User talk:Khoikhoi/Archive 16

Mother Teresa

I have no idea about Latinus... As for Mother Teresa, what i know is that her father was of Aromanian origins. but i am not sure about her mother's origins... Going for the 16th archive, right?:) Hectorian 01:36, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for your response. By the way, I do not like those unsourced edits there and elsewhere intended to present the speakers of minority languages in Turkey less than they actually are. But I do not like its exact opposite either. Atilim Gunes Baydin 09:34, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Wikiproject Ossetia

Hi Khoi

The Goals of this WP are attentioned in it and so you can read here:

Goals

WikiProject Ossetia was created to help those interested in improving all of the Ossetian-related articles on Wikipedia to find a particular area in which they are interested in working. Our goals are as following:

• Present a realistic view of Ossetia and the Ossetian people in the world.
• Make Wikipedia a primary and reliable source of Ossetia related information.
• To improve the quality and quantity of Ossetia related articles, including improving Ossetia to featured article status.

If you saw any part of this Goals are mentioned:

Goals

WikiProject Ossetia was created to POV User:Zandweb's Idea ...

then you can say it is POV.

If you think any of those mentioned Goals are POV you are free to moderate it, but before that I suggest you to read at least two more WPs and their Goals.

If you want to create any WP yu can read [1]. Fortunately I will not remove all stubs related to its articles like this: [2] / [3] / [4], and I will not stimulate or persuade someone to do like these: [5] / [6]. Because these are exactly POV and POV organize according to chauvinism and bigotry.

ZANDWEBT

Barzanî

Hi, I am not so firm on the name politics at en: I'd say: just try and look if someone complains :) --Erdal Ronahi 10:08, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Valencian Community and Galicia

(in English/en inglés)
Please, you must move give the articles "Galicia (Iberian peninsula)" and "Valencia (autonomous community)" to "Galicia (Spain)" and "Valencian Community", because it's more suitable. I cannot do it. Thank you.

---

(en español/in Spanish)
Por favor, usted debe trasladar los artículos "Galicia (Iberian peninsula)" y "Valencia (autonomous community)" a "Galicia (Spain)" y "Valencian Community", porque es más adecuado. Yo no puedo hacerlo. Gracias. Satesclop 18:19, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

In the Valencian case, "Comunitat Valenciana" is translated to English as "Land of Valencia" according to the Regional Government, as it's used, i.e., in official tourism information. Cheers. --Joanot Martorell ✉ 20:13, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Joanot has invented it. The translation of his official name is "Valencian Community". He is a Valencian separatist, and has forged the reality. See the web of the Generalitat Valenciana: [7]

Jemten and Celikokte

Hey,I'm really not them, if you would like to check you can do it of course. There are thousands of users here in wikipedia, naturally someone may think like me about Roma people, sincerely- Zaparojdik 22:41, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

2006 referendum in Transnistria

Please see this edit [8] which was made without any prior discussion. I have raised it on the article's Talk page, but I can't revert anymore or I will be in 3RR trouble. What to do? Need advice. - Mauco 21:42, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Still some issues, but not as blatantly POV as before. I found out, luckily, that I was not the only editor on that article with common sense... - Mauco 15:04, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

The thread which you started in Talk:Transnistria has had several entries since then. Please give us your opinion on the last few. See Talk:Transnistria#Referendum_section and my proposed version as a result of this reasoning[9] - Mauco 04:54, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Article

did you have any time to look at the articles that I have sent you?neurobio 00:25, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Re: Sinan

Script and transliteration is done over at Sinan. In the meantime, over at the test version for an Ottoman Turkish Wikipedia, I've got myself involved in the very first edit war over there. Yee-haw. —Saposcat 04:18, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Names and spelling

Hi, look how they are doing it with Russian names: Tchaikowsky. The English is the title, but cyrillic and transliteration are mentioned in the article. That's logical, since it's the English WP. --Erdal Ronahi 07:42, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Ok then, thanks for asking. See you. --Erdal Ronahi 12:32, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Roma people

Hey, of course there is no bad feelings about chencking user, I think that's one of your work on Wikipedia. Roma people's has no official population in records but Turkey just guess it by forse of first records of the republic and it's being 300.000 to 600.000 currently. They are mostly live in Thrace and large part of them migrated of way lawless to Turkey from Bulgaria after Bulgaria being an indepent state. Today they are really assimilated and they speak Turkish. I have never met with a Roma but I also don't think bad about them, I just think that It may be anti-Turkism to put Roma people page false and not current information. Sincelery- Zaparojdik 20:54, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Khoikhoi for adding 300.000- 2 million into the Roma people article, it's more right because it was look indubitable about their population in Turkey but not indubitable in Bulgaria, thanks again. -Zaparojdik 22:45, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

RfA Thanks

Thank you very much for participating in my RFA, which closed successfully earlier this week with a result of (50/3/0). If you have any further questions or suggestions, feel free to write me. I hope I will live up to your trust. Michael 19:35, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

RfA thanks

Hey Khoikhoi. Thank you for supporting my recent RfA. It finished with an amazing final tally of 160/4/1. I really appreciate your support. By the way, the image on your user page is awesome! Cheers, Sarah Ewart (Talk) 20:49, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Village guard system

Page is suffering from neutrality issues. Care to assist? --Cat out 00:25, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Naming Conventions

In Istanbul article, there is a link to the etymology of Istanbul in the first sentence. If those Greek city articles have an etymology section, the Turkish names can be removed. I am trying to be logical. If you can also at least try to be logical, it will be nice. Please, do not waste the time of the people ;-) Osmanaral 02:42, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

How many Turks live in Plovdiv? And, how many Greeks live in Istanbul? Could you give me these numbers with reference if you are trying to be logical? ;-) Even though the Greek population is very minor in Istanbul (less than 2000), you can find the Greek name of the city in etymology page. So, do not need to create a duplicate on the main [Istanbul] article. Osmanaral 04:35, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

In those Greek city articles, if they place the Turkish name for historical reasons in the history section or on an etymology page, that's fine. I would appreciate that. I am not saying that the Turkish name should be in the first sentence of the Greek city articles. We should not be upsetting our fellow Greek friends by doing that. agree? Osmanaral 04:45, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

ok. Could you tell me your reason for having the Greek name in the first sentence of Istanbul article even though it is in etymology page? Osmanaral 03:32, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

well, in this case the Greek name is not the historical name. The historical names of the city are Constantinople and Stamboul. And, Istanbul is derived from Stamboul. You know that, right? Osmanaral 03:44, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

This is English wikipedia, so it would be more appropriate to keep it in English. Osmanaral 03:59, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

I did. :) It doesn't make your case true. It is for the countries whose alphabet is in non-Latin. Take a look at it and try harder to make your case true ;) Osmanaral 04:18, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

haha..if you do not have an answer, you act like u didn't understand? Let me give you an example, the Chinese do not use the latin alphabet, the article name for their cities has to be in latin, but they can write the name in Chinese alphabet in the first line of the article. Osmanaral 04:31, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

playing the fool, huh? According to WP:UE, you can add the city's name in Greek alphabet in the first sentence of the Greek city articles. Of course, the article name will be in English - no one is saying the opposite (stop being funny). So, make some logic.. Osmanaral 04:49, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

I am giving you an example. It means that if the Greek language had been used in Turkey, it would be appropriate to add the name in Greek alphabet in the first sentence of the city article, and vice versa in Greece. This is the WP:UE guideline. Otherwise, you ll be adding the non-latin names of cities in many different languages in the first sentence. Osmanaral 05:05, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Those are your judgements which do not apply to WP:UE. Today, the Greek language is used by only a few thousand in Istanbul. Adding the Greek name in the first sentence of Istanbul article is only Chauvinism. You cannot explain it in any other way. I am not against our Greek sisters and brothers. I respect the Byzantium and the Ottoman history. So, the Greek name is very welcome in the etymology or history section. Yassas... Osmanaral 05:49, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

It's so silent here...

