Talk:Tanka people
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Tanka
[edit]Tanka or Dan are not only living in Hong Kong. Should the title of this article changed to better reflect it? — Instantnood June 30, 2005 18:09 (UTC)
It would be better to call the page "Tanka" if you ask me. I really do not like the boat people title and it is both inaccurate and confusing. Let me encourage you to do whatever you want. Lao Wai 30 June 2005 19:04 (UTC)
What tongue does Tanka traditionally talk?
- The Tanka are supposed to speak a variant dialect of Cantonese that is distinct from other forms of Cantonese. That's from what I know but there is not much literature on the subject.
Explaination of the terms: 蜑家, 蛋家, 艇家, 水上人.
- 蜑家 (Cantonese: daan6 ga1; pinyin: dànjiā) is a pejorative/derogatory term that means literally meaning "egg families" due to the half egg shape boats that were used by their forefathers. Surely this one means "vermin families"
- 蛋家 (Cantonese: daan2 ga1; pinyin: dànjiā) is a pejorative/derogatory term meaning "vermin families".And this one means "egg familes"
- 艇家 (Cantonese: teng5 ga1; pinyin: tǐngjiā) is a less insulting term since it literally means boat families.
- 水上人 (Cantonese: seui2 seung5 yan4; pinyin: shuǐshàngrén) is the term they used for themselves and prefer to be called by since it has no negative connotations and literally means "people living on the water".
Abstrakt 21:33, 19 September 2005 (UTC)
I was told the Tankas were convicts (rather like the original British convicts transported to Australia), sentenced to live on water and were banned from coming on land, thus preventing them from committing crimes on land. People were allowed to throw eggs at them, hence the term 'Egg Family'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.60.106.5 (talk)
what does "mean" people mean? were they rude?
Most people say tanka is a derogatory term and use 水上人 seui² seung⁵ yan⁴ Hĭ uông lìng (talk) 09:29, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
sources on tanka people
[edit]Acculturation of the Chinese in the United States: A Philadelphia Study Acculturation of the Chinese in the United States: A Philadelphia Study
International Dictionary of Historic Places: Asia and Oceania
Essays on South China's Boat People
Chinese Society in the Eighteenth Century
The Archaeology of Hong Kong: Culture, Capitalist Development, Singapore
The Century Dictionary and Cyclopedia: Dictionary
The Floating World of Castle Peak Bay
The Floating World of Castle Peak Bay
Ethnocentrism and the English Dictionary
Heathen Slaves and Christian Rulers
Chinese Pottery in the Philippines
I'll be filling this article out with these sources.Amuel Gins (talk) 17:28, 29 October 2011 (UTC)
Needs Reworking
[edit]Parts of this article sound almost written by one of those "Bai Yue" nationalists... practically all southern Chinese have ancestry from the "non-Chinese people of southern China", but that doesn't make them any less "Chinese" — Preceding unsigned comment added by AnAimlessRoad (talk • contribs) 15:12, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
- I don't know where your getting this idea that this was written by a "Bai Yue" nationalist. The article makes clear that the tanka are a minority in southern China, and that they are a separate group from southern Han chinese, and separate from typical han cantonese. A "Bai yue" nationalist, would have done the opposite. He would have claimed Cantonese people are all actually descendants of the natives, non han chinese, and that the tanka and cantonese are the exact same people. Most sources do not indicate that, they indicate instead that the Tanka have heavier native ancestry than typical southern han chinese. Check all the sources yourselfAmuel Gins (talk) 02:03, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
- The only thing that needs reworking is the fact that User:WarriorsPride6565 completely lobotomized the article by deleting random words from all over it.Amuel Gins (talk) 02:03, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
Temporarily deleting sections
[edit]I will temporarily blank sections of the article and then restore them, due to previous damage done by WarriorsPride6565 when he removed words from all over the article. This is only temporary.Amuel Gins (talk) 02:35, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
DoneAmuel Gins (talk) 02:43, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
- I have reverted your changes per unencyclopedic and often incoherent phrasing. Materialscientist (talk) 08:06, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
- Materialscietist. You reverted my edit (the good version) to the bad version with random words deleted all over it..
