Talk:Here be dragons

Linguistics Low‑importance

	Linguistics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Linguistics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of linguistics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.LinguisticsWikipedia:WikiProject LinguisticsTemplate:WikiProject LinguisticsLinguistics articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Maps Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Maps, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Maps and Cartography on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.MapsWikipedia:WikiProject MapsTemplate:WikiProject MapsMaps articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Middle Ages Low‑importance

	Middle Ages portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Middle Ages, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the Middle Ages on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Middle AgesWikipedia:WikiProject Middle AgesTemplate:WikiProject Middle AgesMiddle Ages articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

In software

Especially in older software, "here be dragons" is a comment commonly found near source code of unknown origin an mostly inscrutable meaning. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.90.78.42 (talk) 11:13, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Source for usage on modern maps

I would like to see a source for the usage of "Here be dragons" on modern maps. I've never seen this done, except on fictional and humorous maps. And I really doubt that this would be an accepted practice by the people at Rand McNally, National Geographic, Hammond, etc.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Neilmsheldon (talk • contribs) 11:46, November 3, 2006.

2017

Here be dragons explained away unexplored and unknown areas on a globe or a map Torey Stanley (talk) 01:49, 14 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Link to novel

I made a quick fix to the disambiguation problem of the use of "here be dragons" as a phrase and as a novel. Something more thorough needs to be done though. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mystyc1 (talk • contribs) 16:03, June 16, 2007.

You did it exactly right. :) --Quiddity 01:35, 17 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Added another da link to yet a different novel. I think a more thorough fix should be made to these, discussed in Here there be dragons. 63.87.189.17 (talk) 14:10, 13 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There's also a tale by Roger Zelazny. Made a disambig page. — Vano 03:55, 16 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

RuneScape

Can someone verify that RuneScape uses more than one reference? The map on the game's website only shows "Here be penguins" in between islands in the North-West. I couldn't find any other variants. -- 62.143.100.196 11:39, 17 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Does RuneScape -really- need to be referenced here? 70.228.71.158 (talk) 22:25, 15 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Introduction

There are a couple of things that strike me as odd about the intro. First, it says, "...a phrase used by ancient cartographers... in imitation of the infrequent medieval practice." How could an ancient cartographer imitate a medieval practice? Secondly, would the Lenox Globe be considered medieval or would it be early Renaissance? Perhaps someone with a better understanding of history could explain or propose changes.--Trystan (talk) 17:52, 11 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think that "ancient" is intended to be understood in a vague sense, rather than specifically classical antiquity. AnonMoos (talk) 18:32, 11 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

DOI for the Vesta paper

I've added a DOI for the Vesta paper using the doi template (Template:Doi), but it doesn't seem to work properly. Can't see what i've done wrong, so leaving it for someone else to fix! -- AnonymousDonor 2008-04-28 2317 +0100

Firefox 3

is the reference still true? I could not reproduce this with Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.9) Gecko/2008052906 Firefox/3.0.. --194.95.250.30 (talk) 08:05, 16 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's not notable either. I shall remove. -- Quiddity (talk) 17:04, 16 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, Firefox 3 is a widely used internet browser, so I think it is quite notable. And yes, it is still true (just type "about:config", without the quotes, in the location bar). I am putting it back.--Gorpik (talk) 10:11, 15 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Form of be

I don't know if this should be pointed out somewhere in the article, but "Hic sunt dracones" translates as "Here are dragons" as "here be dragons" would be something like "Hic dracones esse". 190.24.91.113 00:47, 2 October 2007 (UTC) POL[reply]

My impression, as a non-speaker-of-Latin, would be that it doesn't matter; the meaning is the same. However, actual Latin scholars may disagree entirely. Akatari 00:15, 31 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

What form is the verb "be" in the sentence "Here be dragons"? "Hic sunt dracones" translates to "Here are dragons". --Komischn (talk) 12:16, 18 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In some middle English dialects, "be" could be a plural present tense form... AnonMoos (talk) 13:00, 18 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I always took it for the subjunctive mood ("Here be dragons (for all we know)"). Of course, I guess then the latin would have been "sint". 63.87.189.17 (talk) 14:03, 13 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's more likely to be a habitual form, a distinctly archaic form (still in use, for example, in the Early Modern English of the KJV, and probably most familiar from there). See here for background. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 16:12, 23 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

But it's a modern coinage. It's faux archaic like "Ye Olde English Pubbe", not conforming to any historical stage of English but probably meant to evoke the subjunctive mood (or the habitual aspect) as a marker of antiquity. I don't think whoever coined the English phrase had a notion of mood or aspect, it was just meant to sound Olde. --46.114.133.109 (talk) 09:25, 12 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Plagiarism?

