Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Equine/Horse training

Sarah Weston?

You might want to look at her book No Fear, No Force. Although she's local, I haven't personally had any dealings with her, some people swear by her, others don't. Might make a good reference book. (ThatPeskyCommoner (talk) 10:00, 12 February 2011 (UTC))

LOL! We just tagged her article for deletion as "not-notable." She appears to be simply a disciple of one of the "horse whisperer" guys, I think Monty Roberts, and so not much new there, just the usual "natural horsemanship" stuff. (We can take further chat on this over to my talk page, FYI) Montanabw^(talk) 00:49, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

Paul Williamson

A suggestion was received from a very interested reader of the WikiProject Equine pages regarding Paul Williamson. She wrote: "There is no page in Wikipedia for an unusual Australian horse trainer, who is currently working at a race horse training facility in Japan, and also giving clinics in Australia and the U.S. His name is Paul Williamson and his webpage is http://www.hybrid-horseman.com. The most famous of his techniques, which he says he discovered, is a means of calming a horse and causing it to lie down, (the "Tap",) by turning its head with a full-mouthed snaffle bridle, such that the horse becomes oddly calm, progresses through a stage of weakness and instability in its front front legs, and finally cannot stand, so that it falls down or lies down. Mr. Williamson has an extensive repertoire of youtube videos of his various techniques, under the youtube name "endospink". This name is derived from an early name for the Tap, which was originally called the "Endorphin Tap", which led to "Endo" as a nickname. At that time he was also known for his habit of wearing pink riding breeches - hence Endo's Pink, and "endospink". (There is a silly but insightful sense of humour in much of his communication with people, but with horses, he is calm, reassuring, and very deft.) I cannot be sure whether Rarey used the technique of turning the horse's head to calm it, or just made the horse fall down, but in Williamson's technique the horse is receptive to bonding and calmed, and remains in that state when it gets up, so that Paul can often ride young and unstarted race horses within a very few minutes. A related technique is the "Half-Tap", where the horse is made calm and quiet, but remains on its feet. In his book on colt-starting, called "Cool Change," Paul references Billy Linfoot in the introduction, which was what led me to look up the literature on Dr. Linfoot. Mr. Williamson treats horses in a friendly and gentle way, but does a lot of work with problem horses, where his athletic skills are displayed. However, his methods are usable by anyone who is reasonably able-bodied. I recommend that he be included in WikiProject Equine."

(I am a life-long horse trainer, mostly self-taught, and informed by reading from books rather than learning from coaches -- I could never afford the money to take professional training, but I like how my horses turn out, and I seem to be able to avoid getting hurt. I am also a professional psychologist. I find the horse training, and the psychology of people and horses to be an enjoyable combination. I look forward to keeping up with WikiProject Equine. Regards to all. Janice Vian, Ph.D. (talk) 03:16, 10 April 2012 (UTC) Updated Sept 10, 2012)

I suggest a review of WP:BLP for how to write up an article on a living person, and then give it a shot. Create a sandbox in your user space to work on a draft and then give us a holler when you think it's ready to go "live." Montanabw^(talk) 16:59, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

Same comments as before. Any sources at all? As far as I can see, this guy is just another "horse whisperer" type, but can you demonstrate WP:NOTABILITY? Montanabw^(talk) 21:23, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

John O'Leary

Mr. O'Leary is an Australian trainer and specialist in horse-related problems -- in fact he calls himself "Mr. Horse Problems" on his website http://www.horseproblems.com.au. He partners with his wife, dressage trainer Linda O'Leary in presenting a comprehensive package of videos and merchandise. He is very well known and respected in Australia. His approach is rather more vigorous than North American Natural Horsemanship, -- he is considerate of the horses, but rather hard on humans, especially those he considers to be abusive or dangerously naïve. Janice Vian, Ph.D. (talk) 00:56, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

Ditto what I've said elsewhere. What do you have for third party reliable source material? I must say his web site does not impress me, amateurish, misspellings, incoherent ramblings. But if he gets national coverage, that would be different. Montanabw^(talk) 04:17, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

Suggestions

I would suggest that he and Paul Williamson be included in the lists on the main page of this article. I am also amazed that Robert M. Miller is not listed there. Janice Vian, Ph.D. (talk) 00:56, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

Miller is a vet, not a trainer. He writes about horse training and while he does do some demonstration work, he's primarily a scientist and behaviorist. And Robert M. Miller has an article. This wiki project task force is sort of a discussion place for articles, not a reference anyway. Montanabw^(talk) 04:12, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

I guess as far as Paul Williamson goes, what are the neutral third-party sources that could be user for a biography? How, in other words, would you get past the criteria of WP:NOTABILITY and reliable sources? Montanabw^(talk) 04:12, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

RfC on the use of flag icons for sportspeople

An RfC discussion about the MOS:FLAG restriction on the use of flag icons for sportspeople has been opened at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Icons. We invite all interested participants to provide their opinion here. Qwyrxian (talk) 02:54, 24 December 2012 (UTC)