Hi, where have you disappeared? We miss you. --Ghirla ^-трёп- 12:16, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Spam advice

Thanks for the note--I will be more careful with my editing. For the record, I do not add commercial links. KonaScout 13:14, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

bonnie back?

I don't know how you manage to always nail him, but here you have a candidate: Cromwells Legacy (talk · contribs). `'mikka (t) 15:09, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Syrians/Syria

I noticed that you took the correct view (that these are mostly used to refer to the country of Syria) at the beginning of the debate but then decided to change your mind to a dab page. I have NEVER heard the term Syrian/Syrians used to refer to Aramaic-speaking Christians, so it definitely doesn't warrant a dab page. Yuber^(talk) 22:57, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes I am. I think Wiki is making a mockery of itself if it lets groups of determined nationalists make dab pages just because their ethnicity sounds similar to the name of a nationality. Yuber^(talk) 21:51, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Cromwell Legacy

Who is Cromwell Legacy? Is Bonaparte, that legend of Wikipedia? I looked at his contributions, he is a new user who start contributing at articles not related with Romania/Moldova.

Regarding the edit he made in the Talk page of Transnistria, I believed it was a valid point: to name it "Moldovan region of Transnistria", in order not to confuse it with the entire region between rivers Dniester and Bug, which was also named Transnistria in WW2 (and which is a teritory ten times bigger). Sometimes such confusions appear, when old demographic data for the entire teritory between Dniester and Bug are compared with actual demographic data of Transnistria - the thin slice on the left of Dniester which belong to the Republic of Moldova.

Anyhow, the edit that was deleted was not vandalism, it was in a talk page (and this is why talk pages are). In my opinion, you overreacted by reverting it.--MariusM 23:39, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Abdul Hamid

No problem man, I found a few sites with references...I hope their alright. --Fedayee 22 September, 2006

Stalin

Gamarjobat. Thanks for the quote. You might like this one: - Comrade Zhukov, Khrushev says that you said word "pig" upon leaving my cabinet. Who did you mean? - Of course Hitler Comrade Stalin! - Right, I thought so. Comrade Khrushev who did you think Comrade Zhukov meant? Tamokk 04:41, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Hey Mr Khoi

Hey Mr Khoi update your gallery with these Romanian pictures...tell me your opinion soon --Blaga 10:12, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Mount Ararat

Several editors have been fooling around with the Mount Ararat intro. I did a copy edit on what they did, but I'd appreciate if you would take a look. Hope your summer was nice! -- Ssilvers 15:51, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Theater

I know you're a smart guy, just compare the two photos:

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:CJROtheatre.jpg or http://www.cs.ubbcluj.ro/~blaga/Cluj/Pictures/Big/theater.jpg

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=4384315

:) It's the same building..--Blaga 18:02, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

You can upload them, just my 2 cents..--Blaga 18:06, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

This is a typical landscape from Romania, most probably from Transylvania

The secret?

LOL :) to be able to get this shot (20 min or so to play with exposures between 2,5 sec@f/8.0 and 15 sec@f/2.8) --Blaga 18:16, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

User:Blaga=user:Bonaparte. Am I right in assuming this, Khoikhoi? Dahn 19:29, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Perfect. Also see User:Danutz, please. Dahn 19:32, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure? On the ro page, Danutz did not create himself a link to an English user's page, and it looks like the English Danutz came up with the idea of a "Romanian-speaking states" template that koko bonnie here keeps reverting to... Dahn 19:37, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

LOL:) --Blaga 19:38, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Template

Could you please do it? There is some weird kink in the template that does not allow me to view it on its own, and I'm sure you could bypass it quicker than I (and consequently list it for deletion). I am currently reviewing another article and my Internet connection has turned frustratingly slow, but do drop a note in case you decide to do this, so I can cast my vote. Many, many thanks. Dahn 00:27, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for teaching me how to fish :). That really was easy, after all. Discussion opened here: Wikipedia:Templates for deletion/Log/2006 September 24. Is there something I have to list with the template, and if so, could you do it? Dahn 01:24, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Btw, I need to ask someone: do your personal links ("my talk", "my preferences", "my watchlist" etc.) ever abruptly move from the right side of the screen to the left when you try to click them? (It happens to me quite often at certain intervals) Also, do you know who and where changes the general aspect of the entire wikipedia by underlining links willy-nilly? Please let me know, so that I may spam them with death threats for making my connection work like crap almost every time they get this bright idea... Dahn 01:30, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. Perhaps I will. I first wanted to know if this sounds familiar (since you say it does not, I figure that the two incidents are, respectively, a bug and a stupid argument over aesthetics...). The main reason I asked was that such things were contributing to the difficulties I had earlier in editing pages (I have sinced logged out and in again, and they appear to be solved for now). Dahn 02:43, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Explorer... I know... Dahn 02:58, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

It's mainly because I have promised myself to have at least one flaw, so my perfection doesn't go to my head :). Dahn 03:02, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

(Come to think of it... if my perfection would go to my head... I would be flawed.) Dahn 03:06, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Revert

So I should revert my revert back to your version?Khosrow II 20:20, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up.Khosrow II 20:21, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Pontian Greek Genocide

Hi Khoikhoi. why are u keep adding the dispute tag? there has not been provided not even one single source to dispute it! have a look at the talk page... only rhetoric arguments. Hectorian 20:54, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

So, if it is so easy (and noone asks for sources and clear reasons to dispute an article), could i add 'dispute tags' for TRNC and Republic of Macedonia asking for them to be renamed? i could also provide sources, along with rhetorisms... Hectorian 21:04, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Ceyhan, Seyhan, Ceyhun, Seyhun

All four are different rivers Khoikhoi. Ceyhan River and Seyhan River are in Çukurova (I will shape up the Çukurova article). But Ceyhun and Seyhun are still different. In Turkish (as, I believe, in other Turkic languages), as briefly explained in the articles relating to those rivers, Ceyhun River is Amu Darya, and Seyhun River is Syr Darya, both of which are in Central Asia. Cretanforever

My 3RR

Thanks for the warning and I will certainly consider myself lucky. I've honestly never had this issue before which I why I haven't watched my steps as much as I should've. What really gets my goat is that I am always careful to state my case on Talk pages and argue the points, but the subject (Transnistria) is a bit controversial ... and, what's worse, the guy who kept ignoring our arguments and who wouldn't engage in serious discussion in the Talk page actually stated that he enjoys edit wars or else life gets too boring for him.[10] Sigh... - Mauco 05:24, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Three Revert Rule

The user Khosrow II violated the three revert rule in the article List_of_English_words_of_Turkic_origin. He reverted the article more than three times. I don't know where to complain. Would you please help me to solve this problem? Chapultepec 16:30, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Let the blocked user have his edit

I am not an admin, but I think you should immediately allow the edit to remain and then you should seek page protection until law enforcement gives an all clear or someone in authority at wikipedia decides otherwise. --Blue Tie 18:52, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Cookies

Chocolate is thought to relieve stress

Hi, Khoikhoi. I don't know if I've ever talked to you before but I saw the threatening e-mail you received on WP:ANI and I hope you're doing OK! I can't imagine how it felt to receive that e-mail. I hope the matter can be resolved and that you're not put off Wikipedia. Enjoy the cookies! :) Srose (talk) 19:40, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Cyprus Refugees

Yep, another article written by a Greek to tell the whole world how bad Turkey is, and how only Greeks ever suffer...

