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May 24

Which Versus That

I see all these rules about when to use "which" and when to use "that"[1][2], but doesn't FDR's "A Date Which Will Live in Infamy" violate these so called rules? Who's right here, the English teachers or FDR? Scala Cats (talk) 03:24, 24 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You (and FDR) are quite right: there is indeed a fairly rigid rule that you can't use that in a non-restrictive relative clause, but the inverse rule promoted by some American grammar teachers, that you shouldn't use which in a restrictive relative, is a bogus rule invented by prescriptivists, and has never been observed in the living language. The LanguageLog blog used to have some rather entertaining polemic articles about this issue; I might find some links for you later. Fut.Perf. ☼ 05:04, 24 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Here's some: [3], [4][5] (with further links). Fut.Perf. ☼ 06:27, 24 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

And here's a previous ref-desk thread that may be of interest. Deor (talk) 14:10, 24 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

See English relative clauses#That or which for non-human antecedents. Loraof (talk) 15:18, 24 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I obviously have a few non-human antecedents. Just saying. :) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 05:50, 25 May 2017 (UTC) [reply]

You have a non-human aunt to cede us ? StuRat (talk) 14:35, 25 May 2017 (UTC) [reply]

Yes, I've been a monkey's uncle for quite some time, after my dotty fairy godmother appeared unexpectedly one day and granted my rhetorical wish in a fit of inattention. I also became a monkey's nephew. It's quite nice, apart from being told by Uncle Bob and Aunt Mary, whenever I see them, how big and tall I've grown and, confusingly, being asked what I want to be when I grow up. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 20:17, 25 May 2017 (UTC) [reply]

The right answer, apparently, would be "Seven feet!" (Or the metric equivalent) ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 01:44, 26 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

My chosen response to that question was "a murderess", although that has not come to be. μηδείς (talk) 22:16, 26 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't do it/But if I'd done it/How could you tell me that I was wrong? --Trovatore (talk) 00:59, 27 May 2017 (UTC) [reply]