User talk:Shantiwong

Your submission at Articles for creation: sandbox (June 21)

Your recent article submission has been rejected. If you have further questions, you can ask at the Articles for creation help desk or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help. The reason left by Theroadislong was: This submission is contrary to the purpose of Wikipedia.

Theroadislong (talk) 09:29, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

Hello, Shantiwong! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Theroadislong (talk) 09:29, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Thomas Wardle (pacifist) has been accepted

Thomas Wardle (pacifist), which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

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DGG ( talk ) 19:49, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Cornelis Bijvoet has a new comment

I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Cornelis Bijvoet. Thanks! Turnagra (talk) 22:26, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you Turnagra. The role of Bijvoet with the MS Oranje is so inter-twined, I can see how it might be difficult to determine how important his role was. It is also made difficult in that I have hard copies of many of the sources but they are not available online. Anyway, here goes:

Source 1. Bijvoet supervised the building of the Oranje's engines and as the article mentions, in her launch trials she achieved speeds that were faster than any other motor ship in the world. My first choice for a reference is reference no. 20, the post-war letter from Gebroder Sulzer (Sulzer Bros), the Swiss engineering firm that built the engines. Sulzers offer him a plaque on the Oranje that recognised his valuable contribution to and collaboration on the building of this record-breaking vessel. Regarding this aspect, I would also add Reference no. 4, from the Dutch Courier which also mentions recognition of his role, being invited by the Queen of the Netherlands to attend the launch of the Oranje, as a member of the party of Crown-Princess Juliana and Prince Bernhard. And the Scheepvaart Museum (National Maritime Museum) has accepted the donation of Bijvoet's logbooks (while Chief Engineer of the Oranje during the war) as part of its collection. This is mentioned in the article but I could include an excerpt from the correspondence with the Museum.

Source 2. In Grund, Wim (2001), Oranje, een koninklijk schip (Oranje, a royal ship), he is mentioned at least 14 times as Chief Engineer. Reference no. 19, (p 159 in this source), refers to his post-war role in overseeing the conversion of three troop ships to immigrant ships, taking the great waves of Dutch emigrants to Canada, which leads to...

...Source 3. He was awarded the Order of Oranje-Nassau as an Officer (reference number 22, Kanselarij der Nederlandse Orden, Chancery of Dutch Royal Orders) for the great merits of the conversion of these ships 'into such excellent emigrant ships that foreign trade journals wrote about them.' (This is from a personal document, not cited but I could add this to the list of references). The Chancery website states that 'Individuals who are appointed as Officers of the Order of Oranje Nassau have generally rendered outstanding service of national or even international importance.'

Please let me know if I need to provide more information. I can strengthen this aspect of the article if you think that would be useful. Thank you for you interest. Shanti Shantiwong (talk) 07:39, 6 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks - I think my concern is more around WP:SINGLEEVENT, in that if Bijvoet is only notable around the Oranje (and it does seem his role in that ship is notable) that it might make more sense for him to be covered as part of that. Ideally we'd have something demonstrating that he was notable outside of the Oranje, in order to remove any doubt around the article. Turnagra (talk) 02:06, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for this insight. I was unaware of the Single Event categorisation. In thinking about that then, his Order of Oranje Nassau was definitely for his technical expertise in shipping design and engineering beyond his service on the Oranje, in being put in charge of the post war conversion of the three troopships, Groote Beer, Waterman and Zuiderkruis. The converted troopships transported thousands of Dutch emigrants fleeing the post war Netherlands to the US, Canada, Australia and New Zealand for 10-15 years. Their conversion from very basic facilities as troop carriers to comfortable, efficient migrant ships was sufficiently highly regarded to earn Bijvoet the Oranje Nassau in 1951. His wife writes that at the ceremony, his citation states that he was acknowledged for his expertise and innovation in drawing up the plans of the ships, and then supervising and working on their construction, and that everything was done to such a high standard that it had drawn international attention.

Does this help in demonstrating that he was notable outside of the Oranje? If so, should I flesh out the section on the conversion of the troopships and the reason for the awarding of the Oranje Nassau, more or less as I have done above? Can I use a personal communication like his wife's letter as a source? The citations from that time are not online unfortunately.

Thank you again,

Shanti Shantiwong (talk) 02:45, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

That definitely helps, yes - if you could flesh out the article with a bit more content on that, then that should be all that's needed to approve the article. As for the sourcing, I'm not sure whether the wife's account on its own would be enough, but the sources don't need to be online - people use physical sources all the time. If you have enough to cite them manually then that should be totally fine.

Interestingly, one of the ships you mentioned carried my family out from the Netherlands to New Zealand after the war, so I suppose I've got a connection of sorts to the article after all! Turnagra (talk) 03:11, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

I have re-worked the article and hope I have addressed your suggestions. I found additional sources in my archives. Thanks for your help with this. Nice to hear of the personal connection with the article! Shanti Shantiwong (talk) 08:56, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

All good, I've gone ahead and accepted the article - you may wish to also consider giving it an infobox. Nice job on the article! Turnagra (talk) 09:24, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you Turnagra. I have been waiting a long time to get to this stage with the article and am delighted with your comments about the 'C class'. I will look at making an infobox. Many thanks for being so supportive. Shanti Shantiwong (talk) 09:37, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Cornelis Bijvoet has been accepted

Cornelis Bijvoet, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

Congratulations, and thank you for helping expand the scope of Wikipedia! We hope you will continue making quality contributions.

The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on its talk page. This is a great rating for a new article, and places it among the top 21% of accepted submissions — kudos to you! You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

Since you have made at least 10 edits over more than four days, you can now create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for creation if you prefer.

If you have any questions, you are welcome to ask at the help desk. Once you have made at least 10 edits and had an account for at least four days, you will have the option to create articles yourself without posting a request to Articles for creation.

If you would like to help us improve this process, please consider .

Thanks again, and happy editing!

Turnagra (talk) 09:23, 7 May 2023 (UTC)