User talk:Realist2/Archive 7

I'm sorry to see you leave

I had fun working with you, perhaps instead of leaving the project you could simple take a Wiki break? Giving up and giving in means letting the person in the wrong win. I'd rather not see that happen. hug. Bookkeeperoftheoccult (talk) 21:36, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Yay! Bookkeeperoftheoccult (talk) 21:40, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

I'll do it at some point today. Bookkeeperoftheoccult (talk) 21:50, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

We've had our differences, and more than a few words were exchanged that were unfortunate, but it's a shame nonetheless that you're leaving. You put the time in and are a valued editor. I've watched from the sidelines the situation that seems to have been the tipping point. It's too bad it has come to this. If you change your mind, we'll all still be here. Otherwise, best of luck. freshacconcispeaktome 21:51, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Ditto. Glad we could work together. Take a break. Come back. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 03:18, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Reply

Damn, you're leaving? :( That sucks! Anyways, I have my own fansite- http://www.maximum-jackson.com/discussion and we may be interested in running it on our front page when the front page goes live, but I would need to present it to my team. We can always post it within the forums as well. What kind of article would you need? Marnifrances (talk) 03:20, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Ok, no worries. Let me know when it's ready to go and we'll see if we can put it as news on our front page. It's amazing! :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marnifrances (talk • contribs) 04:58, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry I didn't get back sooner. Contact me via my michael jackson page- www.michaeljackson.com/profile/marni and I am always on www.maximum-jackson.com/discussion - I am one of the admins. I hope you get this message before leaving. :) Marnifrances (talk) 04:15, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Ok That's good news. It really sucks what has happened- you have been a total asset to Wiki. :( Anyway, you can still contact me at either one of those avenues. If you contact me on the michael jackson page, I can pass my email details to you there. :) Marnifrances (talk) 02:36, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

barnstar

		The Resilient Barnstar
		For continuing to contribute to the project, even in the face of adversity and discrimination, I award User:Realist2 the The Resilient Barnstar. Bookkeeperoftheoccult (talk) 09:41, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Bless you bookkeeper, i have seen some terrible things in resent days, some friends have become enemies while other friendships just keep growing stronger. Realist2 (talk) 09:49, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Well deserved barnstar, may I add. You've been through a lot, Realist2, and it's only made you stronger. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 19:57, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Oh this in the hardest part of saying good bye, im so sorry i coundn't live uo to your expectations.Realist2 (talk) 23:31, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Bsrboy

This editer has just contacted me through wiki mail twice. As he was blocked not only for sock puppetry but also for calling me a nigger and a black bastard i would appreciate it if you could try and resolve this ang get back to me. Its already caused me enough heartache. Realist2 (talk) 14:17, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Did he racially abuse you in his emails as well? If so, please forward the email in full with headers and I'll organise an abuse report to be filed with his ISP via CheckUser. I suggest you just add him to your ignore list, he's spamming a whole lot of administrators right now. --  Netsnipe  ►  14:23, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

The guy that has left me in this mess. Realist2 (talk) 23:33, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Evidence

• A - This shows an ip adress calling me a black bastard and adding porn to my page. Realist2 (talk) 00:25, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
• B - shows the same ip adress calling me a nigger and telling us his secret to getting seperate accounts.
• One of these ip's request for unblock was "I should be unblocked because im white, why are you treating the nigger so nice, you should be hung. Seen here CC.
• Check my talk page history for more but those are the main ones.
• A friend of mine "The Elfoid" reported the ip adresses to the admin board. My evidence is just one of those edits elfoid made, the discussion has since been archived so i cant find it.C.
• Using that clever computer thing admins were able to establish that it was user brsboy seen hereD. Note that he completely confesses and admits to his racism against me even though we were friends.
• When he first found out i was considering leaving wikipedia over racism, he was still pretending to be my friend by writting NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!! on my talk page (just before he was court red handed).E
• He continued to email me even after his block as seen by a discussion above.
• Yes I have had blocks and warnings in the past but not on the issue of civility, rather 3RR, ive never behaved like this with another editer and i never will again.Realist2 (talk) 00:54, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Extended block