- The last good version of the article was this one by User:Kali95
- User:WarriorsPride6565 the started editing the article after that. He apparently had a problem with his browser, which resulted in random words all over the article being deleted while he edited. see User talk:WarriorsPride6565 for the repeated warnings delivered to him regarding his mass deletions of words on multiple articles
- In the following edits, WarriorsPride6565 completely mutilated the article with his deltion of random words all over it Tanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka peopleTanka people
- he was unaware that he was the source of the problem, he attempted to reinsert the words which were deleted, but while he readded those words, other words dissapeared. Over here, WarriorsPride6565 tries to readad the word "China", while the words "university". and "surname" get deleted and again when he tries to readd "China", the words "chinese", and "surname" are again deleted
- After he was warned about this, he apparently fixed his browser, but he did not bother to fix the article
- User:Sevilledade, who previously edit stalked me a few months ago and obsessively made "corretions" to all my edits, including before on this article, in which he unnsesesarily reqrote massive portions of my work, did not feel the need to do the same to WarriorsPride6565, even though WarriorsPride6565's edits included horrible english, spelling, and grammar. (see the edits yourself), and WarriorsPride6565 edited it far less than I did. Sevilledade included derogatory comments about my edits in his edit summaries.
- Sevilledade's "corretions": "Historically Tanka was considered to be outcasts, since they were an boat people who lived by the sea. They were often referred to as sea gypsies by both Chinese and British. It has been concluded that the Tanka origin trace back with the native ethnic minorities of southern China who may have took refuge on the sea and gradually assimilated into Han culture, but Tanka still preserved many of their native cultures that are not found in Han Chinese culture. " (The correct form of the words are "were", and "traces back".
- Sevilledade was actually informed by another editor about the deletion of words from the Tanka article. He chose to ignore the message and do nothing at all to fix the mess.
- I decided to fix it myself, and restored the article to the good version, restoring all words
- Then I did other edits, adding a section on the Portuguese and Macau. You had an issue with only this specific section. But you chose to revert all of my edits, reverting to the bad version of the article.Amuel Gins (talk) 21:06, 1 March 2012 (UTC)
Pejorative?
[edit]See Talk:Tanka for a move discussion that affects this page's redirect/disamb. Note also:
- Farewell to Peasant China: Rural Urbanization and Social Change in ... - Page 75 Gregory Eliyu Guldin - 1997 "In Dongji hamlet, most villagers were originally shuishangren (boat people) [Also known in the West by the pejorative label, "Tanka" people. — Ed.] and settled on land only in the 1950s. Per-capita cultivated land averaged only 1 mu ..."
- Sovereignty at the edge: Macau & the question of Chineseness - Page 354 Cathryn H. Clayton, Harvard University. Asia Center - 2010 "The seuiseuhng yahn, known more commonly by the pejorative term "tanka" have been described by one anthropologist as "a floating population" in the literal sense: living on their boats, the Cantonese seuiseuhng yahn specialized in fishing"
- Capitalism in contrasting cultures Stewart Clegg, S. G. Redding, Monica Cartner - 1990 "Both of these are referred to by ordinary Cantonese as 'Tanka', a highly pejorative word for which a number of improbable folk-etymologies are current; members of the community resent the term 'Tanka' and refer to themselves as 'Seui- ...
- Papers from the fourth and fifth annual meetings, Gypsy Lore ... Gypsy Lore Society. North American Chapter. Meeting, Joanne Grumet, Gypsy Lore Society. North American Chapter - 1985 "There has been for perhaps 1,500 years in the Cantonese-speaking areas of South China a group treated as pariahs, and known to history as the "Tanka". The word "Tanka" is now, however, a pejorative one, like "nigger" so I will henceforth ...
