Template talk:Country data Saint Martin

Local flag

could someone add Saint Martin Local Flag to the template ? some organizations use this flag for Saint Martin. Example. Mohsen1248 (talk) 19:49, 11 December 2012 (UTC)

Shouldn't the local flag actually be the white collectivity flag? According to Flags of the world this seems to be more official than the blue one, of wich there is not evidence that is actually used on the island.Grioghair (talk) 07:18, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

Edit request

The local flag image that is currently used (File:Flag of Saint-Martin (fictional).svg) is not the correct flag - this flag possibly doesn't even exist. See this page on the reliable Flags of the World website for more information. Please change it to File:Flag of the Collectivity of Saint Martin.png. Bazonka (talk) 00:06, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Partly done: The Collectivity flag has been listed first, and a note has been left at the bottom of the documentation about the local flag's "dubious" nature. – Paine Ellsworth ^CLIMAX!

Can the collectivity flag be removed again? It's a non-free file and as such shouldn't be used as a flagicon. SiBr₄ (talk) 09:26, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

• Un-done: This request (or completed parts of it) have been undone. Please establish a new consensus before re-requesting this change. Technical 13 (talk) 15:23, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

There are two solutions to this I think. We link to the Flag of France only. Or we replace the non-free image with the image off Flags of the World at [1]. The site indicates that we can use this as long as we quote the source - see [2]. Using the fictional flag is absolutely unacceptable though - it's just wrong. Bazonka (talk) 17:43, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

FotW forbids commercial use of its content, so the images from FotW aren't free either (see WP:NONCOM). SiBr₄ (talk) 19:00, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

OK, so unless we intend to keep the fictional flag, we are left with just one option - the use of the French flag only. Unless anyone disagrees, I will make another edit request. Bazonka (talk) 19:35, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Does the fact that it's not used locally actually make the "Martini glass" flag "wrong"? The flag is used to represent Saint Martin by several websites, even if it was just made up by someone. It's a different issue if a reported local flag turns out to represent something else, such as the green/yellow flag of Akrotiri and Dhekelia. SiBr₄ (talk) 19:57, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Yes of course it's wrong. Wikipedia shouldn't propagate a known error, even if other sites continue to do so. If it was a well-known flag then perhaps there could be some justification, but hardly anyone is likely to recognise it anyway, so we really must be factually accurate. Whilst perhaps not as precise as a flag pertaining specifically to the island/territory, the flag of France is still accurate. In the absence of other options, I think this is what we have to use. I therefore propose the removal of the local option from this template. Bazonka (talk) 20:15, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

I can't really think of another example of a flag that is neither official nor actually used. Many other French overseas areas have unofficial flags, but I don't know whether these are used locally. Maybe it is indeed best to stop using the Martini flag entirely (at least by removing it from the template). SiBr₄ (talk) 21:01, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

(edit conflict) I'm entirely neutral either way, but as long as the image is only displayed on article pages, then it does fall in the realm of fair use. We can make sure it is only transcluded on articles with something like:

{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}||<includeonly>[[File:Example.jpg|30px]]</includeonly>|[[:File:Example.jpg]]}}

Which renders like: File:Example.jpg on all non-article space pages. Werieth, am I correct in saying this? Technical 13 (talk) 21:21, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

usage of non-free files via templates is not allowed. Werieth (talk) 21:23, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Werieth, even if they are only transcluded on articles? Which NFCC is that (I'm asking to learn, not because I don't trust you). Thanks! Technical 13 (talk) 21:48, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

That would fall under WP:NFCC #3&8. We only include non-free files where absolutely needed. Werieth (talk) 21:50, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

If you added the file to this template you would be adding a non-free file to 672 pages. That is at least 25 times more than the file that currently holds the most used non-free file record. Also how are you going to meet WP:NFCC#10c? I feel sorry for the SoB who has to write almost 700 non free rationales. Werieth (talk) 21:53, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

No, it would only be 27 pages. Most of the 672 use the main French flag; hardly any use the /local variant. Bazonka (talk) 21:59, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Still there is no reason to make the collectivity flag available via this template. In the few articles in which a particular non-free flag may be used, it's better to transclude it directly. This way it's easier to locate non-free files that are used without FUR, and the image links to the file page showing the non-free details. Also, the country data templates are almost always used for flagicons, for which it seems unacceptable to use non-free images (flagicons are usually decorative and the used images are never described or discussed). SiBr₄ (talk) 22:39, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

As per discussion above, please remove the "fictional" Local version of the flag - it's not official and isn't used. Thanks, Bazonka (talk) 23:03, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

Done -- John of Reading (talk) 07:30, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

Edit request 2

Please add [[Category:Country data redirects|Saint Martin]] to the redirect at Template:Country data Collectivity of Saint Martin. SiBr₄ (talk) 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

Done — {{U|Technical 13}} ^{(t • e • c)} 16:44, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

