This is an archive of past discussions about User:Nedim Ardoğa. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
Thank you very much, I am flattered . I only want to enrich WP in a small way. May this new year bring happiness to all of us. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 19:34, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
There were two battles... And in the past, I wrote many things about that on the talk page of Battle of Maritsa. Böri (talk) 09:13, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
Uysyn
Dear Nedim, I happened to refer to the Uysyn article, and noticed that its talk page was replaced with a bunch of non-nonsensical links that classify the most prominent union famous from the Han Shu records as low-importance subject, and practically disable the Talk page, denying readers a chance to review the past comments or contribute new comments. Can you please restore the talk page to its original condition. Happy New Year! Barefact (talk) 09:12, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
I checked Talk:Uysyn (beginning from 9 Dec 2008). As far as I can see there were no previous discussions on the page. There are only the project notices for three projects, all of which are group in to a banner. You can see the names of the projects by clicking the show button at the right of the banner. Cheers. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 20:11, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
Hi Nedim Ardoğa! Someone has posted a warning message to me about a recent edit of mine. I suspect the message was not from you. Please check. Cheers. --CeeGee11:20, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, Nedim, for suggesting that the List of Turkish women writers should be merged with the article Turkish women writers. As you will see from my comments on the latter's talk page, I think each has an important place on Wikipedia and should be expanded separately. With Women's History Month coming up, we hope to expand coverage of women authors from Turkey with new articles. You might be able to help with suggestions of new names, including contemporary women who are gaining a place on the literary scene. For the time being I already intend to write about Sevgi Soysal (1936–1976), (tr) and Tezer Özlü (1942–1986) (tr, good wrtie-up here). I would appreciate additional suggestions.--Ipigott (talk) 14:01, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
The Beatles'ın "Dig It" şarkısında John Lennon, Gerçek-Doris Day, Gerçek-B.B. King ve Gerçek-Matt Busby (1950'lerdeki Manchester United t.direktörü)'nin öldüğünü ve "değiştirildiğini" anlatıyor... (Üçü de 1958 yılında ölüyor.) Bunları anlatmasının nedeni Gerçek-Paul McCartney'nin de 1966 yılında ölmesi ve "değiştirilmesi". /Bu konuda yazdıklarımı sürekli siliyorlar. / Eğer bahsettiğim kişilerin 1958 öncesi ve sonrasındaki resimlerine Google'da bakarsanız (Paul için 1966), anlattıklarımın doğru olduğunu görürsünüz. Böri (talk) 11:15, 16 March 2015 (UTC)
Konuyu bilmiyordum, aydınlattığınız için teşekkürler. Ama ansiklopedik metinlerin güvenilir kaynaklara dayanması lazım. Fotoğraf farklılığı ansiklopedik kaynak sayılmaz. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:51, 16 March 2015 (UTC)
Note:Above dialog in Turkish is about the song Dig it and the story behind it.
What I wrote is the truth. You can look at this Wikipedia article: Paul is dead Look at his photos. The photos are important because "they" are trying to hide these things! Regards, Böri (talk) 08:32, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
This edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:History_of_the_Ottoman_Empire&diff=655305714&oldid=654591154, breaks the link to a series of articles. A series is (like 1,2,3,4,5) sequence of articles explaining events in a timeline. I recognized from your edit, you want to create the ranges (1699–1792 Decline) and (1792–1922 Dissolution). These are arbitrary dates. If you want to create an article explaining the years in range 1699–1792. You can. But these 200-300 years are too wide for 100-200Kb files. The title "defeat and dissolution 1908-1922" is not dissolution so pls do not try to make it so. And if you insists we can get rid of all these fictitious definitions (rise, growth stagnation, dissolution) and just leave as "History of Ottoman Empire between ... and ... (only as date ranges). Thank you. --SelimAnkara1993 (talk) 14:25, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
Hi, Selim; en-WP has very few Turkish contributors and I appreciate your contributions to WP. Please keep on. As for the subject at hand; the Ottoman History is categorized as Rise -Growth-Stagnation -Decline and Tanzimat. The milestones are 1299 (1302)-1453-1579-1699-1839-1922. The third of these 1579 is the death date of Sokollu Mehmet. Sometimes 1606 in stead of 1579 is taken as the milestone (By the treaty of Zitvatorok, Ottomans gave up their supremacy claim.) Well I used these dates except for 1839, Because in WP articles dissolution is far more emphasized than the 19th century reforms. You’re welcome to change 1606 to 1579 or 1792 to 1839 . But considering growth up to the end of the 17th century is not reasonable (mad or 5-yr old sultans, very short-term grand viziers, red coins, continuous revolts in Anatolia etc.) Cheers. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 17:46, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
This classification (Rise -Growth - Stagnation -Decline -Dissolution) is based on lands or battles gained or lost, which a warrior empire do. I'm sure there are other ways of classifying history of the ottoman empire. Another tree level one is: classic age · Reform · Modernization. What I'm emphasizing is that (Rise -Growth - Stagnation -Decline-Dissolution) is only one classification. The range of these periods are even an issue by itself. This is not a totally developed idea. I would like to move these classifications on an article by itself. It is obvious that there is not going to be one article "History of ottoman Empire." I would like to find a way to tell the content without involving classification issues. I want to avoid moving content from one article to another, or article naming wars, based on classification issues. SelimAnkara1993 (talk) 20:11, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
No problem at all. Yesterday, I've been to Tarsus for the Turkey girls' national U-17 match against Finland. By this opportunity, I locally checked out the difference between the both stadiums. So, I'm gonna review that article and correct if needed. Cheers. --CeeGee12:27, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
Ooh! Really sorry for that. I decided very shortly, and couldn't get an airline ticket even. I've arrived in Tarsus on Saturday at 14:15 only, missing the game's opening ceremony. I left Tarsus after the match at around 18 hours to go back home via Adana by intercity bus as came there. I apologize for not thinking of notifying you for a meeting. However, I promise to do it by next opportunity. Thanks for kindness. Cheers. --CeeGee08:00, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for helping out with this page. I've made some minor changes to what you've added: (1) Please try to get the exact location of the theaters when putting in coords; you can usually see them on the satellite images, or grab them from another site that gives a plan; (2) Don't worry about putting in links to the provinces under the modern names because the page for the city will have it (and if it doesn't, you might want to add it there). Again, thanks! - Eponymous-Archon (talk) 18:27, 15 April 2015 (UTC)
Perge
Not sure where our differences arise. I am saying that Perge is not a Roman theatre. I do not deny that it may contain a Roman theatre. Therefore, it cannot be categorized as a "Roman theatre." The list you pointed me to seems to confirm that. Sofia, for example, is not categorized as a Roman theatre. If there is an article on the theatre itself, that would, of course, be categorized appropriately. Roman theatre or whatever.
