Talk:Outlaws Motorcycle Club

Comments

From Article: "Each chapter has a clubhouse. These clubhouses are used for "church meetings," parties, and privacy. They are usually secured by concrete walls, steel doors, razor wire, guard dogs, and video surveillance."

Is there proof of this? I'm not sure that every chapter has a clubhouse, and I doubt whether many of them would be secured to the extent that this makes it out to be. 01/30/2006

This should be corrected. 03/24/2006

"The Outlaws collect information on their rivalries with other clubs. They primarily collect newspaper clippings regarding incidents with other clubs. On occasion, though, an Outlaws member will bribe a law enforcement officer to obtain information on the location of a rival club's members. Outlaws also travel, at the club's direction, to the funerals of fellow bikers."

What??? These seem like rumors with NO verifiable facts... I suggest that this entire section be removed, or backed up with sources. 03/24/2006

Regarding: " The Taunton, Massachusetts Club house was raided, but due to immunity of the Brockton club house nothing happened." WTF does that mean?98.176.116.13 (talk) 00:44, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

this is Jesse the FBI along with the tech company have attacked me for 5 years and in my heart surgery put a microphone in me without my knowledge among other electronics and now we're not allow me to get medical treatment when I'm having heart attacks or get a lawyer to sue them all because I was a outlaw any brothers want to help a brother get out lawyer 2600:100B:B00D:DD55:0:6D:2D40:8C01 (talk) 05:12, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

As the Outlaws originated in Illinois (McCook, south side of Chicago) and their main base of criminal activity despite branching out throughout the United States remained Chicago for many decades, Somewhere in this article should point out that the current Chicago headquarters is, and for MANY years has been, Joliet, Illinois, or more distinctly, Ingalls Park in Joliet, Illinois. While the Outlaws presence has severely lessened in Joliet and all of Chicagoland since the 1980s after many arrests and prison sentences, the Chicago Outlaws still engage in criminal activity with their main center of operations being the Outlaws "clubhouse" on East Washington Street & Schonie Street, Ingalls Park, whose clubhouse largely displays the Outlaws name, slogan/motto GFOD (God Forgives Outlaws Don't) and the One Percenter logo. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Soco79 (talk • contribs) 15:46, 3 January 2015 (UTC)

SS tattoo's

I question the statment that relates SS tatoo's to proof of a members violent history....the same thing was said of the Hells Angels, who also used the SS( "Filthy Few" in HAMC lexicon) symbol. The allegation that these tatoo's denoted certain criminal acts (murder etc.) in the HAMC has been widely discredited 195.7.34.195 10:03, 22 February 2006 (UTC) T.J. McKenzie It is used as a brand perse for the murder of a rival of any kind. I can assert that.

Patched over by the Outlaws in 1977

Incorrect. Satan's Choice was being monitored with heavy law enforcement tactics during the mid 1990's particularly 1996/7. Satan's Choice was a very strong club in Ontario Canada during thsi period. They were not patched over. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TacticalTemplar (talk • contribs) 13:50, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

You are right, the entire Satan's Choice organization was not patched over to Outlaws. Only four former Satan's Choice chapters became Outlaws in 1977 after Bernie Guindon was jailed in 1976 and they became a bit less prominent and somewhat more disorganized. Outlaws wanted a foothold in the lucrative drug trade in Canada and were able to woo those four chapters. The remaining Satan's Choice organization operated independently, occasionally allied with other organizations, until 2000, when the remaining few were either patched over to Hells Angels or disbanded. Guindon also became a member of the Hells Angels. Garth of the Forest (talk) 18:05, 16 July 2012 (UTC)

Removed on May 5, 2010. Please clarify if incorrect with sources. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TacticalTemplar (talk • contribs) 13:53, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Recent incidents entry

I added that in there because everything else in the article, as far as I can tell, is just rumor and speculation. Since that incident was so recent I knew I could put the link up to the story to verify it. Scoop 20:46, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Biggest Club?

