Template:Did you know nominations/Scouring (textiles)
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron (talk) 19:58, 9 September 2021 (UTC)
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Scouring (textiles)
Wool, before and after scouring.
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that once the textile industry was a household production?Women behind textiles[1]: 36ALT1:... that scouring (pictured) is a cleaning process for textiles which is now an industrial process adopted from domestic chores; women in the Scottish Gaelic tradition were used to sing waulking songs while doing cleaning and milling? In groups women were used to sing while finishing the newly made cloth- ALT2 ... that scouring in wool (pictured) is among the essential pre-treatments of textiles that prepares them for subsequent processes such as bleaching, dyeing, and printing? Source – Textiles, pp. 74-75
- ALT3 ... that scouring of wool (pictured) was carried out in aged urine? Source – pp. 92
- ALT4 ... that all textiles go through scouring, which is a cleaning process before the application of color and prints? Source Textiles, pp. 74-75
- ALT5 ... that scouring is among the essential pre-treatments of textiles that prepares them for subsequent processes such as bleaching, dyeing, and printing? Source Textiles, pp. 74-75
Created by RAJIVVASUDEV (talk). Self-nominated at 05:47, 30 July 2021 (UTC).
– Hi @RAJIVVASUDEV – The article is new enough (created on July 27, 2021) and long enough (6296 characters). Most of the prose is cited, and earwig shown minimal similarity (1%). QPQ is not required. The major issue with this nomination is the hook. The first hook doesn't link the article, and doesn't relate much with the article. ALT 1 is too long; it needs to be reduced. I don't quite feel that "gaelic.co" is a reliable source. I also noticed that some everyday words in the article like "home" and "women" are linked; remove those links. As of now, article needs to be copy edited. Ping me when you have addressed these concerns. Thanks! – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 15:07, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- Alt 1 comes in at 239 characters, above the 200 character limit on hooks. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:58, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- The illustration I see with this nomination does not show scouring at all, but fulling, an entirely different process. The nonsense about adopted from domestic chores is balderdash too. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 16:24, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- @Kavyansh.Singh Thank you so much for your review and comments, BTW Kindly ignore Roxy because they have special interest in me and my work, their [comments] are [more or less similar] on my every edit. I'll make the changes you've suggested. Thanks and regards. RV (talk) 16:39, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, I see. I'll suggest you to add some more interesting hooks. And anyways, his concern about image is more or less true (though it could have been said in a bit polite manner). I noticed that he removed my comments from this page in this edit. I wonder why? @RAJIVVASUDEV – Thanks for your work so far. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 16:48, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- No, their comments are not valid. Fulling is a part of wool cleaning. That is how the women were used to clean the newly made woolens in pre-industrial time. But if the changes are truly necessary, I will make them. Thanks for your kind words. Best regards RV (talk) 17:08, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- Your understanding is incorrect Raj. Fulling and scouring are not the same, nor was one a development of the other. My concern about the image is not "more or less true" but "totally accurate." Regarding comment removal, which appears to have been my fault, I didn't know I had done it, and suggest that an edit conflict may explain it. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 17:27, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- Roxy the dog Fulling and scouring are not synonymous, but they are correlated. And cannot be imagined apart from one another. Fulling involves two processes: scouring and milling (thickening).[FYI, See definition] IMO, the talk page is a better place for further discussion. RV (talk) 02:27, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
- Your understanding is incorrect Raj. Fulling and scouring are not the same, nor was one a development of the other. My concern about the image is not "more or less true" but "totally accurate." Regarding comment removal, which appears to have been my fault, I didn't know I had done it, and suggest that an edit conflict may explain it. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 17:27, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- No, their comments are not valid. Fulling is a part of wool cleaning. That is how the women were used to clean the newly made woolens in pre-industrial time. But if the changes are truly necessary, I will make them. Thanks for your kind words. Best regards RV (talk) 17:08, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, I see. I'll suggest you to add some more interesting hooks. And anyways, his concern about image is more or less true (though it could have been said in a bit polite manner). I noticed that he removed my comments from this page in this edit. I wonder why? @RAJIVVASUDEV – Thanks for your work so far. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 16:48, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- @Kavyansh.Singh Thank you so much for your review and comments, BTW Kindly ignore Roxy because they have special interest in me and my work, their [comments] are [more or less similar] on my every edit. I'll make the changes you've suggested. Thanks and regards. RV (talk) 16:39, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
- The illustration I see with this nomination does not show scouring at all, but fulling, an entirely different process. The nonsense about adopted from domestic chores is balderdash too. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 16:24, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
Review for ALT 2–
– @RAJIVVASUDEV – The hook still has few issues. We can't have two sentenced hooks. Moreover, the hook needs to be mentioned in the article. And I don't understand what does "even before you wear them"mean? Please mention the page number of the book sourced with the hook. The image looks fine, but is it related with the new hook? – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 06:10, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
- Hook is revised per advise. Regards RV (talk) 07:32, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
– The hook looks fine now, and is cited. I made a few changes. ALT 2 with image is approved. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 07:48, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
