on the roster is not a reliable method, so sticking to just wrestlers with wwe.com profiles allows us to be clear that they are signed talent. But ultimately, I agree with you. If someone is actually signed to a WWE contract and appearing on NXT television or house shows, they should be on the NXT roster; we don't really need to separate out the NXT roster, though we do need to verify in some way that the person is fully signed, not an extra brought in for that show. oknazevad (talk) 22:16, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

Yes, as I said, putting them as unassigned personnel isn't logical or sensible because they aren't unassigned, they are training at the Performance Center and working Florida loop house shows as part of their developmental process without being part of the televised NXT roster. The roster page at WWE NXT lists wrestlers who have made any sort of appearance on TV in the way you're suggesting but the problem is what do you quantify as 'debuting on NXT'? Developmental wrestlers can appear as extras in battle royals etc and then wait years in some cases before an actual TV debut and push. We used WWE.com because it seemed the most reasonable as a source to determine which performers had been officially called up to the televised roster and were considered television talents. Blake and Murphy were tag team champions for almost a year and haven't been released, the fact that we haven't seen them on television for a while doesn't mean we can just remove them because we feel like it, there's no way of quantifying that. And many of the guys you've now boldly included as part of the NXT roster have never been seen on television, in some cases they may never be. I understand your broader position but your approach here is not just heavy-handed, it's a frankly inaccurate portrayal of things.Dannys-777 (talk) 22:36, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

I've seen you decided to go with the article looking like garbage. Don't worry, it'll be fixed eventually. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 15:59, 29 October 2017 (UTC)

Why is Angle on the main roster?

Do we have to do this every time an authority figure wrestles? Guys like him, HHH, Shane, etc. belong in their regular section. When we note it with "occasional wrestler," it covers the "occasional" instances that these guys get in the ring. 4-5 matches a year is well within the "occasional" description. This jumping the gun has got to stop. Kjscotte34 (talk) 16:05, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

Agreed. "Occasional" means that a match like last night is one of the occasions on which he wrestled. That does not make him a full-time roster memeber. We really do need to stop changing this list for every storyline. That's not the real-world perspective with which we write. oknazevad (talk) 16:10, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

As the one who put Angle on the main roster, there was a very real world reason for it - Raw has a boatload of guys either injured or ill, and they need healthy bodies. Angle is wrestling because he isn't rehabbing an injury or fighting off an infection at the moment. Nothing to do with storyline, everything to do with the very real world necessity of the fact that Raw is short on able bodied wrestlers, and need all hands on deck at the moment. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:11, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

He's wrestled in one match, as a special event mandated by the circumstances. We don't know yet if he'll wrestle more, or how often. Right now, he's just like Shane or Triple H, an authority figure who occasionally wrestles. oknazevad (talk) 20:21, 23 October 2017 (UTC)

Which, as we've stated, is covered in the "Occasional" description. He wrestled Sunday out of circumstance. Going forward, he'll probably be a "Big 4" PPV performer. But the primary role is authority figure. These guys aren't going to be sick forever. Kjscotte34 (talk) 12:49, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

OK, I can accept that. So outside of Shane/Angle/HHH winning a title/Rumble/MITB (because champions automatically go on the list) they stay where they are. Vjmlhds (talk) 17:11, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

Well, with HHH announced for at least 5 UK shows coming up, this is clearly more than an Angle/TLC "one off"...this is clearly a "We need healthy bodies, so HHH has to pick up the slack" move to help fill out the shows (HHH also filled in for AJ and KO on the SD South American tour recently, so he's been busy lately in the ring. Vjmlhds (talk) Vjmlhds 23:15, 27 October 2017 (UTC)

Triple H wrestling on house shows doesn't mean he should be on the Raw roster here. The Raw roster should be for people who appear on television as wrestler for the brand

House shows count too. Guys who don't appear on TV frequently wrestle at house shows to stay sharp. TV ain't the end all, be all. Vjmlhds (talk) 19:31, 29 October 2017 (UTC)

You'd think that, but apparently not if you're in NXT. Regards, — Moe Epsilon 20:30, 29 October 2017 (UTC)

He's not staying sharp he's covering for a depleted roster

First, sign your posts, second, all the more reason why he's listed...guys are dropping like flies (9 injured/ill on the Raw side), and someone has to go in there and pick up the slack, which is exactly why he's listed...if this were just some special one off, it would be different, but since he's in there grinding away like everyone else (out of necessity, but doing it anyway), he gets added to the list...right now, he isn't Paul Lesveque the executive, he's HHH the wrestler because that's what WWE needs him to be right now. Vjmlhds (talk) 23:50, 29 October 2017 (UTC)

I am voicing my objection to this one. He is an "occasional" wrestler. As soon as this viral infection runs its course, he's going to be back in an executive role, except for WM season. His PRIMARY role is still as an executive and member of the board. He is likely running these house shows as it is which is why he's present. We don't need to fiddle with this list every single time someone ties their boots. Now, when we get to that RR-WM season, I'll change my stance if the situation allows. Kjscotte34 (talk) 12:53, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

I agree. "We don't need to fiddle with this list every single time someone ties their boots." Could not have said it better. oknazevad (talk) 13:00, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

Here's how best to explain it...Joe Blow is a teacher, who is also in the National Guard. His unit gets activated, and he goes to his assignment. At that point, Joe stops being a teacher, and becomes a soldier. Now, once his mission ends, Joe can go back home and resume being a teacher, but as long as the mission is ongoing, Joe is a soldier. While obviously not the same as a wrestling company, the idea is the same regarding HHH and the current situation brought upon by Raw being a M*A*S*H* unit. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:14, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

Except HHH hasn't stopped "being a teacher." He continues his primary assignment (executive) while *occasionally* filling a spot on the tour. He's advertised for what, five dates? Not to mention, members of the RAW roster were returning on Monday. Kjscotte34 (talk) 10:36, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

Vjmlhds has once again moved Kurt Angle and Shane McMahon to wrestler sections of their brands, even through their primary roles on the shows are General Manager and Commissioner not wrestlers, this needs to stop. A note saying that they occasionally wrestles is more than appropriate. TheDeviantPro (talk) 21:14, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

Not worth getting into a big stink over...I tried a new idea, it got rejected, so that's that. Never know unless you try. Vjmlhds 9talk) 22:22, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

Why is Lio Rush listed in the TV section?

He's only had a couple of brief appearances, and isn't listed on the wwe.com Superstars section. Surely if Rush warrants being in the TV section, then we should add Fabian Aichner and, possibly, Cezar Bononi too? IanPCP (talk) 12:05, 3 November 2017 (UTC)

Chris Jericho

Jericho is touring with Fozzy in 2017 until November 18th 2017. (Source: http://www.fozzyrock.com/fozzy/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/22489670_10155470879826195_8287917905988034392_n.png) then again in 2018 from January 28 2018 to February 13th 2018 according to http://www.fozzyrock.com/fozzy/tour/. Jericho also will be at NJPW's Wrestle Kingdom 12 (January 4th 2018) PPV wrestling Kenny Omega according to https://www.facebook.com/fourthree4/videos/1966337916714826/ which shows Jericho challenging Omega Wrestle Kingdom 12 then there is Jericho's Cruise (http://www.chrisjerichocruise.com/) that runs from October 27th 2018 to October 31st 2018 which has Fozzy shows as part of its official entertainment. - 2A02:C7D:CC6:4400:65D0:E076:5BEF:B638 (talk) 16:35, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

Mark Andrews

Mark Andrews is currently linked to the Mark Andrews disambiguation page instead of the Mark Andrews wrestler page. - 2A02:C7D:CC6:4400:A194:ECA8:260D:9F8F (talk) 13:44, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

Chris Jericho *is* still with WWE

From today's Q&A on PWInsider:

Q: So is Jericho and Omega a one and done deal? Or is Jericho signed with New Japan now?

A: Jericho is still with WWE. He is working the New Japan match with their blessing. I still fully expect to see him at WrestleMania. WWE likes to bring back every available star for that show and Jericho certainly fits that description.

They've also mentioned on podcasts that - having originally reported Jericho's contract had expired - they've since heard he is, in fact, still under some sort of WWE deal. IanPCP (talk) 15:51, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

It would help a ton if these so-called "experts" on the dirt sheets (who are supposed to know all this stuff), would get their stuff together. Vjmlhds (talk) 00:18, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

As per various Opinions, WWE CEO Vince McMahon permitted him to wrestle in NJPW same as Brock Lesnar did for UFC 200 During he is still in WWE Contract. Maybe we need to seek some help from NotTheFakeJTP about this issue. JTP you need to look through these kindly. Broken nutshell (talk) 16:04, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

PWInsider is a reliable source, so Jericho stills with WWE --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 21:22, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Don't know why I, of all people, was asked to help with this, but HHH Pedigree is right; PWInsider's word matters here. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 22:00, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

It's like John Cena at Survivor Series. You were choosen randomly. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 22:15, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Terms

Question -- did someone somewhere decide that we should be referring to the personnel here as superstars, rookies, etc. It doesn't make a huge difference to me, but in the spirit of consistency I've reverted the page back. The editor in question appears to have a history of edit warring. Kjscotte34 (talk) 12:32, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

No, we don't use such marketing terms in the name of neutrality. The editor making the changes is not respecting consensus or Wikipedia policy. If he makes these changes again, he should be blocked. oknazevad (talk) 13:16, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

How do you ask for someone to be blocked? I'd say he's deserving of a block by now IanPCP (talk) 16:52, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

No need. He's been blocked indefinitely by an admin. Kjscotte34 (talk) 18:15, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

Wonderful. IanPCP (talk) 18:29, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

Suggestion about re-ordering the page

Just a suggestion, but I reckon it'd look better if we had Main Roster, NXT, and then Broadcast Team, Referees, etc. Broadcast Team, Refs, etc include NXT staff so it feels like it should be below NXT. Thoughts? IanPCP (talk) 20:52, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

@Moe Epsilon: had recently arranged things just that way, but it got reverted. I wouldn't mind your suggestion, @IanPCP:. Vjmlhds (talk) 21:56, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

David Otunga

David Otunga worked the Clash of Champions Kickoff Panel, therefore, he is no longer inactive due to "legal issues" and should be restored to normal. WWEPersonnelCleaner (talk) 21:42, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

Fixed Chris "WarMachineWildThing" ^{Talk to me} 21:50, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

Isabel Lahela

She never actually showed up at the PC. She should be removed. https://www.sportskeeda.com/wwe/from-the-wwe-rumor-mill-isabel-lahela-not-signed-with-wwe

Just adding this signature - with a time and date - so this comment gets auto-archived eventually IanPCP (talk) 13:04, 29 December 2017 (UTC)

Jason Jordan

Note for Jason Jordan : "Son of Kurt Angle (storyline)."

Just adding this signature - with a time and date - so this comment gets auto-archived eventually IanPCP (talk) 13:04, 29 December 2017 (UTC)

Returns

Taynara Conti and Enzo Amore both returned at seperate live events last night. They should no longer be labeled "inactive" — Preceding unsigned comment added by WWEPersonnelCleaner (talk • contribs) 18:26, 6 January 2018 (UTC)

Paige

Where is Paige? Trevor800 (talk) 05:28, 14 January 2018 (UTC)

See Other on-air personnel. Did you want something edited in her row? jd22292 (Jalen D. Folf) (talk • contribs) 07:16, 14 January 2018 (UTC)

Mohamed Fahim

He just signed with the PC yesterday. Needs to be added to unassigned personelle

http://sport360.com/article/wwe/264156/boxer-mohamed-fahim-becomes-first-egyptian-signed-by-wwe

I've added him now. Thanks for the reference IanPCP (talk) 19:21, 28 January 2018 (UTC)

Unassigned Personnel

EC3 and Candace LeRae are not on WWE.com therefore they should be under unassigned personnel. Also, Candace is not Gargano's manager. She's never even accompanied him to the ring. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.177.35 (talk) 02:22, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

Drake Maverick

Rockstar Spud is now Drake Maverick the GM of 205 Live — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.177.35 (talk) 03:40, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

He's been moved to Other On Air Personnel IanPCP (talk) 13:28, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 February 2018

Under The NxT signings, there have been a few more recent signings of Hanson, Raymond Rowe and Ricochet that are not listed 90.219.248.110 (talk) 21:18, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 00:23, 3 February 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 February 2018

EC3 and Candace LeRae are not on WWE.com so they should be under unassigned personnel 72.71.177.35 (talk) 22:05, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

 Not done for now: I didn't make this decision, but I'm pretty sure it's based on precedent; EC3 was shown in the crowd at a TakeOver, much like many other NXT signings (Drew McIntyre, Lio Rush, etc.), thus he will be on NXT. Candice LeRae is set in stone in NXT, however. She actually fought at TakeOver (sanctioned, no, but still jumped to ringside) and accompanied Gargano to the ring at yesterday's tapings.
Tl;dr, EC3 could be unassigned, although it's highly unlikely, and Candice is definitely in NXT. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 00:28, 3 February 2018 (UTC)

Lars Sullivan

As of 2/6 Lars Sullivan will have been inactive for 30 days including NXT tapings. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.177.35 (talk) 14:44, 5 February 2018 (UTC)

Inactive.

