Talk:Tea/Archive 4

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Archive 4

Carcinogen?

At the bottom of the page, this article is noted to be in a category of carcinogens. Is tea actually carcinogenic? I thought it was supposed to be good for you. 66.30.40.7 (talk) 14:40, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

It's been removed. I agree with you that that seemed shady. Drinking hot beverages can be carcinogenic (scalding can cause mouth cancer) but the general evidence seems to be that overall, tea is likely to prevent cancer, not cause it, although the science is still young. I don't see anywhere near enough justification to put it in this category. Cazort (talk) 17:31, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

History and Origin

THis section states, with reference, the current scientific consensus regarding the plant's natural origin and then goes on - without reference - to discount it in what appears to be an emotional and plaintive attempt to correct a perceived historical injustice. Unless some outside published source can be cited for these speculations, I think we need to remove them and stick to what can be referenced. TheCormac (talk) 14:38, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

The supposed "Chan" reference does not even appear on the History of Tea in China WP page (which presents the Shennong myth as fact). Is someone repeatedly inserting this unverified reference? Martindo (talk) 01:19, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Who is "Chan"

There are references to "<ref:Chan>" littered all throughout the article but no actual reference to it in the Reference section. Who is this person and what article or book did they write? Sjschen (talk) 18:51, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

Mashing Tea

who put Mashing as a Yorkshire word its orginally a Lincolnshire word —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kingdomoflindsey (talk • contribs) 08:36, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Mashing is used all over the eastern half of the North and Midlands - including Notts, Derbys, Leics, parts of Staffs. I doubt any one area can claim the origin of the usage. It is perfectly natural to use it as it was formerly used for infusing barley malt to brew beer. I never knew any other word for making a cup of tea as a child in Derbyshire.Sjwells53 (talk) 14:56, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Tea preparation table

The table [1] was copied from http://mayatea-com.vsourceweb.com/teaprep/ I removed the mayatea.com link because this is not a reliable source, rather than changing the link to the subpage. Should we keep the table, or remove it? --Ronz (talk) 03:02, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Reliable sources

Self-published sources and advertising copy should not be used as references here per WP:RS. I've tagged the article as a reminder and call for assistance in identifying, removing, or replacing poor sources. --Ronz (talk) 16:38, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I think the sourcing on this page (and other tea-related pages) has been very lax. Tea companies' pages I think are not acceptable sources except in special cases where they are sourcing specific facts for which there is compelling reason to believe that they are accurate as a source. Even large, mainstream tea companies routinely have misleading and sometimes totally false statements (like "white tea is lower in caffeine than black tea"). Cazort (talk) 17:36, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Nonsense in United Kingdom section

The United Kingdom section, directly under Tea spreads to the world, contains nonsensical and semi-nonsensical language. E.g. "The London 2012 section of the paralympic handover in Beijing included tea as part of the routine[clarification needed], this is the original civilised tea ceremony developed and as the only birth place of tea in our World.[40] This is such the strong connection made between Britain and tea." Also, at least one of the citations in this section is bogus. --Smithfarm (talk) 13:41, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

Cultivation in UK

There is a note in Curtis's 4275 (1847) on the attempts to smuggle the plant and seed into England.

Many are the disappointments and delays of Science! It was not till after Tea had been used as a beverage for upwards of a century in England, that the shrub which produces it was brought alive to this country. More than one botanist had embarked for the voyage to China,–till lately a protracted and formidable undertaking,–mainly in the hope of introducing a growing Tea-tree in our Greenhouses. No passage across the Desert, no Waghorn-facilities, no steam-ship, assisted the traveller in those days. The distance to and from China, with the necessary time spent in that country, generally consumed nearly three years! Once had the Tea-tree been procured by Osbeck, pupil of Linnaeus, in spite of the jealous care with which the Chinese forbade its exportation; and, when near the coast of England, a storm ensued, which destroyed the precious shrubs. Then, the plan of obtaining berries was adopted, and frustrated by the heat of the tropics, which spoiled the oily seeds and prevented their germination. The Captain of a Swedish vessel hit upon a good scheme; having secured fresh berries, he sowed these on board ship, and often stinted himself of his daily allowance of water, for the sake of the young plants; but just as the ship entered the channel, an unlucky rat attacked his cherished charge and devoured them all! ... the facilities of communicating with foreign countries are very different now from what they were in the days of Linnæus and of the first importation of the Tea-Shrub!

I see several facts that could be included, if someone elects to improve the article they might be able to verify these with other sources. cygnis insignis 10:32, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Summary Style

So I'm thinking hard about cutting down all the translations of "tea" in all the different languages, because it's ultimately trivia. Same goes for the various types of tea, in particular their preparation. Rather than entire sections (and a few of them no more than 2 or three sentences) that discuss tea preparation, we could just put each section as a single sentence, or a small list. We've gotten too detailed in this article on some points, which makes the article hard to maintain, and impossible to reference. It's big enough as it is. Shrinking it will do good. Hires an editor (talk) 17:19, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

Odd temperatures

There are a number of temperatures that look odd, most notably repeated occurences of the combination 210 F/99 C referencing the "boiling point". Because the boiling point (at a typical atmospheric pressure) is identically equal to 100 C, this does not make sense. Either an unfortunate conversion has taken place, or there is some specific reason to use a pre-boiling temperature---which should then be explained.

Generally, I would very strongly encourage the use SI units (e.g. C) over non-SI unit (e.g. F), with the latter, if at all mentioned, being the secondary and parenthesized number. 188.100.199.10 (talk) 16:41, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Also, the Fahrenheit boiling point is usually 212 F. 210 F is commonly used in American tea culture, from my experience. I guess it would be inaccurate to call it a boiling point though. Generally you don't put completely boiling water into your cup but, rather let the water settle, even if only for a moment. 128.95.86.215 (talk) 17:06, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

cleanup necessary

I've added the cleanup tag after trying to save the # 5.9 United Kingdom section. I removed the most obvious vandalism, but that section is still filled with badly written sentences, nonsensical sentences, paragraph that are very loosely related to tea ( opium for example ) and obvious biased statements. IMO, that paragraph should be completely scrapped and rewritten. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.143.211.125 (talk) 23:24, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Theine

Why is Theine not mentioned? Theine is the type of Caffeine found in Tea, just as Guarana is generally "another" type of Caffeine. Memsom (talk) 13:33, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

If you would have tried searching for Theine on wikipedia you would find that it redirects to caffeine where it is mentioned with reference that Theine has been proven to be same as Caffeine. If you think Theine is more than that then you would either write about it in the caffeine article or start an entry on theine.. But you must give citable and verifiable published reference.. Best if it is a journal paper or a book--Dr.saptarshi (talk) 20:33, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

I suspect that the impression it's different is fostered by the French practice of marketing tea which is described on the label as "detheinée". However, closer reading of the contents usually makes clear it refers to removal of caffeine from the product.Sjwells53 (talk) 15:01, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Good public resource document

I found this fine public resource document with lot of good images of all the chemical compounds in tea and coffea. Some of these may be incorporated to enrich the relevant articles: http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monographs/vol51/index.php Just wanted to share this for now...I will myself try to find some time later to work on these. Hope someone may find these info useful --Dr.saptarshi (talk)

Data in production table

Data in the table under "Production" are properly sourced, i.e. FAOSTAT shows data that match the data in the table here. But the production numbers for Turkey appear to be internally inconsistent. FAOSTAT shows a decrease in the number of hectares cultivated in Turkey from 2006 to 2008, while tea production increased fivefold in the same interval. Probably a reporting error in the "official" data. Anyone know of another, independent source to compare this to? 208.196.65.106 (talk) 16:45, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

A Terrible Paragraph

A cup or mug of tea in Britain is usually made in a different way than is common in China and other Eastern countries. Over 90% of tea consumed is black tea, often but not always with a small amount of milk and / or sugar added. Today the British mug of tea is often made by placing one tea bag in the mug and pouring boiling water on it till seven eighths of the mug is full. The mixture is then stirred to help the tea dissolve out of the tea bag into the hot water and often the tea bag is then squeezed against the inside of the mug with the spoon to dissolve still more tea before the tea bag is thrown away. The tea bag is not soaked in the tea for more than a minute otherwise the tea will be much too strong for most people's tastes. A little milk may well then be added and perhaps sugar according to the drinker's taste with another final stir of the mixture. A cup of tea may be made in the same way or just as likely will be poured out of a traditional tea pot where tea bags and hot water have already been mixed. The drinker then adding milk and sugar, if required, and stirring the ingredients together before gently, occasionally, sipping the hot beverage, often while talking, reading, working, watching TV, gazing out the window or simply day dreaming. On semi-formal occasions tea is almost always drunk from cups, and perhaps from the best china cups on really formal occasions. A mug of tea is the most common way of casually consuming tea at work and at home. Tea and coffee are the most popular hot beverages in the United Kingdom

Yes, all of that. It is completely uncited. Much of it is irrelevant, such as talking about how one would drink the tea, and what's more, my family and myself drink tea often, and the length of time the teabag is in the cup is never regulated. It could be less than a minute to five minutes. This should be cited, rewriten or deleted. Haecandrome (talk) 19:45, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Tea Jam

What about the Republic of Tea brand "Tea Jam", available in Ginger Peach (96040) and Blackberry Sage (96041) in association with the respective teas? UNIT A4B1 (talk) 22:44, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

tea see also section

Tea Terminology Tea Studies Library Classification and Index The article Tea Studies Index needs some help to comply with wiki standards. We use this in China, and it would be great to have it on wiki, but I am not certain on the wiki style. Please feel free to edit. icetea (talk) 09:10, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

To be corrected

<< The Polish word for a tea-kettle is czajnik, which could be derived directly from cha or from the cognate Russian word. However, tea in Polish is herbata, which, as well as Lithuanian arbata, was derived from the Latin herba thea, meaning "tea herb." >>

was NOT derived from the latin herba thea, as tea did not exist at that time in Italy, nor in Greece. As explained in the article tea or chai is a word of oriental origin... All in all the polish herbata is mostly dialectal and only herba existed in latin and means herb or plant. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.56.3.102 (talk) 18:35, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Low quality reference for caffeine content

