Talk:Khalistan movement/Archive 12

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Archive 12

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 October 2022 (3)

Add under “…Khalistani sympathisers" in Canada, Italy, and the UK.”:

Simranjit Singh Mann, MP elected in 2022 from Sangrur, is currently the only openly Khalistani MP in the Indian Parliament and his party SAD (Amritsar) is the only pro-Khalistan party in the Indian parliament currently.Gopalchan45678 (talk) 12:25, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

References

 Done Aaron Liu (talk) 12:54, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

Territorial claims of Khalistan

Add under "...The proposed state would consist of land that currently forms.":

Punjab (India), Chandigarh, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh, some parts of Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh. Himalayan range in the north and Thar desert in the south will be make the geographical boundaries of Khalistan.

NOTE: This article stated that "The proposed state would consist of land that currently forms Punjab, India and Punjab, Pakistan", but in fact not a single Khalistani secessionist group claimed Pakistani Punjab, this needs to be corrected, I have given the reference of the map issued by the Khalistani secessionist group Sikhs For Justice and Reference no. 3 is from the website of the Council of Khalistan (Government of Khalistan in Exile during Insurgency in Punjab and also served as a member of UNPO untill 1993)

Shubhdeep Sandhu (talk) 14:40, 29 November 2022 (UTC)

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Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 19:37, 30 November 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 13 December 2022

May I edit this so that correct information can be put? Khalsa Mishima (talk) 08:57, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

You can't, since it is [[Wikipedia:Rough guide to extended confirmed protection|extended confirmed protected]. You can suggest edits here on the talk page using an edit request. Please suggest specific changes of text, with supporting citations if it is new information as opposed to something like a typo fix which doesn't need a citation. --Mvqr (talk) 13:16, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 22 December 2022

93.33.59.228 (talk) 13:21, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

I want to add some things , because I'm current president of Khalistan Movement

 Not done: Joke. Lemonaka (talk) 16:21, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

Add under "...The proposed state would consist of land that currently forms.":

Punjab (India), Chandigarh, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh, some parts of Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh. Himalayan range in the north and Thar desert in the south will be make the geographical boundaries of Khalistan.

NOTE: This article stated that "The proposed state would consist of land that currently forms Punjab, India and Punjab, Pakistan", but in fact not a single Khalistani secessionist group claimed Pakistani Punjab, this needs to be corrected, I have given the reference of the map issued by the Khalistani secessionist group Sikhs For Justice and Reference no. 3 is from the website of the Council of Khalistan (Government of Khalistan in Exile during Insurgency in Punjab and also served as a member of UNPO untill 1993)

Shubhdeep Sandhu (talk) 12:00, 31 December 2022 (UTC)

Khalistan's claim on Punjab, Pakistan

Khalistani separatists never claimed Punjab, Pakistan. From the beginning of the separatist movement Khalistani separatists have released only two proposed maps of Khalistan and both maps claims Indian territory only and this is enough to clear that the Khalistan Movement is limited to India only.

File:Proposed Map of the Republic of Khalistan.png

The Proposed map of Khalistan released by Sikhs for Justice (A nonprofit organization which seek self-determination

The Proposed map of Khalistan released by Shiromani Akali Dal (Amritsar) (Political party in Punjab, India support the secession of Punjab from India)

Shubhdeep Sandhu (talk) 06:30, 10 January 2023 (UTC)

The Khalistani movement as it started had already made it clear about their territorial claims.

Now that another map has been proposed, it seems we don't need a map here.

I would also say that the new map is not broadly recognized. Capitals00(talk) 07:40, 10 January 2023 (UTC)

First of all explain me how Khalistan Movement made it clear about their territorial claims? ("With Reference") then i will understand your point of view and we can come to a better conclusion.