I have to say, i really am quite fed up of all this rubbish now. --A.Garnet 20:00, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the comment

And thanks for posting the email at WP:AN/I, more people needed to see what was happening. I wish I could be as detached about it as you are, but this thing is irritating the heck out of me. --Akhilleus (talk) 20:02, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

İzmir

Hi Khoikhoi. I notice you reverted my change to İzmir. My edit restored the original era usage to BC after the many instances of its use in the article had been systematically changed in violation of current Wikipedia policy (either BC or BCE is OK. The preference of the first major editor should be adhered to). I've put it back to using BC (but not AD) because this is how it was from the outset. I hope this is not too contentious. Cheers, Arcturus 21:36, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

I understand your point of view, but this article is about a place, not a religion. I think all - or most - of the articles about judaism and Islam don't use BC/AD. Personally I can't see a problem with BC, though I acknowledge some people might prefer an alternative to AD. I now tend to edit articles with just the year, e.g. 6 instead of AD 6, but for years before 1 the use of BC merely sets a marker with reference to a person who did exist, it makes no statement. Is the preference of the first editor set in stone? No, and if it was a religious article perhaps a change would be justified, but surely not in an article about about a place. Arcturus 22:16, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Late Reply

Hey thanks for the star :)) I will try more to improve everything. I just hope that I will be able to liberate more of my time from some disputes and try to contribute to other areas of interest (i am interested in other things than just conflicts or invasions :))..

On the other hand, I just came across to this issue of weird e-mails that some people have been receiving.. I hope that things are ok and will be ok.. I read the whole story, it was just plain weird for psychos to get worked up on such a small article (if it were a joke, it wasn't funny).. So how r u holding up? Baristarim 00:05, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Well I have been stressing a bit too, the usual.. friends, running around, work etc.. I am glad that you are taking it cool.. :) Well, my first full contribution to Wiki: [Constitution_of_Turkey]!! I completely rewrote the article.. It even looks better than [constitution of France]! I wish I could liberate more time from some disputes and concentrate on stuff like this.. I will try to add a history section to it when I have the time.. Take care! :) Baristarim 14:12, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Cretanpride

Not a problem. I understand why you did what you did: the threat was a scary one, and if I hadn't had so much experience with Cretanpride I might have taken it more seriously. As it is, knowing Cretanpride's history, I was fairly certain that "Emily" didn't exist; I still took the matter seriously enough to contact the police, but I didn't really think anyone was in jeopardy. (I think that on some level I also took comfort in the 48-hour deadline; if we had not had a result from the police by the time the deadline came close, and if we had received further notices saying "I'm serious! Change the article or she dies!", my attitude would probably have been different.

But there's no need for you to apologize. It was a stressful situation, and we were acting without guidance. I don't blame anyone for their response.—Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 02:23, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Cretan

Hi. The source concerning the changed edits is an english one, so i could read it. and it was not saying the things it was supposed to... thus, Miskin's edits are justifiable. Regards Hectorian 10:52, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Bonaparte

Should be taken care of now; let me know if something has been missed. Jayjg ^(talk) 15:23, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Forgive my recent excessive overtones, I never mean to create a hostile atmosphere but I can't help noticing that you have a constant prejudice against my edits. I have nothing against you and I know that supporting NPOV is always your priority. Miskin 16:49, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Friendly regards

Hey Khoikhoi,

I just saw the posts about the threatening e-mail you got, and just want to give my warmest regards. Unfortunately there happen to be some unpleasant personal attacks on Wikipedia. But this one is really is really distateful and offensive. I am glad to see that it didn't knock you out and that you still contribute in an honourable way. Geçmiş olsun as we say in Turkish. Bertilvidet 19:38, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Cretan Turks

I don't understand why it was moved.. What is the basis for it, even the Greek name in the title refer to it as such? Baristarim 20:51, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Urgent! I believe that Miskin and Tzekai are the same user [11] and [12].. What is the procudure? He has been requesting the same moves for ages. Your help would be appreciated.. Baristarim 21:04, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but after seeing your report to User:whatshisname I just cannot believe that you didn't want me to get blocked, nor that you sent me this last message out of pure desire for reconciliation. You accepted my apology after 12 hours or so, and if it weren't for a certain sequence of events you would have probably not replied to me at all. If you had wanted to find a mutually acceptable solution, you would have easily done so by suggesting it to me earlier in the day, letting me know that you're actively interested in the topic. Instead, you indirectly accused me to an administrator and most importantly, you didn't interfere once my block was put. The truth is that you were simply annoyed by my earlier overtones towards you, and that my apology was not enough to redeem it (as it was meant to). I can still co-operate with you in order to settle this debate, but don't expect me to reconcialiate as if nothing ever happened. Miskin 01:55, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Mr. Lefty's RfA thanks

Hi, Khoikhoi, and thanks for supporting me in my recent request for adminship, which succeeded with a final tally of 70/4/4. I hope I can live up to your expectations, and if there's ever anything you need, you know where to find me! --Mr. Lefty Talk to me! 00:06, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Talk:Transnistria#List_of_links_for_discussion

Want to give us your views? Hopefully this will end the most recent edit war and settle it for a while. - Mauco 05:56, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Islam in Romania

Please take a look on this page. The entries made by User:Timor Stultorum mix irrelevancy with inflammatory speech. Since Timor seems to like the arbitrary capitalization of words like "Mosque", since his English is of the same quality, and since his edits reproduce the exact same details as those pushed in the text by User:Vintila Barbu, I think we are dealing with a sockpuppet. You might also want to check out what he alleged on the talk page, to have an exact context for his poisonous POV. Dahn 11:59, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

since you agreed without any reserves with the accusation of sockpuppetry made against me [13], why don't you ask for a check ?

--Timor Stultorum 13:08, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Question

Hello Khoikhoi. i uploaded an image [14], but i am not sure about its copyright status and which tag to use. the disclaimer of the site [15] puzzled me:/. i am not sure if u can help, but i would appreciate it if u could... Hectorian 17:51, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Things to be discussed

Dear Khoikhoi,

I am tired of edit/revert debates. I watch your transactions/edit since you sent me a welcome message. I respect your efforts for editing articles and looking for consensus.You are generally far away from fanatism. As you see, I am a new user in wikipedia.After first some my editing, I stopped to make something in wikipedia with a fear of to make big mistakes. But I continue watching some articles, some users to see and understand; what , Why and how they do.

Ok, Lets discuss somethings; 1-Samsun; You reverted my edit. And you add; "List of traditional Greek place names" again. Dear Khoikhoi, lets be serious. Is this an advertisement. There are many links there all of them reference to Greek places like as "Ancient Greek Cities in Anatolia", "Pontus" etc. which I never think about to delete them. But ,"List of traditional Greek place names" at the first line seems un suitable.Assume that; an user puts link to all Greek places related articles like as "List of traditional Turkish place names". Unsuitable. 2-You reverted some links in "Turkish Republic of Western Thrace". Please dont delete them.I know these links are empty now, but all of them are in my agenda.

Convention on naming Turkish-Greek places; There is a huge discussion. Some users offers logical solutions but many of others offers fanatic oppinions. I offered also to Barıstarım that; Lets establish a commission (not more than 7 people)with Equal number of Greek and Turkish users(can be voting among users).this commission delegate another neutral user as chairman/chief/reconciler . Commission make an agenda and puts the principles of naming(in title, in first line, and in the article),putting links,kategories etc. These rules and regulations are announced in a main template page and all related articles linked to that page as a guide. All further debates among users(especially newcomers) are solved by this commission.

I wish to take your oppinions firstly. Much regards and iyigeceler/kalinikta. Mustafa Akalp 18:26, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Samsun

Thanks a lot for consensus. Regards. Mustafa Akalp 20:31, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Nishkid64's RfA thanks

Thank you very much for participating in my RfA, which closed successfully earlier today with a result of (60/9/4). Although, I encountered a few problems in my RfA, I have peacefully resolved my conflicts and made amends with the people involved. If you have any further questions or suggestions, feel free talk to me. I hope I will live up to your expectations. --Nishkid64 22:14, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Translation

Sure, no problems.. (BTW, Wilaya comes from the Ottoman word vilayet, meaning administrative province, so I didn't translate it - same for département. préfecture is similar, it means administrative capital, daira I don't know, it must mean something like county, commune is the area around a city, generally it just means the city itself)

The Wilaya of Algiers (Arabic : ولاية الجزائر) is an administrative subdivision of Algeria, adopted from the old French département of Algiers.

Its préfecture (administrative capital) is Algiers. It has a population of 2.562.000 inhabitants.