As of today Lars Sullivan should be labeled as inactive — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.173.48 (talk) 00:56, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Roderick Strong

Just because he's competing in the cruiserweight tournament doesn't mean he's a part of 205 Live. Most likely a one off to fill a spot. Needs to be moved back under the NXT roster unless WWE says otherwise — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.177.35 (talk) 04:00, 6 February 2018 (UTC)

For everyone who keeps moving Roderick to the 205 Live roster, a) the announcers referred to him as "NXT's Roderick Strong" and b) please take note of this line from the intro to the article: Personnel on the main roster may also periodically wrestle in NXT and vice versa. IanPCP (talk) 13:46, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Lars Sullivan

He is Inactive unless he's been working live events — Preceding unsigned comment added by TyroneTyreseBiggums (talk • contribs) 00:02, 12 February 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 February 2018

Buddy Murphy to 205 Live? 72.71.177.141 (talk) 19:10, 14 February 2018 (UTC)

 Not done for now None of the other one-show tournament participants (Tyler Bate, Roderick Strong) are listed, so I think we are waiting until they make further appearances. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:17, 14 February 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 February 2018

Amanpreet Sign signs with the PC http://www.wwe.com/shows/wwenxt/article/indian-wrestler-amanpreet-singh-reports-to-wwe-performance-center 72.71.177.141 (talk) 03:39, 15 February 2018 (UTC)

 Not done for now: Please provide a reliable, third-party (i.e., independent) source that confirms this WWE announcement so that the notability of this request can be evaluated. Thank you. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 20:12, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

EC3 and Candice LeRae need to be put back on unassigned personnel

Neither are on WWE.com yet

Adding this reply - with a time stamp - so this section gets auto-archived IanPCP (talk) 14:38, 3 March 2018 (UTC)

ASUKA

@IanPCP: You're right at your point you posted your opinion of wwe.com for Asuka. I also trying to recommend wwe.com and do the same thing as you do. CK (talk) 19:05, 12 March 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. We need to remain consistent. If we're moving John Cena to Raw because wwe.com says he's Raw, then we need to keep Asuka on Raw. IanPCP (talk) 19:40, 12 March 2018 (UTC)

Kevin Owens and Sami Zayn

Both are fired by daniel bryan and declared as free agent so according to wwe.com they have to be remain listed here as SD live list. Ping Please. CK (talk) 10:21, 21 March 2018 (UTC)

Samir Singh and the Superstar ShakeUp

Why is Samir Singh listed on SmackDown in the List of WWE personnel? I get that he didn't appear on Raw during the Superstar ShakeUp but that is because he is currently injured. Yes, as I post this, Samir Singh is stil listed on the SmackDown filter on WWE's Superstars page but Sunil Singh is also still listed on the SmackDown filter on WWE's Superstars page even though Sunil Singh was with Jinder Mahal on Raw. Maria Kanellis is also listed on the SmackDown filter on WWE's Superstars page despite the fact her husband, Mike Kanellis was moved to Raw in the Superstar ShakeUp. - 2A02:C7F:C243:E200:2883:9D11:48B3:5C21 (talk) 09:28, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

Samir Singh posted on Instagram saying he’s on Raw as well. Ron234 (talk) 17:15, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

Buddy Murphy

Why is Buddy Murphy still listed under NXT when he's been a part of 205 Live for the past month? The guy hasn't appeared on NXT in ages. - 23:52, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

The consensus has always been to list talents as they appear on wwe.com, which still lists Murphy as an NXT talent. IanPCP (talk) 15:43, 19 April 2018 (UTC)

Samir Singh

He posted on Instagram that he’s on Raw. link - https://www.instagram.com/p/BhsU1xbnfpu/?hl=en Ron234 (talk) 20:52, 19 April 2018 (UTC)

the Saudi Arabia tryouts

Do we have any proof that the "eight finalists" actually got contracts? IanPCP (talk) 22:22, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

205 Live

Here's a quandary:

The cruiserweights are listed on the Raw roster page of WWE.com, but if you look at each individual CW wrestler's bio, they are listed as 205 Live.

John Cena is also listed as a Raw wrestler on thw WWE.com roster page, but his bio says free agent (which is how we list him here).

Since the CWs never appear on Raw any more, and have their own GM, shouldn't they be listed as their own 205 Live brand?

Basically, since we go by Cena's individual bio in listing him as a free agent, shouldn't we do the same for the CWs, since their bios all have them listed as 205 Live?

Just asking.

Vjmlhds (talk) 18:56, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

I see 205 Live as a sort-of "sub brand" of RAW, which is why the wrestlers show up on the wwe.com RAW filter, but have an individual 205 logo on their pages. That said, I wouldn't argue if anyone wanted to treat 205 like its own brand on this page. IanPCP (talk) 21:46, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

"Real name" category

I'm not sure if it's a cultural bias but listing only the first and last name doesn't reflect the realities of some of the wrestler's real names. Some go by their middle name as opposed to their name (Shawn Hickenbottom, Booker Huffman etc.). list the full real name of the person would seem more appropriate. Thoughts?

Adding this comment (with time/date) so this section gets auto-archived eventually IanPCP (talk) 21:08, 15 June 2018 (UTC)

Proposed re-arranging of page

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

• Raw
• Smackdown
• 205 Live
• NXT (just the TV rosters)
• Broadcast Team
• Referees
• Performance Centre (which will include both NXT live event personnel and wrestlers from Unassigned who have been "reported to the Performance Centre" but haven't debuted yet, such as Jessamyn Duke)
• Unassigned (Cena, Undertaker, etc)
• and then the rest

Thoughts? IanPCP (talk) 13:57, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Love it. Just instead of "Unassigned", call them Free Agents Vjmlhds (talk) 17:00, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

I like it too. I also agree with Vjmlhds with calling the Unassigned personnel "Free Agents"--Keith Okamoto (talk) 17:32, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

IanPCP It's 3-0 in favor of your changes - if someone had an issue, they would have spoken up...so I'd go ahead and do it. Vjmlhds (talk) 21:36, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Right. Done. That took a while! Obviously, feel free to make any changes you need to make. (PS, I removed the Saudi Arabian guys, as per my earlier post on here) IanPCP (talk) 23:56, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

205 Live it's not a brand. it's just a raw division. Also, I don't like very much the Free agent section. All this Free Agent it's just kayfabe. Peopel like Keith Lee aren't free agent, are just unnasigned. But it's a minor nipick --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 21:50, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

HHH Pedrigree Please don't single handedly revert something agreed upon by 3 different editors - talk first, revert later (if consensus says OK) Vjmlhds (talk) 05:01, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

IanPCPKeith OkamotoVjmlhds As Galatz explained here, 205 Live it's not his own brand, just a Raw division.--HHH Pedrigree (talk) 10:31, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Regarding the discussion on the other article, Galatz sounded (to me anyway) non-committal, and the conversation is ongoing. As far as this article is concerned, I'll use the same argument like I did on the other one - when you have your own GM, your own ring ropes, your own championship, and your own show, then you are your own brand (the CWs haven't been on Raw in forever, and especially since the post Enzo reboot). Vjmlhds (talk) 17:59, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

They haven't been on Raw TV, no, but they still appear on Raw brand house shows. There's more to a brand than the TV show, which is why we have separate articles for the brand and the series. That reflects the practical realities of being a touring operation; it's not just a kayfabe division, but influences a wrestler's schedule as well. That said, there is something strongly distinctive about the cruiserweight division that warrants some separation.

Conversely, I also have to agree that "free agent" is too kayfabe. That Cena is supposedly free to go where he wants is a storyline element to explain why the company schedules him on either show at will, not an actual privelidge that Cena personally enjoys. I don't think it's a good header to reflect the out-of-universe perspective. oknazevad (talk) 20:09, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Also, WWE includes the cruiserweight under the RAW roster in their website. It's not his own brand. About free agent, I think the only real free agents are Chris Jericho (since he wrestles in WWE and NJPW) and Lesnar (I think his contract allows him to fight in UFC) --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 22:38, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Just to add my two cents in... there's nothing that says the wrestlers have to be split up by a BRAND and just a BRAND. Even if 205 Live isn't a "brand" we can still have a separate category for them. Maybe add a note at the top of the section indicating that 205 competitors can also appear on Raw? IanPCP (talk) 10:28, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

(talk) Triple H has regularly said the goal is for 205 to be an NXT like brand. The smart bet is to take it away from RAW. They don't appear on the program. The WWE.com roster page isn't updated (Mandrews is listed as 205, Buddy is listed as NXT, Lio isn't on 205 yet, etc.). 205 has it's own roster, it's own TV show, and in the future it's own live events and tapings. Putting it separate is easier and more logical. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:55, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

Right now, 205 it's not a brand. According to WWE.com, their wrestlers are also part of RAW, even if they don't appear. However, they appear in some live events. The 205 live events were cancelled due poor sales. The cruiserweight division is a sub-brand of RAW. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 12:28, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

There's no evidence of that being due to low ticket sales. They were discontinued due to the brand being changed dramatically with Enzo's exit. You can't add your own opinion or rumor as reasoning to not better structure the wiki. WWE.com is outdated, as mentioned, so it doesn't necessarily reflect anything. You can dislike 205, which you appear to, but it has it's own roster, championship, and Triple H has publicly stated the intentions of 205 to become a touring brand ala NXT. Thus, it should have it's own section. (talk) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:23, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

I also agree that "Free agent" section is too kayfabe and in my opinion doesn't fit. I feel unassigned suits it better as it encompasses the kayfabe "free agents" such as Undertaker and Cena but also encompasses unassigned wrestlers like Keith Lee. Using unassigned personnel also allows unassigned non-wrestling roles (like an unassigned writer, manager, etc.). --HC7 (talk) 00:52, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

Some thoughts I have on this change:

1. The way the roster is listed makes it look like Raw, SmackDown, and NXT are three separate brands, and we all know that they're not, as NXT is still technically a developmental brand.

2. The performance center recruits section looks as if they're not a part of NXT, and most of them do perform on the road as part of that brand. This section doesn't separate the distinction between who is competing and who is still awaiting debut.

3. The free agents section looks speculative at best. We know Cena, Rock, and Undertaker are, but we never know where new signees go, so why locate the other guys there and not under the recruits section? This goes vice versa: aren't performance center recruits technically free agents until they debut at NXT live shows? The section is also placed in a way that makes it look like it's equal to NXT, which is confusing as a person trying to gather the tiers of the brands and the shows they belong to.

Thoughts? DantODB (talk) 17:16, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

This page is purely meant to be a list of who has some sort of WWE contract, I wouldn't say it's a problem or not if the "tiers of the brands" are clear or not. Each section has a link to the relevant page for the brand/show/etc which gives further details so if you wanted more details about now - for example - NXT fits into the overall hierarchy of WWE, you can get it from the specific NXT page. IanPCP (talk) 13:00, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

edit request

Requesting that the article be unlocked to update some information reflecting the results of the just completed Money in the Bank PPV:

• Alexa Bliss now Raw Women's Champion
• Braun Strowman now the men's Money in the Bank contract holder.

Vjmlhds (talk) 04:21, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

POLL: Should 205 Live be it's own section?

Please comment with just a YES (205 Live should be it's own section) or NO (205 Live should remain a sub section of Raw). I'll start things off with a YES. IanPCP (talk) 10:25, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

First, WP:POLL. "polling is not a substitute for discussion." Second, it's not about me not liking it. It about 205 not being promoted as a separate brand from RAW and SD, event with a GM. I gave many arguments (cruiserweight wrestlers wrestling at RAW house shows, co-branded PPVs not including 205 as one of their brands, RAW and SmackDown had GM even without brand extension, cruiserweight listed in WWE.com under the RAW roster). Also, there is other users against it besides me. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 11:11, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

I started a poll as I feel we've had discussion already. The poll doesn't necessarily mean we have to action anything, I'm more curious to see how others respond. Even if we all decide 205 Live is a part of Raw, what's to stop it having it's own section on the page? There isn't a rule that the sub sections have to be WWE-designated "brands", is there? IanPCP (talk) 11:19, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

@IanPCP: Man what? your questions totally disgusting man Come On. @HHH Pedrigree: is right by his opinion. Now here what I say, Cruiserweight Classics launched in June 23, 2016. Every wrestlers got debuted in RAW, 205 Live launched then in November 29, 2016, Article 205 Live clearly states that, the Cruiserweight wrestlers appear on both Raw and 205 Live. Throughout 2017 and 2018 WWE finally revealed General Manager for them but not yet made any announcement that CWC Division is separated from RAW. It's a Sub Branch of RAW in another Word. CK (talk) 11:44, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

"Disgusting" seems a bit much, don't you think? Plus, my question didn't even ask about whether 205 is a sub brand/branch/whatever of Raw, just whether we should list it separately or not. Either way, I'm just curious as to what people think as I've seen people with differing opinions on here. IanPCP (talk) 12:53, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Until WWE announces otherwise they should remain apart of Raw. When the division was announced it was said that they were apart of Raw. Mattspac 12:57, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

See what @Mattspac: says, The same thing I said above "but not yet made any announcement that CWC Division is separated from RAW." CK (talk) 13:01, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

I Appealed protection and the article has been protected to be edited for 3 days here. CK (talk) 18:42, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

@IanPCP: Do you have a WP:RS to support your !vote? - Galatz^Talk 01:52, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

@Galatz: Do you think he might say anything. if you need help then go with Mattspac and HHHPedrigree who are authenticated users at wikipedia and are right that if WWE hasn't made any announcement yet regarding 205 Live as separated brand even having their own General Manager. Continuously same arguements. CK (talk) 10:35, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

I have no idea what you are trying to say, but every user, regardless of their length of time or previous contributions have equal say in attempt to build a consensus. Therefore what is wrong with asking them to provide a source? - Galatz^Talk 13:44, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

Sure. This article from Wrestletalk (with a tweet from Dave Meltzer) https://wrestletalk.com/205-live-no-longer-on-raw/ coupled with - according to https://www.cagematch.net/?id=8&nr=1&page=8&name=raw&vDay=&vMonth=&vYear=&showtype=&location=&arena=&region= - there hasn't been a cruiserweight match on Raw since 26th March of this year. Whilst I'll fully admit this doesn't make 205 Live a de jure brand in and of itself, surely it makes it a de facto one? IanPCP (talk) 14:20, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

Yes, it unquestionably should. All examples given are from 2016 and 2017 as to why it shouldn't, and old WWE.com pages not updated. Triple H says the plan is for the brand to be touring and separate like NXT. They have a GM. They have a title. They have an exclusive roster. And they even call up wrestlers directly to 205 Live. It does not belong with RAW anymore. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:43, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Reason for Responsible Tagging

Continuously Same arguements having at this article, wikiproject of this article has discussion that resulted in Incorrect information, Same thing that 205 Live is a separate brand of WWE not RAW. If WWE via WWE.com officially declares one thing about listing of rosters then it should be according to website not wikiproject arguements. CK (talk) 13:07, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Sorry, i disagree with this. Triple H said in conference calls (check youtube) that 205 is intended to follow in NXT's footsteps as it's own brand. You can't use outdated articles and segments from years past as examples. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:44, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

UK Division

So... what are we saying? Do we list talents like Flash Morgan Webster, Kenny Williams, Joseph Conners and James Drake? And, if we do, do they get their own section or do they go in Free Agents? IanPCP (talk) 09:17, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

I think with the newer UK wrestlers signed we should give the UK division their own section.--HC7 (talk) 01:00, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

Well, I don't know. I included Morgan Conners and Drake because Solowrestling (a reliable source with a journalist at the 205 live event) said they were announced as new members of the UK division. For me, I would include the UK talent in an entire new section, but most of them work in NXT (Wolfgang is the only in the unassigned section). I would wait until WWE creates the TV show or whatever. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 15:41, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

Well, with Johnnie Saint being announced as GM, I think we can separate out the UK Division from "unassigned"...if you have your own GM, then you are your own brand (cough205Livecough) Vjmlhds (talk) 21:34, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

