Talk:Fantasy football (gridiron)/Archive 1

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 20 January 2021 and 2 May 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Knickthebills.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 21:10, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Types of Leagues Section

I was hoping to learn how to play, but the wiki article opens by crushing my hopes: "In head-to-head leagues, a team matches up versus a different team each week." What does this mean? What constitutes a team? An actual NFL team? Or a group of friends playing fantasy football? Majermike (talk) 03:46, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

A Little Work

This is a sort of convoluted article. It is really difficult at times to understand. 75.48.30.247 (talk) 04:02, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

The "what is a fantasy sport and how is it played" material here should be removed in favor of a link to the generic fantasy sport page; only the information specific to the American football variety (including its apparent primacy) needs its own page. Markjreed (talk) 11:15, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

If anyone has the requisite knowledge, I'd say this article seriously needs much more than one line about fantasy football based on soccer. After all, the phrase here in Britain pretty much always refers to the round-ball game, yet the article is written as though "football" meant the same thing to everyone. Loganberry 22:06, 30 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Above now unnecessary given the retitling of the article. Loganberry 01:17, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)

An overview of VBD in the article would be worthwhile.

Origins

There should be mention of the original location for Fantasy football events: "The Kings X" on Piedmont Ave in Oakland. There is mention of this history in the January/February 2007 edition of Oakland Magazine. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.142.101.168 (talk) 05:51, 2 February 2007 (UTC).

I've removed the bit on the Asgard Fantasy Football whatever, because it doesn't seem to fit into a general overview on the origins of Fantasy Football. --128.227.131.206 01:40, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

If there is any interest at all in allowing external links, I would like a site that I am affiliated with considered. I noticed it is not on Wikipedia. I am a newbie to Wikipedia, but would love to get more involved. Let me know if there is any interest and I can let you know the site. I just don't want to get attacked for spamming. CaptainTiff (talk) 20:35, 8 August 2008 (UTC)Tiffany

There likely would not be interest. Thank you for being considerate enough to ask though. If more folks were like you, my job would be easier. Montco (talk) 21:45, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

External links

These external links are out of control. Perhaps we can vote on a few links we feel worthy?--Blahblah44 18:19, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

They are all equal, however, it is difficult to find the best. Maybe link to none at all? Zorgon 00:25, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

As long as the site's are valid, I don't have a problem with it. It's the sites that lead to broken or "under construction" pages that irritate. Also, the marketing terms "best" "coolest", etc should be left out in my opinion.

The category "Applications To Assist Managing You Fantasy Football Team" is of highly questionable value. I like and respect the sites there, but really, such subdividing of services can really get out of control. Keep it simple, Commissioner Service/Hosting sites and Information sites. Thats all thats really needed. And lets stop going back and forth on the descriptive text following the links. Either we have it or we dont. --Kenmoody 22:56, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

May I suggest just linking to ffbookmarks.com? It's a good portal to many different sites and would get rid of the clutter? 24.254.237.138 03:04, 1 July 2006 (UTC)Z

I'd be very against linking to ffbookmarks as it's not in any way an impartial source. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.229.218.141 (talk • contribs) 21:37, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

ffbookmarks may not be impartial, but DMOZ is. 46 links is beyond excessive. --AbsolutDan ^(talk) 20:42, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

There are many quality sites out there that can be broken into many categories (free contests, league managers, information sites, etc.) however players in this industry (even just the major players) are now in the dozens so whatever the decision ends up being regarding whether or not to have external links, I think it should remain consistent. For example: Why is there currently only one company (footballdiehards) being linked to? 70.183.19.205 23:13, 18 October 2006 (UTC) fantasy football enthusiast

In my mind, the current format is inconsistent. Why list league sites, but not list information sites? If it's too much, then just list the major players so people get an idea and have places to go, but throwing out the entire baby with the bathwater isn't the way to go imho. --stefan 80.109.88.200 11:13, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't know if this can be done but can an Admin or Moderator lock down the External Links section. In reveiwing the history over the last 8 months, there is a CONSTANT edit/change process relating to people putting in links, others taking them out, then people deciding some sites aren't "popular enough", then deciding that no external links other than DMOZ should be allowed, only to have people start adding links once more and starting the process all over again. Can we please put an end to this? Any thoughts? Contenteditor 22:45, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

