Talk:Macombs Dam Bridge

Macombs Dam Bridge has been listed as one of the Engineering and technology good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: April 6, 2020. (Reviewed version).

A fact from Macombs Dam Bridge appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 25 January 2020 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that the swing span of Macombs Dam Bridge was considered the world's heaviest movable mass at the time of its construction?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2020/January. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Macombs Dam Bridge.

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Named after Robert Macomb

This source indicates that the bridge was named after Robert Macomb, who was son of the General Alexander_Macomb_(1782_-_1841), but that article only lists a son William H. Macomb..

The Macomb Mansion derives its name from General Alexander Macomb, who bought it in 1797, and in 1810 it came into the hands of the general's son, Robert, who erected about 1813 the well-known Macomb's dam across the Harlem River, some miles below the Macomb Mansion, in order to secure water power for his mill.

The article on the General notes that neither the General or his father Alexander_Macomb_(American_merchant) were referred to by Jr. or Sr., so perhaps Robert Macomb was the General's brother.^[1]

As no Robert Macomb article exists, and I am unsure which person is Robert's famous father, I will not put this in yet. --Lent (talk) 21:49, 19 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Some more research finds a longer book on the history of the area from a member of the New York Historical Society and seems to make clear that Robert Macomb is the son of the Macomb the merchant :

was purchased, 1797-99, from Von Pfister and Joseph Eden by Alexander Macomb, a wealthy merchant of New York ( Who purchased from the State in 1791 more than three million five hundred thousand acres in Northern New York ...)

... and the mill were sold in foreclosure, and purchased by his son Robert.^[2]

So, therefore I infer Robert's brother is Macomb the General, and that the short section of HISTORIC BUILDINGS^[1] was confused about which Alexander Macomb was the General. This probably makes sense as the book was an advertising giveaway and primarily a history through pictures. Weighing the two sources, Edsall's has more exact dates and is about the specific area, whereas HISTORIC BUILDINGS seems a collection of short captions about building pictures from throughout the New York City. So I think Edsall gets it right :-)

--Lent (talk) 15:35, 20 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

^ ^a ^b HISTORIC BUILDINGS NOW STANDING IN NEW YORK WHICH WERE ERECTED PRIOR TO EIGHTEEN HUNDRED. Boston, Mass.: PRINTED FOR BANK OF THE MANHATTAN COMPANY, Walton Advertising and Printing Company. 1914. Retrieved 20 May 2010. {{cite book}}: Unknown parameter |copyright= ignored (help) Cite error: The named reference "Bank" was defined multiple times with different content (see the help page).
^ Edsall, Thomas H. (Thomas Henry), d. 1897 (1887). History of the town of Kings Bridge : now part of the 24th ward, New York City with Map and Index. New York City: Privately printed. pp. 49–53. Retrieved 20 May 2010. {{cite book}}: More than one of |subject= and |author= specified (help); Text "Call number: SRLF:LAGE-1137351" ignored (help)CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link) CS1 maint: numeric names: authors list (link)

Citizen Action returns river to Navigation

Both this source [1] and the NYC DOT web site [2] seem to agree that in 1838 or 1839 a group of citizens took the law into their own hands and breached Macomb's dam.

The idea of constructing a bridge in its present location was initiated by Robert Macomb in 1810. The Legislature awarded Mr. Macomb the right to erect a dam; one-half of the toll for crossing the bridge was to be donated to the poor, and boats were to pass freely through a lock. The bridge was constructed in 1814. The new dam, however, proceeded to flood meadows upstream and obstruct boat navigation. In 1839 a group of citizens breached the dam with a coal-carrying vessel; this act was deemed legal by the courts, who maintained that "it was a public nuisance to obstruct the navigation."

The final removal apparently took an act of the New York State Legislature, [3] [4]

and eventually, we see evidence of sailing past Macomb's Dam on the excursion steamer Josesphine Wooster's ad: [5]

This is probably worth including in the article. --Lent (talk) 21:49, 19 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Third oldest?

The article states that this is the third oldest bridge in NYC. This is incorrect, because I can think off-hand of three others that are older: High Bridge (1848), Brooklyn Bridge (1883), Washington Bridge (1888), and Carroll Street Bridge (1889). Woops, that's four. Additionally, the University Heights Bridge, while only at its current location since 1908, was originally opened in January 1895, four months before the Macombs Dam Bridge, at its original site on Broadway.

