User talk:Cyrus XIII/Archive 1

Re:Dir en grey template

Thanks :) Took forever, but I finally got into onto all those... articles... so many... haha. Ric | opiaterein 20:39, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Re:-Kai-

I think the fact that it's their only remix album makes it worthy of having a place in the template. However, since they may not ever release another, and they do release a lot of other stuff that's not always easy to classify, maybe an 'other' section would work. I haven't really had a chance to check up on newer edits, but I'll try and take a look. Ric | opiaterein 00:26, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

Advice regarding image copyright

I added a little more info. to Image:Deg tour 00-01 macabre.jpg for an example. Every image needs a source and it is best to have some type of fair use rationale. The sentences "This image is used in an informational article about the DVD illustrated. It is believed use of the image in the article will not impact its commercial value." isn't much but it is better then nothing. -Regards Nv8200p talk 01:16, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

About the kisou booklet...

From what I have read and looked at in one fan site, they was the main booklet with English translations for every song and a hidden booklet inside the CD case with kanji lyrics. Comparing what you typed and what was shown on the website, I am guessing (but not completley sure) that was only applied to the first press versions and you got the regular press version.

But to be sure, try finding metal staples on the CD case's sides.

Thank you very much for taking your time to read this reply.

-AKnot (9/18/06)

Album colours

Yes, the album type now determines the colour. And there is a new colour scheme, which can be changed much more easily. See Wikipedia:WikiProject_Albums and Wikipedia talk:WikiProject_Albums for details. Rich Farmbrough, 21:48 19 September 2006 (GMT).

Unspecified source for Image:Deg myaku.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Deg myaku.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the file also doesn't have a copyright tag, then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Fair use, use a tag such as {{Non-free fair use in|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. --Siva1979^{Talk to me} 22:35, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Unspecified source for Image:Deg final 2003 5 ugly kingdom.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Deg final 2003 5 ugly kingdom.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the file also doesn't have a copyright tag, then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Fair use, use a tag such as {{Non-free fair use in|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. --Siva1979^{Talk to me} 22:38, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

RE:Image sources

Hello! I hope you are feeling fine. To clear up this matter, please view these comments from a more experienced user on my talk page. Hope this clears up things! --Siva1979^{Talk to me} 20:28, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

RE:Dir en grey video releases

I'll add the info in the main article in a few minutes - Ashadeofgrey 18:30, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

WTD. は romaji...

Someone (unless it was you who didn't log in at the time) typed back the wa back to ha for both songs in Withering to death.. Do you think that should be reverted back to wa (if that wasn't you)?

Thank you very much for reading this. Please respond back.

AKnot 00:40, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

P.S. I just reverted it to WA (again, can't really make up). I will leave the next change to you if you want to leave it be or change it.

Album art information

Hey, I realized I didn't lgo on when I added theinformation, but it was I (NotJake13) that added that bit. There was an article I saw as well as a blog post from a formidable source that spoke of it. I will find the links by tonight or tomorrow for citation, thanks! -NotJake13

Toshiya's ESP Bass(es)...

Even though there is only one bass (which is the RU-DRIVE) on his ESP website, he also used another custom-designed bass (from what I believed) by ESP; or actually 2. The first one was somewhat of a reverse P-Bass with a RU-DRIVE like headstock (as identified in the TOUR04 DVD) and the other one is a 5-string. He also used some regular ESP basses (or it could have been Fender basses).

I think the number of custom basses should be reconsidered.

Please answer back. With regards...

AKnot 02:43, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Continuing on with Toshiya's basses...

After some thought I would have to agree about if it's actually important; and it doesn't seem so. Even though we already talked about it, I just want to mention that the reverse P-Bass is by ESP (it's shown in the -Saku- PV and was in a couple of scans like this for example).

Regards

AKnot 05:41, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks on your romanization explanation.

I have checked the summary in the Ryoujoku no Ame wiki. Now I understand. Oh yeah, what is with the speedy deletion in that wiki anyways? Do you know anything about it?

AKnot 06:27, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Hey!! what about you?

I notice that you were removing some info from X Japan's articles: 1- from the Jealousy album to the Dahlia ones, all the albums and singles were recorded in Los Angeles so please don't delete that in the albums infoboxes. 2- and please don't delete other information ;)

The "Recorded" fields in album infoboxes are commonly used to list the studio(s) where an album or single was recorded and/or the precise dates of the recording sessions. Vague information like "Los Angeles" or "Japan" is not used in any of the more elaborate discographies found on Wikipedia (see The Beatles discography as an example).

A few things about the message you left on my talk page:

• Please sign such entries like you would on an article's discussion page, it's easy (just add ~~~~ at the end, the Wiki will do the rest) and it saves people the trouble of having to look you up in their talk page history.
• Make the purpose of your message known in the subject/headline. Again, this saves other people time to figure things out and, "Hey!! what about you?" isn't even very polite to begin with.

Have a nice day. - Cyrus XIII 19:17, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Hello another time

Hi, I like you check my X Japan articles and I know my enlgish isn't enough good to write clear articles, but why you delete stuff I have put? For example in the Art of Life article, you delete the history and other things, why?!! and you put studio album, Art of Life never was a studio album, is an EP!! If you don't know about X please don't edit!, Thanks!Darkcat21 19:19, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

I will try to put this simple:

• For the second time, you contacted me on my talk page without stating the purpose of your message in the subject/headline field. In the future, I will not read such messages.
• The use of mulptiple/any exclamation marks does not improve your point.
• You wrote "my X Japan articles" - was this just ill phrased or do you actually believe that your contributions to these articles entitle you to anything, like reverting edits by other contributors, made with the Wikipedia quality standards in mind?

As people on Talk:X Japan have already suggested before, if your ability to make worthwhile contributions to Wikipedia is impaired by weak English skills or personal fandom, do not make them at all. You will save other people a lot of their time. - Cyrus XIII 19:54, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

Re: The Marrow of a Bone

My apologies for the reverts regarding the new album. I have a habit of skipping Flash intros on webpages, so even after checking the official site for three or four times, I didn't catch the announcement - my bad. - Cyrus XIII 00:39, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Not a problem at all, I actually did the same thing when I saw the "Skip" link as well ;) - Sinistrality 00:42, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

By the way, since you appear to be new to Wikipedia editing, would you like me to show you the ropes/point out some things that would improve your contributions? I don't mean to belittle you or anything, as Wikipedia is learning by doing. Just want you to know, that your fellow contributors are here to help. :) - Cyrus XIII 01:11, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

I wouldn't be at all offended, I pretty much am still being a complete noob about everything that I do. I really need to use preview more, heh. - Sinistrality 01:51, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

X Japan track list tables

Hi, I see that you made some infoboxes for the X Japan singles and albums articles, Ok, it's nice, but sometimes in Music/Lyrics you put: Yoshiki / Hitomi Shiratori, yes, Yoshiki the music and Hitomi the lyrics, but Hitosmi is Yoshiki they are the same person, do you think is better to put Yoshiki/Yoshiki or we should put something at the bottom telling that are the same person? Thanks, take care, oh, and another thing I see you always remove: Yoshiki was the producer of all the songs and albums by X Japan ;) Darkcat21 08:37, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

I am sure you will be able to come up with verifiable sources for all your claims, just as you did with the Art of Life article. Have a nice day. - Cyrus XIII 11:38, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

hide article expansion

Please read: Talk:Hide_(musician)#New_information_about_hide. I hope you accept that sources, if not I'll ask to a third opinion, oh and if the artucle has some grammar error, please fix it and don't remove the whole article. I have also add more information at Art of Life providing official sources (Yahoo and hide's site). Check that also. Thanks. Darkcat21 16:30, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Image tagging for Image:Fair to midland.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Fair to midland.jpg. The image has been identified as not specifying the source and creator of the image, which is required by Wikipedia's policy on images. If you don't indicate the source and creator of the image on the image's description page, it may be deleted some time in the next seven days. If you have uploaded other images, please verify that you have provided source information for them as well.

For more information on using images, see the following pages:

• Wikipedia:Image use policy
• Wikipedia:Image copyright tags

This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. 19:05, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Dir en grey and capitalization

I personally don't care how the song titles are presented in Wikipedia, I just question something. You direct people to WP:MUSTARD for these cases, but rule one states that exceptions may be made, which include song titles in all caps or all lowercase. At least, that's how I read it. Nothing personal, I just wanted clarification. -フェニックス|talk 04:00, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

While WP:MUSTARD indeed states the possibility of such exceptions (not in a "rule one" but in the section "Titles and section headings"), a larger number of Wikipedia guidelines (from which WP:MUSTARD has only been derived from after all) suggest the use of standard English formatting, even if official sources suggest otherwise (see WP:MOS-TM and WP:NC#Album_titles_and_band_names). In addition to that, there are virtually no all-uppercase track lists on Wikipedia related to more popular/known artists, even though they are not that uncommon in album packaging. So in the larger context, there remains little to support the formatting eccentricies seen in previous incarnations of the Dir en grey related articles. I might also add that all move-requests related to my de-capitalization efforts have been honored by our fellow Wikipedians.