I agree with @Vjmlhds: on both counts there IanPCP (talk) 13:41, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Again, 205 Live is a sub-brand. part of raw. There is no annoucment about 205 Live being their own brand. Money in the Bank (and the following PPVs) is billed as a co-branded PPV with RAW and SmackDown, no RAW, SmackDown and 205Live (BTW, I know there is no cruiserweight match at MITB, but during every promo about co-branded PPVs, there is no 205Live). If WWE names somebody as Main Event GM, does it mean it's a brand? No, just the GM of a TV Show. During the supershow era, RAW and SD were two separate shows with different GM but weren't brands. About the UK division, i think is fine their own section, since the sources talk about it as a different division outside WWE main brands (RAW, SD and NXT). --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 19:39, 15 June 2018 (UTC)

Whilst that's your opinion, I respectfully disagree. At it's inception 205 Live was completely a sub-section of Raw. No doubt. These days however, when was the last time Raw had a 205 match? Coupled with 205 having it's on on air authority figure, I would absolutely say it's its own brand. As for your comment about Main Event, if Main Event had it's own GM and it's own roster of talent who were never on Raw then I'd make a case it were a separate brand too. BUT... we'll never reach a consensus without some sort of poll, so maybe we should do just that on this talk page? IanPCP (talk) 21:07, 15 June 2018 (UTC)

If anything, them not being included in the commercials only further establishes them as their own entity. NXT isn't mentioned either. Neither is WWE UKC. 205 has a weekly TV show, it's own roster including call ups specifically on the show, it's own champion, it's own GM. There is no reason not to have it as it's own page aside from HHH Pedigree not liking it. Enough people disagree to overrule him. As for UK, you could do it there too. User:Anon User (talk) 04:47, 16 June 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk)

Their own wrestlers and champion, who are included under the RAW roster. It's not about me not liking it, I gave many arguments, which aren't been heard. (cruiserweights listed under the raw roster in WWE.com, cruiserweights working on RAW house shows, RAW and SD had GM without the brand extension.) --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 11:18, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

They never had GMs for long without a brand extension, that's factually incorrect. The WWE.com superstars pages aren't updated. And NXT talent work raw live events sometimes too. Them not having live events currently opens them up for that. They also sometimes do appearances on NXT events, that doesn't make them NXT talent. There's no reason to have them there. You just keep ignoring all of the reasons to move them because of you disliking them. just stop. People want it that way and there's no good reason to not do it. --Anon (talk) 11:18, 16 June 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk)

Supershow era started on 2011-2012 until 2016. During that years, RAW had GMs like AJ Lee, Vickie Guerrero or Brad Maddox. At the bottom of the page Mattspac and Broken nutshell think like me, because WWE never made any annoucment about CWC as a separate brand. It's not me not liking it, it's about there is no annoucement. You give only interpretations, like "they don't appear on RAW" or "they have a GM" to assume "205 is a different brand". Again, WWE never made any announcement. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 16:31, 17 June 2018 (UTC)

For example, this is from Cedric Alexander's WWE profile "Now that Cedric Alexander has had a taste of the bigtime, he's determined to take his game to the next level in WWE's Cruiserweight division on Raw, as well as on the Cruiserweight-exclusive show WWE 205 Live, which airs Tuesdays, only on WWE Network." Brian Kendrick "Few Superstars have more at stake in Raw’s Cruiserweight division than The Brian Kendrick." Lince Dorado "The Golden Lynx brings his fast-paced and high-flying style to Raw and the Cruiserweight-exclusive show WWE 205 Live," Dar "Dar looks to catapult himself into superstardom on the global stage provided by Monday Night Raw, as well as the Cruiserweight-exclusive show WWE 205 Live". WWE considers the cruiserweight division as part of raw, never made an announcement. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 16:43, 17 June 2018 (UTC)

Yes Me and Mattspac. Supershow era started on 2011-2012 until 2016. During that years, RAW had GMs like AJ Lee, Vickie Guerrero or Brad Maddox. At the bottom of the page Mattspac and Broken nutshell think like me, because WWE never made any annoucment about CWC as a separate brand. It's not me not liking it, it's about there is no annoucement. You give only interpretations, like "they don't appear on RAW" or "they have a GM" to assume "205 is a different brand". Again, WWE never made any announcement. I also appealed it's protection on June 16 see the thread above or my contributions because the WP:RFP of that thread has been archived. I used the word Arguements held while reporting for fully protection at article. I also closed a discussion above. I fought with User:Vjmlhds whom I called his edit SOCK EDIT when he's going to remove the confusion template that posted above articles or thread, then Fight was ignited at my talk page. Last year the same situation held with some articles that involved me in attacking users, I vandalized several IP Talk Pages, I received 2 blocks, see my talk page as a proof. Talking about 205 Live, Read the article Survivor series 2016 and 2017, 2016 states that if Kalisto won the title (as he was in smackdown), All the cruiserweights will be transferred to SmackDown, and in 2017 storylines Kurt angle announced that every raw champions excepting cruiserweights will challenge their smackdown counterparts, Cruiserweights are not because they don't have their SMACKDOWN COUNTERPARTS. I'm still repeating one thing, still re writing my messages, again providing proof. CK (talk) 20:32, 17 June 2018 (UTC)

All of the info given is older. Nobody is disputing the Cruiserweight division was once apart of RAW. It simply isn't anymore. They do not appear on the show. 205 Live has it's own GM. HHH continually discusses in conference calls how the show will be it's own touring brand ala NXT. Citing old WWE.com articles that aren't updated when it's already been established they don't update regularly doesn't help your case. Using 2016 and 2017 examples are not relevant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:42, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Well, with the official announcement that NXT:UK is good to go, I think that we can safely move them into their own section now. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:55, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

It's done, might need some fixing up.HC7 (talk) 18:39, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Those changes have been reverted as the were not supported by the references given. Firstly until it launches I suspect all people will still be on the main NXT roster officially, since they have been wrestling there, and no one has provides a source that says otherwise. I checked the first two people, the first being Wolfgang and that source only says they are in the UK tournament, not in a UK brand. The second, Mark Andrews says 205 Live. Clearly not supporting they are in the NXT UK brand. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 19:10, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Protected edit request on 18 June 2018

Here's a list of changes that happened during tonight's Money in the Bank PPV.

• Add James Ellsworth on SmackDown roster after he returned to WWE tonight and realigned with Carmella.
• Mark Braun Strowman with Money in the Bank contract holder.
• Change the Raw Women's Champion from Nia Jax to Alexa Bliss after Bliss cashed in her Money in the Bank contract on Jax. Keith Okamoto (talk) 04:01, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: The page's protection level has changed since this request was placed. You should now be able to edit the page yourself. If you still seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details. — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 08:02, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

General sanctions

Semi protected to allow only auto-confirmed edits under the new WP:GS/PW to slow down unconstructive editing. Please discuss proposed changes here.-- Dlohcierekim (talk) 15:51, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

UK Roster / NXT UK / the two Royal Albert Hall shows that just aired

Sorry if anyone considers this a spoiler... at the end of the second show, Triple H and Johnny Saint brought out "the NXT UK roster". Are we safe to consider these wrestlers has signed and able to be listed on this page? Or should we wait for some more sources? IanPCP (talk) 21:42, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

What is a valid and correct reference?

As there doesn't seem to be a consensus - especially with regards to the NXT UK section - what does a reference need to have to be considered valid? For instance, the reference I used for Zack Gibson was from a national newspaper and it mentioned him being signed and it being for a WWE "UK show" IanPCP (talk) 12:55, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

What it needs to be is laid out in WP:V. The show is not the brand, so if you were to try and tie the two of them together, that violates WP:SYNTH. You need one source that accurately summarizes everything you are trying to convey. In reality at the end of day 2 of the UK shows last week Triple H came out and said he was with the NXT UK roster. All you need is a source that says who he came out with and that would suffice. Just linking to their WWE.com profile which lists the not as part of NXT UK is a violation of wikipedia policy, since the reference does not support what is being claimed in the article. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 13:18, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. Would a review of the Royal Albert Hall shows - if it includes a list of who came out at the end - be sufficient to list a talent under NXT UK? I like to think I know a decent amount about references and validity, but you're obviously more au fait with this than I am :) IanPCP (talk) 13:27, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

Yes, as long as it says that they are the NXT UK roster - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 13:39, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

I've used cite episode to cite the actual video from the WWE Network, along with the time - 145 minutes in - and the quote - "Triple H bringing out the roster of NXT UK". I hope this is enough to qualify as a valid Wiki reference. If so, I'll add the rest of the names IanPCP (talk) 18:50, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

Yeah that should work. Here is a WP:RS that lists out all of the people [1]. The tricky thing is though we have no way of knowing they will be exclusive to this brand. For example, Noam Dar is on the list of people who came out as part of the NXT UK roster, does that mean he will no longer appear as part of the Raw roster? If they appear on both how will that be reflected here? Should people appear on multiple brands it may make sense to reorganize the tables and show everyone alphabetically and add a brand column, where multiple could be listed. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 18:56, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

That source is written by me, by the way IanPCP (talk) 18:57, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

(and I forgot James Drake and Zack Gibson) IanPCP (talk) 18:58, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

I want to make sure you are aware of WP:SELFCITE. Being as PW Insider is listed on WP:PW/RS, you could potentially be citing yourself on Wikipedia. This does not mean you cannot site yourself, but it is supposed to be limited and all WP:COI are supposed to be disclosed, which I do not see on your user page.

As of the issue at hand, if Noam Dar is on the NXT UK roster and the Raw roster, I do not believe that he should be listed twice (I havent reviewed the entire list in detail to see if there are others), anyone have suggestions? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 19:10, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

I wouldn't consider anything a COI if I'm not citing myself. You'll notice I've never once mentioned that - or any other PWInsider - article I've written, as I wouldn't want to cause any sort of conflict; hence my choosing to cite the actual video IanPCP (talk) 19:17, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

(as a matter of full disclosure, I do not work for PW Insider. I've written a very small handful - probably 5 or so - articles for them over the years. I've never once been paid, and I've only written them on the basis of 'I'm someone who spotted some news so I've emailed them'.) IanPCP (talk) 19:25, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

I just moved 205 Live, but I hope we're all happy :)

I slightly changed how 205 Live is listed on the page. It's listed like the other brands - a section for male wrestlers, a section for other on-air personnel - but is clearly shown as a sub-division of Raw. I hope this is a nice compromise that keeps everyone happy IanPCP (talk) 14:58, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

 Done Ummmm!....... Yeah This one is ok I pick that. so No one can argue or can get confuse, go with that one. and yes The following section features talent signed with the company, but not assigned to any particular brand. In select cases, they are billed on-air as "free agents". written for unassigned roster, so why don't we put something like to define why separated. should I do? or ....... CK (talk) 15:23, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

I would say it's not necessary. Details like that should be on the 205 Live page, which is linked at the top of the section. IanPCP (talk) 15:58, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

They haven't officially said the cruiserweights are not on RAW anymore. There is no source stating that either. Yes, they have been mainly on 205 Live. Shouldn't a consensus be reached before making such change? Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 00:41, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

If you look at the way 205 Live is listing, it's as a sub-division of Raw; but with it's own sections for performers and other on-screen personnel, as a means of a compromise, as reaching a complete consensus doesn't seem likely IanPCP (talk) 01:18, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

While I'd prefer their own section, I can accept this compromise for now. Still less than ideal, but sufficient. Anon (talk) 05:00, 21 June 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk)

@IanPCP: When I made my comment, I was thinking you put 205 Live as its own section. It's good for now. But until it's confirmed that 205 Live is completely separate from RAW, it should stay. Mr. C.C.^{Hey yo!}_{I didn't do it!} 14:39, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Just found this little tidbit. Basically says HHH pulled the CWs off of Raw to keep them on their own show so they can be protected, and part of WWE's overall strategy to reboot the division. So it essentially says that they wanted the CWs to be their own brand, and not merely just part of Raw. Just saying. Vjmlhds (talk) 23:10, 28 June 2018 (UTC)

That is YOUR way of reading it, which is not supported by a WP:RS. Limiting their exposure has nothing to do with the brand. Additionally 411mania is not a RS so you need the original PW Insider reference to even support that. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 00:53, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

OK - here is the officially official source...point still stands though. Vjmlhds (talk) 01:43, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

Again, it's your way to read that. "It was a decision made when Triple H took over as the showrunner of the 205 Live series as a way to keep the talents from being overexposed and to make sure they were kept in a position where they were protected. It was part of the company's strategy of trying to change the perception of the Cruiserweight division." HHH wants to protect the CW, but I don't read anything about "it's an independent brand", that's your interpretation, not essentially says because isn't in the text. BTW, on June 24 and 23, 2018, Alexander defended his title during RAW house shows. [2] [3] — Preceding unsigned comment added by HHH Pedrigree (talk • contribs)

It very clearly says its own series, its specifically does not call it a brand. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 16:14, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

It's very clear HHH Pedigree just has a vendetta against it. How in any world did having it under RAW as 205 but not mixed in between the main roster and staff hurt anyone? God, you're being pretentious. There's enough reason to keep it separate, at the very least let the 205 Live have their own spot under RAW. - Anon — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 04:18, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

205 Live is the name of the show, we organize by brands not shows. We don't list people who regularly appear on Main Event as such. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 11:51, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

Main Event doesn't have a General Manager, it's own title, another rumored title coming, exclusive signings, nor is it ever called a brand. Hardly the same thing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 07:35, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

205 Live doesnt have its own title nor is it called a brand - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 12:44, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

It's not? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0plydydRgY This was Tuesday, and re-aired on youtube. "Leading this brand" is what the 205 Live champion said. Looks like it's a brand to me. Keep this up Gala and I will be reporting you to wiki admins. This is done regularly on Twitter, 205 Live, and other WWE Network programs.