• Subdivisions of the wilaya
• The wilaya of Algiers is divided into 13 daïras and 57 communes:

Question

How can I list a page in a category? I just created category:Constitutions of Turkey, but I cannot list the constitutions there even though I put a category:constitutions of turkey tag at the bottom of concerned pages.. Baristarim 06:10, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Ok i think i found out how.. :)) Baristarim 06:12, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Baristarim and A. Garnet independently proposed the splitting of the article, and Cretanforever edited the new articles with me. Hectorian and Nikosilver didn't object the idea. You're the only person out of 7 who did, and apparently you haven't even reading the talk pages. Will you restore it please? Miskin 18:19, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Inanna

Hi Khoikhoi. I comprehend your suspicion. But I am not the same Ajda. As for my username; I've borrowed it from Ajda Pekkan who is one of the most popular Turkish singers. "Ajda" is not a so common name and that makes it more attractive for used as a username. You can find hundreds of “Ajda” usernames in the internet. I should have written more stuff about my username. On the other hand, you don't know what it writes there because you're not a Turkish speaker. Inanna and Ajda17 are arguing there. :) Ajda 22:37, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

3RR

Hatra article was vandalized long ago be "assyrian" members they claim it was an assyrian city, the problem is when you want to correct it they face with this :"try to add more than subtract", we will not accept lies on those articles and this article should be protected from vandalism.

Gagauz people

On 11 August, an anonymous editor added the unsourced claim that there are 100,000 Gagauz in Brazil, but the "total population" numbers have not been updated. Should we do that, or remove the Brazil mention, or add them to the total but put a "citation needed" tag? Biruitorul 11:05, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Thank you–the list looks much more professional now. Biruitorul 02:22, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

User:Loganos

Thanks for blocking the Greier/Bonaparte sock. However, he is back now as IP 220.130.115.44[16] and among other things just vandalized my talk page. - Mauco 20:53, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

'al hamaat-elements' ?? Where did you get it from? Chaldean 03:38, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

I honestly do not know about Assyrians in Tatar. I caught that about 4 months ago, and I dont know who wrote it. Well is if there is any additional info on the net Chaldean 03:40, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Wow, according to this [[17]] there were 1,800 Assyrians in Krasnoyarsk Krai, so go try figure that out LOL. Chaldean 03:43, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

I know, but I just found it wierd how there are 1,800 Assyrians all the way in Krasnoyarsk Krai. Chaldean 03:50, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Well I found this;[[[18]] "7. Mr. Arsen SAVVA (Kazan, Russia): Development of the Assyrian Historiography during Political Evolution in Russia (19th through 21st century)." - I'm guessing this guy is a representative of that Assyrian community. So I guess there must be some truth about Assyrians in Tataristan. Chaldean 03:54, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

LOL by the way, there are some funny (and things I dont agree with) cartoons made by those Assyrian-Russian-influenced-Communist [[19]] Chaldean 03:57, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Moving Turkish articles

Hey Khoikhoi, I keep noticing that you move articles with Turkish titles into their proper Turkish spelling. Thanks for that. I was wondering whether you do actually know some Turkish or not. Atilim Gunes Baydin 23:41, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Thank you! And you spelled the few words you know correctly. I know many people from Turkey who cannot write "bir şey" properly. Hoşçakalın (that is, so long, in formal form. Informal would be Hoşçakal). Atilim Gunes Baydin 00:08, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

No, and I don't know why actually. The thing I was referring to was how you wrote "bir" and "şey" separate (that is the correct way), in addition to using the correct letters of the Turkish alphabet (I appreciate that very much). I can tolerate when Turkish is written with only English letters because of technical limitations, but there are these rules governing when some word or enclitic is supposed to be separate and when not (I don't want to bore you with details), and a great many of people get these wrong. There are sites like [20] (this one is for the rule governing "de") made by people furious about these mistakes like me. Regards, Atilim Gunes Baydin 01:00, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

California

U know what is funny? i was about to ask u (in a humourous way) if u are going to vote for Mary Carey (i saw that on tv), but i did not know that a greek is also running for governor:) Hectorian 23:49, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

LOL:). do u think that i could possibly confuse a pornostar with Huffington:p? i was talking about Phil Angelides. i heard in the news a young Californian asked if he would vote for Mary Carey, and he said "...at least she is as clever as our president":). Hectorian 00:03, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Cyprus

I thank you for asking me, but it may not be received well by various personages on Wikipedia. My slant on this issue is towards the Turkish Cypriot view and may not be regarded as a NPOV. I have to be honest and say that I have a fair degree of hostility to Greek Cyprus and Greece, and that would be reflected in my postings User:Hectorian would certainly agree with that. User:Expatkiwi

Seljuq dynasty

I just ran into this article.. Is it true that there are people who claim that they were not Turkish??!! Gees.. I left a post in the talk page and will keep an eye on it for sometime.. Baristarim 02:21, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, I have a hard time trying to see what is good faith/bad faith [21].. Where is the line between adopting persian customs and being assimilated ? I don't know, there seems to be some really fishy POV pushing going on the Seljuq family had become extremly Persianized in culture and language, to an extent that they were regarded "Persians" by outsiders??.. I don't know but I just don't understand where this will to minimize Turks comes from, it is not like they came from Mars u know.. I had enough of this.. Baristarim 02:34, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

I am definitely not giving up for the moment, but I had enough of this minimization of Turks, u know, if you let some people have their way, they would get away with all sorts of historical revisionism.. There are way too many judgements passed Azeris are Iranian people that speak Turkish?? Azeris are not Iranian people that speak Turkish.. They might be Persian, but they are definitely NOT Iranian.. It is like claiming that ancient Romans are all Italians!!! French and Spanish are all originally (more or less) Roman, but they are NOT Italian.. I am just saying that you become aware of some other types of POV pushing that is taking place, some people make so that Turks are Iranians originally.. Nothing can be farther than the truth.. Iranians are shias whereas Turks are Sunni, so much for same culture, same religion.. Just because Turkey and Iran are neighbors, it doesn't mean that Turks are Iranians... Baristarim 03:01, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, I said that Azeris can be Persians turkified by Oghuz, but Persian is not Iranian.. In the same way that French are not Italians because they were (more or less) Romans way back when.. I mean, I am sorry to say this, but I have the impression that somehow you have a hard time balancing certain POVs coz u r so distant from the subject matter, I have been to Azerbaijan twice and have seen all of Middle East, what I can say is that they speak Turkish, and that they can be of Persian race, but to classify them as Iranian is going way over the top... As for pan-turkism, look, believe me when I say this, it is more of a joke in Turkey than anything else, all countries in Europe have had similar ideologies one time or another, pretending that pan-turkism was the big daddy of those is also wrong and agenda-pushing.. I have a very strong communist POV and I have extreme fundamental problems with such ideologies, but they should not be taken out of context to give the impression that they hold much sway among Turks.. Megali Idea, Great rome of Mussolini, pan-hungary, pan-iranian, pan-chinese, pan-russian, these all exist and they have caused much more wars than pan-turkism, no? Did u know that the recent riots in Hungary against the PM was organized primarily by a party who wants to reunite the historic Hungarian lands of the Austro-Hungarian empire?? In any case, it is also POV pushing to claim that people are what they don't want to be - the name France comes from the Germanic tribe of Franks, but I have never heard a German POV-pushing saying you guys are not French, you are Germans mixed with Romans, you see what I mean?? Similar problem at Babur article, he said he was Turkish, and so he is, what is all the fuss?? You are what you want to be, not what you don't want to be.. So just because most Iranians think that Azeris are Iranian that makes it anymore credible? doesn't that show that pan-iranian can also be POV-pushing and that such pan-ist ideologies exist everywhere in every country?? They should all be considered in the same category and dealt with in the same way, that's all I am saying... Baristarim 04:15, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Btw as for something that Atilim has said above about the correct spellings, I had a problem with this Treaty of Kucuk Kaynarca, i couldn't move it to its correct spelling Treaty of Küçük maybe because it was blocked, how can I get around it? Thanks and cheers!! Baristarim 04:18, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the treaty thing.. :)) As for what you said, you see that's what I was talking about balancing POVs and putting things in context.. I can also say that there are many many Kurds who are Turkish nationalists.. In fact they can be ultra-nationalists sometimes coz they have something to prove in a way.. You see that's what mean.. If an Azeri is an Iranian nationalist, he is no longer Azeri (maybe by race, but not by choice), same goes for the Kurds I talked about above - and that's what counts, Azeris being Iranians who talk Turkish has many political undertones, I had read a lot about this subject back in the day, and I know for a fact that this argument has been supported by the Iranian government for ages just to facilitate their assimilation of Azeris that live in Iran, rightly or wrongly, as a deturkification process (if they are all Persians in the first place at all).. That is also pan-iranism and fascism, right?? I just want to know why there are different standards applied to similar things, that's all.. Turks get to be the whipping boys whereas others get away with crime.. You can find a similar analogy with Kurds in Turkey I suppose, but the fact is that the Azeris are not Iranians of whatever kind.. They can be turkified Persians, but not Iranians.. Why is the Seljuq dynasty listed under the Iranian history template and not even one of history of Turks?? Seriously this is getting way too much, wiki is rapidly getting a reputation of being a POV bonanza, I know of people who refuse to look at wikipedia articles anymore when they are making research..Baristarim 06:12, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Cool, I hadn't seen the template coz it wasn't at the top of the page like the Iranian one (aha aha, wink), must be a coincidence :).. Yes, exactly like the village guards :) And there is a tacit agreement between Iran and Turkey about the Azeris and Kurds, none of them tries to stir ethnic seperatism in the other's territory :) As such, it allows the other one to continue with assimilation.. The process is a bit complicated but trust me on this, I know this from a relative who is an ambassador for Turkey (not for Iran though).. Coz if Turkey wanted it could easily stir up tensions with Azeris in Iran.. Any case I am worried about some of the pan-iranist stuff out there.. I will try to keep an eye, but I cannot do much unfortunately.. I just took a look at the Persian Empire article, and I just don't get why it goes all the way to current Iran.. Academically Persian Empire refers to the empire before the conquests of Alexander the Great, what is this illusion going on over there??? The article would deserve much more to be entitled History of Persia with its current form.. In any case, take care I have to log off :)).. Baristarim 06:50, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Seljuq Dynasty or Seljuk Dynasty??

