Talk:Brightest Blue

Album release dates

Ok, many outlets are reporting her album is titled Brightest Blue and will be released on June 12, however others say it's title is unconfirmed and is out on June 5. Let's discuss. Musiceditor515 (talk) 20:24, 17 May 2020 (UTC)

In the source provided on the page, which was issued to Press Party from Universal Music, the album is releasing on 5 June 2020; no other information has been issued in an official capacity. Title and other release dates are speculative, and Wikipedia does not speculate. livelikemusic (TALK!) 21:00, 17 May 2020 (UTC)

Lead single

Worry about me is only available on the deluxe version. So is Power the lead single or maybe flux, because its also on the album? MotherofSnakes (talk) 09:55, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

"Worry About Me" was promoted as a single from the album, therefor, by its inclusion, it is the album's first single. All songs released prior were not promoted as album-related releases, therefor, they are not included in the infobox. livelikemusic (TALK!) 13:46, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

How was Worry About Me promoted as a single from the album? She never once mentioned anything about Brightest Blue while promoting the song. You’re just assuming it was promoted for the album since it was released close to the album release. You’re just making things up. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 (talk) 22:04, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Inclusion of pre-released singles

Per {{Infobox album}}, "Close to Me," "Flux" and "Hate Me" should not be included, as they were never released in promotion of the album; they were each released as stand-alone releases. Their inclusion on Brightest Blue is merely all they have in-common. Their releases were standalone, and not made in promotion of the album. livelikemusic (TALK!) 17:00, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Do you have a source that says "Flux" was not released in anticipation of the album? It was released as a formal single and is included on the album. "Worry About Me" was also released prior to the announcement of the album, so by that logic only "Power" should be included as the lead single.. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 18:03, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Again, simply being included on the album does not equate to it being released as a single from the album. Other stuff exists. See Romance (Camila Cabello album) for example: "Señorita" (Shawn Mendes and Camila Cabello song) was released as a single from Mendes' self-titled third album and not promoted from Cabello's album, despite its inclusion on the album later. As for "Worry About Me," it is included on a format of the album and was promoted as the first single from the album, therefore, its inclusion is appropriate. Even within {{Infobox single}} it states: If the song was originally released as a single well in advance of the album, This is the past for the three linked songs above. Simply being included on the album does not immediately mean they were singles from the album; they were standalone releases later put into the album. Marketing and promotion began with the release of "Worry About Me," per its press release. livelikemusic (TALK!) 18:17, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for the detailed response. Pointing to the press release (which I found without you linking) is what I was seeking. Yes, OSE. However, the press release does not list "Worry About Me" as the lead single. In fact, it terms it a "new single" and explicitly states that it follows the previously released, aforementioned singles. This groups those previously released singles with the announcement of the album (which was then slated for June 5.) Further, the announcement for "Power", if we are looking at the album announcement as a determining factor of singles promoting the album, explicitly includes a new album announcement in the title. This press release also refers to "Worry About Me" as a "recent single" rather than the lead single, and emphasizes its inclusion alongside previously released singles "Close to Me" and "Hate Me". If we are using cited sources to inform what songs are included, we can't cherry pick based on what we believe is the artist's intent. We need to look at official announcements and reported, verifiable news. If you can point to such a source listing "Worry About Me" as the lead single, even though it is not included in the core album, that would nonetheless justify its inclusion over other officially released singles. Otherwise, looking at the sources, two singles would be considered the lead single: either "Close to Me" (the first released single that is included on the album) or "Power" (the first single released with reference in the press release title to the forthcoming album). Falconerjmoosey (talk) 18:51, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Entertainment Weekly called "Worry About Me" the first single from the album in its article from March 2020. As for the June 2020 release, it was made just prior to the COVID-19 pandemic shut down, so plans seem to have changed, much like other releases have changed in response to the pandemic, both in terms of music releases and concert tours. And, if you want to use your own argument, the press release for "Worry About Me" also announced that album title and details to be revealed soon, and the album's title and change of date were not announced until the release of "Power," which does not negate the intended use of "Worry About Me" as the first single in promotion of the album. livelikemusic (TALK!) 19:13, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Entertainment Weekly may have reported on the release, however it is not an official press release. The article was written over two months ago, prior to the release of the tracklisting, so terming "Worry About Me" the lead single is speculation. I noted that "Worry About Me" mentions the forthcoming album, however you are failing to acknowledge that I specified that "Power" mentioned the forthcoming album in its own press release title, whereas in "Worry About Me" it is included in the subtitle. However, neither press release terms either single as the lead single. On the contrary, both press releases mention the previously released singles, which groups of all the singles as belonging to the album. This article from Billboard refers to "Close to Me" as the lead single, as do numerous other outlets. The complication merely arises from the fact that Ellie has grouped the songs in the "Brightest Blue" (album proper) and in the "EG.0" portion from the Deluxe Edition. In either scenario, either "Close to Me" or "Flux" would be considered the first official singles from the album. The fact of the matter is that if a single is released as an official single, and is later included on the track listing, it is an official single that supports the album. You could argue that a single immediately preceding an album's release is the intended "lead single", but it does not change the fact that previously released songs that are included on the track listing are official singles. If we are getting into OSE, see Dua Lipa's debut as an example of singles that were official releases in support of the album despite their release years before the album was announced or formalized. Changes to the article that cite songs from the album as being official single releases should be considered in good faith unless sufficient evidence is presented to the contrary. And in this case, Entertainment Weekly's speculation is not sufficient when it is in direct contradiction to official press releases. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 20:37, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

