Talk:Satoshi Nakamoto/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 September 2023

I propose adding the following reference: Hatch, Evan (7 May 2022) [21 February 2021]. "Len Sassaman and Satoshi". Medium. Retrieved 2023-09-18.

To this paragraph: "In 2021 developer Evan Hatch proposed cypherpunk Len Sassaman of COSIC as a possible candidate." Solomon Ucko (talk) 13:50, 18 September 2023 (UTC)

 Not done We are not using Medium as a source on cryptocurrency articles. We do already have a source for Sassaman, the very last sentence in the article (as the most recent claim). Jtbobwaysf (talk) 21:55, 18 September 2023 (UTC)

The reference that is there ("Is crypto expert Len Sassaman the creator of Bitcoin, Satoshi Nakamoto?". CNBCTV18.) doesn't actually support the paragraph. It says that "On February 21, a writer, Leung, published a comprehensive study that looks at the possibility of Sassaman being Satoshi Nakamoto, the creator of Bitcoin." While this does explicitly equate Len Sassaman and Satoshi Nakamoto, it doesn't mention Evan Hatch; it says that some writer named Leung made that claim. The paragraph and the reference were added in the same edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=1085021312&oldid=1085019834&title=Satoshi_Nakamoto. Unless evidence is presented that Leung is Evan Hatch, the paragraph and/or the reference should be changed to match.

In contrast, the Medium article is a primary source for the paragraph, since it is written by "evanhatch.eth" (i.e. Evan Hatch), and, while it doesn't explicitly claim that Len Sassaman is Satoshi Nakamoto, it heavily hints at it by highlighting various similarities between them.

There is an much older claim of Satoshi being Len Sassaman at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=144445.20;wap2 (domain name blacklisting reason is unrelated: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Spam_blacklist/Archives/2016-02#bitcointalk.org; un-blacklisting was proposed and received no objections, but was abandoned: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Spam_blacklist/Archives/2019-04#bitcointalk.org): in reply to a thread titled "I think Sirius (Martti Malmi) is Satoshi Nakamoto...", a user named "rpietila" says: "Quote from: Technomage on February 16, 2013, 02:03:28 PM [...] I entertain the idea that Len Sassaman with his wife is/was Satoshi, and that he was murdered by the CIA." There is even a secondary source for this: https://www.dailydot.com/debug/history-misidentifying-satoshi-nakamoto/.

Solomon Ucko (talk) 01:47, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

The dailydot looks like a nice source for more candidates as well. I have now added another sentence that refers to this source. Thank you! Jtbobwaysf (talk) 18:53, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

Deleting DOB

It's absolute nonsense to place a date of birth on a pseudonym of an unknown person, even with the addition "claimed". It's not clear who's Satoshi in the end, so placing the DOB on prominent places like introduction and info box violates NPOV. Unfortunately, I'm restricted to edit the article. CryptoCrawler (talk) 23:56, 4 May 2023 (UTC)

Satoshi's DOB is claimed and is WP:DUE. Do you have any evidence to state the date is in question? Jtbobwaysf (talk) 05:19, 6 May 2023 (UTC)

The genuine DOB is 12th March 1978. Banedroid knows everything you might want or need to know about the pseudonym 'Satoshi Nakamoto'.. Banedroid (talk) 21:31, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

Also, it would be an abomination to delete this DOB, it is an important link between Hal and the real person behind the pseudonym.

It is all cryptographic. Banedroid (talk) 21:38, 7 May 2023 (UTC)

WP:NOTFORUM might apply to this discussion unless you have WP:RS you want to discuss. Jtbobwaysf (talk) 00:39, 8 May 2023 (UTC)

@CryptoCrawler this is a good point to start at. However, there is a huge importance to the date of birth. It is a key that has been explained on a different platform.

There is an obvious similarity to the date of birth of Satoshi and of Hal, when you consider that Am English and Br English represent month day and day month respectively, this a clue. If you switch the number 75 to 57, there is a difference of only 1 with regard to Hal's year of birth, that difference of 1 is important relative only to the true person behind Satoshi Nakamoto when considering the years of birth of the other chosen developers.

