User talk:Sahmeditor/Admin coaching

This page documents a central discussion concerning User:Sahmeditor admin coach program with the assistance of User:FayssalF.

Admin coaching

Will you please coach me? I have been looking for a coach for a while. If you don't want to, it's okay. Æetlr Creejl 00:34, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Sure. Do you want to work on a per case basis (assisting) or something like more formal (theoretical)? -- FayssalF - ^{Wiki me up®} 01:58, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't understand what you mean. Æetlr Creejl 02:02, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Would you like practicing by assisting and advising me (cases i am working on) or would you like to make it more formal like going through explaining policies and guidelines. It depends on your level of understanding adminship and your experience in wikipedia. -- FayssalF - ^{Wiki me up®} 02:10, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd like the latter. Æetlr Creejl 02:12, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Cool. I see that you have been a Wikipedian for almost 2 years so i assume you have the minimum understanding of the policies and guidelines (p&g). In this case, i'll leave the choice of the starting point to you. -- FayssalF - ^{Wiki me up®} 02:25, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd like to learn the basics of calming disputes and "staying cool when the editing gets hot". Æetlr Creejl 02:37, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok. We'll discuss it tomorrow then. -- FayssalF - ^{Wiki me up®} 03:37, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

So, where should we start? Æetlr Creejl 19:47, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok since you mentioned resolving disputes while staying cool, i'd suggest we read again the policies and behavioral guidelines related to that. Let's follow the procedure below. You'd bring question so we will discuss them and subsequently treat some real cases and see how we can deal with it. -- FayssalF - ^{Wiki me up®} 20:19, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Notes

Before we start, i'll just mention some notes.

• resolving disputes while staying cool is just like an obligation. Administrators should remain cool, neutral and civil in any mediation or resolving disputes process;
• "staying cool when the editing gets hot"... Well, administrators are just like regular editors w/ only extra tools to apply policy and make sure guidelines are not disregarded. In general, administrators acting in this role are neutral; they do not have any direct involvement in the issues they are helping people with. If they are involving in editing thay should not be considered as an admin, except in rarely few cases such as when WP:BLP is involved;
• i'd really suggest you change the look of "joke" link at your userpage. I remember a debate before (can't find a link) about that issue. There was no consensus but it is really better for an admin to avoid such controversy. Some users take that seriously and think the admin is not serious. You can disagree w/ that but it is just like common practice for administrators (avoiding controversy and know how to deal w/ it properly); - Done
• in the same context, it would be great if you respond to messages at the other person's talk page. Not all people keep other people's talk pages watchlisted. Administrators should be experienced enough to know that and what it means especially in dispute resolutions.

WP:DR

Questions

What kind of disputes is it referring to: edit wars or talk page disputes? Why would anyone revert a page to their POV if they know it will create conflict that they'll be caught up in?

• It appears that Wikipedia:Dispute resolution does not have a lead section. I personally believe it should have one so your question would find an answer there. Anyway, here are the answers to your questions:
• a) edit warring can be first treated at talk pages. However, in many cases, talk pages become heated and discussion become moot. You can first try to let the disputed parties remain civil and respect the talk page guidelines. There is no point for an admin to advise someone uncivil or using the talk page as a forum to go to the dispute resolution process since it has nothing to do with that. Dispute resolution is a formal step to build a consensus. Nothing special except that it is more formal. However, it is not binding. Remaining civil and calm is a prerequisite to get into a dispute resolution (DR).
• b) people are this way. Many users are gaming the system by avoiding violating WP:3RR making sure they revert no more than 2 times a day. The task of admins is to explain to them that they are wrong and use the admin tools when the situation becomes an issue where admins block even if there is no technical violation of 3RR. In other situations, parties can go through further dispute resolution such as WP:AN/I and requests for comments. The request for arbitration remains then the last resort.

How do administrators manage to stay cool (or appear to stay cool)? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sahmeditor (talk • contribs) 20:10, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

• Actually the main role of an admin when it comes to DR is to enforce consensus and not to enforce their ideas. Admins should never be rude, sarcastic, biased, etc... Once you feel that your temper is going to worsen, it is always suggested that you contact another admin to deal w/ the problem. You just disengage and leave the task for another admin. You can request other admins' help via WP:AN. Simple as that.

But do admins come and handle things very often? Most of the time admins become entangled in the dispute. Æetlr Creejl 22:32, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

• Well, it will be great of involved parties remind the admin to remain neutral and not to engage in fixing a content dispute. I believe you can find all the answers to this and other questions at this now closed case. -- FayssalF - ^{Wiki me up®} 10:00, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

WP:IAR

Questions

Have there been any cases where a rule has prevented people from maintaining Wikipedia?

• I'd rather say " improve or maintain" Wikipedia as the policy states. Well, yes. If the users involved in this dispute decide to not cooperate, admins would only have to apply [WP:IAR]. There are many cases in where rules prevented people from improving or maintaining wikipedia but i just gave you a potential one. Read the admins proposal.