Talk:Revilo P. Oliver

Palindrome

I'm adding

An article by him was denounced in print as a transparent fraud because the palindrome looked so suspicious.

My guess would be that the article was an op-ed piece in the New York Times in the 1960s. The accusation by a reader was published simultaneously with a statement that such and such an institution listed him among their faculty.
--Jerzy·t 17:40, 2005 August 4 (UTC)
I dunno if it's worth working into the article, but i'd never heard the name elsewhere, & got curious abt whether is was invented solely to provide the palindrome. It seems otherwise, even though most Google hits on

Revilo -Oliver

appear to be products or handles. Revilo Winchell Bio is pretty elaborate if it is a fraud; it says

Revilo Winchell was born in Rockville, Conn., March 23, 1837

and the placenames make sense. I'll research for further confirmation of its authenticity if requested.
--Jerzy·t 17:57, 2005 August 4 (UTC)

National Socialist?

What is the basis for the assertion that Oliver was a National Socialist, or held any Socialist viewpoints and/or ideology. nobs 05:25, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

I wondered about the assertion too. I guess it is pretty accurate to say that he "came to openly embrace an essentially National Socialist worldview", as he was in accord with its main principles (esp. "anti-Semitic" Aryan racialism) and wrote favorably of it. I don't think of him as being an National Socialist in the same way that George Lincoln Rockwell or Savitri Devi were, as they held NS as the answer in a way that Oliver didn't seem to. In "[http://www.stormfront.org/rpo/MAXWELL.htm Eminent Sheeny]", Oliver asserts that "by destroying Hitler and the National Socialist régime in Germany, [Americans] destroyed their own future." As for being a Socialist, in [http://www.stormfront.org/rpo/SHEKEL.htm The Spurious Shekel]" he seems to regard National Socialism as "really only a kind of nationalism". —Morning star 06:25, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

Thank you. That is a well researched and well presented response. In this particular case, it is not too much of strech to brand Oliver with the NS label, and seems well deserved too. nobs 14:31, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

I feel this article is a smear and the accusations of fascist, anti-Semitic, neonazi, advocate of racism and anti-Jewish need to be backed up with proof. I have read some of his material and it is clearheaded intellectual analysis which demonstrates he was a great man with a lot of knowledge. This article makes him sound like some sort of goose stepping nazi. Lightningstrikes 05:10, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

You are exactly right. Wikipedia is notorious for its subtle philo-Marxist and philo-Judaic biases. Non-polemical scholarly accuracy in relation to Western racial nationalists is not very likely. See Kevin B. MacDonald on this subject, especially his Culture of Critique.

Comment As an admirer of Dr. Oliver, I don't see this article as particularly biased. It has things in it I like, and things in it I don't much care for, which rather ought to be the reaction of a partisan (on either side) to most neutral articles on controversial figures. I have read Dr. Oliver's America's Decline and The Jewish Strategy. In the first book, he speculates that it would be a good thing if in the future, as he felt was not unlikely, that the dominant religion of the West, Christianity, be replaced by a new faith in which Adolf Hitler would replace Jesus Christ as the central figure. On that basis, as well as the lack of any contradictory remarks in those two books, or in those of his other essays & speeches with which I am familiar, I feel quite comfortable in placing Dr. Oliver firmly in the camp of national socialism. The organization now known as National Vanguard, but previously known in the late 1960s as the National Youth Alliance, was overtly national socialist in orientation (the group's principal founder, Dr. William L. Pierce, was the editor of National Socialist World magazine, which was a publication of George Lincoln Rockwell's American National Socialist White Peoples Party). Dr. Oliver is regarded as one of its (the National Youth Alliance) other founders (in addition to Dr. Pierce, that is) and Dr. Oliver appears in a recruitment film for the National Youth Alliance. I have seen that film on VHS, and it consists of nothing but Dr. Oliver sitting at a desk while explaining the virtues of something which sounds an awful lot like a neo-Nazi perspective, and then he urges everyone watching to join the openly national socialist National Youth Alliance. This really should clear up the matter of whether or not its appropriate to call Dr. Oliver a national socialist. There's no doubt he was one. The fact that he was one of the relatively few American neo-Nazis to have won the respect of non-Nazis is irrelevant; he still was one.KevinOKeeffe 13:44, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

