User talk:Vettakkorumakansnehi

Sitush is playing a game and he has no intention to let you do anything. Good luck! You are going to give up too or get banned by one of his admin friends. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.230.129.67 (talk) 15:05, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hello. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. You could also click on the signature button or located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your username or IP address and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when they said it. Thank you. --SineBot (talk) 20:30, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

Hello, Vettakkorumakansnehi, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for registering an account. I hope you like the place and decide to stay.   Introduction  5   The five pillars of Wikipedia   How to edit a page   Help   Tips   How to write a great article   Manual of Style   Be Bold   Assume Good faith   Get adopted

If you need help, ask me on my talk page, or get instant online help at IRC. You can also place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will come shortly to answer your questions.

Anna Frodesiak (talk) 11:53, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Help request

How can I achieve NPOV with a dominant user (a roll-backer but not the page administrator) of a protected article suspected to be exhibiting characteristics described in WP:OWN ?. Efforts on talk page for consensus-building is being converted to filibustering , moving goal points or ad hominem. Invitations on user talk pages is being evaded. What is a practical solution ? Vettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 18:02, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

See WP:Dispute resolution and WP:Requesting dispute resolution. JohnCD (talk) 18:15, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

Third opinion

Hi there. I saw you left a request recently for a third opinion. Before I chime in, would you mind editing your request to comply with the WP:3O guidelines? Specifically, you need to ensure that the request does not argue for against either point, but rather gives a very brief summary of each side's point of view. Thanks. — Bdb484 (talk) 18:44, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

I donot know if the existing request has any relevance now because the opposing user keeps removing it from the relevant talk section !!! since i did not want to get in to an edit war, i thought it might best be ignored. Would you advice a different course of action ? or do you think what i did was appropriate ? Vettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 18:58, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

I have provided my opinion as per your request, although i am not very positive about its outcome because the non-consenting user definitely discredits 3O (and his talk history exhibits characteristics described in WP:OWN and WP:GAME). Anyways thanks for the try.Vettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 20:19, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

I am sorry to see User:Sitush bury you with his mastery of wikipedese and his network of buddies among the admins here. I truly appreciate what you are trying to do there and I apologize for my sarcastic tone earlier.

But frankly, I think it's impossible to move forward any argument when User:Sitush is involved. He/She will get the way.

I wish you all the best. Check out Admin:Savio's page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.231.65.124 (talk) 15:25, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

I dont even know who u are and even if u were sarcastic !!! Forgiven....no probs... :-)....oh no...i admire and respect User: Sitush...i think he is a great editor and has kept caste related articles free from caste-warriors. I have even agreed with him on previous occassions. I apply the same rules for me and other users. If i am wrong i must be challenged because its not the "user" that matters but the "article" that matters. Otherwise wikipedia as a project will fail in its objectives. VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 15:34, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Well, I had posted something sarcastic (or I thought) at the top of your Talk page. Forgive me again but this time for not knowing where to post on a given Talk page. Anyway, it's good that you didn't see it.

Well, a lot of things on Talk:Nair page is becoming garbage. So, the Nairs are now trouble-makers now not a militia caste/group whatever lol! It's all a long Orientalist slagging of Indian castes. You may admire him but I don't and I suspect he is of Indian-origin and has experience with living or working closely with Indians. He is clearly biased. Also, it's funny to see the Ezhava caste being glorified while the Nair community is being slagged.

This is what wikipedia has become.. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.231.65.124 (talk) 16:06, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