Thanks nonetheless for pointing out this inconsistency in WP:MUSTARD, I will suggest to fix that right away. One last thing, should you contact me through my talk page in the future, please just sign your message with your English nickname. As you can see on my user page, my language skills do not encompass Japanese. - Cyrus XIII 11:56, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Dir En Grey "Messy"

I added the reason in the talk section as to why I felt that the banner needs to be there. Particularly I think it needs attention from outside the "J-rock clique" on wikipedia (no offense to them but they are horrible at stylizing their writing and they tend to dramatize everything, which is not very encyclopedic). So the syntax and grammar of the article needs to be fixed up a bit, and I feel an outsider should do it, hence why I put up the banner.

Dec 11 2006 12:39 xcuref1endx (UTC)

Dir en grey [a knot] DVD

For the new Dir en grey DVD, the sources are all just through [a knot] members, but the official information can only be viewed by fan-club members. It is, however, posted on all of the Dir en grey forums and message boards. The announcement of the DVD occured in November, and the only details disclosed wer that it would be of the BUDOKAN concert, and there would be additional documentary footage from the past year. As far as the Disc 1 - Disc 3 error, that was simply a mistyping by myself. I'll edit that, as well as look for any other mistakes. Thanks for your questions and comments! --Jake 19:11, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Capitalization of Japanese "No" particle.

I haven't referenced any pages with the capitalization of particles in Japanese becuase I could not find one. The basis of my edit was: If the particles Ha (or Wa), Ni, and Wo are capitalized, then the other particles (such as "No") should be also. If there was a page on the capitaliztion rules which includes the rules of Japanese particles, I would be more than happy to reference it next time. If not, I think that should be a standard from now on, if one particle is capitalized, so should all of the others. Otherwise, no particles should be capitalized (as is the common rule when writing out artistic titles). Thanks for your concern! --Jake 20:17, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Genre section help.

I would have to agree on that. The section needs to be improved for sure, but I am not really good on that (but laying the foundation on it). Would you help me on it?

AKnot 00:25, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Your edits to Japanese rock related articles

Hello and welcome to Wikipedia. I have noticed that you have already made a few edits which are rather problematic. I do not doubt your good intentions, but let me point out a few things:

• As stated by the respective article, music genres are not limited to musical criteria alone. Hence your edits to Japanese rock have been reverted.
• WP:MUSTARD (which is an official Wikipedia guideline) states that music genres which are not proper nouns are not capitalized, so it would be visual kei and not Visual Kei.
• Also note that full capitalization is not employed very often on Wikipedia and certainly not for the name of a band or artist. Typesetting decisions like LUNA SEA are not to be carried over to Wikipedia (see WP:MOS-CL, WP:MOS-TM).

Have a nice day. - Cyrus XIII 18:11, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi. I see you have a problem with capitalization.

You said: Note that full capitalization is not employed very often on Wikipedia and certainly not for the name of a band or artist. Typesetting decisions like LUNA SEA are not to be carried over to Wikipedia.

If Wikipedia does not employ the use of full capitalization, then Wikipedia does not spell correctly names such as LUNA SEA, SUGIZO, HYDE, etc. Japanese artists tent to work with the aesthetics of romanized words. Some times it's spelled with capital letters, like LUNA SEA. Some times it's spelled with small letters, like L'Arc~en~Ciel members' names hyde, tetsu, ken and yukihiro. Some times it's mixed up, like UVERworld, or has unusual symbols like a dot or a star. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.206.182.205 (talk)

I am aware of these aesthetics, as you call them, yet they are still at odds with common Wikipedia guidelines, such as Wikipedia:Naming conventions#Album titles and band names. - Cyrus XIII 19:34, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Except that Wikipedia:Naming conventions#Album titles and band names says absolutely nothing about capitalization (or lact thereof) of band names or album/song titles. By your standards, articles related to American bands such as matchbox twenty and their albums (for example) more than you think you are as well as Japanese bands such as the pillows should be capitalized normally, which would go against official sources. - Beau99 20:45, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Forever Love

Hello, i see you removed the info that i gave it a source, yes it comes froma fan site but it's just a copy of the interview, why you have removed? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.184.82.124 (talk) 14:52, 1 January 2007 (UTC).

Re: Deg edits

Thank you. Hopefully I'll be able to add a little bit of incite on all of them. As a musician myself, I like to see the equiptment be given the proper credit. Saka 19:02, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

re:Questions on survey procedure

Hello, I was wondering a few things regarding survey/consensus procedure (with the KISS/Kiss discussion in mind, as you might have guessed): 1) Can/should a move nominator post in the Support section as well or is this unnecessary (or even frowned upon), since his/her position is probably clear from the nomination already? 2) How are votes treated which come in after the request has been up for more than five days and has already been moved to the backlog? - Cyrus XIII 01:59, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

No problem, all is cool. Normally, what you want to do is to sign yourself and say "support as nom" or something to the extent. Once or twice I've seen people get weird about it (i.e., they were unfamiliar with precedent), but most of the time, you can support as nom and no one will have a problem with it. Anyway, for clarity's sake, it's probably best to sign it at the top of the list (most nominators are the first ones to sign, of course). And, often times, the reason the requested move is let to sit a few extra days is in order to help gauge greater consensus - voting late is never a problem if the poll is still open (some people get fussy about the word "vote", as it's formally a discussion, not a vote, but I don't get fussy over wordage). Hope this is clear. Patstuart^talk|edits 02:20, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes it is, thanks a lot. :) - Cyrus XIII 02:23, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Korn

This revision I used is much more complete, why do you maniacally remove semi-protection? My revision features associated acts, dates of affiliation with record companies and improved style about David's hiatus...why bother changing? Broken soul 00:54, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Do you really expect other editors to pick your more worthwhile additions from blatant misconduct (like adding semi-protection to articles without being an administrator)? - Cyrus XIII 01:03, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Chillout, dude...Is it really worth it? Okay, mea culpa, I didn't know about the fact that semi-protection should by applied by administrators only , and sorry about my comments, it's 2:10 am, a little bit late, and by the way: this article is very important to me, I put an effort in spending enormous ammount of time in order to keep this article and every related one updated and well-stocked. Broken soul 01:12, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I see your point and I can certainly relate, so I will offer you a word of advice: No matter how much effort and time goes into your contributions, you should also consider that your dedication could be held against you in disagreements. Take a look at WP:OWN, you'll see what I mean. Now, I am pretty sure, that most Wikipedia editors who work on music-related articles do so out of personal affection for the respective music and the artists behind it. But in order to create sophisticated articles for the general purpose encyclopedia that is Wikipedia, one has to take personal preferences and fandom out of the equation. Ask yourself the following, just as an example: Why did you bold the alternate typesetting for Korn (the one with the reverted R), in order to improve the article for the general public or because you like the real spelling better as a fan of the band? Have a good night. - Cyrus XIII 01:42, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Hehe, no, I just thought it would be catching more attention, and it looks more aesthetic. Personally, I don't prefer backward "R" (it may be confusing in searching articles using ctrl-f), it's just an imitiation of a logo Personally, I'm into completely other music right now, but this one is the band I'm still keen on news, and like editing stuff about them, and I see your point about getting rid of personal affection...Ok, goodbye as well :) Broken soul 01:46, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Flag on Queen article

Hi, I noticed you reverted my removal of the England flag on the Queen (band) article. What purpose would you say it serves there? Why an England flag rather than a UK one? Thanks in advance --Guinnog 21:21, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Hello, I have already commented on that matter at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style. I would also have to say that your comments at Talk:Queen (band) are not really productive, but I will go into detail why over there. - Cyrus XIII 21:31, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I saw your comment there. I look forward to reading your detailed explanation on the article talk page. --Guinnog 21:35, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Re. Protection of X Japan article

Hi, following the full protection of the article (as opposed to the requested semi-protection), I would like to ask two questions:

• Was there any misbehavior on my part?, considering that my reverts where merely made to counter the re-insertion of unsourced information and well within 3RR limits?
• How to proceed from here, would putting in for a third opinion at WP:3O be an option?