In ictu oculi (talk) 11:58, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
Primary documents
[edit]
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Register for British and Foreign India, China, and Australia
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Miscellany
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Register for British India and Its Dependencies
The Amber Gods, and Other Stories
The Penny Magazine of the Society for the Diffusion of Useful Knowledge
Waldie's Select Circulating Library
All the Year Round: A Weekly Journal
Ti-ping Tien-kwoh: The History of the Ti-ping Revolution
The Metropolitan
The Metropolitan
The Metropolitan
The Metropolitan Magazine The Metropolitan Magazine
A Peep at China in Mr. Dunn's Chinese Collection A Peep at China in Mr. Dunn's Chinese Collection A Peep at China in Mr. Dunn's Chinese Collection
Guide To, Or Descriptive Catalogue of the Chinese Museum Guide To, Or Descriptive Catalogue of the Chinese Museum
Ten Thousand Things on China and the Chinese Ten Thousand Things on China and the Chinese
Narrative of the expedition to China, from the commencement of the war
Narrative of the Expedition to China
Correspondence Relating to China
The Guide to Knowledge, Or Repertory of Facts
History of the pirates who infested the China Sea: from 1807 to 1810
Translations from the Chinese & Armenian: With Notes and Illustrations
Translations from the Chinese & Armenian: With Notes and Illustrations
British and Foreign State Papers
The Flag-ship: Or, A Voyage Around the World in the United States Frigate Columbia...
The Asiatic journal and monthly register for British and foreign India, China and Australasia
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Register for British and Foreign India, China, and Australia
Narrative of the Second Campaign in China
Narrative of the Expedition of an American Squadron to the China Seas and Japan
Travels in China, New Zealand, New South Wales, Van Diemen's Land, Cape Horn, Etc., Etc
History of the Pirates who Infested the China Sea from 1807-1810
The Indian News and Chronicle of Eastern Affaires
Allgemeines Lexikon der bildenden Künstler von der Antike bis zur Gegenwart
Vocabulary of the Canton Dialect
A Chinese and English Dictionary
English and Chinese pronouncing dictionary
A Syllabic Dictionary of the Chinese Language
A Chinese Chrestomathy in the Canton Dialect
Rajmaan (talk) 22:07, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
Guide To, Or Descriptive Catalogue of the Chinese Museum
A Peep at China in Mr. Dunn's Chinese Collection
The Fan-qui, Or, Foreigner in China: Comprising a View of the Manners, Laws, Religion, Commerce, and Politics, of the Chinese, and the Present State of Their Relations with Great Britain
The Fan-qui in China, in 1836-7
The Stranger in China: Or, The Fan-qui's Visit to the Celestial Empire in 1836-7
The fan-qui in China, in 1836-7
The Fan-qui in China, in 1836-7
The Fan-qui in China, in 1836-7
The Fan-qui in China, in 1836-7
Waldie's Select Circulating Library
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Register for British and Foreign India, China, and Australia
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Miscellany
Waldie's Select Circulating Library
Nature's Teachings: Human Invention Anticipated by Nature
Alone in China, and Other Stories
China and Japan, and a Voyage Thither
Life of Capt. Joseph Fry, the Cuban Martyr
Life of Capt. Joseph Fry, the Cuban Martyr
Six Months Among the Malays, and a Year in China
A Legacy of Historical Gleanings
The Asiatic Journal and Monthly Register for British India and Its Dependencies
A Chinese and English Dictionary
The seven little sisters who live on the round ball that floats in the air
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DNA tests and disease / Thalassemia
[edit]Given that the thalassemia tests were done on the present-day Tanka population (data were not of Tankas from several hundred years back), and given that the article stated that there was/is a significant level of sexual relationship between Tanka women and Portuguese men for the past several hundred years, is it not more likely that the thalassemia genes in the present-day Tanka population are inherited from Portuguese ancestors (or other Mediterranean ancestors) rather than Yue/ Southern Chinese/ South-East Asian ancestors? 159.180.98.82 (talk) 01:42, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
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