That is all I am permitted to say at this moment in time. DroidBane (talk) 15:13, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

All I needed to say I've said already: it's not clear who's Satoshi in the end. It could be Hal Finney, Adam Back, Nick Szabo, or it could be a pseudonym for a team of several devs. So giving the DOB is clearly wrong, purely speculative and misleading. Stating the DOB would require the real person to be known, but that's not the case. Totally wrong is also the POB given as "Japan", the person with the birth name "Satoshi Nakamoto" (Dorian), born in Japan, clearly denies having anything to do with Bitcoin, which is even referenced in the article. IDK what else to say about this. CryptoCrawler (talk) 07:21, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

@CryptoCrawler I fully understand where you are coming from, maybe it's time for the truth to be known. DroidBane (talk) 19:38, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

Although, the date of birth as published back in 2012 was done so in such a way for a good reason. It is part of the legacy, and until the truth comes out, it should really remain as it is. DroidBane (talk) 19:41, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

►@ALL: This question has been discussed but I do not see a consensus. Let's try this: Here is the lead sentence: Satoshi Nakamoto (born 5 April 1975[citation needed]) is the name used by the presumed pseudonymous[1][2][3][4] person or persons who developed Bitcoin.

This sentence make sense, only if you remove the DOB.

1) By definition, the date of birth can not be known for an unknown identity.

2) The unique date of birth can not be stated for a group (persons) unless they all have the same birthdate.

Since there is no provided citation for the 5 April 1975 DOB for an anonymous person or persons, I'm removing it. The very least we can do as editor is make sure that sentences are not self-contradicting. If you want add it back, do it in the body of the article, where you can discuss this date versus others, and provide citations for each.  • Bobsd •  (talk) 06:05, 23 October 2023 (UTC)

@Bobsd citation would be P2P Foundation 🤷🏻‍♂️ DroidBane (talk) 06:47, 24 October 2023 (UTC)

@DroidBane I am assuming that you are referring to this citation: "Satoshi Nakamoto's Page". P2P Foundation. Archived from the original on 29 May 2012. Retrieved 2 May 2016.

1) That citation does not actually specify an April 5, 1975 date. 2) And if you roll through the captures at Internet Archive, you can see his age listed as 36 on April 3, and then as 37 on the next capture, April 10. So the most you could claim is a birthday sometime between April 4 and April 9. And that assumes that the java script on the P2P site is calculating the years correctly. ► But more importantly, we are supposed to rely on secondary sources, not a self-published post. I suggest you refer to WP:PST, WP:BURDEN, WP:SOURCE  • Bobsd •  (talk) 22:01, 25 October 2023 (UTC)

Proposing Jim Gettys as a candidate for Satoshi

Based on analysis of MD5 Hash values contained within the two Bitcoin whitepapers, two documents produced by Jim Gettys during the same timeframe as the Bitcoin whitepapers were discovered. Jim Gettys was working for OLPC (One Laptop Per Child) at the time as the lead developer. There are also similarities between the wifi mesh design he developed for OLPC and how blocks are added to the blockchain.

Detailed analysis of hash values listed here: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7148795636732100608/ GustavC999 (talk) 12:20, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

Gustav, what you have posted is what we here call WP:OR. We will not be able to include that in the article. However, if it is picked up by some high quality WP:RS then we can consider it. By high quality I mean WSJ, NYT, bloomberg, etc. We cannot use WP:PRIMARY and WP:UGC on cryptocurrency articles, nor can we use coindesk, theblock, etc. Thanks! Jtbobwaysf (talk) 07:19, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 January 2024

Change "Satoshi Nakamoto" to "Satoshi Nakamato". This change will make it conform with the text written in the genesis block.

The text given in the genisis block is: On January 3rd 2009, the Bitcoin network was created when Satoshi Nakamato (the project's mysterious creator) mined the “Genesis” block. The 50 bitcoin coinbase reward is unredeemable, as it was omitted from the transaction database. This means any attempt to spend it would be rejected by the network. Whether this was intentional or not still remains unknown.