Regards - Cyrus XIII 22:12, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Hello. No, I didn't see any misbehavior. I could also not certify that any user had violated the WP:3RR. The two users you were reverting (Darkcat21 and 62.57.22.131) might have violated it actually, but only if proved that they're the same person through a checkuser. I don't think that a checkuser is currently necessary though as there's not much of a sockpuppet abuse anyway. A WP:3O or WP:RFC may prove useful to attract more input into this dispute so that a consensus about the disputed content may be established and the article be unprotected. Regards,--Húsönd 22:27, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I am currently writing up something for the respective talk page, along with a summary for WP:30. In the meantime, the other editor involved has admitted to be behind those IP-based edits in a related content dispute. I am not quite sure whether to take any further action regarding this now obvious 3RR violation, but would you consider exerting your right per WP:3RR#Enforcement to revert the protected article to the last revision from before the edit war? Regards - Cyrus XIII 23:30, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

I was going to ask you to provide a diff where the registered user claims he/she's the same person as the unregistered user in order to block him/her for 3RR. However, even if proven, the transgression occurred too many hours ago and it's really not necessary to do that now. I have a strict policy for maintaining neutrality upon protecting articles so I once again must decline your request. But in order to revert the article to your last version while protected you may: 1)create a straw poll on the talk page of the article asking users to either endorse your last version or Darkcat21's (if there's consensus about endorsing yours, then I shall revert to your version); or 2)place a request on WP:RPP in the section Current requests for significant edits to a protected page and ask the locked version of the article to be changed to your last (if you do this please state the disruption caused by the other user so that another administrator will understand your motive).

I hope this helps. Regards,--Húsönd 00:21, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

Re: Second opinion / WP Japan

Hello, I would like to ask for your opinion on my recent rewrite of Visual kei, seeing that you have previously commented on the article's talk page and appear to be an experienced editor, not too involved with the subject. You know, whether my edits were to harsh, the reasoning behind them not sufficient - I would really appreciate an outside view. I am also interested in becoming involved with the Wikiproject Japan in some capacity. Is there any sort of step-by-step approach to that or how do these things go? Regards - Cyrus XIII 12:14, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

I hate to say it, but your rewrite is not good at all. There isn't even a basic definition of what VK is. It's certainly not an art movement, appearances in anime and manga are almost tertiary, and works of fiction are totally irrelevant. VK is not necessarily bishonen or androgynous - Mana, for example, would be closer to a drag queen, because his mannerisms and dress are feminine. Most of the bands you cite at one point or another had members who wore Victorian-style dresses, and to claim bishonen for that isn't really a good idea, especially since the bishonen article is wrong, too. You're leaving out a lot of the influences on earlier VK. Up until a few years ago with the advent of cosplay-type VK bands, most bands were gothic in the New Romantic sense. This is my OR, so we can't use it, but VK has had different "waves" that are distinguishable blocks of time where there has been a specific style and sound. The problem is that it is very hard to source an indie genre's origins except through chronicles, and there aren't that many. I would suggest, however, that you rv the article back to the old version, because it is more accurate and comprehensive than the current version. Also, do not add Visual Rock as a link. I looked at the article, and it's not correct either.

As for Wikiproject Japan, just go to the page here and sign up. That's it! It helps to add your area of expertise, as well. For projects, though, it's not quite as haphazard as WP as a whole is: it is generally expected that you have a decent level of knowledge in whatever area you choose to work in. MSJapan 16:53, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the advice but I will probably resort to editing/expanding the current stub. It might be a bit of a deletionist attitude but I consider the gain of actual information for the average reader to be higher with a short, rough overview in place, rather than several paragraphs filled with completely uncited information; especially when they do not appear to be entirely written for people without any preconceptions of the phenomenon. One might also add that if reliable sources are that hard to come by the issue of verifiability is joined by one of notability. Regards - Cyrus XIII 17:23, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

My point is that your overview is wrong. Furthermore, verifiability and notability are two different things. I can verify a lot of general information, but I couldn't tell you, for example, if X Japan was the first VK band. Fool's Mate used to be a totally UK New Wave mag; I've got issues from 1984 that prove it. And notability issues? Are you seriously trying to say that VK is all of a sudden not notable? Come on now. Lastly, just because you don't like what I have to say doesn't automatically make me wrong; you did ask for my opinion. I've further expanded the article, and the information is internally verifiable through Wikipedia thus far. MSJapan 17:46, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

Consensus

No, I'm afraid there does not appear to be a consensus on that discussion. If you want to attract more people to it, you should post to the village pump, community portal, and WP:CENT. Grouse 01:21, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

X Japan

I think that at this point, it may just be most helpful to see if there are a couple members of a related WikiProject that might be able to help the articles. I think that given the recent activity, it might be helpful to take a break from these couple articles to see if some neutral parties can improve it and then come back to see if the articles are in better shape. I say this mainly because it can sometimes be hard to see the article as a whole during a dispute (I've noticed myself doing the same thing before). If I ask Darkcat21, would you be willing to let myself, the people who provided outside opinions, and people from related WikiProjects to work on the articles for a couple days and then check how the article looks? I think this would be an easy way to de-escalate everything. ShadowHalo 01:32, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

This is becoming frustrating as Darkcat21 appears to be ignoring good-faith attempts to fix the situation. I've warned Darkcat21 with {{needsource}} since this edit involved removing citations. Since WP:3O has already been used, what do you think about opening up a request for comment? ShadowHalo 22:12, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Ack, I did. Sorry about that. I'll request comment at WP:RFC/USER now. (To be sure, WP:RFC/USER and not WP:RFC/BIO, right?) ShadowHalo 08:53, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Alright, the RfC is just about complete (sorry it took awhile, I had to gather a bunch of diffs). As soon as you get the chance, you'll need to add yourself to "Users certifying the basis for this dispute" and provide a diff at "Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute" that shows that you attempted to resolve the situation. Also, please put in "Desired outcome" what you would like the RfC to review. ShadowHalo 09:44, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

I've listed it at Wikipedia:Requests for comment/User conduct. My understanding is that the RfC will be approved or rejected. If approved, someone (I don't know whethere it's supposed to be one of us or a neutral party) will notify Darkcat21 of the RfC so that the user can respond to the dispute. Other users will provide outside opinions, and we see what results from there and what should happen next. (By the way, I did remove the last part of "Desired outcome" and reword it to remain WP:COOL.) ShadowHalo 17:57, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure since I've never done an RfC before, though my guess is that it should be moved. ShadowHalo 23:38, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Dir en Grey

Thank you for all your edits and adds to the art. Wiki is my only "reliable" source for the moment, so can you give me the names of yours?Quatreryukami 19:51, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Oh, you misunderstood. The name of your sources(websites,etc.):DQuatreryukami 14:06, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

ThxQuatreryukami 14:17, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Visual Kei

You have said my edits at Visual kei article were "strange", Ok, look X Japan was formed in 1982, and Visual Kei fas formed in 1994, do I have to say more? Visual kei was an expansion of Visual with gothic clothes, compare a really Visual kei band (Malice Mizer) looks with X Japan ones, and you'll see the difference. Darkcat21 21:59, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, this is really difficult to explain but I will, I'll do it here instead of Visual Kei talk if you want you or I can translate this into the talk.

First of all, stop adding the New York Times article, it contains some errors, for example about visual kei:

X Japan went from playing loud, fast thrash-metal to stadium-shaking pop ballads, in the process pioneering its own genre, a Japanese equivalent of glam rock known as visual kei.

It's my opinion or he's saying that visual kei is a musical genre, he talks about the music and he says "pioneering its own genre", really visual kei is a genre? You have also said that visual kei it's not a genre and due to this you deleted some stuff at the main article, so we have the first error, he don't know what's visual kei, then equivalent to glam rock... ehem... compare:

• Image:KISS in concert Boston 2004.jpg - Glam Rock
• Image:Malice Mizer - Gardenia 01.jpg - Visual Kei

Can you see the difference? Also check this if you want: http://www.asiaweek.com/asiaweek/98/0522/feat1.html "Their style was Visual Rock", X Japan was Visual Rock not Visual Kei, the one from NYT was wrong, and I'll say that he was influenced by that article on asiaweek, or the ones from asiaweek fixed lot of errors that there were in the NYT article. Or this: http://weeklywire.com/ww/11-02-98/fw_music.html

Then we have that X Japan was created in 1982 (as hide official site says) then we have that Visual Kei was created in mid 90s, how can you explain this? Darkcat21 20:22, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Despair in the Womb

Yes it's true that is has not been mentioned in the website. I mentioned it after watching this from YouTube which originally came from an recent interview with Kaoru by Gyao. Should we just wait until the DVD releases and find out then?

Thank you, with regards...