Edit request 3

Could someone please add the local flag of Saint Martin to the template? The "local" parameter should display File:Flag of the Collectivity of Saint Martin.png. Davykamanzi → talk · contribs 15:45, 27 April 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, that's a non-free image, so we can't use it just for decoration. -- John of Reading (talk) 16:11, 27 April 2014 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 21 July 2017

Please fix the link-alias-football line. The correct code is: link alias-football=Saint-Martin {{{mw}}} national {{{age}}} football team
Maiō T. (talk) 21:16, 21 July 2017 (UTC)

Not done: Maiō T., I'm not really sure what you're trying to accomplish with this change. What are {{{mw}}} and {{{age}}} supposed to be doing? I am unaware of this template requiring those inputs. Primefac (talk) 14:04, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

@Primefac: See the bottom line of this section. Wikilink of Saint Martin team is displayed incorrectly (it's men's "A" team instead of women's under-20) and, definitely, this edit will fix it. Maiō T. (talk) 15:26, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

The other option would be to drop the link alias-football altogether; I can't see any other Country data templates on that example page that use it. Primefac (talk) 16:50, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

@Primefac: I've created Template:Country data Saint Martin/sandbox with that mentioned code
Saint Martin ← this is the result of {{fbwu|20|Saint Martin}}
Saint Martin ← this is the result of {{fbwu|20|Saint Martin/sandbox}}
"fbwu20" means: football, women, under 20 years. Maiō T. (talk) 19:50, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

@Primefac: I've edited the sandbox: I've removed the football-alias lines, as you suggested above
and here is the result ...
Saint Martin ← {{fb|Saint Martin/sandbox}}
Saint Martin ← {{fbwu|20|Saint Martin/sandbox}}
... in comparison with the regular version:
Saint Martin ← {{fb|Saint Martin}}
Saint Martin ← {{fbwu|20|Saint Martin}}(incorrect wikilink)
So, sandbox is tested, we could copy it to live. Maiō T. (talk) 20:43, 5 August 2017 (UTC)

 Done. Thanks for the work on this. Primefac (talk) 20:49, 5 August 2017 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 7 March 2018

Update the template from the sandbox so that the local flag from Commons is included. S.A. Julio (talk) 07:46, 7 March 2018 (UTC)

 Done — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 08:32, 7 March 2018 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 29 March 2018

Remove the "flag alias-football" line from the template. The local flag is not used for the football team. CONCACAF, for example, uses the French tricolor for Saint-Martin. See [3]. This is an old link, but I'm having trouble finding a more recent example after CONCACAF's recent website upgrade (many old links on their site are 404ing). But I have never seen Saint-Martin's local flag in use by the football team (unlike the local flags for Guadeloupe, Martinique, etc.) Bmf 051 (talk) 08:06, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

 Done For the record, this is the second change to this template in a month, so future edit requests should take this in mind if/when a new change is requested. Primefac (talk) 13:21, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 10 May 2019

Hi, File:Flag of the Collectivity of Saint Martin.svg was deleted from commons 9 May 2019. Cheers KylieTastic (talk) 14:25, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

 Done. Primefac (talk) 14:39, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 9 October 2019

As above, File:Flag of the Collectivity of Saint Martin.svg no longer exists. Can somebody replace the broken link with the French flag? Sumanuil 20:56, 9 October 2019 (UTC)

Edit request 4

Can anyone remove "| var1=local"? "Local" no longer exists as a flag alias. DenSportgladeSkåningen (talk) 13:24, 15 November 2019 (UTC)

 Done. Primefac (talk) 14:52, 15 November 2019 (UTC)

Adding (real) Local Flag, Coat of Arms on White Background

I know that the previous 'local' flag was dubious but Saint Martin does use a flag with its coat of arms on a white background, similar to Mayotte and Saint Barthelemy. I have linked it here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_Saint_Martin_(local_version).gif Would be very useful to distinguish from France eg. in football, much like all the other French territories are. Point of reference: https://fotw.info/flags/mf.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by Filip Vachuda (talk • contribs) 01:43, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

I suspect that, like all of the other local flags, this one will also be deleted as a copyright violation. Not going to even touch it until that's sorted out. Primefac (talk) 02:19, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 18 May 2023

Add local or unofficial variant found here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Saint-Martin_Flag.jpg The flag is the coat of arms on a white background which is the same rationale as including Saint Barthelemy's. Sources: https://www.fotw.info/flags/mf.html#dub https://www.faxinfo.fr/la-presidente-aline-hanson-vous-souhaite-un-joyeux-noel/ (flag is seen in the background) http://www.com-saint-martin.fr/ (official coat of arms is in the bottom right) JSwift49 12:57, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: No indication that this is a real flag in use. All examples given use the crest. Primefac (talk) 13:54, 18 May 2023 (UTC)