So now Entertainment Weekly isn't reliable? In Wikipedia's eyes, it is reliable, and that is enough. Again, simply because information was not known, per the citation, does not mean it not to be true. If that were the case, we would be going through multiple articles disputing information, and that's just chaotic bullshit. That source from Billboard does not explicitly state it is the lead single (note, I am not saying "first," either). It merely asks if it is or not. I am in firm belief of the positions I've made as to why the three songs above are not singles from the album, per the template and other linked pages/guidelines, and I will await more editors to involve, instead of a back-and-forth of two editors only. Also, there is no "deluxe" album; both Brightest Blue and EG.0 are grouped as the same release only. There is no standard or deluxe release. livelikemusic (TALK!) 20:49, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

1.) There is no reason for inappropriate language. 2.) I did not say "Entertainment Weekly" was not reputable. Please do not put words into my mouth. I merely pointed out that the article contradicts official press releases. 3.) Now that the album is available for pre-add on streaming services, I do see EG.0 included as a distinct portion of the album but part of the album nonetheless. I concede that point. 4.) However, you once again are failing to recognize that official singles, whether they lead the album or not, are official singles. Standard album pages on Wikipedia, including this one, include the portion clearly labeled "Singles from ______".

Here is a Venn Diagram to visualize the information we are debating. None of the singles released fit all three criteria. So let's stop debating which single is the "lead" single. All five songs were official single releases, and all five songs are included on the album. It is cut and dry. As I mentioned before, "lead" singles do not have to be the first single. So, whether or not you are in "firm belief", it cannot be argued that these songs should [edit: shouldn't] be included as singles from the album. I, too, welcome other editors to become involved. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 21:33, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Diagram is not relevant to what Wikipedia states, so I will not be paying attention, and I do not agree. You are ignoring things that have been posted, and, again, will be waiting for more people to discuss here. Will not continuing to speak in the same circles through this discussion, as it is clear you see your point and I see mine, and they are not going to cross. Again, inclusion on album ≠ automatically mean it is a single from the album. livelikemusic (TALK!) 21:39, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

What did I ignore? Please point it out to me and I will address it. You pointed out that I was incorrect about the album having different versions, I conceded. Please tell me how that is not addressing your points.

Saying that a single from an album is not "a single from an album" is mind-boggling mental gymnastics and exactly why we are not going to agree. I don't have time to overhaul the page, nor the interest or energy in undoing your anticipated edits, so I am leaving it at this for now. We will just have to wait and see what others ultimately feel in the long run. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 21:49, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

I would just like to add that LiveLikeMusic is also edit-warring on the pages “Close to Me”, “Hate Me” and “Flux”. For some reason he keeps removing the album (Brightest Blue) from the infobox, even though on all three pages it says in the opening paragraph that they are included on the album. This is clearly because while he recognizes that they’re included on the album, he is still insistent that they are not official singles from the album. I’m not sure how to tell if they’re official singles or not, but what I do know is that on Ellie’s discography page, all five songs (the ones I mentioned plus “Worry About Me” and “Power”) are listed as singles from the album.