AKnot 21:27, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

X Japan source material

Thanks for the quick response. I'll try to include information from the refrences as soon as possible. As for the scan, my means of obtaining it are actually a little tricky. I found it by joining a Yahoo! group called "X Japan memorial" or something to that effect. The group is filled with spam bots, but under the files section has a few really good articles that support a few things. That's how I found the NY times article that's made the rounds on the jrock articles, there's also something about Toshi's leaving X Japan, and the article we discussed about their pending international debut. Thanks again. Vespertilio 20:13, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Art of Life citations

No offense, but I am not sure whether you should be handing out advice regarding references. After all, that request for comment has been filed against you for citation-related reasons, among other things. And what exactly are you suggesting here? To cite information under an arbitrary "official biography" label instead of precisely stating its origin? - Cyrus XIII 21:27, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey, you're saying that I can't help people? You're banning me or whatever? It's yor problem if you don't have enough money to buy that official book and check the info written by staff from the band. And also really nice that when I added the same info that I guess that Vespertilio is going to add, Cyrus warned me and deleted the stuff and I was saying that was from a book and this stuff, and now you help him/her, really nice, you have also said this: "but in the absence of any grave misbehavior on your part, no one's going to doubt the good faith behind your contributions." ehem, you were the one that the Art of Life problem was the first problem about sources, then you removed my info, but you won't remove his/her, why? Darkcat21 18:05, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

4 u

		The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
		For Edits and Rewrites to the Dir en Grey article. Thanks

Orphaned fair use image (Image:Yoshiki hayashi conducting.jpg)

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The Pillows

Yeah, no idea how to handle it. The article isn't really a subject of my interest enough to enforce it alone, it's more of one of those articles I check every couple of months or so. Maybe try to get it moved, and then make the pillows a protected redirect? That could do it.--SeizureDog 12:11, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Unspecified source for Image:Despairsray.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Despairsray.jpg. I noticed that the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you did not create this file yourself, then you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, then a link to the website from which it was taken, together with a restatement of that website's terms of use of its content, is usually sufficient information. However, if the copyright holder is different from the website's publisher, then their copyright should also be acknowledged.

As well as adding the source, please add a proper copyright licensing tag if the file doesn't have one already. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Fair use, use a tag such as {{Non-free fair use in|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If the image is copyrighted under a non-free license (per Wikipedia:Fair use) then the image will be deleted 48 hours after 19:38, 10 February 2007 (UTC). If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Ptr ru 19:38, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Fool on the planet

Wait, the album cover capitalizes it as "Fool on the planet". If something intentionally doesn't use standard caps/grammar/spelling or whatever, we don't fix that for them, as that would be changing the title. --W.marsh 02:02, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

As a matter of fact, we do it all the time. See...

• Wikipedia:WikiProject Albums#Capitalization
• Wikipedia:WikiProject Music/MUSTARD#Capitalization

- Cyrus XIII 02:09, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

those are just project rules... WP:NAME says "In band names and titles of songs or albums, unless it is unique, the standard rule in the English language is to capitalize words that are the first or the last word in the title and those that are not conjunctions" However this is a unique title, they intentionally didn't capitalize the words as one normally one. We do try to leave capitalization the way people published it... hence {{lowercase}} (see all the articles that use it to preserve irregular capitalization). --W.marsh 02:43, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

As far as my experience with capitalization related issues goes, the lowercase template pretty much only exists to cover the few exceptions permitted by WP:MOS-TM. And mere project rules or not, album related-articles are under the scope of WP:ALBUMS, so if they got it all wrong, by all means, tell them so. Though I would suggest that you read this article first, as it sums up the reasoning behind "unofficial" capitalization of trademarks and media publications really well. Please note that I do not mean to come across as dismissive or rude, if I do, I'm truly sorry. It's just that I have been through this discussion several times and after a while it gets a little unnerving how people keep suggesting to "open the gates" to all kinds of non-standard capitalization, regardless of the fact that Wikipedia could never even attempt to establish a coherent style if it was to follow these suggestions. - Cyrus XIII 03:06, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

No, and I might be coming off the wrong way too... I'm really more trying to understand this issue myself than telling you the way it has to be. But it's always seemed to me that we strive for the official title of works, unless a common title is much better known... part of that means following the capitalization used by the artist. You might actually be right though, as article titles in ALL CAPS seems like a bad idea offhand, but something still strikes me as wrong about capitalizing words that an artist clearly chose to leave lower case. Anyway, I'm sorry if this seems like a tired argument to you (I don't mean that sarcastically) but the solution to that is to get something clear and easy to understand added to WP:NAME on this issue, so we can just follow a clear guideline and not have an argument every time the issue comes up. I have already started the ball rolling at Wikipedia_talk:Naming_conventions#Work_titles_with_irregular_capitalization. --W.marsh 03:15, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

X Japan reunion

Hi, do you think we'll have to ask a for a third opinion in this case? I was looking for one, but I don't find anyone with Japanese skills, if you can help, Thanks. Darkcat21 22:35, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Jung Myung Seok

Thanks for your 3O, and your advise to me. It's nice to know I am not alone, although it certainly feels like that, as I have been trying to get more editors to watch over the article with not much success. Hopefully you won't mind sticking around for a little while and getting your hands dirty, as it looks like there's going to be a fair bit of dispute. RB972 15:49, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism? Nice

Classy. Matt Yeager ♫ (Talk?) 07:06, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Forgive my triteness. Look at the diff I provided, specifically your edit summary. Look at what exactly you were reverting. You were calling my previous edit vandalism (that's what "rvv" means). (The entire idea of an edit saying "rvv, look at the discussion" is absurd; if it refers to a talk page, it's a content dispute, therefore not vandalism.) I was calling you out for labeling what I did vandalism, certainly not calling you out for vandalizing. Matt Yeager ♫ (Talk?) 20:23, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm afraid the way I used the "rvv" abbreviation was somewhat detached from its word-for-word meaning (it was rather aimed at the way you were reverting changes without discussing), which was quite careless of me - my apologies. I hope we can agree that neither of us meant to explicitly accuse the other one of vandalism and let's try to cool down and go about that move discussion in a peaceful and productive way. Regards - Cyrus XIII 05:41, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Alright, we're good then. 20px Matt Yeager ♫ (Talk?) 23:27, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

(Though I'm still waiting on a reply on the matchbox twenty talk page.) Matt Yeager ♫ (Talk?) 23:31, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Dir en grey (romanization)

Look... whether you like it or not, there is absolutely no way anyone can deny the massive amounts of errors on Dir en grey's official English discography page. You should probably take a look for yourself here before you edit anything more. There are various romanization errors that I personally can't trust as "official". While it's nice to follow some sort of standard, I (and a few others who don't edit Wikipedia) feel you're going way too far, and a fellow editor is now avoiding all DeG-related articles for the same reason. -Beau99 01:20, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

So you, along with a few other people do not trust these official romanizations? Well, that's to bad, since the guidelines at WP:MOS-JP suggest to give them preference nonetheless and I just apply them, like I subject band names to WP:MOS-TM and song and album titles to WP:ALBUMS. To you these derivations from the respective "correct" forms might be grave and irritating, while I'm just ironing out cumbersome exceptions in pursuit of a coherent and easy to manage style. Because they are just that, style issues and we already spend way to much time on Wikipedia engaging in repetitive fights over these petty details, instead of concentrating on actual content.

How many Wikipedia articles on Japanese rock bands do you know, which actually contain information that is backed up by sources? It's not in my habit to brag, but beside the ones I have worked on, the list will probably be very short. And for the most part, unverified information is ultimately useless information, which of course does not occur to people who mistake Wikipedia with a free fansite hosting service. They devotedly defend all those little capitalization eccentricities without considering that Japanese has no concept of its own for upper and lowercase letters and tirelessly decorate an English language encyclopedia with loads of kanji that are not even displayed correctly in 80% of today's web browsers. If you and your nameless friends would like to stand for that, fine by me. I'm not here to win any popularity contests. - Cyrus XIII 02:15, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

I see you didn't follow my simple suggestion. Fine, I don't care anymore. I didn't want to speak up, but I got tired of seeing incorrect romanizations (regardless of whether they're "official" or not) and incorrect capitalization of song and album titles. If I didn't, someone was bound to do it sooner or later. I'm going to go ahead and end this right now also, because things have the potential to get ugly when I'm involved. Good day to you. Beau99 02:38, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Rfc

(Note for you on my talk page.) — Athænara ✉ 09:33, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Image:Queen logo (name only).svg

I am assuming you created this image, if this is the case wouldn't it be better to use a license such as {{GFDL-self}}? It is only part of the logo after all.— miketm - Queen WikiProject - 10:44, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Well, as I have stated before, it has been used independently from the full "crest" numerous times and as such still appears to be copyrighted material, whether I created that vectorization or not. - Cyrus XIII 13:52, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

D'espairsRay Interview

Why did you remove the link to the D'espairsRay interview? It is relevant to the D'espairsRay page and numerous other pages for other entertainers have links to interviews. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HayateTokidoki (talk • contribs) 21:27, 25 February 2007 (UTC).

