Talk:Relationship of Cyrillic and Glagolitic scripts

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Fascinating article. A few typos and grammatical slips need tidying up. I look forward to coming back to it. Koro Neil (talk) 10:47, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Just knock yourself out :D --Ivan Štambuk (talk) 16:17, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Could someone identify/link the "Constantine" mentioned early in the article. Constantine the Great? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.79.230.17 (talk) 23:22, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

'Kônstantinos' was the given name of St. Cyril when he was christened at Thessaloníkê in 827/8. He assumed the religious name Кѷриллъ when becoming a Roman monk around 860. For details cf. Saint Cyril the Philosopher.

Nuremberg - Ángel.García2001 93.193.64.66 (talk) 13:51, 6 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Chernorizets Hrabar's account

The illustration contains the first three words "Prěžde ubo Slověne" - but not the quoted text. I erased it.

Nuremberg - angel.garcia2001googlemail.com93.193.64.66 (talk) 13:55, 6 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

церковь (ch), чаание (č)

Is that the right way around? ч is the one you hear in cha cha cha. ц is the one you hear in tsar and pizza. 2A01:CB0C:CD:D800:ACF2:215E:FC66:11DE (talk) 15:12, 28 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The article mostly follows the Scientific transliteration of Cyrillic (not sure about đerv, but that's not confusing), so чаание (č) is correct and "церковь (c)" would be right. Since that part is about sounds and not letters using IPA seems a clearer, but for some vowels more problematic, alternative. I'm pretty sure ѫзыкъ should be ѧзыкъ/ѩзыкъ, judging both by the word and the (ę). The same probably applies earlier to ѫзоікомъ, ѫзꙑкомъ. I guess this is a good faith transcription error, but I may be missing something. чаание also looks strange, but something similar (namely аа) was possible at least in imperfects. I also think there is no yus in the word ꙗдъ. Ⱑ/Ѣ(ꙗ) was used for both ja and ě in glagolitic and older/translitterated cyrillic texts. (Ⱔ)/Ѧ (ę or a similar frontish nasal) was also pronounced ja at least in the russian/eastern redaction, but that probably refers to later periods and/or different areas than the ones we are talking about. This combined with the similar shape of glagolitic Ⱑ and cyrillic Ѧ probably contributed to some confusion. At the beginning of a world Ⱑ/Ѣ usually (always?) represents 'ja' and some earliear revisions of the article had this coupled with ju and talked about initial syllables. Some revisions linked to yat, and the considerations about greek η better applies to ě. Overall the article has changed quite a bit since the reference was added and the best approach would be to recheck how well this parts are supported by sources. I guess both ě and (initial)(irregularly) jotated syllables would be problematic to represent in the greek alphabet, but it's not clear what the source, (Schenker 1995), is actually talking about and a page number would also be great to add. Personuser (talk) 00:17, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

живѣтъ (ž), ѕело (dz), церковь (c [ts]), чаание (č), and широта (š)

The initial consonants in живѣтъ (ž), ѕело (dz), церковь (ch), чаание (č), and широта (š) were completely absent in the contemporary Byzantine Greek phonology,

Shouldn't it read: The initial consonants in живѣтъ (ž), ѕело (dz), церковь (c [ts]), чаание (č), and широта (š) were completely absent in the contemporary Byzantine Greek phonology ...

It's certainly true that ž and dz as well as č and š were absent in Byzantine Greek; however, c [ts] seems to be as much a part of Modern Greek as well as Byzantine Greek.

So my guess is that it should read:

The initial consonants in живѣтъ (ž), ѕело (dz), чаание (č), and широта (š) were completely absent in the contemporary Byzantine Greek phonology ...

... and instead of using the digraph tau-sigma the creators of the new script used a single symbol for c [ts] as well, i.e. церковь (c [ts]) ... it is of course true that tau-sigma only appears in loanwords ... so maybe /ts/ did in fact not appear initially. Still, we will have to change the transcription of церковь = c = [ts].

Wathiik (talk) 11:09, 3 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

ch = c

I've changed ch to c - and also added the IPA symbols; which in the case of c = [ts] is actually easier for most speakers of English and also works for most other people familiar with a Latin-based spelling system. Wathiik (talk) 08:43, 4 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]