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September 11

Question about a drumming effect

On some songs, drummers use an effect that seems to increase the pace of the music, while actually keeping the same time. As I have no musical training at all, I'll make an effort to describe it... bear with me... it's a couple of extra beats, perhaps including a drum with a deeper tone.

Maybe this will help more. Phil Collins uses this effect quite often in his version of You Can't Hurry Love.

So... what's that called?

--Dweller (talk) Old fashioned is the new thing! 09:07, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe syncopation? 196.50.199.218 (talk) 13:01, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(edit conflict) Here's the Supremes version for comparison [1]. 2A00:23D0:D7F:1901:3DA8:CEC:84B0:B7E7 (talk) 13:09, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

By no means a reliable source but here is a blog that discusses it. https://www.musicology.blog/behind-the-beat-unraveling-the-timeless-appeal-of-phil-collins-cant-hurry-love/ 196.50.199.218 (talk) 13:30, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yea, it says: "The tempo of "Can't Hurry Love" is a lively 194 beats per minute (BPM), which contributes to the energetic and danceable nature of the song. It’s worth noting that this tempo is slightly faster than The Supremes’ 1966 original, which had a BPM of 181, giving Collins’ version an added sense of urgency and excitement. The song's drumbeat is particularly interesting, featuring a syncopated rhythm that emphasizes the upbeat and propels the song forward. Collins, being a drummer himself, adds his own personal touch to this element of the song." Martinevans123 (talk) 13:36, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've been searching, but I can't find a book we have on Motown with lengthy interviews with Holland and Dozier. I remember that one of them claimed that because they normally worked with the singers and musicians separately the other one had Diana Ross singing to a half-speed beat. Then, the music was recorded at full speed. Combined, her vocals fit the beat well, but the lull in her voice introduced tension because it wasn't fitting perfectly with the syncopated drums that all of the instruments were playing along with. I hope we didn't lose that book. It had all kinds of interesting tidbits like purposely making Levi Stubbs sing above his normal range to make it sound more emotional. 75.136.148.8 (talk) 14:18, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry for not referring to the question though. Syncopation accents the offbeat. If you omit the down beat consistently, it is commonly referred to as playing on the backbeat (very popular in early rock and roll). The beat in You Can't Hurry Love doesn't omit the down beat. It keeps it for most of the rhythm, then omits it once followed by a backbeat fill. That missing beat followed by the fill makes it seem more anxious or peppy. That is why that specific beat was used in many other songs, notably Lust for Live and Are You Going to Be My Girl. Trivia bit: VOA used it in on-air station identification morse-code (fake code, not a real message) in the 70s. Some have claimed that while in Germany, Bowie and Pop heard VOA's ads and lifted the beat from there instead of lifting it directly from You Can't Hurry Love. 75.136.148.8 (talk) 14:25, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Flams? [2] Martinevans123 (talk) 13:24, 11 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Some truly excellent and informative responses already here. Shame I don't give out awards for Ref Desk threads any more. --Dweller (talk) Old fashioned is the new thing! 11:05, 12 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Do you mean gated reverb? Collins was instrumental (ugh, sorry) in developing and popularizing the effect. Matt Deres (talk) 15:37, 12 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]