I've now reset your block for a period of 72 hours due to your continued incivility and personal attacks that you have made on this page while blocked (see here). - Rjd0060 (talk) 21:18, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

You are incorrect, on my block log you say "Harassment of other users or personal attacks" as the reasoning. The editor has long been blocked, so it cant be harrasement and i havent directed anything at him personally as he cant see it. Realist2 (talk) 01:45, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Blocked users can still view Wikipedia, and them being blocked is quite irrelevant anyway. If anything, it's worse, as they can't respond to it. Regardless of who you're talking to, it's polite and just good common sense to treat them civilly. If they are a troll or vandal, don't "feed" or encourage them, just ignore them. Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 04:42, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Yer unblocked. I don't take 'civility' to mean that editors have this inherent right to feel unoffended. Have a blast, and perhaps you will discuss an editor's proclivity to be bigoted in a discussion. the_undertow ^talk 09:46, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Im still blocked until 2 in the morning , why, im so confused by all this?

• OK, this is good. Realist2, I think several simple errors were made in good faith, and I hope we can all put this behind us. Easy for me to say, I was not the one who was blocked, but hopefully you are a bigger man than that. Guy (Help!) 11:43, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Im still blocked until 2 in the morning , why, im so confused by all this? Realist2 (talk) 15:43, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Your block log shows that you shouldn't be blocked. It might be an autoblock that hasn't been taken care of. Template:Autoblock will have more information about what you need to do to have an autoblock lifted. --Onorem♠Dil 15:49, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I've removed the autoblock of your account. - Rjd0060 (talk) 16:01, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Comments

Well, you have been unblocked, which you know. I'd just like to say that I would hope you do not leave the project because of all of this. Please realize a few things. First, I was not completely aware of the entire situation when I blocked you. The thread you posted above really explains things. I did block you based on several questionable comments that you had left. I see how I could have been more sympathetic to your situation, but again, I was not completely aware of it, and should have done some better research prior to the block. Even with your "Evidence" thread above, I still would ask you to try and remain civil in the future, and pursue other alternatives to stop disruption from other users. My apologies for the harassment that you have had to endure from other users. No constructive contributor, such as yourself, should have to undergo that type of continued harassment. Again, I hope that you can overlook this and continue on with the project. If you do decide to stick around and ever need anything, don't hesitate to ask on my talk page. Sincerely, - Rjd0060 (talk) 17:27, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I see my retaliation in 2 phases;

• The first , directed at the ip adress who abused me
• The second , directed at the specific user a few days later when i found out it was a friend all along.

• • If it had turned out that the identity of the ip adress was someone i hadn't known i woundnt have needed to retaliate a second time. It was only becuse i knew and trusted the person that the second incident occured. Realist2 (talk) 17:34, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

In the future, can I ask that rather than retaliate that you please post a comment at WP:ANI or even on my talk page? This will ensure that the harassment is taken care of promptly. - Rjd0060 (talk) 17:37, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I will, hopefully it wont be double crossed by a friend again, so hopefully there wont be a need, like i said previous bans against me were for 3RR, ive never had this sort of an issue with civility before. Realist2 (talk) 17:41, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

OK. If there is anything I can do for you, don't hesitate to ask. - Rjd0060 (talk) 17:51, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

OK, i will. Realist2 (talk) 17:54, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

(Continued from the Thriller talk page, which I see has just been archived.)

Yes, I am the artist formerly (and probably in future) known as Kakofonous. The business with Daara J was a gigantic misunderstanding between the two of us, and I apologize immensely if you took offense at the comments I made—when I suggested a different reviewer, I meant only that it might be useful for the article to get a fresh pair of eyes to look at it, not that you were in any way unfit to review it. I have also seen the trouble you have been through recently, and I would just like to say that I hope you do not retire as I did, which I have been reconsidering for a while now. You are a tremendous asset to the project and it would be sad to see you leave. --24.218.182.169 (talk) 17:36, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Responded to your comment on my talk page. --24.218.182.169 (talk) 18:45, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Bye