It seems that in Livelikemusic’s eyes, if an artist doesn’t mention an album while promoting a single, then it isn’t an official single for the album. But Falconer’s point still stands; the page for Dua’s debut includes all the pre-release singles, going back to nearly two years before the album was released (the same time between this and “Close to Me”, coincidentally). Clearly Dua wasn’t mentioning the album in 2015. I remember, she announced it in late 2016. All this to say that I agree with Falconer, we shouldn’t be cherry-picking what pre-release singles count as “official singles” or not. Unless Ellie herself says they were just promotional singles, they should be included on the album page as official singles.

Also LLM, I must say that I find it humorous that you came to my talk page to ask me to stop, but just the other day when I came to your talk page to ask how we could come to an agreement regarding Dedicated Side B, you promptly removed what I said from your page. You clearly have no intention of cooperating with others to come to an agreement. You instead choose to stubbornly stick to what you believe, even if the whole world disagrees with you. Maybe be more open to simply discussing things with people? I can almost guarantee it would be a better way to resolve things then what you currently do. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 (talk) 21:53, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Omg LLM, you really just accused Falconer of ignoring things while you ignored his diagram?? I can’t with the hypocrisy, it’s so strong with you. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 (talk) 21:55, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Yes I would love to know why the diagram was irrelevant and how that is not ignoring my points. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 22:05, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

What I’ve realized is that LLM has realized that this website is basically a joke. Like, if two people are arguing or edit-warring, it really doesn’t actually matter who’s right or wrong, it just matters who knows more than the other person. I don’t know how to send people warnings, or how to report people. But LLM does. So now the admins here are going to side with him. LLM is only good at one thing, and that’s reporting people. He’s not good at defending his points or discussing things with people, so he rarely does. Instead, if someone disagrees with him and tries to talk to him about it, he deletes their comments and reports them. What a mature person. We hate to see it. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 (talk) 22:11, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

WP:NOPERSONALATTACKS WP:Wikihounding WP:Sockpuppet is happening right now. Until more editors want to actually discuss content and not editors, I will continue to discussion. livelikemusic (TALK!) 22:13, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Buddy I’ve made several comments about the content, you’re just choosing to only look at the personal comments. And while I admit they’re not necessary, it’s not like they came from nothing. Both Falconer and I have mentioned how Dua’s album page includes singles released two years before the album. Surely you don’t think they were promoted as singles from the album? 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 (talk) 22:18, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

I certainly hope you aren't under the impression that the contributor ending in 5D80 and I are the same person. We are two different editors, and therefore there are two people in favor of the proposed changes that correctly list all official singles released from the album. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 23:13, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

I'm not. livelikemusic (TALK!) 23:15, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

I won't be saying much but I agree that being included on the album does not mean it's a single and it shouldn't be included in the single infobox unless being said so by the artist. Raritydash (talk) 23:36, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

If that’s the case, how can we justify including any of the songs in the infobox? And that goes for every album page as well. That’s a pretty weak line of reasoning. There is no difference in the older singles and the more recent ones, other than that the older ones are... older. Except older ≠ not being a single. 2601:48:8100:9740:F469:9EC6:7F1A:5D80 (talk) 23:41, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

References

• Can someone, in simple terms put below my comment reliable sources that can fulfill the following statement:

"X" was released as a single of Brightest Blue

Where "X" can be: "Close to Me", "Flux", "Hate Me", "Worry About Me" or "Power". Because any "fact, allegation [or] idea for which no reliable, published sources exist" or any "combine[d] material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources" constitutes original research. Template:Infobox song#album already covers this precisely to avoid people adding songs solely because they were included in a subsequently released album. © Tbhotch^™ (en-3). 01:46, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