This article states that the Outlaws MC is now the biggest outlaw biker club, but cites no proof. The Hells Angels would disagree.

Agreed. Also, "biggest" means different things to different clubs. Most number of members? Most number of chapters? Most number of countries with chapters?War (talk) 06:29, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

The Hells Angels would disagree but that doesn't make them right. They're dropping in membership and the Outlaws are growing quite fast. If they haven't surpassed them yet, they will soon. 72.154.166.199 (talk) 20:46, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Hells dropping in membership? ROTFLOL! Can you cite any source for that claim? In Canada alone, prior to 1997 they had chapters only in two provinces (BC and Quebec - okay 3 if you count Thirteenth Tribe), having opened their first Canadian chapter in 1977 in Montreal (formerly this chapter were the original bad-ass Popeyes). The BC guys used to be Satan's Angels; they were patched over in 1983. In BC alone they went from 5 chapters and about 70 full patch in the mid-nineties to more than seven chapters and over 100 full patch less than 10 years later. Keep in mind quality is more important than quantity for HA, who make good use of associates; maybe not true for other clubs - example Canadian Bandidos (case in point the recent Shedden massacre). Plus you have to factor in all the former independent clubs who are now either full patch HA or affiliates all across the country. By the year 2000 the Canadian Hells Angels had patched over enough former independent or affiliate clubs to now have chapters or affiliates in at least nine of ten provinces and two of the three territories. Plus they are expanding into countries they've never had chapters in before. Worldwide membership is estimated at well over 3500 full patch; Outlaws claim what, 1700? So probably under 1000 in reality. True, membership ebbs and flows as the more hard core ones get killed or sent to prison and as the old guard die off, but there is no shortage of younger hangarounds and puppet clubs who can't wait to become full red and white. A more interesting study would be average lifespan of members of the two groups, or average tenure - i.e. how long on average do they stay as members? Which is more true HAFFA, or OFFO? Garth of the Forest (talk) 05:24, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

Gang vs. Club

I reverted the change in category from Motorcycle Club to Motorcycle Gang. The Outlaws are, in fact, a motorcycle club. The term motorcycle gang has no concensus definition. Mmoyer 02:38, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Heloo, people this is a a trademarked item you are dictating here in Wiki. Outlaws Motorcycle Club is trademarked and recognized by the Federal Government as a legal Club.... You need to remove the gang reference.The Crips, Bloods, 813, etc are not trademarked...and are gangs... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.114.113.108 (talk) 23:30, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia's use of the Outlaws name is covered within fair use. If not, see WP:NLT. tedder (talk) 01:13, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Unreferenced Material

I removed gobs of unreferenced material from this article and have begun searches for refs to support some of the less outlandish claims. Mmoyer 03:06, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Unsolved Murder of John "Burrito" Klimes

Should a section also be included over the murder of Klimes? He was very prominent in the Lyons, Il chapter, and his murder has never been solved, though there is much specualtion. I remember 100's of bikers driving down 47th street in Brookfield, IL in 1981, when I was 10 years old. Nathraq 17:09, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Wikify

Anyone mind if I wikify the history section as per tag? Julia Rossi (talk) 08:49, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Similar

It is believed that the Pagans have similar restrictions on membership to those of the Hells Angels. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.157.255 (talk) 16:17, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Irrelevent. This not an article about the Pagans or the Hells Angels. FYI: just about all OMG's have similiar restrictions on membership.War (talk) 06:31, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

You are quite right. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.143.180.30 (talk) 14:13, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Call to Vote: Criminal Activity

In my opinion, the paragraphs inluding alleged detailed criminal activity needs to be removed or revamped.

