Talk:Origin of the Gurjara-Pratiharas

Arbitrary heading

The word Gurjar has been used alternatively as a country and for a particular caste as well. This has lead to the confusion about the origin of Gurjar Pratiharas. But if we notice the other places such as "Gujarat" in India, "Chach-e-Gojar" in Iran, a Province of Spain with the name "Gojar", "Gujar Khan" in Pakistan and many more, we can easily understand that these places were once habituated by the Gurjars or Gujar or Gojars.

It is very much clear that these places were named after the Gurjar people, who had a clear specific identity and they did not just migrated from any "Gurjar Country". If it was the other way round then there would have been thousands of caste with the prefix Gurjar residing in all parts of India e.g. Gurjar Rajputs, Gurjar Jats, Gurjar Ahirs, Gurjar Dhobis and Gurjar Valmikis.

Moreover, If the antique Gurjars were different from present Day Gurjars then how come the present day Rajputs connect their pedigree to Antique Kshatriyas and for that matter to the Rajputras? All those people, who resided in Rajputana, whichever caste they belonged to, must have become Rajputs. It seems highly unjust to differentiate Present day Gurjars from Antique Gurjars whereas they are found numerously in the places where those antique Gurjars ruled.

This all started by the clever change by Col James Tod, who was prejudiced with Gurjars due to their (Gurjars') enmity with Britishers and the world known association of Rajputs with them (Britishers).

See how Gurjar History was stolen by wrong translation

Page231-232.

Colonel James Tod, who as the first British official to visit Rajasthan spent most of the 1820s exploring its political potential, formed a very different idea of the 'rashboots'. Not only was it his boast that 'in a rajpoot I always recognize a friend,' but seemingly in a friend he always recognized a rajput. Their hospitality to one who was offering acknowledgement of their sovereignty plus protection from the then devastating attentions of the Marathas was overwhelming. Tod found rajputs all over Rajasthan; and the whole region thenceforth became, for the British, 'Rajputana'. The word even achieved a retrospective authenticity when, in an 1829 translation of Ferista's history of early Islamic India, John Briggs discarded the pharse 'Indian princes,' as rendered in Dows;s earlier version, and substituted 'Rajpoot princes'. As Briggs freely admitted, he was much indebted for the unreserved communications on all points connected with the history of rajpootana..... to my friend Colonel Tod.

At page 232 the knowledgeble writers describes why Col Todd did it since it was his job to find weak alley.

About Rajputs: The closest attention to their history proves beyond contradiction that they were never capable of uniting, even for their own preservation: a breath, a scurrilous stanza of a bard, has served their closest confederacies. No national head exists amongst them..... and each chief being master of his own house and followers, they are individually too weak to cause us (i,e, the British) any alarm. *3

Read more: http://ashokharsana.proboards.com/thread/202/origin-gujjar-pratihar#ixzz4KJKQcMFy

It leaves no scope for any further confusion.

While I agree that James Tod is not a reliable source, neither are comments made on website discussion forums. The issue of the relationship between the Gurjara-Pratiharas and the Gurjars has been discussed on a multitude of occasions across a range of articles and the consistent consensus has been that it is not even closely certain. Sources say various things and here on Wikipedia we follow the procedure laid out at WP:NPOV. - Sitush (talk) 08:55, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

I Understand what you mean, but why is it so difficult for anybody to understand that the present day "Gurjars" are similar to those antique "Gurjars"? There was one more article on wikipedia named "Gurjara kingdom" which is now unavailable. It is really disheartening to see that the ongoing "caste war" in our country is depriving the public of true knowledge about our history. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ashokharsana (talk • contribs) 11:10, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

This is Wikipedia. It is not our role to speculate. We just follow the sources. If you want to discuss why people do this or that, or indeed if you want to right great wrongs, then this is not the place to do it. - Sitush (talk) 11:21, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

Ashokharsana, Gurjara Kingdom in not 'unavailable', it has been moved to Gopa Rashtra. 220 of ^Borg 11:31, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