I searched every news article that mentioned the album, and none of them said anything about any of those songs being a single. So are we now saying that none of the songs are singles? I think that’s a pretty ludicrous thing to say, but it’s not my decision. 2601:48:8100:9740:78DC:F0E8:638B:631A (talk) 02:51, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

Close to Me released as single. Flux released as single. Hate Me released as single. We are not discussing if these songs were singles, we are discussing this: "The pop star teased the release of the first single (Worry About Me) from her upcoming fourth album" and "I wanted to release this song (Power) off my upcoming album as a preview into the world my new album is in!". It's like we go to the Upcoming Katy Perry sixth studio album (when existing) to add that 365, Con Calma, Never Really Over Small Talk, Harleys in Hawaii or Never Worn White (if any of them is included) were singles off that album despite Perry saying Daisies is the lead single. © Tbhotch^™ (en-3). 03:38, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

In terms of recent releases and logic here are the some common themes to be mindful of:

• If the artist x was listed as "featured" on artist Y's song and the song is featured on X's album, then it might not be considered a single from X's album
• The record label is a big giveaway, if the song was released by Y's record label but included on X's album, its not a single from X's album. Record labels compete against each other and don't generally pay to promote someone else's album.
• If a song is featured on any 1 version of an album, I believe it should be included in the infobox. There are loads of examples of this but the most prominent ones I can think of are "Super Bass" by Nicki Minaj which was always a deluxe edition bonus track but gained traction and was released as a single.

I hope these comments help. I'm generally against the idea of pre-release singles. There are loads of reasons that songs are released and then excluded from the track listing. Record labels often downgrade unsuccessful singles or if an album is pushed back but stick to logic per WP:DUCK, if a song was released and is included on at least one version of an album its a single from that album unless the above applies. In Katy Perry's case she never said "Harleys", "Never Really Over" etc were from an album but clearly said that they were standalone singles. Bear that in mind too. Also note that the "lead single" from an album is the one that directly precedes its release, not necessarily the first one. → Lil-℧niquԐ1 - (Talk) - 09:00, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

We have two reliable sources (i.e., Entertainment Weekly and Consequence of Sound) stating that "Worry About Me" is the album's lead single and one reliable source (i.e., The Line of Best Fit) stating that "Power" is such. With that in mind, any single released prior to both of those songs' releases wouldn't be official album singles, no? KyleJoan^talk 10:55, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

Lead singles are the ones directly preceding the release not necessarily the first single, see Lead_single#More_than_one_lead_single_of_an_album ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 16:10, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

This is really a response to numerous threads above: I really don't understand the concern over which singles are lead singles. If an artist is recording an album, and releases a song, and that song is ultimately included on all versions of the album, it is a De Facto single from the album. Literally the sentence is, "Close to Me is a single from the album Brightest Blue." This cannot be disputed. It was an officially released, non-promotional single that is on the album. What can be disputed is the intended lead single. This does not negate the fact that "Close to Me", "Flux", and "Hate Me" are all officially released singles that are included on the album, and therefore are singles from said album. Regarding "reliable sources", they may be generally reliable but every publication is prone to error. In particular, you point to two different reputable sites conflicting in which of the two singles is the lead single. Which one is it, then? In this case, we must defer to to the official press releases, which explicitly mention "Close to Me" and "Hate Me" in particular, and term "Worry About Me" and "Power" as NEW singles. The official Brightest Blue press release from yesterday follows this same pattern. It mentions the previously released singles, terms "Worry About Me" and "Power" as new singles, and does not distinguish either one of them as being a lead single. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 16:29, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

I just want to say, I am giving up. If we get an official statement from Ellie on social media, we can update this. I am not saying that Ellie isn't hoping everyone forgets about the songs that either a.) didn't chart well and/or b.) don't fit her vision for the album. To these eyes they are being very careful with their language by calling songs "recent releases" and "new singles." But even then, following that logic, "Power" would be the 'lead' single and therefore should be the only single listed at this time. Again, it is clear I vehemently disagree, but I am not going to waste my time and energy on this anymore. I am confident enough in myself that I can stomach visiting the page and seeing the dishonesty in the infobox. Best of luck, all. Falconerjmoosey (talk) 16:37, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

Was anything actually concluded here? I don't see a clear consensus just a muddle of different (and very valid) opinions but not necessarily a direct answer about what is and isn't classified as a single from this album. There's already acknowledgement that press releases are not independent and therefore not the be all and end all as we all know record labels demote "singles" all the time when it doesn't suit them to call them singles from the album. The crux of the argument, per {{Infobox album}}, they were released during the album's marketing i.e. had the album been mentioned at their time of release.