Not its not. Wrestlers say stuff all the time that is not official. Paul Heyman calls the Universal Championship the Universal Heavyweight Championship, so you better go move that page. This is why there is the desire for sources to be WP:SECONDARY. Provide a source that is a RS that supports your claim. You cannot because it isn't its own brand. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 01:32, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

You left me no choice, I reported you and they're looking into your behavior. On a side note, further proof is on the WWE Performance Center's site where under the Journey they list success stories for talent from RAW, Smackdown, and 205 Live. Note: not Main Event, because that is a B-show and not a brand. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:58, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

The cruiserweight championship is defended on Raw brand events. The PPVs are co-branded, yet don't list 205 Live as one of those brands. A wrestler referring to it as a brand doesn't make it one, they say stuff that is not official all the time. Please provide something official that states it, or any RS that calls it a brand - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 10:51, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

Spoiler alert: NXT guys do RAW and Smackdown live events too. That doesn't confirm anything besides 205 doesn't have their own live events yet so this gives them work. Hideo was on the Smackdown tour of Japan. Gulak and Gallagher were at the last NXT show. Gallagher and Dar were at NXT UK. Nese did an NXT live event. That doesn't make them apart of NXT. And yeah, co-branded between RAW and Smackdown. 205 isn't apart of those events and neither are their competitors. PWInsider reported they're purposely kept away to be their own brand. If you want to discount that, fine, Triple H has said the goal is to have 205 be a touring brand with their own live events and special events (see PPVs) ala NXT. The only PPV appearances 205 has made in six months are Wrestlemania and the Greatest Royal Rumble, both of which had NXT talent appear too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 20:17, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

You might want to reread that PW Insider story, it calls it a division not a brand. If its actually its own brand, like you claim, then provide a RS that states it is. That should be easy if it was accurate. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 20:28, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

They call the UK NXT brand a division too. It's still a brand. They just use the terms interchangeably. It's all over the product. They constantly call it a brand on television, and that's where it matters most. Not WWE.com where they notoriously don't update things forever. IE: James Ellsworth is still not listed on the roster. You're using strawman arguments and changing the goal posts. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 00:00, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

Here is WWE on Instagram labeling Cedric Alexander as a 205 Live star and not a RAW star in the power rankings: https://www.instagram.com/p/BlLlRwLnC5U/?hl=en&taken-by=wwe — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 03:14, 17 July 2018 (UTC)

New NXT Champion

Regarding tonights NXT tapings for the next month Tommaso Ciampa defeated Aliester Black to win the title Paulrossi93 (talk) 03:17, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Mae Young Classic 2

Last year this page pointed women wrestlers with WWE contracts who competed in inaugural Mae Young Classic tournament such as PC recruits and NXT superstars. What about this year? For now PC's Deonna Purrazzo, Tegan Nox, Rhea Ripley, Kavita Devi, Jessie Elaban, Kacy Catanzaro, Reina Gonzales and off corse Io Shirai , NXT's Taynara Conti and NXT UK's Jinny and Killer Kelly are in the second tournament with free agents like Kaitlyn, Mia Yim and others who could have their own section (I know they don't have contracts but this could be pointed out before the table).

--Botchamaniac (talk) 20:25, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Sami Zayn injury

Since long-term injuries are frequently listed in the Notes section, I thought it might be pertinent to list Sami Zayn's extended absence due to rotator cuff surgeries: https://www.wwe.com/article/sami-zayn-injury-interview (Also I don't edit Wikipedia very often; I hope this is the right way to bring this up)

Schaichopath (talk) 13:45, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

205 Live stars listed separate from RAW on Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/p/BlLlRwLnC5U/?hl=en&taken-by=wwe

On top of being called a brand by those on television and WWE's Youtube, WWE's social media is listing 205 Live as it's own brand. The majority here feel it should be in it's own category as well. Perhaps now is the time to make the move. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 03:17, 17 July 2018 (UTC)

You have presented nothing new, since they always but 205 Live on these things. Its a division of the brand, not its own brand. You haven't provided anything that shows WWE officially considers it a brand, or a WP:RS calling it a brand. Wikipedia works on WP:V not what you claim the majority want. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 13:58, 17 July 2018 (UTC)

Triple H, the boss of WWE on RAW listing brands "RAW, Smackdown, NXT UK, NXT, 205 Live". Boom. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 10:05, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

I've been in agreement with Galatz regarding how things should be listed...until now. Long ago, it was decided that we do things here according to WWE.com. Here's what WWE.com does: they list all champions by which show they are on. The drop down menu lists 205 Live as a show to search for superstars. Virtually everything is listing 205 seperately. I agree that it's likely time to make the move. 205 Live -- in my humble opinion -- should be listed after Smackdown and before NXT. Kjscotte34 (talk) 15:49, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

@Kjscotte34: They are listed separately because they are a division of Raw, not a brand. If you look at the WWE 10k filing it lists their brands as Raw, SmackDown and NXT. The WWE's Cruiserweight championship page discusses how they started as a division of Raw [4], yet if they are not a division wouldn't it say so? Wouldn't it say they got their own brand? They refer to Raw and SmackDown as brands in writing constantly, yet never 205 Live. They don't have their own live shows, they tour with Raw. Beginning with Backlash they started saying all PPVs are dual-brand events, yet the cruiserweight championship is defended on these events, why not call it tri-brand? So other than a listing on WWE.com, which would be just as logical with a division as a brand, do you have anything that supports it? Any WP:RS? Anything? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 17:15, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

Unfortunately, @Kjscotte34: Galatz has a very clear vendetta against 205. He deletes talk discussing why it should be it's own section and tries to get anyone who disagrees with him banned. No matter what the consensus is here, he'll fight it tooth and nail, moving the goal post each time or use strawman arguments just to not give it credit. It's very weird.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk • contribs)

Bottom page 8 (14 of the PDF), of their annual report, which can be found here [5], states "NXT has now evolved into our third brand after Raw and SmackDown a". So as of when this was published 4 months ago clearly the WWE's official position was they had 3 brands. They were listed under 205 Live for a while. So what has changed since this report was published? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 17:22, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

They said third brand, not third and final. There's five.

I've strayed away from the conversation until now, but I found the article on Lio Rush's 205 Live signing, which refers to 205 Live as the "purple brand" twice; in the body itself and in the article's subtitle. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 05:26, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

Gala has said just one piece of proof and he'd accept it. There is the proof we need.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk • contribs)

@32.213.92.177: Good try but I asked you for one, something you have continually failed to do. There is no rush to change things based on one article when there is not a trend in referring to it as that. The correct approach per wikipedia policy is to wait and see what it is referred to as and form a consensus, not jump on one thing. Especially since we many times have used the consensus to go against what WWE.com has, check out John Cena on this page as an example. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 11:43, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

At this point, I'm done with civility. You're such a tool who has such a clear vendetta it's alarming. Proof upon proof, from the product itself to the man in charge of 3/5 brands to a WWE.com article calling it such that you asked for and you still keep moving the goal post and clutching straws. You're exactly what's wrong with Wikipedia and the reason why people don't take it seriously. Instead of wikipedia representing true and factual information, you have a bias and let that be the story instead. Embarrassing and a sham. One day the mods will ban you for this behavior, and I won't feel bad for a second.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk • contribs) }

You clearly did not read the comments that were said to you at WP:ANI by multiple people who were not me. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 23:54, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

@Galatz: Ummm! John Cena, Oh Yes! Nickag989 already reverted my edit regarding John Cena as he did same thing as that IP did regarding 205 Live. I even tried to vandalize IP Talk Page, I spuriously added block templated on his account, even if Admins try to block him, or try to warn him, He will never accept any warnings, never realize his mistake, he just made Wikipedia a Court as he continuously engaged in arguments like a Lawyer fought for a court case. He is likely a Sockpuppet of Vjmlhds. I was talking that Now I can perform an edit regarding John Cena's Status as a reverting editor recently blocked indefinitely Nickag989 and retired from wikipedia, I said this because you mentioned John Cena listed under RAW on wwe.com . CK (talk) 14:48, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

@Broken nutshell: Sorry, but I'm not IP 32.213 etc. I don't do socks...if I make an edit, I put my name to it. I went on record as saying I was standing down on 205 Live, and I meant it then as I mean it now...not worth the hulla-baloo. Don't appreciate the false accusations. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:49, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

Kindly, There's a lot of difference between boss and employee, Triple H is neither a boss nor controls WWE wholly, Vinnie Mac is the real boss as Triple H is an occasional wrestler, He just named shows separately it doesn't mean that Cruiserweights are not a part of RAW brand, WWE.com is neither glitchy nor having any old updates, regarding 205 Live, WWE itself hasn't made any announcement regarding separation of RAW and 205Live, not even on twitter not even on their any social website accounts. other web materials that had been provided as the evidence are still unreliable sources that states 205 Live has been separated because WWE itself hasn't confirmed any update regarding it.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Broken nutshell (talk • contribs)

Is brock lesnar with wwe anymore?

I was wondering if brock lesnar has left wwe After he lost the universal title to roman reigns Liljoshee (talk) 15:49, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

As of earlier this week, Meltzer said he had a few days left on his contract. So if not today, soon. Then it's off to the circus to ring in the new year. InedibleHulk (talk) 03:52, 25 August 2018 (UTC)

Why can't i edit?

Could someone tell me why i cannot edit anymore on this page Liljoshee (talk) 15:53, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

I would assume it's because you're a brand new user and this is a protected page. What are you trying to edit? Kjscotte34 (talk) 16:35, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Names of female personnel

I don't have an account, so I can't edit myself, but the document sourced for Stephanie McMahon's real name lists her as Stephanie McMahon Levesque, but the page says Stephanie Levesque. As well, the source listed for Candice LeRae's real name is a database that shows no proof of her taking her husband's last name. Either a better source is needed, or it should not be assumed that she took her husband's name. 108.25.61.82 (talk) 16:39, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Neville

We shouldn't remove him until a credible source lists him as being gone from the company or he's removed from WWE.com. Dirt sheets do not count as credible if WWE still has him listed. Once he's officially removed or announced as released, then remove him. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 03:00, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

PWSheet and The Observer are reliable sources, see WP:PW/RS. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 16:32, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

WWE.com is A source, but not THE source...probably just a case of sloppy housekeeping as to why Neville hasn't been removed yet. Vjmlhds (talk) 16:43, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

Please add an edit summary

When making edits to the page, please add an edit summary as it makes it quicker to see what's been changed (as well as useful for justifying your change if need be). Thanks IanPCP (talk) 16:26, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

NXT:UK

There is an error with NXT:UK that needs fixing in the article as when you highlight the [reference number] of the NXT:UK superstars in Ring name you see "NXT UK Championship". WWE Network Exclusives. 145 minutes in. WWE Network. "Triple H bringing out the roster of NXT UK" |access-date= requires |url= (help). Also, WWE has no NXT:UK filter yet on their Superstars page so Pete Dunne, Tyler Bate and Trent Seven are listed there on the site even though we know that they are part of the NXT:UK roster as well. - 2A02:C7F:C243:E200:D99E:4C35:B032:C8A7 (talk) 17:30, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Nikki Bella

Can someone take Nikki Bella off of the smackdown brand? She has not appeared on smackdown for a couple of years and she is currently an unassigned talent along with Brie. Thanks. BIRCHJ (talk) 08:26, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

But she is A free Agent BongumenziBMZ (talk) 16:40, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Big Show

Apparently Big Show will be on Smackdown now. Can someone add him to there or move him to the Free Agent section? Source: https://www.wwe.com/shows/smackdown/article/big-show-vs-randy-orton Kingoftheworldb (talk) 20:43, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Dasha Fuentes

I’m sure nobody will notice, but Dasha Fuentes returned tonight on SmackDown and 205 Live so she’s no longer inactive — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.92.254.98 (talk) 02:42, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

205 Live brand

I recognize this will go nowhere again but since all of the old conversations are gone, I figured I'd pop in with this:

https://www.wwe.com/shows/wwe-205-live/2018-10-10 more references referring to 205 Live as a brand. They do still say division too, but they use the terms division and brand interchangeably for both 205 Live and NXT UK, while also using the word division in regards to RAW and Smackdown due to the tournament on Mixed Match Challenge. I'm exhausted getting into a big argument and debate about it, but hey, more proof is here that 205 Live is a brand. Take it or leave it, it's there. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 02:50, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Yet Lio Rush and Drake Maverik are on Raw every week. Mike Kanellis is still listed as Raw [6] but appeared on 205 Live. I notice you have ignored all of those things. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 11:31, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

They appear as managers. Dakota Kai is still on NXT despite appearing on NXT UK. Mike just hasn't been moved yet officially. I said I'm not getting in a debate, just pointing out more fact. Go delete or archive more points to hide your losing arguments please. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.92.177 (talk) 22:06, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

Samir Singh

Samir returned on RAW to accompany Jinder Mahal to the ring, therefore he’s no longer inactive. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.92.254.98 (talk) 03:00, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

Edit Request: Please Move Matt Riddle and Mia Yim to NXT

I don't know how to edit the tables bio links: https://www.wwe.com/superstars/matt-riddle https://www.wwe.com/superstars/mia-yim

BionicWilliam (talk) 02:43, 1 November 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 October 2018

Johnny Moss' real name is John Mossop source: http://www.timesandstar.co.uk/news/WWE-welcomes-West-Cumbrian-Johnny-Moss-86a1febe-fb88-4733-90d4-73e439724b2e-ds Apx01 (talk) 11:09, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

 Done Saucy^{[talk – contribs]} 02:32, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

Noam Dar and Mark Andrews

As this seems to be topical right now... I'd suggest they both belong in the NXT UK section - with notes about appearing on 205 Live - as their WWE.com profiles both have the NXT UK logo on them instead of the 205 Live logo. IanPCP (talk) 13:51, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

• Seth Rollins .jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 05:26, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

NXT UK

Just to make life easier going forward, whoever holds the UK Championship, UK Women's Championship, and (once we get champions) the UK Tag Team Champions automatically get listed under NXT UK (regardless if they also appear on NXT or 205 Live).

Setting champions aside, if someone is part of 205 Live and also appears on NXT UK, than 205 Live should get priority as 205 is part of Raw.

If someone works on both NXT and NXT UK, than NXT should get priority, as NXT is the more established brand.

So in review, if someone works both the UK brand and either 205 or NXT, than the more established brand gets priority, with the exceptions being the UK champions, as they automatically go to NXT UK for as long as they hold their titles.

Vjmlhds (talk) 18:07, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

I believe the page as a whole needs a pretty big overhaul. There are a few issues that I think an overhaul could address.

1. Right now the page is too heavily sourced based on primary sources, which is not really accurate anyway. For example, Chris Jericho has a WWE.com profile but is not signed, so using the WWE.com profile as a reference is useless. Instead if people feel so strongly this should be here then we could add a column called "Bio" and have a link to it rather than using it as a reference.
2. Choosing which brand to list someone as when they compete on more than one is completely WP:OR.

