Talk:Wagon Wheel (song)

More origins predating the versions of Dylan and Secor

I think it's fair to refer to parts of songs that went before the later versions of Dylan and Secor. Curtis Jones' song 'Roll Me Over', presumably recorded in 1939, also uses the phrase 'like a wagon wheel'. Therefore the term blues standard is appropriate. I like the later versions very much (I even wrote my own, Dutch version), but legally something might be wrong in this Wikipedia article regarding authorship and maybe even considering copyright.

@RobertvanderVelden: Jones recorded a song in 1939 titled "Roll Me Mama"[1] that includes the lines "Now roll me over, just like I'm a wagon wheel" and "just like I ain't got no bone". He re-recorded it in 1963 as "Roll Me Over",[2][3] with some of the lyrics. When tracing the origins, it's best to use the earliest. Also, please note that songs titles use "quote marks" and that additions such as these[4] should have inline citations to reliable sources. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:59, 25 August 2018 (UTC)

@Ojorojo: Thanks for the precise reply. A song that also needs to be added to complete the history is "rockin' and rollin'", recorded in 1950 by Lil' Jackson.

Feel free to make corrections, I'm not very experienced in editing Wikipedia. I am pretty accurate in gathering facts, though.

Sounds like the perfect opportunity for someone to get "experienced in editing Wikipedia". Best to find articles that already put these strands together as support for your contention.--Artaxerxes 14:40, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Secor quote

(removed from article)

"I find that the number of singers in the chorus makes it all the more exciting. That's what folk music is and this is a folk song. I think the thing that's interesting about 'Wagon Wheel' is that a folk song could be really popular in 2013. Every strike is against it. All the odds are against folk music, particularly one song rising up and having an impact."

Ketch Secor

--Artaxerxes (talk) 18:55, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Unbalanced treatment of Rucker version

I think the current version places too much emphasis on a cover version. I would like some other opinions before I undo another person's work, but the various subsections and quotes are not encyclopedic. It reads like an interview/ article with Rucker. Also, there is a more detail on the OCMS version on their page than on this particular article. That seems odd as well. 24.210.190.173 (talk) 18:57, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

Samples

Might be helpful to have audio samples of . .

1. Big Bill Broonzy's recording that led to
2. Arthur “Big Boy” Crudup's
3. Dylan's “Rock me, mama” outtake
4. OCMS version
5. Rucker version

The OCMS page section on the song also adds some depth to the background.--Artaxerxes (talk) 18:34, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Notability

is this page necessary....at all...for any reason?--Tainter 01:44, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't see so. Delete, yes? Mang 06:32, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

This page is notable in my opinion but I'm too lazy to find sources or anything at the moment - but go look at how many people have covered it on youtube. dozens. SECProto 23:15, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

I agree, while it may have been better for someone to start by writing an article for O.C.M.S. (album), I think this is their most popular song and it has an interesting history with the Dylan co-write. The article could use better sources. CMT describes this as the band's signature song [5] which is one of the proposed criteria in WP:MUSIC/SONG, and they rank the album as one of the top 10 bluegrass albums of 2004. Americana-UK ranks the album as number 18 in their 2004 year-end survey. -MrFizyx 21:18, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

I can't see how this is marked as a stub - at the moment, it's a great article with everything I need to know about the song - answered all of my questions! NickGlasowiski 03:25, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

DEFINITELY a keeper! I was in Mountain View Arkansas and a group was playing this piece. I remember thinking the group looked like they were from the 60's. The harmony was incredible, and the guitar, banjo, harmonica, and fiddle were great. I actually thought "Bob Dylan" when I heard it. I wrote down the few words I could remember when I returned to my vehicle and couldn't wait to get home and Google the lyrics and find the song. I was amazed to find the chorus was written by Dylan for Pat Garrett & Billy the Kid. I just sat through the entire movie and was disappointed when I didn't hear Dylan sing the chorus. This article explained why. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pactum314 (talk • contribs) 02:03, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Saving Jane did not record this song. Pat Buzzard, member of Saving Jane did. I think that needs to be set straight. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tkohio (talk • contribs) 03:10, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

This page reads like Darius Rucker's PR company wrote it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.27.35.79 (talk) 08:00, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

On the song's popularity/impact from freetimes April 23, 2014:

Penned by Old Crow Medicine Show frontman Ketch Secor in the late ’90s and borrowing its chorus from an unreleased song fragment by Bob Dylan, “Wagon Wheel” solidly predates O Brother Where Art Thou?, another Coen Brothers movie that helped kickstart folk music’s renewed popularity back in 2001. At some point in the last 10 years, though, it emerged as the unlikely anthem for restless legions eager to unleash the banjo — and all of its rustic associations — as a building block in modern popular music. You can hear it at frat parties, weddings, baseball games and barrooms across America, its saturation approaching the ubiquity of standards like “Free Bird” and “The Weight.”

--Artaxerxes (talk) 16:25, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

References

Lists of covers

Someone wants to include a fairly random list of bands covering this song, including bands not even rating Wikipedia articles. This is a song every bar band is doing these days; I propose limiting such a list to those bands with significant covers (chart ratings, perhaps, or reviews, or anything other than bare claims that so-and-so did this song.) (I'm glad I get paid when my band does it...but we're not listed here either.) --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 20:19, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

I don't see an 'Other versions' section. One just pulled from lede: "The song was also remixed by the electronic duo Timeflies as a part of their Timeflies Tuesday series on Youtube." --Artaxerxes (talk) 15:16, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

==Other covers== (removed from article)

• Blues singer Matt Andersen and Against Me! covered the song in 2005, Jeremy McComb in 2007, Red Wanting Blue in 2009, Mumford & Sons in 2010, and Chad Brownlee in 2012.
• Timeflies released an online version with new adapted lyrics using the refrain from the song.
• Rockabilly singer Jason Lee Wilson covered the song with directionally-correct lyrics on his 2010 album Big Gun.
• Scottish folk musician Norrie MacIver covered the song in both English and Scottish Gaelic on his 2015 solo album Dans na Rathad (The Road Dance).
• Irish duo Neil Byrne and Ryan Kelly covered the song on their album, Live in Australia.
• Lily Kershaw
• Stephen Kellogg and the Sixers frequently covered the song live, including it as a bonus track on their 2009 album, The Bear, and on their live album, Live from the Heart: 1000th Show, Irving Plaza, NYC in 2010.
• Part of the song was performed line by line by six different artists in a Bank of America commercial lead-in to Ken Burns' Country Music PBS series in 2019.--Artaxerxes (talk) 14:45, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

References

Origin

"originally sketched" is incorrect, I think. It is generally said (by which I mean, I've read more than one person saying this) that Bob Dylan credited Arthur Crudup for "Rock Me, Mama". Crudup, in turn, is alleged to have said that he based his song on Big Bill Broonzy's "Rock Me Baby". Broonzy, in turn, got the chorus from somewhere else, before such songs were recorded. The anonymous origin of this chorus makes this folk music in the purest sense.

Here's an article giving this origin story: CraigMiloRogers (talk) 04:29, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

The Old Crow section on the song [[6]] tries to lay this out. Also see Samples section above. --Artaxerxes (talk) 17:54, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

References

Chorus

"The above chorus is NOT the order of lines sung in the original Dylan version, rather it is the order that Secor used wherein he inverted the 1st set of 3 lines with the 2nd set of 3 lines."--Artaxerxes 03:45, 24 March 2017 (UTC)