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Badghis is safe now?

http://www.pajhwok.com/viewstory.asp?lng=eng&id=47223 —Preceding unsigned comment added by ZXR222 (talk • contribs) 09:40, 19 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Pashto not spoken?

On 7 December 2007 KabulHospital said "Pashto is not spoken in Badghis", and deleted the Pashto name leaving the Persian. The linguistic map of the area indicates that Turkman is the predominant language, but that both Pashto and Dari (a form of Persian) are spoken, Pashto a lot more than Dari. The lead sentence originally read: Badghis (Persian: بادغیس) (Pashto: د بادغيس ولايت) is one of the thirty-four provinces of Afghanistan. Are the non-English names used by groups that are in a severe minority in the province irrelevant to the article? The Turkman name for the province might be useful. Perhaps the others should be removed. What do you all think? --Bejnar (talk) 01:44, 20 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Even the Turkmen do not speak their own language. Uzbeks and Turkmen in Afghanistan usually use Dari Persian instead, otherwise they couldn't communicate with the other ethnic groups. Also the Turkmen language is not native to Badghis and neither is the Pashto language. The original language in Badghis (and the language still most spoken today) is Dari Persian. See the Iranica entry on Badghis. Quebecer (talk) 17:07, 20 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

There are Pashto speakers in Badghis, but they Pashto is not used there. The language the different ethnic groups communicate with eacher in is Dari-Persian. Quebecer (talk) 17:17, 20 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I do understand that Dari is the lingua franca for inter-tribal communication in much of Afghanistan, and I am willing to believe (without citation) that that is true in Badghis as well; however, that doesn't address the issue of the native languages of the peoples that are actually there. The scholarly documents indicate that the Turkmen people in Badghis speak a Turkmen language, even though they may be functionally bilingual. I understand that the Sunni Aimak speak a variety of Persian as their native language as well. Based on the use of Dari as a lingua franca, I can see keeping the non-English names for the province. --Bejnar (talk) 17:40, 26 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Bejnar you son of a whore, first you claim dirty filthy Pigtu language is spoken by most than you turn your words. I spit in the face of your mother who have bore such a donkey like yourself. Filthy Jewish Pisstun.--188.107.5.219 (talk) 06:47, 13 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

https://afghanag.ucdavis.edu/country-info/province/files/All-Badghis.pdf Pashto is spoken by atleast 40%.. we see bias of Wikipedia yet again. 182.180.61.170 (talk) 07:29, 31 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Pashtuns and Pashto in Badghis

Around 97% of the population of Badghis lives in rural districts while 3% lives in urban areas. Around 51% of the population is male and 49% is female. The most frequently spoken languages are Dari, spoken by 56% of the population and Pashto, spoken by 40% of the population; followed by Uzbeki, spoken by five out of 964 villages, Turkmani by four villages, and Balochi spoken by only one village. ^[1]

According to MRRD (Ministry of Rural Rehabilitation and Development of Afghanistan) Pashto is spoken by 80% of the population. Pashtuns are in majority in some of the districts: 85.6% in Morghab District^[2] and 97% in Ghormach^[3].

Based on that information I will be updating the demographics info of the province. (Ketabtoon (talk) 20:46, 23 July 2009 (UTC))[reply]

Ketabtoon, nowhere it is mentioned that Pashtuns are majority. Your references do not even mention the word Murghab. You hallizunate to much.--94.219.98.69 (talk) 17:51, 25 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ghormach was confirmed, and I just made a mistake with the source for Murghab. I corrected the source for that as well. (Ketabtoon (talk) 02:39, 28 December 2010 (UTC))[reply]

I think wikippedia is extremly biased towards pashtuns.. example is this province of Afghanistan.. where the largest districts are pashtuns.. and pashtuns make the majority.. yet article says otherwise.. Tigerkhan007 (talk) 12:38, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

99 percent of people in Badghis province are speaking farsi (Persian) 2A02:3030:81C:876A:1:0:CD2:68D1 (talk) 12:51, 31 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