Reference number 24 relating to caffeine content is of rather poor quality. It cites the Stash Tea company's website as the source for the caffeine content information. I would strongly suggest revising this. For such a basic fact, I'm certain that there is a journal article or at least a more credible website available. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Libertarian99 (talk • contribs) 12:45, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

Removed info about Assam teas in the lead

The bit about Assam in the lead was poorly placed. I thought about moving it lower down, but realized it was just a copy-paste job from the article on Assam tea anyway. So, there's where it belongs. DigitalHoodoo (talk) 16:44, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Impact on neurotransmitters Dopamine and Norepinephrine

Drinking tea in moderation increases attention, motivation and a feeling of reward. Drinking in high doses induce hypertension, migraine like headache, nausea and clouding of thoughts, which is somewhat similar to puffing cigarettes. Is it solely because of the caffeine content? Or there is something else? Anyone knows more about the chemical side of tea and whether it has any MAO inhibitor properties? And how exactly it affects the neurotransmitters? What is the half life of the chemicals that affect the brain? Sub40Hz (talk) 08:34, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

The main "active ingredients" in tea that you're describing are caffeine and theanine, which is similar to, and synergistic with, caffeine. I presume hypertension, aggrivation of migranes, etc is likely a result of caffine if it is true - do you have any sources for these claims? I also wonder if these side effects are a result of tea consumption at large, or perhaps limited to certain types of tea (e.g. the bergamot used in Earl Gray has a few potential side effects when consumed in huge quantity, and certain low-grade teas have been known to be contaminated with fluoride). In regards to nausea specifically, I presume this is an effect of tannin, though one would need an RS to support that. As far as the half-life of chemicals and their specific actions on the brain, those things are best reserved for the WP pages concerning the specific chemicals. DigitalHoodoo (talk) 20:15, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

also - no, tea is not an MAOI. —Preceding unsigned comment added by DigitalHoodoo (talk • contribs) 20:17, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

The Tea wiki

Can be found here [2]. Jackiespeel (talk) 18:02, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

In Our Time

The BBC programme In Our Time presented by Melvyn Bragg has an episode which may be about this subject (if not moving this note to the appropriate talk page earns cookies). You can add it to "External links" by pasting * {{In Our Time|Tea|p004y24y}}. Rich Farmbrough, 03:21, 16 September 2010 (UTC).

Turkish Tea

It must be noted that Turkey possibly has the highest tea consumption per capita. Though it is one of the largest producers, it does not export much, so that says a lot. Someone should also add Turkish "çay" in the language chart. A few pictures of traditional tea kettles (double decked!), traditional tea glasses (thin waisted!) and semavers would be nice too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.229.112.98 (talk) 19:03, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

We would need an RS to support the "highest tea consumption per capita" claim; basing this upon the production & export figures is OR. However, if you can find any information, please add it! DigitalHoodoo (talk) 19:59, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Argentine "tea"

Is the herb called "te negro"--produced and consumed in Argentina--from Camellia sinensis plants? Although the taste has almost nothing in common with Assam, Ceylon or China black teas, Argentina is listed as a tea producer in this article.Torontonian1 (talk) 20:30, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

preparation section

Pu'er Tea 95 to 100 °C (203 to 212 °F) (Limitless????) Several limitless, really? icetea8 (talk) 06:38, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

European tea plantations

The article says, "The only European plantation is Cha Gorréana, located in Ribeira Grande, São Miguel island, Azores (Portugal)." How about the Black Sea coast of Georgia and Russia? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.40.1.129 (talk) 17:29, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Also how about small-scale growers such as the Tregothnan estate in Cornwall? 132.185.144.121 (talk) 12:57, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

ITC external link on trade data

Hello everyone, I am working for the International Trade Centre (ITC). I would like to propose the addition of an external link that could lead directly to the specific product trade data held by ITC. I would like you to consider this link under the WP:ELYES #3 prescriptions. Moreover, the reliability and the pertinence of this link can be supported by the following facts 1) ITC is part of the United Nations 2) No registration is required 3) Trade data (imports/exports) are regularly updated 4) The link gives direct access to the trade database referring to the specific product 5) The addition of a link to reliable cotton trade data could provide an appropriate contribution to the piece of the article related to economics. Thank you for your attention.Divoc (talk) 17:54, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Polish for tea

Why is herbata included under derivatives of tea? While it seems obvious to me that it is not a native word, since few Polish words start with "h", it does not appear to have any etymological link to "tea". It seems more to do with herbs/herbal (from Latin languages). It should be listed as an isolate, one of the few if I'm not mistaken. 98.64.73.9 (talk) 16:28, 16 July 2011 (UTC) Tom

Health claims

Many of the individual tea articles have claims of beneficial health effects and sometimes contradictory; they should be centralize here Health effects of tea, instead of riddled throughout the articles. icetea8 (talk) 14:43, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

primary tea processing

i understand this is not a chinese tea article and is for all teas, and most of my understanding is from chinese, so please explain other processing terms (where used, india,...). This process "curing" is called "added processing" and is not need to make the classification of the 6 teas, it can be added, for example a oolong that is roasted or not roasted is still an oolong and a puer aged or not aged is still a puer. If you put in (added processing)aging and roasting then you should also include scenting and spicing(flavoring). Please look at this graph.

Primary Tea Processing (no roasting, scenting, or spicing)

---

i am using tea jargon fermention/oxidation, when i mean microbe fermention i use piling. "green Puer青普: sun fixation曬青 > rolling揉捻 > sun drying曬乾 > at this point it is done and can be aged but it still is green puer the thing that makes a Puer is it has to be sun fixed, the aging is an added process, yes it should be aged but it does not have to be it is still a green puer at this point. and it can be compress into cakes. "dark tea黑茶and dark Puer熟普: sun fixation曬青 > rolling揉捻 > piling 渥堆 > sun drying曬乾" (dark and dark puer have sun fixation, regular green tea doesnt have sun fixation) "white tea白茶: withering (fermentation) 萎凋 > rolling揉捻 > drying乾燥" ( yes lightly oxidation, but white tea is not high heat fixated it is withered then rolled lightly then dried, many from in fuding china) "oolong tea烏龍茶: withering(with buising/tossing)萎凋 > fermentation發酵 > fixation殺青 > rolling揉捻 > drying乾燥"" (you are correct the tea is bruised usually several times, but the chart has sun withering this is not an important step to oolongs, many oolongs are made with indoor withering an example cool long time withering like anshi iron goddess) green tea綠茶: fixation殺青 > rolling揉捻 > drying乾燥(the fixation is usually pan fixation in china/taiwan and steam fixation in japan)

yellow tea黃茶: fixation殺青 > rolling揉捻 > sweltering悶黃 > drying乾燥(similar to green tea but has a added swealtering process no added heat the tea is piled up after fixation and rolling for short-time only made in the spring)

black tea紅茶: withering萎凋 > rolling揉捻 > fermentation發酵 > drying乾燥 (key point for all black teas is first rolled/ctc/rupture cell walls then fermention)

to create the varieties of tea we do not need the "curing/added process/加工" of roasting: for example if a green tea is roasted it still is a green tea like the japanese tea (Hōjicha/ほうじ茶/番茶). oolongs can be roasted but not necessary, same is for scenting and spicing. see below.

problems of translating: taiwan and many parts of china use 初製and 加工 differently so i will put what i mean by each below: added processing 加工, here i mean soming added after the tea is one of the main varieties and cant be changed again example like once it is a green tea it wont change into a black tea: re-drying覆火, aging 陳放 (by storing), roasting 焙火, scenting熏花, spicing調味 what is important is the primary processing: Primary Processing初製from fresh leaves 茶青not all are used: withering萎凋, fermentation發酵, fixation殺青,rolling揉捻,drying乾燥, 渥堆 piling, this is the process that make a tea black or white or other variety.

icetea8 (talk) 06:29, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

This is a good point that should be addressed. I'll work on clarifying. However, this is only a general overview, and as such should use fairly common language and simple concepts (i.e. it should be easy to digest for people with no knowledge of tea at all). The finer points (raw vs. cooked puer, for example) can be addressed in the articles dedicated to puer tea, ooling tea, and so on... DigitalHoodoo (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 19:26, 15 August 2011 (UTC).

Swedish: chai??

Not officially swedish word me thinks. Can be of course used for indian type tea for marketing as it in Finland too, but not a really swedish word, but foreign loan word. No dictionary gives that form as traditionally Swedish, like the Finnish traditional dialectical terms that come from Russian. Use as it is in the table just mixes the meaning so I will take it away. If somebody disagrees - you can explain this and the traditional use in Swedish language it has (if there is one, which I don't think there is). --213.138.155.99 (talk) 11:49, 1 September 2011 (UTC) (E. Suhonen, A Finn, who speaks Swedish well) -

Also would ask if the chai is used in English for general tea and not just for Indian type of tea. I think if it is used just for Indian type of tea, it should not be in this table, because it again mixes the table for givin right imbression of the issue. Please remove it if it does not. --213.138.155.99 (talk) 11:59, 1 September 2011 (UTC) (brevious)

You could make a bullet point remark at the section etymological observations. Just a suggestion. It explains the English word too, unfortunately unreferenced, so I wouldnt know. -- Cold Season (talk) 16:50, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

Hydroxycut confusion

The connection of Hydroxycut's reported side effects to the tea extract compound is irresponsible, and makes a claim that has no foundation or evidence: "liver damage, caused in part or completely by the presence of green tea extract in these supplements; the most notable cases include Hydroxycut[...]" Hydroxycut became popular first as a version of the bodybuilder's infamous trio: caffeine, ephedra, and Asprin: in this case guarana extract, ephedra extract, and white willow bark for the natural ASA. After ephedra was banned they switched to a blend of other popular ingredients: Garcinia cambogia, Gymnema sylvestre, chromium polynicotinate, caffeine, green tea- and Citrus Aurantium, which is inexplicably not mentioned in the Wikipedia article on Hydroxycut. The studies cited only attribute a causal association between liver failure and Hydroxycut as a whole: there is no reason to single out Camellia sinensis as the culprit- and given that tea is exponentially the most widely-used ingredient that happens to appear in that formula (excepting caffeine), the likelihood of the tea (a minor ingredient in the capsules)being the problem is almost nil. The Citrus Aurantium (Bitter Orange) peel, used as a source of synephrine to replace ephedrine, is the most likely culprit, coupled with excessive caffeine. Add in the new Hydroxycut Advanced, and you're talking about at least three different formulations of the product- and given the timeline, it's likely that the liver failure cases were in customers who had literally NO tea in their capsules. Specifications per dose of Hydroxycut (2000mg):

   Guarana Extract....................910mg (containing caffeine)
   Citrus Aurantium....................300mg (containing synephrine)
   L-Carnitine.............................100mg (amino compound/quat)
   Salicin Complex.......................15mg (salicylate phytohormones)
   Chromium Picolinate..............300mg (niacin-bound chromium, a trace mineral).

