Talk:Kurdish language/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

ZAZA is a dialect of the Kuridsh language!

Why haven't you edited Zaza a dialect of the Kurdish language? The Zaza dialect is related to other Kurdish dialect as Gorani, Kalhoori that are spoken is southern and western part of Kurdistan, in Hewraman, the Kuridstanina cities of Kermanshah (Kirmashan in Kurdish) and Ilam. Just because the Kurds haven't have the opportunity the last 100 years to rule themselves, the enemies of Kurdistan want to confuse the more than 4000 years old brave history of Kurdistan by try to distinguish the Kurds. The Zaza is a Kurdish dialect and they are an undevided part of Kurdistanian people. Separating the Zaza dialect from Kuridsh language is THE SAME MISTAKE as saying "British is not English, American in English" (reffering to that sorani, kurmanci, gorani and kalhori are as American in that example; british as Zaza dialect and english as Kurdish). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.151.43.53 (talk) 19:41, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

There is a famous saying regarding politics of languages: A language is a dialect with an army and navy.Heja Helweda (talk) 23:03, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Can a Zaza from Bingol, and a Kurd from Erbil communicate fluently? How about a Kurd from Suleymaniyah, and a Kurd from Van? The answer to both questions is no, and this should make us think deeply about what Kurdish really means. It seems like this term is applied to all of the languages spoken by the inhabitants of the regions where Kurds live. It may make sense politically (that is, Kurdish politics) but to me it doesn't make any sense linguistically. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.102.50.81 (talk) 05:04, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

It appears to have become fashionable to accuse the Kurds of engaging in cultural supremacy and bullying people who live "in regions where Kurds live" (as though they even held many basic freedoms, let alone AUTHORITY outside of northern Iraq to control the people who live in "the regions where Kurds live") into being Kurdish. This is absurd and totally baseless, and I suspect the motive is nothing more than creating division within what little exists of a weak Kurdish unity as it is, not least of all due to the impassable borders between them, but also the employment of this very tactic, nothing new, cause fractures within previously strong bonds as has been worryingly weakened with the Zaza. They were given the idea that Kurmanci speakers neglected or ignored the Zaza culture and language while promoting Kurmanci. It's inconceivable to me how Kurmanci speakers can be accused of holding any advantage with which to do so, as I was totally unaware that Kurmanci speakers had the resources and freedom at hand to promote their culture and language. Accusing a people like the Kurds, who hold no rights even to their own culture in most of the countries they inhabit, of engaging in Kurdification of others is positively absurd. For you to go on to suggest there is a need to question the meaning of "Kurdishness" is just the most retarded thing imaginable, as if to suggest the Kurds have grown into a formidable unified force, and who can only be stopped by adding FURTHER divisions between them, beyond the international borders and the linguistic, cultural and religious barriers between their different communities, though in spite of which they have little faltered in their determination to hold strong to their identity as Kurds. There is more than linguistics here to take into account, there is a shared history, a shared culture, a shared identity. For this very reason, most Zaza continue to identify as Zaza KURDS, to the frustration of those who'd like to establish deep divides. Linguists appear to have an utter obsession with drawing distinctions between the various Kurdish groups, especially the Zaza and other Kurds, but even between Sorani and Kurmanci, the endless argument of whether they are dialects or languages as though such terms, by their own admission completely abstract, relative, and most importantly irrelevant, served any purpose whatsoever aside from creating artificial divides between people who against all odds have attempted to overcome them.

Kurds in kurdistan can understand both Kurmanci and Sorari!! how the hell did you came up to that conclusion?? It's harder with zazaki but it's still some kurds how nderstand it to. Kurmanci and Sorani is like Swedish and Norwegian!! ans as i know this people can understand eachother!! this is only something brought here by ur enemies to seperate the kurd more!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.227.179.6 (talk) 05:30, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

And Swedish and Norwegian are considered distinct languages... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.25.235.152 (talk) 10:28, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Stop spreading misinformation. Kurmanci and Sorani are not mutually inteligible. I know standard kurmanji and know very well about local dialect and I have met many sorani speakers and most of the time we spoke other languages to communicate. Even kurmanji speakers don't always understand each other this video is a very good example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-AZZfHB6L8 --Rojan98 (talk) 16:42, 21 October 2019 (UTC)

removing sourced content

Please do not remove sourced content. Portbase (talk) 09:35, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Portbase Refrain from Wikipedia:Cherrypicking your sources and don't remove templates if you aren't addressing them. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 09:42, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