There is not nearly enough linkspam to warrant semiprotecting the page. I guess I don't agree that we have a problem, especially now that there isn't a huge linkfarm there anymore to entice spammers. One spam revert every few days is not a big deal. n₆^c 23:08, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. It is a nuisance to deal with, but I guarantee an admin would not grant a semi-protect. They only act on much more serious cases. SubSeven 00:32, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

There are certain sites that are demonstrably more steeped in the history of online fantasy football.. where are they: theHuddle? Gridiron Grumblings? KFFL? These sites were providing fantasy football news and information since before the "boom" of fantasy sports, and they are still publishing quality work. Why are they being removed in favor of souless late-comers and corporate megasites that have displayed ZERO innovation and/or insight into the game?

DMOZ keeps deleting all the people on here. Not really fair. Everyone should be able to post their sites here if they are not for profit and trying to get info out there. Why DMOZ do you keep deleting everyone elses sites????

I recently published an article, for my syndicated column which appears in a few Chicago area newspapers, about Fantasy Football. I have submitted it here for your consideration for the External Links section. I have submitted other published articles via discussion in the past to various Wikipedia topics. If you feel the intent is not really warranted, no harm, that's why I posted it here first. Fantasy Football and Google Docs --Dkaufman1 16:51, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Ijust posted an entry on Fantasy Football on the web that I thought was pretty good and didn't have links in it, but upon wandering in here (which I guess Ishould have done first) it seems you guys have already been back and forth on the subject of discussing sites that are involved. I would like to say I think there should be SOME discussion of Fantasy Football on the web - it's insane not too - I do understand the danger in mentioning one site and not another. I tried to be specific by mentioning the big corporate sites, as well as small sites that did stuff specific and when it came to audio either rated well on Itunes or were doing video blogging which while not novel, is new in terms of how it's being produced with money behind it now.

Anyway, I think the section should stand, but others may feel the need to trim it, given the earlier discussion. But I strongly feel there needs to be an entry here on the impact of fantasy on the web.Raltorn 22:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Expansion

Shouldn't there be mention of keeper leagues and dynasty leagues as well?

DMOZ.Org please stop deleting posts. Thank you. Jordanb4prez 19:40, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Link sites with thousands of links, 25% of them being dead, are useless. Newer ones such as www.allfantasyfootballlinks.com which emphasize less sites but ones with quality need to be promoted.

Demographics

It would be fun to have info about demographics, such as : how many people now play the game ? What is the average profile of a player (age, sex, race) ?

I fail to see the usefulness of such information. As well, it would be difficult to obtain accurate information. It seems to me that profiling an average player would be subjective. Besides, if people from all ages and races enjoy the game, why exclude them? Maybe an accurate number of users on a popular site like Yahoo Fantasy Sports would be useful. Lincoln187 07:55, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

The FSTA has good information regarding market size & demographics, but Yahoo has never been helpful in compiling this data.

Yahoo

Is it just me, or is the Yahoo section of the article a little out of control? I mean, mentioning popular websites such as cbs, espn, and yahoo is fine, but why do we need a screen capture?

cleaning up

Ive spent some time cleaning up this article, correcting errors, rewriting and adding sections. It still needs an organizational overhaul, though; the sections must follow a logical order and nest correctly -- currently they do not. any takers? 68.36.197.244 08:00, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Along the same lines, what's with the RotoHog spiel? There are dozens if not hundreds of different ways to play fantasy football, I don't see anything but advertising in describing RotoHog's system, naming the site and linking to it.

types of games -- clarification

the article is very unclear on types of games. Here is some information that should be worked into the article:

==Types of games==

There are three major types of fantasy games: regular, salary cap, or one-timer.

===Regular leagues===
In regular leagues, owners keep their players from week-to-week (unless dropped or traded), and no player may be owned by more than one team.  Initial methods of player allocation are serpentine drafts or auctions.  The leagues may be also categorized by how the transition between years is handled: teams may completely re-draft or re-auction, keep a limited number of players (keepers), or keep as many players as liked (dynasty).

===Salary cap leagues===
In salary cap leagues, owners may arrange their teams however they like as long as they are under-budget.  Players may be owned by multiple teams simultaneously.

===One timer leagues===
Owners may select their rosters each week however they like, with the stipulation that one can only own a player for one week each year.  Players may be owned by multiple teams simultaneously.