In short, the Hydroxycut observations are misleading, have nothing to do with tea, and should be removed from the article. 69.165.149.221 (talk) 02:42, 7 December 2011 (UTC) In fact, I'm doing it now, and until someone provides a shred of reputable evidence linking TEA (as a singular ingredient) with any cases of liver failure, it should stay out. Its presence here is absurd. 69.165.149.221 (talk) 12:25, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Did Tea Drinking Lead to Urbanization?

Did Tea Drinking Lead to Urbanization? Something to mention in the article. Sourced from The Ghost Map, by Steven Johnson -- cheers, Michael C. Price ^talk 16:26, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Bibliography Section to "Further Reading"

My understanding is that a Bibliography section is not to list the sources cited in the notes, but to give "further reading." Also different from general references However Wikipedia:Further reading is under discussion. I have edited with this in mind. Hope this works!ch (talk) 19:56, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

ambiguous verbage quoted from a biased source

the article states "Certain tea has more caffeine by weight than coffee; nevertheless, more dried coffee is used than dry tea in preparing the beverage,[24] which means that a cup of brewed tea contains significantly less caffeine than a cup of coffee of the same size.".

what does this sentence even mean? the wording does not make sense. what beverage? a tea beverage, which is what this article is about? i do not know by reading this. this statement contradicts itself, as well. because what it is saying is that, at the end, tea has less caffeine than coffee because, in the beginning of the sentence, certain teas have more caffeine than coffee.

If the statement means that tea has more caffeine, by weight, than coffee, yet people use a larger, heavier by weight amount of coffee grounds when brewing an 8 ounce cup of coffee than they do when brewing tea, -- right there! what? how do we know this is true? ...then the statement goes on to say that the tea, therefore has less caffeine than coffee does. One can assume the author meant that this occurs because people add more coffee grounds, by weight, than tea leaves, when preparing coffee and tea.

additionally, the quote, #24, came from the Stash tea company, which sells tea, and therefore has a biased view. Also, the link for the original source, #24, from Stash tea, is a dead link, so one could not verify this information. At this time, one may only ponder whether this statement is true, as it is not backed up by research. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chakrabrat (talk • contribs) 17:13, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

Agreed, I have removed it. Link rot and a webshop as reference... --Cold Season (talk) 17:21, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

Temperatures in "Preparation"

The temperatures for each tea as listed in the chart vs each section for Oolong, Green, etc, differ, great enough to cause confusion. For example, the chart suggests Oolong should be brewed at temperatures between 80-85C, while the actual section for Oolong says 90-100C. That's a pretty big difference when it comes to tea, so which one is more accurate? Why is one section of the article not consistent with itself? 174.112.6.146 (talk) 21:58, 14 January 2012 (UTC)

ITC external link to trade data

Hello everyone, I am working for the International Trade Centre (ITC). I would like to propose the addition of an external link that could lead directly to the specific product trade data held by ITC. I would like you to consider this link under the WP:ELYES #3 prescriptions. Moreover, the reliability and the pertinence of this link can be supported by the following facts 1) ITC is part of the United Nations 2) No registration is required 3) Trade data (imports/exports) are regularly updated 4) The link gives direct access to the trade database referring to the specific product 5) The addition of a link to reliable data could provide an appropriate contribution to the section of the article related to the economics of tea and its trade. Thank you for your attention.Divoc (talk) 17:24, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Role of Tea in Human Health

Consumption of tea is probably beneficial to health given its high antioxidant, flavanols, flavonols, and polyphenols content. It also probably helps with mental state. Tea now sounds confused about this healthy characteristic, and I'd like to redo the introduction to incorporate this information.32cllou (talk) 10:58, 4 March 2012 (UTC) Looking over the article, there is dated research in the body. If the introduction is updated, we need to fix much of the body.32cllou (talk) 16:32, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

Well, the article's intro is very tight at the moment, and there is another article on the health effects of tea. Don't start major rewrites or revisions without considering where the best place for this information is going to be. Also, "dated research" is a little vague :) - what do you think is out of date? I have good access to current scholarly / medical databases, as well as a comprehensive knowledge of the plant and its preparation, so I would be very happy to help you clean it up or revise content if you're interested. DigitalHoodoo (talk) 22:23, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

The subject needs lots of work too. I'll be careful to not expand the overall length of Tea, or overlap with health effects of tea. Read Wikipedia rules about how an introduction length should reflect the body length, so that will be kept that tight. I just spent a small fortune buying the articles to include, which is all recent research finding large reduction in various types of cancer risks, almost incredible blood sugar moderation and reduction of 2 diabetes incidence (looks better than taking the new medications), improved cognition, reduced risk of dementia and Alzheimer’s. Next time I'll ask you to provide the papers!! Let me rewrite with references, and see what you think. I'll review the health effects section before starting.32cllou (talk) 01:04, 7 March 2012 (UTC) There's lots of junk in that health effects sub32cllou (talk) 07:10, 7 March 2012 (UTC) Linking to other Wikipedia articles worked well and to very well done content. Now to add a little in tea main text.32cllou (talk) 15:08, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Yikes, I'm sympathetic - scholarly information gets expensive indeed... but that's a social ill best described in other articles ;) If you're in the US, you might check your public library for access to paid databases - many PLs provide access from home, equal to university libraries (as a librarian, I have to shamelessly promote these kinds of services). Anyway... I haven't gone over it in quite a while, but I suspect the 'Health effects" article - like you said - needs a lot of work, and these types of article always need more citations and verifiable facts. The main article (this one) has a lot of good stuff to work with already, and needs mostly polish and careful pruning. For example, we have full articles for different tea classes and varietals, preparation, health effects, tea culture, and so on; a lot of that stuff is repeated here. I would be very happy to see better coordination between this page and those. These are a set of articles I enjoy editing (they don't have any thorny BLP issues, no extreme or polarizing political arguments... it's a nice change of pace), and I'm happy to see someone else interested in improving them. I'll be around in coming days to poke and prod (busy with non-WP research); in the meantime, be bold. DigitalHoodoo (talk) 20:04, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

A little early commentary on your recent changes (specifically your scrapping of the ~2k words in the old "health effects" subsection of this page) - be careful that you're not scrubbing out potential health drawbacks to tea consumption or overconsumption. They do exist, even if the positive effects outweigh them for most people. :) I'm happy to see the refs, though, and can't complain about including more positive research on my favorite beverage. I will be reinserting some of the deleted text, as it provides a significant counterpoint to the positive correlations in the Alzheimer's studies, etc. DigitalHoodoo (talk) 20:13, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Boy, I'd already forgotten my changes but it's easy to compare back. The "increases the risk for rheumatoid arthritis" (RA) side effect text I deleted in health effects was referenced with an unrelated yahoo news page, and I can't find any RA related drawbacks to tea consumption. Certainly not what was written there. Generally, I can't find any human studies finding actual ill side effects to tea consumption. None, save the caffeine component, which might be largely mitigated by cold steeping. Recent human studies find reduced heart disease, diabetes, and broad range of cancers risk. Might be antioxidant, might be anti-inflamatory action. Somehow blood sugar in moderated. Most of those studies seem to have been completed in the last 10 years, and they negate the older largely animal research. That's what I'll try to put in the main article, but it might be short because I don't really understand much of the journal language. That will make me conservative, not so bold. I'll check out our library, but using the PC there means waiting in line and using for 15 - 30 min max. Ugg, coordination between main and subs will take lots of brainpower. What's BLP? I do read some one sided articles in Wikipedia. Thanks for the be bold.32cllou (talk) 07:40, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

There are a couple notable ill effects, though not necessarily from the tea itself. Fluoride is a big one, especially in Western China and other places that drink large amounts of lower grade tea containing high fluoride levels. There are a lot of "mights" in your claims here ("Might be antioxidant, might be anti-inflamatory action. Somehow blood sugar in moderated"); to me, this is a red flag that an editor might inadvertently slip into original research, or overstating the claims and conclusions of otherwise reliable source material. Note that I'm not accusing you of anything, and genuinely assume good faith - only asking that you be mindful. 156.98.129.16 (talk) 19:37, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

References

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Tea/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Sasata (talk · contribs) 20:29, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Quickfail rationale: This article has several cleanup banners (mostly citations needed) that should have been dealt with before GAN. Additionally, there are several paragraphs without citations, which makes it impossible to a reader (or reviewer) to verify the accuracy of the text. Furthermore, all sources in the "Health benefits" section should be checked to ensure they conform to WP:MEDMOS standards. Please ensure that future GAN candidates are up to standard by checking each against the guidelines; these ill-prepared submissions sap reviewer's time and are counterproductive. Sasata (talk) 20:29, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Caffeine content of tea not prominent in article

I am surprised that Caffeine is not mentioned in this article until Paragraph 2 of Section 5. Much like coffee, surely tea owes its dominant position in modern culture to the stimulatory effect of its caffeine, and not to its health benefits. I would expect a mention of the caffeinated nature of tea somewhere in the opening section, which currently reads like a advertisement for tea drinking. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.206.28.206 (talk) 11:36, 17 June 2012 (UTC)

Tea or Coffe

Is teine more excitant than cafeine? nuriamt (talk) 21:59, 18 April 2001

Teine and caffeine are the same molecule.HBMount (talk) 05:53, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

What does eg: OP, FOP, FBOP, SFTGFOP stand for?

