Help desk
< June 2	<< May \| June \| Jul >>	June 4 >

Welcome to the WikiProject Articles for creation Help Desk Archives
The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current Help Desk pages.

June 3

17:15:48, 3 June 2017 review of submission by TooTallSid

TooTallSid (talk · contribs)
- Draft:Dosho Port (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Please help me. I am stumped about why Dosho Port lacks notability. I reviewed the suggested pages Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources and Wikipedia:Notability (people).

People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published[4] secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other,[5] and independent of the subject.[6]
— Attribution, Wikipedia:Notability (people)

The person has received a well-known and significant award or honor, or has been nominated for such an award several times. The person has made a widely recognized contribution that is part of the enduring historical record in his or her specific field.
— Attribution, Wikipedia:Notability (people)

The verifiable, reliable, independent secondary sources in this article:

Martin, Andrea. "Ceaseless Effort The Life of Dainin Katagiri" (PDF). Minnesota Zen Mediation Center. mnzencenter.org.
McDaniel, Richard Bryan (2015). Cypress trees in the garden : the second generation of Zen teaching in North America. Sumeru Press. ISBN 9781896559261.
Ford, James Ishmael (2006). ZEN MASTER WHO?: A Guide to the People and Stories of Zen. Wisdom Publications. ISBN 9780861715091.
"Sanbo Kyodan: Harada-Yasutani School of Zen Buddhism and its Teachers". ciolek.com. Retrieved 2 April 2017.
Ford, James. "Monkey Mind - Easily Distracted". Patheos.
"Official Website of the City of Minneapolis".

Dosho Port has received a well-known and significant award or honor in the form of dharma transmission from two notable Zen masters in the United States.

From a real world standpoint, I made these comments about Dosho Port's notability on the talk page for this article.

In Zen, lineage is very important. The Zen concept of dharma transmission is the final, official certification by a Zen teacher that a Zen student is 100% able to continue the teacher's instruction. Lineage is like getting an Eagle scout in the B.S.A. - one has to jump through many hoops and demonstrate competence. Dosho can trace his lineage back to the historical Buddha. More importantly, he can trace his lineage back to some of the more important Zen masters in the U.S.
Dosho is mature (in his 60's). He has worked with many people in the current Zen tradition.
Dosho has innovated in developing a way to support Zen students who do not have easy access to a teachers. Currently 30 students pay $1,200 year to work with him.
Dosho (and his wife, Tetsugan Zummach) are the new priests at the Nebraska Zen Center, one of the oldest Zen centers in the U.S. (40 years)
Dosho is part of the "new age" in American Zen that combines the teachings of the two main schools of Zen, Soto and Rinzai. This is an exciting approach to Zen that is strongest in the U.S.
Dosho has demonstrated the value of his Zen practice in his work with violent youth in the Minneapolis public school system.

Dharma transmission is particularly important and the impetus for creating this page. Lineage and dharma inheritance seem to be unique to Buddhism. They allow the teachings to be traced back even to the historical Buddha, 2500 years ago. It is somewhat like Emmanuel Ax being able to trace his teachers back to Franz Liszt, except even stronger.

Comments?

Hi TooTallSid. Let's examine the premise that the draft cites six reliable, independent, secondary sources:

In what way do you feel Martin fits Wikipedia's description of a reliable source? Is Martin an academic, journalist, or professional writer? They write, "This essay ... is simply the result of my personal quest to learn about my teacher's life and preserve what I found in narrative form. It was written to honor Katagiri Roshi." Is the publisher a university press, academic publisher, or respected mainstream publisher? Does either the author or the publisher have a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy? The book contains only three sentences about Port, which does not constitute a substantial depth of coverage. Also, Port is listed in its bibliography, which calls into question its independence from Port.
McDaniel is another unknown author writing for a very small publisher. It is held by only four WorldCat libraries. This might be because it is a relatively new book, or because it's on a niche topic. It also might indicate that libraries don't consider it a good source. Whatever its quality, the total content attributed to it is "Port has had a rich life in Zen", which suggests that it does not have a substantial depth of coverage of him. The book is based on interviews. If the material on Port came from an interview with Port, then whether it's independent depends on whether McDaniel has provided substantial analysis of his own, or whether it's just Port talking about Port.
ZEN MASTER WHO? is the most promising source. It's from a well known publisher, and is widely held by research libraries. However, the total content attributed to it is a sentence and a half, which again raises concerns about its depth of detail on the subject.
Ciolek has a mere three sentences about Port.
Monkey Mind is a blog, not a reliable source, and should not be used as a reference.
The City of Minneapolis source lists Port as one of 50 individuals to receive an award from the police department in 2010. This does not constitute significant coverage.

Some of these are reliable, independent, secondary sources, but even in aggregate they do not contain significant coverage of Port.

Perhaps you can find more and better sources, or provide more information to assuage concerns about some of the sources above (by mining the sources for more content, or through the citation template's quote parameter, for example). You may be able to get assistance from Wikipedia:WikiProject Buddhism. You've read the relevant policies and guidelines. To gain a deeper understanding of how they're applied, you may find it useful to participate at WP:RSN and/or WP:AfD for a while. --Worldbruce (talk) 05:05, 4 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]