Please let me know what should a "legitimate source" be like?The Real Rana aka Ashokharsana (talk) 07:48, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

It is well documented in the Gujarat State Gazetteers: Ahmadabad District Gazetteer that the Gujjars belong to the Gurjar race which named Gujarat or Gurjarsathra. It can be checked here at page 199 [[1]] The Real Rana aka Ashokharsana (talk) 08:40, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

How many more times do I have to tell you that sources from the British Raj era are not considered to be reliable? And that on Wikipedia you can't just promote the opinion that you favour? - Sitush (talk) 08:57, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

References

Regarding the origin of gurjar dynasties.

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Welcome friends, I want to introduce a few wrong myths about the many communities of our country -

Friends Britishers have gone already who put up some of the others community in criminal list due to their aggressive nature towards them and tampered their history to weaken them and just to divide them and favoured others like gave them govt. Jobs, made regiments for them and their children were allowed to study and many other privileges. Try to understand the motive to put up these various communities i.e Gurjars, meena, yadav etc in the criminal list due to which they were not allowed to get the govt. Jobs in british era like in their military force, police just after the 1857, their children were not allowed to study, their lands had been snatched from them etc. and this is the only reason that majority of their own brothers had changed their own caste, religion, Identity etc just to escape from this draconian criminal list but thanks to them who faced the challenges and still maintained their own well known culture and traditions with their older Identity. They are very simple people who are trying their best to get the education but still not well educated like others because It only 70+ years to been Independent in 1947 and they only came out of this draconian criminal list only in 1952. India could never been colonial if some of their own people not supported them just to evolve themselves.😟 And betrayed their own people. These people had struggled a lots to come up again but still majority have been engaged in farming, Indian military forces, Dairy farming , own business, gyms etc. I know these people have very aggressive nature due to which they had faced a lots of challenges specially in british era after 1857. but anyways they are trying their best to come up again and they are very cooperating and respecting nature but a little bit aggressive nature too 😞 They live for the country and die for the country, the people of our own country. They have all kinda respect for all religions, castes, community, race, gender etc. But because of the less education they still surviving and have failed to understand their own history which always motivates them and still many of the people trying to hide these all from them. I'm talking about the various communities here not any particular one like Meena, Gurjars, yadav etc. But still many of their own people behave them just like they are uneducated people and used wrong words for them but nobody want to understand the main reason behind of it why some of these communities lag behind and still involved in farming, diary farming etc. I will suggest these people please focus on education as much as you can and try to understand your real history which will motivates you in every step in your life.

Thank you for reading and for your cooperation. 🙏👍 Ravi mavi (talk) 07:07, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Ravi mavi, Wikipedia is not a WP:FORUM. Please do not use the talk pages to write essays and blog posts. All posts here must directly relate to the content of the page, and should be supported by reliable sources. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 07:14, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Now, taking revenge right. Okay it your choice I don't wanna hurt to anybody. But it's okay. Thank you Ravi mavi (talk) 07:22, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Origin of Gurjar Pratihar dynasty

Kautilya3 what you mean to say the page is not for gurjar od anything. I believe this page is related to tell how the Gurjar Pratihar dynasty was originated from and what was the actual fact behind it not a kinda propaganda running by you people. Now, I understand why the Wikipedia loosing it's credibility and Britannica is evolving just because of your type of people who are putting information as per their own will and even after providing four references for the article written by out of which two are of governmental recognised references. But you continue to revert the my article just for taking a revenge from me even without WP:CONSENSUS and without considering the references and giving warning continuously for taking revenge even I talked in very polite and calm manner but just because you are extended one. I remember those days earlier when I used to search anything on google and instantly Wikipedia page appears on front but now, Wikipedia is loosing its credibility because people like you come up here who just support others to spread the propaganda and sometimes also takes revenge instead of being polite and calm. Now, I understand why Britannica's comes at top when I search origin of gurjar Pratihar on google but earlier it was not the case. Ravi mavi (talk) 08:45, 4 December 2020 (UTC)