I failed to find anything in this article that explains all "classifications" of teas, even teas of the same kind can have different "classifications", like:

• Assam OP
• Assam BOP
• Assam SFTGFOP
• Jasmine FBOP
• And so on...

I think this is have something to do with the kinds of leaves in the tea, but I don't know what eg. FBOP is a abbreviation of, and what thing this abbreviation tries to explain. Thanks for answers, and can someone that knows also write a section in the article? --Sebbes333 (talk) 20:27, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

I have found some information that I seek:

• OP = Orange pekoe
• FOP = Fine Orange pekoe
• BOP = Broken Orange pekoe
• FBOP = Fine Broken Orange pekoe
• SFTGFOP = ? Fine ? Golden Flowery Orange pekoe

But I still have no clue what "Orange pekoe" means... --Sebbes333 (talk) 20:48, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

Orange pekoe? Deli nk (talk) 20:57, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

Yes, thats what I mean, Thanks, I will correct the misspelling. --Sebbes333 (talk) 21:16, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

There's a page on Orange pekoe I haven't read it yet but I assume it explains. Roly (talk) 21:23, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the answers! --Sebbes333 (talk) 21:33, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

Origin and history

Somebody writes this in the origin and history section, "The first recorded drinking of tea is in China, with the earliest records of tea consumption dating back to the 10th century BC" and cited two sources for it. These two sources are similar, from another encyclopedia. I took a look at the two sources and none of them has the above info.

What the source says is "Tea was cultivated in China in prehistoric times and was probably first used as a vegetable relish (as it was in American colonies and still is in some parts of Asia) and medicinally. By the 8th cent., cultivation had begun on a commercial scale in China, and shortly thereafter, in Japan. The tea ceremony of Japan was introduced from China in the 15th cent. by Buddhists as a semireligious social custom. Tea was first imported into Europe by the Dutch East India Company in the early 17th cent., and its subsequent popularity played an important role in the opening of Asia to Western commerce."

It doesn't say the earliest record is in 10th century BC and by whom. Can anybody verify this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.187.186.220 (talk) 10:19, 28 October 2012‎

Check again. From the Beverage section: "The tea brewed from the dried leaves of this plant has been drunk in China since perhaps the 28th century BC and certainly since the 10th century BC, from which time written records of its use survive." - M0rphzone (talk) 02:05, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Health and Herpes

The paragraph on destroying viruses is copied straight from the reference cited, which turns out to be a Watchtower tract which doesn't itself contain any references to the original research. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.5.162.9 (talk) 15:10, 21 April 2013 (UTC)

Snobbery

I've moved this from the article because of copyvio concerns. The tea.co.uk reference has references of it's own that should be used if someone wants to try to include it reworded, to avoid WP:V and WP:OR problems. --Ronz (talk) 16:35, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

For much of the twentieth century, methods of preparing and serving afternoon tea were the subject of much snobbery. In a letter to Nancy Mitford, a social commentator and great satirist of upper class behavior, the author Evelyn Waugh mentions a mutual friend who uses the expression 'rather milk in first' to express condemnation of those lower down the social scale. This expression was used by the Georgian and Victorian elite to deride their middle-class governesses for the practice of pouring milk into the cup first, dubbing them "milk-in-first misses." In the British film Gosford Park the tension is depicted as continuing to exist; Lady Sylvia McCordle sneers at the police Inspector Thomson for putting the "milk in first" and in the film he quickly realises how the act demonstrates his social "inferiority" and becomes embarrassed. Nowadays the 'milk in first or tea in first' debate is altogether more light-hearted, but nonetheless everyone has his or her preferred method of making tea.

I added that because that part was for a long time in the Tea (meal) article. When Logical Cowboy removed it, [3] with the motivation that it does not belong to the article tea as a meal, but rather to tea, I put that there, that´s all. Considering that it was in the article for a long time didn’t bother much to check it. I do not know who made the initial contribution. Hafspajen (talk) 12:22, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

That explains it. Thanks! --Ronz (talk) 14:57, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

References

The word "tea"

This section is way too long and detailed. A lot of it is just language trivia and should be removed. I also don't think it makes sense for us to be listing every derivation of the word "tea" in every language. This is supposed to be an encyclopedia article about tea, not an article for a linguistic journal about the word. Some discussion of the word is appropriate, but this is just excessive. Kaldari (talk) 21:28, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

I tend to agree. The plain text before the tables is sufficient. The tables are going too far. Does anybody disagree? --Roly (talk) 15:48, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

I think the section on the word is interesting--in fact, this is exactly the topic I was looking for. I can't find any evidence elsewhere, though, that 茶 is or ever has been pronounced "da" or "ta" in Japanese. Japanese dictionaries give only the pronunciations "cha" and "sa."˜˜˜˜ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ahchambers (talk • contribs) 04:51, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

List of Tea Varieties?

Is there a list of tea varieties? I cannot find one. I know there is a list in the tea infobox, but it is in no way complete, and there are plenty of tea variety articles not included in the infobox. Abbott75 ღ 02:25, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

Not Tea

Hi, I'm just wondering since theres a redirect in from Not Tea, wouldn't it be a good idea to stick a little note explaining not tea and a link in to hitchhikers guide to the galaxy? I figured I would make a member and ask this on the talk page instead of just doing an edit to tea without geting anyone opinion Davnoctu (talk) 17:44, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

I added the template. I hope you refer to the video game and not the whole franchise. Tbhotch.^™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it! See terms and conditions. 22:18, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

Incorrect dates / "success" of tea bags

"In 1953 (after rationing in the UK ended), Tetley launched the tea bag to the UK and it was an immediate success."

It certainly was not a success for many years.

I grew up during the 1960s and remember significant advertising for tea bags starting during the late 60s / early 70s. The general public reception was highly dismissive, with articles and interviews taking a somewhat scornful attitude towards tea in bags, rather than being prepared in teapots from loose tea - the traditional Englsh way. It was quite a few years, perhaps mid-70s, before tea bags were considered widely acceptable rather than just a cheap, low quality convenience. This view was held throughout all strata of society. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.130.102.129 (talk) 23:26, 21 November 2013 (UTC)

Korean and Japanese words for tea

In the text, it says "The Korean and Japanese word cha comes not from Cantonese but from the Mandarin chá." There are a couple of problems with this, firstly tea appeared in Korea and Japan long before what's called considered modern Mandarin appeared, even before Old Mandarin, therefore it is not clear what the sentence is trying to say. The language of the earlier period when many words were borrowed by the Korean and Japanese is called Middle Chinese (the way those words are pronounced is referred to as Sino-Xenic pronunciations). It also somewhat contradicts a later sentence where it says "Korean and Japanese, for example, retain early pronunciations of ta and da." (although according to the article, it can be pronounced both as da and cha). So did they change their pronunciation somewhere along the way, or was there a later borrowing of pronunciation? It is confusing, and needed clarification, I have therefore added citation needed tag to make sure that there are sources for those assertions. Hzh (talk) 16:56, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

The Japanese Wikipedia appears to affirm that "ta" and "da" are alternative On'yomi readings of the kanji 茶, however it does not provide any citations. Per ja:茶#名称:

日本語の茶の字音は呉音「ダ」、漢音「タ」、唐音「サ」である。「チャ」という音は院政時代の『色葉字類抄』から見られ、漢音と唐音の間の時期に流入したと考えられる。また、朝鮮語漢字音も「タ」と「チャ」があるが、植物・飲料の茶だけを指す場合、「チャ」を用いる。

In other words, the Japanese pronunciation of "cha" first occurred within the dictionary titled ja:色葉字類抄, which was created in the Heian era. The Go'on reading is "da", Kan'on reading is "ta", and To'on reading is "sa". (Despite the names Go'on 呉音, Kan'on 漢音 and To'on 唐音, Go'on readings actually came from Korea, Kan'on readings from the Tang, and To'on readings from the Song.) --benlisquare_T•C•E 14:22, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. Since I don't read Japanese, perhaps you can help edit the appropriate part of the text? The citation needed tag can be removed. From this can I also assume that the sentence "The Korean and Japanese word cha comes not from Cantonese but from the Mandarin chá" is misleading and perhaps wrong? Maybe it should be rewritten as coming "from an older form of Chinese". Hzh (talk) 18:58, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

I don't think Mandarin, as we know it today, existed during the Heian period. I'd think it's safe to say that the statement is a bit dubious. However -- that's assuming that everything the Japanese Wikipedia article says is correct. The Japanese Wikipedia has a track record of not having enough citations in general throughout its articles, and the very paragraph that I quoted from there has zero references. I'll leave the decision up to you, since I don't think we have enough verifiable information here. --benlisquare_T•C•E 19:34, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

I must apologize: earlier today I saw the comment, above, and before I realized it was a quote from the article and not simply an editor's words, I edited the quote and fixed the grammar in it. I changed "words" to "word" (because "cha" is one word, even if in two languages). Then I had to fix the verb to go with that singular subject; I changed "come" to "comes". Then I thought, even though it is still under discussion, I would made the same changes to the original statement in the article, but I couldn't find it. So, starting from the next comment, above, you've been discussing a slightly different version of the statement than was originally there. Sorry about that.CorinneSD (talk) 00:01, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

I finally found the sentence. Here it is again:

"The Korean and Japanese words cha however come not from Cantonese but from an earlier form of Chinese."

