Talk:The Overlake School

Hello Overlakers! Please use this page to discuss the article rather than putting comments in the article itself. Yellow Ant 18:11, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

My apologies about the revert. I was looking at an older revision. Amcfreely 02:48, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Some major changes

"In a recent development, the wikipedia article for "The Overlake School" has been the site of a small editing battle, during which several students inserted funny but false statements about the school and the faculty; the edits have since been removed and Bill Schuver has been made aware of the problem, although it is currently unclear if the vandalism has stopped permanently."

I don't think this is an appropriate matter to put on the wikipedia page itself.

I also have added a section related to the conflicts between the administration and the students. I tried to move this information out of the main part of the article, as well.

I graduated from Overlake in 2005, so any more information (especially current) would be great.

Opblaaskrokodil 04:08, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Food Director

Is Michael Vaskovitz as food director the high school senior Michael Vaskovitz? If so, I think it might be worthwhile to note that it's a student held job. I left it alone for now in case it's his dad or something... Opblaaskrokodil 04:25, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

"Notable Alumni"

The people whom I just removed were not notable at all. Keita is not a professional male model, these are just jokes put by people who know them (like Andy Lum being called a professional baby maker a while ago). I welcome someone with evidence to prove me wrong, however. Opblaaskrokodil 20:28, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

"Administration"

It might be useful to have the names of the current administration on the page. 69.91.149.105 22:24, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Generally these types of lists are discouraged, but it's really up to the article's editors. Calebrw (talk) 22:41, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Sup

Opblaaskrokodil i wanna help you look after this page, me being a current student, i can probabaly do a much better job than you ever can anymore, unless if you become a new teacher here. and i know how conservative you are and wanna keep things clean, but a little bit of the truth wont hurt.

p.s. the reason i came on here, is because i see you cant handle it on your own, so if you could please post the original because this artical got "edited" wrongly, i tried to change it but i dont have the full length default article.

Ethics

as a newcoming student i am wondering why some of the students feel that the school has lost sight of the original purpose of the school and what has happened to cause that could someone please shed some light on this matter

Follow up to question in Ethics section

As all things do, the Overlake school is ever-changing. As individuals we grow from a certain environment, and accept that as a standard. Change is needed to continue to function in society, even though they redefine that basic environment we where used to. This is the sensation of Old Age. When people say “back in my day...” and “kids today don’t …” it is for this same reason. The Overlake I remember is much different then it is today. (I was on campus having this discussion with a teacher last week in fact). There is a pattern of people being liberal in their youth and conservative later in life. Overlake is a bit of a microcosm of that. I still believe that all major changes are well thought out and enacted for the greater good of the community, even if in the immediate eyes of the student it does not seem so.

Hard facts are simple though.

The student conduct code has been rewritten expanding the school’s disciplinary power on off campus incidents. (Restricting personal freedoms for your own protection, sound familiar?)

The popularity of absolute cultural respect forced a teacher off campus how had been with Overlake for almost three decades. The school may be free of a few slightly un-tasteful jokes, but lost with him are stories of the Vietnam War and the schools farm history. (It is a serious question, which is worse for a student’s education)

But that is change. In my Overlake years, I saw a new art barn, a new performing arts center, a new gym and a new field, none of which I felt I really needed. The one thing that I truly felt I needed was gone by the time I needed it, few people at the school will even remember the words: Senior Lounge. -whitneyfreedman.com

Overlake culture

Wow, this article reads like a list of statistics. People reading this would have no idea what makes Overlake different from, say, 50% of well-funded private schools. The intro in diff is terrific compared to the one the article has now. Surely with all the news articles about Overlake there must be some WP:RS sources covering the vibrant culture and academic style? Mazemaster225 (talk) 11:22, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Requested move 31 August 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) SilverLocust 💬 06:52, 16 September 2024 (UTC)

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Overlake School → The Overlake School – The school is called The Overlake School. All of the language on the school's official website refers to it as such. It was recently changed by another user who suggested that "The" should not be used in the names of schools. I couldn't find any documentation of that fact in the Wikipedia Article Titles guidance, and plus -- the name of the school is THE Overlake School.

