Template:Did you know nominations/Mother Parish of the Apostle Santiago (Los Realejos)

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: rejected by reviewer, closed by BorgQueen (talk) 11:21, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Church of St James, Los Realejos

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Church of St James, Los Realejos

... that the Church of St James (pictured) was one of the first religious buildings in Tenerife? Source: Acosta, Alfredo, Historia, quote " ...Alonso Fernández de Lugo y su comitiva decidieran edificar un templo a Santiago Apóstol como muestra de agradecimiento
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Fictional music
- Comment: If approved, please put this in the queue for July 25.

Created by Evrik (talk). Self-nominated at 00:53, 26 June 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Mother Parish of the Apostle Santiago (Los Realejos); consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

General eligibility:
New enough:
Long enough:
Other problems: - Sources

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook eligibility:

Cited: - n
Interesting:

Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
Freely licensed: Used in article: Clear at 100px:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Hook is interesting. Earwig checks out. However, the sourcing is a problem. The citation to Noticias de la historia general de las Islas Canarias does not provide any page numbers. Considering that the cited document runs to nearly 2,000 pages, exact page numbers are needed. The article has a footnote in Spanish, but no explanation as to where it came from. The biggest problem is that one of the main sources for this article—and the source for the ALT—is a blog, which is unacceptable per WP:BLOGS. These all need to be fixed before this DYK nomination can proceed. —CurryTime7-24 (talk) 00:08, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

@CurryTime7-24: I made a strategic choice in using the blog because it appears to be published by the church, and it is easily accessible. I will go ahead and work on the sourcing in the days to come. --evrik ^(talk) 15:14, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

Comment Is that English rendering of the name supported by any source in competent English? It seems to me it should at least be "parish church" not "parish", and probably "Apostle James" - and why not link that? Johnbod (talk) 13:47, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

The name as it is now was what appeared to be the most consistent translation. If you can find a source that list a better name, let's talk. --evrik ^(talk) 17:19, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

That sounds like a "no", Evrik. As you may know, "parroquia" in Spanish means "parish", but is often loosely used to mean "parish church", rather than the more correct "iglesia parroquial". This should not be followed in English translations. It should be moved to Parish church of the Apostle James (Los Realejos) or left completely in Spanish, & let people make of it what they can. And, btw, why aren't you linking Tenerife? Few Americans know where that is. Johnbod (talk) 19:56, 3 July 2023 (UTC)
That wasn't a no. The Spanish name refers to it as the "Parroquia Matriz" (i.e. Mother Parish). Tenerife is linked in the first line. --evrik ^(talk) 20:08, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Wading through treacle... It was a no if you don't have it in English. "Parroquia Matriz" translates as "main church of the parish" NOT "Mother Parish", which is meaningless in English! You don't link Tenerife in the hook', and you should. Johnbod (talk) 04:19, 4 July 2023 (UTC)

Note that Church of Santa Ana (Garachico) also has "Matriz" in its Spanish name per the main source, which rightly hasn't been translated into the English name. Johnbod (talk) 04:29, 4 July 2023 (UTC)

This, an older book by the Ministry of Tourism gives "the parish church of Santiago", not very idiomatic, but better. Other travel guides just give "St James' church", which may be best. "The Parroquia Matriz del Apóstol Santiago (St James Church) was one of the first religious buildings in Tenerife in 1496...". Charge (heraldry) (talk) 13:41, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
@Johnbod: - I linked Tenerife in the hook for you. I'm not sure what the final answer on the name is. Make the change to Parish church of the Apostle James (Los Realejos), I think that is fine. Really, I have to set aside a chunk of time to update the references. That matters more to me than the name. --evrik ^(talk) 15:21, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
- Ok, after looking at how we handle other Spanish churches (rather a mess), I've moved it to Church of St James, Los Realejos, which is fine. I've updated the hook, but not moved this page. Johnbod (talk) 17:25, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

Glad that the naming issue was sorted out. However, the sourcing problems in the article remain and need to be fixed. In addition, the wide span of page numbers cited from Antonio Rumeu de Armas [es] suggests WP:SYNTH. A span of two or three pages is fine, but the single citation comprises three disparate references each spanning about 15–20 pages. That totals to around 60 pages, which is unacceptable. —CurryTime7-24 (talk) 18:28, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

I'm short on the time needed to fix the citations. If someone want to help, I'd be willing to share author credits. If not, I'll withdraw this nomination. --evrik ^(talk) 14:52, 25 July 2023 (UTC)
- It's been three weeks since the above (six weeks total), and no edits have been made to the article. Since no one has helped, I'm considering the nomination withdrawn in evrik's continuing absence. BlueMoonset (talk) 05:17, 15 August 2023 (UTC)