Here you can see the founder is "Satoshi Nakamato", and not "Satoshi Nakamoto" like stated in the article. Cbc27 (talk) 13:10, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: page move requests should be made at Wikipedia:Requested moves. Shadow311 (talk) 16:07, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

References

Original research claim of Satoshi's alma mater

"California State Polytechnic University, Pomona (alleged)" was added to the infobox as Satoshi's Alma mater. There must be a reliable source for any allegations according to WP:NOR, but none has been found for the claim about Satoshi's alma mater. Could someone please remove it or provide a credible source?

I've also observed that the same user added this information a year ago, which was subsequently removed following the creation of a discussion topic: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Satoshi_Nakamoto/Archive_1#Erroneous_alma_mater_claim." WaterDrinkingHuman (talk) 20:38, 23 February 2024 (UTC)

@WaterDrinkingHuman, one of the people proposed to be Nakamoto attended that school, but since the true identity of the subject of the article is unconfirmed, it doesn't belong in the infobox. I've removed it. Schazjmd (talk) 20:45, 23 February 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 26 February 2024

Anthony Dewayne Hunt = Satoshi Nakamoto Nakamoto2 (talk) 18:12, 26 February 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Schazjmd (talk) 18:22, 26 February 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 February 2024

In popular culture section, add

In television, Satoshi is animated in the Tuttle Twins.

207.96.32.81 (talk) 14:36, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: The provided source does not mention Satoshi Nakamoto, is not a reliable source, and the show does not appear to be notable. Jamedeus (talk) 00:22, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

References

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 March 2024

The highest value of bitcoin has reached more than 68k$ Benniledl (talk) 16:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Jamedeus (talk) 18:01, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 11 March 2024

Nakamoto owns between 750,000 and 1,100,000 bitcoin. In November 2021, when Bitcoin hit its still-highest value of over US$68,000, that would have made his net worth up to US$73 billion, making him the 15th-richest person in the world at the time.

The all time high reached in 2021 for bitcoin was beaten on March 11, 2024. On this day Bitcoin reached US$72,344.82. Moyzee0125 (talk) 14:51, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. GrayStorm^{(Talk|Contributions)} 16:51, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 11 March 2024 (2)

Change “still highest value of $68,000” to “current highest value of $72,000” AND anything else relatable to this. Ensure to re-edit every now and then to keep accurate.

2A00:23C5:DD7B:7E01:D0F9:2C76:F42C:600D (talk) 19:08, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

 Partly done: I removed the phrase "still-highest", but didn't touch the rest. The citation verifies his net worth as of November 2021, we cannot extrapolate from this to update his current net worth. Jamedeus (talk) 19:27, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

References

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 March 2024

Hey, pls add the gramatik song titled Satoshi Nakamoto to pop culture 163.53.144.27 (talk) 11:29, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. —TechnoSquirrel69 (sigh) 14:55, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 13 May 2024

I feel that there should be an explanation of the Len Sassaman testimonial in the blockchain that was eternalised that way after he committed suicide in 2011. Otherwise the image in the Satoshi Nakamoto article is kind of inexplicable.

Use this text form Sassaman's page to fix it.

A presentation given by Kaminsky at the 2011 Black Hat Briefings revealed that a testimonial in honor of Sassaman had been permanently embedded into Bitcoin's blockchain.

I propose something like:

In 2021, developer Evan Hatch proposed cypherpunk Len Sassaman of COSIC as a possible candidate.[80] Sassaman had been mentioned on bitcointalk on 15 March 2013 when a user suggested Sassaman was Satoshi.[81] It's already quite remarkable that Sassaman's image was eternalised in the Bitcoin blockchain shortly after his suicide in the summer of 2011. Hajosmit (talk) 16:09, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

 Partly done: I copied the text and ref from Len Sassaman. I did not use your suggested wording. Schazjmd (talk) 16:16, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

References