I made a google test about this:

• Google test - This is the English Wikipedia, as such the most common name must be used:
• Seljuq Dynasty: 557 hits [22]
• Seljuq Turks: 14500 hits [23]
• Seljuk Turks: 119000 Hits [24]

I still fail understand why it was moved to Seljuq Dynasty.. It is by far known as Seljuk Turks in English (with an extremely overwhelming majority), used everywhere in the Wikipedia as such, every encyclopedia and book in the world refers to them as such and defines them as a Muslim Turkish/ic dynasty of Persia, Brittanica etc. The name game about whether it is about the dynasty proper or as Turks as a whole, that's way too much POV fork, the dynasty of the Seljuks can be talked about in the Seljuk Turks article and history of Iran/History of Persia article.. What do you think about this move that has been made? I put many posts on the talk page - people tell me how Ottoman culture was Iranian etc (except Islam, it was Byzantine and Roman at the base btw), but I am coming to the end of my wits here, this is really too much, if this stays like this and we concede to a bunch of pan-iranists, I will seriously lose my faith in it, as I said, I don't know why some people are always content with this movement of minimization of Turks and applying anachronisms by taking things out of context.. regards Baristarim 13:45, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Great Fire of Smyrna

The article still contains some pro-turkish bias made by Kertenkebelek. Maybe you could fix it (taging isn't the solution). Mitsos 14:51, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Seljuqs

Hey Khoikhoi ... could you please keep an eye on Seljuqs?! Thanks. Tājik 20:47, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Hey, I rather ment the discussion, as well as the comming weeks. In the next 3 months, I won't have much time to participate in Wikipedia. I trust you, so please keep an eye on certain articles, especially the usual "Truco-Persian" articles, such as Seljuqs, Babur, or Safavids. Thanks. Tājik 20:52, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

chinese warriors

Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/Snle `'mikka (t) 17:37, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Suspected sock-puppetry

I have suspected Snle for being a sock-puppet of Zhang Qiang for quite a while. I just gave him a formal warning on his talk page.--Niohe 17:39, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Shenyang, Dalian, etc.

Thanks for the heads up, I'll keep an eye on these articles. -- ran (talk) 23:00, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Let's see what he responds to our comments on talk pages first. -- ran (talk) 23:43, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

In which case I will pwn him with messages in Chinese doubting his loyalty to the Chinese nation. I'll start by accusing him of supporting Manchurian independence. =) (half j/k) -- ran (talk) 23:56, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Reply

I am sorry it was a bit late.. I have been running around (virtual running more like :)). I will try to keep an eye on those articles..I just wanted to ask you how I could archive my talk page, it has become too long :)) As for the Azeri thing, I know that those issues are too complicated but most of the time they depend on the conjecture and are dynamic, and never reflect the true feelings of countries concerned.. For example this [25] for an interesting take on the Armenian Genocide and Armenia.. It is true what he says you know.. Similar to Iran thing.. At the moment, after the Iraq war, Turkey is trying to get Iran's support against the Kurds, which also fits Iran's agenda since it would be doing Turkey a service even the US can't or won't, its ally for 50 years (it wont coz Kurds are the only allies it has in Iraq).. Thus the tacit agreement not to delve into this separatist issues for some time in each others territory.. It can change faster than sunny weather in spring, but for the moment, that's the case.. Kinda like Greece back in the day when they were supporting PKK (remember Ocalan?), but now they want Turkey to get into the EU, coz it is better for them.. It's all complicated :)) At the end of the day it is the Kurds that will get the shaft, sometimes I really feel sorry for them, but hence, this is life - we can only watch. I hope that u had a good weekend.. Baristarim 00:11, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

? I am still trying to make out what u were trying to tell me, were u just pulling my leg or being sarcastic??.. i was just trying to tell you that global political conjecture can be complicated [26], is Iran helping Turkey coz it wants to? No. They need to, and Turkey needs them as well.. Same thing for the Armenian Genocide, the main focus for armenians must be the improvement of the geopolitical and economical situation of armenia before anything else, since the EU would accept Turkey as long as it is in its interest even if Turks massacred half of Middle East and nuked all of Africa - show me the money!.. I hope that what I told you wasn't interesting in the same way as the links that you gave me.. I will translate the text before tomorrow.. Baristarim 05:17, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

No, that's not at all what I wanted to say :)) I was referring to the europeans when i said show me the money! - i wanted to say that, europeans, will admit turkey as long as it is in their interest.. I definitely know that Armenians want it recognized because they believed it happened - i think there was a misunderstanding :)). As for the other thing, maybe it is the late hours playing with my mind, but I just had the slight impression that u were pulling my leg, that's all :)) Baristarim 05:41, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

I see that you took care of the 'Pontic language' article by locking all alternative names, just because you wouldn't help with the double-redirects. Both 'Pontic Greek' and 'Pontic Greek language' are now locked by your Majesty. I don't know if you ever noticed, but during my last beef exchange with the administrations I chose not to mention any names, eventhough it was all your fault. All you have to do is ask from an administrator to undo your exploits and restore the article to its original name. You wouldn't want me to do it for you. Miskin 11:05, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

um...

