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(Redirected from Talk:Gavin Dempsey)

Requested move 15 March 2020

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The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved, but made Tweek a disambiguation page. -- JHunterJ (talk) 12:36, 7 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Gavin Dempsey → Tweek – Per WP:COMMONNAME. The common name that this person is known by is Tweek (his professional alias). However, that page is currently a redirect to List of students at South Park Elementary#Tweek Tweek. I propose that this article be moved to Tweek, with a 'if you're looking for' template placed at the top for people looking for the South Park character. There's precedent for esports player articles using the alias as the article title (MKLeo, Leffen, Plup), but also precedent for using their biological name. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 19:16, 15 March 2020 (UTC)—Relisting. Jerm (talk) 14:58, 23 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support per nom, he's known only by his screenname. SnowFire (talk) 02:55, 16 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong oppose - the mainstream reliable sources always identify him by his full name - not his alias alone. Using his full name provides superior WP:NATURALDIS. Naming articles by these gamer aliases is also unprofessional and plays into a fanbase at the expense of good taste. This player is also NOT the most common use of Tweek (certainly not above the South Park character or the general term). -- Netoholic @ 05:34, 16 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Comment. "Unprofessional" or "good taste" is a matter of preference, sure, but the part about "mainstream reliable sources" doesn't seem right. The vast majority of references in the current article are a sea of "Tweek". If some of these sources are considered not mainstream enough - a more established source like this ESPN article identifies the player as Gavin "Tweek" Dempsey in the first paragraph, and then proceeds to use "Tweek" afterward throughout the article to discuss the subject. It seems the name used in mainstream reliable sources is "Tweek", and sometimes it really is by alias alone, not that this would matter IMO if Gavin Dempsey is mentioned once and then dispensed with. As a reminder, articles are for readers, and many readers (including myself in this case) have absolutely no idea what the "real" name is behind an alias. SnowFire (talk) 17:11, 16 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Although I will add on the matter of fans lacking good taste - I don't see how gamer handles are any different than author pennames. It's perfectly cultured to talk about Mark Twain or George Elliot in high academic journals, or more recent examples like Madonna or Lady Gaga. People sometimes have performer names, it's no big deal, and it's not a recent change. SnowFire (talk) 17:23, 16 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • When gamers get talked about in high academic journals", then your point may be valid. But in every mainstream and highly-respected source, gamers are never introduced by their gamer tag alone without reference to their full name. It is only in fan-level media where they can get away with using such shortcutting. What a disingenuous comparison. -- Netoholic @ 03:48, 17 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
        • We'll have to agree to disagree. My contention above is sincere, not disingenuous.
        • Also, per above, how someone is introduced is less important than how they are referred to in the body of a text. 1x reference to a real name in an introduction and 20x references to a penname is a strong sign for using the penname. Note that Wikipedia's own article "introduces" Twain as Samuel Langhorne Clemens in the opening sentence, then proceeds to refer to him as Twain when discussing his work. SnowFire (talk) 04:16, 17 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
          • Article titles are all about how someone is introduced - that's what a title is. That introduction in reliable sources is how those sources do their own form of disambiguation. For example, a source might use the full name of an organization, but then later use an acronym in the rest of the text multiple times as a shortcut. But we would not weigh multiple uses within a source of that acronym toward COMMONNAME - we'd use the full name just as they did. Likewise, if a high quality source introduces a person, they often do so by full name first, and then either last name or stagename or alias for the rest of the time. It is very few people that are popular enough to warrant only use of the stagename or alias because that identity is ubiquitous in the culture... and in those cases we name articles based on that alias. I can think of no professional gamer which meets that standard in the common culture, so -all- of their articles should be named for their full name. -- Netoholic @ 04:50, 17 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per WP:COMMONNAME.--Ortizesp (talk) 00:04, 17 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Move to Tweek (video game player), not Tweek. I've seen no evidence that the esports player is the primary topic associated with the name "Tweek". In addition to the South Park character, tweek can refer to a form of radio interference, a character in Fur Fighters, various misspellings or variants of tweak, and a handful of trivial literary usages. Meeting the primary topic is a relative high bar, and at best 'Tweek' is currently equally prominent between the cartoon character and the person, although the former has been in use much longer than the latter. --Animalparty! (talk) 03:01, 20 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose as currently proposed. I am not seeing evidence of a clear primary topic. A quick Google search reveals a wide range of meanings for the word, "Tweek", and confirms that this is also a common misspelling of "tweak". BD2412 T 16:21, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong oppose. This is a person, not a dog. You have a redirect from Tweek, this is enough for search. Mikus (talk) 19:30, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA Review

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Gavin Dempsey/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: David Fuchs (talk · contribs) 17:54, 3 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

{{in progress}} Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 17:54, 3 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments below:

  • Overall
    • Is there nothing out there about his early life and how he got into professional competition? You have his hometown in the infobox and his birthdate in the lead, but no apparent reference for this information.
    • Lead doesn't adequately summarize article (it feels like a random assortment of his top finishes instead of following a structure that explains the topic.)
  • Prose:
    • You shouldn't use contractions for encyclopedic writing (the character he'd use two years later in his first tournament win)
    • What are the Panda Global Rankings? These are repeatedly referred to but never with an indication of why that's notable. Same with Low Tier City 5/7, etc. It really needs to be more accessible to more casual readers.
  • References:
    • You've got a lot of opening sentences in paragraphs that aren't referenced, and go beyond what I'd consider uncontroversial statements that don't need to be, especially since they editorialize on his performance, e.g. Although Tweek competed in a small number of Super Smash Bros. Melee events, he first rose to prominence competing in Super Smash Bros. for Wii U., Tweek's next tournament wins came in May, where he won both Saints Gaming Live and Get On My Level 2019. , Genesis 6, which was held at the end of January, was Tweek's first major event after being signed by TSM., Throughout the second half of 2019, Tweek put on strong performances at several major tournaments, but won few of them., Due to the pandemic, most of the tournaments scheduled for the first half of 2020 were cancelled or moved online.—citations needed. This is a huge issue throughout the article.
    • What makes Shoryuken, The Game Haus, EvenHubs, GameTyrant, Hotspawn, and Dexerto reliable sources? I not specifically that Shoryuken, Dexerto, and EventHubs are listed as unreliable per discussions at WP:VG/S.
    • Spot-checked statements attributed to current refs 1, 2, 7, 12, 14, 15, 21, 29, 34, and 42.
      • Ref 14 is used to source As a result of his strong performances, Tweek was ranked the second best Smash player for 2018 in the Panda Global Rankings, behind only Leonardo "MKLeo" López Pérez. By this time, Panda Globlal listed his main character as Bayonetta, with Cloud Strife and Donkey Kong as secondaries. but the video at the time quoted says nothing about his secondary characters.

The fact that a number of references appear to be unreliable and there's a ton of synthesis here, as well as a lack of basic information I'd expect to meet the minimum threshold of comprehensiveness, mean I'm failing the article at present. Once the above issues have been addressed I encourage you to resubmit the article. Thanks, Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 20:58, 8 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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