(There's also a bunch of bridges in Central Park dating back to the 1860s, and one in Prospect Park from 1890; I'm not sure you can count them, not being on streets. Depending on whether you want to count overpasses as well, the 5th Avenue overpass over a road in Greenwood Cemetery in Brooklyn dates to c. 1850, and there's a bunch in the Bronx from 1889. See uglybridges.com for a list sorted by date.) Shalom S. (talk) 23:49, 14 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 19:22, 22 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(

Comment or view
Article history

)

... that the swing span of Macombs Dam Bridge was considered the world's heaviest movable mass at the time of its construction? Source: NYCLPC p. 2
- ALT1:... that New York City's Macombs Dam Bridge, a swing bridge, was originally the site of an actual dam? Source: http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/html/infrastructure/bridges-harlem.shtml#macombs

Reviewed: Michigan Stove Company
Comment: More hooks to come later

5x expanded by Epicgenius (talk). Self-nominated at 20:29, 7 January 2020 (UTC).[reply]

I will be reviewing this. At first glance this already seems more than long enough Y and passes the 5x expansion mark. Y I'll look at the rest later, and evaluate hooks when you have them. – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 21:54, 7 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

John M Wolfson, thanks for talking up the review. Can you look at the first two hooks? I have just gotten out of a surgery and will not be able to look for other hooks for a couple days. epicgenius (talk) 16:00, 8 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Will do, hope you feel better! – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 16:04, 8 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The article seems neutral enough and Earwig's tool does not return any copyvios. Y ALT0 is directly stated in the article and verified by the source given. Y (I'm not so sure that ALT1 is expressly stated in the body of the article; ALT0 is better in my opinion, anyway.) QPQ appears adequate.Y Overall, I see no problems with ALT0, and can approve them if you don't feel like making more. – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 06:54, 10 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- John M Wolfson, thanks for the review. I think other hooks can technically be made, but they wouldn't be as interesting. For instance:
  - ALT2 ... that the Macombs Dam Bridge, called "a beautiful piece of engineering work", was featured in an Edward Hopper painting? "The Harlem River: The Beginning of a Developing Movement in which the City May Take Pride"; LPC p. 8 epicgenius (talk) 02:03, 11 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    - Agreed. – John M Wolfson (talk • contribs) 02:23, 11 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Macombs Dam Bridge/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: The Rambling Man (talk · contribs) 21:39, 5 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

"Adam Clayton Powell, Jr. Boulevard (Seventh Avenue)" these both link to the same article?
- Yes, these are alternate names for the same road.
  - Don't think you need to link them both then. A bit later you do it differently, i.e. " Eighth Avenue (Frederick Douglass Boulevard)" is linked just once. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 15:00, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    - Thanks. I have fixed this. epicgenius (talk) 15:01, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
"about the Harlem River's navigability" caused by the dam? More like complaints about the dam's impact on the river's navigability?
- Fixed.
"The Macombs Dam Bridge is the third-oldest major bridge still operating in New York City. The Macombs Dam Bridge..." repetitive.
- Done.
"swing span" and "camelback span/bridge" are overlinked in the infobox.
- Well, we need these links in the "design" section, but I don't think the caption links help much. I replaced the caption. epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
"Construction cost" in infobox, how do we know these are 2019 values?
- Fixed.
Is there no more up to date traffic information than 2016?
- That is correct. I looked on the NYCDOT's website, but all the traffic counts there seem to be even older. epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
"third-oldest major bridge" what qualifies it as "major"?
- That is what the NYCDOT says. I think the DOT only counts bridges over water. epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Is there an appropriate architectural link for "chord"?
- Yes, but it redirects to "truss". epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Some duplicate links: Jerome Avenue, University Heights Bridge, Ninth Avenue elevated line, swing bridge, Coogan's Bluff...
- Fixed.
"The approach ... Currently the approach" a touch repetitive.
- Fixed.
"Alfred P. Boller" you previously expanded his P.
- Fixed.
" adjacent.[44][40][45] " order.
- Fixed.
"1897 postcard of the eastern approaches to the bridge" avoid starting with a number if possible.
- Fixed.
"while the Yankee Stadium was" do you really need "the" here?
- Not really, but it's the Bronx, so we put "the" before random place names. epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
"The work, expected to cost $34 million... began a $145 million renovation..." that escalated quickly....!
- It did, but the $34 million was to prevent the bridge from collapsing, and the $145 million was to completely refurbish the bridge. epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Non-breaking spaces between the number and the million in all cases.
"demolished[70] after " could we move that ref to the end of the sentence please.
- Done.
Some spaced hyphens need to be spaced en-dashes in the ref titles.
- Done.

That's it. An interesting read, thanks. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 11:21, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@The Rambling Man: Thanks for the review. I have addressed all of your comments. epicgenius (talk) 14:50, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Just one quick response. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 15:00, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  - Huzzah. All good in this hood, so I'm promoting. Nice work. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 15:14, 6 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

[Bank-1] HISTORIC BUILDINGS NOW STANDING IN NEW YORK WHICH WERE ERECTED PRIOR TO EIGHTEEN HUNDRED. Boston, Mass.: PRINTED FOR BANK OF THE MANHATTAN COMPANY, Walton Advertising and Printing Company. 1914. Retrieved 20 May 2010. {{cite book}}: Unknown parameter |copyright= ignored (help) Cite error: The named reference "Bank" was defined multiple times with different content (see the help page).

[Edsall-2] Edsall, Thomas H. (Thomas Henry), d. 1897 (1887). History of the town of Kings Bridge : now part of the 24th ward, New York City with Map and Index. New York City: Privately printed. pp. 49–53. Retrieved 20 May 2010. {{cite book}}: More than one of |subject= and |author= specified (help); Text "Call number: SRLF:LAGE-1137351" ignored (help)CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link) CS1 maint: numeric names: authors list (link)

[1]

[2]