If you still disagree, could you be more specific in your comments? Thanks.
Hi, can I interest you and page stalkers in this project? For starting missing articles from other wikis. All about addressing systematic bias. You could use it to list lots of missing Turkish article at Wikipedia:WikiProject Intertranswiki/Turkish. If so put your name down on the project talk page and add a tick by your name. Even if not, at some point we'll do some Turkish stub of the week drives and will need your input on what is missing! I'm aware that other wikis the quality isn't always great for translation, but the idea really is to identify notable missing articles and aim to start a lot of them with improved sourcing/content.♦ Dr. Blofeld11:54, 3 May 2015 (UTC)
Your link points to a part of an article in Diyanet Vakfı Ansiklopedisi (Encyclopaedia of Religion Foundadtion) The article is about “izladi Skanderbng 1443” According to the left paragrapf of the incomplete article somebody named Hasan was appointed as the commander instead of Skanderbeg who was converted to Islam. After Ottoman defeat in İzladi, Skanderbeg converted to Christianity and captured Kruya .According to the right paragraph, there were 800 houses which were mostly situated outside of the inner fort. During the 1669-70 war Venetians attacked Kruya and the Ottomans employed a military unit of 137 man strong. Unfortunatelly the rest of the article has been blocked. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 11:16, 10 May 2015 (UTC)
You should use the incomplete tag [1] when the article is missing some key events, this article is not missing the elements that are generally required for writing such kind of article. Even one or two listing are enough. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log) 23:43, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
Besim Üstünel
Dear Nedim Ardoğa! The reason why I've removed the name of the hospital was that we have many hospitals in Istanbul named Florence Nightingale, and I couldn't figure out which one was it he died in. Cheers.--CeeGee12:58, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
Yes there are many. But this one happens to be named İstanbul Florence Nightingale. (The others are named for the districts or quarters of İstanbul such as Kadıköy or Şili). Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 13:13, 5 June 2015 (UTC)
Elections template
Hello Nedim. {{Turkish elections}} is only for public elections, and hence does not include the presidential elections prior to 2014 (it has a note stating this which you somehow missed). These are on {{Turkish presidential elections}} instead. Cheers, Number57
I think things are being lost in translation on the 2013 Turkish local government reorganisation article. Your use of the word "serve(s)" multiple times in the article doesn't really make the best sense in the English language. For instance, the sentence:
"In all provinces with a population less than 750000 traditional municipalities serve. The municipality of the province capital (Turkish: il merkezi) serves only to the capital city of the province."
Simply doesn't make any sense, with the use of the word "serve" really throwing off the meaning. I'd rearrange most of the page. "Provincial capital municipality," for instance, doesn't really need its own subsection. It should simply be included in a section that discusses regular or basic municipalities in non-metropolitan provinces. The Metropolitan municipalities section reads pretty clearly, though, I'd take out the last sentence and place it in the "District municipalities" section and perhaps add a sentence that these are a type of combined/consolidated municipal-provincial government. However, once you get below that, things needs to be consolidated and clarified. The information in the "Provincial capital municipality" should be rolled into the "District municipality" section. To paraphrase what I'd write for the "District municipality" section:
"District municipalities (Turkish: ilçe) form the basic level of local government in Turkey. Within non-metropolitan provinces, district municipalities are subordinate only to the provincial government based in or administered from a provincial capital municipality, but are otherwise independent from each other. In metropolitan municipalities, district municipalities are largely subordinated to the combined/consolidated municipal-provincial government, which have no provincial capital municipality."
Again, this is only what I can gather from what the page, so I may be wrong. But, perhaps you can use some of my wording to rearrange the page and make it more clear. It seems that this is way less complicated than it currently reads, and by that I mean that other countries have similar municipal and administrative subdivisions. Perhaps reading pages on how other countries are divided at the local level will help to. The only thing I'm still legitimately confused about, I guess, are town municipalities (beldes). I'm not sure how they are different from district municipalities in non-metrpolitan provinces. Maybe, this is something you could talk about the the context of another countries administrative subdivisions to help me understand. For instances, here in American underneath the national level (and then state level, which is a political level of subdivision that does not exist in Turkey) there are counties, which are the basic administrative subdivisions and I guess equivalent to your provinces. Some counties are then further subdivided administratively into townships, which would be roughly equivlent to "district" in Turkey. Overlying county (province) and township (district) level, however, are municipalities (which can actually cross county (province) and township (district) borders) such as cities and villages. I guess at the municipal level American cities would be equivalent to your "district municipalities" and villages might be "town municipalities." You can have multiple district or town municipalities within the borders of (or even across the borders of) districts and provinces. --Criticalthinker (talk) 14:42, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
Well WP is a project of collobration. If you feel something needs to be fixed, please fix it. I'd be only too glad to observe the improvement. As for the text, I guess some concepts can't be translated clearly. The problem is that there are two different sets of administration in Turkey. Governors (vali, kaymakam) are appointed by the government (mainly for the security) . Valis govern in the whole province and kaymakams govern in the districts. Municipalities (mayors) are elected posts and up to 1980 they were responsible only in the urban centers. Now the sphere of influence of the metropolitan municipalities overlap with that of the governor. Belde (town) may be a poor word. It may loosely be translated as subdistrict (third level of government administration). There are none in the metropolitan municipality and they will probably be obsolate in the near future. I hope I made myself clear. Thanks for your interest on the subject. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 07:36, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
BTW, I just wanted to mention that I've tried to help make clearer other country's local government pages, as I'm interested in citie and how they are governered across country. The reason I'm asking you all of these questions and getting so detailed is that if I change something, I want to be sure what I'm talking about. For Turkey, I'm still very confused. I think I'm very close to getting this, but there are still some basic things being lost in translation that I'm hoping you can help me with. I do not want to pester or annoy you, so if you'll entertain my questions, I'd greatly appreciated it. --Criticalthinker (talk) 12:03, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