Damn it, I'm gonna miss you. You've been a big help, thanks for everything. I'm really sorry that some people haven't learned the true meaning of Assume Good Faith. I'm REALLY sorry that this happened to you. Anyway, I bid you farewell, and wish you success in wherever life takes you. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 20:00, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, im just finishing my ends and then going. Ive been unblocked, but when my block was extended form 1 to 3 days that was the final straw. Realist2 (talk) 20:05, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

For what it's worth, I apologize for handling two unblock requests, and I really hope you reconsider and decide to stay. --Golbez (talk) 20:46, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I was very concerned about that, if i hadn't specifically told you not to, i imagine you would have done a third. Im not sure it was entirely professional and goes against the idea of impartiality entirely. Never mind, well all make mistakes, i have never seen of or heard of so many admin apologizes in one day. Looks like everyone was having a funny day. Realist2 (talk) 20:53, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Thriller

I put my name on. I thought even from the beginning that this would be the best way. I'm glad it could be worked out so that one of the most successful reissues of all time has its say on Wikipedia. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 20:30, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I thought you're retired. Go ahead. =) --Efe (talk) 01:01, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

You can now paste the summary of Thriller 25 to the mother article. Integrate the bonus track listing to the prose. Thank you. --Efe (talk) 02:04, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

A Day in the Life

Do you know anyone who might be able to help me with this after you're gone? Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 20:55, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Phew, it's been an hour, and I've finished formatting the citations. I'd appreciate it if you had a look. NOTE: I will delete the "References" sub-section after I'm sure that no more citations are needed. Some of them may be valuable. Anyway, I've read your "Thoughts" on the talk page, and I'll get to it right away. Thanks a lot! Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 20:57, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

See the Talk page. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 21:28, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, I'm done with everything that you told me to do. I think it should be MUCH better now. You should look at the Talk page to see my comments. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 21:47, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I won't be editing for a couple of hours, I have some work to do. Until then! Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 21:47, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I think it's ready for a GA Nomination, agreed? Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 01:16, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

What are you saying here? I'm sorry, I just don't understand what you're saying. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 23:49, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Oh, okay. You're right, there's no need for a PR (unless I want to pursue an FA with this after GA). Anyway, I've asked the guy who said he was going to PR the article, and there was no response. Best now just to leave it alone and work on Thriller 25. :) Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 00:10, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

I understand

and its not like I didn't act dumb either :(. So big sorry from my side too. Hope you don't leave; the article about the most important album ever won't write itself. :) indopug (talk) 02:33, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

=) --Efe (talk) 02:41, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Re: 2008 tag...

Yeah, since the decision to revert Thriller 25 back into its respective page, I don't actually think it's necessary even if the albums are "basically the same", lol. BrothaTimothy (talk · contribs) 04:58, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Welcome. We'll see how this goes now. BrothaTimothy (talk · contribs) 05:02, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah I hope it ain't just all for naught. BrothaTimothy (talk · contribs) 05:08, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Re:T25

I already started gathering solid sources from the net to completely revamp this one. But as you've stated, I will probably slow down helping you then. Its up to you. =) --Efe (talk) 05:35, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

When someone asks me to help, I will as long as I have time. When someone asks me not to, I'll be glad. =| --Efe (talk) 05:50, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I did a minor ce. They should be properly sourced. --Efe (talk) 11:22, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I thought of coming over here because I have no class tomorrow. Anyway, I'll be online for two to three hours. --Efe (talk) 11:25, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Some more balancing of reviews. Anyway, its getting ok. Just source them all. --Efe (talk) 11:35, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Thriller

Thriller will take a lot of work before it is ready for another FAC. There's a lot of sources to go over and cite (as well as verify the reliability of), and the prose needs a lot of work. I say this as someone who's co-written two album FAs (Be Here Now and Loveless). I will most likely help out on the article in the future, but it won't before the end of the month because I am verrrrry busy for the next two weeks. WesleyDodds (talk) 10:02, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Just FYI I have redone the press release sentence and managed to get rid of passive verbs as well as get both points across. --DizFreak ^{talk Contributions} 19:25, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Peer review/Beyoncé Knowles/archive1