I understand that the Nair-Ezhava tension has a historical root in Kerala.But then as independent wikipedia articles - they must be treated seperately and objectively otherwise users can have what is called "spill over" when discussing things in different pages. This is very bad. Casteism is black mark on Indian history. If users become possessed with caste feeling while editing articles..the cause is almost certainly lost. I dont think he is biased in a casteist way. He has a great sense of objectivity, which i appreciate very much...but then then objectivity also has problems associated with it. We all tend to understand things we read in the way we want to understand them - psychologists call this confirmation bias. All of us have it...we just have to fight it out of us. While discussing topics..ego is a bad thing...just put the ego in the bin while discussing and keep an open mind that even ur opponent could have a point - then all is well :-)) If i am wrong ..i have no probs to apologize..i think it makes me not a lesser one.. but dont get me wrong..u must make a user account...its better :-) VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 16:29, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Casteism may have been a blackmark on Indian history though the consequent fractured society ensured that Indian culture was not completely obliterated through mass conversion like in other parts of the world. But that is all another discussion. I am not defending or justifying the casteist past and I think the record of casteism is horribly bad. But that doesn't mean that caste identities are not important. If I identify with a caste, it is my way of identifying with my ancestors, the same way a Jewish person identifies himself/herself as one. There is no implication that I am above or below anyone.

I do think User:Sitush has a bias against the so-called forward castes. Otherwise, he would have put down his tent at the Ezhava page too. Frankly, there is no rivalry between castes as such. I only visited it recently after several years to see if that page is also marred beyond recognition like the Nair page. Instead I find glorification. I don't mind it. But they are not independent articles either. There have been persistent attempts for years to vandalize the Nair page. You can see it all in the Talk page. I have followed it off-and-on (once in a year to sometimes once in a few months) and this attempt at vandalism has been a persistent theme.

I am not displaying my ego. I don't even have a username and I am actually taking a risk by letting my IP get published. The egoist one is the guy who is frustrating every one of your attempts at a solution by burying you under a mountain of wikipedese.

I am not making a user account because that way I will definitely get banned because then I am playing User:Sitush's game. I have noticed many newbie users get banned because of his games. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.231.65.124 (talk) 17:55, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

This is not true. Newbies dont get banned. You have to learn the wikipedia rules and policies...and then if you "work" within this frame without violating policies, and contributing in a constructive way..then everything will be ok :-))....always remember the article is more important than the user...thats all...even if that user be oneself...VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 20:12, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Help request

A user commented to me - I have a lot of experience of Wikipedia and you have very little - see this this . I have informed the user it is inappropriate but such comments are very uncivil/disturbing – is there a better way to handle it? VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 16:06, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

Has there been any other clashes or disagreements between you and the user concerned? Mdann52 (talk) 16:08, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

content-disputes exists as both of us overlap as contributors to India related topics. I have on more than one occassion in the past overlooked his ad hominem during consensus-building. But it has now come to belittling me. I have reacted to it as politely as i can ...as you can see in the diff provided in my help-request. I dont want to make trouble for him, he is a good editor but handles too many on his watch list that probably stresses him. However, that cannot be used as an excuse for behaving in an inappropriate manner during discussion. Is my present reaction to his comments appropriate or do i need to handle this another way next time ? VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 16:17, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

Next time, send me a message on my talk page, and I'll take it from there Mdann52 (talk) 16:50, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

Great - thanks :-) VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 16:53, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

naveenpf (talk) 10:56, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Vettakkorumakansnehi. You have new messages at Sitush's talk page.
Message added 00:42, 23 June 2012 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Sitush (talk) 00:42, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

Sanctions

As noted at Talk:Nair, please find below a formal notification that explains the discretionary sanctions that exist for caste articles etc. Thanks. - Sitush (talk) 13:06, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

The Wikipedia community has permitted administrators to impose discretionary sanctions on any editor who is active on any page about social groups, explicitly including caste associations and political parties, related to India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Nepal. Discretionary sanctions can be used against an editor who repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behavior, or any normal editorial process. If you engage in further inappropriate behavior in this area, you may be placed under sanctions, which can include blocks, a revert limitation, or an article ban. The discussion leading to the imposition of these sanctions can be read here. Please familiarise yourself with the information page at Wikipedia:General sanctions.