My name on Wikipedia was Iranian Patriot for a long time. You just realized it? LOL ;) Yea, that was during the heat of my rage against Pan Turks, because of encounters I had had with them earlier. Even now I am vehemently anti Pan Turk, and it frustrates me taht so many of the good Turkish people and people from the R. of Azerbaijan have been brain washed into believing the most ridiculous things about history. For example, GM never wanted the correct facts to be mentioned regarding the history of his nation. Then, when I started creating the articles about the real history of the R. of Azerbaijan (the name change) and the Iranian theory regarding Azeri's, I asked him how his opinion has changed now that he knows all these facts. Do you know what he said to me? He said basically that he knew all of this before hand. So this makes me wonder, do Turks and Azeri's from the R. not want to know the truth, even if its infront of their eyes, or do they honestly believe what they believe. I vehemently believe that pan Turkism is the new Nazi style ideology (just compare the two). I thank God everyday I encounter pan Turks (I'm not saying GM is a pan Turk by the way, I'm saying he has been mislead, like so many of the other Wikipedian's of Turkish and Azeri (from the republic) descent) that there is no pan Iranism, because that way, there is no one to make foolish claims and disgrace and humiliate the Iranian people. The Turkish people need to fix whats wrong with there system, and take facts for what they are. You probably dont know what its like to have people make the most ridiculous claims against your nation or its history, and I hope you never do.Khosrow II 06:03, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I was raised in the West since the age of six. I cannot read or write in Persian. Almost everything I have ever learned comes from Western sources. I am a person who believes in facts, and a person who changes his opinion to match the facts. For example, I lived 17 years of my life believe that Arabs forced Iranians into Islam during the Arabic occupation (which is something that most Iranians believe). However, when the facts were presented to me that showed the otherwise, I changed my view, and have tried to spread the word to other Iranians. Arabs did not force Iranians into Islam by mass murder (however, there were a few instances), that is a Iranian nationalistic lie for the most part. You have to understand that the Turkish educational system and the R. of Azerbaijan education system is full of historical revisionism. Most of the things they are taught are lies. For example, in the R. of Azerbaijan, they are taught that Babak, teh famous Persian hero who fought the Arab occupiers, was an Azeri "Turk" who fought against Persian chauvanism. The Azeri embassy in Italy claims that Zoroastrianism is a Turkish religion. One of the old Politicians of Turkey had claimed that Mohammad was a Turk, and that all civilizations started with the Turks. The dictator of Turkmenistan even went so far as to claim that God was a Turk. This is what I'm talking about. We are not dealing with a small minority of people, we are dealing with politicians, who deliberately brainwash their people.Khosrow II 15:03, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Turks. The dictator of Turkmenistan even went so far as to claim that God was a Turk - I apologize for budding in, but this is unbelievably funny :D Chaldean 02:36, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

My God, the concenquences of ultra-nationalism can be idoiotic. Chaldean 02:42, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, in his auto biography, the dictator of Turkmenistan starts of by saying Praise be to Allah, the most noble of Turks (or something like that). Unfortunately, pan Turkism is not only restricted to a few individuals, it has affected everything in Turkic society from politicans to the people to society in general. It must be stopped for the sake of everyone, it truly is the new form of Nazism.Khosrow II 21:50, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

I know!

Kinda felt bad blocking it! Except I knew it was a troll (and of course, it said "shit"!) Glen 07:23, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, got him :) Glen 08:14, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Posha

As far as I know there are no Roma groups living in Armenia or eastern Anatolia. The closet thing to them are the Yazidi Kurds. -- Clevelander 08:17, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

I could be wrong, though. Roma are known to exist in other regions of Western Asia (such as Iraq). -- Clevelander 08:27, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Tunbs

Hello, I noticed you made an edit to the page on Greater and Lesser Tunbs, and you also were having a conversation with Khosrow. I think you are a sensible and moderate person. I would like to ask you to help me because I don't know what to do now. I'm new and I just happened across that article and wanted to add a bit to it to make it more neutral. What happened is that all these people immediately jumped at me and won't let me edit a thing. Just look what happened: They've reverted me every single time I wrote anything in that article. They don't even bother to explain or give any reasons. They just say it's my "POV", whatever that means. They claim I'm a "sockpuppet", for no reason whatsoever. They wipe out things they don't even disagree with, just because I wrote them. Instead they fill in dubious statements they give no references for, like that there had been an agreement between Iran and Britain, or that Iran argues the islands are theirs because they are in Iran's "territorial waters". (If Iran really argued like that, they must have very very stupid diplomats. That's really a thing only a clueless amateur could write.) I keep explaining what I'm doing on that talk page, but it feels like I'm talking to deaf walls. I made a request for comments, but nobody answered. I talked to an administrator, but he says he doesn't know enough about the topic. I'm frustrated. I think a new user shouldn't be treated like this. Can you help? Thank you, FellFairy 12:55, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Articles

Dear khoikhoi. I wonder if you could have read the any of the articles that I have provided you? if yes I would like to hear what you think.neurobio 23:38, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

918

I explained this in Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/Snle. Anyway, I geuss I may be mistaken, so I uncommented it. `'mikka (t) 02:23, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Ποντιακή ενδυμασία

I can't understand, Khoikhoi, why u dispute something so obvious... Here are some photos of a Pontian federation in Thessaloniki [27], [28], [29]. I hope this is enough to remove the request for citation from Trabzon. Hectorian 02:45, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

I still can't see your point:p. The photo u showed me is from an article about an instrument, which is an integral part of pontian music. it doesn't say anywhere that the people in the photos are lazs... And even if the traditional clothing of pontians and lazs are somehow similar (i still have not seen a laz...), this picture in Trabzon was uploaded by a greek user, stating that it pictures a pontian greek. i doubt if he would upload the picture of a laz, claiming that it is about a pontian. the same clothing is still used by the pontians in greece as u saw, so the request for citations may be removed now. btw, see the article Kemenche and what it says about the Cretan lyra and the Byzantine times. still have doubts? Hectorian 03:09, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm, i had the impression that it was uploaded by Asteraki. anyway, ask him. and also ask him of the people from the black sea region are generally known in turkey as lazs, and also if the 'lazs' is used with a negative meaning there. Hectorian 03:16, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Maybe... but, never trust the words of an asena:). Hectorian 03:21, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Can u get on gmail? Hectorian 03:21, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Baristarim

This user is messing up articles, very obviously pushing for a Pan-Turkist POV. He is even messing up the article "Babur", which is written by User:Sikanderji, an academic at Oxford! His recent edits in Babur can be interpreted as nationalistic-motivated vandalism (the information he forcefully pushes into the intro is already mentioned in the article!)

Tājik 02:57, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

I was just about to write to you about this, in fact.. First of all I am not a nationalist, believe it or not.. I have added two references from Brittanica to back up what I wrote with exactly the same wording as it is used there.. I didn't know that adding sources was vandalism!! Exactly my point, it was written by an academician himself, and therefore is originial research, it is his own thesis.. Tajik and Khosrow deleted what I wrote that was sourced to Brittanica, there are many articles in Wiki when something that was mentioned in the body of the article is also mentioned in the intro.. It is also mentioned later on that he is Muslim, why is it mentioned in the intro then? Khoikhoi, I was going to ask you what I should do since I thought of putting a post on WP:AN, but I also would like to have your opinion.. Isn't removal of sourced info vandalism? I can also say the same thing, that it should be mentioned in the intro and not later on.. In every bio article, people's ethnicities are mentioned in the intro, not later.. In my POV, it is POV-pushing to try to push it downwards in the article.. Baristarim 03:12, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Sockpuppet?