A section of the page on alleged criminal activity, in a general fashoin, may be more professional than a crime by crime synopsis as we have on the page at the moment. I can see if an article is about one criminal, whose only claim to fame was crime. But in regards to a whole motorcycle club, listing various murders and others crimes seems out of place. anyone?Nathraq (talk) 17:56, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Well, one reason for including verifiable crimes in there would be to help establish whether they are a club or gang. tedder (talk) 18:21, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

If the information is properly referenced, including multiple references that verify that it was a known member or members of the "club" who was (were) charged or convicted, and the crimes are noteworthy, then I vote that yes, by all means it should be included. Especially if RICO was applied, successfully or otherwise. Whitewashing is common on these outlaw biker articles, and should be discouraged. Garth of the Forest (talk) 05:33, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

I think it's basically a difference in how OMCs work is the real thing. For streets gangs, they are all about crime. For the 1%ers, so and so might deal drugs or guns or women or whatever. Hell, they might ALL sell meth. But the MC itself is not a meth trafficking sceme. It's just something <blank> amount of members do. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.35.163.210 (talk) 15:21, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

This is not a vote, and it isn't about any editor's opinion. Independent sources call them a criminal enterprise, and that's why the article says it. When the club claims what you just said -- that's it's only individual members acting on their own, and not the club organizing crimes -- it is self-serving. It isn't even an argument, its nothing more than contradiction of the accusation of being organized crime, and not a very convincing contradiction. That's why we put more weight on independent sources. --Dbratland (talk) 17:47, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Allies

I removed Pagans as an ally. The Pagans and Outlaws are not really allies, at the least they might have an on/off relationship. They have been fighting each other in Pennsylvania for some time now. I think the only thing that they do share is a mutual hatred for the Hells Angels. The citation for the Pagans as allies links to a story about the Mongols allying with the Pagans, not the Outlaws allying with the Pagans.98.176.116.13 (talk) 00:48, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

It was sourced to some blog, which fails WP:RS, so it never should have been included in the first place.--Dbratland (talk) 02:09, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Tory politician was a former full patch Outlaw?

This edit is highly dubious. It's sourced to four articles, but in actuality it is one article with original reporting and 3 articles that parrot what the first article says. All they really have is photos of the subject associating with the Outlaws, wearing some emblems of one percenter culture. They assert that he is a full patch member but show no evidence whatsoever that he is any more than a hang around -- if that. Do two photos even prove you're a "hang around"? The articles imply that not only is he a full patch member, but that to be a full patch member you must have committed a crime. This is an egregious violation of Wikipedia's standards. Given that gossip doesn't belong on Wikipedia, what is any of this doing here? In what sense is this encyclopedic?

If these two photos turn out to be meaningful in any way, then reputable media outlets will no doubt report on it, and they'll include some facts. Until that happens, delete it. There should be no great hurry to spread negative claims about anybody. --Dbratland (talk) 22:25, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

I'm less bothered about the intricacies of if/how/whether he is a full patch member, but having read Wikipedia:BLP#Presumption_in_favor_of_privacy, especially WP:NPF and WP:BLP1E I don't think it is appropriate at this point to add anything in the article about this individual. If the new story develops e.g. if he resigns or is ousted from his role then perhaps his inclusion should be revisited. For now though I have removed it. --Biker Biker (talk) 08:23, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Famous and infamous members

David Allen Coe was a patched Outlaw earlier in his life. He initially refused to play in any city that had a Hells Angels chapter. Sources for this are all over the net and print media. Photo with an Outlaw 1% shirt: http://today-is-their-birthday.blogspot.com/2010/09/outlaw-country-music-singer-david-allan.html. 98.176.233.118 (talk) 08:27, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Do you have a reference? The link you posted is pretty much a word-for-word repost of parts of Coe's wikipedia article. Even if you do, is it relevant to the article that he used to be a member? --Biker Biker (talk) 13:23, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

• Never saw the wiki article on DAC-but here is just one source that mention his past membership. As far as being relevant..there is a section for famous/infamous Outlaws on this page. DAC is a pretty famous figure.

http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2009/apr/15/blurt1/

"The agent, Austin-based Rob Devine, admits that he had to cancel the show after he allowed Brick by Brick to put the tickets on sale. Devine says that he didn’t know that San Diego was one of the cities (along with New York and San Francisco) that Coe refused to play because of a longtime promise he made to himself that he would never play in a town that is a home to Hells Angels.