- If this article goes to DYK, will there be a proper explanation of wool scouring, far more important than Kier boiling in cotton? Including scouring machinery and it's history. At the moment, there isn't a reasonable explanation of wool scouring, which is far far more important than cotton scouring, as unlike cotton, all wool is scoured. Sentences that are meaningless like the following ... "Steeping refers to the unshorn-washed wool on the back of the sheep " ought to be erased. We should not mislead readers by putting this in DYK as it stands. I also note that the newly proposed pic shows raw wool and post souring wool, but no detail about scouring itself. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 16:00, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
- @Roxy the dog – About the image, I see no issues as the source clearly states "Wool before scouring by the Siroscour process (top), and after (bottom)"; which is related to scouring. As to your other concern, I guess some assistance is required by a user experienced in this topic. I reviewed the nomination per the hook, which is cited to a reliable source. I'll seek some assistance from the DYK talk page. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 16:14, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
- @Roxy the dog Your pain can be understood. Good to see that you learn about the topic that did not exist when it was begun. [See Talk page]. You mustn't be concerned about what you pretend to be and stop hounding. BTW What makes you understand the importance of cotton less than wool? Secondly, how do you know that the wool in the image is soured not scoured? Here are the examples of your authenticity and sincerity in regard to the project, Where was the reader's interest when you proposed these articles unforgivably for deletion? Performance (textiles) [2], Bolt (cloth)[[3]], Ninon[[4]], slopseller [[5]] and interfering with the creation of Khes and Kesh episode [[6]], [[7]], [[8]]. Your comments on the picture are pathetic, we shall examine the valid concerns. Lastly no need to harp around, you are free to edit/remove/add the objectionable contents. After all Wikipedia is a team work. Thanks RV (talk) 03:57, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
- Raj Please note that the purpose of this page is to discuss the nomination for DYK of this article, not for your personal attacks on me or discussion of other articles. Discuss the message, not the messenger. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 09:11, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- Please do not portray it as a personal attack; I have tried to reply to every query and improve the article.@ Admin FYI, It was an [unknown] place for the messenger till 20th June. Kindly pay attention, they are here for these two articles [The subject article] and [Textile performance] only. Thanks RV (talk) 10:40, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- Do you think that we should have a proper description of wool scouring in an article about scouring, particularly when the so-called hook here is about scouring of wool. Anybody coming to the article who wants to find out about scouring will be left with the impression that cotton scouring, a minor process in the cotton industry, is all there is. There isn't even a simple attempt to cover wool scouring. I also note that this article is about "scouring" not "Textile performance", so I suggest that this article is unsuitable for DYK, still. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 14:11, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- Though cotton contains fewer impurities than wool, is this a reason to say
that cotton scouring, a minor process in the cotton industry
? Please provide a source. We don't rely on opinions. Scouring is an essential treatment for every fiber type ranging from natural to synthetic. RV (talk) 15:04, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- Though cotton contains fewer impurities than wool, is this a reason to say
- Do you think that we should have a proper description of wool scouring in an article about scouring, particularly when the so-called hook here is about scouring of wool. Anybody coming to the article who wants to find out about scouring will be left with the impression that cotton scouring, a minor process in the cotton industry, is all there is. There isn't even a simple attempt to cover wool scouring. I also note that this article is about "scouring" not "Textile performance", so I suggest that this article is unsuitable for DYK, still. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 14:11, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- Please do not portray it as a personal attack; I have tried to reply to every query and improve the article.@ Admin FYI, It was an [unknown] place for the messenger till 20th June. Kindly pay attention, they are here for these two articles [The subject article] and [Textile performance] only. Thanks RV (talk) 10:40, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- Raj Please note that the purpose of this page is to discuss the nomination for DYK of this article, not for your personal attacks on me or discussion of other articles. Discuss the message, not the messenger. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 09:11, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
- @Roxy the dog Your pain can be understood. Good to see that you learn about the topic that did not exist when it was begun. [See Talk page]. You mustn't be concerned about what you pretend to be and stop hounding. BTW What makes you understand the importance of cotton less than wool? Secondly, how do you know that the wool in the image is soured not scoured? Here are the examples of your authenticity and sincerity in regard to the project, Where was the reader's interest when you proposed these articles unforgivably for deletion? Performance (textiles) [2], Bolt (cloth)[[3]], Ninon[[4]], slopseller [[5]] and interfering with the creation of Khes and Kesh episode [[6]], [[7]], [[8]]. Your comments on the picture are pathetic, we shall examine the valid concerns. Lastly no need to harp around, you are free to edit/remove/add the objectionable contents. After all Wikipedia is a team work. Thanks RV (talk) 03:57, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
- @Roxy the dog – About the image, I see no issues as the source clearly states "Wool before scouring by the Siroscour process (top), and after (bottom)"; which is related to scouring. As to your other concern, I guess some assistance is required by a user experienced in this topic. I reviewed the nomination per the hook, which is cited to a reliable source. I'll seek some assistance from the DYK talk page. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 16:14, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
- If this article goes to DYK, will there be a proper explanation of wool scouring, far more important than Kier boiling in cotton? Including scouring machinery and it's history. At the moment, there isn't a reasonable explanation of wool scouring, which is far far more important than cotton scouring, as unlike cotton, all wool is scoured. Sentences that are meaningless like the following ... "Steeping refers to the unshorn-washed wool on the back of the sheep " ought to be erased. We should not mislead readers by putting this in DYK as it stands. I also note that the newly proposed pic shows raw wool and post souring wool, but no detail about scouring itself. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 16:00, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