References

Hazaras and Aimaks in Badghis

Inuit18 insisted in a 10 August 2009 edit that there were no Hazaras or Aimaks in Baghis Province. In addition to the existing citations in the article, Badghis tribal map on nps which shows the Hazara and "Badghis Executive Summary" Program for Culture and Conflict Studies, Naval Postgraduate School, page 7, which says The Hazara of Badghis reside in the western reaches of the province., there are a number of other sources that say that there were both Hazaras and Aimaks in Baghis Province. For Hazaras, see, for example, Conflict in Afghanistan: a historical encyclopedia‎ page 103, by Frank Clements which says: One such group, the Kala Nai Hazaras, are Sunni Muslims who claim descent from the hordes of Genghis Khan; they settled in Kala Nau, now Badghis Province. For the Aimak presence, see, for example, Dupree, Nancy Hatch and Gouttierre, Thomas E. (1997) "Chapter 2 - The Society and Environment: Social Structure: Other Groups: Aimaq" A Country Study: Afghanistan from The Library of Congress, which says: Aimaq, meaning tribe in Turkish, is not an ethnic domination, but differentiates seminomadic herders and agricultural tribal groups of various ethnic origins, including the Turkic Hazara and Baluch, that were formed in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. They live among nontribal people in the western areas of Badghis, Ghor and Herat provinces. --Bejnar (talk) 20:09, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In general, Aimaks belong to Tajiks. 3 of 4 tribes are of Persian origine. http://www.nps.edu/programs/ccs/Docs/Tribal%20Trees/Tajik.pdf

The Hazaras Badghis are called Moghol, that´s how they call themself. The term Hazara on them is only used by your source. Their numbers took 1975 500 souls. Adding them to the entire ethnical composition, they will make lesser than 0.001% of the population. If you do not have the clue about Afghanistan, the fake ethnical compositions gave by AIM, a Pashtun-centric NGO group, than keep away from articles you are not cognate with.--188.107.8.82 (talk) 11:30, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

--94.219.218.150 (talk) 23:00, 29 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The link you cite no longer exists, but it was to a slide in a power point presentation which indicated that Courage Services Inc. (February 2007) Tribal Hierarchy & Dictionary of Afghanistan: A Reference Aid for Analysts was its source. Please refer to the sources above for the fact that Aimak is not an ethnic denominator. --Bejnar (talk) 17:42, 30 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

http://www.nps.edu/programs/ccs/Docs/Tribal%20Trees/Tajik.pdf

Aimaks mainly Iranic descandt and are of Tajik cluster. Three of four tribes are Iranic, the forth one, is a Turko-Mongolian tribe of the Hazaras of Bamian but are Sunnis in faith, unlike their brothers in central Afghanistan. Their native culture, of all Aimaks is Persian and as such they call themself, except for the Hazaras who prefere to use Aimak. Unlike Kuchi Pashtuns, who are a mix of Baluch, Sindhi, Gypsy, Turko-Mongolian Ghalzais and pashtunized Abdali Mongols/Tibetans and other tribes, the Aimaks are compared to them homogene--188.107.8.82 (talk) 11:26, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Reverted edits by 94.219.198.90

Reverted edits made by IP 94.219.198.90. According to Ministry of Rural Rehabilitation and Development, and UN (UNDSS and UNAMA) "Around 97% of the population of Badghis lives in rural districts while 3% lives in urban areas. Around 51% of the population is male and 49% is female. The most frequently spoken languages are Dari, spoken by 56% of the population and Pashto, spoken by 40% of the population; followed by Uzbeki, spoken by five out of 964 villages, Turkmani by four villages, and Balochi spoken by only one village." [1] Since, Pashto is only spoken by the Pashtuns, this means that Pashtuns make up around 40% of the population. The content is sourced with reliable sources. (Ketabtoon (talk) 01:42, 11 August 2010 (UTC))[reply]

Pashtu is not only spoke by Pashtuns. There are hunded villages that situation near Pashtun´s settlements or are surrounded by Pashtuns. A small minority of Pashtuns are settled and the majority, maybe some 80% are nomads. They also speak Pashtu. Btw, your source is financied by Afghan Mellat, a Pashtun nationalist party, close alike NDAP Nazi Germans--188.107.8.82 (talk) 08:30, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ethnical composition: Tajiks 62%

                     Pashtuns 28%
                     Uzbek 5%
                     Turkmen 3%
                     Baluch 2%

http://www.nps.edu/Programs/CCS/Badghis/Badghis_Executive_Summary.pdf --188.107.8.82 (talk) 11:23, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The source is a government ministry and the information was taken from the United Nations and Central Statistics of Afghanistan. If you do not value the sources, it is your problem. (Ketabtoon (talk) 13:56, 11 August 2010 (UTC))[reply]