This is my biggest project to date and I would like to ask your suggestions for it to improve further. Thank you. --Efe (talk) 12:57, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank for the response. Do not be surprise if someone asked you to do a peer review. You're a GA reviewer right? --Efe (talk) 05:43, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

I left comments there. Please check it out. --Efe (talk) 07:43, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

What's good about asking someone's help is that, especially when they're not familiar with the subject or article, they can easily spot errors, from obvious to complex one. --Efe (talk) 01:35, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Michael Jackson images

I'm on it, as you will have seen. Wikipedia cannot have breaches of copyright hanging around, even if they've taken the rubbery route that the last one did to get to the article. However, even policy aside, I detect an agenda behind these images, and I'm not going to let that pass. Now this is the sort of things that you would have to deal with as an Admin. I think you have what it takes to get voted in, but not just at the moment. Recent events are too recent, if you see what I mean. However, we can put a plan together to address those issues. Meanwhile, if you want to be an admin, you have to commit to the project, and that means removing the "Retired" banner for a start. Nobody is going to support your application if that is there, and even maybe within three months of it. I'll take a look at your contribs & suggest areas you need to look at. Meanwhile, take some time out to read WP:ANI, WP:AN and the other policy noticeboards to see what issues come up there. If you still want to do it, you'll need some familiarity with these, as well as a good grasp of policy. Up to you. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 22:15, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Your blocks are one reason why I think you need to wait a little while before applying for adminship; the first you can explain by being unfamiliar with policy, the most recent was unfortunate and I couldn't do much because I wasn't around for a while. But as an Admin you would be expected to explain things to editors, and if you couldn't do that for your own block, you should think whether you can do that for a rampaging vandal who won't listen to reason. I think you might not have been blocked recently if you had not been visibly so upset and reacted so strongly- admins are expected to have somewhat thick skins, given the insults and vandalism we have to put up with; your handling of those racist insults would be bound to be mentioned at your RfA. I'm really NOT trying to deter you here, just point out that all your history here is visible, and people have long memories. I would wait three months to let some water flow under the bridge, things to smooth out a bit, and get down to writing articles. Also, a deeper and wider knowledge of policy would help you. Hope that helps.--Rodhullandemu (Talk) 22:50, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Smile!

Kodster has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling to someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy editing!
Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

I think you needed one. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 22:55, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

1000 Edits in April Barnstar

		The Original Barnstar
		For making 1000 edits in the month of April, I award thee with a Shiny Original Barnstar Luksuh 15:24, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Why i thankyou. Realist2 (talk) 15:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Talk:Michael Jackson archives

Hi, there is only one set of archives, it's just that it has two indexes for some reason, and one of these is manually updated and has been missed. I've fixed it. The page is automatically bot-archived when it gets over 65K-bytes in size. Hope that helps. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 19:35, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Re: Michael Jackson

Yeah, I've been seeing the good work you've been doing with the article. It keeps looking better and better! And congratulations on the Thriller GA certification, it got certified before I even got a chance to look, heheh. I am sorry about your recent troubles, that is something nobody should have to go through. Also, I hope you and Cooljuno can work out your differences about the pics. I think you both have a point: It is not fair to unnecessarily make Jackson look bad by using unflattering pics in the intro -- but at the same time Cooljuno is right that the pics disproportionately represent Jackson in the distant past. There is only one picture that is less than a decade old! So for whatever that's worth, hopefully you guys can work out a compromise. Anyway, hang in there and keep up the good work! --Jaysweet (talk) 20:02, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Pictures

I removed your latest incarnation on the michael Jackson page. In no way did it bring anything useful to the issue of his humanitarian statues so would cause the article to fail FA. However if you want to add anymore pictures, particulary to the charity section, i actually need your help. Looking at the pictures we have shoots from 1984, 1987, 1995, 2005. We need a picture from the Dangerous era (1991-1993) that ilistrates his humanitarian stuff with the heal the world foundation. If you can get something on that it would be very useful. Realist2 (talk) 15:37, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

What are you talking about, he was speaking on the subject when that picture was taken so what seems to be the issue? I sourced it and everything.--Cooljuno411 (talk) 19:54, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Its not relevant to the humanitarian issue, there are pictures on his humanitarian efforts that ARE useful but that is not. As you are good with pictures i would appreciate it if you could find something from the early 90's that would be very good there. Realist2 (talk) 19:57, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

OK, SO INSTEAD OF A PICTURE OF HIM TALKING ON STAGE, YOU WOULD RATHER HIM BE DOING WHAT????? I'm sorry but that is what he does, i am not sure if i can find a picture of him digging wells in Mexico, or something, for the locals. Sorry that is what you get, him speaking out on stage or singing for charity. That is what he does....