I suggest we solve both of these issues by simple listing everyone, together, alphabetically. It would look as follows:

Ring name	Bio	Real name	Brand	Notes
Akam	[7]	Sunny Dhinsa	Raw	WWE Raw Tag Team Champion
Apollo Crews	[8]	Sesugh Uhaa	Raw
Akira Tozawa	[9]	Akira Tozawa	Raw (CW)
Ariya Daivari	[10]	Ariya Daivari	Raw (CW)
Aiden English	[11]	Matthew Rehwoldt	SmackDown
Pete Dunne	[12]	Peter England	NXT, NXT UK	WWE United Kingdom Champion

References

Thoughts? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 21:07, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

No. All due respect, but your proposal would just make one ginormous list, everything would run together, and it would be a slog to figure out who is on each brand. It's much easier on the eyes to have separate lists divided out by brands. Vjmlhds (talk) 22:08, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

It would be very easy to sort, based on the sortable table. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 22:26, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

I hear you, but we're talking about well over 100 male wrestlers amongst all the brands to put in a single list...that just doesn't work. It's best to have things broken up. Vjmlhds (talk) 22:39, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

For what it's worth I did the math...between Raw (40), the CW division/205 Live (15), SD (32), NXT (35), and NXT UK (23), there's 140 male wrestlers between those brands...you try to put all of them into one single list, and it simply would be more harm than good. Vjmlhds (talk) 00:08, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Any thoughts on the bio issue? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 18:26, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Don't bother...that's just making a section for the sake of making a section. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:35, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

I prefer the current system. It has some flaws, like Kane or Cena switching brands, but I think is more visual in the current way. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 13:53, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

@Vjmlhds: Its not making a section for the sake of a section. Right now the entire article is sourced improperly. A WWE.com profile in no way shape or form confirms they are a current employee. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 14:22, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 November 2018

Can Someone change the order so that Goldust goes before Gran Metalik. Egaliteryan4 (talk) 19:10, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

 Done Izno (talk) 19:16, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

wwe.com show logos for wrestlers

if we are going by these on this page, mark andrews, tyler bate, trent seven and a couple of others have been officially changed to NXT UK. Also on Jack Gallaghers notes it says hes appeared on NXT UK but he hasn't ever been on an episode of the show. what do you guys think? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.113.63.135 (talk) 08:37, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Lucha House Party

Shouldn't they be listed under "cruiserweights"? Yeah, I know they're on RAW as well as 205 Live, but we've established that 205 Live isn't a separate brand - and is just part of RAW - and it seems incorrect to not put them with the cruiserweights when they are definitely part of the RAW "cruiserweight division". This isn't like deciding whether to list Noam Dar as 205 Live or NXT UK as those are two separate brands, whereas this is just deciding where - within the same brand - to list Kalisto, Dorado and Metalik. Thoughts? IanPCP (talk) 13:47, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Since the LHP is now mixing it up with the big boys on Raw, they should be listed on the main Raw roster. They can still pop up on 205, but they've now essentially graduated to the primary roster on Raw (to give the red brand their own luchadors to counter Rey Mysterio on SD, and to shore up the tag team ranks). Vjmlhds (talk) 17:56, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

I get your point, but I still think they should be listed as "cruiserweights" as they are, and - as we've established - the 205 Live cruiserweights are part of RAW so would be able to appear on RAW whenever. Still, I'm not changing anything, more just chipping in my 2 cents IanPCP (talk) 20:24, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Exactly, that is why breaking it up by brands like this is a flawed system. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 20:27, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, but putting 140 guys into one big supersized list would be even worse (that would just be a giant fustercluck). Vjmlhds (talk) 03:38, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

To be fair, I'm not a fan of the current system, or of one massive list. But I can't think of any other options. Other than perhaps one large list, sub divided into alphabetical chunks? Like these pages List of former WWE personnel (A–C). Probably a bad idea. Just thinking out loud IanPCP (talk) 12:34, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

About LHP... we agree 205 Live is a sub-brand of RAW. Then, 205 wrestlers, in their profiles includes the 205 logo. Kalisto, Metalic, Dorado have the RAW logo. So maybe, WWE decided to pull them off the CW division. About the brands, I don't see any problem. We have a discussion after the brand extension, I will look for the thread. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 13:52, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

If we're using their wwe.com profile logos to decide, then Noam Dar and Mark Andrews should be under NXT UK. IanPCP (talk) 13:57, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Well', that's another discussion and I prefer to stay away from that, I just wanted to give my two cents. Tecnically, it's WWE roster and they decide the brand of the wrestlers. I remember Sin Cara said during an interview he is a cruiserweight but WWE want him out of the division since he is too tall. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 14:02, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

"Well, that's another discussion and I prefer to stay away from that" Understandable :) IanPCP (talk) 14:04, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

LHP still appear on 205 Live and have the 205 Live purple nameplate when they appear on RAW. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 02:37, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

Riddick Moss

No longer inactive as he returned to action last night at an NXT house show with a loss to Matt Riddle — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.92.254.98 (talk) 02:32, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 04:16, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Shafir & Duke

They don't have wwe.com profiles yet, so why have we listed them in the main NXT section? IanPCP (talk) 15:47, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

Because they were heavily featured during the NXT tapings this past week, forming a stable with Shayna Baszler. This follows up on them helping Baszler at Evolution, and again at TakeOver: WarGames. WWE.com profiles are nice, but not the end all-be all. Vjmlhds (talk) 19:38, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

For what it's worth, they were listed under Performance Center Recruits before I moved them to NXT after it became apparent that they were becoming part of the brand via their association with Baszler and all the events I outlined above. Vjmlhds (talk) 19:47, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

I get your points, but I still feel it's premature. These tapings haven't even begun airing yet. It feels a bit WP:CRYSTAL to me IanPCP (talk) 22:05, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

As per WP:Spoiler, we can include things that are "in the can", but not yet aired (as long as there is a reference, which I have provided). It's like title changes that happen during TV tapings, but not yet aired - the matches happened, and we reflect that in the articles here...same idea with the Duke/Safir situation. Vjmlhds (talk) 00:33, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Sure thing re: WP Spoiler, but isn't this setting a precedent that we may not want to set? Do we want editors moving someone from the PC section to the NXT section whenever someone new seems to be featured prominently in taping reports? IanPCP (talk) 12:51, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

Happens all the time in ROH and Impact, when new people come in during TV tapings and they get added to the roster...same thing here. Nothing precedent setting about Duke/Shafir. Vjmlhds (talk) 15:28, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

The issue isn't WP:SPOILER or WP:CRYSTAL, the issue is WP:OR. You are drawing conclusions based on information you are see/reading. WP:PW/RS need to be used to identify them as on that brand. This is the issue with this page, it is full of people deciding when and where someone should move. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 16:33, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Galatz It would be nice if WWE gave some sort of Moses/10 Commandments style "Thou shalt..." announcement, but things rarely work that way. 99.9% of the time, you just have to use your eyes and your ears, and put 2 + 2 together...pretty much like how real life works. Vjmlhds (talk) 19:33, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Except on wikipedia putting 2+2 together is called WP:SYNTH and isn't allowed. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 12:18, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 December 2018

please add punishment martinez to the nxt men's roster. 76.102.40.147 (talk) 03:14, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

 Already done Listed under Performance Center recruits. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 03:34, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

WWE.com changes to 205 Live

I know the powers that be or claim to be in this section hate 205 Live so they'll discount this anyway, but WWE has finally separated their roster page. 205 Live stars are no longer listed with RAW with the exception of the Lucha House Party and Mustafa Ali for Smackdown. This includes Mike and Maria Kanellis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 00:53, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

I would say that this, definitively, means 205 Live should now be in its own separate section, with Lucha House Party under Raw (with a note that they also appear on 205) and Ali on SD (again, with a note) IanPCP (talk) 14:01, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

I certainly agree, but history tells me Galatz won't agree. He may be reasonable, we'll see. Slightly related, here's a WWE video where a WWE employee calls 205 Live the best brand of the year https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioqP0OoC17E and here's one where Mustafa Ali further refers to it as a brand https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aF3YU6kbK4 . I know that doesn't matter to a few, but any extra evidence stacking up can't hurt! And here's an article where it calls it a brand twice https://www.wwe.com/article/wwe-205-live-top-10-matches and another article from WWE.com where it's called a brand twice https://www.wwe.com/shows/wwe-205-live/2018-10-10 . Additionally, credible websites such as Ryan Satin's site and WWE Network News refer to it as a brand. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 07:27, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

This is WWE finally confirming that 205 Live is a separate brand. Someone should get around to making the 205 Live (WWE brand) page. - Mt.FijiBoiz

Agreed completely. But with so many things locked and hard work just auto reversed by certain people I can see why some are slow on the draw. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 20:08, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

I think by this point, with so many editors in agreement and tangible evidence from WWE, there shouldn't be an issue (knock on wood). Vjmlhds (talk) 23:30, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

You're probably right. While I feel and felt the old information was credible, Galatz did say he just wanted proper evidence. Now it should be sufficient. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 03:57, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

WWE has always listed them separately. But do you have any evidence that is a brand not a division? What is your WP:RS that this is a change. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 19:40, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

Galatz First things first, Merry Christmas, and I hope your holiday was a good one. Secondly, it just appears that you are waging a one man battle here - more and more editors are coming to the to the conclusion that 205 is its own entity (and providing evidence to back them up). Just looking at this thread, it's 4-1 in favor of making 205 it's own deal. Take it from someone who has been in your shoes - one man trying to fight "Wiki City Hall", when the consensus is going against him never ends well. Not issuing a threat or being combative, just speaking from experience...sometimes you just gotta take an "L" in order to save yourself some grief later on...nobody can win 'em all. Vjmlhds (talk) 20:19, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

Whilst WWE.com has always listed them separately, in the past EVERYONE who was listed as 205 Live would always be listed as Raw, and that is no longer the case. Hence the change IanPCP (talk) 22:24, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

Firstly, its not a !vote, so the quantities are not the thing to focus on. Second, you say they are providing evidence yet per WP:ONUS show me what means they are definitively a brand, and supported by a WP:RS. The only cruiserweight to show up on SmackDown is Mustafa Ali, who they clearly stated was definitely a SmackDown wrestler now. Yet there are multiple who appear on Raw regularly, yet still listed as 205 Live. Are they touring by themselves? What is this support that there has been a change other than WP:OR? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 23:00, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

Galatz I'm really starting to sense a little bit of WP:Own on your part. It almost feels like you are bound to be the last man standing at the Alamo. When you are telling 4 other editors to "show me", that comes across like you are trying to be judge, jury, and executioner...not a good look. Vjmlhds (talk) 23:31, 25 December 2018 (UTC)

Or more likely than you thinking that, you said more and more editors are coming to the to the conclusion that 205 is its own entity (and providing evidence to back them up) and I am asking you to support your stance. You said that people are coming and providing evidence, yet still the only "evidence" I see is the WWE.com bios. These bios do not say anywhere that it is a brand vs division. So all I am asking is for you to support your statement, that is a reasonable request. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 01:21, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

I linked to several places calling it a brand. It is also a division, just as NXT UK is called both a division and a brand. If you are hanging your hat on the division label also being used then NXT UK as a section has to be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 01:32, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Additionally, if they are no longer listed on RAW I can't see the argument of keeping them listed with RAW. Your only argument could be Drake, Lio, and LHP must appear there as they appear on TV. That's it. Otherwise, I think Ian, Vj, or Fiji may need to report this matter for further review as Galatz has had similar issues in the past. With proof mounting, holding onto it for the sake of 'winning' or ownership is doing the site a disservice. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 01:36, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Galatz IP 32 has provided evidence, and backed up by Fiji and Ian, and I tend to agree with them. You really are going down the road of "my way or the highway" here, and it is never a winning battle here on Wikipedia (BELIEVE ME...I have the battle scars to prove it). Don't try to be that "one righteous man" - all it will lead to is a block. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:43, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Here are some further links of non-primary sources referring to 205 Live as a brand: https://dailyddt.com/2018/10/11/buddy-murphy-right-205-live-wwes-best-brand/, the credible WWE Network News - https://www.wwenetworknews.com/2018/09/15/wwe-205-live-makes-highly-requested-day-and-timd-slot-change-on-wwe-network/, and Caged Side Seats https://www.cagesideseats.com/wwe/2018/10/10/17960506/latest-stars-wwe-moved-from-raw-to-205-live-spoilers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 04:22, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

And here is an interview with Ali away from the company's product where he refers to it as a brand: https://www.wrestlinginc.com/news/2018/12/mustafa-ali-talks-about-fans-leaving-wwe-205-live-before-648941/, you can also find the full audio. I propose if Galatz reverts edits again he should be reported. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 04:27, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Every single thing you have provided is not a WP:RS. Like I said, you cannot provide any that say it. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 14:23, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Also you NEVER make changes while conversation are happening, you guys have been around long enough to know that. Also per WP:CONSENSUS you need to try and reach everyone as much as possible to change a consensus yet this was brought up no where other than here. Also you only had this on discussion over Christmas, its pretty unlikely everyone would be able to participate over that time period. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 14:30, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

WWE has literally just acknowledge 205 Live as a brand in this tweet they posted today. https://twitter.com/WWE/status/1077957293482958848 - User:Mt.FijiBoiz

And as mentioned on ANI as well as here before they are clearly stated before that it is not. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 18:43, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Source where WWE has stated it is NOT a brand. Not where they also called it a division, but where they said it isn't a brand? The closest thing you have is RAW 'winning' and retaining the brand over two years ago now. NXT UK is called a division too, so you cannot rely on that wording unless you remove both. Does wikipedia only account for news two years and older now? Any chances since apparently don't count?