Shubhdeep Sandhu(talk) 09:07, 10 January 2023 (UTC)

I don't have to cite thousands of reliable sources which support the standard map. The map you are pushing is proposed by a fringe organization and it won't be added on Wikipedia. Capitals00 (talk) 00:52, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

Come on man! It's just like Pakistan claims Kashmir and i say Pakistan claims whole north india with Delhi its capital coz Pakistan is based on Mughal Empire (for example Pakistan's missiles are named after mughal emperors) is it make any sense?

If you don't give a reliable source or reference then you are obviously not following Wikipedia's Policies and guidelines. You have thousands of reliable sources as you said above, but you only need to give one or two from them.(WP:CS)

SFJ & SAD (A) are two Pro‐Khalistan organizations not fringe organizations, SFJ is registered nonprofit organization in the United States and SAD (A) is a registered political party in India, whose leader Simranjit Singh Mann is a lok sabha member in the Indian Parliament but yes both organizations are fringe organizations for India like CTA for china, ANC for Spain and PLO for Israel, and this shows you are not neutral and pushing only Indian Narrative here which is also against Wikipedia's Neutral Policy.(WP:NPOV)(WP:PG)

My point is simple, When not a single Khalistan Organization claimed Pakistani territory then why should it be written on Wikipedia?

The territorial claims of the Council of Khalistan(Government of Khalistan in Exile and a former member of UNPO) are also limited to India, when we talk about the territorial claims of a proposed state, we use the map issued by the organizations fighting for the establishment of that proposed state for example you can see territorial claims of Tamil Eelam, Catalonia and Tibet etc...

Shubhdeep Sandhu (talk) 13:41, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

References

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 February 2023

Spelling [bhindranwala] and factual errors. Bhujang Singh (talk) 13:50, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:55, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 March 2023

"change neveral to never" on line 11. SopranoCrewMember (talk) 00:12, 28 March 2023 (UTC)

 Done Cannolis (talk) 04:59, 28 March 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 March 2023

Change “prescribed” to “proscribed” in the section discussing how Khalistan separatist groups are not banned in Pakistan. waxwing slain (talk) 10:40, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

 Done ScottishFinnishRadish (talk)

Khalistan Infobox

quite a while ago removed an infobox with info on Khalistan, though I find this wrong.

1:It doesn't exist but we didn't do it for LTTE, right? It did control territory during an insurgency and so did (and does) ISIS, so it de facto did exist.

2: I know that the infobox helped me understand the movement easier. Shouldn't we at least find if more users find the article easier with it?

3: You claim "Khalistan doesn't exist", but the article's title suggests that Khalistan is a movement. A movement is not a country, it doesn't need territory to be what it is. A movement is a group of individuals that follow one main idea. It is like a political party. It will not need territory to operate. 146.196.33.212 (talk) 06:43, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

@Wareon reverted. Also sorry for so many edits. Complete mistake on my end 146.196.33.212 (talk) 06:45, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

Semi protected edit request

In the intro, after “in the Punjab region, please add “of South Asia”. 2600:100C:A202:5967:E5B6:1470:DF4C:2405 (talk) 17:17, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

 Not done for now: "Punjab region" already links to its article, and the preview popup has a helpful summary that includes the geographic location. I don't think it's necessary to add this here, since any reader confused about the location can very quickly and easily access that information. Actualcpscm (talk) 18:04, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: India in Global Studies

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 18 January 2023 and 14 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: Pranavsheo, Sammwise39%, VarunKandula123.

— Assignment last updated by Adirrao (talk) 22:05, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 June 2023

Some information has not been corroborated correctly. Mian Singh (talk) 09:48, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Hyphenation Expert (talk) 10:32, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 30 June 2023

The article uses the wrong acronym in one instance. It mentions and cites the Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada however it puts the wrong acronym after (IRCC). IRCC stands for Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada which is a federal department separate from the Immigration Refugee Board of Canada. The correct acronym is (IRB). It should be replaced or remove the acronym entirely and it will be fixed. 142.120.140.15 (talk) 10:18, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

 Done Lightoil (talk) 10:57, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 August 2023