Oliver was favorably disposed, in retrospect, toward National-Socialist Germany, but my impression from having read a good bit of his writing for Liberty Bell is that his views on economics were rather old-fashioned, not particularly socialistic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.42.2.195 (talk) 03:59, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Oliver's World War II Service

The discussion about Revilo P. Oliver needs major revision. The author of the article accepts without independent verification Oliver's claim that during his World War II service in the Army Signal Corps, Oliver "came to be in charge of a rapidly expanding department, and advanced from Analyst to Director of Research (eventually responsible for the work of about 175 persons.")

However, I have obtained the FBI file on Oliver along with his service records from the National Personnel Records Center. Neither reflect that Oliver was ever a Supervisor or "Director of Research" of anything! All documents refer to him simply as an Analyst.

More details are available from me: Ernie1241@aol.com

The following line has no documentation as to it's accuracy: "During World War II, Oliver worked with distinction at the U.S. Army Signal Corps installation, Arlington Hall, in cryptanalysis."

If Oliver "worked with distinction", what, if any awards did he receive? In addition, that language is unwieldy and not consistent with U.S. Military phraseology. 76.217.35.16 (talk) 15:16, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

After he left the John Birch Society, Oliver associated himself with blatantly anti-semitic and neo-nazi organizations and publications such as George Dietz's publication, Liberty Bell, and William Pierce's National Alliance. [Prior to organizing the National Alliance, Pierce was the editor of the American Nazi Party journal, National Socialist World.]

Oliver's writings are archived on the following websites:

http://www.revilo-oliver.com/ and

http://www.revilo-oliver.com/Audio/Audio.html

With respect to Revilo Oliver being described as a "fascist" or "national socialist" -- I recommend a careful reading of Oliver's many articles published in the frankly pro-nazi magazine Liberty Bell.

Below is an excerpt from a September 1973 article that gives Oliver's interpretation of the "Mass Sedition Trial" of the 1940's -- during which the Justice Department under FDR sought prosecution of numerous individuals who were thought to be pro-nazi.

You may read the entire article at: http://www.revilo-oliver.com/rpo/No_Escape.html

"The Sedition Trial in 1944 made it obvious, and indubitable to anyone willing to think critically about it, that the United States had been surreptitiously captured by the Jews and their Communist barbarians. At that time, the Americans, or a tiny but determined minority of them, amounting perhaps to one-tenth of one percent of the population, could have retaken their country. Instead, for forty-four years, the Americans watched in idiotic apathy the dismantling of their industry, the confiscation of money and its replacement by trading stamps of no intrinsic value, the sabotage and defilement of their culture, the use of their schools to abort children's minds and destroy innate character, their ever increasing subjugation to a ruthless bureaucracy, the gradual elimination of every right their ancestors had enjoyed as freemen, and the wholesale importation into their country of both anthropoid garbage and shrewd racial enemies by the Judaeo-Communist conspiracy. (3)

(3. One of the most important articles ever published in Liberty Bell is Ivor Benson's "The Immigration Riddle Unwrapped" in the issue for April 1988, which makes it clear that the importation of niggers and wogs into Britain was organized and financed by a conspiracy. It is clear that the Jews, having found it impractical to carry out the plan to exterminate all Germans, which was prematurely announced by Kaufmann in Germany Must Perish! (reprint available from Liberty Bell Publications, $4.00 + postage), have resorted to the more gradual method of exterminating the Aryans in all of their countries by running in hordes of sub-humans and eventually dissolving Aryan blood in a fetid mass of mindless mongrels. Aryans, their minds rotted by Christianity, grin idiotically as they see prepared the biological graves to which their children are destined. The present influx of Chinese and Japanese, who are buying up large parts of the United States and Canada, is, of course, an entirely different phenomenon. They belong to a highly intelligent and civilized race, and they, of course, feel only contempt for the Aryan idiots who have, in effect, given away their property by sabotaging their own industrial capacity; they will not debase their own blood by marrying Aryan fools. The influx of Mongolians is encouraged by the Jews, since it hastens the liquidation of the Aryan nation; what will happen when the interests of the two intelligent races no longer coincide is anyone's guess.)" Ernie1241 14:53, 1 December 2007 (UTC)Ernie1241