We have provided enough proof it is. Prove it is not a brand or the changes will continue to occur and you changing them will resort in a report. Support your work. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 20:54, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

It's pretty obvious that things have changed and "before" no longer applies. oknazevad (talk) 21:01, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Indeed. However, if he can provide proper evidence let him. He always asks for it but doesn't provide anything himself. The baseless claim WWE outright said 205 Live isn't a brand has never happened. He 2+2'd it, which he himself has criticized in the past. As NXT UK has proven, a division and brand are not mutually exclusive and thus his argument falls apart. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 21:04, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

(edit conflict)That might be the case, but the sweeping changes that were done were completely wrong. For example, changing events branded specifically as a Raw branded event, cannot be considered a dual brand event, yet that happened. If it is a brand, what is the start date? Clearly the WWE in March 2018 did not consider it a brand, based on pg 8 (14 of the PDF) [13], when it says it had 3 brands. Or according to this edit December 23, 2018 is the date [14]. There still is no 205 Live branded tours or anything similar to that. So other than a tweet, which if WWE is the entire basis of it, means that it fails WP:SELFSOURCE (see last bullet point). There are no WP:SECONDARY sources supporting it. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 21:10, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

@32.213.93.209: Per WP:ONUS I do not need to prove that it is not a brand, you need to prove that it is. That is like me telling you to prove to me that Mars is not a star, you cannot come up with a source specifically saying it isn't a star because there is no reason anyone would need to have one, but if you wanted that, the onus is on you to prove it. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 21:13, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Here are three WP:RS that refer to 205 Live as a brand: https://www.cbssports.com/wwe/news/triple-h-explains-the-back-to-basics-approach-that-has-saved-wwes-205-live/ (CBS), https://www.pwtorch.com/site/2018/09/15/wwe-announces-205-live-will-move-to-wednesday-nights-ahead-of-nxt-starting-this-week-w-heydorns-analysis/ (Pro Wrestling Torch), and https://prowrestling.net/site/2018/02/28/02-28-moores-wwe-205-live-audio-review-roderick-strong-vs-kalisto-tjp-vs-cedric-alexander-wwe-cruiserweight-title-tournament-second-round-matches-general-manager-drake-maverick-discusses-h/ (ProWrestling.net) - Mt.FijiBoiz 21:13, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

The CBS link does not refer to it as a brand at all, in fact the opposite, it mentions '205 Live' cruiserweight division. The word brand appears three times in that article, the first in reference to Raw, the second into how they branded the show, and the other two in reference to NXT. You are correct about the PW Torch article, and PW.net is not a RS. So those sources support both my stance that it is just a division and the other yours. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 21:47, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

I think we disagree on what WP:ONUS actually is. To me, it looks like it's referring to whether or not accurate/verified information is worthy of warranting inclusion. NOT about whether something actually is accurate or otherwise. IanPCP (talk) 21:51, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Firstly Galatz you are misinterpreting WP:ONUS. Secondly, CBS does refer to 205 Live as a brand ("a [cruiserweight] branded show"). You're being a contrarian. - Mt.FijiBoiz 21:51, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Also, 205 Live can be a brand and a division. 205 Live is a cruiserweight-exclusive brand and home of WWE's cruiserweight division. Just like NXT UK is a brand and home to WWE's United Kingdom division. - Mt.FijiBoiz 21:51, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

I am not misreading anything. Firstly, you want it listed as its own brand on this page, you have still not tried to gain a broader consensus outside of the people who follow this page on an over arching change, which you are required to do (such as alerting the wikiproject). You want it included that CWs are listed as a brand, not a division of Raw, so yes the onus is on you to verify that it is a fact. And you are completely misreading what a branded show means, its like saying Evolution was a women's branded show, it doesn't mean that women have their own brand. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 22:12, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Incorrect, Galatz. YOU are stating 205 Live is not a brand despite evidence to the contrary. Thus you must provide evidence to back up your stance. You have not provided adequate proof besides 2+2. As for no live events, that isn't really a good argument anyway since NXT UK doesn't have live event tours outside of their TV either. And live events are not what qualifies as a brand. Again, you're 2+2ing. You have to have definitive proof that argues all the proof we've provided that WWE now considers 205 Live a brand. If you do not have it, you do not get your way. It's that simple. It is a brand and unless you can source anything to discredit our numerous sources of different variety, then you cannot have your way. Refusal to accept this will lead to reports and your status will diminish as a result due to your ownership. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 22:16, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Galatz you are consistently moving the goal post. You have for some time. The more proof is provided the more you move it. You once asked for any example of WWE even calling it a brand. That lead to you bringing up the roster page. Now that has changed you wanted non WWE sources. We provided that as well and you moved to "division vs. brand" which we proved was incorrect. Now you're moving to live events. Stop changing the goal post. Ian, VJ, Fiji or Okna please report him. We can't have him disrupting this page forever. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 22:18, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Galatz, you are contradicting yourself now. YOU created the NXT UK (WWE brand) page as "United Kingdom (WWE brand)" when everyone thought it was solely a division because it was also a brand. Just like 205 Live is a brand and a division. - Mt.FijiBoiz 22:18, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

I have not changed any goal posts, scroll back through all of the old posts on the same topic, everything has been said consistently for as long as this has been discussed. I did provide evidence that the WWE in March said they only had 3 brands, in an official annual report. At that same time 205 Live had their own rosters, so nothing has changed. Yes I did create the UK brand, based on multiple sources calling it a brand, I have no diea what you are talking about everyone thinking it was just a division, I supported the page with sourcing calling it a brand. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 22:31, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Wrong, you have regularly changed it over the past discussions. inconsistent. 205 Live's roster was not separated on their page in March. It is different now, plus we have provided evidence of that. And correct, NXT UK is called a brand, but it is also called a division. Just as 205 Live is now called both. So if 205 Live isn't a brand, neither is NXT UK. If NXT UK is, so is 205 Live. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 22:38, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

Additionally, your source is inaccurate. The wording states that NXT is the third "touring brand", not the third brand, nor does it state there are only three brands. So even with your outdated information, you're incorrectly pulling your own narrative from it incorrectly. Never does it say 205 is not a brand or there are only three brands, just that at that time there were only three "touring brands". Nowhere does it state something has to tour on it's own to be a brand. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 22:43, 26 December 2018 (UTC) :

I am unable to add to the report against Galataz but please make note of what I said before regarding his source. He is 2+2ing. The proof he provides says there are three TOURING brands, not three brands only. Aside from it being outdated, it doesn't say 205 Live isn't a brand, simply that the other 3 mentioned are touring. Nowhere does it say a brand has to tour to be considered a brand.

And further more for one more bit of argument: I present the WWE ECW brand which existed from 2006 until 2010. From 2007 onward the brand did not tour nor did it have special events. In fact, it even had it's superstars appear on both RAW and Smackdown far more often than 205 has in 2018. To dispute 205 Live being a brand would be to dispute not just NXT UK is a brand but that ECW was a brand. Touring does not determine if something is a brand, and pushing the goalpost in that direction only further hurts your credibility. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.213.93.209 (talk) 23:36, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

I've had this same exact argument with Galatz in the past and here it is again with even more editors supporting 205 Live as a brand. Funny thing, when we had the argument, I provided evidence of WWE referring to it as a brand but he still would not accept it then, and as we can see, he still is not accepting of it now. Also, this is a case where a primary source trumps a secondary because the primary is the one who makes the distinction, not the secondary (WWE is the one who decides what is and isn't a brand, not any secondary source). There are plenty of primary sources (WWE) that refer to 205 Live as a brand. --JDC808 ♫ 01:38, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

I'd hate to disparage anyone but it's always seemed like he had a vendetta against 205 itself, and I may be incorrect but I feel he once openly admitted to not liking it but that may be misremembering, so please don't take it as fact. If nothing else, it's definitely ownership. Regardless, he's been warned for his actions and I suspect this change will last with other editors and mods having seen the discussion and not disagreeing while others flat out agree with us. At a certain point if Galatz keeps messing with articles incorrectly he'll be banned for it, so I'm sure he'll either learn his lesson or get punished. And again thanks to JTP for showing me how to apply a signature. 32.213.93.209 (talk) 02:37, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

In previous discussions, the earliest of which date back years at this point, I had been opposed to listing 205 Live as a brand. Based on this discussion, I think that evidence shows that WWE now recognizes this as a brand. Let's finally put this to bed please.LM2000 (talk) 05:55, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

LM2000 Consider it done. Vjmlhds (talk) 16:29, 28 December 2018 (UTC)

Reasoning for listing talent just once?

This isn't to stir some kind of debate or argument, but I'm curious: why? For example, Lucha House Party are considered both RAW and 205 Live members. Dakota Kai and British Strong Style are on WWE.com for both NXT and NXT UK. Wouldn't it be more simple just to list a wrestler in each section as opposed to just one and adding the note? And wouldn't that lead to a more accurate and clear list? I'm sure there's many who will look at one specific roster and see someone missing and not realize it. It just seems strange without knowing the reasoning. For example, Sami Callihan appears in both MLW and Impact, but he'll appear on both roster lists. They're different companies yes, but brands are meant to essentially operate similarly, so I'm just curious what the official reasoning behind the decision is. NotMyEditor (talk) 22:27, 29 December 2018 (UTC)

For one thing, it saves space. This article is big enough as it is, no reason to add unnecessary clutter. Secondly, it's redundant to have people listed multiple times in the same article. Regarding Sami Callihan - Impact and MLW are two separate companies, each with their own article...one has nothing to do with the other. Here, everybody in the article all work for the same company. Nothing more complicated than that...saves space and avoids redundancies. Vjmlhds (talk) 01:53, 30 December 2018 (UTC)

Jim Smallman / Glen Joseph / Jon Briley - NXT UK

Happy new year everyone. The three owners of Progress - Jim, Jon, Glen - have finally publicly acknowledged they work for NXT UK. All three of their Twitter bios now mention NXT UK in them. Glen specifies he's a "producer" but the other two don't mention job titles. So, my question is... how do we list them here? Under Producers? IanPCP (talk) 19:03, 1 January 2019 (UTC)

I'd go with that...even if publicly they only say they have "backstage jobs/roles", that's 99.9% of the time code for producer. Vjmlhds (tslk) 21:39, 1 January 2019 (UTC)

Whilst that is where I was leaning, it isn't completely supported by any sources. I'll add them for now, but if anyone finds a concrete source that says they are "producers" for "NXT UK" please add it! IanPCP (talk) 10:03, 2 January 2019 (UTC)

How many months do Tyler Bate and Trent Seven have to be off NXT TV before someone can move them to the NXT UK roster? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.113.63.135 (talk) 06:49, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

YouTube and Network shows

Is it really that important to put that a wrestler host a show on one of the platforms in the notes section?. It just looks really bad to me. Can someone explain why it is important to know that Bo Dallas has a cooking show or Baron Corbin has a ghost show? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.113.63.135 (talk) 06:52, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

I agree. Information like that would be best placed on the individual wrestler's page and seems unnecessary for this list IanPCP (talk) 13:56, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

It's incredibly obscure information that clutters the look of the page — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.113.63.135 (talk) 05:07, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

They gone. Vjmlhds (talk) 05:53, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

Looks so much better! Amazing! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.113.63.135 (talk) 06:12, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 12 January 2019

Change Sid Scala's real name to "Jonny Bailey". ZucavG (talk) 01:08, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 04:37, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

Would a Facebook profile be considered a reliable source? I'm a close personal friend of Sid.

ZucavG (talk) 17:44, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

 Not done for now: not unless it is a public profile and confirmed as his --DannyS712 (talk) 17:48, 12 January 2019 (UTC) DannyS712 (talk) 17:48, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

Okay. I'm not 100% on whether his profile is public or not, but here you go. If it turns out to be private, I will remove the link. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ZucavG (talk • contribs) 18:34, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

@ZucavG: The only public thing that is relevant is "Other names: Wee Man" so sorry but that isn't a reliable source to change his real name --DannyS712 (talk) 19:26, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

That's okay. Link has been removed. ZucavG (talk) 19:30, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

NXT UK / UK Performance Center

Hello all. Figured it would be good to try and reach a consensus on this asap. So... with the main NXT we tend to leave talents listed in the Performance Center section until they have a profile on wwe.com, and then we move them to the main NXT roster. I would suggest the same for NXT UK and the UK PC. Last night Kay Lee Ray and Jazzy Gabert were shown ringside and the announcers made mention of them competing in NXT UK in the future but - as they are yet to have wwe.com profiles - I've listed them in the UK PC section. Thoughts? IanPCP (talk) 12:20, 13 January 2019 (UTC)

Roster Brand

The Bella Twins is RAW, Kane is SmackDown, when this superstars become free agents? Cena & Taker its correct but the another 3??????? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2800:370:6F:8D90:B00B:FF5A:EA09:EAC4 (talk) 04:28, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion:

• McMahon Family.jpg

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 07:23, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

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Shane McMahon

Since Shane McMahon is now a champion, he automatically goes to the main roster, and stays there as long as he holds that shiny blue belt.

Once he drops the strap, he can go back from whence he came.

Vjmlhds (talk) 06:46, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

The Bellas

Why are the bellas listed on raw? They only returned for a short stint on raw just like Trish and lita. They haven’t appeared on raw for almost three months. They can go in unassigned wrestlers if they must be kept active... BIRCHJ (talk) 16:44, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

WWE.com has them listed on the Raw roster. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:44, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Kacy Catanzaro

If we're moving Kacy to NXT, shouldn't Xia Li be moved as well? IanPCP (talk) 16:26, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Jeff Jarrett

2 days running (Royal Rumble and this week's Raw) he has been attacked by Elias so it looks like he is feuding with Elias and also he is booked as a talent in addition to becoming a WWE Producer. Personally I feel that Jarrett should be moved to the Raw roster section as I don't see the rivalry ending any time soon especially as there is a high chance that he will most likely be on next week's Raw too. But so far his profile on WWE's website hasn't been moved into the Raw filter which is something that we need before moving him there. - 2A02:C7F:C243:E200:9DA1:6E99:706A:2D40 (talk) 11:02, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

WP:CRYSTAL and WP:OR. Nothing needs to be done yet. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 17:52, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

Eddie Dennis, Jordan Devlin, Kenny Williams and Tyson T-Bone all have Superstar bios on WWE's website.

Eddie Dennis, Jordan Devlin, Kenny Williams and Tyson T-Bone all have their own WWE Superstar bios on WWE's website under the NXT:UK filter and the All Superstars filter. https://www.wwe.com/superstars/eddie-dennis https://www.wwe.com/superstars/jordan-devlin https://www.wwe.com/superstars/kenny-williams and https://www.wwe.com/superstars/tyson-t-bone are the links to their WWE Superstar bios. - 2A02:C7F:C243:E200:B50A:7B34:F6FE:1564 (talk) 12:07, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

Amir Jordan and James Drake also have their own WWE Superstar bios on WWE's website under the NXT:UK filter and the All Superstars filter. https://www.wwe.com/superstars/amir-jordan and https://www.wwe.com/superstars/james-drake so the NXT UK Championship". WWE Network Exclusives. 145 minutes in. WWE Network. "Triple H bringing out the roster of NXT UK" reference can be changed removed for these 6 wrestlers and in the place can be included a reference that links to their WWE Superstars bios. - 2A02:C7F:C243:E200:7CEA:48B7:D7EB:6F00 (talk) 19:40, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

Xia LI

The Chinese female athlete Xia Li should be moved because she has already appeared on WWE NXT (NXT TV) in a dark match against Lacey Evans. She also appeared at the Royal Rumble with the rest of the NXT wrestlers present for this match, so if you do it for Kacy Catanzaro done the same with Xia Li, please she deserves it. 2A02:2788:6E4:15B:68:35A5:5B09:6CD1 (talk) 21:50, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. – Jonesey95 (talk) 08:22, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

I do not understand why Kacy Catanzaro was moved to WWE NXT roster so being on the list and not Xia Li? Explain to me knowing she has never appeared on television. It should also change this change so put it in the list of WWE NXT roster. She faced Mia Yim, which will be broadcast in the coming weeks. https://www.f4wonline.com/wwe-news/nxt-tv-taping-spoilers-possible-title-change-275846 https://www.pwtorch.com/site/2019/01/31/1-30-nxt-tv-taping-results-spoilers-more-fluid-segments-veteran-wrestler-references-other-options-alternate-endings-filmed-for-main-event/ https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:List_of_WWE_personnel&action=submit

2A02:2788:6E4:15B:25D6:EBB9:F7E1:681F (talk) 23:34, 2 February 2019 (UTC)

McMahons

Just to set the record straight, the McMahons are in their own section because they own the company, and are the authority figures across Raw and SD.

