Talk:Porte des Morts

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On 17 July 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved to Death's Door, Door County. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

Untitled

This page needs some major editing and, perhaps, combining with the entry entitled "Death's Door". The source of the name in Holand's book (there cited) seems the most reliable available.

The Griffin did not founder in Death's Door. While it was last seen leaving Washington Island, it was going north to the Straits of Mackinac. One theory contends it foundered in Big or Little Bay de Noc; another says it was in northern Lake Huron. It's final location has never been determined in a way that can be verified. It was not "one of the largest ships" on the Great Lakes at the time, it was the only ship on the upper lakes, and another ship would not again be built for a very long time on the upper lakes.

The canal at Sturgeon Bay was not needed to avoid Death's Door. A much safer passage between Lake Michigan and Green Bay is found just north of Washington Island. The canal was primarily to avoid the distance around the peninsula, an important factor when ships traveled less than ten miles per hour.

The Louisiana did not ground in Death's Door, but on the beach of Washington Harbor on the north side of Washington Island. I don't know about the others named.

Technically, the strait is not between the Door peninsula and Washington Island, but between the peninsula and Plum Island. The Detroit Island Passage lies to the north of Plum Island and a body of water too shallow for navigation separates Detroit Island from Washington Island. Sometimes the Detroit Island Passage is lumped together with Porte des Morts Passage and may contribute to the notoriety of Porte des Morts, since the Detroit Island Passage has many more hazards to navigation. RDavS 02:58, 4 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I noticed the two articles, and wondered what was the difference. Please edit as needed to fix the inaccuracies. Many of your comments in the above discussion should be added to articles to make everything clearer. Royalbroil 12:58, 5 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The two articles have been combined. RDavS 18:53, 6 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 17 July 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: no consensus. No consensus was found even after two relists, no reason to relist this a third time. (closed by non-admin page mover) – Material Works 16:17, 9 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Porte des Morts → Death's Door, Door County – Per WP:USEENGLISH, the common name in English appears to be "Death's Door". It is called that name in articles, such as this, this, and this. I'm also open to Death's Door, Wisconsin if the proposal is too specific. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 09:09, 17 July 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. Natg 19 (talk) 23:40, 25 July 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. Skarmory (talk • contribs) 05:02, 2 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support per WP:COMMONNAME and WP:USEENGLISH. Rreagan007 (talk) 16:34, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Is there any clear guidance on using a colloquialism over an official name? Local newspapers use both, maritime books tend to use "Porte des Morts," there's a report from 1890 which even says the strait is "popularly called Death's Door." It's a case where the official USGS place name is in French but frequently gets translated into English. I think we should stick with the official one. SportingFlyer T·C 19:03, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

WP:COMMONNAME says that we should use the most common name, not the official name. Rreagan007 (talk) 19:08, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

That's true, but from what I've looked into, I see these names being used basically equally. SportingFlyer T·C 10:58, 18 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Neutral on the move, but Death's Door (Wisconsin) would be the preferred title, per WP:NCPLACE. 162 etc. (talk) 18:16, 18 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
- Ditto this. — AjaxSmack 04:11, 20 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It actually should be Death's Door, Wisconsin per WP:USPLACE. estar8806 (talk) ★ 11:57, 2 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
This isn't a populated place, it's a geographic feature, so it should not be comma disambiguated. Death's Door (Wisconsin) would indeed be proper. Elli (talk | contribs) 12:21, 9 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Relisting comment: Can we get stronger evidence on which, if either, name is more common? Skarmory (talk • contribs) 05:02, 2 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.