I think instead of talking about leadership, it would help me rewrite things if we stuck with the names of the subdvisions. Again, if there was anyway to make a chart showing which subdivisions are subordinate to others or even a map showing an example of all the different divisions, that would be very helpful. As far as I can tell it goes something like:
Metropolitan municipality > district
Province > district > district/capital/town/village municipality
That said, I'm not sure if that's correct. So, my questions are in non-metropolitan provinces, does a district contain multiple municipalities? Because it seems that in metropolitan municipalities, once you reach the district level, the entire district is incorporated as a single municipalities so that districts and municipalities essentially share the same borders and function as consolidated district-municipal entities. I guess my other question is is municipalities are administrative subdivisions of districts, or an entire other layer of government like they are in my country? In non-metropolitan provinces, can municipalities cross district and/or provincial borders? Because if that's the case, they aren't subdivisions of districts and provinces, rather an independent level of local government overlapping administrative subdivisions. --Criticalthinker (talk) 11:58, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
Following is the summary of the hierarchical model
Thanks. So, in provinces, are districts also incorporated wholly as municipalities, themselves, or is it only that municipalities/cities can exist within districts? Can there be more than one incorporated municipality/city within a districts in provinces? Give me an example of the hierarchy in a province (less than 750,000) with an incorporated municipality of over 100,000. I'd like to see how villages and cities administrations look as it relates to district and province borders. --Criticalthinker (talk) 14:37, 16 June 2015 (UTC)
I rewrote the article 2013 Turkish local government reorganisation after doing a bit more research. Hopefully, with this rewrite, associated pages (such as the age of metropolitan municipalities, districts, etc...) can be rewritten to fit the new (and better) understanding of administrative divisiona and local government/municipalities in Turkey. Here what I was able to find. The original article made mention of five kinds of municipalities. In reality, I found that there are really only types local governments: combined district-municipality municipalities in metropolitan provinces in which entire districts are governed as municipalities with one additional subordinate level called neighborhoods (mahalle), and then standard town and village municipalities in non-metropolitan provinces. Within the second group in non-metropolitan provinces (standard town and villages municipalities) you have one standard municipality that is designated the capital/administration center called a "district center." In a non-metropolitan province, you also have a district that is designated as the capital/administrative center called a "central district," but this is not really a municipality rather a specially designated district, and a district is just an administrative division, not a municipality. Metropolitan provinces don't have a central district and none of the district municipalities have district centers since each district only includes a single municipality which shares its borders. So, from what I'm able to flesh out to go with the hierarchy you gave above it goes:
Nedim, I had an additional question since city pages on Turkey don't usually make this clear. Are there beldes which share boundaries with the districts in which they are located? I know this is the rule in the metropolitan municipalities where all existing beldes and koys within districts were merged to create a consolidate district-municipality. But, are there any cases outside of metropolitan municipalities where beldes are large enough that there is no other municipality (belde and/or koy) present within a district? Are there any cases outside metropolitan municipalities in which all existing belde and koy have been merged essentially creating a consolidate district-municipality? I ask this, because when you go to most articles for cities in Turkey here on Wikipedia, they seem to conflate city and district, and the district pages also very rarely seem to list the belde and koy located within, and this is unlike the province pages, which do list the districts within these provinces. I'll also ask, again, are there any maps in existence which show the boundaries of belde and koy within districts? --Criticalthinker (talk) 08:46, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
Beldes and köys (village) are a part of the district as far as the district governor is concerned. But except for the metropolitan municipalities they are not a part of the district municipality. Let me give you an example (for non metropolitan municipality). Balkusan is a village with no municipality. Elected village head (muhtar) is considered as a subordinate of the Ermenek (district) governor (ie, kaymakam). But he/she is not a subordinate of Ermenek mayor. I hope this is clear. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 09:14, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
Unfortunately, this did not answer my question, at all. I thought I was rather clear, really. What I wanted to know is whether there are any beldes within districts outside of metropolitan municipalities which share the same boundaries as the district, itself (again, a sort of consolidated district-belde). It seems the answer to this question is "no," but I simple want to be sure.
Again, when you go to city pages for Turkey, they almost never seem to list the local governments (beldes and koys) included within the district (ilce), which I find odd since province pages clearly list the districts within those provinces. It would seem that a district page would list the second tier of divisions within it. I'd just like an example and an article showing a district page which lists the different local governments (belde and koy) within it. --Criticalthinker (talk) 09:17, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
Oh, and to be clear, I do understand your example using Balkusan, but it wasn't really addressing the question I ask. I understand that Balkusan (koy) is subordinate to Eremenek (ilce) and not Ermenek (belde). I guess what is strange to me, again, is that the English-language page for "Ermenek" seems to be a combined page for the belde and the ilce, and that in the "Geography" subsection, it doesn't list Eremenk (belde) as one of the settlements in the district, while seemingly listing every other belde and koy. --Criticalthinker (talk) 09:26, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
No officially speaking Ermenek is ilçe and not belde.(Belde is actually a village which has a municipality.) Ermenek is a small ilçe (district) center. Balkusan is a part of the district but it has nothing to do with the municipality of Ermenek. (Maybe to clear the confusion, it would be wiser to use the words "ilçe" and" belde" instead of the English equivalents. Ex Soviet Union editors frequently use the word "rayon" for a class of settlements) Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 09:38, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
The page for Ermenek says that it is both a town (belde or koy or some kind of municipality) and a district (ilce) which shares the same name as the town. It seems to imply that Ermenek as a settlement has its own local government apart from the district government of the same name. You say it's not a belde, but I was simply using that in a general sense that it has a government; as a district center I imagine it is at least a koy, which is type of local government. Upon further inspection, it does appear that the settlement of Ermenek (not the ilce of Ermenek) IS a belde (http://ermenek.bel.tr/).