If the wording is kept as it is, it appears that cha is one word; in that case "words" needs to be changed to "word" and "come" to "comes" (as I suggested above). An even better wording would be:

"The Korean and Japanese word for tea, cha, however, comes not from....", or

"However, the Korean and Japanese word for tea, cha, comes not from...."

Also, I think saying "comes not from Cantonese but from an earlier form of Chinese" suggests that Cantonese is not a dialect of Chinese. I read the discussion above, and I realize there are difficulties with naming what language or dialect it comes from, but I think something needs to be said. – CorinneSD (talk) 23:09, 3 February 2014 (UTC)

It might be better described as "pronunciations" rather than "words". My knowledge of Korean and Japanese is extremely limited, but they appear to be same word in Hanja and Kanji, so I'm not sure if they can be considered different words. It appears that the word was borrowed into Japanese multiple times and acquired different pronunciations depending on when the word was borrowed. We can consider rewording it or deleting the sentence entirely and explain it further elsewhere. The Cantonese pronunciation appears to be only relevant for a later period in Chinese history (16th century onwards?) and not relevant to the period when the word tea went into Korean and Japanese usage when there was probably no Cantonese as we know it today. Hzh (talk) 16:55, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

The section on Japanese pronunciations remains very problematic. In practice, ta and da simply do not exist as words for tea in the Japanese language. Common general-purpose dictionaries such as Daijirin do not even mention them; ordinary Japanese people have never heard of them. The Japanese word for tea is cha, period, and the text currently that claims Japanese has words ta and da with cha as an 'alternative' is deeply misleading. Frankly, in the absence of a clear explanation, let alone a single reliable citation, it is not obvious that any of that belongs in the article; at best it seems to be a historical note on ancient usages that have not left any traces in the modern world. 109.151.7.76 (talk) 16:05, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Expanding "Processing and classification" section

Section "Processing and classification" should be expanded. Yes, there is the "main article" link, but is too short anyhow.

(We have a very long The word "tea" section, for example, I think is even more important to be able to understand (a little better) the different kind of tea (which are often cited in this article) without moving to another article. --109.54.1.65 (talk) 08:18, 15 May 2014 (UTC)

I understand why you made the suggestion, but according to Wikipedia guidelines any expansion to information on tea processing should take place in that article, not here. This is done to avoid creation of what is known as a content fork and to prevent this article becoming too long for readers to navigate comfortably.  Philg88 ^♦talk 08:29, 15 May 2014 (UTC)

Teaism

While teaism is in The Book of Tea, I think the concept teaism deserves its own article, just like tea ceremony and tea culture. icetea8 (talk) 02:25, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

TEA DESSERTS I think it would be a good idea to add dishes and desserts to complete the article.(Lomopite (talk) 23:31, 11 March 2011 (UTC))

Tea desserts and other foods using tea should be added. I like Japanese green tea ice cream!Pete unseth (talk) 12:10, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

Wouldn't recipes go into the Cookbook section of Wikibooks? https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cookbook:Table_of_Contents Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 22:32, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

Data incorrect in 'Production' Section?

The Visual Chart of Country Production is inconsistent with the Tabular data. India is listed as <20%, while Turkey is listed as > 20% of world production. This isn't consistent with the Tabular data which shows India producing > 20% and Turkey as < 20% of the world production. I do not know which one is correct, but the data should be aligned. 207.38.43.28 (talk) 20:35, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

Image galleries

Image galleries are needed to make this page more readable and more suitable for display on non-PCs.

-- http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Images#Gallery_syntax

This branch still has the intact gallery tags -- http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Tea&oldid=622666737

I have done a lot of overall maintenance with respect to tea related articles, but the article only recently has developed so many images that the need for their proper organization has become necessary. Eyreland (talk) 23:36, 24 August 2014 (UTC)

Green/Black Tea

Under "History" it is stated that green and black tea both grow on the island. But the difference is only one of preparation, no? So this statement seems misleading. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.100.20.218 (talk) 13:17, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

The island? As for the difference between black and green teas, read Tea#Processing_and_classification. - Takeaway (talk) 14:19, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Translation question

Can anybody here answer the question about a type of Chinese tea posed here [4]? Jackiespeel (talk) 10:45, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

Deficits of tea bags

A lot of the claims about the problems with tea bags in the 'Packaging' section are un-cited assertions about the opinions of 'tea aficionados'. Claims like "The paper used for the bag can also be tasted by many" are, I think, inappropriate. Who are the 'many'? If these claims are the results of the author conveying his own sense of the anecdotal evidence he's been exposed to, that fails the Wikipedia verifiability guidelines. I propose deleting the sentences in that section that lack citations.

Ionocube (talk) 03:02, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

The article is still awash with unsubstantiated assertions and generalizations, many of which are highly questionable. --Ef80 (talk) 17:32, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

Psychoactive drug and nootropic

Please add {{Nootropics}} and [[Category:Psychoactive drugs]] to the article as tea contain the psychoactive drug caffeine. --94.245.53.33 (talk) 21:39, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Teas that do not make use of Camellia Sinensis

It may be useful to cite a more comprehensive list of the other types of teas (including "Herbal" or "Tisanes" teas such as the Rose_hip, Chamomile, and Rooibos cited thus far). The most we have here to that effect is:

"The phrase herbal tea usually refers to infusions of fruit or herbs made without the tea plant, such as steeps of rosehip, chamomile, or rooibos. These are also known as tisanes or herbal infusions to distinguish them from "tea" as it is commonly construed."

and from the Tea culture section:

"While herbal teas are also referred to as tea, most of them do not contain leaves from the tea plant."

I'd like to offer up Mate_(beverage) (non-herbal), Mentha, Lavandula, Hibiscus, Ginger, and Malva_sylvestris as examples in addition to the aforementioned ones. (For more herbal teas, see Herbal_tea) Anyone who is not already familiar with tea is likely to easily mistake these non-Camellia Sinensis teas as a different category of Camellia Sinensis tea, eg: thinking they are akin to white, black, yellow, etc. and as a result be confused when seeing that they're excluded in this chart:

coupled with possible confusion seeing the Tisanes category listed in the same Steepting Teas chart as the other Camellia Sinensis teas with little distinction therein, or to have not even heard of non-Camellia Sinensis teas such as these. (It's noteworthy that Mate can be steeped two ways, one of which is traditional bag-steeping ("Mate Cocido") and the other being continual steeping within in a gourd, which is very unconventional in the world of teas.)

This could help further emphasize the distinction between these types of teas, showing the importance of Camellia Sinensis and the different varieties of it, while further emphasizing that the term "tea" can also apply to a variety of beverages formed using other plant matter, and to help spread familiarity of these non-Camellia Sinensis teas to those seeking knowledge on the subject.

It may also be worth noting that, much like Camellia Sinensis teas, many of these have their roots as medicinal beverages. Because of that, we could also consider making a list of those non-Camellia Sinensis teas that are still to this day primarily used for medicinal purposes rather than recreational. 38.89.230.194 (talk) 16:08, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

No the last para of the lead is "The phrase herbal tea usually refers to infusions of fruit or herbs made without the tea plant, such as steeps of rosehip, chamomile, or rooibos. These are also known as tisanes or herbal infusions to distinguish them from "tea" as it is commonly construed." This is how it should be. We have plenty of articles on Mate (beverage) and so on, see Category:Herbal tea. Johnbod (talk) 16:17, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Source for steeping times?

There is a very re-assuring and authorative looking table showing the steeping times for various tea types. Is this OR or is there an as yet un-cited RS? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.171.199.35 (talk) 01:34, 21 January 2016 (UTC) –https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_3103

chemical reaction when lemon added to tea

The article speaks of the common practice of adding lemon to tea. From personal observation, I note that when lemon juice is added to tea, it changes color, which I assume is the result of a chemical reaction of the acidic lemon to the tea (one of the results being removal of the bitter taste of the tea). Can anyone provide add an explanation for this? - kosboot (talk) 13:29, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

Teapedia

We CANNOT use Teapedia as a resource for our citations in ANY tea article. All teapedia is is a website that copies all of our information word for word about tea and uses it for their articles. They use no sources what so ever and don't even credit Wikipedia. They are NOT a reliable resource whatsoever.Ilikeguys21 (talk) 16:42, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Adding Myanmar and India to the country of origin.

Tea was grown in wild by the Singpho People of India and Kachin People of Myanmar independently even before commercial Tea was introduced. I think giving credits to both Myanmar and India for 'Origin' column is apt. The Introduced Column can have only China because it was found there first. Please let me know what you think.

References: http://www.teamuse.com/article_000803.html https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singpho_people https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maniram_Dewan http://www.indianteahelp.com/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assam_tea http://www.silkroadgourmet.com/the-origins-of-tea-in-burma/ http://www.myanmars.net/myanmar-culture/myanmar-greentea.htm — Preceding unsigned comment added by Auro Sista (talk • contribs) 04:52, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

The bigger problem is the quality of the refs. Wikipedia cannot be a reference for itself, so those can be thrown out (although, those articles may contain useful reliable sources). TeaMuse.com doesn't appear to have any editorial oversight. Indianteahelp.com appears to be little more than a community forum with related links. Silkroadgourmet.com is a personal blog, although the author appears to be a published author - so an argument could be made that this one meets the threshold of being a reliable source. Myanmars.net appears to be a tourism site, which is problematic under WP:RS guidelines.

If better refs can be found (which potentially exist, just need to be located), then the material could be added. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 19:17, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

'Processing and classification' section, again

Section "Processing and classification" should be expanded. Yes, there is the "main article" link, but is too short anyhow.

I've raised this issue already, now at Talk:Tea/Archive 4#Expanding "Processing and classification" section. One user answered that 'according to Wikipedia guidelines any expansion to information on tea processing should take place in that article, not here. This is done to avoid creation of what is known as a content fork'

But looking closer at that guideline page, this issue looks like Wikipedia:Content forking#Acceptable types of forking as Wikipedia:Content forking#Article spinoffs: "Summary style" meta-articles and summary sections and Wikipedia:Content forking#Related articles. And this is somehow already done in this article.