I suspect User:Henco to be a sockpuppet of newbie User:MarkStreet, who claims is the editor of "Tiraspol Times". Henco registered in 2 October and his only contribution at Wikipedia until now was to vote for links in Transnistria talk page.--MariusM 09:23, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Pan-Turkism article

User:Zaparojdik seems to be behaving badly. Could you do something to help calm the situation down? Thanks! -- Clevelander 20:40, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Rumi

The vast majority of Turks didn't even know who Rumi was until he became famous in the West and "cool". Ask Ali or someone else familiar with Persian literature, Rumi is hardly read in Turkey, and the Turkish translation of his works is new and hardly popular in Turkey. --ManiF 00:25, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but not from internet warriors who like to claim anything and anyone "cool" and "shiny" as Turk, Turkish or Turkic. A random person in the streets of Iran or Tajikistan can cite Rumi for you, but a random person in the streets of Turkey wouldn't know a thing about Rumi. As far as I know, Rumi is not widely read in Turkey, I've never seen a source that says so. --ManiF 00:41, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Rumi wrote in Turkish? Where are you getting this from? --ManiF 00:44, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, his main body of work is in Persian, but he also has a few random verses in Turkish just as in Greek and Arabic, but that doesn't make him "widely read" in Greece and Saudi Arabia, now does it? --ManiF 00:53, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Anyways, I want to get some rest. Have fun editing Pasha. --ManiF 01:04, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Just wanted to say that there is a very popular and historic Rumi whirling dervishes monastery/mosque right in the middle of Istanbul at Istiklal Caddesi, its most popular street, it is always full to the brim.. Just to avoid confusion, I am not claiming that he was Turkish, I know that he was Persian, and that he later adopted to a life in Turkic lands.. Baristarim 04:07, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

(To Khoikhoi) You're welcome. u know how i found out about them anyway...:) Hectorian 04:55, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Of course! what else could it be? u must know that these articles attract so much attention and i am not checking users' contributions:p Hectorian 04:59, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

If the modern name in english is different, why should i object? u already know that we should use the name used in English... I've already added the greek name;-) Hectorian 05:05, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Bonaparte

Yep, and definitively tagged some others. Jayjg ^(talk) 22:55, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

F R of TR

U r right about your last addition, however I had no real contribution to that article, I just reorganized and tried to lay the foundation for future improvement.. OTOH, I think that many sections will have to be improved and certain sections cut down.. I think that a paragraph needs to be written about the armenian genocide half its current size (while still conveying the same POVs) and, hop, transit the readers to relevant articles, tr-arm relations, arm gen, maybe eventually tr-eu relations.. That article still needs tons of work, there is still no Turkish-american relations article!!! thank you for the inuse tag, i wasn't aware of that astuce! :)) Baristarim 04:01, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Ok, that's an issue that I don't want to approach with a thirty foot stick :)) I was not saying to what degree the POVs should be presented.. I was just saying that a shorter paragraph needs to be written reflecting the concensus (whatever it is at the moment :)) on this issue.. that's all.. But, extreme caution has to be taken to avoid this descending to a POV-war since that section has to relate to its implications on the foreign relations of turkey at the moment.. In fact, I am completely against any POV argumentation on that section, just saying Tr-arm relations have been stranded because of the emotions surrounding the arm gen, and it is the biggest stumbling block towards a true peace in the Caucasus region, and, hop, go read the rest in other articles :)) - that sentence was one of the first edits that I made in the tr-arm relations article the second day I joined wiki :)) Something of that sort.. One of the worst results of POV-pushing in some articles is that the title of the article/sections end up having no logical relation to what is being discussed in the main body, sadly :)).. Baristarim 04:37, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

External link on the Gheorghe Funar article

I have seen that you restored the external link without making any contribution to the discussion page (and probably without even checking it first). Could you please re-remove the external link, have a look on Talk:Gheorghe_Funar and add your opinion in there, and only after that modify the article. Alexrap 10:57, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Re:Posha

Hi! Sorry for the delay. There are very few informations about these people. The sources that I have only keep repeating some words in Lomavren, that might provide some useful informations about the early history of the proto-Romani people. In fact only on Wikipedia I found the name Posha and the only link that I found to indicate they are the same or only a branch of the Lom people is this Ethnologue page. I have no idea if Posha (Bosha) it is an acceptable name by these people themselves, or they prefer Lom. Because of this scarcity of informations I didn't dare yet to begin an article about the Lom. Desiphral-देसीफ्राल talk-फेन मा 14:36, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

web page

maybe you will find this site interesting http://legionarmenian.free.fr/ . it is in russian but try babel fish it does a perfect job. http://babelfish.altavista.com neurobio 01:31, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

sorry for late reply I was offline. Misis is the ancient city dating back to prehistoric ages. misis koprusu just talks about a bridge built in the 4th century by romans.

irmak and nehir (river) are almost the same thing. Cay however is much smaller.

hi Khoikhoi. I made some aditions to the Armenian volunteer units but some how the references and links dissepeared. I could not spot why. Could you please take a look at that. thanksneurobio 19:06, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Transnistrian referendum, 2006

Khoi, since you requested full protection, which was granted, on Transnistrian referendum, 2006 due to editwarring, the edit war obviously went away (duh) but instead of solving it in Talk, the editor (User:MariusM) immediately filed a request for mediation.[30]

I have some problems with this and would like your advice and that of any others who can give advice:

1. My first concern is that he does not attempt to work out the differences amicably first, in Talk. This, to me, is bordering on Troll-like behavior.

2. My second concern is that he jumps straight to mediation without first following the normal sequence of events as outlined in WP:DR. This is not a newbie error. We had the same problem with the same person two weeks earlier, where I initially assumed that it was simply a newbie error. I pointed out what he should do[31]. Now, the second time around, he can't plead ignorance.

3. My third concern is more serious. In his mediation request, MariusM provides a very misleading list of "involved parties"; in effect stacking the deck. In the past week, he has been reverted over this by me, you, Mikka, Pernambuco, Tekleni, Int19h. Yet he leaves out you, Mikka, Pernambuco, Tekleni and instead lists as "party to the dispute" a poster sharing the same view of MariusM (User:Peteris Cedrins) who is not involved in the dispute at all and in fact doesn't have a single edit to the article in main namespace.

4. This same Peteris Cedrins, in turn, brought in two more characters: One, User:Vecrumba who is real, but shares the same focus on Baltic edits, and who has never previously had a single Transnistria-related edit either, here or elsewhere. The second, User:Anna Planeta is one of Peteris Cedrins' personal sockpuppets. This puppet is chronically inactive except for supporting Peteris Cedrins in previous reverts and, now, a mediation intervention.[32]. Earlier this year, Ghirla unmasked this particular sockpuppetry.

I don't see this going in the way of fair and constructive dispute resolution at all and I am inclined to disagree with this particular request for mediation, pending your comments. - Mauco 03:41, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Khoi, you can join the mediation process if you want. I didn't invited you as you didn't participate in talk page at our discussion regarding the disputed paragraph. Anna Planeta and Vecumbra were not listed at begining as involved parts, but they joined and agreed the mediation. Tekleni (in fact his sockpuppet Tzekai) already agreed with me that paragraph should stay, anyhow Mauco informed him about the mediation [33] and he can join mediation if he want (is not true what Mauco tell that Peteris Cedrins is my friend; for me is only a nickname found in Wikipedia, I don't know him), Pernambuco didn't have any comments about the paragraph and he specifically told he don't want anymore to get involved in this dispute [34] and Mikkalai asked for a refference which meantime was added at the disputed paragraph, and afterwards didn't participate any more at the discussion (he officialy anounced he has a break [35]).--MariusM 09:45, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Anna Planeta is just a sockpuppet of Peteris Cedrins. Neither of the two (nor Vecumbra) are parties to the dispute: None of them ever reverted me or MariusM, and none of them has a single edit in the article's mainspace. At the very least, everyone who reverted MariusM should be invited to resolve this dispute, and this should be ideally based on the log and not based on MariusM's own interpretation of who feels like being a party to the dispute and who doesn't. - Mauco 13:18, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

I didn't invite Anna Planeta or Vecumbra at mediation, it was their decision to join (about sockpuppetry, is Mauco's speculation, he shoud ask a check). Cedrins and Vecumbra participated in the article talk page, they were not able to make changes in the main space as the article was protected. Baltic people are neutral in a Romanian-Russian dispute and they have good knowledge about ex-Soviet space, their input is valuable. Pernambuco anounced already that he don't want to be involved anymore in this problem and Mikkalai anounced he has a break, this is why I didn't list them as involved party (as you know, all parties should agree to mediation). I invited User:int19h which was on Mauco's side in the talk page and Cedrins which was on my side in discussion, to have a fair mediation (2 against 2) but I have nothing against participation of more people. Mauco, please sign for agreement, mediation is a fair way to solve disputes. I am amazed by Mauco's claim that I didn't try to solve disputes in the talk page.--MariusM 14:24, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Henco