1) Sources should not be removed. 2) Templates should not be misused. 3) The page is called Kurdish languageS and not "Kurdish language". Portbase (talk) 09:54, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Titles are not God-sent. How are the templates being misused when you are cherrypicking? Also, if sources shouldn't be removed, I can add dozens of academic works by linguists arguing that its one language. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 10:11, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

This page is about Kurdish languages and not a single Kurdish language. A single Kurdish language who all Kurds can speak and understand it does not exist. Kurds from Turkey, Iraq and Iran speak different and can not understand each other. Why this attempt is coming from someone who is involved in all Kurdish related articles? If a Kurdish state exist someday the indigenous people of this state the Kurds speak different and can not understand each other because a single Kurdish language does not exist. For example a Kurmanji speaker can not understand every word of a Sorani speaker. Calling this languages to dialects is a way for Kurdish nationalists to unit the Kurdish people for a Kurdish state because everyone know that language is identity. But we are here on Wikipedia and should not dream about a Kurdish state and a single Kurdish language. Portbase (talk) 10:30, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Focus on my question instead. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 10:41, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

There are many other sources who call it languages and not dialects. The claim that the page Kurdish languageS is about a single Kurdish language is ethno-national pov. Portbase (talk) 10:53, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

So non-Kurdish linguists who argue that it is one language are pushing for an ethno-national POV for the Kurds? --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 11:05, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

There are many Kurds who are involved in science and manipulate it. This page is literally called Kurdish languages (plural) and deals with several languages ​​that are spoken by Kurds and not a single language that all Kurds can speak and understand. Someone who misused the page Kurdish languages for a single Kurdish language has ethno-national intentions. And not even all Kurds call their language as "Kurdish". There are many Kurds who call their language Kurmanji and Sorani. In Turkey, many Kurds call their language Kurmanji and they do not call it "Kurdish". "The speakers of North Kurmanji call their language in general Kurmanji and never Kurdi (Kurdish)."[1] Portbase (talk) 11:33, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

So Kurdish linguists cannot be neutral - got it. But I was talking about western linguists? Are they pushing for an ethno-pov as well? --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 11:41, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Not all linguists agree. There are linguists and Ethnologue who clearly call it independent languages and not dialects. The attempts by Kurdish linguists and Kurdish nationalists who misused the page Kurdish languages for a single Kurdish language is ethno-national pov. Portbase (talk) 11:47, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

If not all linguists agree, why did you add to the article "According to Kurdish nationalists the Kurdish languages are different dialects of a single Kurdish language"? It's becoming clear that you're Wikipedia:NOTHERE. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 11:50, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Because this page is called Kurdish languageS and not Kurdish language. And according to the source Kurdish nationalists call it dialects. The previous version was totally pov. Portbase (talk) 11:55, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Baseless claims from you. On Wikipedia we only work on the basis of sources, not personal believes. Read the rules before editing. Refrain from POV-pushing and be constructive or I will involve admins. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 11:57, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

First of all I have added an information with source and you have reverted my edit and the source. Your edits are for personal beliefes. Portbase (talk) 12:02, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

I wrote about dialect differences in Kurmanji with many tables (in the article about Kurdish grammar which I added about 9000 bytes) but got deleted because he needed "source", even though I had sources many places in the text and I am a native speaker. I don't have time to do an edit war, I am new to this website and don't know to use it and stop here because I don't have time. I could give even more sources if he asked. After some search on the internet I found an academic work on Kurmanji dialects: https://www.academia.edu/9265566/Regional_variation_in_Kurmanji_A_preliminary_classification_of_dialects) It is a fact that Kurds don't speak one language but several close related languages and many more dialects. Also, most Kurmanji speakers call their everyday language Kurmanji and not "Kurdi". The only Kurmanji speaking population that really call their language "Kurdi" are Badini (the south-eastern dialect of Kurmanji). Central Kurds (aka Sorani) and as far as I know southern Kurds, on the other hand, call their language "Kurdi" and always called it so. Not "Sorani" and so on. The term "Sorani" is just a tribe name. I am a Kurd myself. I am a fluent Kurmanji speaker. I speak both the standard Kurmanji dialect (which is based on Celadet Bedirxans) and my local Kurmanji dialect.--Rojan98 (talk) 14:09, 23 October 2019 (UTC)

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Kurdish languages

The reality is that kurds have many languages and kurmanji is one of them, and that kurmanji has dialectal varieties as which can be compared to difference between central kurdish and southern kurdish. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rojan98 (talk • contribs) 13:27, 21 October 2019 (UTC)

I don't think it is correct to say Kurds have many languages. Kurmanji is a Kurdish language dialect and its variations would be called sub dialect. Don't you agree?Marmzok (talk) 01:19, 3 February 2020 (UTC)

