User talk:Azirlazarus

Welcome!

Hello, Azirlazarus, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

Please remember to sign your messages on talk pages by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{help me}} before the question. Again, welcome! — Joaquin008 ^(talk) 13:30, 17 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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Starting an article does not give you any right to insert your POV. Please refer to WP rules. Egeymi (talk) 15:44, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'm a leading Gezi protestor and I confidently can assure you that the image itself is POV. It intentionally misleads the motivation of resistance. If otherwise argued, it should be brought to discuss section. Azirlazarus (talk) 15:48, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

If you read the article you will see that it is a reflection of people's anger against the government, stated by journalists and academics. If you have any problem with the photo you may suggest to delete it. But what is the link between the article and Istanbul bombings given in "see also" section? Then put all incidents happened in ıstanbul, but also in Ankara, Izmir and other provinces where demonstrations occur. Egeymi (talk) 15:54, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Nationalist elements?

Dear Azirlazarus, what exactly shows the nationalist aspirations of the protests shown in this photo? --Երևանցի ^talk 15:50, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

First of all, the Turkish flags. All that who live in Turkey will easily liken it Republic Protests which had carried Turkish nationalist and Kemalist aspirations, finally leading to E-memorandum (basically the armed forces threatening the government to step down). The second is T.C. thing. It was a wide discussion between nationalists and the rest for some months now. T.C. (Türkiye Cumhuriyeti, Republic of Turkey) was removed from a banner of an institution of health ministry and got criticism from nationalist segments, causing stir. Seing it in this prominent protest's page, one would easily get the misconception that gezi resistance is in hands of the same people. A bad bad bad misconception for simply an environmentalist and anti-government resistance, don't you think? Azirlazarus (talk) 16:02, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think Kemalism/Republicanism should be confused with nationalism. Generally, Kemalists advocate for secularism, while nationalists are simply anti-Armenian and anti-Greek. Ataturk is widely recognized as the founder of modern Turkey and the Turkish flag, I think, can be seen in many non-nationalist protests.

At last, nobody ever stated the protests are organized by nationalists. As I understand, there are several major groups in the protesting masses: environmentalists (the original protesters), Kemalsists (anti-Erdogan forces) and nationalists. I do think it's wrong to present this anti-government protests as nationalist, but nobody tries to do so. Let's be honest, people with Kemalist views must be significant part of the gathered at Taksim, even if the protests were initially simply environmentalist and anti-government. I think that including this picture in the article doesn't suggest that the protest have nationalist goals. --Երևանցի ^talk 16:18, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

That doesn't really refute both my arguments. No words on T.C. thing? It's a symbol of nationalists and Kemalists. Still, why insist on adding this contested picture? There are many more pictures that represent the soul of the movement here. Azirlazarus (talk) 16:28, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Alright, you are an insider. I'll go with you on this.

By the way, how do you think this protests will conclude? Are they just starting or its almost the end? You see a possible involvement of the army? --Երևանցի ^talk 16:34, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Ce n'est pas un revolution, I can guarantee that. Erdoğan is a legitimately elected PM with free and fair elections and we always can bring him down in next year's general elections. Still, it's the first time Istanbulites rise up for environment and again it is the first time Erdoğan is that vigorously contested by a surprising coalition of various segments of the society. He'll now know that he can't just do anything he pleases. All in all, this is a step up for Turkish democracy and I think we've already won by forcing the police out of the Square. Movement'll fade away slowly from this point forth (reserving a possibility of igniting again in any case of a stupid move by government). Azirlazarus (talk) 16:45, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

That's interesting. I think everyone will benefit in more democratization of Turkey. You don't see any sings a Egyptian/Syrian scenario here? --Երևանցի ^talk 17:07, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Not a chance, no. Because, Turkish model still has its core merits. Azirlazarus (talk) 17:11, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

We'll see how it goes. Thank you for sharing your views. --Երևանցի ^talk 17:20, 1 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]