Talk:Frazer Nash

Comments

Most references imply that AFN = "Archibald Frazer-Nash", not "Aldington Frazer-Nash". -- Hotlorp 19:13, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Agree! Deleted acronym explanation and added formation summary of AFN Ltd which pre-dates acquisition by HJ Aldington. Refer to Jenkinson and Thirlby.

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Where did the "2" come from, for the number of Continentals built? I saw what I thought was the only one a couple of months ago at Prescott. -- Hotlorp 01:08, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Michael Sedgwick says two in his A-Z of Cars of 1945-1970. Quote- "One car (with reduced capacity engine) was bodied by Lotus Elite stylist Kirwan-Taylor; other was clothed with bodywork utilising Porsche roof and doors."

http://www.frazernash-usa.com/afn01.htm agrees there were two. Malcolma 08:41, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Apples and Pears

Frazer Nash is Cockney rhyming slang for slash. But it's not easy to see where this fact might fit into the article. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:33, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

Name

The name of the article should be hyphenated.

http://www.classiccarcatalogue.com/F/frazer%20nash%201956%20march_ad.jpg

Some sources show the name hyphenated, most do not. See the References and External links of the article. 72Dino (talk) 19:08, 2 October 2012 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page not moved. Most votes below oppose the move, so certainly no consensus in favour, and it's almost two weeks old.  — Amakuru (talk) 21:59, 26 June 2013 (UTC) (non-admin closure)

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Frazer Nash → Frazer-Nash – The company's name is hyphenated, as it is based on the founder's surname; for a reference, see the talkpage post above this. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 09:21, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

• Comment Neither of the two external links use a dash/hyphen, and the logo itself says "FRAZERNASH" from those links -- 65.94.79.6 (talk) 09:20, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

• [1][2][3][4][5] - certainly in its most recent form, the company's name is hyphenated. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 09:31, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

• AgreeUnsure, but there seem to be a few hyphens missing here? Martinevans123 (talk) 09:42, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

• If the move goes through, I'll go and hyphenate everything in both articles. [6][7] are examples. Part of the problem seems to be an enormous inconsistency with sources; some list both Archie and his company with hyphens, some without, and some split the two! Anyone with a bit of knowledge about British family names would know that "Frazer Nash" would almost certainly be incorrect, whereas "Frazer-Nash" is highly plausible - especially for someone of an upper-class background (which, given his place of birth, and the military rank he obtained, he clearly was upper-class.) Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 09:50, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Oppose: this article is about the Frazer Nash car company and that most certainly did not have a hyphen in spite of the founder having a hyphen in his name. There is no hyphen used by the Frazer Nash Club and they should know. The link quoted above takes you to an advert for Fraser-Nash spelt with an S not a Z so I don't think that is relevant. I don't know who they are. The current company which is mainly an engineering consultancy has a hyphen but they are not what this article is about. Malcolma (talk) 09:55, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Is the company name a registered trade mark? Martinevans123 (talk) 10:00, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

• [8] - an official advert from the company, I'm pretty sure. Clearly has a hyphen. Once again, the Frazer-Nash Namir has a hyphen in almost every single source, and that's definitely to do with this company. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 10:02, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Rather buried under Aeronautical career in the Wikipedia article on Archibald Frazer-Nash is a statement that he added the hyphen to his surname in 1938. If you Google the words frazer nash hyphen you will get an Amazon book extract from A to Z of Sports Cars: 1945-1990 (it has an impossibly long URL so I won't try and copy it here) which goes into the use of the hyphen.

The references given above all apply to the proposed car to be made by the new company. The original car company name was not hyphenated. Malcolma (talk) 10:23, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

So the car company, and all of its cars, predated the change of name? Martinevans123 (talk) 10:46, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

• Absolutely no opinion at all, thus oppose change. More than any other maker, it seems to be unclear just which form F-N used themselves, or whether this changed over time. To avoid name ping-pong, we should make no change here until some absolutely rock-solid evidence shows up to put it one way or the other.

Note also that Archie F-N's name isn't a source for the company name, nor is the name of the modern company. They're separate entities. Andy Dingley (talk) 11:10, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

This issue was covered in Throughbred and Classic Car magazine back in October 1981, unfortunately I no longer have a copy to inform you of it's conclusion and although I remember the article I don't remember the result, hopefully someone else has access. Mighty Antar (talk) 23:24, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I have a copy. It’s on page 83 and it’s by Harold Hastings (who sadly died shortly before the issue was published). His research is thorough and authoritative. His conclusion is that the name of the car certainly did have the hyphen, while the name of the company that made it did not. Indeed, he argues that Capt. Nash later changed his name for the recognition it gave him with his own very successful marque. Other double-barrelled names in the pre-war market included: Alfa-Romeo, Austro-Daimler, Angus-Sanderson, Belsize-Bradshaw, Charron-Laycock, Chenard-Walcker, De Dion Bouton, Delaunay-Belleville, Hispano-Suiza, Isotta-Fraschini, Leon-Bollee, Paige-Jewitt, Rolls Royce and Straker-Squire. In fact, about four out of every five names. If anyone one would like a scanned copy of this one-page article, let me know and I’ll email it. Or else is there an easy way to get it published at Commons? Martinevans123 (talk) 17:45, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose I've done a fair amount of research when writing 1950s American automobile culture and American automobile industry in the 1950s (both are GA) and most sources did not use hyphens. Dennis Brown | 2¢ | © | WER 12:20, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

