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I have made some initial edits to try and reduce the advertising nature of this page. Lots to do. DPWiki01 (talk) 22:35, 30 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Question regarding ref searches

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@David notMD and AttackHelicopter51: First, thanks for helping to clean-up the article. Second, did either one of you find any additional SIGCOV during your clean-up efforts? Because when I was starting to do searches earlier I didn't find anything except the one mix online reference already in the article. Unless one of you saw more I'm thinking there's no reason not to send this to AFD as an WP:NCORP fail. Spectrum {{UV}} 2604:2000:8FC0:4:68BA:3B32:8613:8B6D (talk) 21:30, 18 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I couldn't find any. Upon a search of the company, the 20~ results seem to all be social media accounts from the company and the company's website, which you can pay to have your results popup. I agree with an AFD - AH (talk) 22:03, 18 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Not my field and I did not search. David notMD (talk) 03:54, 19 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the input, if I can't find anything when I get a bit of time for a BEFORE here I intend to nom it. Spectrum {{UV}} 2604:2000:8FC0:4:68BA:3B32:8613:8B6D (talk) 16:27, 20 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Apogee Studios

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The new editor asked a question at my talk page which relates to the editing of this article so I am responding here.

First, a general comment. Some days, I feel like we mislead people when we say that Wikipedia is the encyclopedia “that anyone can edit.” Well technically true, the aphorism leaves the impression that editing is easy and that's not always the case.

Whenever we add a statement to a Wikipedia article we want to make sure that it is true, and sometimes it is tempting to use the words of the source to make sure that the claim accurately reflects the truth as written by the source. However, that runs afoul of copyright considerations, so the editor has the challenge of writing something in their own words but still making sure that it doesn’t become inaccurate.

I understand you want to include something in the article about Apogee Electronics regarding a studio.

The first question I'm struggling with regards the ownership.

Your proposed sentence: 

Apogee Studios is a recording studio in Santa Monica, CA, owned by Bob Clearmountain. It is located at the headquarter of Apogee Electronics. The performance venue is also home to KCRW's Apogee Sessions.

states that the studio is owned by Bob Clearmountain. If so, what is the relationship between the studio and apogee Electronics? is it simply that the studio is physically located in the same building? It is not uncommon for an organization to own a building and sublease some of its space to unrelated tenants. if the organization is notable and there's a Wikipedia article about the organization it doesn't automatically follow that the article would discuss each of these tenants. My guess is that there is a relationship stronger than simply a landlord / tenant relationship, but I can't tell from the sources, other than the observation that the owner of the studio there is also an advisor to the subject of this article.

An additional problem is that while Forbes Magazine is generally high-quality secondary source, they also have a concept of contributors. They host material written by others, and do not take editorial control over it. Such material has the status of an opinion column not a fact-checked news article. That means there are serious questions about the Second Source cited. See this RSN discussion for more information.

I'm not comfortable agreeing that the sentence is appropriate for the article at this time but this discussion is exactly the way such issues are resolved.--S Philbrick(Talk) 11:02, 20 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your explanations, Sphilbrick!
I found some more information and would like to get your opinion regarding adding Apogee Studio and Philantrophy / Environment sections to their page. Are these secondary sources suitable?
Apogee Studio
Apogee Studio is a recording studio in Santa Monica, adjacent to Apogee Electronics’ headquarters and is owned by Apogee Electronics and legendary producer, mixer Bob Clearmountain. KCRW hosts shows in this venue, called KCRW Apogee Sessions.
https://www.kcrw.com/music/apogeestudio
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Clearmountain
http://www.aes.org/events/147/presenters/?ID=9016 - Bob and his wife, Betty Bennett (owner & CEO of Apogee Electronics) currently host radio shows for local Santa Monica radio station KCRW at their Apogee Studio that resides in the Apogee building in Santa Monica.
https://www.lamag.com/culturefiles/photos-belle-sebastian-kick-off-kcrws-apogee-sessions/
https://www.waves.com/events/august-2019-waves-apogee-studio-live
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsMRebgsifVthxlzXN4Z5iqmyFg9ebLYC
https://dexterstory.wordpress.com/2014/02/20/march-18-2014-kcrws-apogee-sessions-presents-kelis-live-apogee-studio-santa-monica-ca/
Philanthropy / Environment
Apogee Electronics supports non-profit organizations: Corazon de Vida, Care.
https://www.corazondevida.org/partners
https://www.care.org/sites/default/files/documents/09_CARE_USA_Annual_Report.pdf
Apogee Electronics is a Santa Monica certified Green Business.
http://gbc.boldarray.net/directory/apogee-electronics-corporation
Apogee Electronics won the Sustainable Quality Award
https://sqa.secure-platform.com/a/page/award_winners/a
Apogee Electronics is a corporate partner of UCLA Institute of Environment and Sustainability
https://www.ioes.ucla.edu/cpp/
I would appreciate your input. FridaAlpin (talk) 19:33, 20 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@FridaAlpin: In general, youtube is not an appropriate source for Wikipedia articles, see WP:RSPYT, likewise with WP:BLOGS, and other Wikipedia articles. The waves link is essentially a sponsored add, and also no good. And while there is some room for WP:ABOUTSELF, the content can not be unduly self-serving. It would be best if you had reliable independant secondary sources for references. Relatedly, be advised that I have nominated this article for deletion precisely because I was not able to find multiple sources of that variety providing significant coverage, without which a neutral and verifiable article cannot be written. You are welcome to improve the article while the discussion is ongoing, and if you can provide at least three reliable independent secondary sources providing SIGCOV I am happy to withdraw the nomination. Spectrum {{UV}} 2604:2000:8FC0:4:68BA:3B32:8613:8B6D (talk) 23:38, 20 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I understand now that youtube is not appropriate. But how about all the other sources I provided to the above topics (see links above) - such as wikipedia, KCRW, UCLA ...

For general information about Apogee, the company - I am going to add the following source: https://www.mixonline.com/recording/apogee-electronics-20-365560 and hope this considered an appropriate source. Please let me know. Thanks!FridaAlpin (talk) 07:25, 22 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@FridaAlpin: Wikipedia is not a reliable source by our own standards and cannot be used, see WP:CIRC and WP:UGC. The KRCW article is clearly promotional, though that does not mean it is entirely unusable. The issue is that while both it and the lamag make it clear that Bob Clearmountain is the owner, neither details the specifics of the business organizational relationship between the two entities. From WP:RS Sources should directly support the information as it is presented in the Wikipedia article, it would be best if you had an independent reliable secondary source that detailed it directly. If you are unsure if a source is reliable or not, the place to ask is WP:RSN, thank you. Spectrum {{UV}} 2604:2000:8FC0:4:68BA:3B32:8613:8B6D (talk) 23:03, 22 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I added several references and would appreciate if someone could review. Thanks in advance. FridaAlpin (talk) 17:44, 26 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

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You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 15:07, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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