The trouble is that the present way is too short and too undefinte to the point that this section is almost not understable by its own. (What do 'Wilted', 'allowed to yellow', 'bruised' and so on mean?!) --5.170.13.173 (talk) 11:31, 19 August 2016 (UTC)

Some confusion in the additivees section

In the paragraphs on pouring from height there are several sentences which seem to be unrelated, they are about brewing and servings rather than pouring. If they are about pouring height it needs to be clarified.Ilikeguys21 (talk) 18:08, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

yes, it's all rather a mess. I've tried a quick fix. Johnbod (talk) 18:24, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

→what can be done ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 116.7.249.178 (talk) 06:12, 7 December 2016 (UTC)

Cooling?

wtf is a "cooling flavor"? flippin idiots and your ridiculous "open encyclopedia" experiment. what a mess. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.189.201.97 (talk) 03:19, 7 January 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 March 2017

Black tea and red tea are different in tea system. It is better to add Red Tea, including Pu-erh Tea and Jinjunmei in the Red tea list. JqZ (talk) 19:22, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. TheDragonFire (talk) 11:15, 12 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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Semi-protected edit request on 1 April 2018

Hello,

in the passage about milk I'd like to change the sentence "In Eastern European countries (Russia, Poland and Hungary)..." to "In Eastern European countries (Russia, Poland, Slovakia, Czechia  and Hungary)...," because it is indeed in those countries as well a tradition to drink black tea with lemon and I know this because I lived there and I am Slovakian. edit: honestly I don't know how you can ask me for a proof that I drank the tea this way, it's ridiculous, but okay here are some websites, that are in Slovak, you can use google translate to do the translation for you and you can read that in deed there are tips for adding lemon into the black tea.

Thank you FrogySK (talk) 01:48, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. –Ammarpad (talk) 09:00, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

Production

I just updated the tea production table using the latest FAO data (same citation as previous years), adding 2014, 2015, and 2016. The list showed the top ten tea producing countries as of 2013. I added Myanmar, as they've been on that list most of the last ten years. I did not remove the update tag, as there is still work to be done bringing this section up-to-date, especially the charts and graphs. Gary D Robson 00:58, 4 April 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gary D Robson (talk • contribs)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 May 2018

Tea is made from Ancient China 115.160.161.194 (talk) 05:05, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

 Not done Already referenced in "Origin and history". Martin of Sheffield (talk) 08:47, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 August 2018

Remove the extra full stop in the sentence "As a result, black tea in the West is usually steeped in water near its boiling point, at around 99 °C (210 °F).." Markkozlov (talk) 01:58, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

 Done. Thanks! Dawn Bard (talk) 02:16, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Disambiguation needed

|ans = no Some questions

• There is Preparation and classification of tea with the same title Black tea under it. This is ambiguous. How to make it better?
• Under preparation, consider adding Hyderabadi Irani Chai . Hyderabadi Tea is not mentioned in this page which is unique in its preparation.
• Tea flavors include still more variety of flavors and essence. Should it be covered here?
• There are individual pages for all the tea types listed, why is it summarized here, instead of providing reference to broader article?
• Chai Tea Latte is not mentioned, though covered under Milk Tea, which has its own wiki page, in this page.
• Teas from Kerala especially Sulaimani Chai , Tamil Nadu which has biggest black tea production in India & , Srilanka find no mention in this article.
• Tea is classified as follows in India
  • Masala Chai
  • Darjeeling
  • Assam
  • Sikkim
  • Nilgiri tea
  • Munnar
  • Dooars-Terai
  • Kangra

Ajeyaajeya (talk) 03:47, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

References

The general issues with your edits here and here as examples are that 1) they appear to promote tea-based tourism in India (see WP:NOTPROMOTION), 2) they add redundant and excessive tea examples (see WP:NOTDIRECTORY), and 3) the sources used are not substantial WP:SECONDARY reviews on tea composition or consumption, but typically are blogs or commercial websites, or were unsourced. India's history and consumption of tea are well-represented in the article. According to WP:NOTEVERYTHING, we don't need to detail every regional favorite among Indian teas among your examples and promotional sources above. --Zefr (talk) 15:59, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

Above comment comments on previous edits and what "appears" to another editor and not factual. It also discriminates tea based on regional basis instead on taking an unbiased factual view. How many examples mark it excessive is not clear from above comment. India's tea consumption is "well represented" is opinion and not fact. Please explain metric for representation. Similarly there are plenty of Tea varieties in large tea producing countries similar to India, such as China. It may be made available with good sources by another editor which does not make it out of scope of this wiki page I guess. The article is bloated with duplication and redundancy within the page which needs more clean up. Talk marked as not answered.

Semi-protected edit request on 17 February 2019

Nina021111 (talk) 08:29, 17 February 2019 (UTC)Tea ceremonies have arisen in different cultures, such as the Chinese and Japanese traditions, each of which employs certain techniques and ritualised protocol of brewing and serving tea for enjoyment in a refined setting. One form of Chinese tea ceremony is the Gongfu tea ceremony, which typically uses small Yixing clay teapots and oolong tea. Moreover,In China, tea is one of the daily necessities for Chinese people. Chinese literati and officialdom believed that tea has seven proposition: elegance, friendliness, grace, cultivate the mind, improve moral integrity and the main claim is harmony.

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. DannyS712 (talk) 02:20, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

About the protection

I can contribute hugely to this article because i live in a state which is one of the major tea producers of the world and i have been learning even the most minute things about Tea gardens and their workers since my childhood. I think if you shorten the period of the block then it would be helpful to this article. From a Universal Servant Levent Heitmeier (talk) 15:56, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

@Levent Heitmeier: You can edit as an autoconfirmed editor; if you just make a few more edits and wait a few more days, then it will be open to you. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 18:29, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

As K explained, you will be autoconfirmed after ten edits and four days. Before you leap into making major changes to the article, be aware that it has been around for a long time, and has a history of more than 5,000 edits. Many editors have this article on their Watch list, meaning that any changes you make will be scrutinized quickly and thoroughly. At a minimum, have good quality citations for any content you add, and provide justifying reasons for any content you delete. David notMD (talk) 02:11, 1 April 2019 (UTC)

Hi, Mr. Levent. There is one thing young bucks like you don't realize about Wikipedia in the beginning. Editing Wikipedia isn't about what you know at all, it's only about what you can research in WP:Reliable sources and properly cite. Your lifetime of detailed knowledge, on its own, is worth nearly nothing here, sad to say. Happy Editing!--Quisqualis (talk) 05:32, 1 April 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 January 2020

Tandoori Tea : Its a process of serving tea by adding flavor of Tandoor by Heating clay pot to high temperature and then immediately adding the regular milk tea. Subrata Sen Bhowmik (talk) 19:51, 17 January 2020 (UTC)

 Not done - The edit request is to "specify what text should be removed and a verbatim copy of the text that should replace it. "Please change X" is not acceptable and will be rejected; the request must be of the form "please change X to Y"." And it should be supported by a WP:RS source. The source provided is a recipe - WP:NOTRECIPE. --Zefr (talk) 20:00, 17 January 2020 (UTC)

References

"Pitewey" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Pitewey. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Steel1943 (talk) 15:41, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

"Yeopcha" listed at Redirects for discussion

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"Teamelier" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Teamelier. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Steel1943 (talk) 15:49, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

"Alternative Tea" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Alternative Tea. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Steel1943 (talk) 15:51, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

"Gourmet tea" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Gourmet tea. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Steel1943 (talk) 15:54, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Instant Tea

Suggesting that a separate article is made that goes more in depth into this topic.

As for what to put in that article: brief history, processing, and composition. The processing section should have a bulk of the physical chemistry involved in making instant tea.

If not, edits could be made to the subsection of the existing tea article, but there's definitely enough information to make a separate article.

Bibliography: "Tea." Def. 2. Merriam-Webster. Merriam-Webster, n.d. Web. 12 Dec. 2016. <https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/tea>. Houyuan Lu et al. (7 January 2016). "Earliest tea as evidence for one branch of the Silk Road across the Tibetan Plateau". Nature. doi:10.1038/srep18955. Gebely, Tom. "Tea Processing Chart." World of Tea. Eggs and Toast Media, LLC, 29 Aug. 2016. Web. 12 Dec. 2016. <https://www.worldoftea.org/tea-processing-chart/>. Willson, K. C., and M. N. Clifford. Tea: Cultivation to Consumption. London: Chapman & Hall, 1992. Print. Page 535. Willson, K. C., and M. N. Clifford. Tea: Cultivation to Consumption. London: Chapman & Hall, 1992. Print. Page 538. Millin, D. J. and Swaine, D. (1981) Fermentatino of tea in aqueous suspension. Journal of the Science of Food and Agriculture, 32, 905-19. Willson, K. C., and M. N. Clifford. Tea: Cultivation to Consumption. London: Chapman & Hall, 1992. Print. Page 539. Long, V. D. (1979) Aqueous extraction of black tea leaf. III - Experiments with a stirred column, Journal of Food Technology, 14, 449-62. Pintauro, N. D. (1977) Tea and Soluble Tea Products Manufacture 1977. Food Technology Review, Vol. 38, Noyes Data Corp., Park Ridge, NJ. Willson, K. C., and M. N. Clifford. Tea: Cultivation to Consumption. London: Chapman & Hall, 1992. Print. Page 544. Moshfeghian, Mahmood. "TEG Dehydration: How Does the Stripping Gas Work in Lean TEG Regeneration?" Jmcampbell.com. John M. Campbell & Co., 1 Aug. 2013. Web. 12 Dec. 2016. <http://www.jmcampbell.com/tip-of-the-month/2013/08/teg-dehydration-how-does-the-stripping-gas-work-in-lean-teg-regeneration/>. Reineccius, Gary, and Henry B. Heath. Flavor Chemistry and Technology. 2nd ed. Boca Raton, FL: Taylor & Francis, 2006. 39-41. Print. Jöbstl, Elisabeth, J. Patrick A. Fairclough, Alan P. Davies, and Michael P. Williamson. "Creaming in Black Tea." Journal of Agricultural and Food Chemistry 53.20 (2005): 7997-8002. Web. Liang, Y. R.; Lu, J. L.; Zhang, L. Y. Comparative study of cream in infusions of black tea and green tea Camellia sinensis (L.) O. Kuntze. Int. J. Food Sci. Technol. 2002, 37, 627-634 BP 1,380,135 (1975) Unilever Limited, Cold Water Soluble Tea Wickremasinghe, R. L., BP 1,432,078 (1976) Improvement in or Relating to the Production of Cold Soluble Tea Concentrates and Powders. Willson, K. C., and M. N. Clifford. Tea: Cultivation to Consumption. London: Chapman & Hall, 1992. Print. Page 547. Willson, K. C., and M. N. Clifford. Tea: Cultivation to Consumption. London: Chapman & Hall, 1992. Print. Page 550. Canon, Eden. "What You Need To Know About Citric Acid." EthicalFoods.com. N.p., 03 Dec. 2016. Web. 14 Dec. 2016. <http://ethicalfoods.com/citric-acid/>. RheoSense. "Viscosity of Newtonian and Non-Newtonian Fluids." Rheosense.com. RheoSense, n.d. Web. 14 Dec. 2016. <http://www.rheosense.com/applications/viscosity/newtonian-non-newtonian>.