Incoherent article opening

The opening of this article seems to be too detailed for an introduction. An abstarct or summary is missing. I would be happy to work on this. Marmzok (talk) 01:33, 3 February 2020 (UTC)

Native language in Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan

Nowhere in the reference documents cited is stated that Kurdish is spoken by 96% of the Kyrgyz population and 88% of the Kazakh population as a native language. That sentence should be removed immediately. I cannot believe that this piece of utter misinformation could stay on this restricted page for more than 5 years. Isn't it a bit too clear that Kurdish wouldn't be spoken by overwhelming majorities in Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan? Efekankorpez (talk) 08:22, 27 April 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.43.202.100 (talk)

It's 96.4% of 88.7% of the Kurdish population in the two countries. Not the whole population. --Semsûrî (talk) 08:36, 27 April 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aurat (word)

The terms "Aurat", "Arvad", "Avret", and "Awrath" may refer to: Women of Asian religious or cultural descent and identity.

Self nomination for AFD since article copy pasted to Draft:Aurat for incubation because IMHO current article title Aurat (word) is misleading and confusing leading to western systemic bias and stifling the article growth. Please find Detail reason at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aurat (word)

I invite project members to review current and potential sourcing and weigh in on the AfD discussion. Thanks! Bookku (talk) 02:54, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

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Archiving this talk page

Is it time to set up automated archiving for this talk page? Its size, 126K greatly exceeds the threshold suggested at Help:Archiving a talk page, and there are many long-closed discussions on it. Largoplazo (talk) 19:41, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request

In the intro, right after, dialect continuum, please add “of Iranian languages” to make it clear.2603:8081:160A:BE2A:DD51:DA92:D0AB:7E3E (talk) 19:21, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

 Done I considered responding that it's implied by the reference to "other" Northwest Iranian languages in the third sentence, but decided it makes sense to be be direct about it rather than leaving it as an implication. Largoplazo (talk) 19:47, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

Hint

Kurdish languages in the Kurdish language(s) is not Kurdî. RealRojSerbest (talk) 11:57, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Fixed now. Thanks. --Semsûrî (talk) 12:09, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Her bijî. There is a huge debate about the difference between northern Kurdish and central Kurdish. I am afraid that Wikipedia might be the first place to say Sorani, Iranian language from Iraq or Sorans are different Iranic ethnic groups and not Kurds. Peace out, RealRojSerbest (talk) 03:44, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Kurdish language in Iran

Kurdish is also a recognized minority language in Iran. Can you put that in the infobox ? Avestaboy (talk) 22:39, 26 January 2021 (UTC)

South Kurdish (Xwarin Kurdish or Kermanshahian Kurdish) Pronounciation for This Title (Kurdish Language) > (زۆڤان کۆردی - Zûwane Kurdî)

Hi I do not have Wikipedia Account to become a Writer > i am Kurd of Zangeneh Tribe of Kermanshahian Kurdish (Kermanshahian is nickname for South Kurdish people and South Kurdish Language) we say Zuwane Kurdi (زۆڤان کوردی) not Zemani or Zimane Kurdi (زمانی کوردی) > our Language little near Zaza-Gorrani Dialect as to as we say Zewan and Zuwan Kurdi

i request for adding Southern Kurdish pronunciation for "Kurdish Language" (Latin : Zuwane Kurdi) (Arabic-Iranic Sorrani : زۆڤان کوردی 5.201.197.30 (talk) 12:51, 4 April 2021 (UTC)

We need a reliable source for the Southern Kurish spelling. So far I can't find anything on Google on 'زۆڤان کۆردی' --Semsûrî (talk) 12:53, 4 April 2021 (UTC)

i writed by Sorrani Writing > u must write زوان کوردی for search in Persian Writing to find beacuse in Iran we Writing Persian we call it Kermanshahian Kurdish Writing in Kermanshah and Ilam , u can search Zuwan Kurdi in Latin European Writing> in My Language we say Zuwan

this is many sites i found to say :

https://t.me/s/kurdileki?before=346

https://www.magiran.com/paper/873034

http://asoyroj.com/farsi/detail.aspx?=hewal&jmara=1431&Jor=1

https://www.instagram.com/amoozesh_kurdi/

https://www.ilamtoday.com/alam/show/?ihwfshfuw-%D8%B2%D9%88%D8%A7%D9%86-%D9%83%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%AF%D9%8A

https://ku.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuwan

https://sites.google.com/site/xuwarin/zuwani-kurdi

http://kurdishacademy.org/courses/south/peshwetin-ku.html

5.201.197.30 (talk) 13:09, 4 April 2021 (UTC)

I have added the Southern Kurdish name now. --Semsûrî (talk) 13:33, 4 April 2021 (UTC)

Fix names natively

Please replace line one col 1319-1368 to: cî}}), [[Central Kurdish]] ({{lang|ku-Latn|Soranî}}.