• In The Guardian, Goulding premiers "Flux" as one of the songs from her new album.
• Beyond the Stage calls "Flux" the lead single from the album.
• Billboard says "is this the lead single of our dreams" which is WP:synthesis if we're suggesting that it confirmation of its lead single status.
• Pressparty - press release mentions new track "Power", recent single "Worry About Me" as well as "further follows on from releases such as "Close To Me" and "Hate Me" as well as an Amazon Music exclusive cover of Joni Mitchell’s 'River' which saw here claim her third UK No. 1 – becoming the last number one single of the decade." It's synthesis to suggest that these songs are singles not singles based on a press release

The lead single debate is a distraction from the "what songs are singles" debate. For me, it boils down to the fact that at the time of release of "Flux" Ellie was talking about her 4th album. A clear indication that it was promoted in release of her fourth album which she had not yet titled. Many artists release songs in a similar position. Given the similar discussion for Smile, what do you think tbhotch? And livelikemusic you didn't respond to the message I left on your talkpage, so in the interests of closing off this discussion properly with a consensus, what do you think? If we can't decide maybe a full and proper RFC needs to be opened. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 14:37, 15 July 2020 (UTC)

At this point, a RfC definitely seems necessary, especially as now original research is being thrust into the article. As for my talk page, my apologies, in returning to work in the midst of COVID, things have become a bit.... hectic. livelikemusic (TALK!) 17:01, 16 July 2020 (UTC)

I've started one below at Talk:Brightest_Blue#RFC_on_Singles_from_the_Album if you would like to comment @Livelikemusic, Falconerjmoosey, and Tbhotch: ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:11, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

I (Theenforcer22) have a number of points to make:

- this approach to not including the 3 singles is not consistent with the approach to other albums on Wikipedia and the relationship with tracks previously released as singles.

- this is not consistent with the Wikipedia page of each of the singles which refers to them as being singles released from the album 'Brightest Blue'.

- It's been stated that the singles were not released to promote the album - the fact they are on the album is promoting the album. The 3 tracks in question are currently 3 of Ellie's top 5 most popular tracks on Spotify and it is the version available on the album Brightest Blue, not the single, that is popular. They are therefore quite clearly promoting the streaming of this album.

- This is not consistent with standalone singles going back decades where standalone singles were tracks that were never included in the regular track listing of a studio album (not bonus tracks). Going Out by Supergrass; Drown by Bring Me The Horizon; Mountains by Biffy Clyro: all examples of tracks released as standalone singles later to be included in the track listing of a subsequent album a year or so later. All listed as singles from the album on Wikipedia. There will be hundreds more examples of this.

- Misleading information. I used Wikipedia upon the album's release to investigate whether this album contained any popular singles. I concluded that it didn't based on the singles listed. This is clearly inaccurate given 3 of Ellie's current most popular songs are on this album and were in fact singles - but not listed as singles here — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theenforcer22 (talk • contribs) 09:38, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 June 2020

There is a typo in the lead section. There should be a comma after Blackbear, not a period. 208.98.223.30 (talk) 15:34, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

 Done Megan Barris (Lets talk📧) 15:41, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Tracklist

"Sixteen" is included as the closer to the latter side of the album. It might be a purely digital edition tracklisting, it's on Spotify and Apple Music as far as I know. Froyo Fox126 (talk) 03:32, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

RFC on Singles from the Album

There is some difference of opinion as to what constitutes a single from an album when previously released songs are included on album's track listing but are not specifically called "singles" by the artist or record label. In the case of Brightest Blue the question is whether or not the songs: "Hate Me", "Flux", "Close to Me" are considered singles for the purpose of album's infobox. Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:09, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

Template:Infobox_album#Template:Singles states Do not add specialty- or limited-release singles, such as those supplied to radio stations and music publications, which are often marked as "Promo copy" or "Promotional". Do not include singles that were added as bonus tracks on a re-release of an album. For songs that appear on more than one album, list the song as a single only for the album(s) where the single was released as part of the marketing and promotion of that album

It also says For complex release scenarios where it may not be obvious that a single was released as part of the marketing and promotion of the album on which it appears, seek consensus on the talk page for the album.