Yes, the source above is taken from NPS which is a non-government group. Your source know that non-Pashtuns, specially Tajiks make the majority, thus use the language as it´s tool but fact is, majority of Pashtuns there are Kuchis and the urbanized Pashtuns are very small in number and do not make along the Baluchi, Jatti (gypsy), Ghalzai-Mongols and Abdali Mongol Tibetan tribes the majority. That´s what actually even the source you provided state. In general, we know how the current anti-non-Pashtun government threadt non-Psahtuns. Now, people are dealing with them.--188.107.8.82 (talk) 14:42, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Btw, do not mention Hazaras. Hazaras do not live westward outside of Kunduz and Mazar. If you have no idea than keep away. In no source, not even in that you´ve provide it is stated that Hazaras do live there. That´s your own ethno-fascistic POV, Kussmadarzai. Kiram da kusse nane faishet--188.107.8.82 (talk) 14:43, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Sunni Hazara

According to the Naval Postgraduate School article cited for Badghis "the vast majority of the Hazara are of the Shi’a Muslim faith" and "The Hazara of Badghis reside in the western reaches of the province." This is reinforced by a report on Badghis from 1885 in The American Naturalist which said: "Kustik, in a valley about fourteen miles long and three-fourths of a mile wide, is a Jamshidi town; but twenty miles to the east of it commences the Hazara country, a vast plain stretching toward the north, and eroded into a chaos of steep hillocks and hollows by the Murghab drainage. Kala-nau, the chief town of the Hazaras, is a prosperous one." Frank Clements in his book Conflict in Afghanistan: a historical encyclopedia,‎ page 103, says: One such group, the Kala Nai Hazaras, are Sunni Muslims who claim descent from the hordes of Genghis Khan; they settled in Kala Nau, now Badghis Province. Kala Nau being Qala e Naw. That Wikipedia article says "Its population was estimated at 9,000 in 2006, of which mostly Sunni Hazaras. Other significant communities include Tajiks, Pashtuns, Balochs, and Uzbeks." Unfortunately, the cited source does not support any of that. The Sunni statement was added by Abdulhy in February 2023 without citation. The first mention of Sunnis in the Badghis article was by IP editor 203.171.96.142 on 30 January 2024 without citation. This is partially supported by a report on the Hazara by the Minority Rights Group which says: "There are significant Sunni Hazara communities in the provinces of Badghis, Ghur, Kunduz, Baghlan, Panjshir and other areas in the northeast of Afghanistan." But that report also says: "Hazaras speak a dialect of Dari (Farsi dialect) called Hazaragi and the majority of them follow the Shi’a (Twelver Imami) school of Islam." Unfortunately the district reports currently cited in the Badghis article do not list any percentages for the Hazara, even in the western districts of Qali-i-Naw and Ab Kamari where presumable most of the Hazara are located. The Ethnolinguistic map of Afghanistan (here) does not show any Hazara in Badghis Province, but in addition to the large area in central Afghanistan, shows some scattered groups in southern Afghanistan, especially in the southwest in Nimruz Province. This lack of identification of Sunni Hazara in Badghis Province is explained by Niamatullah Ibrahimi in his Nations and Nationalism journal article The state, identity politics and ethnic boundaries in Afghanistan: The case of Sunni Hazaras, where he says: "Historically, significant communities in the provinces of Badghis, Parwan and Panjshir were identified as Sunni Hazaras with shared myths of common ancestry and cultural and folkloric traditions with the Shi'a Hazaras." He goes on to say: "Consequently, the Sunni Hazaras played down or actively concealed their ethnic identity in order to evade the risks of the social and political association with the historical marginalisation and persecution of the Shi'a Hazaras. Instead, as Sunni Muslims and Farsi speaking communities, they tended to identify with local identity categories such as clans or places of origin or with their neighbouring Tajik communities who are also predominantly followers of Sunni Islam and speak Dari." So these Hazara are likely part of the so-called Tajik populations listed for those districts. Thus it appears appropriate to leave in the Sunni references currently in this and the Qala e Naw articles, pending better sources. --Bejnar (talk) 02:32, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] ttp://www.mrrd.gov.af/nabdp/Provincial%20Profiles/Badghis%20PDP%20Provincial%20profile.pdf

[2] ttp://www.aims.org.af/afg/dist_profiles/unhcr_district_profiles/western/badghis/murghab/D_Murghab.pdf

[3] ttp://www.mrrd.gov.af/nabdp/DDP/Badghis/Ghurmac%20DDP%20Summary.pdf

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