The link has been removed per Wikipedia's guideline for external links. Regrettably, tokidokijournal.com is a self-published and not well-known publication, hence it does not meet the criteria for reliable sources. - Cyrus XIII 21:58, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Puppets

The standard thing to do with puppets is report them at WP:AN/I or WP:SOCK. You may get some action by an admin, you may not. It's also probably worth posting a note on the user talk pages saying that use of sock puppets for purposes of attacking another editor is a violation of WP:SOCK. (Do this as an FYI, without specifically accusing anyone of being a sock puppet, perhaps; sock puppets tend to argue that accusations of puppetry are a violation of WP:CIVIL, WP:AGF, and/or WP:NPA; an FYI may - or may not - avoid such nonsense.) -- John Broughton (♫♫)

Random Deg stuff: My Reply

Hello. I think it's a good idea to have Dir en grey in both WP:Metal and WP:Japan (for sure). Some bands like Moi dix Mois and Sex Machineguns are mentioned, so why not? But it can be challenging since most of the articles are mostly of power, thrash, death, black, etc; not really metalcore (besides Unearth and Lamb of God) or even nu-metal. Some might debate about it. But still, I think it's a good idea to have it there since there are more metal elements in the latest record than rock.

The Marrow of A Bone felt stronger than Withering to death. It might be me but I thought they were using multiple genres for multiple songs at once. If they did, I thought they did it pretty well. Also I can finally hear Shinya's bass drumming at an reasonable volume. AKnot 01:00, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

blink-182

Replied at Talk:Blink-182#Typography rather than across different talk pages. I have changed the "sometimes typeset" as it's not correct but will not change the article without further discussion. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 22:02, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I have left my final words on the matter at the above link. However, I would just like to apoligise again for the edit summary and assure you that I was in no way questioning the fact that your edits were in good faith. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 09:04, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 21:02, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Toshi talking about X Japan reunion

Hello again. First of all, why removing the reunion thing? You have deleted official sites, that's vandalism, On Toshi's official website it still appears the reunion thing, but he deletes always the message before, but in the new message it says:

 そして今後も変わらずコンサートを続けてまいります！
 また皆様とお会いできますこと楽しみにいたしております。

If you don't know Japanese it's your problem, but here it says that he's happy to see everybody again and that the reunion thing it's still alive because there were some problems (check Oricon news, Yahoo news, etc.). And it's stupid because Yoshiki have said also this on his blog. Thanks, but I'll revert your edit. Darkcat21 13:07, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Lowercase Band Names / "sometimes typeset as"

Hi there,

I noticed you're going through the articles of bands whose names are officially rendered in all lowercase and changing the article title so that it's "correct" English. I don't doubt these are good faith edits, but I think you should slow down for a moment:

• Musicians' names aren't just "trademarks" (as you keep citing WP:MOSTM) -- it's the name they've chosen to identify themselves by, and there's often a particular reason they've chosen to do that (maybe a personal reason, maybe it's symbolic). Admittedly, often it's just pretentious narcissism -- but unless they explicitly say that's the reason why, then we shouldn't assume it's just a meaningless flourish if they've made it a point to render their names like that.
• Your solution of saying that the lowercase name is "usually/sometimes typeset as" is misleading -- band names like the pillows aren't just "usually/sometimes typeset as"; it's the most common form of the name and the name the band officially identifies itself as. "Usually/Sometimes typeset as" gives the impression that a handful of fans occasionally choose to write it like that out of laziness (for example). And the "to fit the logo" bit for the pillows is completely misleading: people write "the pillows" to match their official name, not the logo; the logo merely reflects the official name.
• And as Matt Yeager noted on the matchbox twenty talk page, why are you ignoring the "three main principles" regarding proper nouns on WP:NCON? Using the lowercase form is how the subject chooses to identify itself, and I don't really see why WP:NCON should be overruled by WP:MOSTM (for instance). Purifiedwater 19:04, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

(Expanded on a point and corrected a mistake. I'm sleepy, sorry. :-)) I do get the sense, though, that where you and the editors who are in favor of keeping the lowercase differ is that you don't believe that different capitalization constitutes a different spelling. In all honesty, I don't think any of the guidelines cited thus far were specifically written with cases like matchbox twenty or the pillows in mind, so there is debate to be had here. What do you intend to do about k.d. lang, actually? That might be a good litmus for this... Purifiedwater 19:23, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I presently have no intentions to do anything about that particular article, since I'd like to focus on actual content as opposed to style issues for a while (i.e. that new discography page for The Pillows). But I'll certainly answer the points you have raised:

• Dragons flight already addressed the "are band names trademarks?" issue quite well, the only thing I'd like to add is, that while few bands embody the "band name = brand name" idea as strongly as Kiss, the basic ramifications remain the same (action figures and comic book tie-ins or not). Trying to determine some sort of threshold would only introduce glaring NPOV issues.
• You can certainly imagine that after a band has reached a certain critical mass in terms of popularity (which it more or less has to, in order to be notable enough for Wikipedia in the first place), it is bound to attract a high amount of media coverage outside of official or fan-driven circles. Enter all the MTVs, Amazons, NY Times' who drop stylized typography just like Wikipedia does by and large (not just through WP:MOS-TM). Hence non-absolute phrasings along the lines of "sometimes" or "usually". They also avoid putting an overly strong emphasis on the official typeset, in order to not pertain to brand management after all.
• As I already wrote in my reply for Matt Yeager, I do not believe WP:NCON was written with formatting issues in mind. WP:MOS-TM evidently was, so from the perspective of someone who considers that guideline applicable to band names, The Pillows and Matchbox Twenty were pretty clear-cut cases.

Anyway, I need some sleep now as well, so have a good night then. - Cyrus XIII 02:56, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Reasonable points, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree for now. The discussion will just continue on WT:MOSTM then. Thanks for the cordial reply, BTW: it seems like the most heated debates on Wikipedia tend to be over the seemingly trivial (like stylistic deputes), so I appreciate the friendliness. (And sadly, there won't be any sleep in my future -- exams week, and it turns out that goofing off and not studying actually could have a detrimental effect on my GPA. Who woulda thunk? :-)) Purifiedwater 03:34, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

hide

His name does not use a capital H. --Sn0wflake 02:01, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Canvassing

There are concerns that you might be WP:CANVASSing users into voting for the issue on ×××HOLiC. All I am going to say is that if you invite people to support a motion, it seems only fair to invite people who oppose it, too. If not, then don't invite at all. It does not make things fair. There isn't a need to treat this as a warning - just a friendly notice. x42bn6 Talk 17:56, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

For the record, Cyrus XIII notified me, and I voted against.--SeizureDog 20:33, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Dir en grey

I'm not into music articles much, so I don't have much advice to give. What does the band name mean though? It's obviously not Japanese or English; looks German to me.--SeizureDog 20:33, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

I'll Kill You (The Catnip Peddlers song)

I have added a "{{prod}}" template to the article I'll Kill You (The Catnip Peddlers song), suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but I don't believe it satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and I've explained why in the deletion notice (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and Wikipedia's deletion policy). You may contest the proposed deletion by removing the {{dated prod}} notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page. Also, please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. Big Smooth 22:19, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Deletion of Covers of X Japan

Hey, why you have erased my commentaries of discs of X Japan? also why you have erased the covers of I kill you and Orgasm single?, excuse me, but you aren't the owner of wikipedia, I have the same right that you to modify and to collaborate with the encyclopedia. In addition, my sources are reliable, not because you say that they are not it. Shadowxfox

Request for edit summary

Hi. It would be nice if you could use an edit summary a bit more often, and even for minor edits if the changes are subtle and not obvious from a diff why they are done, like here. Thanks. You can reply here if you have comments. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 03:14, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Complete Discography and Videography of X Japan

Guten tag !

Well, as my sources about X Japan are unreliable and sooner or later you erase my commentaries of each one of articles, I propose to you that yourself complete the X Japan's videography with your comments and sources, and I will provide to you the covers with reliable and recognized sources.

PS: http://www.jpophelp.com is a reliable source?

