Talk:Rampal (spiritual leader)

Skip to table of contents

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Rampal (spiritual leader) article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. If consensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.

This article is written in Indian English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, analysed, defence) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.

If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.

Biography

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles

India: Haryana Low‑importance

	India portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject India, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of India-related topics. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page.IndiaWikipedia:WikiProject IndiaTemplate:WikiProject IndiaIndia articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Haryana (assessed as Low-importance).

Warning: active arbitration remedies

The contentious topics procedure applies to this article. This article is related to articles about living or recently deceased people, and edits relating to the subject (living or recently deceased) of such biographical articles, which is a contentious topic. Furthermore, the following rules apply when editing this article:

You must be logged-in to an autoconfirmed or confirmed account (usually granted automatically to accounts with 10 edits and an age of 4 days)

Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page.

Dayanand Saraswati

Article talk about criticism by Dayanand Saraswati, founder of Arya Samaj. It must be some other Dayanand, not founder of Arya Samaj. As founder of Arya Samaj died years ago in 1880s. Please correct it. -Nizil (talk) 09:28, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

misunderstood. Its criticism of, not by. Its Ok. -Nizil (talk) 09:37, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Why he is the special one "Rampal"?

There are numerous individuals, I would guess hundreds of thousands, named Rampal, several arguably more famous than the Sant Rampal (see Rampal (disambiguation), until a few days ago. Why is he the chosen one? It would be far clearer if the article is termed "Sant Rampal". Malaiya (talk) 02:36, 21 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

No one else is known only as "Rampal" - they have a distinguishing first name / last name. No article was located at Rampal in the past. Sant is an honorific, and should not be used as per Wikipedia conventions. Even media outlets simply refer to him as "Rampal". utcursch | talk 05:18, 21 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

described as a godman

To the best of my knowledge, the term "godman" is used only by the English press. Is there a Hindi equivalent of the term? More accurately, "often described as a godman" it should be "often described as a godman in the English press". It is a derogatory term that can be applied to any (and only to) Indian/Hindu religious leader.

Malaiya (talk) 02:44, 21 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Jay Michaelson writes in the The Daily Beast: "The phrase of choice to describe Rampal is “self-styled god-man,” which has been repeated ad nauseam in the press. But as Indian-American author Rajiv Malhotra tweeted, “All Hindu gurus r self appointed bcause there is no Vatican like central authority.”Is India’s Fallen ‘God-Man’ So Different From a Megachurch Pastor?

Malaiya (talk) 23:54, 22 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Need of this article

Is this article really important until the court gives its judgement? We do not have a Wikipedia article for any criminal. Moreover he is not an important person internationally.- Vinay Kohli (talk)

The article cannot be deleted Because the person satisfies the WP:GNG has widespread media coverage and following it deserves an article. Whether he is important or not is not relevant to wikipedia, he is notable as has been shown in the national media coverage. --DBig Xray 20:27, 10 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Kabir Panth

Need more citation that he was actually a Kabir Panthi. Only news reports are not enough i guess as it even hurts the religious believes of other people and blemish the image of Kabir Panth.- Vinay Kohli (talk)

Thanks for your comments, you do have a valid point, it seems largely based on WP:SPS. Based on your comments i have added the word claims, till we get a better source for the same. feel free to edit the article further if you disagree with more things. just make sure you have reliable sources--DBig Xray 20:27, 10 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding his teachings

The cited source states the following regarding the subject's views on charity: He says “unnecessary charity is prohibited.” His website adds, "Do not have to give anything in form of charity anywhere and to anyone. Neither money, nor unstitched cloth etc, nothing. If someone comes asking for any charity then feed him and give something to drink like tea, milk, lassi, water etc, but do not have to give anything else. Who knows that beggar might misuse that money." So his views should be mentioned in the right context. - NitinMlk (talk) 23:45, 3 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

This article mentions that "he claims that all the major religious scriptures — including Vedas, Gita, Quran, Bible and Guru Granth Sahib — name Kabir as the supreme god", and it cites this source for the same. But the sentence seems like WP:SYNTH. Can anyone quote the lines which support the aforementioned claim? BTW, the claim regarding Vedas seems fine. - NitinMlk (talk) 00:09, 4 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Incorrect information

