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Talk:Charles M. Robinson (architect)

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Try Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL and Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL. --doncram 10:54, 7 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I suspect the following three items in Greenbush, Wisconsin
  • Charles Robinson House, Center St., Old Wade House State Park, Greenbush, WI (Robinson,Charles), NRHP-listed
  • Robinson-Herrling Sawmill, Old Wade House State Park, Greenbush, WI (Robinson,Charles), NRHP-listed
  • Sylvanus Wade House, At jct. of WI 23 and Kettle Maraine Dr. in Old Wade House State Park, Greenbush, WI (Robinson,Charles), NRHP-listed
relate to a different Charles Robinson, who would likely also be wikipedia notable. Charles Robinson is already a dab page of many same-named persons. --doncram 12:20, 7 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I don't know if they're the same person. It seems unlikely because he's not from the area. I am familiar with the location - all 3 are buildings located at the plot of land and I photographed each of them for the county's NRHP list. The Wade house is the core of the site and there are important clues to the history of the site in that article. Charles M. Robinson's lifespan is reasonable for those buildings but adding him would be original research without some reliable source. Royalbroil 03:07, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Database dump

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I've moved Doncram's database dump to here until it can actually be verified that these are all the correct Charles Robinson. I already removed one error, and have struck out another, bringing the total of bogus entries on the original list up to 5.--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 18:19, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

An inflated view of any problem, as the article creator (me) added but immediately removed 3 during initial edits of article. --doncram 00:24, 10 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Works (and attribution) are:

*Robinson-Hiller House, 113 Virginia St., Chapin, SC (Robinson, Charles P.), NRHP-listed

I am going to return these to the article. It is a major part of the article, and a significant contribution, to provide this list of notable works. It is documented in the article that this person was mainly in Virginia and also started his career in Altoona, Pennsylvania. The NRIS database documents association of name to each of these works. Some judgment has been applied to not list the Wisconsin ones in the article already. If there is reason to question any particular other one, please state that here, but it is crazy to suggest the architect of many Richmond VA schools is not the same Charles M. Robinson who designed another Richmond VA school. So the removal seems wp:POINTY and unreasonable. --doncram 20:28, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
No, putting every Char.*Robinson you can find in the NRIS database in the article is unreasonable. Reverted.--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 20:32, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Um, it is not that, it is not every such hit, it is the VA and Altoona PA ones known to be associated with this architect. Returning. SarekOfVulcan, are you determined to edit war? There has been consideration by two other editors, me and RoyalBroil (invited to comment by me) about inclusion/exclusion of items here; SarekOfVulcan you do not have a consensus or even a majority opinion. Note I removed myself, or accepted removal of several items, including three WI ones and a stray MS one. It is conceivable that there could turn out to be a remaining error, say about the SC one, but it is unreasonable to remove all the VA schools. Are you seriously saying you doubt that any specific VA school in this list is associated with Charles M. Robinson architect of VA schools? --doncram 20:55, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
P.S. FYI, the VA NRHP noms are online, e.g. this NRHP nom for Anna Bolling School. Maybe you'd be happier if you browsed in that one, and some others? I don't get what you would have any legitimate concern about here. I do get that you might not "like" the current article, but it is a legit topic and the mention of these items is supported legitimately. --doncram 21:06, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
You want the data in, you do the browsing, and you provide the proper citations.--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 21:08, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
There is a citation for every item, i.e. the NRIS citation. I see you removed the list again, for 3rd time i think -- I think unreasonably -- and I will return it again (and add some more info). You provide no specific argument against any one item that is included, from being included. --doncram 21:13, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
No, that's a citation for "I ran a random database query off this database", it's not a citation for "this architect built this building".--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 21:30, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
There is specific documentation text linked that talks about Charles M. Robinson designing (or supervising design of) 23 VA schools. Just consider, do you seriously think a different Charles M. Robinson designed any of the VA school items you remove? Each is sourced to NRIS, which, with sensible interpretation, supports that Charles M. Robinson designed these. What on earth are you thinking?! --doncram 21:37, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Sarek, the NRIS database is too weak since Charles Robinson is a common name - even the M. is fairly weak. The real question is "Can you find a reliable source listing his works?" to meet WP:VERIFY since the burden is on you, Doncram? The VA schools is a much stronger guess since it's his state but SC listings are tenuous. I don't dislike the article or the topic if he indeed was the architect on many listings. Royalbroil 05:42, 11 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

To clarify about the 2 SC ones, i started articles on Robinson-Hiller House, 113 Virginia St., Chapin, SC, and Lutheran Theological Seminary Building: Beam Dormitory, 4201 Main St., Columbia, SC. South Carolina Department of Archives and History sources clarify that the 2nd but not the first are works of architect Charles M. Robinson. I think it was reasonable to have both in the article while drafting, as upon further review it easily coulda turned out that both were works (one with a typo in architect name, which often happens). That's my judgment based on experience with many architect articles. For another example, i really believe that

  1. Cathedral of the Nativity of the Blessed Virgin Mary, 204 S. Cedar St., Grand Island, NE (Brinkman & Hagan), NRHP-listed[2]
  2. Hoisington High School, 218 E 7th St., Hoisington, KS (Brinkman & Hagen), NRHP-listed[2]

are both designed by the same architect, though there is an as-yet-unresolved contradiction in source's spelling for the 2nd architect.

If another editor would return the list of works to the article, minus the Robinson-Hiller House item, I would appreciate that, or I will after 24 hours. --doncram 00:24, 10 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I object as stated above. Royalbroil 05:42, 11 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I have re-inserted several of the buildings from doncram's list, with citations to additional sources verifying that they were designed by Charles M. Robinson, the noted Richmond architect. Cbl62 (talk) 02:23, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Nice job. :-) --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 02:38, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Good work!

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Congratulations on scooping me and good work on the article! I am one of the few who are self-professed called "CMR scholars", having studied his works for several years now, with a goal of trying to photo-document all the remaining buildings of his around the state of Virginia (more photos for the commons forthcomming). There actually has been a commons category since March for his works, which I just linked the article to. Good work, and let me know if there is any way I can help in pulling from my research records. Morgan Riley (talk) 23:24, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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