Shane got moved to SD due to winning the title, and will go back once he loses it.

Thank you.

Vjmlhds (talk) 14:41, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

All McMahon family members are involved in each brand in a different capacity (e.g., Triple H also being a producer of NXT). However, if placing them in their own section regardless of this is what's most concise, then there's no reason for one member to be separated due to their larger involvement pertaining to one brand. This is why putting them all in the unassigned section is the most accurate. Additionally, per WWE.com, all four McMahon family members are listed under current roster, Raw, and SmackDown; deviating from this would be original research. Cheers, all! DantODB (talk) 14:49, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

@NotTheFakeJTP: @IanPCP: @NotMyEditor: @Galatz: @ClassicOnAStick: @Boogiesgonnagetya: @HHH Pedrigree: My apologies for pinging, but feel free to chime in as well! Thanks! DantODB (talk) 15:00, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

I was never happy with them having their own section, so I don't really have a dog in this fight. Sorry! IanPCP (talk) 20:28, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

Maybe the best would be their own section. They are not really unassigned, they are assigned to every show indefinitely. As for Shane being on the SmackDown roster I do not think that's right, he should be with the rest of them. Additionally, I agree with unassigned being moved up as User: KyleJoan was attempting to do. STATic message me! 23:07, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

I agree. They aren't unassigned, so why put them there? JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 23:57, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

I guess my point was that since they are technically assigned to all of the brands, by default, they would be considered unassigned at the same time since it is not just a particular one. I agree that if the McMahons have their own sections, Shane should stay within it no matter which brand he is most involved in. Re @IanPCP: Would you agree that they should be considered unassigned personnel? Thanks all! KyleJoan (talk) 05:04, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

I agree. I think the McMahon in their own section is fine, since they appear in both brands. Also, I think Shane should be included, he is not a SD exclusive even as a Champion. He can be in his own section as SD Tag Champion. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 16:24, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

@KyleJoan: I'm still not sure what I think is best, just that I was never convinced by them needing their own section. IanPCP (talk) 18:18, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

The McMahons are a special case, they own the company, they're on-air authority figures, they produce the shows, they wrestle, and may even sweep the floor after the show for all we know...can't really pigeonhole them into one category. Thus since they are the omnipotent everything within WWE, putting them in their own section makes the most sense. I only put Shane on SD because the tag champs should be listed together, but that's not something I'm gonna fight to the death over. Vjmlhds (talk) 21:30, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

there should be no "special cases" or "exceptions" making them one off is called WP:OR. They should be just in the generic category, whether holding a title or not. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 21:47, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

The read I'm getting here from all the comments is McMahons in their own section - OK (by and large)...Shane on SD - not so much. I can live with that. Like I said, the only reason I moved Shane was due to the title, but if the gallery thinks it unnecessary, then I'll accept that (besides, it'll probably be a moot point shortly anyway...I don't see Miz and Shane as long term champions - but that's for a different venue). Vjmlhds (talk) 18:07, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Real Names section

There doesn't seem be consistency with this section. Some wrestlers have their full names listed (eg. Andrade), others have their names listed excluding their middle name (eg. Kalisto) /first name (eg. Bobby Lashley), others have suffixes added "II", "Jr" (Big Show, Velveteen Dream) etc. I would suggest for consistency that all wrestler's real names are listed in full in the Real Name section. Before making any additions I'd like to throw it out here for some additional opinions/views. Thoughts? BBX118 13:51, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

Looks consistent to me; all the names seems to be first name / last name, and nothing else. Andrade's name follows Spanish-language naming customs, wherein Manuel is the first name, and Andrade and Oropeza are both surnames; similar to a double-barrelled surname in English-language customs. As for Lashley, apparently Bobby is his middle name, so his real name should be listed as Franklin Lashley. IanPCP (talk) 00:15, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

As for suffixes - Jr, II, etc - they're only listed where appropriate, and following the first name and the last name IanPCP (talk) 00:16, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

Lio Rush

He has been removed from the 205 Live intro and tweeted signifying he's strictly apart of RAW now, however he still appears on the outdated WWE.com roster page (along with Ali). NotMyEditor (talk) 20:11, 14 February 2019 (UTC)

This is the tweet he is referring to I am assuming. If he is on the Raw roster page I feel like we should remove him from 205 if he is done appearing there. StaticVapor message me! 20:33, 14 February 2019 (UTC)

Already done. I put Rush on the main roster, as he really isn't a manager, but a flunky (just like the Singhs are for Jinder Mahal). Truth be told, there are really no pure traditional "managers" in WWE (outside of Paul Heyman) - it's either female wrestlers "standing by their man" (Lana/Naomi/Carmella), or lower tier guys being flunkies for the bigger stars (Singhs/Rush). Vjmlhds (talk) 21:35, 14 February 2019 (UTC)

In fact, several sources say Rush is Lashley's manager. [15] [16] [17] --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 23:24, 14 February 2019 (UTC)

Manager just has a very liberal definition these days, I guess. But he clearly isn't the prototype, old school, just stand at ringside type of yesteryear. Vjmlhds (talk) 23:38, 14 February 2019 (UTC)

I know. It's different from the times of Blassie, Heenan, Hart... times change, there is a few "pure managers", but sources say he is Lashleys manager (in fact, his role is similar to Heyman, appears, uses the mic) --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 23:48, 14 February 2019 (UTC)

I hear you. Just I think the term is used too loosely, but the sources are what they are. Vjmlhds (talk) 00:13, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

Batista

Hi. I saw Batista made his return and PWInsider says he will appear next monday. However, I think he should be as Unassigned, not RAW. He made two appearances, but he is not assigned to RAW brand. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 15:19, 28 February 2019 (UTC)

This is why I originally removed him when he was added right after Raw. However, PWI is saying he will be on Raw next week, and he did not appear on SD this week. Who knows if WWE will update their roster page to include him. What did we do when Goldberg or Sting came back? I assume they only/mainly appeared on Raw too. StaticVapor message me! 20:02, 28 February 2019 (UTC)

Goldberg went to Raw (which became fait accompli anyway when he won the Universal Title). Sting went on the main roster (there was no brand split then, so that was an easy decision). I'd just leave him on Raw, as it's very obvious they're building up to a Mania match with HHH, and Raw is the show where that match is being built up. Vjmlhds (talk) 00:18, 1 March 2019 (UTC)

I don't remember who, but some user changed Kane to Unassigned since "he just appears where he is necessary for the storyline". However, Batista in RAw is just a minor question, I just wanted to know your opinions. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 10:14, 1 March 2019 (UTC)

New PC signees

WWE.com StaticVapor message me! 01:21, 12 March 2019 (UTC)

Piper Niven

Piper Niven made her NXT UK debut at the last set of tapings. Should be moved to female uk performace center roster — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.176.89 (talk) 16:40, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

Can you provide a reliable source that says she's signed? Her appearing at the tapings - even if she was wearing an NXT UK t-shirt - doesn't count IanPCP (talk) 17:38, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

"After the bell, as Ripley insisted that she was still the most dominant women in NXT UK, she was suddenly interrupted in stunning fashion by Piper Niven! The first-ever NXT UK Women’s Champion chose to exit the ring, as Niven climbed through the ropes and asserted that her arrival signals that Ripley is no longer the most dominant women in the brand." https://www.wwe.com/shows/nxtuk/2019-3-27 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.176.89 (talk) 03:05, 28 March 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

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Question

Is Becky Lynch Raw and Smackdown Women's Champion or are you going to edit this after the unification of both the title Bikrambhawan (talk) 12:23, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

It wasn't a unification. They are still two separate titles, they just have the same holder. IanPCP (talk) 19:20, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

When to move someone from PC to NXT?

I'd always thought the consensus was to keep someone in the Performance Centre section until they were established enough on television to have a wwe.com profile page. In fact, there's a note at the start of the NXT section of the page that states:

Do not add wrestlers to this section until they are listed on WWE.com, they should be added to 'Performance Center recruits' section until then

So? What's the correct approach? I'm happy to go with whatever, but if we've decided to ditch the requirement for a wwe.com profile, we need to remove the note on the page.

Thanks everyone IanPCP (talk) 22:38, 21 April 2019 (UTC)

If they start appearing on TV, then they should be moved up. It's a 3-step process in WWE - PC--->NXT--->main roster. Once someone starts appearing in NXT, then they have moved on from the PC. Not necessary to overthink things or throw in a million "Yeah, but..." qualifiers. Vjmlhds (talk) 14:53, 22 April 2019 (UTC)

I tend to disagree, as WWE/NXT has a habit of using someone as a jobber before they make their 'proper' début; such as "Patrick Clark" and "Velveteen Dream Patrick Clark" before we got the proper début of "The Velveteen Dream". If we're just going by someone making an appearance on TV, then we should move Adrian Jaoude, Eric Bugenhagen, Dan Matha, Stacey Ervin Jr, and probably some others as they've all made TV appearances. Several in Jaoude's case. IanPCP (talk) 00:15, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

It should be once they wrestle for NXT in a non-jobber roll. I think Punishment Martinez should br moved down. He has only been used as a jobber and has not wrestled on the recent tv tapings. Eric Bugenhagen has debuted on tv in a non-jobber role and Kushida debuted at the last tv tapings (match airs it two weeks). So those two should be good to move up. StaticVapor message me! 01:04, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

Define "non jobber role" though. Isn't this why we had the wwe.com bio requirement to avoid arguments? Also, if someone has a match on the tapings - but it hasn't aired yet - should they be moved? Technically speaking, their matches could get canned before the show airs so it could be considered WP:CRYSTAL to move them before their matches make TV. IanPCP (talk) 10:08, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

Yeah, whichever way we go we have to be consistent. I think the 'non-jobber' role would entail either getting a win or appearing in their own vignette/angle. ItChEE40 (talk) 11:24, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

Yeah that is what I was thinking ItChEE40. Non-jobber role is exactly how it is described. They would have to get a win/vignette/angle. For example, Kushida goes up since he wrestled at the taping and they are advertising the match airing. They have been notoriously slow on updating the roster, and we need not follow the primary source. An example of staying down would be Albert Hardie Jr.. He wrestled on World's Collide, he performed well and it was a competitive match. Same thing with Punishment Martinez (until his new look debuts on tv that is), assuming he is not in a non-winning jobber role still. With these guys, they wrestled few competitive matches on WWE television, but clearly not part of the active television roster yet. StaticVapor message me! 03:54, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

The page itself still has an issue with relying on primary sources, so establishing our own rule like that would go towards fixing that. ItChEE40 (talk) 05:57, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

"but clearly not part of the active television roster yet" surely without a source that indicates whether someone is "active television roster" or not, this would just be WP:OR? IanPCP (talk) 13:53, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

Negative. Sources indicating that they are appearing consistently at television tapings makes them a brand member. All the advanced PC people also perform at live events as "NXT", so calling anyone an NXT roster member would not be OR. I am sure just about every NXT roster member spends sometime at the PC, so the only alternative option to making a "rule", would be to just combine the two of them into one NXT section. StaticVapor message me! 18:26, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

Dain and Breeze

I support this edit. Dain did not wrestle at these NXT tapings so it is just Meltzers word at this point. Breeze has more reason to move, but he is still listed on Raw on wwe.com. Probably just there till Dango is good to go. We could note that he also appears on NXT. StaticVapor message me! 03:39, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Nikki Cross (just like Dain's aledged move to NXT) was moved to Raw on Wikipedia based on Meltzer's word. There is people thinking that Cross could be the witch even though her WWE Superstar bio has no brand on it. Rememeber there is a white witch on NXTUK by the name of Isla Dawn whom just like Nikki Cross is also Scotish and Dawn could easily be the witch instead. It is possible the Lake of Inreincarnation healed/cursed Bray Wyatt with white magic. When people think of White Magic at least in videogames they think of Divine Magic.

Bray Wyatt's Firefly Funhouse promos have been airing on both Raw and SmackDown and even though his Superstar bio still says Raw it doesn't mean that might not be moved to SmackDown once his promos finish. All alledged moves are rumours until they actually happen and Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. - 2A02:C7F:C25A:A200:CDA6:3A85:AF25:233 (talk) 09:17, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Wrestling Observer is considered a reliable source, so if something is reported there, it can be relayed to Wikipedia. WWE.com profiles are nice, but not the end all be all, since they do things on TV time, and not real time...that's why we have secondary sources. Vjmlhds (talk) 12:18, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Just because something is generally considered a reliable source, does not mean we follow their WP:CRYSTALBALLing. This is a list of current active rosters, in their current states (not future states). So at this point Dain is not on the NXT roster, he is not on their live events, did not wrestle at the tapings and his wwe.com still says SmackDown. So until we have one of those things, we do not move him. StaticVapor message me! 13:26, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Agreed. When ESPN says "Player XYZ will be traded from Team A to Team B, which will be announced tomorrow." If you go to Player XYZ's page, he is listed on Team A's page until the deal is finalized and announced. I don't know anyone says ESPN is not a RS, yet they are not used for these sort of things. I see no reason why WWE should treat this differently than how MLB articles do. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 13:40, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Yeah I see no reason to jump the gun, but some people just can't wait and find out. They would rather Wikipedia be possibly factually incorrect... StaticVapor message me! 14:32, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

I'd say brand moves are covered by this line from WP:CRYSTAL - Avoid predicted sports team line-ups IanPCP (talk) 23:46, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

Noam Dar

Unrelated, but instead of making a new topic, do you folks feel Noam Dar should still have 'appears on 205 Live'? While it looks like he is indeed moving brands, he's still in the 205 Live intro for now. He could be considered apart of both.NotMyEditor (talk) 22:38, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

I did break it out since I want to avoid confusion for others. He is now NXT UK full time, and has moved back there. See [18] - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 22:51, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

Not for nothing, but the article says he will be NXT UK full time but for now remains on 205 until that's done. His potential injury only adds to it being messy I suppose. NotMyEditor (talk) 23:10, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

Update, he has appeared on 205 Live once again. Time to edit NotMyEditor (talk) 03:01, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

Nikki Cross

Hey so I saw some videos of Nikki with raw superstars before the wild card happened so can you put nikki cross to raw https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A08tciCqtZY https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka3NYb3vOKI https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=98ggcrqOEbI The Awesome Guy in the world (talk) 07:01, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Beth Phoenix

Pretty sure Beth should be removed from the Raw women's roster. It appears her return was just for WrestleMania and she does not appear as an active WWE superstar on WWE.com — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.38.209.220 (talk) 12:49, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

I agree, she’s a commentator for NXT now and just finished up on the European tour. She is no longer an active wrestler. BIRCHJ (talk) 09:05, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

Talking Snack?