Sorry if "belde" is a very specific term; I was simply using it in the sense of "town/city council." Is it not the case that the settlement of Ermenek has an associated local government that exists within the district of the same name? Is it possible you're trying to tell me that the settlement of Ermenek is neither a koy nor a belde but rather has no government, and that entire districts are incorporated as beldes? In that case, any belde and koys within the Ermenek belde-ilce would be second-tier municipalities. That is a question I asked before, but you have at least implied that is not the case. I keep begging you for this, but if you had a map showing belde and koy boundaries within ANY province, that would instantly clear up the confusions and questions I have. --Criticalthinker (talk) 17:52, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
Please see the List of populated places in Karaman Province as an example. (Karaman is not a metropolitan municipality) Each of the 6 sections is about a district (including the central district) and the lists in each section are about the villages in the district (except for the very first entry in the list which happens to be the district center) . Both the province center (i.e. Karaman) and the district (ilçe) centers have municipalities. Also bigger villages (which are officially called belde) have municipalities. For example Balkusan is a village with no municipality. But Güneyyurt with over 5000 population is a village with municipality. I hope this helps. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 18:34, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
Everytime I try to nail something down, though, you change the subject. You originally got me off topic by using Ermenek as an example. When I got something wrong about that, you're moving back on to the province. I was specifically asking you about Ermenek; please respond to that. Ermenek is a settlement (with or without a municipality, I do not know, but it seems to be at least a koy) within the district of the same name, correct? As for lists of populated places in districts, I know here in the United States the page on counties (roughly equivalent to ilce) include all settlements within that county including both those with and without municipalities, but each of those categories are clearly divided out and indentified from one another. So, again, since you orginally brought up the example of the settlement of Ermenek, how is it that you say it doesn't have a corresponding municipality when I posted the link to what appears to be a belde page for Ermenek settlement? (http://ermenek.bel.tr/) --Criticalthinker (talk) 08:10, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
I'm not sure if you're joking or seriously asking. By now everything should be clear. Ermenek is a distrcit center and like all district centers it has a municipality. But the municipality has nothing to do with the villages of Ermenek. A last note; please; follow the link to source . (http://rapory.tuik.gov.tr/22-06-2015-22:09:20-12700617649460550142789483.html) You'll find the official page . In addition to all district centers all villages with are marked by (B) have municipalities and all other villages have none (Becaıuse they are too small to support one.) Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:16, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
This really, really must be something lost in translation. I completely understand that Ermenek municipality has nothing to do with the villages. I'd asked you multiple times. Anyway, all you had to say that the district center had a corresponding municipality. Instead, you said this:
"No officially speaking Ermenek is ilçe and not belde."
See why I was confused? I didn't get confused for no reason. I was clearly confused by something you told me. Ermenek is both the name of a belde and the same of the settlement that is the district center. All I was asking is why it seems district centers seem to have a combined district and municipal page instead of each having their own to prevent this kind of confusing. That makes things confusing for people not familiar with Turkey's system of local government. In my country here on wiki, even county (equivalent to an ilce) gets a page and so does it county seat (district center). It's also the case that while every county (ilce) county seats (district centers), not all county seats have a corresponding local government, though, they usually do.
I am not trying to be rude or mean, I just like to be very precise. It seemed like we were talking past each other, or the subject kept being changed. I do not take this personally, I simply take it as a difference in language/semantics. --Criticalthinker (talk) 15:47, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
Cahit Karakaş
Hi Nedim Ardoğa! At the Cahit Karakaş's biography, you had written "plurality", which I AGF had changed to "majority". As you've reverted my edit, I guess I made a mistake. Would you pls tell me the Turkish word of "plurality" you are using. Thanks a lot. --CeeGee11:27, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, but I wanted to know the Turkish word of it. Your link points out to a legal term in law. I am really a little bit confused. Cheers.--CeeGee11:52, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
As far as I know there is no special word for it. In 1977 CHP gained 212 seats out of 450. That's why in spite of the election victory (highest percentage ever) they were unable to receive the vote of confidence and had difficulty to elect a member of the party to the speakership of the parliament. The majority limit was then 226. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 13:59, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
I see. I was also aware of that fact. However, I'm not sure that "plurality" is the exact term even if "majority" is maybe not even correct for. Anyway, I hope everyone understands what was meant and if not someone can correct it. Thanks for your explanations. --CeeGee15:28, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
Please see "In the News" section of WP for the usage of the word "plurality" in which you have doubts about. (The Social Democrats win a plurality in the Danish parliamentary election) Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 06:58, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
Thanks very much indeed for your hint. I'm now convinced of the correct use of the wording. However, my lang-en is not sufficient enough to understand what it means in lang-tr. Anyway, do not bother it. Cheers.
Hi. Can you take a look at List of consorts of the Ottoman sultans, please? I think Ottoman sultans didn't have wed wives after the reign of Orhan Ghazi until the marriage between Suleiman the Magnificent and Hürrem Sultan. I think the dates provided in that list are not true, besides they're unsourced. For example I think Suleiman didn't marry Mahidevran as historical records show that Hürrem was his only legal wife. Keivan.fTalk18:44, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Also I need your advise about this mess, which is caused by User:Retrieverlove. He or maybe she created two articles about two Ottoman princesses and then moved them to different titles and changed the material a little. Now we have Hatice Sultan (daughter of Ahmed III) and Fatma Sultan (daughter of Ahmed III) with similar material and also Hafsa Sultan and Şehzade Sultan. Well, the first problem is their notability. Was Hafsa Sultan a notable princess? She doesn't have an article in Turkish Wikipedia and I think her date of death has been mistaken with Hafize Sultan, another daughter of Selim I from another wife. I don't even know that Şehzade Sultan was a real person or not. Did she exist? Selim I's Turkish article which is also a featured one, doesn't list the name of this girl in his children's list. Also here in their articles you can see that Çoban Mustafa Pasha is said to be their husband, while he was married to a daughter of Selim I named Hatun Sultan. The problem with Hatice Sultan (daughter of Ahmed III) and Fatma Sultan (daughter of Ahmed III) is that they already have the same material. Unfortunately Ahmed III had two daughters named Fatma and Hatice. I can't find out which one was the influential one and which one wasn't notable at all. As you have had many experiences in Turkish and Ottoman topics, can you help to solve these problems? Keivan.fTalk19:22, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
As for your first comment I agree with you. Hürrem is notable for being a legal wife. I have started the article Mahidevran. I never came across a source about her being a legal wife. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 17:18, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
Belediye
Now that I have a better understanding of districts, I had a few questions about local city/town governments I thought you might be able to answer for me.
The first question is about the sense of the difference of the terms "belde" and "belediye." Is it that "belde" is a term to talk about a spatial/physical settlement area (urban settlement) and "belediye" speaks more to the sense of an associated local government around that belde?
My second question is whether or not belediye can cross district and provincial boundaries? For instance, in my country, belediye-equivalent municipality (incorporated cities and villages councils/local governments) can cross/exist within multiple district-equivalent divisions (counties), but a belediye-equivalent municipality can not cross a state (roughly equivalent to province) border even if the physical settlement does cross state boundaries. In that case, each half of the settlement is incorporated as seperate local governments in each state (see: Kansas City, Kansas and Kansas City, Missouri as an example).