I have a picture of him singing and the page say: "Michael Jackson performing at the Democratic National Committee's "A Night at the Apollo" voter registration drive & fund-raiser at The Apollo Theater in New York City. April 24, 2002.". But it is not from the early 90s. --Cooljuno411 (talk) 20:07, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Yes i looked at the site myself just now, that picture of him singing live would be much more relevant, shame its not from the early 90's but its better. Im dumbfounded that you never choose that in the first place, you dont intentionally have to add pictures that portray Jackson in a bad light when there is a perfectly good one right next to it. Realist2 (talk) 20:14, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Could you also add his picture to the dangerous era. pic.Realist2 (talk) 20:18, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

How is someone standing on stage "bad light", you think i'm out to get him or something. W/e. But i'll shrink and upload that picture in a moment.--Cooljuno411 (talk) 20:20, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Before you add any more pictures i advise you consult me first. You consistantly miss name or misrepresent them. Your lastest picture is most certainly not a bad era picture. Realist2 (talk) 16:16, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

OK, so please do tell waht was wrong with that picture i put under "bad". I think you just remove pictures because you don't personally like them.--Cooljuno411 (talk) 21:16, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Firstly we already have a good picture for the bad era and seconly its not a bad era picture. Its from his history world tour. Just look at his face its obvious its 1995 onwards. Realist2 (talk) 21:19, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

You can have more that one picture per a section, I personally like articles to have lots of pictures (see:San Diego-Tijuana metropolitan area, for an example) and feel free to take a picture or other pictures from [[1]].

"Thriller" sound clip

Actually, er, it has a valid fair-use defence and could stay in the Michael Jackson article. However, it's also in CoolJunio's archive version, where it's invalid use since it's not in Article space. Hope that helps. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 22:28, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Hi, the rationale is already there on the upload page, and it looks fine. Fair-use sound clips and images are fine as long as there aren't too many of them and they are relevant and addressed in the article text. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 22:44, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

FUR - Fair Use Rationale, i.e. a copyright defence. It has one. It's fine. So do most of the images. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 22:48, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Picture of MJ

Why are you removing all the pictures from the article? (we will talk on this page, respond here, not on my page) --Cooljuno411 (talk) 23:35, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

They had to be removed as a requirement of FA review. Would you like a link to see it? Im gutted, some of mine had to go too. Realist2 (talk) 23:36, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Waht does it say is the reason you must remove all the pictures and link to article too please. And BTW, if this is something stupid like a project or something i a cgoing to readd the picture cause being reviewed by a project has no place in my book for down-grading the an article....--Cooljuno411 (talk) 00:34, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

here - no its not some little project, its an award that is given to the article according to how good it it. The primary goal of wikipedia is to get all articles to FA. Cheers. Realist2 (talk) 00:39, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Where in that does it say "lets lower the quality of the article by removing pictures", cause i can't find any mention... --Cooljuno411 (talk) 00:48, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

It says they cant be used otherwise it cant reach FA = lowers quality. Realist2 (talk) 00:56, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Thriller 25 GA on hold

I put Thriller 25 on hold. Look at the talk page for more info. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 23:45, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

I think it'll be helpful if, instead of writing '''done''', you use the {{done}} template. It just makes a checkmark and "DONE" so that it's easier to stand out. Hope that helps. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 00:33, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Regarding the quote for the Context section, get me a quote if you can and put it on my talk page. If it's good, I'll put it in the article. It's fine as it is, but I think a quote could make it better. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 00:34, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, the quote will work. I'll work it into the article. Only I was confused because you put it in "A Day in the Life" section instead of "Thriller". ;) Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 01:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Finished with the quote. Can you add in the lead something about the reception of the album, like "It was received well by critics..." and so on. Thanks. When you're done, I'll look at it. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 01:33, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