Competition format

All three types of league may use one of two competition formats: Head-to-head, with weekly matchups and seeded playoffs, or rotisserie, where only cumulative points matter. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.36.197.244 (talk • contribs) 08:11, 4 December 2006 (UTC).

Effects on Spectatorship section

I'm inclined to remove this altogether unless somebody provides a published source. It's a somewhat obvious synthesis of factual information, but it's a synthesis nonetheless. N6 03:04, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

I think the critical paragraphs in this section are altogether uninformative. Jake Plummer might feel fantasy football has ruined the game, but he nor the editor gives any reason why. And frankly, who cares if fantasy football players are "an incongruity in the wants."? Who cares if they cheer for both teams or only for the running game of a particular offense? I don't see why spectators can't get whatever enjoyment they want out of football, or sports, or anything for that matter. I think this section is interesting to highlight how rooting has changed from a traditional favorite team to a tangled web of different individual scenarios, but I don't see the point in mentioning that a few ex-football players think that is a bad thing. I don't see how their opinion is all that meaningful or interesting. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.18.101.5 (talk) 19:51, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Punter?

Which fantasy football league has punters available? I've never seen one.--RaiderFan 01:03, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

There are a few. For example, SportsGrumblings.com offers TUFF leagues which use punters as a skill position. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.99.15.253 (talk) 21:25, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Number of QBs

I had changes the number of QBs used on a regular roster from 1, to 1 or 2 and it was changed back. Maybe it's just me, but half the leagues I've played in have used one, the other half 2. And I've also never seen a league with 1 QB and 3 WRs. on 1 with 2 or 2 with 3. DevelopmentArrested 00:12, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

It is just you. I have never played in a league with two QB's, nor has anyone I know who plays fantasy football, nor have any of us ever been invited to such a league. There's also the fact that the default settings on Yahoo, CBS Sportsline, ESPN, and every fantasy-info site I've ever used or seen all have one QB as the default (they usually allow more, but the default is always one). Two QB's is exceedingly rare, except if you happen to play with people who use that format, in which case it would appear common without actually being so. It would make sense to pick one "default" roster that can be agreed upon, and then mention that each position can have more or fewer slots than the default. I suggest we use the Yahoo default roster, which uses one QB, three WR's, two RB's, one TE, one K, one DST, and no Flex. eae 18:45, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

(I deletd the message that was below me bc it was a blatant ad) Well then if we're only going on default rosters, then it should be lables 3 WRs not "2 or 3" DevelopmentArrested 01:15, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

You're right, i fixed it. eae 18:26, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Editorial material

INDIVIDUAL DEFENSIVE PLAYERS or IDP NFL Fantasy Football There is an article here that explains the new 2009 strategy of IDP Fantasy Football: http://monksidpweeknflfantasyfootball.blogspot.com/2009/09/idp-fantasy-football-2009-year-of.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by WRArtMonk (talk • contribs) 19:15, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

I'll be randomly pulling out some editorial material related to fantasy football. Some of which may or may not be useful. KyuuA4 23:18, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Link Nomination

Fantasy Football always seems better when your team is brought to life. Most of the sites like Yahoo and ESPN have custom logo creators and such that are just simply garbage. A link should be added for these guys who slave to bring creativity and realism into fantasy football leagues...all for free.

http://thefantasyhelmetproject.com/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Helmetcreator (talk • contribs) 19:47, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

The lack of external links in this article are ridiculous. The links in the fantasy basketball and fantasy baseball articles seem to be much more appropriate.

In addition to links to the big media sites like yahoo, cbs and espn, I'd also recommend a link to RotoHog.

• RotoHog Fantasy Football Website —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.174.254.54 (talk) 05:30, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

This isn't an advertising platform, not for Yahoo, not for CBS and not for Rotohog. There is too much linkspam at WP anyway.Montco (talk) 11:52, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Good Article that explains many of the common questions about fantasy football http://www.fantasydraftmaster.com/fantasy-football-questions/ thought it might be useful (Dmay22 (talk) 02:45, 18 March 2010 (UTC))

Next Generation of Fantasy Football (ADVERT)

The recently added "Next Generation of Fantasy Football" section is written like an advertisement.

Please help rewrite this from a neutral point of view and add citations to support the inclusion of this section in the article.