I am requesting to edit a part of this article as misinformation because of an accusation made without evidence and false claims. 2A02:C7C:665B:5000:18B4:4211:8FF2:524 (talk) 13:48, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: requests for decreases to the page protection level should be directed to the protecting admin or to Wikipedia:Requests for page protection if the protecting admin is not active or has declined the request. — DaxServer (t · m · e · c) 14:13, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of paragraph

Harmeet Singh, the chief of Khalistan Liberation Force, was murdered at Dera Chahal Gurdwara, near Lahore in Pakistan on 27 January 2020. Harmeet had masterminded the 2016–2017 targeted killings in Punjab as well as many other terror attacks. There have been varying reports on the cause and killer of Harmeet. According to some Indian media Harmeet was killed over an afair while other media outlets say Harmeet was killed over a financial dispute. Others have speculated Harmeet was killed by R&AW or ISI. This theory is favored by most Sikhs. A police spokesperson when asked about Harmeet's fainted ignorance claimed they had no knowledge of such an incident. Harmeet's parents requested his body so they could perform the final rites, but Pakistan did not comply. No FIR was registered by police in Lahore over Harmeet's murder. Harmeet was creamated with only a few attending the creamtion. The NIA failed to provide a death verification report for Harmeet. He would be succeeded by Avtar Singh Khanda.

Most of this paragraph is just the personal life of Harmeet Singh. Why are the funeary rites and theories about his death consequential enough to be included here? Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 15:06, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

Courtesy of @CanadianSingh1469. Please go ahead and delete that is not relevant — DaxServer (t · m · e · c) 16:37, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. I deleted the paragraph in its entirety. Do you think the 2016–17 targeted killings in Punjab, India deserves a brief mention on this page? Southasianhistorian8 (talk) 20:18, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

Do you know if the sources talk about those attacks in the context of the whole movement? — DaxServer (t · m · e · c) 07:22, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Proposed addition of paragraph

I propose the addition of a brief paragraph on the activities and alleged assassination of Hardeep Singh Nijjar. It would seem to fit neatly right at the end of the '1985 to present day' subsection, immediately preceding the 'Militancy' section.

Proposed text:

On 18 June 2023, Hardeep Singh Nijjar was shot dead in the parking lot of a Sikh temple in Surrey, Canada. Nijjar was the head of two pro-Khalistan organisations in Canada, and had been accused by the Indian Government of orchestrating targeted killings in India, for which it unsuccessfully sought his extradition. On 18 September 2023, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau publicly accused the Indian Government of being behind Nijjar's assassination. In response, Trudeau's government expelled an Indian diplomat from the country, and reportedly suspended trade talks. Riposte97 (talk) 01:15, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

Added. Capitals00 (talk) 02:14, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

References

Date format

The 2020s sub-section uses MM/DD/YY format. Not only is the inappropriate but is internal inconsistent. Could someone with access change the dates to DD/MM/YY. Thanks. 2003:EB:B747:8500:6471:7EA:F369:D324 (talk) 12:38, 14 July 2023 (UTC)

Calling it "inappropriate" seems like a bit much, but there is certainly a possibility of confusion for folks. MOS:DATEFORMAT specifies that DD/MM/YY also is recommended against. Instead, either YYYY-MM-DD should be used; or, more preferentially, the date should be fully written out with the month spelled out in its entirety. 172.56.152.22 (talk) 17:25, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

Typography and layout

There's a typo in the section "2020s", viz (my bolding):

The arson attempt was promptly surpressed by the San Francisco Department

I think this should be "suppressed". I would be grateful if someone with enough editing privileges were to fix that. Nicolai (talk) 19:31, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

 Done Thank you for pointing this out. RegentsPark (comment) 20:52, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

Improve Lead paragraphs

Here are some new WP:RS references from Sep / Oct 2023 that may help improve the lead to make it more balanced and neutral.

• "What is the Khalistan movement and why is it fuelling India-Canada rift?". reuters. 2023-09-19. Archived from the original on 22 September 2023. Retrieved 2023-09-24. Sikh separatists demand that their homeland Khalistan, meaning "the land of the pure", be created out of Punjab. The demand has resurfaced many times, most prominently during a violent insurgency in the 1970s and 1980s which paralysed Punjab for over a decade.