Classification

It bothers me that the classification list (from white to post-fermented) doesn't appear to be ordered according to degree of processing, but rather from light to dark. I propose fixing this by moving green to the top bullet. Any objections? Ottoump (talk) 19:33, 28 March 2020 (UTC)

Second most consumed beverage

Considering the recent growth of coffee and the decline in tea sales, I question the statement that tea surpasses coffee in consumption. I looked at many sources that indicate coffee consumption is now larger worldwide.Tea consumption is larger than coffee consumption because tea is economical for lower middle classes of the world.

Do you have a good source for that? Ottoump (talk) 19:35, 28 March 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 April 2020

I think since Tea originated in china we should mention the Chinese name for tea is 茶 71.241.203.32 (talk) 14:59, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Already mentioned under Etymology. – Thjarkur (talk) 15:08, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 October 2020

India is the largest consumer of tea now a days. 2402:3A80:957:1217:D6D:45AE:77CD:9718 (talk) 05:30, 9 October 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ɴᴋᴏɴ21 ❯❯❯ talk 05:32, 9 October 2020 (UTC)

Kashmiri Chai

Omitted from the article is Kashmiri Chai, (aka: Kashmiri pink tea, noon tea, noon chai). Source: Krishna, Priya (June 9, 2017). "Kashmiri Chai Tea Is Pink and Luxuriously Delicious". Food & Wine. Meredith Corporation. -- (There are plenty of other sources, e.g:[5])

Please include; thanks. --2603:6081:1C00:1187:3126:540A:D85A:8430 (talk) 00:16, 27 December 2020 (UTC) [edit: 20:13, 28 December 2020 (UTC)] ... BTW, does this article really need to be locked?

I requested it to be downgraded to Wikipedia:Pending changes. Now the page is editable. (CC) Tbhotch^™ 02:13, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

Current largest producers

Need to find a way of sourcing the claims current largest producer of Tea between China and India. WP:RS will be needed. I've just reverted [6] because the referencing was not good enough, it must be support directly and passively on the rendered URL without putting in parameters and hitting buttons to get the required results. Djm-leighpark (talk) 14:55, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

Caffeine content

It seems the source for caffeine content in green vs. black tea is itself refers to an article on Google scholar that can no longer be found. Since the difference in caffeine content of black and green tea seams to be debated in other articles perhaps someone should have a look at this? MacHaddock (talk) 16:40, 3 November 2020 (UTC)

In my experience scientists are rather hopeless on this sort of thing, rarely specifying precisely the tea they are using. There is no single such thing as "green tea", or black. Green tea is generally drunk far weaker than black tea, especially black tea with milk, and sometimes the leaves are less mature, so perhaps have less caffeine. But even if the caffeine content per gram is the same, a typical cup of green tea will contain far less caffeine, because less tea is used, & it will often be steeped for less time, & the water may be significantly less hot. Johnbod (talk) 17:03, 3 November 2020 (UTC)

It depends so much, not only on the type of tea, but how mature it was when picked, which processing methods were used, and on the many ways tea can be prepared, that getting a definite answer for every case would be time-consuming and expensive. In addition, the final results of such an expensive study might be clumsy (or even misleading) for ordinary people to apply to their own situations.

Your subjective impressions of the different effects of each type of tea are more relevant to your life anyway. And if you've been advised to consume less caffeine, it's probably better to just quit caffeine rather than quibbling over one tea vs another. TooManyFingers (talk) 18:12, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Cities

There is a theory that tea drinking enabled cities to grow large, before proper sewerage and sanitation was developed. Tea is a natural antibiotic that, if drunken regularly, help protect against the diseases that poor sanitation brings. It is an explanation for why China had such large cities, for so long through history.

Should it be mentioned here? cheers, Michael C. Price ^talk 21:44, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

E.g. https://scienceblogs.com/mikethemadbiologist/2007/07/23/did-tea-drinking-lead-to-urban cheers, Michael C. Price ^talk 21:49, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

There's also a theory that the Earth is flat, WP:FLAT, and this nutty idea would be another example for that article. Tea is not an antibiotic or antiseptic, and consuming it over the long term has no effect on human health - see Health effects of tea. It is just flavored water. Zefr (talk) 22:02, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

Etymology

This edit was justified because 1) it repeats an entire other Wikipedia article, Etymology of tea, and 2) invites the origin of pronouncing tea from countless countries and languages where tea is consumed, WP:NOTDICTIONARY. Zefr (talk) 21:13, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

What is left is not etymology of tea. No one knows what relevance there is in relation to the word "tea" (which is an English word). If you are complaining that there is too much of it, then what you should do is to trim the section, not removing whole chunk of it that renders the whole section meaningless. Where a section has been split off to another article (the etymology article was split off from the section some years ago), per WP:SPLIT, there should be a good summary of the article. Whatever that was left from your edit is not a summary, because it says nothing about the etymology of the word "tea". Hzh (talk) 21:33, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

I suggest you propose a version here on the talk page for what the etymology of tea should be in abbreviated form per WP:NAD, and how that's different from the Etymology of tea article. It seems clear enough now to me as a derivation from the Tang dynasty and various dialects in China. Zefr (talk) 21:50, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

How can anyone know the etymology of English word "tea" from reading that paragraph which is entirely about Chinese? It is also misleading, since the English did not get the word from the Tang dynasty (that sentence explains how the Chinese adapted an earlier word during the Tang dynasty), and they did not pronounced the word like "tea". The English got it from the Dutch who got it perhaps from the Malays who got it from Hokkien (Min Chinese). The etymology of the word is entirely about the pronunciation of the word, which some believe ultimately has a non-Chinese origin, and that you removed. That section is now completely useless. You caused the problem, therefore either restore it (then trim) or write a proper summary. Note that per WP:BRD, if your bold edit that changed a long-standing version get reverted, then you should be the one who try to get consensus. You also misused WP:NOTDICTIONARY, which is not meant for a case like this. Hzh (talk) 22:36, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

WP:SYNC says Since the lead of any article should be the best summary of the article, it can be convenient to use the subarticle's lead as the content in the summary section, with a {{main}} hatnote pointing to the subarticle., so why not copy the lead from Etymology of tea to that section in this article? Schazjmd (talk) 22:44, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

That lead probably needs to be adjusted first, for example, someone added a sentence about tea meaning dinner (used in Northern England). That should not be in the article on tea since it is not relevant to the word's origin. Hzh (talk) 23:09, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, I saw that bit about dinner and was baffled, but figured it would probably make sense if I read the entire article (I didn't). Schazjmd (talk) 23:29, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

I will fix the lead later when I have the time. That can then be used in the article here. Hzh (talk) 08:56, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

We may be making this revision more complex than needed, as the OED definition gives sufficient clear information. I'll present the two existing etymology sections on Wikipedia, then offer a draft blended from both and the content of OED. Although the sources are generally fine, using them all isn't necessary, WP:OVERCITE, so I propose limiting sources to OED and 1-2 others. As we are revising the section for English uses of tea, we can borrow from OED, which provides that history specifically. The lede from the Etymology of tea is:

• The etymology of the word tea can be traced back to the various Chinese pronunciations of the Chinese word 茶. Nearly all of the words for tea worldwide fall into three broad groups: te, cha and chai, which reflected the history of transmission of tea drinking culture and trade from China to countries around the world. The few exceptions of words for tea that do not fall into these three broad groups are mostly from the minor languages from the botanical homeland of the tea plant, and likely to be the ultimate origin of the Chinese words for tea. The other exceptions of words are national localisations of the word tea using descriptive or related words (e.g. herbata in Polish, from Latin herba thea).

References

The Etymology section of the article states:

• The Chinese character for tea is '茶', originally written with an extra stroke as '荼' (pronounced "tú", used as a word for a bitter herb), and acquired its current form during the Tang dynasty. The word is pronounced differently in the different varieties of Chinese, such as chá in Mandarin, zo and dzo in Wu Chinese, za in some Xiang Chinese dialects, and ta and te in Min Chinese.

References

Blending: proposed draft: The Chinese character for tea, '茶' – originally written with an extra stroke as '荼' (pronounced "tú") – was used as a word for a bitter vegetable, acquiring its current form during the Tang dynasty. The etymology of the word tea derived from three regional pronunciations in China: te, ch'a, and chai. The Mandarin ch'a became the Modern English tea via Dutch (thee) and the Malay (teh). The first use in England of the word, tea, occurred in the mid-18th century.