Lastly, are there any examples of belediye that include more than one belde within its boundaries? Or, are belediye associated within only one belde? I know in my country with very few exceptions, belediye-equivalent municipalities only cover one contiguous urban settlement. In larger cities, the urbanized area may spill outside belediye boundaries, in in that case, these areas simply incorporate as new belediye so that you can have a grouping of suburban belediye surrounding a central belediye (which may or may not be a district or provincial center). Thanks! --Criticalthinker (talk) 11:59, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
The answers (all for non metropolitan municipalities)
Belediye is an elected post. It is responsible only in one urban settlement. Belde means a village with a belediye. (Most villages don’t have a belediye) The il (province center) and the ilçe (district center) also have a belediye. But they are not called belde.
Belediye border can’t cross the ilçe border. Just the reverse they are limited only to urban fabric. Any village in the rural area of the ilçe but out of the urban fabric is not a part of the ilçe belediye . But it may have a belde municipality of its own.
No belediye is reponsible in more than one settlement. The example you have given seem to be similar to metropolitan municipaliy. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 17:06, 2 July 2015 (UTC)
Thank you. So, it appears belediye (as it seems to be defined on its own wikipedia page) is much what I thought it to be. It's the title of the local government/municipal council, and belde is the name of the physical settlement. To clarify this sentence, though...
"Belediye border can’t cross the ilçe border. Just the reverse they are limited only to urban fabric."
The urban fabric of a city/settlement often aren't contained to district borders (even with smaller cities and sometimes villages) around most parts of the world, and I doubt Turkey is any exception. So, I guess what you are saying is that in the case a city/settlement does cross a district border that a new belde is created for that part of the city/settlement on the other side of the district border. Just as another example, where I live in America, my own city/settlement and it's associated local/municipal government actually exists within three different counties. It's not a huge city (a bit over 100,000), but it's wedged up into the very corner of its county, and when the urban area grew the belediye (city council) expanded its borders to include new parts of the settlement in the other ilce (counties). I guess this is not possible in Turkey where each of the areas that extend into the other counties would have their own seperate municipal governments. --Criticalthinker (talk) 20:12, 3 July 2015 (UTC)
Oh, I have an additional question to even the one I asked above, Nedim Ardoğa. I hope you are getting annoyed with me; I'm just very interested in your company and how local government works. :) I noticed in the 2013 Turkish local government reorganisation that I rewrote that I may have gotten something wrong. In the "number of municipalities" section at the bottom of the article, which I did not change, I noticed for the first time, today, that there appears to be district municipalities in non-metropolitan municipalities/provinces. In fact, the article says that there are even more of these than town municipalities. I was under the impression that only in metropolitan municipalities were the various belde in each ilce very merged to form a single belde-ilce government. This would also expalin why on some city articles why there sometimes sees to be a page that describes a "city and a district":
"Gelibolu, also known as Gallipoli (from Greek: Καλλίπολις, kallipolis, "beautiful city"), is the name of a town and a district..."
So, there are districts outside metropolitan municipalities in the provinces that are also wholly governed as belde just like those in the metropolitan municipalities? Is this mostly only in central districts? Did the local government reoganisation mean that all ilçe merkezi were merged with their il merkezi? If this is the case, I need to correct the article, as I seem to imply that district municipalities are only present in metropolitan municipalities. Understanding this might finally allow me a full understanding of how local government in Turkey works, and then I can finally get around to clarifying the List of districts in Turkey article. The "district municipality" concept reminds me a lot of the consolidated city-county concept we have here in America where counties (ilce) might have had multiple city councils (belediye), originally, but at some time in its history the city government merged with the county government merged and the county largely becomes governed as a city with no other city councils within the county. I think the only difference in district municipalities is that while the belediye and ilce overlap one another in terms as its borders and boundaries are concerned, at least in the districts that are not central districts, this new metropolitan municipality still includes both kaymakam and saşkanı (along with the belediye council). This little fact is less important than my original question, but interesting nonetheless. Anyway, let me know if I'm correct. --Criticalthinker (talk) 15:40, 4 July 2015 (UTC)
Gelibolu is a district center and not a belde. But with a population of 30000 it is a small center. I think the creator Barıstarım in 2007, who now seems to be inactive in WP , used the unofficial term town. Remember in 2007 there were no belde articles in WP, and he probably thought a small semantic shift would cause no harm. (I came across other similar "disrict and town" phrases in WP for other small district centers. ) Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 17:43, 4 July 2015 (UTC)
"All district centers have municipalities (belediye)."
Is this not the true? Does the settlement of Gelibolu not have an assoicated local government/municipality? If that is not true, that will indeed be helpful when I rewrite that article.
EDIT: I see what the confusing is. I'm using belde/belediye interchangeably. When I speak of either of these terms or even the term "city", please know that I'm talking about a "city/town/village with a council or local government." Gelibolu is very much a belediye. I apologize if I confused you. Perhaps it would help if I simply started using the term "municipality?" I thought I was fairly clear that I'm talking about local governments as opposed to urban settlement (belde) unless otherwise specified. Anyway, I guess I was only asking if a place liek Gelibolu was a "district municipality" since that's what the local government page here seems to imply as it gives Gelibolu as an example of a "district municipality" with is a district in which all existing belediye have been merged into one belediye thereby sharing the borders of the district in which is resides. --Criticalthinker (talk) 09:46, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
Anyway, back on the issue I was asking you about, there are "district municipalities" in some provinces? As I said, I thought these consolidated ilce-belediye only existed with metropolitan municipalities. What are some examples of district municipalities outside of metropolitan municipalities? The local government reorganisation page said that Gelibolu is a district municipality. Again, my understanding of "district municipality" was that it merged all local governments/councils into any one district into a single council that shared the same borders as the district. I was under the impression that these mergers of belediye and koy and such only occured within metropolitan municipalities, but the local government page here on wiki says that there are a total of 400 district municipalities in the provinces outside the metropolitan municipalities. --Criticalthinker (talk) 09:31, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
All ilçe (district) centers have belediye (municipality) without exception. But their sphere of influence is limited to the district center only. In general villages don't have a belediye. Relatively populous villages ( population more than 2000) may have a belediye if they vote for it. In this case the village is called belde. In a typical province there may be 10 districts and about 20-40 villages in each district. In addition to district center belediye there may be two or three belde belediyes in each district. As for an example please see the template