RealRojSerbest (talk) 08:24, 7 April 2021 (UTC).

Claims that Kurmanci and Sorani are "as different as English and German"

According to Philip Kreyenbroek (1992), it also may be misleading to call Kurmanji (Northern Kurdish) and Sorani "dialects" because they are in some ways as different from one another as German and English.

This is complete arse. My father is a Kurmanci speaker, and he has very little trouble understanding the Sorani dialect. To make a comparison like German and English is wholly unfounded and inaccurate, and I believe is an outsider's pedantic study of the two dialects. An English speaker would be hard pressed to understand anything spoken in German beyond the simplest of sentences, and only then by estimation. The same goes for a German speaker trying to understand English. Sorani and Kurmanci speakers have a level of mutual intelligibility far greater than do German and English speakers, comparable to Spanish and Italian.

If there are any other Kurmanci or Sorani speakers, I'd like to hear their opinions on this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.206.108.128 (talk) 15:33, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

I am not a Kurdish speaker, but I have a couple of comments. You deleted the article's claim that Kurmanji (aka Kurmanci) and Sorani are as different as English and German, but you did not delete the following claims the article makes:

Sorani differs on six grammatical points from Kurmanji. This appears to be a result of Gorani (Haurami) influence.

1. The passive conjugation: the Sorani passive morpheme -r-/-ra - corresponds to -y-/-ya - in Gorani and Zaza, while Kurmanji employs the auxiliary hatin, come;
2. a definite suffix -eke, also occurring in Zazaki;
3. an intensifying postverb -ewe, corresponding to Kurmanji preverbal ve-;
4. an 'open compound' construction with a suffix -e, for definite noun phrases with anepithet;
5. the preservation of enclitic personal pronouns, which have disappeared in Kurmanji and in Zaza;
6. a simplified izafeh system.

Those claims are unreferenced, but do you deny them? The article makes the well-referenced claim that "Sorani has neither gender nor case-endings, whereas Kurmanji has both" -- a big difference. The cited source for that also says: "In Sorani pronomial enclitics play a crucial role in verbal constructions, while Kurmanji has no such enclitics." The fact that written Kurmanji is in a Roman alphabet while written Sorani is in a Persian alphabet creates an important further barrier between them in the modern world where so much language communication is in the written form. Seanwal111111 (talk) 16:25, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

The new clarifications added to that section of the article are welcome. It makes sense to compare it to English and German from a grammatical perspective, but the previous entry did not draw that distinction, and made no mention of the similar vocabulary and pronunciation, which might have mislead readers with regards to the extent of the differences. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.169.156.86 (talk) 15:58, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

I know many Kurds and they cannot understand spoken Sorani. Even Wikipedia has two separate wikipedias: Kurdish wikipedia is entirely in Kurmanci and a separate Sorani wikipedia exists. I am not talking about the issue of Arabic and Latin script which is a different question. Why wikipedia recognizes this difference but English wikipedia calls them one language in this article, I do not know. We should move everything to a Kurmanci and Sorani article and leave here only the differences and linguistic things, changing the name to "Kurdish languages". That way we can include Zaza too. Plentoytime (talk) 17:48, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

I am Kurmanji speaker and I can pretty much understand Sorani but not completely. As for GOrani and Zaza, I cannot understand these at all, actually at times I can pick up more what a Persian says then a Gorani/Zaza.--87.194.107.249 (talk) 01:49, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

This sounds like an obvious step. It does not deny any similarities or closeness linguistically or culturally to acknowledge reality of the languages. Quoting passages from Kurmanci and Sorani Wikipedia may well be a good example case to demonstrate those Kurdish languages. Nobody tries to say Norwegian and Swedish are the same language, and there is more substantive differences here. This does not affect the Wiki pages for the "Kurdistan Region", it is just an issue of linguistics. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.25.235.152 (talk) 10:35, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

I think it's very misleading to say "kurmanji & sorani are as different as german & english is". This is true if you just compare technical grammatical aspects. Say you look at whether there is grammatical gender, different cases etc, then yes the statement is true. You might even say kurmanji & sorani are as differnet (grammatically) as kurmanji & english is. But these statements are very misleading. Let me define a new language called "Genglish", which is german with a few changes to make it grammatically similar to english:

• There is no gender, all nouns are "die" (feminine in German).
• No cases for nouns, slight simplification of grammar. Pronouns only have accusative & nominative case.
• Small changes to phonology. For example pronounce "W" like a round one in english rather than a hard "V" as is done in german.
• Maybe a few other changes too, like modify 20% of the vocabulary.

