Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2024 October 31

Welcome to the Wikipedia Help Desk Archives
The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current Help Desk pages.

October 31

Compliance with MOS:FOREIGNQUOTE

'When editors themselves translate text into English, care must always be taken to include the original text, in italics'. Is there any way to do it that isn't an eyesore? The only ways I have seen this done is just wholly providing the original language text following the original in the body, which is a massive waste of text. I guess you could use footnotes. But I think those are both eyesores, especially when it's on a page that has a decent amount of quotes. Is there any better way to do this? What is the recommended way? PARAKANYAA (talk) 00:06, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@PARAKANYAA The recommended way is at MOS:FOREIGNQUOTE. I don't see why this would be an "eyesore". We might be able to provide better advice if you could please link to the article in question. Shantavira|^{feed me} 11:07, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Shantavira It's an eyesore because having to duplicate the full text again in the body of the article after every quote is too much. Effectively the only tolerable option is to include no quotes.

It's not one page, it's just generally. PARAKANYAA (talk) 11:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@PARAKANYAA. Quotes in articles should be few and short. Please provide an example of the supposed problem. Shantavira|^{feed me} 14:12, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

For example, book articles or other media. Articles for media reviews tend to use a lot of quotes from reviews in reception sections. PARAKANYAA (talk) 21:36, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

PARAKANYAA, you could just include the translation as an explanatory note, which resolves in a different section at the bottom of the page than regular footnotes, and so do not interrupt the flow. If there are already a lot of explanatory notes, you could separate them off into their own section by using the group attribute of template {{efn}}. Mathglot (talk) 03:13, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

The cleanest solution might be to summarise or paraphrase the quote so the original language quote can be excluded. If this is not possible or desirable, since quotes must always be cited anyway, the original language quote could be included in the |quote= parameter of the citation template. Folly Mox (talk) 20:56, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Help with archiving Talk Page

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Aesthetic_Realism Can someone please help me create Archive 14 for this Talk Page? I thought it was supposed to auto-archive after 14 days of inactivity when more than 4 threads were present but that is obviously not working because the thread at the top is from 2019. When I tried to manually archive it, a message came up stating "This page is on the title blacklist, so only administrators, template editors, and page movers can create it."

Can you please archive the current Talk Page as Archive 14, or alternatively, direct me on a way I can do it using an automated script? Thank you. Lore E. Mariano (talk) 01:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@LoreMariano the bot is configured to only archive discussions on that page when there are more than 4 sections present. You could change that in the source code, or manually archive using tools like one click archive. '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 01:39, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@LoreMariano: Talk:Aesthetic Realism only has 4 threads. As you said, it's supposed to auto-archive when there are more than 4. Talk:Aesthetic Realism/Archive 14 is not on the title blacklist. Is that the page you tried to create? Do you get the quoted message when you click that link? PrimeHunter (talk) 02:09, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Probably you tried to create Talk:Aesthetic Realism\Archive 14 (wrong kind of slash), which is on the title blacklist. It should show an error message about that, but the infra in this area has a few holes. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 02:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that's the page I tried to create--maybe I had the syntax wrong. I just tried again, using your Talk:Aesthetic Realism/Archive 14 link, and it's working now.

I had tried copying and pasting "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Aesthetic_Realism/Archive_13" and changed the 13 to a 14, and that's when I got the message. But your Talk link worked, so thank you! Lore E. Mariano (talk) 02:18, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

It's almost perfect now except that Archive 14 isn't showing in the Talk page Archive Index list. Does it get automatically populated? I couldn't see how to include it as a link in the Index. Lore E. Mariano (talk) 02:33, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@LoreMariano: You haven't created Talk:Aesthetic Realism/Archive 14. Special:Contributions/LoreMariano doesn't show any recent page creation. PrimeHunter (talk) 02:45, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

No idea what I did wrong last night. But it's there now--I just re-did it and the Index is now showing Archive 14. Thank you for your help. Lore E. Mariano (talk) 20:02, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Visual editor and 2017 wikitext editor side by side? / Show preview?

Hi! I've (finally) been trying the visual editor, and have also enabled the 2017 wikitext editor. One thing I noticed is that when using the 2017 wikitext editor, a live preview doesn't appear next to it like it did before I enabled the visual editor, even though I have "show preview without reloading the page" enabled in my preferences.

Is this option incompatible with the visual editor? Is there any option to show the 2017 wikitext editor and the visual editor side by side, which would serve the same purpose as a live preview?

Also, I'm wondering what "show preview when starting to edit" and "show preview before edit box" mean, as I don't see any differences whether I enable or disable these preferences?