Taking all of that into account here are my questions that I think we need resolving

• Question 1: If a song like "Flux" is released as a single i.e. independently from the album, has a single cover, had a music video, and is unveiled as a song from the upcoming album, is it a single from the album regardless of where the artist/label say it or not?
• Question 2: Does an artist saying "X song is the lead/first single from my album" overrule any previous singles that are released and included on the album's track listing?
• Question 3: In the world of digital and streaming, when an artist includes previously released singles, they contribute towards the number of album equivalent units sold. IMO, that means that pre-released singles are part of the promotion for that album because they count towards its promotional success. For me, that's a clear answer to the "complex release scenario" but the current wording is too open to interpretation.

When responding the RFC, it would be useful to refer to the three separate questions. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 11:09, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

• Q1. No, a RS is needed that indicates it is a single. With all the different types of releases, trying to establish our own definition of what is and isn't a single is too difficult. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:42, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
• Q2. No, it should be handled as WP:Conflicting sources and WP:WEIGHT. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:42, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
• Q3. Again, no – it needs a RS, since there is no clear definition of a single. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:42, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

"Singles" are an artifact from the days when they were defined by their physical appearance, charts, and Top 40 radio airplay. Looking ahead, these designations are likely to become even more blurred and meaningless. If it is really that important, it should be left for the main body and not the infobox. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:42, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

• I think that Lil-unique described the situation perfect here. The songs are included on the album and thus the sales will benefit from its inclusion, making it a single from the album. It doesn't really matter what the labels call something, singles have been downgraded to "buzz" singles for years because they weren't as successful as they hoped and they launched a new "lead single". Lead single doesn't mean first single either. I think that if a song appears on an album then it should be referred to as a single from it UNLESS it was promoted for other reasons (for example "Love Me like You Do" was released and promoted for Fifty Shades of Grey and then later included on her album). All of these songs were released in the lead up to an album. Whether or not it took 1.5 years for it to come out is irrelevant. The same applies to Katy's album Smile. It's a new tactic for record labels to be releasing a lot of singles leading up to an album to benefit from SPS. — Status (talk · contribs) 15:22, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
  • I think that "Sixteen" should also be included in this RFC since it appears on international editions of the album. — Status (talk · contribs) 22:53, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
• I would stick with the existing instructions deprecating specialty or promotional songs. It's a greatly different scale of effort when a song is available free on SoundCloud versus printed up in large numbers for purchase in a physical form. Binksternet (talk) 15:33, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

  comment, Binksternet the guidance says, discuss non-clear situations on a talk page. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 23:02, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

• comment Q1 & Q2, I do not think the author is necessarily the definitive authority on this. 'This is my first single' is ambiguous. Is it first to be written, published, or as you infer ordered in the tracks? Q3, I agree with what you say, and like others here I believe the industry has begun to blurr these designations. Fred (talk) 13:32, 18 July 2020 (UTC)
• Comment:Apologies that I haven't understood the question-answer format correctly. However, my opinion, in simple words, is that "Close to Me", "Hate Me", "Worry About Me" and "Power" should be listed as the only four singles from the album, in that order. I would consider adding "Flux" and "Slow Grenade" if evidence of a radio release (other than the unreliable Australian website) was provided.--NØ 08:36, 20 July 2020 (UTC)

• Comment @MaranoFan: but Goulding is British artist and in the UK, we don't send songs to radio as such. As airplay doesn't factor into the charts, radio stations choose what to play. Its a different system to the rest of the world. Songs get playlisted by the radio stations of their own volition. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 09:22, 20 July 2020 (UTC)