In the case of User:Henco, he may be Bonni or he may be MarkStreet, but either way, you already removed his votes - for Tiraspol Times and everything else - so it doesn't matter much at this stage. He didn't come back, didn't repost his votes, so the issue got sorted out easily. There are some other users in that voting round which are obvious sockpuppets, but the Henco instance is DOA. - Mauco 03:47, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Iranians notice board

I thought the notice board was just what the name implied, a notice board?Khosrow II 04:41, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

But I'm not telling anyone to vote in any way, just to voice their opinions. For all I know, there could be a person who would vote keep, or delete, or merge, or whatever. When there is a vote going on, everyone needs to know about it.Khosrow II 06:02, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

But its not my responsibility to notify them, they have their own wikiprojects/notice boards for a reason, they can do the same thing, cant they?Khosrow II 15:11, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

But I never told anyone to vote. I said come voice your opinions...Khosrow II 05:03, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Here is something from awhile ago. Azerbaijani notice board: [36]. See, its perfectly normal to do this and others do it too, its not vote stacking at all, its just notifying people whats going on. Its a notice board for a reason.Khosrow II 04:49, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Ok, thanks.Khosrow II 04:53, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

WTF?

Ainu people "scare quotes"?

I happen to like Japanese people including those that are Ainu ok? you don't make baseless acusations. 132.241.246.111 05:05, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

O.J.

Maybe you don't know it but the Ainu people were in the Islands long before anyone else so if any one group has a right to the title of "ethnic Japanese" it's them hence the phrase was put in quotation marks to avoid pushing a POV.

Pontic Greek

Kukul.jpg. He's Greek...One of the Semercidis's oldest illustraions. User Omer? I don't know. He doesn't use html anyway.--Salahana 10:04, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

RfA thanks

Thank you for participating in my RfA, which finished with a tally of 66/11/5. I learned quite a bit during the process, and I expect to be learning a lot more in the days ahead. I will be taking things slowly (and doing a lot of re-reading), but I hope you will let me know if there is anything I can do to improve in my new capacity. -- Merope Talk 12:57, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Re HR in Turkey

It is still considered an edit warrning. Think ahead Khoikhoi. Try to imagine whether people might doubt what you wrote, or need more information about it. Supporting what is written in Wikipedia by referring to a clear and reliable source will add stability to your contribution. When in doubt about whether something might be disputed, provide a specific citation.

The policy mandates the following:

• Articles should contain only material that has been published by reputable sources.

• Editors adding new material to an article should cite a reputable source, or it may be challenged or removed by any editor.

• The obligation to provide a reputable source lies with the editors wishing to include the material, not on those seeking to remove it.

My advice, in order to enhance the article, is to go look for references. As i said Khoikhoi in the article's talk page, references to Human rights in Turkey are so abundant. -- Szvest 23:08, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

You can just be bold and go restore the sourced material. If the anon removes that than it will be considered vandalism and they will be warned or blocked if they are persistent. -- Szvest 23:37, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

It has already been done by Tekleni. -- Szvest 23:40, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Where to report open proxies

It would be better if you reported open proxies at WP:OP, not at WP:AIV. This way, the proxy can be blocked across all Wikimedia Foundation projects after it gets verified. Jesse Viviano 19:48, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

I changed my mind. If the proxy is being used to vandalize, then report it at both places. I realized that there could be times where the proxy is being used for vandalism now, and need immediate attention. However, reporting it at one place can leave Wikipedia exposed for a long time, or leave all other projects exposed until someone else catches it again. Jesse Viviano 03:21, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

My RfA

Just wanted to send a quick note of thanks for your support in my RfA. :-) I really appreciate it! Best, Irongargoyle 19:59, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Henco is indeed MarkStreet

I asked for a checkuser and received a confirmation that Henco is indeed MarkStreet [37]. Another person User:Gallenweekend voted in Transnistria talk page for Tiraspol Times, he registered in 7 October and the only thing he did was to vote for "Tiraspol Times". Checkuser don't confirm him as a sockpuppet, however I still have doubts. MarkStreet was aware of the sockpuppetry accusation as of 6 October, he could take some measures not to be identified as sockpuppet.--MariusM 22:44, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

circassians

why did you remove the sprotected ? Instead of reverting this IP address, it seems as the best solution. Amoruso 00:03, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

yep, just realised it ! d'oh ! :) well it seems like a good solution, i'll ask someone. Amoruso 00:06, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

The map

No, not everyone's happy. That map is garbage. It contradicts maps put out by reliable organizations. It has half of Iran as being Turkic! Its ridiculous, I dont know who made the map, but they obviously didnt know much.Khosrow II 00:48, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Please be more observant this time. Now Baristam thinks he's right.Khosrow II 00:54, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

You just put the same map in again. What are you doing? The colored map is the exact same thing except with colors added.Khosrow II 00:55, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Please undo that map also, its not accurate. Look at the locations of Turks in Eastern Europe and the Crimea, its ridiculous!Khosrow II 00:57, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, its less exaggerated, but its still exaggerated.Khosrow II 00:59, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

What the hell is this khosrow? [38] You have been doing this for ages about every article to recruit meatpuppets.. once again under attack?? How dare you judge the contributions or efforts of other users like this? STOP, if you don't and this continues, I will be reporting to u and the rest of your gang to admins.. Khoikhoi - what do u think? Baristarim 01:06, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Arabs in Turkey

I know, it's a dicey terminological situation. There are two groups (Alevis and Alawis), but these are the same word in Turkish (Alevi). So the original LOC article said Alevi – evidently taking its data from Turkish sources – while clearly meaning to signify the same sect as you find in Syria (Alawis). Would you rather we went back to the older formulation, which mentioned several variant spellings in the same breath? I wasn't sure whether this would help clarify the situation or confuse it. Q·L·1968 ☿ 03:33, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm afraid I can't help you with the Arabic names – I don't actually read Arabic, but since the article on İskenderun provided an Arabic equivalent, I copied it over. (Must get around to learning the Arabic alphabet one of these days...) Q·L·1968 ☿ 15:40, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi there!

I actually became dismissed from the desk job obviously for political reasons and I returned back to military training. I run for three kilometres in the morning. Not yet so terrible though...

As for the article Arabs in Turkey, I humbly advise you not to rely on Congress Library data for any article. Some factual errors: Hatay currently has a Turkish-majority population, the figure % 4 is highly doubtful, most Arabs in Turkey are Sunnis. For example the wife of Prime Minister Erdoğan is a Sunni Arab from Siirt. Both Sunni and Alawi Arabs live in Hatay. The schism between these populations are obvious. Sunni Arabs have a significantly high rate of illiteracy and other indicators of social impoverishment. Arab population in Gaziantep is negligible and Arabs form the majority in these districts in Siirt, Şanlıurfa, and Mardin: Siirt, Aydınlar; Akçakale, Harran; Mardin, Savur, Yeşilli. All three of these provinces have overall Kurdish majorities. There are also groups of Sunni Arabs in Adana and Mersin. For example, some Sunni Arabs in Çukurova are descendants of refugees from present-day Libya who left for Anatolia following the Italo-Turkish War in 1912. So, the case is not so simple as the Congress Library bric-a-brac asserts. ;-) Take good care of yourself and pray to G-d for me...Ciao! Behemoth 08:39, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

For reverting vandalism to my talk page. MER-C 08:42, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Ok, thanks :) Baristarim 08:53, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

"Sumerian gulf"

Hi, I noticed your complaint about that guy who was trolling the Persian Gulf with his Sumerian gulf neologism. Good joke, for sure. I guess you won't mind if I have put the redirect up for deletion. Fut.Perf. ☼ 12:15, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

My RfA

Thank you for participating in my RfA, which passed with a tally of 91/1/4. I can't express how much it means to me to become an administrator. I'll work even more and harder to become useful for the community. If you need a helping hand, don't hesitate to contact me. NCurse work 15:28, 8 October 2006 (UTC)