Now, the new language "Genglish" is grammatically similar to English. One could say that "Genglish is as different from German as English is". However, a German speaker will not be able to understand English without intensitve training. But even if he might find Genglish hard to understand, after very little training he will be able to understand most of it. This is the situation with Kurdish.

My native dialect is "southern kurdish" (feyli/kalhori), which is much more distant from kurmanji (northern kurdish) than sorani is (central kurdish). In the beginning I had a hard time understanding kurmanji, but after 1-2 hours of studying the differences & listening to TV programs I'm able to understand between 75-90% of any kurmanji TV show I see (depending on local kurmanji dialect & how many turkish words are used). On the other hand, I'm a danish citizen and do a PhD in Canada. Thus I speak danish and english at a native or near native level. Knowing both of these (especially danish for vocabulary) helps A LOT when learning german. I've been studying german intensively for months and only recently been able to read simple books & understand a bit of TV Show (Heute Show is my favorite).

Therefore clearly, southern kurdish (and thus definitely also Sorani) is MUCH closer to kurmanji than english & german are. Languages are complicated things and to take some basic binary notions like technical aspects of grammar to talk about "lingustic distance", is very misleading. 2607:FEA8:1D5F:FB98:BD55:D7E2:C10D:4E7E (talk) 07:06, 21 September 2016 (UTC)

I am a sorani speaker and i understand kurmanci almost completely, and I've never lived in a kurmanci speaking region or studied kurmanci Zageos21 (talk) 09:24, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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Two variant maps of Kurdish-speaking areas?

Is both really needed? The one below seems to be a lot better and details. I propose we keep just the one. --TataofTata (talk) 15:08, 26 September 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 October 2021

Aland jakob (talk) 12:06, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Largoplazo (talk) 12:17, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Kurdali

Recently Kurdali (Palai) added to the article as a main subdivision of Kurdish. There is only one reference and the claim is based on a short footnote about Kurdali on the source page. One reference is not enough to add it as a main division of Kurdish. Actually, there are not many sources about this dialect, even the article was created recently. We can mention Kurdali, but I oppose listing it as a subdivision. Other credible sources are needed in order to add Kurdali to the list. (I call @Kwamikagami and Semsûrî:, and other users to this discussion) Serchia (talk) 13:09, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

If there's not a lot of information on Kordali, it could be merged into Southern Kurdish. --Semsûrî (talk) 14:08, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

Is there some reason you believe that the Atlas of the Languages of Iran is not reliable? There are many obscure languages in the world. Obscurity doesn't mean they don't exist. — kwami (talk) 19:19, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

@Kwamikagami: I don't say it doesn't exist. We are talking here about the classification of the dialect. We can mention this dialect on this page, but not list it as a main subdivision, as there are not enough references, even Laki is not listed as a subdivision that may have more resources. Serchia (talk) 15:21, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Okay, but do you have reason to believe that the Atlas is not reliable? — kwami (talk) 17:29, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

@Kwamikagami: I don't know about the whole atlas, but for this matter, as there is only one reference, I don't see it as a reliable source. I think at least we need three reliable references from good linguistic resources in order to mention it as a language. Kurdali is listed on Glottolog as a dilaect of Southern Kurdish, Glottolog is a more realible source and we should list Kurdali in this page as a dialect of Southern Kurdish, aslo in its main article. Serchia (talk) 20:05, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

Glottolog is not a RS for dialects. They copied over LingList wholesale, and that was put together by students who probably knew less than you or I do. Many of the dialects are spurious, or are under the wrong languages. Glottolog has started its own research on dialects for the past few years -- you'll see that here and there -- but they've barely gotten started. — kwami (talk) 21:16, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

@Kwamikagami:The claim from the Atlas is also based on the student papers. I find a table in this book (Nationalism, Language, and Muslim Exceptionalism), and Kordali is listed as a dialect of Southern Kurdish. Ethnologue also listed it as a dialect of Southern Kurdish. So, a better way here is to list it as a Southern Kurdish dialect, as there are more sources to prove that. Serchia (talk) 20:58, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

It's quite common for a 'dialect' of a language to prove to be distinct. When that happens, you can always find older sources that call it a dialect. The question is whether the source finding it a distinct language is reliable, not how many old sources you can tally that call it a dialect. — kwami (talk) 21:27, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 February 2022

Yalda smailii (talk) 16:06, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

زبان کوردی یک گویش نیست!یک زبان مستقل است

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:15, 17 February 2022 (UTC)