I fixed the grammar a bit. If you're done, I think its time for the final review. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 19:34, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Actually, I thought it's good for GA. If you're okay with it, I did the final review and it's good. Anything you want to add before I make the final call? Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 19:41, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Re:

Sorry. I thought you were discarding good faith messages. =) --Efe (talk) 03:51, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Maybe he's just busy. --Efe (talk) 03:57, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Soon. If im done with "Baby Boy" or if I have free time. --Efe (talk) 03:35, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

again with Jackson

Thanks for your help in cleaning up the Jackson article...I've been doing cleanup too, and Youtube.com isn't a reliable source due to copyright issues. From now on, if you have anything to say about Jackson/editing about the article, please post it on the FAC page. Thanks. --Andrewlp1991 (talk) 15:09, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

GA Law Reviews

I saw your comment at User talk:Rodhullandemu, and would just mention that there was some discussion of matters at Wikipedia talk:Good articles#Lacuna re legal articles, which seems to have stalled, but which you may find interesting. Regards, Bencherlite^Talk 22:06, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Multiple and repeat FAC noms

Realist2, I've removed your repeat nom of Thriller (album) from FAC after it was recently archived. Please see the WP:FAC isntructions regarding multiple noms, as you have another nomination up now. (" Users should not add a second FA nomination until the first has gained support and reviewers' concerns have been substantially addressed.") Also, it is expected that you will take time necessary to address all previous issues before re-nominating Thriller; a peer review may be helpful. Regards, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:17, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

It can be hard to get feedback at peer review; for an effective peer review, see WP:FCDW/March 17, 2008, contact people from WP:PRV and ask them to review, and invite the editors who commented on your previous FAC to comment there as well. To get a good peer review, you have to go out and bring in the reviewers, but because there's no time pressure, reviewers who do engage are often willing to spend time. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:51, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Smile

DizFreak ^{talk Contributions} has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling at someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Cheers, and happy editing!
Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Thanx. Realist2 (talk) 03:55, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Thriller album

Who have you contacted for a Peer Review? I'll contact some folks but don't want to ask the same peeps. I'll be back this weekend, work calls me. We can do this.--DizFreak ^{talk Contributions} 03:38, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

• I will add it to my list - there are a fair number ahead of it, so it may take several days. Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 04:07, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Re:MJ

You can't link to YouTube if its a copyvio video, but if you can get publisher info, dates, original source etc, you can source to it (but maybe not link to the video). If there is a video that shows him collecting an award for 300 mil charity, I think its odd not to be allowed to include that information. indopug (talk) 11:39, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

If it happened at the 2006 WMA are you sure that there aren't any sources/news items describing the event that have mentioned the award? (direct your searches toward the 2006 WMA) indopug (talk) 15:16, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

I think if you can figure out who broadcasted the event, the date and so forth; you can include the link. (I'm sorry I can't access YouTube from my computer) indopug (talk) 15:26, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

RE: Thriller, you should reference the hell out of that external link at the bottom of the article (making of Thriller from people who worked on it). indopug (talk) 18:18, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Michael Jackson images

Let me ask you this first: do you believe that the Michael Jackson article, in its current state, provides all the information necessary to understand the man, his career, etc. (the topic)? Put another way, do you believe the current article to be comprehensive, complete, etc. (however defined) such that no additional information could be added that would significantly increase a reader's understanding of the topic? ЭLСОВВОLД _talk 14:54, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Michael Jackson article

I'm done with the Michael Jackson article. I looked for grammar, spelling typos, and basic prose, but a copy-edit would be helpful (if it hasn't already been done). There's one thing wrong, and that is the references. Many of the references are not formatted correctly, and you know that the FA reviewers are REAL sticklers on referencing. Also, you have a separate "References" section for that one book (The Magic and the Madness). Well, if you're going to put a references section AND a notes section, then put the other books used for the article in the same format. What I'm saying is that either you have to put The Magic and the Madness in its full form in the "Notes" section (like the other book refs), or you put the other book refs in shortened form for the Notes section and put the full citation in the "References" section. Either way, it has to be changed, because it is inconsistent. Tell me which way you want to use, and I'll do it. I'll try to help you with the referencing too. Anyway, the article itself looks really good! Great job. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 21:30, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm done with the references. You might want to check it out. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 21:53, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks a lot for the barnstar. Wow, that was a surprise, finishing all the references and seeing that on my talk page! The only thing I can disagree with is that it IS of interest to me, because my interest (and reason for being here) is to offer quality information to the public. Thus, anything I do that helps Wikipedia is in my interest. But it's okay, thanks a lot man.

