Talk:Transformative justice

Appropriateness of new content

In this edit, LysergicAcidity added several paragraphs regarding the thoughts of Adrienne Maree Brown on the subject of transformative justice. I disagree that this content is appropriate for this article. Transformative justice is a social issue that must be addressed at the societal level, but this new content centers largely on personal strategies to handling conflict. While these may be useful guidelines by which individuals can lead their lives, Wikipedia is not a "how-to" or self-help guide, and this content is not useful in an encyclopedic sense. I ask @LysergicAcidity: and other editors to discuss this matter. WikiDan61^ChatMe!_ReadMe!! 13:21, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

I appreciate your commentary, @WikiDan61. I stand by my edit, as Transformative Justice (TJ) is a movement intrinsically based in self and community help. TJ posits looking at things in a matter seeking to uproot problems and undertake reflexive processes. As such, the questions are demonstrative of the practice and not necessarily instructive in their nature on the page. While it may appear suggestive of a how-to, TJ is a bold, undeniably political and ostentatious topic and Wikipedia urges its users to be bold in writing or updating articles. Similarly, I think it would be efficient to evoke the Ignore all rules rule, as TJ is somewhat still avant-garde in its proposals and implementations, meriting that it be learned about holistically. LysergicAcidity (talk) 18:01, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

I appreciate that perspective, but the material still comes off with the wrong tone for Wikipedia. I'd like to suggest a change, from:

Brown offers three practical considerations to reflect on on in situations of conflict that would allow for a collective pivot to transformative justice:

• Listen With “Why?” as a Framework

  It is important to listen with a deliberate will to understand in what contexts a specific harm was able to be perpetrated.

• Ask Yourself/Selves ‘What Can I/We Learn from This?’

  Every experience of conflict ought to be a teaching moment about one’s humanity helping to facilitate introspection.

• How Can my Real-Time Actions Contribute to Transforming this Situation (versus Making it Worse)?

  While there may be times in which a public callout is the appropriate form of handling conflict, most situations warrant a personal exchange between the person to understand their point of view, hence breeding trust, resilience, and interdependence—pillars of what the transformative justice movement aims on establishing.

to

Brown offers some practical considerations to reflect on on in situations of conflict that would allow for a collective pivot to transformative justice:

• deliberate listening with the goal of understanding the contexts that enabled a specific harm;
• learning from each conflict to help facilitate introspection;
• considering alternatives to public confrontation in response to conflict, such as personal exchange to breed trust, resilience and interdependence.

This wording provides a more declarative and less imperative version providing the same meaning. WikiDan61^ChatMe!_ReadMe!! 19:21, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

@WikiDan61 I appreciate your rewording and accept your edits. All part of the Wiki learning process. LysergicAcidity (talk) 21:54, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

@LysergicAcidity:  Done WikiDan61^ChatMe!_ReadMe!! 23:39, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

Edits to History and Context: Add Some Narrative and Examples to the History?

Re edits made by @Rosesav, important notes on the history and ideas of restorative justice were made. Unfortunately, they seem to have since been erased. The current article lacks footnotes in key places, making general factual statements without any clear souce: such as the statement, "The lineage of contemporary strands of transformative justice practices remains rooted in other anti-carceral and abolitionist social movements that emanate from Black, Indigenous and other racialized communities."

Both versions of the article would be strengthened with a more succint delivery of the philosophy of transformative justice, as well as a clearer historical narrative based on actually existing practices, movements that have advocated transformative justice and influenced its upsurge, and historical successes. For instance, it would be important to describe exactly what transformative justice practices have existed within indigenous and black societies. Such examples should be readily available. This would be both instructive and provide a more engaging narrative.

If possible, a narrative about the relationship between transformative justice and penal justice, particularly in the early colonial period could also be interesting, so as to illustrate the frictions between these justice systems. JustinJacksonGeorge (talk) 18:17, 28 March 2023 (UTC)

Agree that it would be helpful to have more footnotes in various key places / where certain statements have been made without clear sources. I also think it would be interesting to describe the history of the movement and key events as well as key thinkers. Amnesiamachine (talk) 01:29, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

Helpful Additions to the Introduction and Small Edits

As suggested by @Hosanna.galea, I think that it would be very helpful to contextualize the information on the page by adding a brief paragraph to the introduction. To their proposed text, however, I would a slight specification to avoid misinterpretation and quick rephrasing to help tie the paragraph together.

As @Hosanna.galea wrote: "At its core, transformative justice is based on the belief that violence and harm are not inevitable, and that we can create a world in which harm is less likely to occur.

As opposed to stating that a core belief is that "we can create a world in which harm is less likely to occur," I would remove this and add a new sentence, stating: "Fundamentally, transformative justice seeks to respond to violence and harm without creating more violence and harm, or, at the least, attempting to lessen this by practicing harm reduction." [1]https://transformharm.org/tj_resource/transformative-justice-a-brief-description/

In addition, I would add a sentence at the end of @Hosanna.galea's paragraph, stating that transformative justice (although I wrote restorative by mistake and cannot seem to access this page anymore) can, therefore, be seen as a way of "making things right, or creating "justice." [2]https://transformharm.org/tj_resource/transformative-justice-a-brief-description/ Britneys1 (talk) 03:52, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

References

Wiki Education assignment: Gender and Public Policy

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 17 January 2024 and 29 April 2024. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Mundozurdo (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Samthebossbabe, Jillianmm31.

— Assignment last updated by Shakaigaku Obasan (talk) 13:13, 22 February 2024 (UTC)