Shadowxfox 04:43, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Sources of my covers

http://www.jpophelp.com/scripts/proddetails.asp?artistORD=X+Japan&dnum=200&majorcategory=visual (jpophelp contains all the covers, although some are in different sections)

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/search.html?type=AC&restrict=ALL&strict=&word=X+Japan (some covers, specially those of the new collections)

Shadowxfox 04:53, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

AfD nomination of I'll Kill You (The Catnip Peddlers song)

An editor has nominated I'll Kill You (The Catnip Peddlers song), an article on which you have worked or that you created, for deletion. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also "What Wikipedia is not"). Your opinions on whether the article meets inclusion criteria and what should be done with the article are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/I'll Kill You (The Catnip Peddlers song) and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You may also edit the article during the discussion to improve it but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion debate. Thank you. Please note: This is an automatic notification by a bot. I have nothing to do with this article or the deletion nomination, and can't do anything about it. Jayden54Bot 20:26, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Providence Marketplace Cleanup

I cleaned up the entire page, removing what seemed to be advertising out of the page. I also set up new references. Hopefully, I will be able to get some inages and better references onto the page. I removed the deletion tag and also the advertisment template. If you disapprove of it, you may place the templates again and explain it on my talk page.--Mxc140 18:03, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

TJ Spyke RfC

After looking over the basic form for an RfC, I'm not sure what I would put as the desired outcome. "I want him to stop doing this type of thing" really doesn't sound that great. Any ideas? -- The Hybrid 03:41, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I think that I just found a better solution than an RfC. Peace, -- The Hybrid 04:14, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Clamp subcats

I don't think it's worth the effort to rename Category:CLAMP cast members because the category has been tagged for listify-then-delete along with most other "xyz by series" categories. For Category:CLAMP images, what do you think is the best name for the new cat? Category:Clamp (manga group) images ?? -- Neier 08:23, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

I think it's a good idea to keep each other informed. I started trough Category:Japanese albums, and when I hit G∞VER, my head exploded. I think that one is going to need a WP:RM to reach any concensus. Neier 12:07, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

I figured the speedy rename for the Clamp subcats would not be a simple matter. :-(

In a related note, you may want to chime in at Talk:Sci-Fi Harry where "correct" is being argued. Neier 23:49, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

When correcting titles, the {{r from alternative capitalization}} is a useful tag to put on the redirect that was left behind. It suits two purposes (one, intentional; the other, ???). First, it marks the articles which are "alternatively capitalized", for whatever reason if it is ever important. Secondly, any edit to the redirect page makes it impossible for a non-admin to re-move the page back to the way it was before. Neier 00:15, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Toshimitsu Deyama photo

I deleted Image:Toshimitsu deyama.jpg as a recreation of Image:Toshi22.jpg, which was previously deleted as a replaceable fair use image. Please don't upload any more copyrighted promotional photographs of living people. ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 01:52, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia fair use criteria; see also wikimedia:Resolution:Licensing policy. These links document a general shift in policy that happened early last year. All replaceable fair use photographs are currently being phased out. Thank you for your cooperation, ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 02:08, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but adding a fair use rationale won't change the copyright status of this photograph - it will remain a replaceable fair use image. ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 02:14, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Correct. BTW, is this Deyama? ˉˉ^anetode╦╩ 02:34, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

X Japan and popular culture

Hello, this days I was thiking of making an article about X Japan and popular culture, and right now I'm at this User:Darkcat21/X_Japan, it would be cool If you can help me in the article, grammar, finding sources. Thank you. Darkcat21 21:21, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I understand you, but for example there are bands that have information about covers on the article of the song and on the article about their influence and then the other information it looks better in an article about them and the popular culture rather than in a trivia section. And about solo efforts of certain members do not have anything to do with X Japan's mark in pop culture, oh it's just that in the same page it would cover the info about hide and X Japan. Anyway if you don't like i won't make it, it's ok. Thanks.Darkcat21 13:07, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Talk:X Japan and WP:3O

I saw your request for a third opinion. We've been developing a bit of a backlog, which is unusual.

I have also been a target of insults from the other editor, so I can't personally address this one. ("Third opinions must be neutral. If you have previously had dealings with the article or with the editors… do not offer a third opinion on that dispute." —Providing third opinions.) — Athænara ✉ 20:02, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Deleted Key Party Records Reference

Hi, Cyrus. Why don't you read through the J-Rock Saga site before you start deleting it as a unsuitable reference. This site includes some facinating info on Japanese underground cultural movements. I agree that it doesn't quote references, but that may well mean the writer is a knowledgable person that can relate the background without any. Pkeets 14:57, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

So now you've deleted J-Rock Saga as an external link as well? What have you got against them? Pkeets 17:20, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Changing CHIC to Chic?

Why have you suddenly unanimously changed the band name from CHIC which is the correct way to spell using all capitals, to the much used but totally wrong Chic? I refer to the discussion on the CHIC (band) page. The band ABBA is an acronym, but is sometimes wrongly spellt Abba, so the guidelines regarding acronyms when it comes to artist or bands are not applicable. Artists are entitled to have their name spellt the way they want. If you have a band naming itself say "plAtonic RoSe" it would be completely unacceptable that they be respellt "Platonic Rose" in an encyclopedia. You have to allow for artistic license, and that is completely different than how to spell a company or other such worldly stuff. Please change back Chic to CHIC, that is the way the band has and wants to present itself.

Pocat-chictribute.com 10:28, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Bias of course, but before I put in my work on the page there was just a little stump of info on CHIC on Wikipedia. I don't mean that gives me the right to spell them CHIC, but a look at their graphical history and contact with many band members have confirmed that the band should indeed be spellt CHIC (with all caps). As it has been spellt for over a year and a half on Wikipedia. If it has been OK for that period, why change it now. I would like to now what gives you the right to change it? Please inform me of the power to interpret rules in this regard, you have?

I would also ask you why you have removed the link on the CHIC (band) page to my web site www.chictribute.com? Which is the no. 1 CHIC fan site on google.

Pocat-chictribute.com 12:32, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

The: ""CHICtribute.com: With news, discography, video, audio, sampling list, history, interviews, reviews, gallery, lyrics, and more!"." ...is simply a description of what my website contains, just as the description you left of the other fan site you did not edit away; "Chic discography and reviews". Why is a content description OK with one site and not the other? My site has also been used as a source for the writer Daryl Easlea when writing his book on CHIC listed as a reference on the CHIC page. If you pick up a copy, check out the thank you notes.

Pocat-chictribute.com 19:37, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Though I know you have been a good contributor willing to engage in discussion, it is important to note that per WP:SPAM you are spamming if you add your own website. This is not to encourage you to create a separate account or add it anonymously, but if it is added by another user who gives a good reason to keep it, then it would probably be worthy of inclusion. JHMM13 19:25, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

OK, I think I am finished with doing any more editing for Wikipedia anymore.

Pocat-chictribute.com 19:37, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Gah!

I don't know what to do with this one -- U-ka saegusa IN db. It's a person's name (Yūka Saegusa in WP:MOS-JA spelling) followed by "IN db". Is he U-ka, or Yūka? Saegasu should be capped; so, no problem there. Then, according to ja:三枝夕夏 IN db, the last part pronounced "in decibel", so, the correct abbreviation should be "in dB".

I don't know which of these to RM:

• U-ka Saegusa in dB (Probably the safest)
• U-ka Saegusa in db (dB vs db; which is wrong, but, I don't know that we can correct that here or not)
• Yūka Saegusa in dB (Meets all WP:MOS-JA rules)
• Yūka Saegusa in db (Meets all WP:MOS-JA rules, with the wrong dB caps)

What do you think? Neier 06:00, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Actually, if I'm interpreting WP:MOS-JA#Names in titles correctly, we shouldn't mess with the name order in the band tite. So, Saegusa U-ka in dB is what I'll start with tonight. Neier 23:15, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough. I hadn't gone to the external site; that was just based on the Japanese wiki's title. Leaving it GNFN is no trouble at all. I don't want to be the one to force a priority rule between the titles and name order sections of the MoS, and this is obviously not a good test case to begin with. Neier 07:37, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't know... maybe a wikiproject "WP:AlterNATIVE caPITalizatIONS"?  :-) Neier 09:31, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

I normally just check in at WP:RM every other day or so. But, there's precedent for a loosely-organized team of like-minded people. Neier 09:50, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Malice Mizer issue

1. Song and album titles are subjected to standard English even if they are French (ex: ~sans retour~)? The French language has entirely different standards regarding capitalization! Also, if the artist chooses to make their titles entirely lowercased, we aren't supposed to be accurate and honor that? Why else do we have the ability to make Wiki articles with no uppercase letters? Is it not to be more accurate?
2. The "English/romanized counterparts" are not the names of the songs. Those romanizations are done unofficially by fans. Why is it that these unofficial romanizations take precedence over the actual titles of the songs?
3. Malice Mizer has described itself as visual kei, rock, and nothing else. It requires total ignorance of both visual kei and gothic rock to even attempt to classify them as the latter. Malice Mizer has very few qualities in common with gothic rock, and those commonalities are completely coincidental and derived from a different source. Visual kei is a musical movement, Malice Mizer was a part of it, it should be classified as visual kei. There is no other acceptable category.
4. What more reliable source do you have than the CD releases themselves? I'm willing to bet that you don't own the CDs, otherwise you'd probably be much more hesitant to alter the titles of the tracks that are on them. Malice Mizer was nearly exclusively published in visual kei magazines (SHOXX, Vicious, Fool's Mate, etc.); they invented the visual kei fashion of gothic lolita (just go to the Moi-meme-Moitie website and it will tell you!); they speak incessantly of fusing visuals with music in many translated interviews found at www.scape.sc

Now, unfortunately, the fact that they are published in visual kei magazines doesn't blatantly say "Malice Mizer is a visual kei band". Nor does the fact that they only have currency within the visual kei community, and nor does the fact that their entire fanbase recognizes them as visual kei. There is no official document that says "Malice Mizer is a visual kei band". But if you have the tiniest bit of knowledge about the band (that is, read publications about them, read the words of the artists themselves, buy the CDs), you know it's a visual band. If you have the tiniest bit of knowledge about the band, you know that it's definitely not gothic rock! So please, stop mangling these articles until we can reach some sort of agreement! Berserk798 01:38, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

You don't understand. Whether or not you own the releases does matter, because those are the only sources! If there were no online sources for a certain article, but an editor had books, would the books not be sufficient? Someone without the books themselves can waltz in and cry "no sources" and revert everything, but in reality all they're doing is perpetuating misinformation because they themselves haven't taken an interest in the topic at hand. Your edits are wrong, and the only sources that can tell you that are 1. the CDs themselves or 2. magazine articles that are found on the fansite that you so speedily dismissed.