• Mogul, Rhea (October 6, 2023). "Why is India so worried about Sikh separatist calls for Khalistan?". CNN. Retrieved October 6, 2023. The decade-long Khalistan insurgency in the 1970s and 80s saw the massacre of civilians, indiscriminate bombings and attacks on Hindus. And in counterinsurgency operations, Indian security forces were accused of a multitude of human rights abuses. RogerYg (talk) 09:08, 11 October 2023 (UTC) RogerYg (talk) 09:08, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

November

@Capitals00 You have been boldly reverted with adequate explanations in my edit summaries. Please get a consensus for contentious edits here first instead of edit warring per WP:ONUS Kiu99 (talk) 14:27, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

You are not explaining why you are reverting the reliably sourced academically accepted facts. Srijanx22 (talk) 15:22, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

[1] Read the edit summaries then. I am only removing undue content from the lead per WP:NOTSCANDAL. We can't place rumours on the lead in the name of " academically accepted facts". No academic is making these claims Kiu99 (talk) 15:36, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

The other edits I removed are just Indian govt claims which are undue. No academic claims there either Kiu99 (talk) 16:48, 19 November 2023 (UTC)

It is a well-known academically accepted fact. For example, "Zulfikar Ali Bhutto had supported the Khalistan idea politically at every possible opportunity while under Zia Pakistan's engagement deepened."[2] You stand no chance with your removal of the sourced content. Srijanx22 (talk) 17:16, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

You're not paying attention. The content dispute here is not about if Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto sponsored the movement or not, it is about the BLP violating gossip material about what ZAB said being placed on the lead which looks like a conspiracy theory. I will not rehash the same policy link I referred to again which mentions this, please go through my first comment.

Also, I would be interested to know what is your (and user Capitals00's) opinion about the claims by an Indian govt official being placed on the lead in a very one sided/unbalanced manner (as no denial by the accused is even mentioned)? Kiu99 (talk) 18:58, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

There are no "claims by an Indian govt official being placed on the lead". There is no BLP violation either. Srijanx22 (talk) 13:08, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

[3] I posted this on the reliable sources noticeboard just to verify if getting into a content dispute for this dubious quote is even worth it or not, and the response I got was this. So, the statement currently in the lead is misquoted and, in my opinion, highly WP:UNDUE. Lead is supposed to be the summary of the body. The current version starts with the needed intro about what the movement is and one line sentences about the events starting from the 1950's to the 1990's as per body.

The currently misquoted (+misplaced) line on the lead is from the "Outside of India" section for which there already exists a paragraph about support from Pakistan and the Sikh diaspora. Hence making this "quote" excess detail and undue for lead.

I also note that there is currently nothing about the militant groups on the lead mentioned in detail further down the article either, which should be. We shouldn't be giving this much undue weight to content from "outside support" section, especially when it involves a cherry picked line from a detailed interview. See WP:LEADFIX

(Side note: when I said claims by the "Indian govt" I was talking about the Punjab govt minister, who IS part of the Indian govt. But I rather not get into that further, my main objection is the undue misquoted line discussed above) Kiu99 (talk) 12:53, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Sources have been already provided to you for proving the inportance of the information. It won't get removed from the lead. It speaks of the creation of Khalistan movement. Capitals00 (talk) 13:22, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Omission of sources/citations that jeopardize the integrity of the article.

Given that the situation involves many political parties, it would be considered pragmatic to use sources that are not partially or holistically funded by these parties as to prevent polarizing and possible biased opinions from influencing and jeopardizing the neutrality of this article.

I'd like to point out the following article for informed choices on the sources: Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources#Sources

Considering that many of the sources originate in India, such as the The Times of India, the following section may be notable: Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources#Paid reporting in Indian news organizations Astrolamp (talk) 04:22, 6 January 2024 (UTC)