Thanks from an irregularly active user :) Helpful Cat (talk) 01:44, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Helpful Cat Slightly off-topic, since you ask about the 2017 wikitext editor, which means using wikitext mode inside the visual editor, I would recommend just using the standard source editor. That has a "Preview" toggle to the right of the menu bar and on any device with a reasonably wide viewing screen like a PC works fine: the preview part can be scrolled independently of the editing area. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:59, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Michael D. Turnbull Thanks so much, switching back to the 2010 wikitext editor for source editing works, and the preview pane is back again. Thank you! Helpful Cat (talk) 03:13, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Please help me

I wanted to add an addition to a harmless article about a Dutch ambidextrous artist in the English section of Wikipedia, when trying to save it, the following warning came out: You've exceeded your rate limit. Please wait some time and try again. At the same time, I have not ruled anything at all up to this point. I made several attempts to save, but no, it failed. Maybe who knows what it is? I've been writing on the Russian-language Wikipedia for 4 years, but I've never seen this. Please help me. Thanks! Znatokgoroda77 (talk) 07:41, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hey Znatokgoroda77, until you are autoconfirmed, which is 4 days and 10 edits here (I understand it's 15 on ruwiki?) there is an IP-based rate limit, which you may have run into if you're using a shared IP and there are other people editing from it. You have probably never run into it because you would have been autoconfirmed on ruwiki for a few years now. Alpha3031 (t • c) 08:58, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hey Alpha3031! Thanks for the answer! There are 20 edits and two weeks of experience in the Russian-language section, as you said correctly. It's difficult to make 10 edits here. I have been trying to send you an answer for more than 10 hours now, but this strange limit does not allow me to do this. Thanks again for your reply. With best wishes, Znatokgoroda77 (talk) 18:22, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

I am trying to add this page to Wikipedia but getting an error

I am trying to add this page to Wikipedia but getting an error and I think it is an error, Saifurrahman is a beacon of creativity and innovation in the graphic design industry and has received many rewards and soon receive the Padma award. I think this information should be included in Wikipedia. Could you help me to resolve this issue?

I am recieving following message

"Welcome to Wikipedia!

Your edit has triggered an automated filter and has been disallowed. It looks like you're trying to add an email address to this page. Doing that, especially with a personal email address, is usually a bad idea as it can attract large amounts of spam. Though there are a few legitimate reasons to include an email address, in most cases Wikipedia will remove email addresses that are added to articles or discussion pages.

If you want to communicate with a particular user via email, Wikipedia has a built-in email function you can use. If you would like to request general assistance, the fastest way is usually to post a question at the Help Desk. Wikipedia also provides a guide to asking for help — including via email — if you feel that is necessary.

If you are attempting to add a link to a Mastodon account, and this filter is preventing you from doing so, please do not file a false positive report. Instead, please follow the instructions at Template:Mastodon user to add a link to the account. If you are experiencing trouble using the template, please visit the Teahouse for assistance in doing so. If you believe you received this message in error, you may report it here." Saifurrahmanprof (talk) 09:43, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

You need to remove the email address from your text in order for you to be able to submit it. 331dot (talk) 09:48, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Saifurrahmanprof: Remove the email address as said, and also all the phone numbers. Wikipedia articles do not give contact information. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:19, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Saifurrahmanprof: I looked at the rest of your attempted text. It's extremely promotional with no sources and totally inappropriate for Wikipedia. It has no chance of being accepted. I suggest you just drop the whole thing. See Wikipedia:Autobiography. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:30, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Saifurrahmanprof: This sentence: "Saifurrahman is a beacon of creativity and innovation in the graphic design industry" is a big red flag indicating you're not the right person to write the article. Please see WP:What Wikipedia is not, especially the WP:PROMOTION part. You need to familiarize yourself with Wikipedia key policies WP:CONPOL as well, most important of them right now IMHO are WP:Neutral point of view and WP:Verifiability. Also, as other said above, WP:AUTOBIO and also MOS:PUFFERY (the last one strictly related to another policy on WP:Neutral point of view). Additionally, as you are clearly a living person, your biography must comply with WP:BLP, whether it's you or anybody else who will eventually write it. --CiaPan (talk) 12:54, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Add/Update a Corporate Logo

The company that I work for has rebranded with a new logo. I would like to update the Wiki listing so that it is current and correct, but as an employee I am barred from making any changes to the listing. Can someone look at www.rjleegroup.com to see that the logo is new and update the wiki listing? Dtel77 (talk) 14:35, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

(another conflict of interest, please.) So long as this isn't non-free, promotional or leaning towards paid edits, you may upload that logo on Wikimedia Commons. 2601AC47 (talk) 14:40, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Logos are rarely appropriate for Commons, as by uploading a logo to Commons you are making it available for anyone to use for any purpose with attribution(like competitors). You should upload it to this Wikipedia locally as a "fair use" image, see WP:UPIMAGE. 331dot (talk) 14:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Dtel77 You will need to make the Terms of Use-require paid editing disclosure. 331dot (talk) 14:49, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dtel77 The existing logo is the file File:RJLG 2 Color Logo no tagline 031711.png which is uploaded here on English Wikipedia as WP:NONFREE, with an interesting comment (see file page) that the combination of text and simple geometric shape would make it public domain in the U.S. However, it is tagged as not being suitable for Commons because of the doubt about whether it is non-free in its home country, which is odd given that RJ Lee Group is clearly American. Your new logo seems to have the same issues, so I suggest you also upload it only to English Wikipedia. Once incorporated in the article (which I'll do if you WP:PING me to its Talk Page after you've uploaded the file), the old logo will be automatically deleted by a bot. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:57, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dtel77: That isn't a PD-logo. The design that precedes the text doesn't consist of "simple geometric shapes" but rather complex curves that cannot be reconstructed using simple geometric shapes. It should be non-free fair use, at lower resolution. I have made the corrections. ~Anachronist (talk) 15:54, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