Now the style guidelines in fact support me, and I'll explain why: "Capital letters are sometimes a matter of regional differences; for example, British writers and editors are more inclined to use them than their American counterparts. If possible, as with spelling, use rules appropriate to the cultural and linguistic context"

Japanese artists very frequently flout capitalization rules as a means of artistic expression. It is therefore inappropriate to the cultural context of these articles to change that, including the title ~sans retour~.

Also, I fail to see anywhere that states unofficial (and unsourced, by your standards!) romanizations take precedent over the actual titles. You'll have to point that out to me.

If you think there are no sources (I provided translated articles regarding Malice Mizer and Moi dix Mois that should qualify as sources, but you dismissed them because they are found on a fansite), then take a moment to research the Gothic Lolita fashion. Just Google it, read up on it, and maybe you'll understand why it's absurd to say that Malice Mizer (where the style originated) is not a visual band.

And the irony that you demand sources saying Malice Mizer is visual kei when you have no sources (not even a fansite!) to verify the claim that they're "Gothic Rock" is not lost. If you listen to their music and research what constitutes "Gothic Rock", you might understand why it's so absurd. Berserk798 20:09, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Noir Fleurir

I did no original research; those sources were taken entirely from the Internet, after making a Google search. Tag it as unreliable, but NOT original research. Please be more careful in the future, please. I have a reputation! :-) Bearian 15:15, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

X Japan

If you renew this issue, I recommend that you split the formatic changes from the content changes, and if he reverts without explaining what the situation is or discussing on the talk page, ask on his talk page what the issue is. There needs to be more communication, if I have read the issue correctly. I am watching the page. —Centrx→talk • 15:21, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Formatting

Replied, and, I guess I'm feeling a bit 意地悪い.  :-) Neier 14:07, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Also, see the latest messages on my talk page for another editor who would probably join our noble effort. Neier 22:06, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Gothic Rock and Malice Mizer

Cyrus, I implore you to discuss on the talk page the label of gothic rock before you apply it to articles. Please. Beyond being part of the visual kei movement, Malice Mizer can't be categorized as anything more specific than possibly "progressive rock". That's even quite a stretch though, considering they have several electronic, industrial, pop, and neo-classical songs as well. I think we need to discuss their musical category on the talk page to come to a conclusion as to what would be the most sensible choice. Berserk798 23:05, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Skin

Hello, congratulations for your barnstar ^^. Anyway, could you visit Skin (Japanese band) and correct some things if they're wrong? Thanks a lot. Darkcat21 11:11, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Hide

Interesting. I figured it was a vandal and April was correct, given how everything in Japan starts then. Neier 11:53, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

School years start in April; most businesses run their books from April->March. New employees join the companies in April (with ceremonies, etc)... Neier 12:02, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Barnstar

D no need to thank me, Cyrus. I just give credit where it is due. You are still, to this day, almost 4 months later, doing more work on the Dir en Grey article than anyone else I've seen. Keep it up, and I'm suprised no one else noticed! Cheers, Quatreryukami 01:55, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Request for Third Opinion

template:History of Manchuria is suffering from extensive revert warring, and discussion is heading nowhere. A RfC was filed, but was only able to get one outside commentor[1]. Please provide a third opinion on whether template:History of Manchuria should be titled History of Manchuria[2] or History of Northeast China[3] [4] to facilitate dispute resolution. Thank you. 08:48, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Tomb Raider Anniversary cover art

Though I do not support of the Games for Windows branded band on top of the cover art, the PC version is, in fact Games for Windows branded, and I think we should let it remain that way. rohith 21:29, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Shinya is born in Hirakata

Ja, Osaka heißt auch eine Stadt, aber dort wurde er nicht geboren. So steht es auf der japanischen Seite zu Shinya und zu Hirakata. Guck bei der Hirakata-Seite auf Wikipedia. Da steht es auch.

I'm bothering you again

Editors have changed the Malice Mizer genre to "Experimental music", "Progressive rock", and "Art rock". I think those are acceptable descriptions, and you haven't raised any objections—I think we can settle for that? Because if we can, I'd like to change the discography articles to be consistent with the main article.

Edit: Actually, "Experimental music" is inappropriate because it isn't used to simply describe music that experiments with different styles--it's more along the lines of challenging the definition of music itself, and that's not something that Malice Mizer ever did. Berserk798 22:30, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Mr.Children

Don't revert the changes i will do in the future, the article now have a "in work process" template, so don't make changes until the template will be removed for me, the new main editor of the article. I know, you want a better Wikipedia for the non-fans and blah, blah, blah but don't do it if you don't know anything about the band. Remember is a Warning, thanks, Greetings =). -Suzuki 21:24, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

A few comments, and recommended reading:

• {{underconstruction}} : you are welcome to assist in its construction by editing it as well. There is no such thing as an exclusive lock on an article. You can request to have an article protected, if you feel it is being vandalized.
• WP:OWN - Pretty much the whole page is relevant to your comments above
• Finally, WP:MOS, WP:MOSCAPS, and WP:MOS-TM

If you feel that any of my edits have violated any of the Wikipedia guidelines, bring it up on the talk page. Intentionally breaking the guidelines to make a WP:POINT could be construed as vandalism. Neier 06:32, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

12012

Please refrain from reverting-good faith contributions made by other users, as you recently did in the 12012 article; please see Wikipedia:Assume good faith. You reverted my entire edit to the article, which had corrected such errors as the usage of the term "the Osaka Prefecture", which is incorrect; it is more correct to simply use the term "Osaka Prefecture" in that specific sentence. Similarly, it is more accurate to state "Osaka Prefecture" within the infobox, as Osaka, the city, is different from Osaka Prefecture. Thirdly, such matters like the date of birth and location of birth do not fall into negative nor controversial content, so your citing WP:BLP does not apply to your revert, as you could have quite easily found sources for such an obvious fact or at least added the citation tags to those particular statements; kindly review any of the single biography articles on the wiki, if you disagree. And lastly, since the group has been described as a visual kei band by numerous sources, as stated in the reference cited within the article itself, the very fact that it has been described as such justifies its usage. The term "visual kei" has also been used to describe the group in the Japanese wiki article for the band. If you had disagreements regarding such matters, you should have discussed this prior of reverting the good-faith contributions of other users. For example, if you had disagreed with the usage of this term, you may have suggested prior changes within the talk page of the article, and attempted to discuss this and your reverts of other matters as I have cited above, however, you refrained from doing so, and instead reverted the entire edit, which should never be done, especially with good-faith edits. Thank you. ···巌流^{? · talk to ganryuu} 18:10, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

boyd

Cyrus, I see that you cited the MoS as your reason for reverting the move. However, WP:MOS-CL#Mixed_or_non-capitalization indicates that you are incorrect.

Ms boyd is not the only individual to use idiosyncratic capitalization in her name; consider k.d. lang, bell hooks, catherine yronwode...

{{lowercase|title}} exists for a reason, Cyrus. I have restored the lowercase spelling. DS 01:51, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Cyrus. A few points. Firstly, the majority of outside references to ms yronwode are in fact uncapitalized. Secondly, your decision to move the article to a capitalized name, immediately after I drew your attention to it as an example of your personal policy being in error, strikes me as being a violation of WP:POINT. Thirdly, because of this - and not because of the boyd dispute - I have blocked you for no more than 24 hours. I concede that you meant well; however, it is important that we are accurate. What you are doing is equivalent to scolding ms boyd for not knowing how to spell her own name. William Faulkner chose to add a 'u' to "Falkner", and thus our article on him is spelled thusly. Ms boyd is an adult, and she has legally changed her name to bear the lower-case spelling. There are many people in the world, and not all of them use the conventional English capitalization rules. Understand? DS 03:33, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Appeal

First of all, I'd like to draw the attention of the reviewing administrator to Talk:Danah Boyd, where there is an ongoing dispute on this page egarding whether to follow the subject's personal preference of capitalization or not. Today, DragonflySixtyseven, who was not previously involved in the controversy ignored the recently failed move request, an open RfC discussion and current guideline text and went ahead to move the article, three times in a row. I'd like to quote his choice of words in his edit summaries and on in a message on the subject's user talk page respectively: "I am ruling that, as her legal name is uncapitalized [...] So mote it be.",[5] and "I have overruled the debate".[6]

On the article talk page and my own, he went on to base his rationale on WP:MOS-CL#Mixed or non-capitalization, even though this particular passage clearly suggests to have the article title follow the majority of outside sources, which happens to be the standard English capitalization in the Boyd case. He also listed several supposed precedents, e. e. cummings, bell hooks, k.d. lang and catherine yronwode, the first being beside the point, since Mr. Cummings' verifiable preference for others to capitalize his name was standard English and the second and third are already being handled accordingly to the Manual of Style (following the majority of outside sources). The Yronwode article was previously unknown to me and a quick look at the sources used for the article [7] [8] and a few additional ones easily found via Google showed that this person's name also appears to be subjected to standard capitalization in outside sources, among them Amazon.com and the New York Times no less.[9] [10] [11] The only reference in the article actually using the stylized capitalization is the subject's personal website, which is hardly surprising.