Additional Information Re: Oliver's Veracity

As I mentioned above, I have obtained Dr. Oliver's FBI files and his wartime service records. Nowhere does it indicate that he was ever "Director of Research" of anything nor is there even an indication that he had any sort of supervisory position. I wrote to Kevin Strom on several occasions to ask for more details but he chose not to reply.

Oliver's 1942 "Job Sheet" while employed at the Army Signal Service described his duties as follows:

"Under general supervision, to perform research and analysis in relation to the translation of foreign language texts of exceptional difficulty; also requiring wide knowledge of the political, economic, and social conditions in foreign countries." In 1943 he was promoted to "Associate Research Analyst."

ADDITIONAL INFO ABOUT OLIVER:

In an October 1959 article in the Birch Society's American Opinion magazine Oliver claimed that between 70 and 80% of the responsible officers in the Department of Health, Education and Welfare (DHEW) were "members or accomplices" of the Communist conspiracy. He also wrote that some DHEW employees served as Communist couriers.

In a March 1959 speech to the Illinois DAR, Oliver stated that "fully one-third of the top echelon of Communist conspirators in this country" were in the DHEW and he cited former FBI informant Herbert A. Philbrick as his source for that statement. The FBI received numerous inquiries about these assertions.

Here is the pertinent excerpt from an FBI Boston field office memo on the matter:

"Herbert A. Philbrick...advised this date he has met Dr. Revilo P. Oliver on two occasions at Urbana IL in late 1959 or early 1960 when Philbrick delivered lectures there. Oliver has written Philbrick on one or two occasions. Philbrick stated he has never given Dr. Oliver any information concerning Communist infiltration of DHEW, stating he knows no one in this Department and has had no information concerning Communist Party activity in the U.S. Government since at least 1944. Philbrick approximately one half year ago heard statements attributed to him that DHEW was infiltrated with CP members...He denied emphatically that he ever made such statements orally or in writing. He considers Dr. Oliver to be an extremist in anti-Communist feelings and violently anti-Semitic."

In addition, the FBI reviewed its Security Index cards and "determined that no employees of the DHEW are included in the Security Index." Since the SI was designed to be the FBI's method of identifying persons it considered actually or potentially dangerous to U.S. security and that included CP members, CP sympathizers, and individuals associated with CP-front groups or anybody with "anarchist or revolutionary beliefs" -- obviously, Oliver's conclusion was totally a fabrication of his fevered imagination.

At the time Oliver claimed that "fully one-third of the top echelon of Communist conspirators in this country" were in DHEW, the FBI Security Index listed 19 Communists or Communist sympathizers working in the entire U.S. government.

A 1963 FBI Domestic Intelligence Division memo contained the following evaluation about Dr. Oliver: "...Dr. Oliver is a Professor at the University of Illinois and is a right-wing extremist."

OLIVER'S WRITING STYLE:

The June 1992 issue of Liberty Bell magazine contains an article by Oliver which includes the following comment:

"My article on Nigger Superiority in the May issue of Liberty Bell was in print before events in Los Angeles gave it an emphatic confirmation. Niggers naturally loot and destroy when they see a good opportunity...for tribal festivities."