(This template lists all provinces; for non metropolitan municipalities you can see such provinces as Karaman, Niğde, Artvin etc.) In these lists beldes are not specified. For Ulukışla district of Niğde I can list the beldes; Çiftehan , Darboğaz and Yeniyıldız. They have belde belediyes, the other villages don't have a belediye. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:19, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
I remember now; there is also a series of articles about the municipalities. For Niğde see List of municipalities in Niğde Province. (Somebody had created this series before the metropolitan municipalities Law. So this list is void for the metropolitan municipalities. But for 51 provinces the list still holds.) Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:56, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
I have to keep asking, because I've asked it three times, now, but the page dealing with the 2013 local government reorganisation has a charter which said that there are 400 district municipalities in the provinces outside of metropolitan municipalities. My question was whether these are structured in the exact same way at the district municipalities within the metropolitan municipalities functioned? To reiterate my understanding of a district municipality, it's when a district center belediye has been merged with the rest of the a territory (other town municipalities and koy) in a district so that the new enlarged belediye and district share the same boundaries, right? I was aware that all districts within metropolitan municipalities were made district municipalities, but I did not know that there were so many district municipalities in the provinces. Could you give me some examples of these district municipalities in the provinces, and also tell me if my understanding of district municipalities is correct? Thanks. --Criticalthinker (talk) 12:20, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
Different administration policies. Hard to explain. When I say ilçe this means, an area in a il which is governed by kaymakam ( an appointed governor) . He/she is responsinble mainly in the security and the central government services (When say central government you can take in like "federal" in the US.) . In 51 ils the mayor is only responsible in a single settlement (either the ilçe center or a belde in the district). He/she is responsible in typical urban services (but not the security and the other central government services.) But in metropolitan municipalities, the ilçe mayor is also responsible in villages and thus the belde municipalities cease to exist. As for your question; the functions of the ilçe municipalities in 30 and 51 ils are exactly the same except that in 30 ils their area of service includes the rural area as well. Also they are considered as the subordinate the metropolitan municipality. In 30 ils the ilçe and the ilçe municipality share the same boundry. You have asked for an example. I think I've already given the example of Niğde (il) Ulukışla (ilçe). In Ulukışla except for the ilçe center municipality there are three belde municipalities. (Niğde is one among the 51 ils). For 30 ils you can check Mersin Province. (In this case there is one and only ane municipality for an ilçe. There is no belde municipality.) Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 13:31, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. Yes, I understand how they function in the 30 metropolitan municipalities, so I need to know nothing more of them so as to avoid further confusion or distraction. My misunderstanding came from me being under the impression that the local government reorginsation only reorganised the districts within the metropolitan municipalities, and not the districts in the 51 provinces. I guess now I'm going to have to find a list for all of the ilce municipaliities in the 51 provinces, since they are distinct from (and essentially dissolve) town municipalities. There seems to be 400 of these icle municipalities in the 51 provinces. I assume that every central district must be merged ilce/town municipality. This new understanding of ilce municipalities will help me make corrections to the local government reorganisation page where I currently only desribe metropolitan municipalities as having ilce municipalities. This was a mistake and misunderstanding on my part. --Criticalthinker (talk) 15:34, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
Oh, I asked for examples of district municipalities in the provinces. On the page 2013 Turkish local government reorganisation is says that there are 400 of these outside the metropolitan municipalities in the provinces. It gives Gelibolu in Çanakkale Province as one example. Are there any patterns as to which districts outside of the metropolitan municipalities are district municipalities? Is it more common that central districts are usually district municipalities? --Criticalthinker (talk) 18:05, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
I didn't quite understand your question. But let me give you some examples. Bilecik Province is a small il ( non metropolitan municipality). Bilecik, Bozüyük and Dodurga have municipalities; il center, ilçe center and belde municipality respectively. They are all independent of each other. Now for metropolitan municipality; Mersin (metropolitan municipality), Yenişehir ilçe municipality and Tarsus ilçe municipality. Yenişehir is a part of Greater Mersin (ie in Mersin urban fabric) But Tarsus is out of Mersin . Both are subordinate municipalities in Mersin metropolitan municipality . (Note that there are no beldes in Mersin). Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 20:03, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
I apologize for confusing you, though, I think my question is very clear. Go to the 2013 Turkish local government reorganisation page. In the chart at the bottom, it shows 400 district (ilce) municipalities outside metropolitan municipalities, meaning that they'd be in the provinces. Is this not correct? Does that chart need to be corrected? Again, I am not confused about how ilce municipalities work within the boundaries of a metropolitan municipality. What I'm interested is where the ones exist outside of metropolitan municipalities. The page seems to give Gelibolu as a ilce municipality in the chart at the bottom of the page, but when I do a bit of research, this doesn't seem to be true. Gelibolu seems to be a regular district with municipalities in it. Did someone compose the chart incorrectly and "district municipality" is supposed to read "district center"? That's the only conclusion I can draw if ilce municipalities do not exists in the provinces. --Criticalthinker (talk) 12:50, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
Please note that there are two sets of municipalities. In metropolitan municipalities (30) all ilçe municipalities are subordinate of the metropolitan municipality. (Their functions differ. For example streets wider than a certain width are constructed by the metropolitan municipality and the others by the ilçe municipality. etc.) There are no beldes. Well in the second set (51) all municipalities are independent of each other .There is nothing wrong in the table you've referred. Gelibolu is in Çamakkale Province. Çanakkale is not a metropolitan municipality and Gelibolu (like other 399) is independent of the municipality in the capital of the province. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 13:02, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
EDIT: According to this source, it appears my suspicions were correct. In the provinces (and in the metropolitan municipalities prior to their reorganisation) "district municipalities" are simply another name for the district centers, minus the municipalities that serve as the provincial centers which double as the "provincial municipality". In other words, a "district municipality" in the 51 provinces is simply the district center of any given district. All other municipalities in the provinces are simply "town/city municipalities." So, in the case of Gelibolu, Gelibolu is a "district municipality" within the "Gelibolu District" within "Canakkale Province." I'm not sure if Gelibolu District includes additional "town municipalities", but many other districts include multiple town municipalities (belde) along with the "district municipality."