I went to this school and everybody - students, faculty, administrators, Seattle Times articles, the school's website itself - refers to it as such. The Beatles? The Walker School? I don't see why an arbitrary rule should require that we name an article after a name that nobody uses.Fantasyfootball420 (talk) 04:50, 31 August 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 06:45, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

• MOVE The article was renamed, without any discussion, from The Overlake School in February 2024 by user:Esrever [1]. The edit summary '“The” not included in school names' is not correct. The default is to exclude it, but "The" can indeed be included in article titles when it is part of a proper name. See WP:DEFINITE. There's no rule specific for high schools, so the closest we can get is WP:UNITHE, which addresses its use in university articles, and says "A definite article should be applied only if The is used in running text throughout university materials and if that usage has caught on elsewhere." The school's material consistently uses either "The Overlake School", or simply "Overlake", never "the Overlake School" or "Overlake School". Here are examples of the use of the capitalized "The" in running text in news articles from: 2013 https://www.redmond-reporter.com/news/overlake-school-graduates-66-seniors-slideshow/ ; 2019 https://www.seattletimes.com/explore/careers/teaching-art-to-hilarious-sweet-honest-and-curious-students-in-redmond/ ; 2022 https://piedmontexedra.com/2022/06/phs-student-wins-2nd-place-in-international-art-competition ; and 2024 https://www.seattletimes.com/education-lab/register-lets-talk-with-wa-teachers-students-about-the-future-of-education/ So, three different publications, covering more than 10 years, using "The" in running text. Meters (talk) 05:44, 31 August 2024 (UTC)
  • The National Center for Education Statistics lists this school under "The Overlake School" too: https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/pss/privateschoolsearch/school_detail.asp?Search=1&ID=01462326 Meters (talk) 05:51, 31 August 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:THE. Generally just referred to as "Overlake" on its own website. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:36, 5 September 2024 (UTC)
  • • I disagree that Generally just referred to as "Overlake" on its own website. Both terms are used, as I pointed out, and usage appears to be split evenly between the full "The Overland School" and the short "Overland". "the Overland School" or "Overland School" are never used. Media sources and the NCES use the full name so it would appear that we should also use it, per WP:COMMONNAME. Meters (talk) 21:57, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

  Both "Overlake" and "The Overlake School" are used on the school's website and independent, reliable sources. Per WP:COMMONNAME, "Overlake School" should not be the title of the article, because it is never used to refer to the subject of the article.

  Guideline 2 at WP:THE, the page you cited, seems to suggest that we should use "The Overlake School", because when independent, reliable sources use the full, unabbreviated name, "The" is capitalized. Fantasyfootball420 (talk) 19:09, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

• Weak oppose per Necrothesp: While "School" is needed for disambiguation, "The" is not, and is often omitted when referring to the institution. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 15:21, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

  If we omit "The" but we include "School", then we end up with "Overlake School", which is not commonly used in independent, reliable sources. Thus, per WP:COMMONNAME, it's not the right name to use. Per condition 2 of WP:THE, we should include "The" not for disambiguation, but because it's consistently capitalized in running text about the school. (See comment by Meters).

  Per WP:COMMONNAME, the only other acceptable title should be "Overlake" (the only other commonly used name), but I suspect we would agree that "Overlake" is too ambiguous. Fantasyfootball420 (talk) 19:03, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

  Struck opinion. I don't really find adequate independent sourcing to form a clear opinion. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 22:54, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support the website uses "Welcome to The Overlake School" in its title and has "The" in the logo which clearly shows it treats "The" as being part of the name. See also this source. Crouch, Swale (talk) 16:24, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Weak oppose per longstanding precedent at Ohio State University. O.N.R. ^(talk) 17:23, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

  Per WP:UNITHE, "Ohio State University" omits "The" because, even though it's part of the official name, "The" is frequently not used in running text about Ohio State University. From WP:UNITHE: A definite article should be applied only if The is used in running text throughout university materials and if that usage has caught on elsewhere. In the case of Ohio State, "The" is commonly omitted in running text by external sources.

  However, The Overlake School is always referenced with "The" in running text, in both school materials and external sources. (It is also shortened to "Overlake" - but "Overlake" is too ambiguous to use as this article title.)

  If Ohio State was consistently referred to as "The Ohio State University", and never "Ohio State University", then per WP:UNITHE, it would include "The".

  From WP:UNITHE: ... some universities only refer to themselves as "The University of X", even in running text (e.g. The College of New Jersey). If such usage is prevalent on university press releases and press kits, contact information, "about" pages, and internal department websites, and it is reasonably common in external sources (try a Google search), then it is more appropriate to name the Wikipedia article "The University of X". Fantasyfootball420 (talk) 21:06, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support per Meters' analysis; most sources include the the. Charlotte (Queen of Hearts • talk) 20:52, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.