User:Dtel77 has been blocked as an obvious sockpuppet of the blocked spamusername account User:RJ Lee Group. --Orange Mike | Talk 20:04, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

I think you got the sockpuppetry relationship backward. User:RJ Lee Group was created a week ago, and User:Dtel77 was created a year ago. ~Anachronist (talk) 20:13, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Serbia's gdp for October 2024 is still not updated!

I want to make change. Dzon Dzouns (talk) 15:36, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

October isn't even over yet, so how can we already have an accurate GDP figure for it? I suspect such figures are only calculated by (competent and/or official) economists weeks to months after the end of the month in question, but I may be mistaken. What is your Reliable source for the figure you want to change, and exactly where in which article(s) do you want to change it? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.6.86.81 (talk) 15:46, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

If that's so, be bold and edit such subject's article. 2601AC47 (talk) 15:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

On further investigation, I find that the article helpfully linked by 2601AC47 has a figure for 2024 sourced to an official (National Bank of Serbia) monthly report dated October (so it's a figure for 2024 up to October, not for October 2024), that was added by Gmiletic on 26 October, 5 days before Dzon Dzouns's request. If this is not the article you meant, Dzon Dzouns, which is it? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.6.86.81 (talk) 16:09, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

metadata hunt

Hello! I am a big fan of Wikipedia (occasional donor and minor editor). I have a curiosity/research-related question, and I need help finding either the answer or a tool to process metadata from Wikipedia for the answer. My question: How many references (i.e. links to unique source materials) does each and every Wikipedia article have?

So all I need, really, is a list of all article titles and the number of referenced sources in each. If the list could possibly be broken into groups (persons, events, technology, concepts, creative productions, or any pre-existing categorization of articles you may use), this would be even more helpful for my statistical purposes, but it's not strictly necessary.

Hollyfeld (talk) 18:43, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

By that, do you mean every reference counted in all 6 million or so articles that have them? In that case, the math is complicated, but you're welcome to try (and help out while at it). 2601AC47 (talk) 19:13, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hollyfield, to get you started, the Page History xtool reports both "References" and "Unique references" for an article, under the "Prose:" subheading. For the categorisation stretch goal, article categories are listed at the bottom of every page; if you're ingesting html, this should be easy to find. Additionally, a machine learning model operated by the Wikimedia Foundation assigns an articletopic to each article, but I'm not certain how to surface this value.

As it happens, some recent database queries were run to investigate a similar topic, discussed at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation/Archive 58 § Random article sample sizes, with data at User:BilledMammal/Average articles.

I suspect that polling the entire population of 6,906,684 articles may be sample size overkill. If you do end up running any queries yourself, please rate limit your requests rather than pounding the server till your IP is blocked.

You may also have some success requesting a database query. It's additionally possible Wikidata has some high level information on this, but I would have no idea where to begin looking for it. Folly Mox (talk) 21:17, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

And to answer the question with something of a generality, the middle two quartiles of random articles sampled in the research I mentioned above cite 2–9 sources, and the median is 4. Folly Mox (talk) 21:20, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Search box typos

When doing a search on the term Rusķ,I find a typo in the Rusk, Texas entry, sear for seat. Where do you go to edit? DMc75771 (talk) 18:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Be bold and edit it... But anyway,  Already done myself. 2601AC47 (talk) 19:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello everyone.

I'd like to speak to a admin who is in charge of looking at drafts for article creation. Size5football (talk) 23:02, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

There is no admin for reviewing drafts, reviewers are volunteers who have received reviewing right. Which particular draft do you have concern about? Tutwakhamoe (talk) 23:07, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Loves Farm Size5football (talk) 23:08, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

then i'd like to speak to a reviewer Size5football (talk) 23:08, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

I am a reviewer. Which draft do you have question about? Tutwakhamoe (talk) 23:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Tutwakhamoe They seem to be talking about Draft:Loves Farm. win8x (talking | spying) 23:12, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

yes thats my draft Size5football (talk) 23:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

i made that Size5football (talk) 23:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

The draft is not currently submitted for review. Are you requesting a review? If so, you'll need to click on the blue "submit the draft for review" button on the top of the draft. After you did that, the draft will be in a queue line, as there are quite a number of drafts waiting for review at the moment. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 23:17, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

i've submitted it @Tutwakhamoe Size5football (talk) 23:25, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Oh, didn't see that. Thanks for the reminder. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 23:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

its fine Size5football (talk) 23:15, 31 October 2024 (UTC)