The only difference in the 30 metropolitan municipalities is that the "district municipality" in each district now includes all of the territory of the district, including any former outlying "town municipalities," villages, and empty territory. With this information, I can finally rewrite 2013 Turkish local government reorganisation and List of districts in Turkey to make them more clear. Thank you for all your help. It is because of you that I went and did more research to figure all of this out. If I have any further questions, it will simply be about the Turkish names of the different divisions and designations (i.e. "town municipality", "district municipality", "provincial municipality", and "metropolitan municipality" etc...) --Criticalthinker (talk) 17:29, 8 July 2015 (UTC)
I'm still waiting to definitively confirm this from another source, so I'll just ask you while I'm waiting. Is the link I posted in the reply above correct in the meaning of the term "district municipality" in the provinces? That "district municipality" is simply another name for a district center in the provinces? Using the example, again, so the municipality of Gelibolu is the "district municipality" of/for Gelilbolu District and that any other municipalities in that district if any exist would simply be called town municipalities? --Criticalthinker (talk) 18:31, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
It's difficult to translate İlçe exactly. In WP and in other places its it is translated as district. But maybe county, or department may be better equivalents.It is usually a smaller city and the surrounding rural area in a province governed by kaymakam. Kaymakam is a subordinate of vali (province goverrnor).İlçe municipality is the municipality responsible only in the ilçe center (not the rural area.) By the law of metropolitan municipalities, the area of responsibility of the ilçe municipality in 30 provinces is increased to include the rural area also. (I feel I'm repeating myself, haven't I explained this before?)Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 21:02, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
"İlçe municipality is the municipality responsible only in the ilçe center (not the rural area.) By the law of metropolitan municipalities, the area of responsibility of the ilçe municipality in 30 provinces is increased to include the rural area also."
Thank you. That finally answered the question for me, that ilce municipalities are just the formal designation of district centers (ilçe merkezi). In other words an ilce municipality is a town municipality that is the district center. Sorry that it took this long; things were being lost in translation. Anyway, could you give me the Turkish terms/proper name for ilce municipality and provincial municipality/center? Thanks, again. --Criticalthinker (talk) 07:38, 18 July 2015 (UTC)
Belediye is municipality; belediye başkanı is mayor. İl is the maim administrative unit (roughly province, presently there are 81 of them) ilçe is the second level administrative unit (as I've explaned before) Municipalities in il and ilçe don't have a special title only il belediyesi (province municipality) and ilçe belediyesi (second level municipality).Belde belediyesi, (only in 51 provinces) is third level municipality. (The suffix -si used for the possesive form). I sincely hope that this ends the discussion. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 11:05, 18 July 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Nedim! I'm Coderenius! I don't think we've met yet, I am a friend of C.G's and I am a native of Turkey living in the U.S, currently contributing to WPTR. I'm am one of the newer users to join WPTR, so it's great to meet someone with a lot of experience like you. You might be able to figure out my first name from my username. If you want to learn more about me, then by all means visit my talk page! Either way, bayramınız mübarek olsun, and I wish you lots of happiness these next few days. It's great to meet you.
The main reason I'm here is because I would like you to finish the DYK review for Dilek Peninsula-Büyük Menderes Delta National Park. Time is running out for it to be elligible, so feel free to provide feedback on the article on my talk page. However, the review discussion for the article is here, and what I really need you to do is give it the final review to see if it's ready for Did you know. Wishing you the best, Coderenius (talk) 17:07, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi, can I interest you in this month's stub drive, with 10 missing articles for Turkish archaeology?
[2] Feel free to add further missing articles to the list.♦ Dr. Blofeld17:40, 7 August 2015 (UTC)
Can you check the material further down the page? It's giving more specifics. NB: Some sources actually do give Van kedi, so we need to account for that. If it's not a singular what is it? A diminutive, like "Van kitty"? A term for kittens in particular? A regionalism? Actually, I asked this at the project page. Anyway, the Van cat#History section is the part with questionable linguistic info. — SMcCandlish ☺☏¢ ≽ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ≼ 01:15, 20 August 2015 (UTC)
You're welcome. The begining year of the term of the 9th Parliament of Turkey in the succession box seems to be in error. Pls check. Maybe 1950 instead of 1954?
Anti-Ottoman Sentiment in the Ottoman Empire article
There is growing faction of anti-Ottoman, I would like your take and advice on it. Various people are trying to put dead people on the section of decline put the picture falls onto the government sectioon of the Ottoman Empire. Your feedback will be much appreciated. Alexis Ivanov (talk) 04:48, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
I noticed you have used this source:Prof. Yaşar Yüce-Prof. Ali Sevim: Türkiye tarihi Cilt III, AKDTYKTTK Yayınları, İstanbul, 1991.[3]
Would you happen to have access to pages 38-40 of this book? Could you verify that it mentions the Siege of Nagykanizsa and supports this edit? Thanks. --Kansas Bear (talk) 06:07, 16 October 2015 (UTC)
The cited source is about the Siege of Nagykanizsa. The source says that the Austrian losses were heavy. But apart from that I couldn't find any reference to 47 cannons or 6000 wounded soldiers. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 15:06, 17 October 2015 (UTC)
Hi Nedim.
If possible, I need your help to translate a few verses from Turkish to English from the elegy of Dukaginzade Yahya bey. see here [4]. Or maybe you can redirect it to someone else suited. The online translation tools are far behind where they should be. A few verses would be ok, they are listed by the end of the pdf document starting from page 37.
Thanks. Mondiad (talk) 21:28, 12 November 2015 (UTC)
I wish to be helpful. But unfortunately I am not a poet and I have no idea how to use an ornamental language. But as far as the translation of the words go the first six verses may be something like the following. (This poem was created after prince Mustafa was killed by the orders of his father)
Help, woe to me, a part of this world is destroyed ; for death bandits killed şehzade (prince) Mustafa
The sun of his face set down; his divan (board) was dispersed. With tricks they forced the Ottoman sultan to sin
Whenever his name was mentioned they critized the hero of the battles maliciously; fate turned the sultan to their side
The slander and the secret grudge of the liars shed tear from our eyes; ignited the fire of separation
He never murdered (anybody) like a murderer; (but) his life was drownd in the flood of calamity, his comrades were spread
I wish I have never seen this event. What a shame; my eyes didn't approve this treatment to him.
Hi Nedim. I have to disturb you again.
I am having hard time finding a reliable translation tool online.
Can you please translate this as well? It comes from [5]
“
Hamse’inde Gencîne-i Râz, Kitâb-ı Usûl ve Gülşen-i Envâr mesnevilerinde üç ayrı Öyküde onu Öykülerinin kahramanı yapmış, ayrıca bizzat konusunu Mesnevî‟den alan, “Süleyman Peygamber`le Sivrisinek” Öyküsini aynen nakletmiştir.
Well according to this source ([6]) this is supposed to be a story of Mevlana: According to Muslim tradition Süleyman (prophet) is the prophet of all animals. One day a mosquito appears before Süleyman's court complaining of the wind. Süleyman says that the court shoıuld hear both sides and calls the wind to court. But when the wind comes blowing, the mosquito is carried away with the force of the wind. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 08:19, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
Hi Nedim.
We have two poem names Nāz ü-Niyās and Sulaimān-name ( or Sulaimānname). How would you translate them in English?