DragonflySixtyseven then blocked me, my edits to the Yronwode article supposedly being a violation of WP:POINT. He assured me, that this was not about the Boyd dispute, even though he used the better part of his message to lecture me about Ms. Boyd's rights as an adult to capitalize her name in the way she prefers. Never mind consensus, due process in dispute resolution and other widely applied guidelines that tell us to drop idiosyncratic capitalization when it comes to companies and brands or works of art (most of them founded/created by adult individuals).

This block not only strikes me as too harsh but also as an abuse of administrative privileges, given that adminship is not supposed to be a big deal and certainly not to be used to almost overtly belittle and lecture opponents in a formatting dispute. Hence I'm hereby putting in for an immediate unblock. - Cyrus XIII 11:18, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Issue raised at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard#Cyrus XIII blocked for wider review. -- JLaTondre 12:54, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, and the three-times-in-a-row move, that was the result of me screwing up the pagemove procedure. And the e-mail block, that was also an accident. DS 13:11, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

To be even more precise: the first two pagemoves were only supposed to be one. That was the screwup. Three times, yes, but only intended to be two. Note that the rationales in the first two are subtly different. DS 13:44, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Dir en grey birth dates and names

I'm seeking your opinion on the topic of Dir en grey's member's birthdates. I have found old scans of a pamphlet from the band La:Sadie's, which gives birtdate information for Kaoru, Die, Kyo, and Shinya. Since the information has been on the internet for a long time, and these pamphlet scans are of official (albeit old) goods, should they be included?

I would be able to provide you with the scans if you would like to view them.

Lastly, real names of the Dir en grye memebers, while having been guessed and posted on every fan site on the internet, have never been confirmed. However, after recent American touring, many peoples autographed merchandise from Toshiya is signed in Kanji as "Toshimasa" or 敏政. I do have pictures and scans to back this as well. What are your thoughts on this information being added to Wikipedia?--Jacob 16:46, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Personally, I would probably look at the scans of this pamphlet and photos/stories about said autographs and and accept them as the real deal - why should anyone want to mess with the data they provide? But as editors, I don't think we can consider either of them reliable sources. as they are not beyond the shadow of a doubt to not have been somewhat falsified (and the pamphlet probably never achieved wide enough circulation, so that people could easily verify what's on the actual copies and what not). While we assume good faith from our fellow editors (and that surely does wonders for our working climate), we have to remain skeptical when it comes to the "outside" world and the sources it provides.

Anyway, could you still upload those scans for me? - Cyrus XIII 11:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Of course. I uploaded everything but the postcard in this album on Photobucket. I can scan the postcard sometime today, but as I just got it, I haven't scanned it yet.--Jacob 15:50, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image (Image:The best of taste of chaos.jpg)

Thanks for uploading Image:The best of taste of chaos.jpg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. BetacommandBot 03:49, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

Image:Dir en grey 2006.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:Dir en grey 2006.jpg. I notice the 'image' page specifies that the image is being used under fair use, but its use in Wikipedia articles fails our first fair use criterion in that it illustrates a subject for which a freely licensed image could reasonably be found or created that provides substantially the same information. If you believe this image is not replaceable, please:

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If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified how these images fully satisfy our fair use criteria. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on this link. Note that any fair use images which are replaceable by free-licensed alternatives will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. --Leon Sword 20:03, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Please take a look at Controversies over the film Sicko and comment on merge proposal

Hi,

The title says it all. I am requesting your opinion only because you've edited the Sicko (film) article and therefore appear to have an interest in the movie. I created the "Controversies" article and think it should stay, but I'd welcome your opinion whatever it is. If you consider this message annoying, I apologize. I'm leaving this message with you and some others without violating WP:CANVASS. I won't be leaving another message asking you to comment again. (My regards to the other XII.) Noroton 23:15, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey, no problems at all with the Roman numeral in your user name. And "Cyrus" is great! Noroton 16:36, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

All right, Cyrus, and why the hell not? I didn't remove anything from the previous talk page. What exactly is the harm? The usefulness is obvious.Noroton 16:56, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

So there's no kind of policy at all on this, it's just a Cyrus XIII etiquette issue? And if we find that two discussions spring up, with some people noticing and some people not noticing that the discussion has been sort of, kind of, moved to another page, which discussion should we listen to? And how will we assume that an editor commenting at one page will have seen the arguments on the other page as these two discussions continue? Given the disputatious nature of the discussion, this alone will probably send it off to be resolved in some other forum, creating more complications, confusion and headaches. Please tell me how you'll resolve this, because you've just taken on the moral responsibility for it. Or will you just walk away to leave the rest of us with the problem? Noroton 17:08, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

You wrote:

It's still not your decision to make. Had I previously participated in the discussion on talk page A, I would not have wanted to have my comments crossed out there and copied over to talk page B and you cannot expect other editors to not have similar reservations. - Cyrus XIII 17:02, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Noroton"

To say that "it's still not your decision to make" is to imply that it in fact IS someone's decision to make. But that authority doesn't exist and it's not practical for each individual editor to move it or grant permission for it to be moved. And anybody can still read the original or even take out the crossing-out lines. Back in the real world, discussions have to take place on one page or they go off the rails. You're creating a train wreck. If you had cited a rule, I would have cited WP:IAR because this would be a classic case for it, and I request that you take a look at that very short, very important policy. Practicality is extremely high on the list of priorities in this encyclopedia. Please reconsider. Sorry if my previous comments were abrupt, but I'm upset. Please look at WP:IAR and reconsider. If nobody else comments on the Controversies talk page, then we don't have a problem. But if people start commenting there, will you agree with me that we DO have a problem? And what would you do about it then?Noroton 17:23, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Just saw this: "advise: Don't push too hard trying to prove to everyone that this controversy page needs to exist. It might annoy people or have them suspect bias towards the subject on your part." Look again. I didn't. Actually, I think the controversy page itself is the best argument one way or the other. Noroton 17:25, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

No, I didn't say that. I said (or meant to say) that the article speaks for itself, meaning that if it's a bad article, no amount of arguing is going to save it, and if it's a good article (asserts notability, treats the subject comprehensively, accurately and fairly; follows other relevant Wikipedia rules) not much should be needed in the way of my arguing for it. I suppose I'll probably make a few points in the discussion, but editors will decide based on what they see in the article itself. Noroton 17:39, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Cyrus, thank you so much for the link to Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines. Here's a section of it that you might want to consult: WP:MULTI. Noroton 02:54, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

YOSHIKI

We would like to update the accurate information about YOSHIKI, Because most of information about him is concentrated in Japan and There are some difference between Japanese articles and Engilish one. So we are considering that the contents sholud be same among them. I do not want you to misunderstand what I said, That is not for the funs and the non-fans, I just want update correct,accurate information about YOSHIKI by staying neutral. You reverted YOSHIKI's MySpace Page and other infomation,but it is incorrect.Please see YOSHIKI.NET. If you are disagreed with my update, please have suggested prior changes within the talk page of the article.Mbe320 23:22, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Mediation

A request for mediation has been filed with the Mediation Committee that lists you as a party. The Mediation Committee requires that all parties listed in a mediation must be notified of the mediation. Please review the request at Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Danah Boyd, and indicate whether you agree or refuse to mediate. If you are unfamiliar with mediation, please refer to Wikipedia:Mediation. There are only seven days for everyone to agree, so please check as soon as possible. --Elonka 23:56, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Hiya, sure, I'm willing to give you my general opinions on how things may go, but it's probably a topic better-suited to discussion off-wiki. Do you ever use IMs? Or if not, feel free to drop me a line in email.  :) --Elonka 19:30, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Request for Mediation

A Request for Mediation to which you are a party has been accepted. You can find more information on the mediation subpage, Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Danah Boyd. For the Mediation Committee, ^demon[omg plz] This message delivered by MediationBot, an automated bot account operated by the Mediation Committee to open new mediation cases. If you have questions about this bot, please contact the Mediation Committee directly.

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