Need secondary sources - editors are not supposed to be making judgments about whether Oliver was fascist by judging his writing of different periods. What did reputable journals or other media write about him? If he attracted national attention, what was said? There are far too many quotes from his own writing, rather than material about him. This suggests that he is not notable enough to merit an article, even if he was outrageous in his writings.Parkwells (talk) 18:33, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

lead

We should shorten the lead. I suggest only mentioning his Kennedy assassination conspiracy view, and his later racialist views and involvement with said groups. There rest can be moved down into the bio section. --LC 23:39, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

I agree that it is an over-long intro. -Will Beback · † · 23:45, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Revilo Oliver's Death

How did oliver die? Was he a suicide? If so, why isn't it mentioned in hiswikipedia biography?

My recollection is that he shot himself. Also, if I recall correctly he had lymphatic cancer. He decided to end his life because the cancer was affecting his brain. That's my recollection anyway from conversation at the time with Kevin Strom. --Hadding

He shot himself. I have the bullets here, actually. Western brand 38 Special. He used a revolver. First shot into the ceiling as a test. Second shot dimpled the primer. Third shot didn't puncture his skull, but it killed him anyway.

-Phil Fiscella — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.253.167.39 (talk) 01:46, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

"Personal Life" section?

I've only just now heard of this bloke. What strikes me as notably lacking in this description of his academic, war-time and political activities and achievements is any "personal life" section, as is usual in biographical articles.

Did he have any partner? Any offspring? Or was he so purely devoted to his causes that he gave them priority over his personal contribution to the propagation of the race, and thus became the last Revilo Oliver?

(or was he ... ... one shudders to think.)

141.243.9.139 (talk) 02:31, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

Dr. Oliver married Grace Needham Oliver. Grace was 5 years older than Revilo (1902-1997). Her first husband was named Maddox, and they had two daughters. One of Dr. Oliver's step daughters is still living, but she married a Jewish fellow and Dr. Oliver did not approve. So he left the house to a series of life estate trusts instead of to his wife and stepdaughters. It is quite an odd story, but eccentric is the name of the game when it comes to researching Revilo Oliver.

You can find Grace's obituary here: http://www.classics.illinois.edu/news/newsletters/1996-97.pdf — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.253.167.39 (talk) 01:44, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

For future reference

• http://www.nytimes.com/1964/02/11/kennedy-target-of-birch-writer.html
• https://books.google.com/books?id=XcLSoljnmBcC&lpg=PR2&pg=PA7#v=onepage&q&f=false
• https://books.google.com/books?id=n7hFAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA1804-IA11#v=onepage&q&f=false

- Location (talk) 16:56, 29 July 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Revilo P. Oliver. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080302044808/http://www.nationalreview.com/flashback/flashback200501030730.asp to http://www.nationalreview.com/flashback/flashback200501030730.asp

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:13, 9 September 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Revilo P. Oliver. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080308122414/http://www.commentarymagazine.com/viewarticle.cfm/Goldwater--the-John-Birch-Society--and-Me-11248 to http://www.commentarymagazine.com/viewarticle.cfm/Goldwater--the-John-Birch-Society--and-Me-11248

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:57, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Research Opportunity

I bought Dr. Oliver's home in Urbana, and donated about 4,000 pounds of his letters and papers to the University of Illinois archives this past Fall.

There is plenty of good material in there if anybody is interested in doing some research. He was a fascinating character, and we have everything from his draft card, military documents, childhood writings, family history, to some unpublished books that he wrote. I also have contacts for several people who knew him in life.

The U of I library is open to the public, although it'll likely take them years to catalog all of it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.253.167.39 (talk) 01:41, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

Two tons?! SpicyMemes123 (talk) 02:50, 2 April 2022 (UTC)

External links

The Institute for Historical Review is a WP:QUESTIONABLE source, so new books published by it after Oliver's death should be verified by an independent reliable source per WP:BURDEN and WP:DUEWEIGHT. I removed three external links to posthumous books from it and another WP:SPS per WP:QUESTIONABLE, WP:ELNO #2 and #11, and WP:NOTDATABASE ("To provide encyclopedic value, data should be put in context with explanations referenced to independent sources"), and added a tag for third-party RS needed. Llll5032 (talk) 06:23, 1 July 2023 (UTC)