Either this is plagiarized from http://www.maphist.nl/extra/herebedragons.html -- linked to in this article, at that -- or that webpage was plagiarized from here. My guess is that the Wikipedia page is the plagiarized one: most of those stealing Wikipedia content don't claim to have been created in 1999 and have the wallpaper and mailing-list references to go with that. I plan on copyediting this, though probably not just now. ExOttoyuhr (talk) 21:19, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Improved "Dragons on maps," and moved the Icarius reference to contemporary: the asteroid Vesta isn't that important for medieval studies... ExOttoyuhr (talk) 15:02, 28 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Add a photo

Adding a photo of an actual map with "Here be dragons" on it would make for a vast improvement in the quality of this article. Anyone able to dig up a free one? Errantkid (talk) 11:45, 14 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'll add a request template at top. -- Quiddity (talk) 17:56, 14 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Merging

Hic sunt leones is barely a stub; I'm pretty sure we could just squeeze that information in here. Any objections to me merging them? Matt Deres (talk) 21:44, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Rogue wave link

I am loosely aware of a scientific theory that linked locations of rogue wave activity to places in the ocean where dragons were drawn on early maps. It is possible that I am misremembering if this was a quack theory or somewhat respectable, but I was surprised on coming to this page that the theory was not even mentioned. If true, it might give credence to the idea that drawn dragons actually referred to places seamen shouldn't wander, rather than just places that mapmakers were ignorant of. Since I remember little of the theory, I'll leave the article without any edits, but if anyone elseis interested, please feel free to look up the theory for possible addition to this article. — Eric Herboso 12:53, 17 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hunt-Lenox Globe

Check out Dragons#Cartography and then Lenox_Globe and you may be able to use that info to find a free image to upload for this page.

Other sources of map images for this article would I suggest be fantasy fiction. EdwardLane (talk) 20:39, 23 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"HIC" vs "HC"

English Wikipedia: HIC SVNT DRACONES
German Wikipedia: HC SVNT DRACONES

Is it "HIC" or "HC"? --80.130.171.24 (talk) 00:06, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In [1] it reads "HC". --80.130.171.24 (talk) 00:08, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

"Hc" has no meaning as a word in the Latin language, so if that's what's written on the map, it stands for "hic"... AnonMoos (talk) 10:54, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Drurer

Why is there a picture of a woodcut by Albrecht Drurer at the top of the page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.225.24.134 (talk) 19:34, 13 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

First off it's "Dürer". The reason is presumably to show an artistic representation of a dragon roughly contemporaneous with the Hunt-Lenox Globe. However, that image is not very important to the article. AnonMoos (talk) 03:51, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I've substituted the same picture from a better-credited source, and added a caption so as to indicate some relevance to the subject, as its use was queried above. But I agree the image is not very important to the article, and also agree with an earlier comment in 2008 ("Add a Photo") suggesting that to add an actual map example with "Here be dragons" on it would make for a vast improvement. Might try to look for one if/when time. Pete Hobbs (talk) 18:06, 4 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Alleged Venetian map

User:FocalPoint's comment on Talk:Terra incognita makes me wonder: is there really such a map in the Doge's Palace in Venice which says "terra incognita hic sunt dracones" somewhere on it? His story shouldn't be hard to confirm or disprove ... --Florian Blaschke (talk) 22:00, 6 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

B-class assessment

While I don't feel that I know enough to comment on the coverage and accuracy of the article, I've filled out the assessment template for the remaining criteria; I've marked referencing as 'no' primarily because of the mixed referencing style at the end of the article, which needs to be tidied up. — Sasuke Sarutobi (talk) 11:16, 3 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Here be dragons. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060209042605/http://www.strangehorizons.com/2002/20020610/medieval_maps.shtml to http://www.strangehorizons.com/2002/20020610/medieval_maps.shtml

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 22:12, 2 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified (January 2018)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Here be dragons. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071102164301/http://www.antiquemaps.co.uk/book/chapter10.asp to http://www.antiquemaps.co.uk/book/chapter10.asp

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 19:22, 24 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hic Sunt Leones

"The classical phrase used by ancient Roman and Medieval cartographers was HIC SVNT LEONES (literally, "here are lions") when denoting unknown territories on maps."

This sentence then cites an article by Van Duzer which doesn't at all talk about Roman cartographers using this expression but rather how medieval cartographers filled in Ptolemy's map with information that did not appear in Ptolemy's geographical treatise. Unless someone can find a source that shows that Roman cartographers used this phrase, I will be removing "ancient Roman and" from this sentence. Edgar (talk) 18:11, 19 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]