Blatant advertising that would require a fundamental rewrite to become encyclopedic, should be deleted. Comment added by Punters (talk • contribs) 16:13, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

OPRK????

what is this? do you want it green or red? do you want it high or low? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.255.179.86 (talk) 16:42, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Team Rosters - Scoring

I would say that Points Per Reception scoring leagues are probably more popular now than Pure Yardage leagues. The author should consider adding a paragraph here about PPR leagues and variations. It may even be worth pulling the "Scoring" subsection out of "Team Rosters" and promoting it to its own section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mitchwenger (talk • contribs) 03:11, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Scoring definitely can/should be it's own section just due to the fact that it is an essential part of the game and there are a bunch of different options that come with it. Knickthebills (talk) 19:19, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

Fantasy strategy and WP:NOTGUIDE

A few days ago, I removed some of the strategy stuff (such as that which went into great detail, including giving the drafting of specific players as example) because it seems to go against WP:NOTGUIDE. It was reinserted yesterday. Rather than start an edit war, I thought I'd post it here and see if we could get a consensus on the material. Kansan (talk) 15:57, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

How is it scored?

The lead needs a brief, general explanation of how the scoring works. Is the idea that the better the players on your team do each week, the more points you score? —JerryFriedman (Talk) 01:07, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

I agreed so strongly that I rewrote the introduction before I read this comment. I came here to explain why.

I had no idea at all how this game was played. The intro gave no clue. I had to go to the bottom of the article before I found text which made it possible to understand what this game is and how it is played.

So I rewrote the intro. Now it clearly states the core of how the game is played and why it is important generally.

Nick Beeson (talk) 14:15, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

I'm not really clear on why you'd take it upon yourself to rewrite the lede for fantasy football when you admit you "had no idea at all" what the game is or how it is played. In addition, your "rewrite" was simply copying and pasting an old version of the lede that is still extant on various vampire sites but that had long since been revised away on Wikipedia proper. I think you made the edits in good faith, but I have reverted them to remove the unsourced info.

Keep in mind that when you do edit on Wikipedia, it should not be simply by lifting text from other websites. Grandpallama (talk) 19:40, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

Joey Leagues? Are you kidding me?

Who on God's green earth calls Keeper Leagues "joey" or "Dynasty" leagues? No one. No one at all in the entire freaking world. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.129.101.2 (talk) 17:08, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

I changed "Joey" to "Keeper". Your right, it sounded a bit erroneous to me too.--JOJ ^Hutton 17:14, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: no move. -- tariqabjotu 15:25, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

---

• Fantasy football (American) → Fantasy American football
• Fantasy football (Association) → Fantasy association football
• Fantasy football (Australian rules football) → Fantasy Australian rules football

– I understand the argument for parenthetical disambiguation here, since all of these subjects would be referred to as "fantasy football" alone. But this has resulted in some pretty poor disambiguators, so I wonder if we wouldn't just be better off with WP:NATURAL disambiguation. If not, I hope at least we can move the first two to Fantasy football (American football) and Fantasy football (association football), respectively. --BDD (talk) 16:43, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related page moves. --BDD (talk) 16:44, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose as nominated; does anyone use those terms? The alternative titles are better [[Fantasy football (American football)]] etc (Fantasy soccer would satisfy WP:NATURAL...) -- 70.24.249.39 (talk) 06:12, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose the move as stated. The problem is real, but the proposed solution is worse. My suggestion would be American fantasy football; the ambiguity that seems to be lurking in this formulation isn't really there, because this type of fantasy sports league isn't common outside North America. 168.12.253.66 (talk) 14:28, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose. Each are these games are known simply as fantasy football within their respective codes, they're not disambiguated, so to apply disambiguation to the name itself doesn't satisfy WP:TITLE. I agree with natural disambiguation over parenthetical where possible but it just doesn't look appropriate here. As for the IP suggesting fantasy soccer, you've got no chance of building a consensus for that. Zarcadia (talk) 20:23, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

"Quotation Marks"

Yeah, awesome guys. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.243.122.74 (talk) 08:42, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

TD-only scoring?

The article uses the undefined term, "TD-only scoring", which needs to be defined in the article. WilliamKF (talk) 16:48, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

Lead for newbies

I know nothing about fantasy football and very little about football itself. I hoped that the Wikipedia article would explain what is going on for beginners. It didn't.

If my opinion, the lead (or an introductory section) should contain the following information. If the answers depend on which type of FF you're playing, give one or two examples of the most common types (for example, head-to-head and total points).