Anyway, I finished the references. You might want to double-check the refs to make sure I didn't make any mistakes. Thanks again! Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 22:33, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

I'd rather not give a support/opposition only because I'm horrible at reviewing articles. Even in school I suck at giving peer reviews. Plus I don't want to throw in a random support simply because you're a friend which would probably look awkward. I only have a single comment anyway: most of the smaller paragraphs and one sentence paragraphs in the article should probably be combined where ever possible. Over all I think its good. I think the hardest thing about getting an article to FA is getting enough people to actually review the damn thing. Bookkeeperoftheoccult (talk) 22:40, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

No i agree completely when it becomes FA i want it on good merit not because all my friends were on the bench. What im really trying to do is keep the confersation rolling as there hasnt been any movement on it in two days. Ill take your advise on the small sections though. Cheers. Realist2 (talk) 22:45, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

In my opinion, I would have no objection of any reason why this shouldn't be an FA. But the thing is, this is my first FA being involved with, and I'm not sure what the FA reviewers are "specifically" looking for. I read the FA Criteria, and it's rather vague. I don't know, maybe I'm too strict on what an FA is, or maybe I'm not strict enough. I read the "AC/DC" article to compare, and "Michael Jackson" looks pretty good. So I really can't tell you that this is FA-worthy, because I don't know myself. I hope it is, though. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 22:50, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Signatures

Here's the link to WP:SIG, where you can find out how to customize your signature with colors. Hope that helps. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 18:20, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Nevermind, that won't really help. Here's the link that you can use (WP:COLOR). To use it, go to "My Preferences", go to the "Signature" box, and copy whatever signature you want using the colors from the above link. Remember to check "Raw signature" so that Wikipedia knows to use this signature instead of the regular one. Feel free to talk to me if you don't understand anything. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 18:25, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

If it helps, here's MY signature without Wikiformatting.

'''[[User:Kodster|<font color="7F007F">'''Kodster'''</font>]]''' ([[User_talk:Kodster|'''Willis''']]) (''[[Special:Contributions/Kodster|Look what I can do]]'')

All you have to do is replace the color, your user name, and the message you want to display ("Willis" and "Look what I can do"). Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 18:41, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

One more thing. You're not allowed to have images in your signature. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 18:42, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

It looks great. If you want more colors, click here for the codes for each one. Cheers, Kodster (Willis) (Look what I can do) 21:03, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

• Nice sig. Some readers may have trouble with yellow on white, though (colourblind?). As for the MJ FA, I'll take a look at it shortly. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 21:37, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

That looks better. It will need to stand out for some users. Cheers. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 21:57, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

neat! Bookkeeperoftheoccult (talk) 22:34, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

To float the "2", you need to put ² around it, you can select it and do it from the edit bar at the top of your edit window, it's the X² button. As for Flickr images on Commons, they are not all OK, it depends what licence the photographer has put on Flickr, and this is checked by a trusted user on Commons. If they check out, they're OK for use here too. As for the different appearances, there shouldn't be a problem since the image says a lot more than words can convey. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 22:49, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

OK, can you send me the Flickr link, I'm a little busy right now. Thanks. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 23:00, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I've had a look at the Flickr image. It wouldn't pass on Commons because Commons is for copyright-free images and what he's done there is to tack three copyrighted images together to produce what's called a "derivative work", and that's no way a free image for our purposes. It would have to be uploaded here with a proper fair-use justification (which wouldn't be difficult to argue in the circumstances). Let me know what you think. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 00:05, 20 April 2008 (UTC)