There is an existing content-dispute on Nair article between me and User:Sitush on the phraseology of a lead sentence. 9 NPOVs provided by me for not acceptable to him , yet adhering to wikipedia guidelines I made no effort to edit the sentence while the consensus-talk was going on. Inspite of the User: Qwyrxian /QW (administrator) makes an wnwarranted threat “Should you edit the article to follow one of your alternatives, we'll revert you” – See here . I explained to User:QW- if that was my intention, I would have not be discussing-consensus in the talk-page in the first place and that his comments were unwarranted. In between, User: Sitush suggested an NPOV of adding an (s) to a word- That was not acceptable to me. So the consensus building had failed. Inspite of this, User:Sitush went ahead and made the addition of (s) without consensus-generation. UserQW (administrator) does not object to it. Assuming good faith, I was willing to ignore this silence and unwarranted edit and hence asked User:Sitush to revert his edit and to generate “collective-editorial consensus” before doing so. It was requested to the Users that consensus in Nair article needs to be a “collective-editor consensus” and not UserQW-UserSitush consensus as that is inappropriate. See here. Such behaviors have from these two users occurred in the past – an examination of Nair-talk page history will reveal it. Immediately User Sitush places a formal notification that explains discretionary ban on my talk page !!!. See here. This is the same user who earlier had engaged in ad hominem and belittling at me in article –Iyengar talk page and OTRS Volunteer Response Team had adviced him not do so. See here. Are such behaviors acceptable from Users ? . VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 14:09, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

Your helpme template brought me here, and I decided to take a look at the situation. I've come to the conclusion that you're not capable of neutrally editing the topic at all, and you're displaying a tremendous amount of what we call IDIDNTHEARTHAT. Under the discretionary sanctions in force on the article, as described above, I'm banning you for 6 months from Nair. This means you may not edit the article or the associated talkpage, or any discussion of Nair in any namespace. When those 6 months are up, if you resume flooding the talkpage with groundless complaints I will extend your ban to indefinite. The Blade of the Northern Lights (話して下さい) 14:58, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

WP:ANI#User:Vettakkorumakansnehi

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.
The Discussion is at WP:ANI#User:Vettakkorumakansnehi Mdann52 (talk) 16:05, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

You've already had an answer from an admin, User:The Blade of the Northern Lights. I'd suggest you drop the subject. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 14:10, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

I have already explained at WP:ANI about "The Blade of the Northern Lights". I have focussed in my grievience-plea at WP:ANI that the issue that needs addressal is the review of behavior of User:Sitush based on the diffs provided by me. I will wait for further inputs from multiple other admins for their independent evaluation of User:Sitush's behavior. Until that may be investigated, i am afraid WP:ANI issue is not resolved. VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 15:49, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Canvassing

You are making numerous posts to user talk pages on the lines of this one. They are far from neutrally worded and there are other potential issues. Please read WP:CANVASS. - Sitush (talk) 01:23, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Legolas95 is one among the users who had participated in our content-dispute and hence is capable of independently evaluating where things went wrong between us. As a person who has directly participated in our Nair-talk-page-discussions that has now lead to events at WP:ANI, he needs to be appropriately informed about the developments. Your terming of it as "canvassing" therefore is inappropriate/a misrepresentation and i fear is an assumption of bad faith towards me. Kindly abstain from such actions until the ANI issue is resolved. Thanks in advance . VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 15:42, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

The point is that your words were not neutral, which is a breach of WP:CANVASS. It is permissible to inform people who had previously been involved, providing that you inform everyone on both sides of the issue, and that you phrase your notification neutrally - something like "There is a report at ANI that you might want to comment on", rather than "i have informed ANI about the ad hominems and various other behaviors of User:Sitush" - the latter is leading and presents the case as if your opinion is objectively factual, when what you should be doing is leaving it up to the reader to decide. -- Boing! said Zebedee (talk) 15:58, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

The intention was neutral, but in case my wordings gave the impression otherwise , then i sincerely apologize.VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 17:21, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

No problem - I don't doubt your intentions were honorable -- Boing! said Zebedee (talk) 17:35, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

I have amended the phraseology on Legolas95 talk page along the lines u stated.....VSVettakkorumakansnehi (talk) 08:44, 30 June 2012 (UTC)