There's a typo in the article. :)

Just had a look at it, seems legit. Talking Snack. Greyjoy ^talk 06:54, 23 May 2019 (UTC)

Noam Dar Back on 205 Live

I said this prior but nobody commented. Noam Dar has been appearing on 205 Live again, and made it clear on TV he's on both brands. Perhaps edit the roster page to reflect he appears on both like LHP. NotMyEditor (talk) 02:29, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

Shadia Bseiso

Shadia Bseiso is still in WWE, she still has WWE in her biography and told a fan that she's still working on it!Unlike her husband who was fired a few weeks ago. 2A02:2788:6E4:15B:28FC:3F51:791:898 (talk) 06:11, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

She was removed from the Performance Center website list of talent, plus Squared Circle Sirens - which is incredibly reliable for female/developmental news - reported she was released http://squaredcirclesirens.com/shadia-bseiso-released-from-nxt/ IanPCP (talk) 12:38, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. NiciVampireHeart 12:50, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

Dolph Ziggler

Transferred to SD following the May 21st edition of SmackDown J-s-assassinator (talk) 06:51, 23 May 2019 (UTC)

Do you have a source to support this and that he wasn't a Wild Card? Based on [19] he is still on Raw. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 11:38, 23 May 2019 (UTC)

Ziggler is officially on Smackdown now according to WWE.com. https://www.wwe.com/superstars/dolph-ziggler --71.88.50.65 (talk) 23:47, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

Street Profits

Any idea if Street Profits are now on the Main Roster? They first appeared on WWE Main Roster TV on Raw yesterday before Braun made his entrance for Braun vs Lashley after The Undertaker Situation was shown on the screen at the rundown of the Raw card at the beginning of Raw before making more appearances on Raw later in the night. - 2A02:C7F:C25A:A200:E87C:57B6:91E9:2196 (talk) 08:09, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

I have not seen any WP:RS state that this was a call up. Dawkins profile still says NXT [20], but Ford's lists none [21]. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 13:23, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

Street Profits stay on NXT until something more definitive pops up. It's like what happened with Aliester Black, Ricochet, Lars Sullivan, and Lacey Evans prior to the Shakeup. Vjmlhds (talk) 13:50, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

Rhyno

WWE or not? I removed him as he literally appeared on the Impact PPV the other night, but someone has reverted the edit as Rhyno previously claimed his contract wasn't up until the 17th. Thoughts? IanPCP (talk) 18:31, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Rhyno has said that is when his contract is up. Impact did not say it was Rhyno and did not call his spear a Gore. Although it probably was him, I have no seen any RS confirm it was him, only assuming it was. Only definitive thing I have seen is that he says he is locked up until the 17th. Even if they gave him permission to appear early, it doesnt mean he isn't still locked in. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 18:58, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

How is this for a RS? Admittedly it is from before the show, but it does state he will be appearing https://www.pwinsider.com/article/127760/spoiler-backstage-at-slammiversary-is.html?p=1 IanPCP (talk) 22:37, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Thats exactly the issue. You need to WP:SYNTH that he was backstage and what happened to have a RS state it could have been him. But again, even if it was confirmed to be him, if his contract is not up until 7/17 he should still be listed here. They have had meetings about working with WWE more, which is covered by RS, so its possible WWE gave him permission to appear while still under contract. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 12:43, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Since we know he is under contract until the 17th, we should keep him until then. I have no problem with us removing him on midnight on July 17. He said that's the day his contract ends and he has not been on their roster page for months. StaticVapor message me! 22:36, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Its possible he lied about the date, but we don't know. Therefore I agree. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 11:14, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

According to Ryan Satin, Rhino was the one under the mask, but stills under contract with WWE. [22] --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 12:16, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

Cool, we'll keep him here until after the 17th. Thanks for the discussion everyone IanPCP (talk) 12:49, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 July 2019

Alicia Fox removed from raw superstars page BIRCHJ (talk) 11:00, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Melmann (talk) 11:27, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Alicia Fox

Dave Meltzer has confirmed that Alicia Fox is no longer an active wrestler on the roster. Needs to be removed from the raw roster BIRCHJ (talk) 10:41, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

@BIRCHJ: Please provide source - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 14:00, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

https://members.f4wonline.com/wrestling-observer-newsletter/july-29-2019-observer-newsletter-aew-announces-tv-details-more-97515

• This is what I found that relays what WON says. It says they are slowly moving her away from a wrestling role, while she will still remain under contract. So I am not sure what we should do. StaticVapor message me! 18:39, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

Malcolm Bivens / Stokely Hathaway real name

Any reason this was removed? IanPCP (talk) 19:28, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

Gallows and Anderson

Gallows and Anderson are Raw Tag Champions tho WWE Personnel main page says The Revival still.

Taken care of. Vjmlhds (talk) 23:39, 2 August 2019 (UTC)

Chad Gable

Please stop moving Gable to 205 Live, as he is still an SD guy.

Yes he's been on 205 Live lately, but he is part of the blue brand's roster.

It's like with the Lucha Dragons...they pop up on 205 Live now and again, but they are officially Raw guys.

Same applies to Gable - officially SD, does 205 on the side.

Galatz is correct on this one.

Vjmlhds (talk) Vjmlhds 14:19, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

I'm not sure if I agree with this regarding Lucha House Party. They appear on both. Chad Gable had appearances but was never considered apart of the roster. Lucha House Party are considered part of both brands, like Noam Dar. NotMyEditor (talk) 11:00, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

Drake Maverick

As long as Maverick has the 24/7 Title (or any title) he goes on the roster.

Real simple concept we've been following for over a decade - when you have a championship, it makes you a wrestler by default, and any other role (manager, authority figure, announcer, or whatever) takes a back seat - long story short...belt > anything else.

It's been how we've done things since this style of format was put together over a decade ago.

Thank You.

Vjmlhds (talk) 13:46, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

Just because WP:OR has been used in the past for editing, does not mean it should continue to be used. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 14:31, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

Holding a title doesn't change his job. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 23:24, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

Kinda does actually. It gives him a whole other job in defending the title. People can have 2 jobs you know. If you look at it that way, it's a matter of what takes priority - his job as being a champion, or his job in running 205 Live. Whatever else he has going on, if he has a belt, that should take priority as far as his listing goes, as champions are presented as being the top level performers...otherwise why bother with belts. Look at HHH when he won the WWE Title in the 2016 Royal Rumble...he had been an authority figure up to that point, but once he won the belt, that became the top priority. It's the old "walk and chew gum" theory. You can be a wrestler and whatever other role. Only thing is, once you have a championship, the wrestler part should then come first. Vjmlhds (talk) 12:05, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

Does winning a championship make you a wrestler or switch rosters

This has been disputed several times recently, so I am starting an official RFC on the matter. Does Shane McMahon winning the SmackDown Tag Team Championship mean he becomes an active roster participant rather than administrative role? Does Drake Maverick winning the WWE 24/7 Championship mean that he is now a 205 wrestler rather than GM? Does Becky Lynch winning the Raw Women's Championship mean that she is a Raw wrestler while still being listed as SmackDown on WWE.com?

Does winning a championship make you a wrestler? Should a wrestler winning a different brand's championship mean they should switch brands? In short, does winning a championship dictate your placement, or should it just be included as a note. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 16:19, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

• No - In my opinion moving someone based solely on a championship is WP:OR. Especially the 24/7 championship, in which you can pin someone while they are asleep on a plane, should not dictate that they are a wrestler. We need independent WP:RS to state they are now a wrestler. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 16:19, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

• • They who hold a title are wrestlers by default. And if anybody is looking for Moses to come down on Mt. Sinai to officially declare if someone is a wrestler will be waiting until they're dead. There are no "official declarations" if someone is a wrestler. Not everything is black and white/cut and dry in life - sometimes you just have to make judgement calls. And longstanding policy has always been to put champions on the roster, as the belt takes priority, and everything else becomes window dressing - not seeing the issue. Vjmlhds (talk) 16:27, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
    • Please link to this longstanding policy has always been to put champions on the roster. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 16:31, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

Archives only go back to 2011, and we've been doing this since 2008. Just something we've always done, and it's never been an issue until you came along, which makes me think you are just looking to pick a fight. Vjmlhds (talk) 16:54, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

As I have pointed out to you multiple times in multiples places, I am not even the one who started this discussion. You mentioned POLICY, not just how things have been done. There is a huge difference. - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 18:30, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

• Making you a wrestler, no. the article is listed by their job, not if they win a title. renee young works as commentator. If she wins the 24/7, doesn't make her a wrestler, just a commentator who won a title. About brand switch, I think it's the same. Lynch stills a SD wrestler, just with a RAW belt. If WWE confirms a brand switch (like Edge winning the WHC), it's OK. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 18:28, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
• You are mixing things up. First it's about Shane being listed as a wrestler, not an executive - then it's about brands. Could you please clarify what you are asking for comments on? Because right now I cannot say Yes or No as there are two questions there. MPJ-DK (talk) 10:34, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
  • When Shane won the SD Tag Team title in January, he was an authority figure, not a wrestler. However, Vjmlhds put him as wrestler during his title reign and back to AF after his title lost. Same with Maverick, he is the 205Live GM, but he changed him to wrestler when he won the 24/7. Galatz is asking about this moves. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 11:56, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
    • @MPJ-DK: Yeah, there are two different situations that are related. Basically does a championship dictate your placement? Does winning the other brands cause you to move? Does a non wrestler winning cause them to move to being a wrestler.
    • Shane's role is purely on screen, so he's not "an executive" which is where the discussion loses me. MPJ-DK (talk) 17:30, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
      • @MPJ-DK: Drake Maverick is on air as a GM of 205 Live. Shane is an on air authority figure across brands. Does either one of them winning a championship make them a wrestler over an authority figure? - Galatz גאליץ^{שיחה Talk} 18:03, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
        • Simplified like that I will go with No. MPJ-DK (talk) 20:50, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

It's not a matter of either/or. You can be a wrestler and whatever other role. People can and do have 2 jobs sometimes. Only thing is, once a title comes into play, the wrestler part then gets priority - again, I cite HHH winning the 2016 Royal Rumble and becoming WWE Champion. Look at Major League Baseball - as recently as the late 1980s, Pete Rose was a player/manager for the Cincinnati Reds (the reason you don't see player/managers these days is that the players' union frowns upon guys double dipping - they look at it as one less guy having a job). Could anyone say Rose wasn't a player in those days? Of course not...he was a manager who also played. Same thing applies here. HHH, Maverick, or whoever else comes down the line are authority figures who also wrestle. Vjmlhds (talk) 12:18, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

I do not think we should move people to the wrestlers section just because they win a comedy championship. StaticVapor message me! 02:40, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

It was discussed several months ago, they wrestled sporadicaly, their main role in the promotion is other. Winning a comedy title doesn't change the fact hat their primary role in the promotion is in Backstage (HHH) and General Manager. If Renne Young wins the title, it doesn't mean she is a wrestler, just a commentator who wins a title. It's not AEW, where Cody and the Bucks wrestle and work in backstage, HHH barely wrestle and Maverick had just 6 matches in his 3 years with the promotion.--HHH Pedrigree (talk) 12:00, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

NXT

As documented by two sources I provided, Raw, SD, and NXT are considered WWE's 3 major global brands, with the first 2 being the flagships. The 205 and UK brands do not have those designations, thus are below the other three.

No OR here, it's all documented by 2 sources (1 primary, 1 secondary, both reliable).

Vjmlhds (talk) 23:30, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

How in the world is 205 below NXT UK? Are we forgetting that the Cruiserweight Championship is defended on most main roster PPVs, while NXT championships are not. Throughtout it's history it has been a step up from NXT, as people move up to 205 such as Lio Rush and Buddy Murphy. Due to NXT still not being main roster, I don't know why it's being placed above. StaticVapor message me! 00:35, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Yeah, 205 Live being below NXT can be argued but for now, it being belong UK seems messy. It also is just a messier organization. But I can see the argument since NXT is bigger. NotMyEditor (talk) 04:18, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

Yeah they have a television deal, but keep in mind 205 Live tours with the main roster (SmackDown) and performs in front of the mainstream WWE crowd. As well as its championship being defended at just about every main roster pay per view. At this time NXT is still gonna be a developmental brand and is gonna be filmed in front of 500 people at Full Sail. It's not gonna kill me if NXT is higher, but having 205 at the bottom makes no sense to me. Currently 205 is more intertwined with RAW/SD than NXT is. StaticVapor message me! 05:04, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

I have bumped 205 up the the #4 spot. It is more established than the UK brand and has been on PPV (mostly pre-shows to be honest, but still...) I don't think that there should be any question that NXT is #3 - WWE says that itself ("3rd global touring brand"), and it's clearly being positioned for bigger things with the USA deal, but I'll give you that 205 should be #4 over the NXT UK. BTW, being at Full Sail doesn't mean it's STILL developmental...how long did NWA/WCW use Center Stage Theater in Atlanta for the Saturday Night show? Or TNA/Impact using Universal Studios (Impact Zone)? Vjmlhds (talk) 11:50, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 August 2019

List of WWE Personel 19:32, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. aboideau^talk 19:35, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

Angel Garza and Isaiah "Swerve" Scott

Any idea if Angel Garza and Isaiah "Swerve" Scott are now on the Main Roster? They first appeared on WWE Main Roster TV on 205 live (talk) 17:59, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

"Main Roster" is kind of a nebulous term these days. Truthfully only die hard, grasping at straws purists think NXT isn't now main roster after the USA announcement. 205 Live is really a niche brand for wrestlers of a specific weight class. The Lucha House Party crew and Chad Gable are guys who do 205 on the side in addition to their official Raw/SD designations. I'd say Garza and Scott are in that boat as well - primarily NXT wrestlers who do 205 on the side. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:33, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

No official move yet, we will have to see what happens in the coming weeks. StaticVapor message me! 05:27, 27 August 2019 (UTC)