Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Spendius

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article promoted by Hawkeye7 (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 20:20, 12 December 2020 (UTC) « Return to A-Class review list[reply]

Spendius

Instructions for nominators and reviewers

Nominator(s): Gog the Mild (talk)

A prime member of the awkward squad, 3rd century BC style. Caused trouble on a scale matched by few, was promoted above his ability and came to an appropriately sticky end. I think that what I have scraped from the sources to create this is sufficient for a run at ACR (but probably not for FAC), but feedback on this and on any and all other matters would be gratefully received. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:24, 8 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Image review—pass

No issues, images are freely licensed (t · c) buidhe 23:48, 8 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source review—pass

Sources look OK for reliability.
Checked Hoyos 2015.
- Page 205: It supports part of sentence but not "their premier general", although it does say he was more successful than Hamilcar.

I could debate that, but have changed to "their senior general in Africa" based on Hoyos, and on Bagnall's "Hanno the Great, who was responsible for affairs in Africa". That OK?

Fine by me. (t · c) buidhe 06:58, 10 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(t · c) buidhe 23:48, 8 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Buidhe, comment above. Gog the Mild (talk) 13:20, 9 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support from Hog Farm

I looked at this at GAN, so I don't know how much I'll find. Will get to soon. Hog Farm _Bacon 01:52, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I find it odd that Mercenary War/Truceless War isn't directly named anywhere in the lead that I can see
"Provisions, money and 70,000 reinforcements poured in" - Maybe clarify that a decent chunk of these 70,000 were tied up in garrison duty and not available for field operations?

That's all I can find. Going to go ahead and support now, given that I'm sure these will be either addressed or demonstrated why I'm wrong, and they're minor anyway. Others will likely have more substantial comments, though. Hog Farm _Bacon 04:09, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Hog Farm. Two good points, both done. Gog the Mild (talk) 13:52, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Eddie891

I'd like to see a concise first sentence outlining what he's most known for (i.e. "Spendius was an escaped slave who led a rebel army against Carthage, in what is known as the Mercenary War") rather than starting off with "was an escaped Roman slave from Campania who was recruited into the Carthaginian Army during the First Punic War at some point prior to 241 BC."

You are absolutely correct. Done.

"he was elected co-general " "of the mutineers"?

It seemed clear from context, but I have changed it to "... he was elected co-general with the African Mathos by his fellow mutineers." That OK?

recommend linking suzerainty

Good point - done.

"a pass or mountain range known as the Saw" is phrased how you want it to be? Reads to me as there is uncertainty whether 'the Saw' is a pass or mountain range

That is exactly how it is supposed to read. Don't blame me, it's what the sources say!

"Spendius was a Roman slave from Campania who escaped from his slavery, or was rescued from it;" yet in the lede you definitely name him an escaped slave, maybe call him a 'former slave' there?

Done.

", an escaped Roman slave from Campania who faced death by torture if he were returned to Roman authority." yes, Spendius is the subject of the article here

Bleh! Fixed.

several duplinks--

A lot! I must have forgotten to run the tool. Sorry. Fixed.

"He did so by a stratagem" Strikes me almost as easter-eggy?

I am scratching my head as why you might think that. They're synonyms. And Stratagem (deception) takes you to Ruse de guerre. I could de-link it, but that seems, to me, less than helpful.

"Hamilcar was appointed joint commander of the Carthaginian army, " when?

I think this is a nice article. Some may complain about the lack of biographical detail, but I personally think there's just enough to justify this article. It does feel a little it hasn't been tied together perfectly, just yet, and that's mostly minor things like duplinks, so it's not super concerning. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 18:26, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There is a fair bit of Bio-info on him. He will never get to FAC, but let's see what ACR reviewers think. I put this together towards the end of the WikiCup and so was probably both distracted and a bit burnt out. I had probably also had about enough of the Punic Wars as well, so I am moving on to other areas.

Thanks Eddie891, appreciated. Your comments all addressed above. Gog the Mild (talk) 20:22, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm satisfied that the prose is at A-class level, so support from me. Nice job -- Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 21:31, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

CommentsSupport by CPA-5

Optional: Gisco split the army into small detachments --> "Gisco split his army into small detachments"

I prefer it how it is. All part of my attempting to avoid the "great man" approach to history as much as I can.

Can live with that.

to Sicca Veneria (modern El Kef), 180 km (110 mi) away --> "to Sicca Veneria (modern El Kef), 180 kilometres (110 mi) away" First time we see the unit in the article.

Done.

the most outspoken of the 20,000 strong army --> "the most outspoken of the 20,000-strong army" Compound adjective here.

Done.

according to the ancient Roman historian Polybius Roman here?

Tweaked.

The pay dispute had become a full-scale revolt threatening MOS:EGG here.

It what way. A reader clicks on "full-scale revolt" and finds an article describing the full-scale revolt in question.

Update, I have rephrased to avoid the link.

he took with him 100 elephants and a siege train Just elephants? Weren't they war elephants or just regular ones and can you please link it?

Linked. It is implicit. I can say "The army consisted of 10,000 men" and expect a reader to understand that the men are also soldiers; ditto elephants.

Link Numidian,

Done.

from where they maintained a more distant blockade.[45][37] Re-order the citations.

Done.

That's anything from me. Cheers. CPA-5 (talk) 12:05, 10 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi CPA-5, good to see you back. I hope that things are good with you. All of your comments above addressed. While you are here, I wonder if you could have a look to see if I have covered all of your comments in your review of Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Battle of the Saw? Cheers. Gog the Mild (talk) 16:30, 10 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Currently I'm okay; sometimes get bored and then work on Wikipedia and sometimes I'm busy irl but that doesn't mean I'm not active anymore. Anyway, it looks like I've again forget a nomination eh. I will have a look into it in a moment.~Looks like all my comments here are addressed and I'm horrified what kind of things those rebels did back then. Support. Cheers. CPA-5 (talk) 20:11, 10 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.