these darned Yankees... can't be trusted wirh good solid Britsh hyphens that were built to last... etc etc., [9] Martinevans123 (talk) 15:05, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

We yanks, you might notice, are also quite fond of commas, yet not hyphens, when most sources don't use them. ;-) Dennis Brown | 2¢ | © | WER 16:08, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

another Great British "marque" (of yester-year)! Martinevans123 (talk) 10:02, 23 June 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

If anyone still wants a copy of the Classic Cars article, please email me. Cheers. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:04, 26 June 2013 (UTC) To summarise - the article says the car models used the hyphen, while the name of the manufacturer did not. So the question is - do the names of the cars in the image captions, and in the table, relate to individual models or to the manufacturer? Either way, I think they should be made consistent!

• I wouldn't mind having a copy, but I think we need more than a single source to verify this. I can look deeper based on that. Dennis Brown | 2¢ | © | WER 11:21, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

  Will send you one later, Dennis. He cites a few books as sources and gives a copy of an early newspaper advert. Meanwhile, shouldn't the article usage at least be consistent? Martinevans123 (talk) 11:36, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

  Taking WP:BRD literal, it should stay like it is, which is the previous consensus version as well. I'm not dogmatic about the hyphens either way, but there is a legitimate argument about "consistency" that says to never use them as well. Dennis Brown | 2¢ | © | WER 13:30, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

BMW badge?

I note that there was a lengthy connection with BMW both pre-and post-war. Did FN ever badge some of their models with BMW badges? Reason I ask is that I have just watched a 1953 film "Park Plaza 605" and managed to identify a car in the film as a "Frazer Nash Targa Florio,", and I am pretty sure that I saw a BMW Logo on the bonnet. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.7.195.132 (talk) 12:16, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Photograph of "1956 Mille Miglia"

One of the photographs is captioned "1956 Mille Miglia", but the article details state that the Mille Miglia model was in production only from 1948 to 1953. The additional details at the original photograph file state "(DVLA) first registered Year of manufacture 1956", so have the years of registration and manufacture been confused? Blurryman (talk) 22:55, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

I've just found other photographs of this same car, showing (registration number?) ERG3, at

http://theministryofclassiccars.com/1952-frazer-nash-mm-mille-miglia-2/

Does anyone object to the caption on this photograph in the article being changed (with appropriate annotation)? Blurryman (talk) 23:17, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

I've now noticed that the caption to the original photograph on Flickr gives the date as 1951, so it seems even the owner of the photograph is not clear about the date for the car. Is it even a Mille Miglia? The car looks almost identical to pictures I've seen of a 1952 Targa Florio model. Were they of distinctively different appearance? Blurryman (talk) 23:35, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for taking an interest in this matter. Q1 my guess is whoever re-registered it (DVLA) didn't know the correct year of manufacture. Q2 I'd guess that's right. Q3 Shouldn't think so. Q4 Its a bit like eating unwashed strawberries isn't it, maybe all's well, maybe it isn't! I am pretty sure I'm responsible for providing the 1956 from the DVLA, trying to protect myself by noting it was what was given to them. I do know it can happen that the same car can be brought out to a track again each year with minor mods. I think you should do whatever you think is best. Would it ease the pain if the photo of that particular car were just deleted? Best, Eddaido (talk) 13:46, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply. I've gone with changing the date in the caption to 1951, as shown in the photo file details, since that is more in accord with the stated years of manufacture of the Mille Miglia model. But if you're not happy with this, please feel free to change it! Regards. Blurryman (talk) 23:36, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Modern day; "Frazer Nash" and "Frazer-Nash"

An acquittance being hired by "Frazier Nash", which I knew nothing of, and as I am curious, I search for it. No trace of "Frazier Nash", but obviously "Frazer-Nash consultancy, a KBR company" cut the deal. Hum... seems quite different though... until checked their our heritage. Looks like the modern day Frazer-Nash somehow relates to Nash & Thompson. This also explains why you can find both "Frazer Nash" and "Frazer-Nash"

Not sure the Frazer Nash consultancy is notorious enough to get its own page, but this requires son ambiguity treatment. I will try something 2A01:E0A:1DC:4570:1412:DAA4:63EB:B496 (talk) 17:13, 3 May 2023 (UTC)