Saint Rampal Ji didn't skip 42 hearings, He couldn't attend only two because of being ill.^[1]^[2] Also, He was never found negligent in His duties, He Himself resigned from the job.^[3] And, there are some other issues too. Kabirisgod (talk) 16:50, 23 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Two of the sources you provided are Rampal's own website. Most reputed news channels have confirmed that he skipped 42 hearings. ^[4] Kenm v2 (talk) 12:49, 13 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ https://gulfnews.com/world/asia/india/tension-in-haryana-town-as-police-readies-to-arrest-sect-leader-1.1412875. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)
^ https://www.satlokashram.org/july-2014-contempt-of-court-case-against-sant-rampal-ji/. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)
^ https://www.satlokashram.org/sant-rampal-ji-maharaj/. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)
^ https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/murder-accused-godman-defies-court-tension-outside-hisar-ashram-691688. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Sant rampal.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 02:52, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Timeline in introduction

I wonder if the second paragraph of the introduction describing a timeline of events is in the relevant section of the article. It seems unnecessarily precise for an introduction. Furthermore, there is a more exhaustive timeline in the following sections. Thedarkfly (talk) 07:56, 21 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Removed a line that states that Rampal has been released from jail

The given source clearly stated that he has been acquitted from one case but he is still in prison for murder. In addition to that, a second source was Rampal's official website which is not reliable. Please provide a source that states he has been released before putting that edit in. Kenm v2 (talk) 12:39, 13 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Kenm v2, if you are talking about this, then the removed content says that he was released from all the charges in the Drugs and Cosmetics case, which is totally true as is telecasted in the news. Perhaps you misread it? 223.181.92.6 (talk) 12:03, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

As long as you don't say that he "has been released of all charges" I am happy with it. The source provided clearly states that he was acquitted in drug cases but still in prison:

"A local court in Hisar on Monday acquitted controversial godman Rampal and three of his aides in a case registered under the Drugs and Cosmetics Rules Act.

But Rampal will have to remain in jail as he is undergoing life sentence in a murder case, and two other cases, including one of sedition. In Hisar, Rampal and his aides are facing four criminal cases" Kenm v2 (talk) 07:22, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The thing is that even earlier it didn't say that he was released from all the charges. 223.181.92.6 (talk) 17:41, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Do not use "Ji" or "Maharaj" when referring to Rampal

The name of the individual is just Rampal. While "Ji" or "Maharaj" can be used as a sign of respect, it should not be used in the article because it is not part of his name. Please stick to "Rampal", "He", and "Him". Kenm v2 (talk) 12:43, 13 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

2006 murder conviction

Hi, i thought i’ll make a talk page topic here to discuss the 2006 murder conviction. I used a reliable reference and the article clearly mentions that he has two murder convictions. Please link some sources claiming that it’s not true. Kenm v2 (talk) 07:45, 13 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

[1] [2] [3] 223.181.94.78 (talk) 18:11, 14 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Look, other than having a conflict online, I have many important things to deal with in the real life. I leave this for the other editors to act or respond appropriately in the case. So, perhaps this is my last message to you... and, if this is, here are my last words to you: 1) You are not acting with NPOV here, please correct it. 2) This is a BLP. 223.181.94.78 (talk) 18:18, 14 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I am the one that added his second conviction in the article and the links you posted above confirm that he is in fact convicted in both cases.

1) You are not acting with NPOV here, please correct it.

As I said, link specific examples of me not having NPOV or stop making acusation. All I see is you making claims without any proof.

2) This is a BLP

I know. Kenm v2 (talk) 08:33, 15 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Repeated Vandalism by 2401:4900:563a:3449:a225:cd3c:175b:abc

2401:4900:563a:3449:a225:cd3c:175b:abc has continually reverted back edits, adding in unnecessary information in the intro section and added information using biased sources like Rampal and his religious group's website. It seems like they are more interested in promoting a pro-Rampal agenda than editing in good faith. Wdonghan (talk) 18:09, 14 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Needs protection against repeated vandalism

This article is target of repeated vandalism especially by the followers of this person. Hence this article needs to be edit protected. Shivck13 (talk) 19:35, 10 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WP:RFPP is where to go for that. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 22:16, 10 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Needs to be edited

Needs editing Trulyy (talk) 21:25, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] ttps://gulfnews.com/world/asia/india/tension-in-haryana-town-as-police-readies-to-arrest-sect-leader-1.1412875. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

[2] ttps://www.satlokashram.org/july-2014-contempt-of-court-case-against-sant-rampal-ji/. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

[3] ttps://www.satlokashram.org/sant-rampal-ji-maharaj/. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

[4] ttps://www.ndtv.com/india-news/murder-accused-godman-defies-court-tension-outside-hisar-ashram-691688. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

[1]

[2]

[3]

[4]