References

Zefr (talk) 16:24, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Per WP:Summary style, the parent article (this one) and the child article (Etymology of tea), should be synchronized; the section in this parent article should summarize the child article. Content should be added to the child first, then reflected in the summary in the parent. Hzh's idea of working on the lead in the child article and then reflecting those changes back here seems most suitable. Schazjmd (talk) 18:33, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

I don't mind who writes it, but it's a good idea to synchronise the lead and the section. As for Zefr's proposed text, I see a number of issues with it. First, what's given in the second paragraph may be redundant - there is already a history section that deals with it, so what's given there is not necessary. Second, what is the intention of giving the origin of the Chinese character '茶'? If it is to explain the original meaning of tu '荼', then more can be given. The meaning of the word is "bitter vegetable" rather than "bitter herb" and can refer to a number of different plants. Note also that this change of character is simply about the written form, not the pronunciation of the word, so has little direct relevance to the English word, but is relevant for noting the change in meaning. Third, the sentence "The Mandarin chai became the Modern English tea via Dutch (thee) and the Malay (teh)" is wrong. "Chai" is a Persian form, not Chinese (I suspect a misunderstanding of the meaning of cf). Also "tea" did not come from Mandarin, the phrasing in the source might have misled you. Hzh (talk) 22:42, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the critiques, which I used to partly revise the draft. Rather than lecturing what to do, the quickest way to a better etymology section is just to work on revising the new text. Zefr (talk) 02:47, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

Sorry for the delay in editing the lead - I need to check a few things because some of what's written in the Etymology of tea article seem not properly sourced, and could be wrong. I'll see if I can find sources for them first before adjusting the text. I'll try to get it done in a week's time. Hzh (talk) 23:34, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

The much-delayed rewrite of the lead is now finished. Have a look at it and see what else needs to be changed, it can be copied over to this article in a week or so. Hzh (talk) 20:58, 29 July 2021 (UTC)

I appreciate the work to confirm history and sources then rewrite the lead, but the Etymology of tea article is difficult to follow for the English encyclopedia, and its lead is too extensive to be included here. Rather than a total copy of the lead, I recommend an abbreviated version for the etymology section, WP:NOTDIC. Zefr (talk) 23:13, 29 July 2021 (UTC)

I don't see how it is extensive, it's only two paragraphs. At the moment the section has only a few words that are actually related to the etymology of the word tea, most of what's written actually have no relation to the etymology of the words in English. How the word is pronounced in Wu or Xiang Chinese is of no relevance to anything, and no one reading the section will understand the actual etymology for tea. As it is, it is completely messed up, anything that can replace it must be an improvement. Hzh (talk) 09:31, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

On reflection, the second paragraph may be unnecessary. Part of it is already in the history section, such as the use of the word tu, and the rest are theories by philologists, which are difficult to be asserted as entirely true. In which case, we can just copy the first paragraph, so that's around half the size. Hzh (talk) 09:46, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

The first paragraph of the rewritten lead at Etymology of tea will work in the etymology section of this article. I don't find it at all difficult to follow or too extensive. Schazjmd (talk) 14:15, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

By itself, the first paragraph is sufficient for the etymology section of the tea article. Thanks for the work. Zefr (talk) 14:24, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Since we all seem to be in agreement, I'll copy the first paragraph from the etymology article to this one. Schazjmd (talk) 22:28, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

"Irrwe urinpe" listed at Redirects for discussion

A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Irrwe urinpe. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 November 26#Irrwe urinpe until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Certes (talk) 16:57, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 4 October 2021 and 9 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Bl2240.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 10:45, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

General

Tea full form — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2409:4071:E90:F64B:1542:C5D6:288C:313F (talk) 15:28, 7 June 2022 (UTC)

tea-bags

More detail is needed on tea-bags. The flow-through bag was viewed as a revolutionary change when it was introduced (starting around 1952?) in America. It was said that the inventor became extremely rich. It was discussed in middle-class households across America and was probably driven by an aggressive ad campaign. There must be documentation on this.

Tea made in tea-bags constitutes over 90% of tea drunk in the U.S. and even in the UK. according to one source, but only 77% in the US according to another (19 Shocking Tea Consumption Statistics - BrandonGaille.com) Kdammers (talk) 16:04, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

That might be WP:UNDUEWEIGHT, considering there is an article on Tea bags. — PerfectSoundWhatever (t; c) 17:53, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

Tea flowers

I have seen several vendors selling dried Camellia sinensis flowers to make a tisane (which doesn't taste much like tea) or mixing them in with tea leaves. When I search for tea flowers I get references to flowering tea which is tea with flowers from other plants, so I haven't been able to find good sources. I did add a note to the top of flowering tea to note that tea flowers are a different product, but it would be nice to put a little detail on this article as well. Ungulates (talk) 22:52, 18 March 2023 (UTC)

Worldwide spread?

While the "worldwide spread" section describes the spread of tea to Europe in egregious detail, it does not discuss its spread through the rest of Asia at all. This section should either be renamed "European adoption," or, ideally, include more detail on other parts of the world. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:7000:AE3F:B00:5043:631F:AFC2:CA3 (talk) 00:22, 22 March 2023 (UTC)

Tea Resin

Recently saw a video short about some sort of tea resin made in China. Apparently they boil down tea until it's a sticky resin, adding flowers to the brew for flavor. We've got to add a section on this. But honestly I don't have any other info about it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EdwinAmi (talk • contribs) 22:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Suggestion more teas

Hyderabadi Chai https://yummyindiankitchen.com/irani-chai-irani-tea-hyderabadi/ Elaichi Tea https://shop.dalmiagold.com/blog/black-tea/5-health-benefits-of-elaichi-tea-you-didnt-know Ginger Tea https://www.thekitchn.com/ginger-tea-recipe-23471621 Ajeyaajeya (talk) 01:43, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

Those are not WP:RS sources and the middle one is blatant spam nonsense. Zefr (talk) 04:00, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 December 2023

Propose change:

Ireland, as of 2016, was the second-biggest per capita consumer of tea in the world.

to:

Ireland, as of 2016, was the second-biggest per capita consumer of tea in the world, after Turkey.

per referenced source.

It's always unsatisfying to read that someone or something is in second place without being told who is first. 2A00:23C8:7B09:FA01:8CA2:14F8:CF7B:BA58 (talk) 01:30, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

 Done – while this is mentioned in a couple places near that sentence I see no reason it shouldn't be mentioned directly in that sentence. Tollens (talk) 02:04, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Source that tea originated in the Irrawaddy river?

Is there a source for this fact? Almost every other site says tea originated in China. 2001:FB1:96:5B03:D036:ED49:3F19:DC50 (talk) 11:57, 14 December 2023 (UTC)

Tea in Russia

Theere is an incorrect thing is written in a tea in russia paragraph. The tea is not made or brewed in samovar, but made with it. The samovar is a water container while the tea itself brewed in a certain teapot. 109.195.90.24 (talk) 16:39, 15 January 2024 (UTC)

Compressed teas

I think that the mention of puerh at "Compressed tea (such as pu-erh)" should be removed. This is due to the fact that firstly, puerh is not by definition compressed. Although it is *usually* sold in compressed form, the only difference this makes is how the tea will age (ex. in the case of Xiaguan iron-compression, a significant difference between inner & outer material of the beeng can be observed due to the tightness of the compression limiting the inside's exposure to humidity), and does not have any significant impact on the character of un-aged teas. It is also very possible to find puerh sold uncompressed. Secondly, listing puerh as a specific example of compressed tea implies that there exists types of tea that are compressed, and types that are not compressed. This is untrue, because any type of tea can be compressed, and it's become a bit of a trend (at least for Western vendors) to compress teas that are traditionally loose, most notably white tea.

Since I am a new editor, I am nervous to make what might be a controversial deletion without any evaluation from others. I think that the best way to move forward would be to add information under this heading about how puerh as well as other heicha are traditionally compressed for sale/transport, but I'm not yet comfortable enough in my writing skills to make this change. Disaster-prevent (talk) 23:15, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Tried to do this. Johnbod (talk) 00:53, 19 April 2024 (UTC)

I've just noticed that I can't edit this page myself, I think it's because I have not made at least 10 edits with this account - I appreciate the edit, but I think it'll have to be altered again, since the "beeng" shape (a disc-like shape) is just as if not more prominent than the brick shape, so calling compressed tea "tea bricks" is inaccurate. The portion stating that compressing tea helps prevent spoilage is uncited, and unless a good source is found it should probably be removed - there can be found aged puerh that is loose, and loose oolong can also be aged.

Maybe it is possible to also include the info in the previous version on puerh being a notable example of a tea that is frequently compressed? I think something like "Tea, most notably pu-erh, may be compressed to assist in storage, transport, and aging etc." Disaster-prevent (talk) 01:46, 19 April 2024 (UTC)

I think you have a point but I don't think it's necessary to remove it completely. Traditionally Puer tea is often always compressed, because the compression process helps the aging process and flavour development over time. It has their unique flavour because of such a process. So it is not misleading to say traditionally made Puer Tea is compressed. But yes, it's possible to buy it in loose leaves. So I think it would be better to add in context that explains that the traditional process often involves compressing into cakes, bricks, or tuochas (bird's nests). But it's also possible nowadays to buy the loose leaf version too. 49.180.117.225 (talk) 15:41, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Major overlaps with 'Main' articles

This article, while quite well-written and in most places well-cited, has two major defects. The 'Origin and history' chapter has 'main' links to History of tea and History of tea in China (not quite sure one can have 2 main links, surely the second one is a subset of the first, too); while the 'Tea culture' chapter has a 'main' link called Tea culture.

In both cases, the correct result per policy is for the chapter to summarize the article at the other end of the 'main' link briefly, in a paragraph or two, citing the major sources of the 'main' article. What is not supposed to happen is for the chapter to extend for hundreds of words (almost 2000 words for the History, over 800 for Tea culture), overlapping widely with the 'main' article.

We should accordingly cut down both sections to comply with policy, allowing the focus of the article to be on Tea itself, with modest main-linked sections on History and Culture. Chiswick Chap (talk) 13:36, 3 May 2024 (UTC)