Thanks! Mondiad (talk) 03:11, 15 November 2015 (UTC)
Süleymanname means biography of Süleyman.But the other one is immensely more difficult.Although used in an Ottoman poem, these words are not Turkish. You probably know that the divan poetry had imported many Arabic words especially in religious matters. As far as I understand, naz means coyness; ü means and; niyaz (not niyas) means supplication all in religious sense. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 21:11, 15 November 2015 (UTC)
Now, I saw an article like that: Hara Huna Kingdom It sounds like "Black Huns". Also please look at Kidarites. That article says: The Kidarite... were a dynasty of the "Ki" clan, probably originating from the Hara Huna Kingdom. They were part of the complex of Iranian-speaking tribes known collectively as Xionites or "Hunas". / And I think,with Hephthalite Empire all of them were Huns. Böri (talk) 08:51, 29 November 2015 (UTC)
and on internet I found: Indians identified two branches of the Hunnic nation: the Sveta Huna (White Huns, i.e the Hephtalite Huns) and the Hara Huna (possibly Black Huns) Böri (talk) 12:57, 1 December 2015 (UTC)
Are there Websites listing Beylerbeys of certain Eyalets?
Especially Turkish websites if they are listing any, for example "Silistre Beylerbeyliği", some Eyalets in Wikipedia have lists, some don't even have English lists they have other language lists, for example the Buda Eyalet, the Hungarian version of the website is crazy, there is a page with the list of the Pashas the Turkish page uses the same Hungarian source, there is even a page dedicated to the Buda Pasha, something that will never see in English Wikipedia. Anyway I was thinking there must be some websites out there probably Turkish listing the pasha of Eyalets. Wondering if you can find it. I don't speak Turkish but I still use Google Translate. Alexis Ivanov (talk) 00:48, 1 December 2015 (UTC)
Hi, I represent Birol Güven and his company on social media. He is an important celebrity in Turkey and his Turkish wiki page is: (türkçe wiki adresini gir buraya) We understand that other people have created an English wiki page for Birol Güven for before and it was deleted. We'd like to create a new page in accordance with Wikipedia rules. What can we do to create this page? Could you help us? (https://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birol_G%C3%BCven) E-posta adresi mi versem daha detaylı konuşmak için iletişime geçebilir misiniz? 88.240.126.70 (talk) 11:51, 11 December 2015 (UTC)
Of course you can recreate a page. I also saw that his page was deleted. But you can recreate it, no problem. I'll help you. But since he is a living person please don't forget to source it. WP is very keen on sourcing, especially for living people. Happy editing. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 11:57, 11 December 2015 (UTC)
Thank you very much. Can you contact me please? Can you send a mail to my mail address? We can speak the details. ertanguven@mint.com.tr 88.240.126.70 (talk) 12:54, 11 December 2015 (UTC)
There are two problems, the article has been deleted because the bot decided that it is a copy of the source. You should use the source but you are not allowed to copy it. In other words you should write your own text. Second problem is that the editor Ertanguven is blocked. If you feel the block is unjust, you can appeal by using the template in your talk page. Cheers. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 18:47, 11 December 2015 (UTC)
Açıkcası neyi nasıl yapacağımızı bilmiyoruz. Rica etsem bir eposta bırakma şansınız var mı verdiğim adrese? Yanlış bir şey yapmak istemiyoruz. Zarar vermek gibi bir amacımızda yok gerçekten. Teşekkürler ilginiz için tekrardan. Epostanızı bekliyor olacağım. 37.154.142.207 (talk) 05:04, 13 December 2015 (UTC)
Birol Güven
So many problems. The article has been deleted twice more by admins Chrislk02 and Diannaa because
Ertanguvenn is a blocked editor trying to evade his block. Diannaa has also protected the article from any further recreation.
There are also issues with what appears to be a shared account What can we do to create this page? Could you help us? which is not permitted anyway, and there is clearly a conflict of interest (COI) and paid advocacy I represent Birol Güven and his company on social media. Paid advocacy involves being compensated by a person, group, company or organisation to use Wikipedia to promote their interests. Paid advocacy is prohibited by our policies on neutral point of view and what Wikipedia is not, and is an especially egregious type of COI; the Wikimedia Foundation regards it as a black hat practice.
Paid advocates are very strongly discouraged from direct article editing, and should instead propose changes on the talk page of the article in question if an article exists, and if it does not, from attempting to write an article at all. At best, any proposed article creation should be submitted through the articles for creation process, rather than directly.
Conflicted users are required by the Wikimedia Terms of Use to disclose their employer, client and affiliation. and post such a mandatory disclosure to their user page using template {{Paid}}.
The text is sourced to a site of unknown provenance, and has a promotional tone had great rating success with even its reruns being the most watched TV program on the day they were broadcast.
I appreciate that you are acting in good faith, but whether Birol Güven is notable or not, Ertanguvenn will not be permitted to promote his client for the reasons given above Jimfbleak - talk to me?13:21, 17 December 2015 (UTC)
I think I was unable to express myself. I am not interceding for a sock puppet. I only ask to how to remove the ban on the article. (After all, it is the editor who has to be punished, not the article) Cheers. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:53, 17 December 2015 (UTC)
Why did you put back those information on Mahidevran's article? Some statements by a person who claims to be of royalty isn't notable at all. I have at least discussed this issue with two administrators and they agreed that these kinds of sources are unreliable. Keivan.fTalk06:23, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
Hi Keivan, When I created the article Mahidevran back in 2009, it was one of the trivial articles of WP and in the first year almost nobody made any significant contribution to it. But later thanks to TV series Muhteşem Yüzyıl it became a popular edittng article and now the no. of edits exceed 1000. Thank you for your contributions. However edit warring is not a contribution. I don't understand why you're so willing to remove Saide Perizat's words. In WP there are uncountable examples of passages taken from interviews. You question whether Saide descents from Mahidevran. Well it is claimed by the newspapers and since newspapers are used as references in WP, unless the opposite is proven, we can rely on it. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 10:55, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
I don't say that news aren't reliable sources. I have used them many times as references for the articles that I edit. But actually they are reliable for the articles that are about individuals who have lived since 20th century. Of course you can get news about their relationships, public appearances and interviews from newspapers but for such historical claim about a person who lived 500 years ago they can't be considered reliable. Those newspapers actually repeat Perizat's statements. They can't prove whether she is one of Mahidevran's descendants or not. Besides all the things that are written on newspapers can't be considered reliable. There were also such information on other sultanas' articles which were removed by other users and even administrators. Keivan.fTalk11:57, 23 December 2015 (UTC)
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