• I'm going to assume that "leagues" form the organizational basis of FF. A bunch of "players" get together and devise the lists of real players. That is called a "league". When I refer to "players" below, I mean the fantasy players who belong to a given league. If I'm wrong about any of this, please correct me.
• Does a list apply to an entire season, or one week, or a particular game? Which is the most common?
• Does every player devise his own list? Or does one set of players devise one list and another set devises another list and those two lists battle it out to "win" that particular game/weekend/season for that league?
• How does one player's list actually win against another players list? Give examples. (The answer to this one question may require a whole subsection but you should still list the most common types first.)
• Can there be multiple winners? Does it make sense to have a league in which nobody wins?
• Does any money change hands? Does money have to change hands?
• Can a league be run by amateurs; for example, by 8 or 10 guys who meet once a week just for fun?
• Can a league be run like a pool? For instance, every week everybody in an office has the chance to buy into the pool with his list for $10. Whoever is determined to win on Monday (or Tuesday) wins the entire pot.
• Can a league be run by a manager who deducts a salary or a percentage of the gross as his pay?
• Are there any statistics about how many FF players there are (say, per week) or how many leagues? Which are the biggest leagues? How many leagues have websites and, in general, the league members never see each other?
• What about big websites, run as a business? How do they make money?

Any information on any of the above questions would help us newbies. --RoyGoldsmith (talk) 10:55, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

I have to agree with this. I'm not American and know nothing about the NFL other than stuff I vaguely pick up from all the US shows I watch (things like "the quarterback is important for some reason"). I don't know how American football works, and all I know about this is the stereotype of guys getting away from their wives to play it. There needs to be a much better initial summary of what exactly it is. As it stands, the article seems to assume that you have a pretty good level of knowledge about everything already and leaps straight into details. I was hoping I'd be able to get everything I wanted to know from the article's lead; both this game and the actual sport both seem incredibly boring and I just wanted a quick overview of what exactly those dudes were doing in the basement together. 86.30.99.158 (talk) 21:19, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

I have tried changing the lead to something better. It's kind of short but what do you think? --RoyGoldsmith (talk) 23:18, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Economic Effects

In the article: " Most of the impacts are positive on the economy overall, but there are some relatively minor drawbacks". This is a totally subjective opinion. Since when is gambling a positive attribute for an economy? Revenue from advertisers going to a gambling organization is not positive. They could spend their advertising dollar anywhere. 2601:281:8001:D900:55C9:8A7F:F374:83F7 (talk) 22:10, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

First line is horrible

The first line of the article is a horrible explanation of fantasy football. As usual with wiki, it's far too technical. Fantasy is not a "role playing game", nor are the people involved "pretending" to own a team. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.115.238 (talk) 00:05, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Fantasy Football for Beginners

In reference to your questions about the "In head-to-head leagues, a team matches up versus a different team each week.", this is simply referring to how Fantasy Football is run. In order to play, you must join a league of usually 8,10, or 12 teams. The teams will all draft real NFL players to their team who they think can help them score the most points each week. When they reference "a team", they are most likely referencing a group of friends playing Fantasy Football. Because you choose players, you create a team as well. Your team will matchup against other teams each week and based on the points that the players score for that week, that is how you determine who wins. The team with the most points beats their head-to-head matchup. This will go on until the end of the season, so 16 total games. Conrb85 (talk) 22:37, 22 September 2016 (UTC)Conrb85

Reference [12] misplaced

Can reference [12] be placed in a correct order? Currently, it is positioned before the text, and with a space.--Adûnâi (talk) 15:01, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Still needs work 2018!

I came to look up the economic impact, and "fantasy football team managers" are extensively referenced without clarity that the "team managers" are Fantasy participants, not the actual "real" managers of the teams! Throughout the article, the "fantasy" participants and actual paid members of team organizations are not well differentiated, in short, the writers here seem to mix up "fantasy" and real professional National Football League operations. Maybe I'm being harsh, but I'm guessing that is a hazard of involvement with this past-time. Reflected in the unsigned author of "First line is horrible" above, I think some "team managers" are more involved with the role-playing aspect (in contradiction to that complaint) I think some "team managers" are "role-playing", perhaps especially before the money and prizes became substantial. Please be aware of the confusion before adding to this article. Cuvtixo (talk) 18:23, 9 September 2018 (UTC)