“Back in the day, [Coe] was in a notorious biker gang called the Outlaws,” explains singer-guitarist Ron Houston, who fronts local country band Sickstring Outlaws. “The Hells Angels and the Outlaws were rivals. [Coe] says that, out of respect, he won’t play in a city that has an active Hells Angels chapter.”"98.176.233.118 (talk) 20:06, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

*Also this magazine webpage--- http://www.review-mag.com/archive/570-579/577/Ncoeinterview.htm

• • "There was a lot of alcohol and drugs or whatever. I told my band, "Don't worry about it. We'll provide our own protection." At that time I was in the Outlaws Motorcycle Club. I had my Outlaws' colors on, and I had my pistol in my pocket and I rode my motorcycle up on stage while Waylon was singing. I got off my motorcycle, and went out and started singing with Waylon. And then Willie came out and sang with us. There was a picture of us in the paper that had an arrow pointing to the pistol in my pocket and another arrow pointing to where it said, "Outlaws, Florida." The headline said, "The Outlaws came to town." That's actually how it all started."98.176.233.118 (talk) 20:11, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Outlaws in Ohio and Boston along with other locations there are chapters that are not listed.

Outlaws in Ohio and Boston along with other locations there are chapters that are not listed. There have been Outlaw chapters in Ohio since the 50's. it surprised me you did not have them listed in your Outlaw's MC chapters list. Dayton and Columbus Ohio is where there chapters in Ohio are located. Also the Outlaws now have new chapters in the USA and around the world in which again, are not listed on your page stating where the chapters of the Outlaws MC are located. Where you can update your information at is www.outlawsmc.com I am sure they have a list of their chapters at their website. Also if you have any reasonable questions you would like answered I think you can also contact them at the aboved name webpage. Just trying to help Wikipedia out with good solid info for your article. I enjoy using your website many times during the year when researching different subjects. Have a great day people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.75.23.44 (talk) 00:11, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Sick Brother "Stokes Cook"

I recently met and became friends with one of your brothers in Federal prison at FCI Fort Dix, Fort Dix NJ. Stokes Cook AKA Bear is his name and he is a good man as well as founding member of the club. Bear has recently been diagnosed and treated for cancer. This happened after my release but he and I are, and will remain in contact until one of us leaves this shitty world. He has recently been transferred to a Federal Medical Center at Butnam NC where he is undergoing further treatment. He has asked me to download and print out all the info on your web site and send it into him. As you know this is both a monumental and impossible task as most of your info can't be printed from the site for obvious reasons. Still, membership in your club has been his life and may now be his salvation as it may well help him find the strength he needs to fight and beat this disease. Any members or well wisher who would care to write to him and offer support to him in this time of need can do so by writing to:

Stokes Cook 09818-074 Federal Medical Center 4-B P.O. Box 1600 Room 4204 Butner NC 27509

Any support offered to him would be greatly appreciated by him and his fellow friends and inmates. If you wish to remain anonymous please feel free to send via e-mail anything that you think he would enjoy to Harley.davivson@yahoo.com and I will personally see to it that it is printed and mailed to him asap.

Now would be a good time to show your support for a fallen brother

Thank You Bob Gallant — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.61.120.97 (talk) 23:15, 15 March 2012 (UTC)

Motto

Stuck the motto back in with a reference. There are many for it, if one cares enough to look. Personally speaking, I am not 100% convinced clubs take these "mottos" as seriously as they are presented. It seems to me more like the cops use the same template for each club, and every club has to have one. But, references are references and are God around here apparently. --Bridge Boy (talk) 23:23, 7 June 2012 (UTC)

Taco bowman

I’m try to find tacos wife or kids to give them a few things taco gave me before he passed away. I was in prison with him and was the guy who took care of him until he passed and was a class friend 2601:680:CD00:A800:B8C6:51A5:25DB:F573 (talk) 18:35, 2 April 2024 (UTC)