Lil-unique1 Please clarify: this seems to imply that radio stations, such as in the U.S., don't choose which music is played on their stations. —Ojorojo (talk) 14:09, 20 July 2020 (UTC)

Ojorojo, in the US you have intermediary organisations like Mediabase that promote songs on behalf of labels. You also have radio station groups and associations for different types of station. In the UK, the largest radio station is actually non-commercial (BBC Radio 1) who have a history of adding songs to their playlists when album's come out as well as when singles are promoted- there isn't a formal system of servicing songs to the radio. The stations are also under no obligation to play songs despite their chart listing. For example, Alexandra Burke scored a number one with "Start Without You", a song that was not playlisted by Radio 1 or its commercial rival station Capital FM and received virtually no airplay. As the largest station in the country, BBC radio 1 has a number of talk shows too but they generally only play music that is playlisted and they only playlist according to a panel of experts. Therefore unlike the US, radio airplay dates do not carry the same weight because songs are not serviced in the same way. Additionally, we have much fewer formats e.g. Radio 1 caters to young people, Radio 1 extra is urban, Radio 2 is Adult Contemporary and in many cases when don't have multiple stations for genres - e.g. Heart 80s is one of two stations that purely play all music from the 80s and sometimes have things like a "dance classics" or "rock n roll" hour. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 19:33, 20 July 2020 (UTC)

That is a gross over-simplification and ignores the diversity in American radio. But this is off-topic and really not relevant to the RfC. —Ojorojo (talk) 13:35, 21 July 2020 (UTC)

Well Ojorojo it was relevant to what Marano Fan was saying because it has never been pre-requisite for songs to be released to radio for them to be classified as singles. But it is relevant because radio stations just aren't as relevant in the UK context. It's not simplification to say that releases and promotion have changed drastically. The guidelines were originally written for when singles were more a physical and an actual tangible release rather than the more fluid/loose definition etc. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 14:10, 21 July 2020 (UTC)

• Exclude, exclude and exclude, i.e. no, no, no. Our friend Katy Perry and her new album can explain why this is blatant WP:SYNTHESIS: [1] One day Small Talk (song) is the sophomore single, but guess what, the next day it isn't; one day Smile (Katy Perry song) is the fifth single, the next day it is the fourth. This is why we don't let users to determine how things are, we solely rely on published reliable sources to do it. © Tbhotch^™ (en-3). 12:48, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

Personnel and credits section

Dear editors. I am currently adapting the Brightest Blue liner notes directly from the CD booklet and am using similar album articles as templates. I sincerely apologise if any sort of errors, misspellings and incorrect formatting that may arise from when I have completed the adaption, however I greatly appreciate friendly advice and corrections as I am not a very experienced editor on Wikipedia. I do not intend to create disruptive edits or any sort of vandalism, I simply wish to contribute and help!

Thanks very much. Emmaan01 (talk) 08:13, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Is the certification definitely correct?

I know the album has been certified by RIAA as gold but I wasn't certain how this was the case. The album opened at 29 which is also its peak. None of the singles did amazingly well on streaming or the Hot 100 yet in less than 3 months its certified as gold? ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 13:07, 10 October 2020 (UTC)

Hoax additions: collaborators or co-writers

Some IPs from Romania and Greece have been adding hoax credits to this album and related articles. They have added ABBA and R.E.M. who are not supported at all in the published sources. They also add unsupported genres. They have messed with Sixteen (Ellie Goulding song) and Power (Ellie Goulding song), and also the album article Higher Than Heaven.

Involved IPs:

• Romania: 5.14.156.172 (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RBLs · proxy check · block user · block log · cross-wiki contribs · CheckUser (log))
• Romania: 86.124.116.218 (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RBLs · proxy check · block user · block log · cross-wiki contribs · CheckUser (log))
• Greece: 2A02:587:1868:CB00:0:0:0:0/64 (block range · block log (global) · WHOIS (partial))

We should be on the lookout for more disruption of this sort. Binksternet (talk) 18:34, 21 August 2024 (UTC)